Mini 882: Star Wars: Legacy of the Force Mafia(GAME OVER!)

[AlmasterGM]

/confirm.

I sense a disturbance in the force.

[AlmasterGM]

Vote: PHANTOM

Was all-caps really necessary?

Ironically, you don't seem to have a problem using caps even when it's not necessary.

CHINAMAN!!!

What's up?

[AlmasterGM]

It was necessary to use all caps to grab Chinaman's attention the most effectively and show my joy in seeing him in this game.

We're doomed.

[AlmasterGM]

Seriously though, Alm what did you mean by...

We're doomed.

...?

He doesn't like you.
I don't like you either.

[AlmasterGM]

I think he's randomly spouting off lines from star wars movies. I'm not sure why.

The force is strong with this one.

[AlmasterGM]

Any thoughts on the game Almaster?

Not really - has anything relevant actually happened yet?

The quotes were random, btw.

[AlmasterGM]

Like I noticed you didn't vote in RVS. Some reason you didn't feel it necessary to do so?

I didn't feel it was necessary to do so, so I didn't. Plus, I'm not really a huge fan of RVS.

Short answer is that Almaster interests me. I don't necessarily need to go into why right this second

It's OK, we can go into why. It's because of Mini 851, isn't it?

The quotes you chose were pretty specific and as Chinaman pointed out, a bit hostile/mean. I can't help but think that you chose them for a reason and would like to know what those reason were.

Agreed. Definitely not random. Plausibly game irrelevant.

I admit I was in a bit of a bad mood, which might have contributed to the quotes selected, but seriously, they had no in-game implications. I just thought the quotes would be fun.

[AlmasterGM]

No, it was more arbitrary. I wanted to see how Almaster would react to it so that I could try to get a read on him. It's a weak vote, but I still want to leave it for now as I don't have a better place to put my vote at the moment.

I'm curious to know what you were expecting and what sort of read you would have gotten.

[AlmasterGM]

Not really liking Nachomamma right now.

[AlmasterGM]

First: I'd like to hear more from I'd like to hear more from Bogre, cateraction, and snow bunny. The first two especially. .

Second: Re: jason v. nachomamma - I think jason is clearly winning the argument here. There doesn't seem to be anything wrong with being careful about a breadcrub - if anything, it seems pro-town to me. Nachomamma's justification is predicated on this opaque, non-verifiable clan forum. We have no idea how good the people there are, how the rule mechanics function, or how the specific game played out.

Third: There is something MUCH more relevant that needs to be brought to attention:

-Two: So far, you have been very cautious as to explain everything you write and make sure we all know you weren't doing something nobody accused you of doing. Jedi are not so cautious IMO. Only the Sith would want to elaborate on and cut discussion of something they previously posted.

How does Chinaman know this is a game of Sith vs. Jedi? My role PM said absolutely nothing about Sith (no beating the Sith, no killing the Sith, no winning when all Sith were dead). Chinaman is obviously going to say, "I inferred it from flavor," but that's a hugh stretch. There are MANY different opposing factions in the expanded universe, and the Sith are actually one of the less prevalent ones. Hell, the flavor in MonkeyMan's first post suggests different factions. I think Chinaman has insider information and a specific win condition that is different from the town's.

There had better be a good explanation for this ASAP.

Vote: Chinaman.

[AlmasterGM]

LOL! REALLY????

Your attempt to dismiss the case by making it into a joke is noted.

Ok, so you answered your own damned question

Noted again.

Yes, I added Jedi for town and Sith for Scum in there for flavor. Of course you already knew that since you predicted the response perfectly. If you read it in the manner in which I wrote it (enough to tell me the answer I am giving you), why are you trying this hard to make it into a Sith-tell? If you really wanna know what I see in the battles of Star Wars, I see Sith vs Jedi. Sith pull the strings and are considered evil (ie. scum) where-as Jedi are the light and good side of the battle (ie. town). Pretty fricken elementary if you ask me.

It's actually not, as you put it, "fricken elementary." If you've read any of the extended universe books, you'll know that a good chunk of them have nothing to do with the Sith. Hell, even the movies don't revolve around the Sith. Star Wars isn't all about Jedi and Sith - there are other characters, and I'm sure that the other town players are aware of this. However, if you don't have the pro-town role PM (as I suspect), you wouldn't be aware that the enemy of the town was not specified in the pro-town PM. You would simply presume we knew it was "Jedi vs Sith" (that's you, the Sith) and talk about it. Which is what you did. Which is why I suspect you

Obviously you aren't going to mount any sort of response other than what I predicted, so I don't need to hear anything else from you on the issue (unless you want to comment, of course). I'll leave it to others to agree or disagree. Also, I'm unsure of why me being able to predict arguments makes my arguments go away - maybe I'm just good at preemption.

I read this and I am at a loss for your play here. YOU think that Jason's Yoda-not-a-breadcrumb comment is harmless then you pull THIS out? WOW. That's all I have to say. Maybe Jason was right to point out something he wrote early on as not a breadcrumb before someone like you could get a hold of it.

Yes, he was right to point it out.

Hell, if anything, the Mods flavor suggesting different factions would make my comments of 1 side vs the other even more townie, would it not? It's Town/Jedi/Overall-good-guys vs the evil trying to kill us off. It doesn't matter how many factions are out there if they are all trying to kill me does it?

No, it does not make you more town. There are lots of different enemies to choose from - Imperial remnant, Yuuzhan Vong, random bad guys, whatever. Pulling "Sith" out of the hat makes me believe you had it in your role PM.

[AlmasterGM]

Why the first 2 over S_B? What makes her any different?

S_B has at least RVS'd. The other two haven't done anything but confirm. I'm definitely not a fan of S_B right now, though.

This does concern me a bit, though. I know the connotation is that he has Scum insider info, but I can't help but get a bit of a RoleFishing feel to this statement.

Not really getting this. Mafia is a game of informed minority vs majority - although townies sometimes get additional powers, they rarely get additional information (for obvious reasons). Because of this, I don't see how the rhetoric "insider information" is loaded w/ a rolefish at all.

[AlmasterGM]

More China votes sounds like an excellent idea.

[AlmasterGM]

@Kdub: Could you please tell us who you are in this game? Yes, I am asking you claim your name and if you would like, your role.

Kdub, DO NOT ANSWER ANY PART OF THIS QUESTION. Chinaman, why do you need this information? Your answer better be pretty damn specific.

Btw, I am Mara Jade Skywalker (note, a Jedi), former agent of Emperor Palpatine and currently wife of Luke Skywalker and mother to Ben Skywalker.

Moar plz. What does your role do?

[AlmasterGM]

I am vanilla townie but I do have information that will help the town IF Kdub answers and I'm able to post in response before I'm dead. Do to the specifics of my information, I can not tell you the info unless certain criteria are met. My hands are tied do to specific rules that I must abide by. In order for me to help the town by giving this info, Kdub must first answer the question.

This smells incredibly scummy. What is the penalty if you divulge the information without meeting the criteria?

[AlmasterGM]

Also, major WTF:

Btw, I am Mara Jade Skywalker (note, a Jedi), former agent of Emperor Palpatine and currently wife of Luke Skywalker and mother to Ben Skywalker.

I am vanilla townie but I do have information that will help the town

Mara Jade is vanilla town?

You've got to be kidding me.

[AlmasterGM]

The penalty is Modkill death. And yes, she's wife of Luke and mother of Ben....

Your VT claim is extremely sketchy and your rolefish with the promise of information is even sketchier. How do you know Kdub is the target you need to "discover"? Why didn't you just make this claim at the very beginning of the game? Your information can't possibly be game-damning if all you need to do is know Kdub's role. I'd be extremely shocked if anyone unvoted from you. Given that ...

I want to hear from the rest of the town first, but why don't you just reveal the info and die via modkill? That ensures that 1) Town gets your info 2) Kdub doesn't need to reveal anything 3) Town gets additional options with its D1 lynch (or, minimally, we could always vote No-Lynch if we want to). Seems like the most pro-town thing you can do right now, no?

[AlmasterGM]

Oh yeah, added benefit - if no modkill occurs, we know you were lying through your teeth and lynch you immediately.

[AlmasterGM]

How bout we put it up to a vote. If town want Kdub to tell us his name, then he do it, if not.....

Fine, but nobody is going to vote for this plan because it's dumb and you are obviously lying. I don't even think I need to respond to your last post it is so wrong. Can I get a hammer please?

[AlmasterGM]

You've got to be fucking kidding me.

[AlmasterGM]

Vote: Kdub

What Chinaman could have known is completely beyond me, but I don't really see any other options at this point.

[AlmasterGM]

You've got to be fucking kidding me.

Interesting reaction, are you saying this at what has just happened or are you more concerned that the day is continuing and votes reset despite the mod kill? It is something I could see scum being really concerned about...

What just went down. If you look at my last post, I presumed the day would continue if there was a modkill...

why don't you just reveal the info and die via modkill?...Town gets additional options with its

D1

lynch

...so I'm not concerned about that. I was just 99% sure Chinaman was lying.

[AlmasterGM]

Kdub, I hate to rolefish, but do you have any other abilities besides being Luke? I normally wouldn't ask, but at this point, I think it's a) necessary information and b) isn't going to hurt the town.

d3x, can you confirm Chinaman's play as sporadic and/or overzealous?

God, theme game setups drive me insane.

[AlmasterGM]

Why were you so quick to unvote Snow Bunny?

This. I don't like S_B's quick unvote at all. Given that Kdub basically claimed VT (plus elaborate backstory), there's zero reason why that should have transpired - seems like a convenient excuse to abandon the bus. Scumbuddies?

[AlmasterGM]

You're not Luke Skywalker.

You can die now, slowly.

Oh yeah, this also.

[AlmasterGM]

I'll go ahead and let you have fun explaining that while I go to bed.

LMAO. More Kdub votes please.

[AlmasterGM]

Vote: Nachomamma8

[AlmasterGM]

I successfully roleblocked Nachomamma last night.

Conveniently, there is no kill this morning.

I PM'd the mod and he said roleblocks stop mafia kills.

More Nachomamma votes, please.

[AlmasterGM]

Also, FoS AGM.

Also, what?

No way.

Way.

@Kdub's death scene-
Mod flavor strongly implies a 2 man mafia. That a confirmed townie was given game setup information specifically identifying the mafia godfather is a MAJOR limitation. Kdub was also a lyncher for a specific townie, a further limitation. Given all this, I strongly suspect either a second mafia team OR multiple anti-town independents.

Strongly agree with the multi-mafia team setup spec. Given that Sith operate in duos, it would be odd if there were 3 of them. One possibility to counter multiple teams, however, is recruitment - in SW, after the Sith Master dies, the apprentice takes his place and begins looking for a new apprentice. There could be players in this game who start town or neutral but can be converted. See my point 3 below for additional speculation on why this might be true.

@AlmasterGM-
While it is enticing to believe that your roleblock stopped the mafia kill, realize it isn't a confirmed guilty result on NM8.

What do you think about JT's claim that NM8 is town? Do you think it is plausible that mafia would jump out and defend their buddy? Also, given that Kdub was revealed as mafia don, it seems unlikely that a different scum player would have investigation immunity (though to be fair, it isn't clear whether monkeyman equates a mafia godfather with investigation immunity.).

I definitely know my result isn't a slam dunk and that there could be other factors involved. However, I also think it's a pretty damning piece of evidence (more so than a generic scumtell, anyway). I'm extremely skeptical of JT's counter for a couple of reasons:

1) It's extremely convenient that he happens to be taking crap when he claims. If Zach or someone said Nacho was town, I'd back off, but JT doesn't exactly have a spotless record.
2) Even if he does have investigative powers, his sanity is not guaranteed. My role is not at all straightforward, and neither were Kdub and Chinaman's. I wouldn't be at all surprised if there was a twist on his so-called investigation result.
3) The "lyncher of" clause that was revealed on Kdub's death leads me to believe the scum may be operating under a timed search scenario - e.g., they have to find a certain player before dying themselves. If this is true, then JT might not mind fakeclaiming in order to save himself and/or Nacho for just a round or two.
4) As someone else stated, JT could be baiting for a CC.

I definitely want moar from JT ASAP.

[AlmasterGM]

How do you know your roleblock was successful?

My night-action PM from the mod specifically stated it was successful.

[AlmasterGM]

Vote: Alamaster GM

I took no actions whatsoever last night... So, Alamaster is obviously lying.

Dumb vote. This isn't a CC scenario like it was yesterday between Zach and Kdub. Just because I successfully roleblocked you and you claim you took no night actions doesn't mean I'm lying. Moreover, we don't even know that you're telling the truth.

[AlmasterGM]

Ninja'd by Zach.

[AlmasterGM]

@JT - How does it create a lot of WIFOM? Also, I agree with Kast that you need to provide more flavor/information to back up this claim. Flavor could also be useful in trying to determine your sanity.

@Kast - My role is more complicated than the action I posted. I can claim more of it plus flavor if needed, but given I'd rather not at this point unless absolutely needed (especially given that scum may have specific targets to hunt and a nameclaim could tip them off).

Also, I would like to reiterate a point I made in my earlier, larger post that may have been overlooked - if the scum have specific targets to hunt, they're working against a clock, not setting up an endgame. As risky as it would be in standard mafia, JT might be willing to risk outright lying about his investigation to buy him/NM some additional time.

[AlmasterGM]

Here's a list of people that I think can die right now, in no particular order:

JasonT
Snow_Bunny
Nachomamma
PHANTOM

[AlmasterGM]

Here's what I don't get - if Nachomamma is town and Jason is scum, why would Jason lie about being a cop to in order to protect Nachomamma?

[AlmasterGM]

I think we should lynch Nachomamma this round.

[AlmasterGM]

I tend to agree that lynching Cat will test Nach's innocence.

unvote
vote:Cat

Wait, what? You want to lynch someone so we can test the innocence of someone else (so we can verify that you got an innocent as cop)? Why not just go directly to the source and lynch Nachomamma? That cuts out all the loose ends and complications.

I really don't like the way you're jumping all over the board lately. It seems like you're scrambling to put us on any track that doesn't lead to you or, to a lesser extent, Nachomamma. I still like Nachomamma and you as my top suspects.

[AlmasterGM]

Alamaster, what complications are you talking about?

Cop sanity, neighbors =/= masons, nightkill complications, weird role setups, etc ... any time you lynch someone else to determine the identity of someone else to determine the identity of someone else, you're in for bad times.

However, one thing to keep in mind, if NM8 is Dur Gejjen, then it is possible that he is in league with JT, and their play could be an elaborate bus.

And this would make perfect sense given all the information we have now.

I still think Nachomamma is the best lynch for today. If he's scum, we know Jason is either lying or has no useful police powers. If he's town, Jason isn't cleared per-se, but we do have to evaluate why he would lie about being a cop in order to save a townie. However, I'm definitely not a Jason fan, especially given his name-claim, and if the day progresses far enough, I'll move my vote to him.

I also agree with Zach's feelings on Snow_Bunny, but I think we should resolve the Jason/Nacho situation first.

[AlmasterGM]

Congrats to the scumteam. I still have no idea why we lynched JT, but I don' think that would've changed the outcome that much because I had no read on d3x or Kast.

Thanks to MM for modding.

[AlmasterGM]

Congrats to the scumteam. I still have no idea why we lynched JT, but I don' think that would've changed the outcome that much

because I had no read on d3x

or Kast.

Thanks to MM for modding.

This is why I investigated d3x actually.

Yeah, good target. Unfortunately your result wouldn't have helped very much