Mini 843- The Fast and the Furious Mafia! (Over-Mod Error)

[Faraday]

/confirmed

[Faraday]

Vote Boxman

obv scum.

[Faraday]

boxman who's scum?

[Faraday]

Do you not like bandwagons and think they provide information?

Don may have given a reason, but really, that makes him less likely to be scum, because....why? Do you think unexplained votes are scummy?

Surely Kodamma would/should be at the top since he placed a later vote on you and also didn't give a reason, no?

[Faraday]

where did i call your vote scummy?

i find you removing your unvote more interesting, and boxman not placing you top of his scumlist.

[Faraday]

Unreasoned votes attempting to bandwagon me to lynch within a few hours for a single semi-random vote are scummy to me, yes.

the likelyhood of you being lynched off a random bandwagon like that is ...what, pretty much zero.

this isn't a newbie game.

[Faraday]

Well I can understand why you'd prefer not to be bandwagoned. I'm more-so seeing trying to see if you actually think the bandwagon has scummy motivations.

Bandwagons are a good way to end the 'random voting stage', the sooner that ends the better. I see nothing wrong with 3 people jumpin on in an effort to kickstart discussion.

[Faraday]

Starbuck anything else to add?

Also would like to point out the next few days are slightly hectic for me, moving in to a new apartment and first week of university, so I could be short on posting time.

[Faraday]

Scum wants to be in the middle of an irrational bandwagon. I bet Kodamma was hoping somebody would jump on after him. Nobody jumps on, well then we gotta jump off! The last person to jump on always gets some attention, and thats bad for scum.

There is no real one place scum want to be. Trying to read his mind will get us no-where, I think he just simply jumped on the bandwagon. There's nothing particularly suspicious about that in and of itself.

Whoaaa this game is moving wayy faster than my last game haha...

With that said, what prompted everyone to start voting Boxman all of a sudden? I can see Faraday suggesting the worth of a bandwagon, especially minus the risk that he'd get randomly lynched... But can you clarify this more? This is my first non-newbie game, so perhaps a bit explanation might help.

Bandwagons are good, in general.

A vote is our means of pressure, thus more votes = moar pressure. The bandwagon on Boxman not only let us guage his reaction, but like we saw who he was suspicious of and so on. Basically it's a good way to kick the game off, and end the 'random voting stage' (hate that term).

Actually nevermind, I just caught up with the thread and it's starting to make more sense. Out of the three that bandwagoned, faraday and don I'd have to say come off as fairly neutral, assuming I'm wording my thoughts correctly. Kodamna's intentions, on the other hand, are quite debateable I'd have to say... Ross does have a point about kod...

Why do myself and don in particular appear neutral?

What do you mean by 'debateable'. Please clarify.

While you are absolutely correct about me testing the waters with my bandwagon vote Ross, I think you, and others, misunderstand my intentions on unvoting.

It makes no sense for me to unvote fearing I was under scrutiny, as I've only become under serious scrutiny, since unvoting.

I stand by my statement when I unvoted, I found Boxman's reaction to be strong and I was not pushing for a player to feel threatened this early in day 1. I did find Faraday's probing questions to Boxman regarding his decision and placement of order of suspects interesting, mostly because, Faraday has yet to remove his vote from Boxman.

Hence my vote for Faraday. To which he raised suspicions of my allegiance, but did not answer why he left his vote up.

Food for thought.

Why don't you want a player, boxman in this case, to feel threatened this early on Day 1. Don't use it early in being day 1 as an excuse, that's crap, it's never too early to put people under pressure.

Thanks; I'm well aware I've yet to remove my vote. You also didn't answer my question in post 36. Where did I call you scummy, I was asking Boxman, using his logic, why you'd not be at the top of his scumlist. I didn't indicate your bandwagonning vote was scummy, and in fact I thought it was reasonably clear I felt the opposite.

I do not think he should be the lynch of the day (he probably won't either as it's only the start of the day and the main reasons for his lynch are bad in the first place

It was pretty much a random bandwagon, so obviously the reasons are less than stellar.

MordyS's 50/51 are solid/correct.

I really didn't see what don_johnson saw of Boxman. It's supposed to be RVS, so why give a reason at all? I definitely don't like that quick bandwagon.

Now I'm not really that suspicious of don_johnson because at least he gave a detailed reason, but MordyS and Kodamma jumped on for no reason other than "who can resist a wagon!". Kodamma, once called out, quickly jumps off the wagon.

I'm not sure if I buy his defense in post 48.

FOS: Kodamma

Why FOS instead of vote?

I know that you started it and I did just read it, so please don't tell me to re-read. don_johnson was the only person who gave a reason, you didn't even give one.

I really don't buy that you were trying to get the game moving.

Why are you trying to deflect attention?

Why not? What do you think his motivation was then?

So more or less, Mordy is FOSing me for disagreeing with him because we have different points of view.

This is a strawman.

Tjoe doesn't seem like the type who's going to contribute much information.....piggybacking can mean you're scum, or you're just lazy town.....lazy town is worst, because there's no solution for it....at least we can lynch scum. Lynching town is never a good idea.

This is all obvious and seems like posting for the sake of posting.

Do you think Tjoe is scum or lazy town at this stage?

Also

Unvote Vote Kodamma

[Faraday]

A quick meta of Tjoe seems to suggest this is actually standard-ish behaviour from him. General lack of content, bandwaggoning etc. Check your other posts yourself to have a look.

Will do a more in-depth read later tho' just in case. Uni first.

[Faraday]

From what I've gathered Faraday seems pro-town to me so far. He has done nothing particuarly scummy in my eyes and is contributing a lot to the discussion. I would like to hear more from Kodamma before I do much more first. Kodamma-Can you please tell us everything you were thinking as you voted boxman and quickly jumped off?

I'll wait for kodamma too

Let's not all stop posting while we wait on him to show up though. There are other players in the game

There is no real one place scum want to be. Trying to read his mind will get us no-where, I think he just simply jumped on the bandwagon. There's nothing particularly suspicious about that in and of itself.

NOWHERE?...not entirely true.some scum may use MordyS' lead as momentum to bring more vote

Well from the qualifiers you used i.e. 'some' and 'may' then I'd say it kinda proves my point. Not really worthy of discussion though.

A vote is our means of pressure, thus more votes = moar pressure. The bandwagon on Boxman not only let us guage his reaction, but like we saw who he was suspicious of and so on. Basically it's a good way to kick the game off, and end the 'random voting stage' (hate that term).

quick bandwagon isn't good for town and can considerable anti-town.

this bandwagon was both good for the town and quick, obviously context is key, as with everything.

Re: Starbuck and her FOS: fair 'nuff really. It wasn't clear to me that you suspected Mordy more than Kodamma.

[Faraday]

Reasons for the vote:
It tests the waters
It provokes discussion
It definitely ended the RVS stage although I seem to be the target as a result

This is fine, and was not something I, in this case was even curious about.

Reasons for the unvote:
My statement about him feeling threatened is truly what I felt. Why it mattered to me is that Boxman's reaction, and the resulting discussion between Boxman and Faraday, made it seem like Box is truly town. Meaning that, worst case scenario, all town had bandwagoned him and scum could easily pile on and hammer the lynch home. Although this seems unprobable, as it would make there actions very obvious to some players, why give them the opportunity.

How likely would you say it'd be for scum to quick lynch someone day 1? Unless they're say, completely incompetent, nothing so blatant will happen.

What about his reaction made him seem town? You think b/c he felt under threat he's more likely to be town? If that's the case then I flat out disagree, as it's a null tell. I actually thought he over-reacted a bit to a random bandwagon.

My gut in all of this though is that in my experience, Day 1 is usually spent with a lot of active town, tripping over their own discussions and quicly laid suspicions, resulting in us lynching one of our own and then re-evaluating on Day 2 as the scum have then killed whichever one of us during Day 1 was having the most productive discussions. It has also been my experience that most scum spend Day 1 hanging back and making low content posts to let the town deal with themselves.

I don't like this at all. Seems like an excuse to go lurker hunting (not in and of itself a bad thing fwiw) and excusing scummy behaviour if people are active. I realise that's probably an oversimplification of what you're trying to say, but still this rubs me the wrong way.

Also at this point, I am pretty sure Faraday's intentions are pure.

Wait...why?

I hope this helps us all on our further discussions, and I do understand why the interpretations of my actions combined with my recent absence led us down this road.

You seem to be tring too hard to appease everyone, like you don't want to ruffle anyones feathers.

There's no reason for a scum player to respond as adamantly as he did towards to quick bandwagon.
He also responded well to Faraday's discussion regarding logic behind people's moves and why they may be helpful vs. damning.

From what I've seen, a scum player in that position would be more inclined to invalidate the bandwagon through deflecting back onto those people that bandwagoned on him rather than listening to logic and dissecting arguments to find points of interest/contention.

I don't understand the first bit. Surely scum or town would have equal reason to oppose the bandwagon. Do you think his strong opposition to his

own

banwagon to be a town tell? That doesn't really make sense to me, if that's what you're saying.

But he (boxman)

initially

did point back to the people on the bandwagon did he not?

Are you guys the most obvious scumteam ever or just mindless sheep?

Seems to indicate he did find those on his bandwagon scummy. Sure he eventually agreed/conceded some points, but that wasn't his initial reaction.

Kodamma who's scum?

Shadow Knight now that we've heard from Kodamma what are your thoughts?

Mordy I have a hard time seeing much to cause you to unvote in Kodamma's last post, what in particular satisfied you enough to unvote.

[Faraday]

What about his reaction made him seem town? You think b/c he felt under threat he's more likely to be town? If that's the case then I flat out disagree, as it's a null tell. I actually thought he

over-reacted a bit

to a random bandwagon.

which part of his post u said overreacted?

Not really sure I understand this. I think the whole 'wtf' response from him was a tad of an over-reaction. Not even sure if that's what you're asking though.

This isn't necessarily a good thing, Kodamma. It's a common scum tactic to not try to promote any agenda, try not to ruffle any feathers (as Faraday himself pointed out), and hope to slide under anyone's suspicion. I'd rather see someone with a pushy agenda who lays it all out there.

True enough, although I would disagree that I'm doing anything like that i.e. trying not to ruffle feathers/slide by.


More later; I have to run. Literally run.

[Faraday]

MOD EDIT: Your Tags are fixed.

[Faraday]

@ Mordy: That's probably fair enough re: the Low content vs lurkers thing, but I still don't really like it. I see your point though.

Heads up scum. Being buddy-buddy with the town doesn't mean a thing. We'll lynch you anyway. So Kodamma and anybody else, you might as well stop playing the social game now because there is no social game to be played.

God I don't like this

at all

. It seems completely off, and even forced.

As to Kodamma's point about him feeling that Boxman was threatened, I'd agree on the part that Boxman seemed very confused and worried, and I myself felt that, but that was due to my relative inexperience at the time.

Yeh this while probably correct, tells us nothing about his alignment.

Too many people not voting.

I've no clue who Shadow Knight's top suspect is for example, he's been quite enough unless prodded with questions, and seems to be quite...idk passive, although perhaps it's just a playstyle.

Could the people not voting explain why, it seems like there's no reason not to have your vote on someone.

Starbuck you still have your vote on MordyS. Who would you say is your second suspect at this point?

And don is the only one who hasn't posted recently afaik. Not sure if he's within prod range or anything though, as we're moving at quite a fast pace.

Still very happy w/ my vote though, ftr.[/mech]

[Faraday]

Couple of quick things...

While townies aren't afraid to piss people off, good townies realize that while the spotlight is on them, it isn't on scum. I generally try to keep my head down during the first day unless I spot a blatant scumtell.

Can you provide a link/game to show evidence of this, just so I can skim over. Search being down is a bitch, . Just to make sure this is true. Prefferably one as scum and town, but if not one will do.

With regards to voting in general, I personally see my vote as being final

But it's not, you can change your vote at any time a lynch hasn't been achieved, thus there's no real reason not to use it, and have it on your top suspect.

And it's hard to defend the validity of something to someone who's only complaint is that it's awkward. "forced" is the word of the week apparently, but if my posts are consistantly that way, it's just a player trait...If I was doing something out of the ordinary it would be weird....Do a meta on me if your feeling diehard, I get that awkward reaction alot in these games.

I don't think they

are

consistently that way, but the two pointed out could be considered 'forced', buzzwords for the win. I'm not sure if it's over-eager townie, or over-eager scum though, it's just something I felt like needed to be pointed out, especially for future reference.


Need more don and starbuck in the thread. I've a splitting headache, so I'm off to bed.

[/mech]

[Faraday]

no idea what happened there. lmao. oh well. it's readable. forgot my '' around the names FFFFFFFFFFU:(

[Faraday]

Hmm some thoughts:

Starbuck seems different than twilight mafia; she seems to be less agressive here, and while town in that game she was mislynched, that's my only meta on her, though it's probably a weird game due to the nature of how it begin w/ Zwet being ridiculous.

The problem w/ Tjoe is it seems to be esentially a policy lynch, however I can see why his play would be seem as scummy, in general, it just seems to be the norm for him, however it does seem anti-town.

Tjoe what do you think of Boxman?

Shadow: I'm not asking you to self meta, I askesd for a link so I can meta. There's quite a difference there. Also that's annoying with search down, but I remember reading a deep south game where you were town, so I'll use that. It's just to make sure you're consistent. Who's your top suspect at the moment shadow? I get that you say you're careful, but there's careful/cautious and there's careful.

Boxman's list is there; he seems to be taking positions at least, even if they're not definite (though they won't be at this stage) which is good. A lot of people neutral or neutral leaning scum/town but not really scummy.

It does seem to still be slightly OMGUS as ther only reason for his Mordy suspicioun though.

[Faraday]

Shadow seems more cautious when scum, from the 2 games I've read where he was one of each. Noted, although admittedly my sampe size is ridiculously small. Might need to read over some of his old games, when I get the chance. Blah.

I remember reading ASOIAF on mtgs, but that was ages ago. Bleh. Anyway carry on,happy with my kodamma vote and see no reason to change it.

[Faraday]

@Faraday

In post 97, you seem to be picking apart Kodamma's response to find anything damning against him. That may not be how you meant it, but it's definitely how I read it.

Interesting interpretation, I'd say. What I meant to do was show I was in no way happy with his explanation. I don't like the last line here. I may not have meant it? Do you think I did mean to ...'find anything damning against him'.Seems to me here just because you found his post solid I should do the same, but that'd be just craaaazy.

Also what particularl parts of my post do you think I'm ....well reaching (as it seems that's what you're accusing me of).

Your response to Kodamma definitely perked my interest in you, and I think I'll be reading you in iso later.

Perked it...how? I assumed you mean you think I'm scummy/slightly scummy, but you seem to be hesitant to say so.


Welcome Spyrex. Are you scum?

More later, if you'll excuse me I'm off to get wasted.

[Faraday]

ill cvommetn tomorrow.

welcome ani

[Faraday]

That word "misrepresentation" is being tossed around quite a bit, I think the correct word might be "misinterpretation".

This is very fluffy. It's also possible he was accusing him of misrepresentation.

IN any case...on to more interesting things.

I like SpyreX's entry to the game, he seems fairly solidly townie, at the moment.
His case on Shadow Knight certaintly looks reasonably good. I agree that Shadow's remained pretty decidedly neutral on quite a lot, and seems to be content to not take many positions. I also agree that's scummy.

What do you think of Kodamma btw?

You know Mordy, you are really struggling to get a case on me.

There have been quite a few incidents where people have stated that they were misrepresented, or that someone said they said something that they did not, or twisted their words. That's all a way to misrepresent someone.

Oh I really hate that first line. What possible reason would you have for saying that?

Do you really think this line of discussion is helpful re: how many people were saying they were misrepresented or not. Seems a useless line of enquiry to pursue.

I find your lack of scum-hunting worrying.

Also accusing someone of not reading the game carefully is hardly ad-hom.

[Faraday]

dj's not lurking. he's just been busy. haven't done a thorough read through here, but i agree with the suspicion on starbuck. top of my list is doombunny. they seem too polite, like they're trying real hard to please, but that could simply be overzealous town. i'll update when i can.

do this plz.

[Faraday]

DO NOT SAY YOU WILL POST TOMORROW OR IN THE MORNING OR LATER OR ANY OF THAT. IF YOU HAVE BEEN GONE AND ARE GOING TO REREAD JUST POST YOUR REREAD. THIS GOES FOR ANYONE ELSE, IF YOU ARE GOING TO REREAD THEN POST THE REREAD. DONT POST A "I'LL DO IT LATER" IF YOU ARE GOING TO DO IT LATER FINE JUST DO IT.

Agreed w/ BUNNY.

Will have a post up later

[Faraday]

Boxman: Either town or scum. DEFINTALEY not neutral. As the reation was quite big, I'd like to know what made him do that, but seems willing to help.

RossWilliam: Neutral, as he seems to be grave digigng and pulling himself out of it at the same time, if that makes any sense.

Your read on Boxman is odd, I don't see why it matters that he's probably not a neutral SK(or even how you came to that conclusion) but yeh, an odd thing to say. Do you think 'willingness to help' is more indicative of town then? (help..what?)

I don't understand the ross point, at all, so please clarify.

[Faraday]

Not a massive fan of PBPA's in general, I feel if you try hard enough you can make anything look scummy, and I don't want to clog up the thread, but just a few points of clarification. Won't have every quote in there, as no one likes quote walls.

boxman who's scum?

Generating discussion is good, but you seriously expect a scum list this early? This strikes me as weird because at this point, boxman has 4 votes on him so its almost like you're daring him to OMGUS someone.

it was due to his reaction, more-so. Wanted to see what he thought.
Moving on, I'm not trying to get him to say something 'stupid' or scummy, just to try and find out his motivations.

can you explain the second part a little better? You find the removing of his unvote (or did you mean his vote) more interesting? Also, are you saying you find kodamma's action more interesting than or equally interesting as boxman not putting him higher on the scumlist?

Both actions together, to me, were interesting. One or the other on their own, is fair, but I thought it might indicate a link between them two.

you seem to reverse your thoughts on kodamma (apparently now, its not scummy at all to be part of that bandwagon?)

I hadn't previously said it was. it was Kodamma who had inferred I had called him scummy for bandwagoning, I had said no such thing, to my knowledge. It most certaintly isn't scummy to bandwagon in the random stage. That's what piqued my kodamma interest.

I'm curious to know why the vote on kodamma here. What changed since the beginning of the post?

I wasn't defending him, just pointing out the logic against him was poor in certain places.
Voted him mostly for the lovely 'Too early to scum-hunt' thing that he used. Refusal to answer my question. Found it vote-worthy.

I'm starting to realize that your method of scum hunting is trying to get people to talk themself into a circle. I don't mind pointing out crap logic when you see it, but laying traps where you ask questions designed to confuse people is going to catch town as often as you do scum. I'm still on the fence whether Faraday is townie or scum at this point.

I'm not sure about this. Like; idk if that's what I do or not. I'm not trying to lay traps, but I like to see if people remain consistent, or at least if they're not why. Stuff like, I feel helps find scum. Basically; okay.


I think I answered all questions there; if there's anything in [particular you're unsure of ask.

Interested to see who you find scummy. Also weekened that it is, won't have time to post much

[Faraday]

^^ ok, so it's going to be one of

those

games.

i am now officially entering "skim" mode until further notice.

anyone care to garner my vote towards a lynch?

haven't you been in skim mode all game? provide something.

lots of people v/la too it seems

[Faraday]

in bed w/ flu will get to this when i feel better :/

[Faraday]

@ Sk I feel I catch bears more often than racoons..but be that as it may.

Re: Ani/Doombunny being opposite alignments, well I'm not so sure. Earlier I felt there was a possible chance of being scum together. I do think it's a valid point, though, that the semantical debate is iffy.

With that said, I think Ani is more likely to be scum. His predecessor's actions were quite scummy, as I've already pointed out, and he's done nothing at all to change my mind. Mostly neutral reads, a vote on Starbuck (granted I feel she's scummy too, which lessens this, it must be said) and not much else.

I'd like to hear more from him before I make my mind up, though, but I'm content at this moment to leave my vote on him.

DJ is lurking or busy, w/e makes no difference as he's popping up with the occasional comment and that's about it.

DJ why are you voting Ani atm?

You seem to think Bunny is scum, if I can read correctly. I'm not really seeing much in post 250, either way, could you explain a little more.

[Faraday]

we are all power roles, the fact that mordys doesn't know this is unsettling.

Indeed, it's stated there are

no

vanilla townies.

I'd like an explanation for this.

Oh, and it goes without saying that Ani should now claim.

[Faraday]

Vote Starbuck

more later

[Faraday]

oh yeh mod internet out at home, so limited access probably.

[Faraday]

You've been fairly scummy up to this point.
Then you come in with this gem:

Well those are some great results. 3 down. /sigh

[Faraday]

You've been fairly scummy up to this point.
Then you come in with this gem:

Well those are some great results. 3 down. /sigh

So no case other than that I've been pretty scummy (with no reasons), and what I posted after the write up?

'No case'? Well that's quite clearly not what I said.

I just haven't bothered making one, as of yet.

[Faraday]

'studying' in the librarby atm so this'll be brief.

I don't see why starbuck claimed so early, I don't want to get into Neighbour/Mason bs, that belongs in GD, it does probably make her more likely to be town, but the fact that she claimed so early, and w/o much reason is odd.

Don: She's saying it's a co-incidence I would assume, i'd be rather confused if not.

neighbours are unconfirmed masons, pretty much.

I too am assuming ani is NOT a neutral survivor, seems like something that happened in Death Note mafia (large theme) where modkilled people were treated as nuetral survivors. Perhaps mod clarification would be best (by perhaps I mean obviously )

SpyreX any particular reason as to why I'm raising your hackles?

I agree that one of the lurkers are probably scum, tho' I guess random odds would nearly assume this anyway.

[Faraday]

Gonna go through Starbuck and what I feel are the main points against her.

I really didn't see what don_johnson saw of Boxman. It's supposed to be RVS, so why give a reason at all? I definitely don't like that quick bandwagon.

Now I'm not really that suspicious of don_johnson because at least he gave a detailed reason, but MordyS and Kodamma jumped on for no reason other than "who can resist a wagon!". Kodamma, once called out, quickly jumps off the wagon.

I'm not sure if I buy his defense in post 48.

FOS: Kodamma

I don't get this, I mean you say you're not suspicious of Don just b/c he gave a reason. That seems like a rather large amount of craplogic. A detailed reason can be still full of shit, like don's pretty much was (no offense).

I know that you started it and I did just read it, so please don't tell me to re-read. don_johnson was the only person who gave a reason, you didn't even give one. I really don't buy that you were trying to get the game moving. Why are you trying to deflect attention?

Well I've already given my opinions on this post. I don't see why you wouldn't buy MordyS reasoning, really. It's obvious he wanted to get the game started.

So more or less, Mordy is FOSing me for disagreeing with him because we have different points of view.

if you read the exchange this is a pretty clear strawman, he's saying she's being inconsistent and making a poor argument.

@Faraday - I FOS'd because currently I don't feel the need to move my vote on Mordy. His back and forth with me has made me a bit suspicious of him, so I'll be leaving my vote on him for the time being.

Refering to her earlier FOS on kodamma. I'd like to point out this seems false, due to the fact the exchange with Mordy only really started after her FOS.
I didn't even spot this initially. I'm not sure if it's scummy per-se, as I suppose it's just...wrong?

Her 148 is rather okay.

I still don't get how me as neutral would pique her interest. I think her vote on Ross wasn't bad, really. He was quite scummy at the time.

You know Mordy, you are really struggling to get a case on me.

I don't like this. No quantifiable reason, it just sits awfully with me.

Was/is the main points against starbuck.

She also refers to herself as town, or the town a lot, which may just be something she does, regardless though, so I'll have to check that out.

Don't like the gem of a post @ the start of day as I said, the straw that broke the camel's back if you will.

early claim = meh. I can see her town reasoning, for wanting an early claim, but also the scum ones. I find claiming w/o reason to be less than optimum play though, at the very least.

Her neighbour dying night 1 isn't really much of a tell, I guess, idk, I just see the claim as no reason to believe her to not be scum.

Anyway, that's basically it. I think Starbuck is very probably scum.

Don_johnson is also probably scum, I think.

someone should investigate her. lynching at this point is stupid. her role is as confirmed as it can be, and her alignment can be discovered other ways. continuing to push this angle is distracting from actual scumhunting imo, and the behavior itself should be indicative of lazy scum latching onto the "easy" suspicion

Well, ya know, if she's scum it's kinda not distracting at all.

Also the fact he's done pretty much nothing all game apart from pop up w/ the occasional one liner. His reasoning for finding SpyreX scum, for not dying. Think he's also a possible scum-partner for Starbuck, i.e. could easily see them being scum together.

I'm also going to..admit I'm a bit confused re: the ani situation. Not knowing if he was scum or not is a severe handicap. As well we can't look for possible scum-partners or not

sorry if this is all over the place

[Faraday]

will catch up on this soon.

Weekened + Fifa 10 = busy.

[Faraday]

Here catching up now.

Tjoe's claim is obviously provable, I see no reason to still be voting him.

[Faraday]

idk why the V/LA case convinced anyone top vote starbuck over anything else, it's not like she hasn't been scummy enough without it. Don Johnsons weird jump on the wagon to try and get her to get back in the game or w/e the fuck it was is scummy too.

If he thought she was town he should have no reason to vote for her.


11 items is lawls. Never seen anything like that. Second the question of if you know what the items do, btw.

[Faraday]

Unvote Vote Don Johnson

starbuck's unlynchable it seems.

[Faraday]

Don't hammer.


I'm confirming him as legit. I got something.

[Faraday]

faraday: so its scummy to pressure other players to respond to cases brought against them that contain tangible evidence?

you realize that you are now voting for someone who has backed off two wagons that were at L-1?

spyrex: lovin it. i am much surprised that oone is coming forward and acknowledging receipt of an item from our 'inventor". seems silly for him not to have used his ability last night, and if someone is witholding info then they are most likely scum so i see no reason for tjoe to be protecting his target here.

I realise I'm voting for you, why should I care that you've backed off? Is that supposed to automatically make you town

I didn't want to make it obvious I had an item, I don't see why that's anti-town or even scummy.
Also I get the impression from the pm that it's possible for items to have adverse effects. But maybe that's just me reading too much into it. I had the option of declining the item, but I can never resist a big red button.

[Faraday]

there are 1 person (given at night 1) who can confirm that I'm an "inventor"

I know that he/she won't know that I give him/her that item but at least he/she can confirm the existence of an inventor.

Yo pay attention, I just did.

Did you know what item you were giving me

For full disclosure I got the pm after the day started, to my knowledge, I can check the time stamps to be sure, but yeh. I was told I'd recieved a package and had the option to take it or not.

[Faraday]

^^^ lynch this guy.

[Faraday]

first post fail.

Obviously I mean DJ.

[Faraday]

I can't wait for endgame for my alignment to be proven and for you guys to see that I am really town.

I wish I had someone who actually dedicated his time to the game so we could have actually used our ability. It's the reason I wanted to replace out because I feel like I'm being punished because he never showed up to the QT last night.

I wouldn't be surprised though if I am the NK tonight. Even though basically now, I'm just a vanilla townie.

You don't have to keep re-asserting you're town. It's actually really pointless, as you know, it changes no one's opinion of you. Srsly.


As for DJ/SK, well Dj's funnies aside, I feel there are some valid points made.
He's basically following w/e SpyreX does after saying he found it odd he wasn't nightkilled.

running joke. though statistics support my theory.

Yo, Dj. Does this mean you weren't serious? It certaintly came across as serious.

MordyS is lookin' more likely scum to me, though I can't really place why, I do trust my gut. Still don't like the not knowing about no vanilla, to me, that seems something scum are more likely to slip up on,. tho there is no factual evidence to back that up.

Tjoe is OBV town. SpyreX looks town to me too.

JereIC replaced Roland? Who was actually moderately scummy, I think. Though I could be confusing him w/ someone else who replaced out. Lemme go check, actually.

Jere probably needs to be a little more involved.

Vote count would be handy, too plz mod.

[Faraday]

Actually confused Roland w/ Ross in my head it seems, roland looked town to me.

[Faraday]

VoteCount!

TJoe Min Ja-(1)- Starbuck,
DonJohnson-(2)- Tjoe Min Ja, Faraday
Shadow Knight-(2)- SpyerX, Boxman,Don_Johnson
MordyS-(1)- JereIC
Boxman-(1)- MordyS

Not Voting-(1)- Shadow Knight
With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is set for Monday, October 19th @11:59 p.m.

Is that a correct vote-count. Changed DON'S VOTE.

Might have missed a few others.

Is Starbuck actually still voting Tjoe? Why? (if you are?)

[Faraday]

I sometimes wish I was a dayvig, just once

Anyway, still quite happy w/ a DJ lynch. He's done nothing to change my mind imo.

Spyrex still looks fairly towntowntown. Boxman be rubbing me the wrong way (mind out of the gutter, plz ) so i'll probs go back and read him in iso when i get a chance.
Aka wednesday or tomorrow, have exams tuesday.

[Faraday]

I sometimes wish I was a dayvig, just once

Anyway, still quite happy w/ a DJ lynch. He's done nothing to change my mind imo.

Spyrex still looks fairly towntowntown. Boxman be rubbing me the wrong way (mind out of the gutter, plz ) so i'll probs go back and read him in iso when i get a chance.
Aka wednesday or tomorrow, have exams tuesday.

the dj wagon isn't happening. shadow knight is getting lynched today. please get with the program.

Why not help it along by switching your vote to him

[Faraday]

I meant switch your vote to Don Johnson

[Faraday]

Explain your role in more detail, plz, SK.

As in bodyguard type? Also Ani's flip makes this more difficult, as I highly doubt a BG + Doctor in a set-up.

Also you should claim your target last night, pl0x.

[Faraday]

Nope, iirc he was voting him most of yesterday. Also I missed a few questions, brb.

[Faraday]

that would be silly.

but seriously. are you ignoring shadow's issues? what points that he made against me to you agree with? what part of my response to his case do you disagree with?

Your response was quite good, i guess. I just have a gut read of scum on you. It feels like you're following Spyrex around and don't really care who we lynch too much.

@ Mordy, yep I find SK to be quite scummy.

Eh, you're not going to be modkilled for telling us what you're role does.
Do you think Ani was scum, Sk?

[Faraday]

Sup, gonna re-read the game w/ the new information.

Starbuck seems possible, but for some reason Mordy's jump on the wagon makes me suspicious too, so I need to read that again.

[Faraday]

^^ needs to be investigated a bit more.

You don't look terribly busy, perhaps you should go do it yourself then.

KOC's inventions are legit, so he's confirmed.

I find MordyS switch onto the wagon weird. In just one post he goes from saying he agrees with what most of SK has said to voting him, pretty much. It's a very sudden turn, and it was at a time when it seemed like Sk was probably going to be lynched.

Also his not knowing this wasn't vanilla is probably something scum are more likely to forget/not know imo.

Vote MordyS

DJ bussing seems, unlikely. SpyreX is fairly obv town.

Idk, if Starbuck as a scum neighbour would defend scum like that, she'd be looking to try stay fairly confirmed and 'clean' WIFOM though.

Hey what do people think of Boxman's 606 thoug.

The no kills line, it reads..wrong to me. Like he's afraid something's stopped his kill, idk. Maybe it's just me, I don't like it though.

As for my

Mordy
Boxman/Starbuck

Would be my top 3 suspects for the lynch, atm.

[Faraday]

I find MordyS switch onto the wagon weird. In just one post he goes from saying he agrees with what most of SK has said to voting him, pretty much. It's a very sudden turn, and it was at a time when it seemed like Sk was probably going to be lynched.

Also his not knowing this wasn't vanilla is probably something scum are more likely to forget/not know imo.

lol. I'd respond to this, but I'm not sure there's an argument in here. But what the hell. I'll point out the obvious: I can simultaneously agree with SK's argument against DJ while finding SK suspicious himself. This seems so blindingly obvious that I can't believe I have to say it out loud.

As for the second point: Why exactly is my "not knowing this wasn't vanilla" probably something scum are more likely to forget/not know? Please actually answer this question so I know you actually believe your case and aren't just blowing smoke?

Sure ya can, but where did you find SK suspicious before that? Maybe I've genuinely missed it, but was it just that one post that made you vote him?

I just think it's something they more likely are to forget. A town full of poweroles are more likely to be aware that everyone else is a power role, it's not somethiong that they'relikely to forget. I mean I really don't see how you could forget the town are all power roles, knowing that you, if town are a power role wouldn't it remind you?

[Faraday]

Ok, at the moment I'm split. On one hand, SK's #355 sounds scummy to me. It's doesn't deliver a lot of content, and really makes a pedantic argument. Add that to his super long PBP where he doesn't find a scum but clears a guy as Townie, and I'm a little suspicious. I'd love to hear more about why DJ and SpryeX find him suspicious.

This is bothering me. Faraday's comment makes sense, but it sounds like SK is lying about where DJ's vote is. Not to mention, and okay, this is the really bizarre part: The only person currently without a voting record is SK. Why would SK say that when just at the top of this page are TWO vote counts, both showing DJ voting for SK, and both showing SK not voting for anyone? So yeah. Since I don't see this Boxman vote getting any traction, I'm willing to put SK at L-1.

So at least two posts I wrote explaining why I found SK suspicious.

A town full of poweroles are more likely to be aware that everyone else is a power role, it's not somethiong that they'relikely to forget. I mean I really don't see how you could forget the town are all power roles, knowing that you, if town are a power role wouldn't it remind you?

This is inane dude, even without taking into account that there are no vanilla Mafia roles either. Plus, the problem wasn't that I forgot. The problem was that I misread the post. So remembering that I had a power role wouldn't remind me it was a game with no vanilla roles.

^^ come on, now. we can't all be don_johnson.

Fair enough. Just consider all the posting I did about Boxman yesterday to apply in full force today. If you need me to repost those arguments, I'd be happy to do it.

blah lemme re-read and come back to this.

Unvote

[Faraday]

^ Wait what.

Come again? I assumed the same thing, b/c they targeted me.

[Faraday]

I'm assuming someone tried to kill me last night.

[Faraday]

and put him at L-1?

Vote Boxman

Okay.

[Faraday]

Hey Boxman.

[Faraday]

Do you agree or disagree with it?

[Faraday]

I need to change my avatar soon. I'm thinking of changing it everytime a game I'm in ends.


But yeh, Starbuck, don't hammer him yet.

[Faraday]

Boxman should claim too.

[Faraday]

Well the quickness is evident.

Quick = bad. Blah let's no be SLOWPOKES, live a little.

[Faraday]

quick = bad? was meant to be a question obv.

[Faraday]

I would definitely like some insight from JereIC, KoC and Faraday.

Well I think you're scummy, as I've said previously.

Also ignoring that giant bomb of a GD thread, completely.

Mordy, I'd prefer to not answer your question at this point, it seems well, more beneficial to wait till/if I need to fullclaim before I out that info.

[Faraday]

What bothers me about Faraday/JereIC/Knights of Cydonia is that, even when they participate, they're really coasting during this game. It's not townie behavior. There's been almost no scum-hunting or discussion out of them. The whole thing has gotten me very paranoid, and I'm starting to feel like almost anyone could be a good lynch at this point. (I have very few super town reads, and a lot of neutral/wavering-scum reads.)

SUPERWAT. how have i been coasting/ I'm pretty sure I made cases against kodamma/starbuck on days 1 and 2. I've been pretty active and involved in a lot of discussion. You wound me, good sir.

Hey Starbuck why are you using bandwagoning on known scum as a negative thing. Also you just point it out, what conclusions do you draw from it.

I'll be quite happy to rosso carne Starbuck, but I think there's more to discuss atm.

[Faraday]

Look, someone posted on that meta,

I remember we lynched you as town in twilight mafia. I remember thinking the way you claimed was scummy in that game. And I think you were sort of angry we were going to lynch you and being like "I can't wait til you jerks see I flip town! I almost want to die now to screw you all." Those kind of comments only make people want to lynch you more, in my experience. Of course, you were right and it's only natural to feel picked on when you're being strung up as town, but still, comments like that speed your death.

I read this and, as someone who wants to win this game, I can't help but second-guess my instincts here. I'm sorry that you feel your meta is unfairly being used here, but until I'm told it's not allowed, I'm not going to ignore possible evidence that exculpates you.

I find her play different to Twilight ftr.

I'm just picking out stuff that I deem relevant btw. lawls, should be doing my confocal microscope report.

[Faraday]

i'm not really sold on boxman being town, btw. i think the only thing in his favour is a vote on sk is quite early. the other points are largely very weak, as listing someone as leaning scum that early is not really very unusual for scum to do.

I could easily see a boxman/starbuck/sk scum team too from some of the points Mordy brought up, i.e. boxman's seemingly chainsaw defending Starbuck.

Wanting to see what KOC has to say too, and probs a bit more for Jere.

Yo Starbuck who do you think is scum? You probs said so but tell me again.

[Faraday]

Hey, Starbuck. What's going on?

You're right tho, I lurk the forum 24/7 and then POP UP when needed. I gots mad ninja skills for an Irish boy.

On a more serious note, I'll get to this later, only posting now cos of what Starbuck said

[Faraday]

holy shit. I assumed I was up against a survivor, but the fact Boxman could kill and I only got a bulletproof via the inventor made it pretty hard for me to win.

Tbh I tried to play as I would have played as town, and at least ANI was scum so I got one right.

Only early comment is not showing the flip of Ani really hurt the town, and me. Boxman and Kodamma had early interaction but not knowing ani's alignment made the whole thing useless.

Boxman probs would have been lynched Day 4 anyway, I think, or Jere so it's probably moot re: the screw up. Fun game and a fun player-list though.