Minvitational 5 - The Inheritance

JereIC · Post Post #288 (isolation #0) » Mon Nov 29, 2004 9:20 am

Hey y'all,
I read over the game last night, and was pretty convinced that Norinel was scum. Tigris found him guilty, he defended Thoth, and Thoth was also setting up to clear him by arguing for mole's sanity, implying that Tigris wasn't sane. But now it looks like mole and Tally are/were both paranoid, which does raise doubts about Tigris's sanity (how likely that she was special and sane?). I'm still leaning towards Norinel as our man, but I think discussion is more useful than lynching right now. First off, it'd be good if we knew if anyone else was attacked last night and survived. I was not.

JereIC · Post Post #291 (isolation #1) » Mon Nov 29, 2004 7:27 pm

Candice: I think she was paranoid, but I'm not sure. If mole is innocent (and we're not drastically misreading Thoth's death scene), then Tal's results were guilty on a pro-town person and on an anti-town person, so she'd be paranoid. I'm putting mole as probable innocent right now becuase he came forward day one and claimed to be a cop with a character name, and claimed to have guilty results on Tally. If he is scum, then he was basically pulling a Lepton's gambit, which is pretty dangerous, and I think unlikely. From that, I'm assuming that Tally was paranoid, but I could prove to be wrong.

Investigator results (excluding Thoth's "results"):
mole: Tally guilty, Quail guilty, Norinel guilty
Tally: Thoth guilty, mole guilty
Tigris: Norinel guilty

JereIC · Post Post #306 (isolation #2) » Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:21 am

Candice: I've had a pet theory in this game that anyone who stands to gain some of Ol'd Dame Hunter's inheritence is a little bit nutty or flawed, for example Summer Summer was anti-town, and Harley Quinn appears to be paranoid. If the back-up doc is a family member, then he might only be 50% effective without knowing it, and so could have protected mole and succeeded, but protected Tal and failed. That'd allow for Thoth being a loner, mole being innocent, and a back-up doc.

By the way, I probably should have posted this Thursday, but I took the LSAT yesterday, and was pretty much out of my mind Friday and Saturday. I'm better now, though.

JereIC · Post Post #316 (isolation #3) » Wed Dec 08, 2004 7:42 pm

Mole's actions really aren't in keeping with scum, as he and others have pointed out, but they're not in keeping with an investigator either, IMHO. Day one, when you got your first result, and its guilty, why did you press Tally about it? Why didn't you wait a day to see if your were sane first?

JereIC · Post Post #320 (isolation #4) » Fri Dec 10, 2004 4:26 am

Kinda waiting on mole's response to my questions...

JereIC · Post Post #321 (isolation #5) » Fri Dec 10, 2004 4:43 am

I should mention now that I'll be away until Monday morning. Don't lynch me!

JereIC · Post Post #325 (isolation #6) » Sun Dec 12, 2004 4:27 pm

Yeah, that's pretty much the answer I expected. I don't think we're going to get much else out of this day, and I'm prepared to vote for Norinel. Any other ideas?

JereIC · Post Post #327 (isolation #7) » Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:37 am

Looks like it's time to

Vote: Norinel

JereIC · Post Post #335 (isolation #8) » Wed Dec 15, 2004 9:20 am

Unvote: Norinel

Bah, I can't vote for a claimed doc. Kerplunk, I think Norinel said his N1, 2, and 3 choices were Yoko Kurama, Quailman, and big_k. Is that correct, Norinel?

JereIC · Post Post #341 (isolation #9) » Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:57 am

Whoa, hold your horses there. It's just my policy not to vote for claimed docs until they've had a chance to explain themselves fully. I'm not sure I believe Norinel, and I was considering voting him again (because it seems weird that he can protect somebody night one when they have to say please first, and also since he knew so much about the movie he claims his role is from, he could just be basing his role off of that), but of course if I do that now it'll just look like I'm reacting to y'all. Kerplunk, what do you mean by an "I-told-you-so" unvote? I started the day saying I though Norniel was our best suspect, so it's not like I've been arguing for his innocence so I could later say "I told y'all he's innocent".

JereIC · Post Post #345 (isolation #10) » Sat Dec 18, 2004 3:38 pm

Kerplunk wrote:
JereIC wrote:Kerplunk, what do you mean by an "I-told-you-so" unvote? I started the day saying I though Norniel was our best suspect, so it's not like I've been arguing for his innocence so I could later say "I told y'all he's innocent".
Why then took it so long for you to actually vote for him? If you play it like this then if Norinel turns out innocent, you can say "I told you so" and if Norinel tuns our to be guilty you can refer to your opening posts.

I understand that you can't vote for a claimed doc in general, but there are a lot of strange/multiple/weakened roles in this game so you could question his claim a little bit more. I felt that unvote without any comments safe "Can't vote for a claimed doc" was ackward.

I didn't vote Norinel right off the bat because I've been burned lately by doing that in other games. Usually, I end up fighting hard to get a guy lynched, and he turns out to be a townie, and I get lynched the next day. Not fun.

As for not questioning Norinel's claim, I thought I had caught him in a lie about his night choice protections and people saying "Please", so I tried to make him commit firmly to the claims to make sure he couldn't later say "Oops, I meant to say..." I figured it'd be best to look unthreatening, so I unvoted him and asked my question as innocently as I could. It ultimately turned out I had just gotten confused, and he could have made those night choices.

At this point, my brain says Norinel is lying, but my gut says he's innocent. The Doc White claim is just so convinient, and fits in so well with the game, I'm tending to not believe it, and I'm going to go with the brain.

Vote: Norinel

JereIC · Post Post #346 (isolation #11) » Tue Dec 21, 2004 1:38 pm

Hey-low? Anyone else got an opinion?

JereIC · Post Post #353 (isolation #12) » Sun Dec 26, 2004 11:43 am

I'm willing to claim if somebody demands it, or you get restless and throw a third vote on me.

Are we under a deadline?

JereIC · Post Post #380 (isolation #13) » Fri Jan 07, 2005 1:25 pm

Wait a minute, why is Candice still alive? Wouldn't a doc be a natural first target for killing groups?

Anyway, I'm

really

suspicious of mole right now. He got a bunch of guilty results, then when we're at lynch or lose suddenly gets an innocent, and introduces this all very subltly. The result is also on the guy who Candice yesterday said she was most suspicious of, and it seems very easy to get an inadvertant lynch that way.

I've got to admit, though, I'm also suspicious of Kerplunk. He's been very quiet throughout the game, and hasn't offered much in the way of thoughts on the game. If we weren't on lynch or lose mode, I'd probably vote for him and demand a role claim.

Speaking of which, we shouldn't vote for anyone until we're sure we want to lynch them. We have at least two baddies, and they may or may not be colluding. If they are colluding, then if one townie votes for another, they'll just jump on and it's game over.

So,

FOS: Kerplunk
FOS: mole

JereIC · Post Post #382 (isolation #14) » Sat Jan 08, 2005 1:58 pm

I say very subltly because you give the results of your investigation without giving the conclusion that can be drawn from that result, which is that you're insane and Kerplunk is scum. Somebody who reads that and recalls your previous results comes to this conclusion, and because you haven't stated it, they feel responsible for it. In their minds, it's their conclusion, so it cannot possibly be a lie (you don't lie to yourself), so they are more likely to belive it. It's a social engineering tactic, and you're using it to get us to think you're an insane cop and that we should lynch Kerplunk.

Speaking of Kerplunk, where is he? I thought he would have posted by now.

JereIC · Post Post #384 (isolation #15) » Sun Jan 09, 2005 12:54 pm

mole wrote:I get the feeling that if I had stated that conclusion that you would still have FOSed me, for trying to get Kerplunk quick-lynched at a critical point of the game.
That
would have been irresponsible of me.

Actually, that's exactly what I would have expected of a cop in your situation; "I got that Kerplunk is innocent. I think I'm actually insane, and Kerplunk is scum, but I want to discuss it before we start a lynch. <

insert interesting and thought-provoking question of your choice here

>" The way you gave your results looks shady, as I said like a social engineering tactic.

JereIC · Post Post #388 (isolation #16) » Mon Jan 10, 2005 3:45 pm

Candice wrote:Knowing now that Norinel WAS a doctor, that there ARE three doctors, I am NOT voting for mole. Period. End of discussion. I was willing to give up my gut feeling that Norinel really was innocent yesterday, but I'm NOT willing to ignore what, in my opinion, makes perfect sense.

I'd like Kerplunk to claim, too. I've been suspicious of him all game long.

Good points, but I wouldn't rule out the possibility that one of the inspectors is bad (say, for example, mole), or that when he was looking through the literature, Phoebus found 3 doc roles he wanted and 2 cop roles, and mole has just been fabricating this all. Still, the set up appears to favor a "mole is innocent" theory.

Kerplunk, by my count everyone except you wants you to claim now.

JereIC · Post Post #393 (isolation #17) » Wed Jan 12, 2005 12:30 pm

You know, for making us wait so long, Kerplunk's role claim better be

spectacular

. I'm talking song, dance, drama, fireworks, a dog that does tricks while riding a bear in a tutu, and a rousing musical finale where the young hero and the ravishing damsel sing a duet to eternal love as they are joined at the marriage altar by a chorus of 50 dressed in replendent white silk, followed by a cast party with confetti and balloons.

And there had better be clowns. A pox upon the house of Kerplunk if there are not clowns!

JereIC · Post Post #395 (isolation #18) » Thu Jan 13, 2005 8:55 am

Well, you're scum.

I'm Inspector Black. My backstory is that I came up pre-game to investigate Madame Hunter's death, and even though I found her untimely passing suspect, others declared no foul play, and I couldn't do anything. I still can't do anything, and I have no night choices; I am a townie. So I couldn't have targetted Quagmire last night in any way.

Anyway,

Vote: kerplunk

JereIC · Post Post #407 (isolation #19) » Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:55 am

As suspicious as I've been of mole, and as much as I feel like he is leading us through the world's greatest Lepton gambit, and as much as I can't get past the notion that he's a second killer try to bump Stewie off to win the game, instead of going through another night, that was a pretty lame claim Stewie.

JereIC · Post Post #409 (isolation #20) » Fri Jan 21, 2005 8:34 am

Actually, it looks like it was Yoko Kuramawho was playing your role then. And there's one weird point where, after Thoth claims day 1, YK randomly votes for mole. It seems like that would have been a perfect opportunity to randomly vote for Thoth, whom he would have known was lying then.

JereIC · Post Post #411 (isolation #21) » Fri Jan 21, 2005 1:55 pm

Yeah, I understand it's tough having to defend the guy you replaced (see me and Rick). I'm holding my vote until mole posts again.

JereIC · Post Post #413 (isolation #22) » Sun Jan 23, 2005 4:50 pm

Hey, mole! You got anything to add?

JereIC · Post Post #416 (isolation #23) » Mon Jan 24, 2005 1:42 pm

Hmph. I really can't get over this feeling that I'm being manipulated by mole. I kind of feel like if I were jeep or mathcam, I would have picked out the giveaways and I'd be casting a no lynch vote right now, to let Stewie and mole cut each other up tonight. However, when I re-read the thread, I can't find anything close to concrete evidence. My gut has been wrong, very wrong, before, and I'm not going to trust it this time. But, you know, if mole turns out to be scum, I want to be the first to say I told you so. By 'you', of course, I mean myself.

Vote: Stewie

And mole, if you are scum, you totally get a nomination in the 2005 Scummines.

JereIC · Post Post #422 (isolation #24) » Tue Jan 25, 2005 3:20 pm

Wow, it's like the world conspired to play with my head. C'mon, Phoebus, stop playing with my already sweatin' head! Pretty, please?

JereIC · Post Post #432 (isolation #25) » Fri Jan 28, 2005 3:08 pm

Whew. I really was nearly convinced that mole was another killer in the end game discussion there. Stewie, I've got to sympathize, I've replaced scum before and it's always difficult to figure out what to say about the guy you replace. I think you did a pretty good job though, and I wouldn't have voted for you except by the process of elimination.