Mini 1198 - Marketplace Mafia - Game Over
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Ethos Goon
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Ethos Goon
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Reads List:
Town(Strongest to Weakest): Red Coyote-> Seacore-> PeregrineV->Hiphop->Newman
Null(Leaning Town to Leaning Scum): Chaos-> Iceguy->Bobsnox
Scum(Weakest to Strongest): Weyoun->Midnight->Mal->Ghost
Will explain them in full tomorrow when we have more time to flesh it all out, but this will give you guys something to mull over until then.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Ethos Goon
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Advertising is bad due to the fact that someone can spend great amounts of funds advertising to assure that a particular item is up for grabs the following day only to have mafia outbid us for it wasting the money spent on advertising. A possible suggestion I was toying with earlier is asking our leading suspects to spend their funds on advertising potentially draining money from the scums fund pool however I haven't worked out if it's optimal yet or not.
Seacore has the leading bid on Setup Info for $41 and Hiphop has the leading bid on Investigation Immunity for $25. No one should attempt to outbid either of them on these items unless they openly state suspicion of these playesr in thread, any outbid of these items right now will be considered to be from scum.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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1. We both believe that advertising and oracle are both relatively useless at this point in the game however I am very much entertaining the idea of the scummier players spending funds on advertising cop and doctor for the sole reason for removing likely mafias fund pool.
2. Our town read on hiplop revolves around his attitude towards investigation immunity and his curiosity of investments mechanics in his first post. Also, mafia want to attain investigation immunity to be falsely cleared by the cop, this doesn't work if they claim they hold it inthread. Town on the other hand want to prevent mafia from attaining investigation immunity therefore want to claim they have it proving any innocent or guilty to be confirmed.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Ethos Goon
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Mafia have day talk therefore their organisation on how to deal with the auction tommorow is inevitable meaning providing any information you can on the upcoming days items is optimal without a doubt, furthermore it would be a good idea to elaborate on how you believe the bidding for oracle went ie. Were you constantly outbid and do you believe it was by scum?
Considering the first wave of auctions are now over I believe it would be a perfect time for the people who obtained double voter and vote nullifer to claim openely in the thread and for all of us to start working out which question should be asked with Seacores Setup Information. If there's any disputes about this occuring it should be stated asap.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Ethos Goon
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I was holding of voting him in hope that Ghostlin would show some form of reaction to our vote placed on him, this hasn't occured though meaning there's no reason to keep our vote placed on him.Unvote, Vote: WLC.
Ghostlin you're massively overstimating the usefulness of the information for the mafia, they only gain two things from it being released. The first being more time to plan and organise their bidding however considering they have day talk this advantage or gain for them is minimal. The second being the ability to advertise and reinfluence the advertised item for tommorow however I do not see mafia openley and willingly advertising to put forward a mafia benefical item knowing that we're likely to steal it preventing them from attaining it.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Ghostlin wrote:If it's useful to only scum, yes. Now, if there's any use to town in knowing which things we should make sure scum doesn't get, then you should release the information so plans can be made.
I've elaborated into the benefits and usefulness of it for the mafia which are minimal, if you have disagreements with them state so otherwise I see no reason why you would want extra information withheld. Outright claiming them right now allows the neighbourizer to effectively have a discussion topic and an ultimate aim tonight while giving everyone food for thoughts in regards to what tactic they believe will be optimal throughout the course of the game.
Ghostlin wrote:What -was- the reasoning of the ranks on your scum/town list, anyhow?
I was hoping for some traction or a bandwagon to form allowing better reactions to be obtained unfortunatly it didn't occur. If there's a particular read you want explained then feel free to ask and I can attempt to explain my reasoning behind it otherwise you'll have to wait until tommorow afternoon when Slaxx and I are planning on getting together to discuss them.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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First of yesterdays scum lynch was awesome and predictable, both Slaxx and myself have managed to attain multiple strong town-reads from it which I'll elaborate on later in the day. Now on to business, the no death means that one of three things occured, these being: 1) Mafia shot at the person that doctor saved therefore the doctor was held by a town player and the saved is town and clear, this is possible. 2) Town shot at the person that doctor saved therefore the doctor could be held by either allignment, this is likely not the case. 3) WLC bought night-kill and no kill was made due to it dying with him, this is the one that I believe is the most likely. All up there's no real need for the doctor to instantly out themselves and who they saved unless the person getting saved is getting lynched which shouldn't be the case as mafia would be shooting at pro-town players that are unlikely to be lynched.
The fact that investigation immunity was sniped means that mafia feared the cop attaining useful reports, this essentially means that mafia themselves don't have cop meaning the cop claiming right now would allow him to out his report which isn't 100% useful I know however it means that doctor can save him tonight as well as providing us with a near clear being the cop of course.
There's no reason for Seacore not to reveal the question that he asked along with the answer because the question isn't likely to help mafia in any particular way furthermore it allows us to have something to revolve discussion around. The people who attained extra vote and vote nullifer need to openely claim them as a lack of claim would mean confirmation that mafia have the ability which may prove as highly useful information if we're able to win auction detective today.
That moves me on to my next order of business, todays abilities up for auction.
1. Auction detective is highly valuable it could almost be used to confirm a player to be mafia and should certaintly be aimed for by town.
2. Commuter is actually really weak, there's not too much mafia can use it for without confirming themselves.
3. Doctor, considering the amount of strong town reads I have I think it's badly needed for town to aim for doctor today to provide a chance to prevent another kill.
4. Love potion really is pointless, no one better bid ofr it.
5. Medium is useful but not optimal, I would recommend against betting high amounts on this.
6. Night-kill, someone that either invested everything or spent nothing from yesterday should aim for this without a doubt in the world, we need this badly.
7. Ninja, only reason to get it is to prevent mafia having it.
8. Roleblocker, we badly need this as well otherwise mafia will just roleblock whoever wins nightkill.
9. Tracker, it's good though not great, I wouldn'tr recommend betting high amounts on it.
10. Watcher, now this is strong, it can be used to confirm and clear multiple players therefore should be aimed at.
TLDR: Auction, Doctor, Nightkill, Roleblocker and Watcher are must-gets. Medium, Ninja and Tracker are also good bids. Commuter and love potion shouldn't be bid on.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Given the specific name of the mafia player being flipped (Zaibatsu) and the answer to Seacores question I believe it's probable that we're up against two scum-teams probably both consisting of two members which means that I'm going to have to go over my reads again to find out which are entirely reliant on WLC flipping scum and which aren't.
Hiphop, I was sort of hoping that not mentioning that it went for $100 might trick mafia into claiming the ability giving us a confirmed mafia nevertheless nothing I can do about it now that you've mentioned it. I believe you aiming for nightkill would be a great idea and anyone who opposes it needs to state so soon. No one apart from hiphop should be placing any bet on night kill today.
So the following are occurances need to happen today: Cop claiming and revealing their report and Extra vote and vote nullifer claiming.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I'm 12 years old and what is this. Hiphop openely stated that he was spending all of his funds on night-kill, why would you attempt to compete with him in it Newman, that's just wasting towns funds. In regards to the items up for auction tommorow I see no reason not to use it now.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Sure, Newmans bid on NK was stupid and lazy however it's not scummy at all and the fact that he openely claimed that he attempted to bid on it and was constantly outbid is a massive town-tell furthermore his story of how he bid on it and spend his funds checks out competely. Remember when Hiphop stated he had it at $117, yeah that makes perfect sense considering Newmans CD investment and what it means is that mafia haven't bid on the item if the battle is just between Hiphop and Newman.
Ghostlin, I don't understand the check on Seacore, his hammer and actions yesterday made him incredibly obvious town so if you could elaborate into your reasoning for doing so apart from him holding setup information I would appreciate it. With that said the cop claim really really helps as it moves you from our possible scumlist to town. Both slaxx and myself believe we've PoE'ed the mafia and will have our reads up very soon, for now we'll start by voting one of the mafia.
Vote: IceyGuyThe price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Ethos Goon
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Starting cash = $100.
Win of bid on oracle = $20 + $1 transaction fee. Remaining funds = $79.
Penalty for not having highest bid = $2. Remaining funds = $77.
Investment = $50. Remaining funds = $27.
Day two started and wage recievement = $90. Remaining funds = $117.
Bid on nightkill = $116 + $1 penatly fee. Remaning funds = $116
Recievement of investment = $75. Remaining funds = $191
Bid on nightkill = $190 + $1 fee.
It all adds up.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I see what you're getting at but at the same time I fail to see Newman as mafia. I need to have a conversation with Slaxx asap, but the following are reasons I don't believe newman is mafia for:
1. I do not see mafia openely claiming that they're bidding nightkill in the thread.
2. I do not see mafia investing money in a CD to later announce that.
3. I do not see how his "I invested, bid my maximum and then when I recieved my investment back placed the rest of the funds on NK" is false in any way.
4. I do not see mafia aiming for oracle on day one while giving away multiple much stronger power roles.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Seacore wrote:1. It's possible, as was suggested, that he screwed up his reading of Auction Detective, I know I've screwed up reading a couple of abilities, and thus he confessed rather than be busted.
2. I'm arguing that this is a lie.
3. You and I have both proven that he had $191 at the time he claimed to have bid it all on the NK. I have proven that he could only have bid $189. Thus he lied
4. WIFOM
1. It's not an ability that is hard to understand therefore I don't see how you could attempt to attack on this basis.
2. So are you stating that he bidded $116 randomly as mafia which also happens to be the number of which investing $50 works with?
3. Yes, something isn't adding up and he needs to explain it asap.
4. I can agree that it this is slightly wifom however the advantages of the cop and nightkill are so strong that mafia can't exactly afford to wifom and aim for smaller and weaker items especially if it's two scumteams.
We are NOT quicklynching this, there's a lot of information Slaxx and myself need to get out in the thread and it's going to take a day or two to get together, we're also waiting on a double voeter and vote nullifer claim.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:Bid on NK for $189, fee: $1, remaining funds: $188. (If the current bid is $190, the second highest bid is AT MOST $189.) He's claiming NK because of Auction Detective (or rather because how he - and I - remembered it) and/or to have a plausible explanation why he isn't bidding on anything else.
Yeah, busted. VOTE: Newman
Yeah, no. It is confirmed that he made two separate bids on NK, one being for $116 and the other being for $189 or $190 depending on if it was a mod error or not, you've just attempted to construct an entire made up transaction record to place your vote on him without even mentioning that it takes him to L-2 furthermore you've avoided discussing the lynch yesterday which you were not part of, the items up for auction today, the abilities won yesterday and much more.
There needs to be more votes on Icey.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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RC, hiphop stated publically that he had the highest bid on Investigation Immunity and it was mentioned multiple times that no one should bid on it without showing suspicions of Hiphop, the item was then sniped. I think it's a reasonable assumption to make that mafia took it.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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RedCoyote wrote:Also, I'm fine with an HN lynch. This whole ordeal just seems too much. I don't think he was being upfront with us about his bidding. Ethos is right that we should hold off, but we should lynch him before we lose our bonus. I also don't understand why Ethos is having to defend HN rather than HN defending himself. Ethos, are you implying that Ice/Seacore/hiphop are all actively trying to get HN lynched under false pretenses? Or are they all just mistaken?
I'm defending HN because we both have a strong town read on him but at the same time I can understand why Seacore and Hiphop suspect him, if it's a mod error than hopefully they realize the need to look elsewhere however if it isn't a mod error I will need to take a second step back and rethink it. So yes, I do believe that Seacore and Hiphop are merely mistaken however I believe Ices attempt to push the lynch was highly opportunistic.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:No, it's not confirmed. He claimed it, and there is no way to prove his claim.
Wrong, it is confirmed in Post #207 by Hiphop. This post alone proves that your entire transaction record is completely implausible and therefore an attempt to create a scenario which never existed.
I don't see any justification for your vote except that you're defending Newman at all costs and I'm one of his attackers.
Your vote and incredibly opportunistic push on HN was just the final straw and solidified my suspicions of you. My vote was placed on you before you attempted to 'attack' HN so I'm unsure how you're attempting to link the two actions furthermore if I was attempting to just attack the people attacking HN I wouldn't have stated I had a town-read on Seacore and Hiphop the leading attacks of him in my previous post.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:That just confirms thatsomebodybid this amount. Newman claimed it after hiphop's post.
I have no fucking clue what you're attempting to get at by stating this. We know that Hiphop stated he was going to bid on NK and therefore no one else should meaning if the person bidding against Hiphop wasn't Newman and was town they would have claimed by now and stated they did so. If the person bidding against Hiphop was mafia then Newman would be town because mafia wouldn't have a bidding war with themselves. So what did we learn from this? Either Newman was the person who bid $116 as mafia or as town so your constructed transaction is impossible and instead of standing back and accepting and agreeing to that like you would if you were town you're trying to defend it.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:EBWOP:Well, both of them are pretty much conftown.
Again you're attempting to link my vote on you to you being one of HNs attacks while ignoring the fact that I clearly had my vote on you before you attacked HN. On a completely unrelated note no one every buy a Dell, computer just broke so now I'm using a family members that doesn't have any of my documents...The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:We know for sure there are more than two win conditions, which very likely means we either have two mafia factions or a mafia/SK setup. In such a setup, I don't see why one scum faction shouldn't overbid another.
Let me just make sure I understand what you're getting at here. You're stating that Mafia faction #1 bet $116 on the kill, was outbid by Hiphop for $117. Mafia faction #2 overbid to $189/$190 and was outbid by Hiphop for $190/$191 and then someone from mafia faction #2 claimed to have mafia faction #1's bid and all of this is more likely than Newman bidding $116 himself as town or mafia.
Did I get that right?The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:You OMGUS'd the only person on your wagon who isn't conftown.
Mal and Bobsnox are far from confirmed town or town at all. You continue to attempt to ignore the fact that my vote on you was placed before you began attacking HN and still somehow manage to continue pushing your flimsy and weak transaction accusation despite how obvious it is that it's incorrect.
It is a fact, you're grasping at straws at the moment and if you're town which I highly doubt you are you need to stand back and realize that.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Good now that everything is explained and dealt with can we start moving this game forward again, the votes on HN need to come of and move to IG. Slaxx and I are in the process of completing our information dump which should be in the thread in the next 12 hours.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Not exactly sure what Maguas last post means at all considering a similar occurance happened in this post but I noticed no difference in the next auction sales list, perhaps Hiphop can elaborate into its meaning.
IceyGuy wrote:I don't see any justification for your vote except that you're defending Newman at all costs and I'm one of his attackers.Ethos wrote:Your vote and incredibly opportunistic push on HN was just the final straw and solidified my suspicions of you. My vote was placed on you before you attempted to 'attack' HN so I'm unsure how you're attempting to link the two actions furthermore if I was attempting to just attack the people attacking HN I wouldn't have stated I had a town-read on Seacore and Hiphop the leading attacks of him in my previous post.IceyGuy wrote:Ethos seems to be trying very hard to start a wagon on me without providing any justification.Ethos wrote:You've just attempted to construct an entire made up transaction record to place your vote on him without even mentioning that it takes him to L-2 furthermore you've avoided discussing the lynch yesterday which you were not part of, the items up for auction today, the abilities won yesterday and much more.
IceyGuy wrote:At this moment,neither you nor Newman have provided any explanations for, and why Newman claimed different bid amounts), instead preferring to attack me.my questions(why you voted me without a case
This is a blatant lie, you haven't attempted to ask me a single question through our entire conversation and I outright challenge you to quote and provide them.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote: When I point out that you don't have a justification for something, like I did in ISO 14 and 22, or when I say there is no plausible explanation (ISO 13), this means that I consider you scummy until you provide me with a justification/explanation, and you did not. Yes, it is not a "question" in the formal sense, but it boils down to the same.
And those were answered a long time ago as quoted in my previous post, you just attempted to find any form of reasoning to jump your vote over and ended up stating that two people didn't answer your "questions" which weren't really questions and were both responded to.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:Then please provide me with a quote containing your justification for your vote in post #239 which does not exclusively refer to events after this post.
I dipped on it in Post #247 but for the sake of completeness the entire reasoning behind the vote revolved around process of elimination as we have as stated multiple strong town reads, the fact that your posts throughout day one included no real content relating to the game outside of mechanics. Avoidance of joining or commenting on the WLC wagon during and after it, your statement that you were going to invest on day one but no comment on what you plan on spend your funds on and your lack of care over who is recieving what power.
Since then however you've contradicted yourself by attempting to push OMGUS as a scum-tell while OMGUS'ing us yourself and clearly grasped at straws over an inconceivable transaction history and record despite an overwhelming amount of facts proving it incorrect. Still waiting for Slaxx to get back for the repo but we should have our information out in the next few hours or at the very latest in the morning.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Time for that information dump I was talking about.
We sniped Governor and Neighbourizer yesterday to prevent mafia from obtaining them. What we now know is that: Ghostin bought Cop for $90. Seacore bought Setup information for $41. HelloNewman bought Oracle for $20. Ethos bought Neighourizer for $20 and governor for $31. We also know that mafia won Extra vote for $40, Nightkill for $100, Investigation Immunity for $39 and Vote Nullifer for $35. So we know that mafia used $214 minimum on the day one auction. That leaves Doctor being bought for $40 and Last will being bought for $29. There's no reason for either of these to claim just yet but later in the game them claiming and everyone stating their full transaction history would be optimal.
Now onto our reads, a summary of them are:
Town Reads (Strongest to Weakest):Seacore, Hiphop, Newman, Ghostlin, Bobsnox, RedCoyote, Pere.
Null Reads:Chaos.
Scum Reads (Strongest to Weakest):IceyGuy, MidnightSorrow, Mal.
Spoiler: Explanation of our readsThe price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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The first five of the eleven reads were mine and Slaxx did the other six, my reads were done by me days ago so the 'overall' sections are slightly outdated as our reads have changed since then so I would recommend looking at the summary to properly understand all of our reads.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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ChaosOmega wrote:Alright, since your CD matured 8 hours into day 2, you invested $50 8 hours into day 1. In addition, you placed a $29 bid on Oracle. Since that money is in escrow until you win the auction, you have $20 after this until you win Oracle, when you get back $9. This leaves you $29. How exactly did you bid for either of those, since both had a minimum bid of $50?
This unlike the $190 bid incident is actually a very very valid point and I want an answer asap.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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HellloooNewman wrote:I do not have them. I only kept PM's of winning auctions.
Why would you delete sent messages? From memory how much did you bid on each and how long did it take to find out that you weren't the leading bidder because right now this is reading as impossible. The leading bid on Cop and Nightkill remained at $50 for quite some period throughout the day therefore I don't see outbidding on them being possible in time to be able to invest nor do I see it being possible to bid on both Cop and Nightkill as it would cost $102 to do so.
It's looking more and more like I was wrong on my town-read on you and I need to badly have a conversation with Slaxx about it, we also all need to work out bidding actions for the end of today as well as organise which power roles are doing what so we have some form of organisation for tonight.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Chaos is correct, at this point it's virtually impossible for HN not to be mafia therefore I propose that we set ourselves a target to have the day end before a new day starts over this means from this post we have just under 20 hours to organise everything, place final bids, start a vig-voting system and hammer the lynch.
For those skimming: Deadline for today is in 20 hours, no one should blitz because we should use every hour of that we can.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Items we need to shut out mafia: Doc, Auction Detective, Roleblocker, Ninja.
We proposethat Seacore and Hiphop choose 2-3 people they feel safe trusting and tell them to bid on those items.
Commuter, Medium, and Love Potion do not matter as much but if you want to snipe them, go for it.
If it is alright with everyone else we would like to take tracker and watcher, its something that could be useful but isn't overly powerful.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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HellloooNewman wrote:Okay, let me lay all my cards out on the table for you. I lied when I said that I bid on Cop/NK on Day 1. I, for the life of me, can't remember where the $2 went. So, rather than rack my brain any further and try to figure it out, I claimed something that was not true. To be perfectly honest, I was sick and tired of defending the same fucking point over and over and over again today, so I got lazy. It happens. I'll be lynched for it. Thats fine.
See, this is the problem, I strongly believed something similar to this was happening earlier today thus my understanding of Seacores suspicion of you but disagreement with the conclusion but I didn't believe you would continue outright lying about your bidding transactions to the point where you lose all credibility and support including mine. Slaxx wants to govern you but I really don't believe it'll do any good at this point and instead will just waste more time. If you're really town you need to badly do the following three things:
1) Find out where that $2 went, an explanation is crucial.
2) State all of your reads.
3) State the oracled items for tomorrow.
NO ONE, I mean it, NO ONE votes until all of these are done and organisation for today's auctioning is complete.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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MS, when did you bid on cop and how much did you bet on it?
Pere, HN stated he bid on 2 other items and the transaction fees for each one for a failed bid is $1 = 2x$1 = $2. Also Governor is not an ability I ever plan to use, I just took it to prevent mafia attaining it and you CAN use more than one ability a night you just can't use multiple charges of the same ability during the night.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Midnight's Sorrow wrote:@Ethos:I tried going in a little bit over the minimum at first with 55$- when that didn't go through I tried again withthe rest of my money.Still didn't go through.So I considered it a fail already and went for something less expensive :/
Just confirming, by the rest you mean the rest of your remaining funds, ie. $100?The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Magua wrote:Lynch was reached as of Post #184, July 3rd, 2011 at 5:46 EST (site time).Nothing submitted after this time was counted.
#NameMinimum BidCurrent BidAuction Length1 Cop x 2 $50 $95 7 days
Unless I'm mistaken the above proves that cop was sold for $95 therefore I don't see how it's possible your bid of $97 lost it, care to explain please MS?The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I know that this may sound highly selfish but I'm hoping we can move the targeted deadline backwards by 24 hours thereby aiming for 10 days worth of bonuses rather than 11 because I won't have any access to the internet for the next 24 hours and to be perfectly honest I am having severe doubts over HN being scum. Everyone needs to voice their opinions in regards to the Ghostlin and Midnight inconsistency because I myself am having massive issues making two cents of it all.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I may be one of the most guilable people in the world but I believe Newmans explanation over the mix up and still consider him to be town but let this be a warning anyone that lies about their auctioning and bidding actions later in the game will be hung. Chaos interrogation of Newman bringing up the fact that it was impossible to have the funds he was claiming to have reads as a solid town-tell.
I'm not entirely sure what to make of MS vs Ghostlin because the way I see it there are only two possible scenario, the first being that MS is lying scum but I see no reason for scum to lie about that and the second being that or mafia have some sort of auction bidding altering power.
I think our best bet is to put the bidding issues aside for now and just lynch the player we all suspect the most because the longer we wait and stagnate the thread the less efficiency bonus we receive. I still believe we should lynch Icey however an updated list our my reads are (Haven't heard from Slaxx so not sure what he agrees with or not about this):
Town Reads (Strongest to Weakest):Seacore, Hiphop, Ghostlin, Chaos, Newman, Bobsnox, RedCoyote, Pere.
Null Reads:MidnightSorrow.
Scum Reads (Strongest to Weakest):IceyGuy, Mal.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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LLD, Ghostlin is cop and near confirmed town to be honest. It is confirmed that mafia sniped at investigation immunity at the end of yesterday meaning that they feared cops investigation or wanted to remove a chance of having cleared players. This essentially means that they themselves didn't hold cop, therefore Ghostlin is town.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Hiphop claimed that he had the leading bid and intent on winning investigation immunity, to mafia this would mean that any innocent the town receives is a clear therefore them receiving investigation immunity instead of hiphop would be crucial. I never stated that mafia would not benefit from the cop ability however I fail to see any possible scenario where mafia lay down majority of their funds on cop and investigation immunity two items which alone do not do much for them.
I suggest you read through the entire thread in chronological order and then proceed to stating your reads because there's a lot of context needed when attaining reads in this setup.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Trust me, I understand where you're coming from because I saw the exact same thing earlier in the game and no if there's two scum teams he wouldn't be considered confirmed town. Though right now I'm very much of the opinion that there's a SK rather than two scum teams because it's clear that one of the scums powers is to steal money from the auction bids which is an ability which wouldn't make sense for one of the teams to have and not the other however it makes perfect sense for a SK to have.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Icey, what I am attempting to say is that the way Choas went about the attack on Newman reads as VERY townie specifics include Post #301, Post #303 and Post #309. Mafia would just want to point out the error or issue giving them a massive chance to push on a player whereas town want to gather information and create an opportunity for a potential slip to occur.
LLD, I haven't heard from Slaxx since he left on vacation but I can say that you have my acceptance to that deal. Waiting on your thoughts on everyone in the room at the moment though.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I can agree and understand on RC and Seacore town but you need to convince me of Maltown because that one post of his is a minimal town-tell furthermore there is really no chance that Newman is SK. There's zilch motivation for a SK to spend funds on Oracle as spending funds on Oracle is only done to work out if advertising is needed or not and SK cannot afford to nor would ever want to advertise.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I don't understand your disagreement with a vig-votting system, it allows the vig shot to be optimally placed as well as locks the person holding night kill into a particular kill which is incredibly good if the person holding is scum.
Sure the addition of a doctor or a roleblocker may make it difficult however if someone wishes to roleblock the person with nightkill watcher will catch the visit or we can auction detective catch the person and if the doctor saves the person shot we can catch them the same way.
Actually I believe I was correct about my setup thoughts in PYP (No scum in the (1,1s) and 2 scum in the (6,?s)) but surely you would agree that the SK would be inclined to bid on multiple other auction items in this setup.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Ethos Goon
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My strongest scum read is Icey by far, his actions throughout today have included obvious contradictions, changing of reads with minimal reasoning and insistence that Newman is scum when he was very quick to drop suspicion of Newman earlier in the day when the wagon seemed like it might die down.
Other scum reads I have include Midnight (Floating between weak scum and null), Mal (Floating between weak town, null and weak scum) and at the moment Pere actually (Bidding related reasons which I'll go into later).The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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I can support a Midnight lynch though I strongly oppose to a HN vigging for obvious reasons. I still am a firm believer of Icey needing to die at some point.
Ghostlin, don't waste your investigation on LLD please. Read bobsnoxs attitude and particpation in the WLC scum lynch and LLDs overall tone and you'll realize she's likely town.
The idea of having the lynch player transfer funds to Seacore or another strong town read is a great idea and I'm struggling to find any potential downside to it so we should go ahead with it.
Vote: MidnightThe price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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IceGuy wrote:I didn't drop suspicion of him. I just changed my vote because of your chainsaw defense of Newman, and because he had an explanation which seemed consistent at the time being.
You continue to attempt to push this blatant lie. You're stating that you suspect me for chainsaw defending Newman against you which would infer that I attacked you for the sole reason that you were attacking Newman however this clearly isn't the case considering I had voted you prior to it. This exact point has been brought up multiple times however you seem content to ignore it and continue to attempt to play the victim card in the situation.
malpascp wrote:@Everyone: do you trust Seacore do direct the NK?
It depends on what you mean by trust.
Do I trust that Seacore will suggest and propose the kill that he believes will best help the town, yes.
Do I trust that the person he suggests to kill will actually best help the town, no.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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LLD covered it fairly well in the above two posts but your usage of 'OMGUS' this game has been appalling, you attempted to attack Newman for voting you calling it an OMGUS while then proceeding to OMGUS me and state that LLD is OMGUS'ing you.
Essenetially you're attempting to state that OMGUS is a scum-tell while committing it yourself. You also continue to ignore the fact that it's very obvious that no chainsaw defence occured but continue to attempt to use that as reasoning for your suspicions.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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Welcome GI, you'll need to do a full re-read and make sure you understand the game mechanics they're incredibly important. First of though you need to provide us with your entire bidding transcript and records. We need to know what MS bid on and how much he spend on it as well as how much funds he has remaining. We are NOT quick lynching, if GI is town his insight is going to be incredibly valuable and if he's scum we gain more information in regards to how they bid.
Icey, you're missing the entire point, attempting to use omgus as reasoning for your suspicions while attacking the person voting you is a complete contradiction. You continue to attempt to ignore the fact that both Slaxx and I were relatively sure on our scum-read of you before any attack on HN was made and keep attempting to to link the two actions to attempt to belittle our suspicion of you while justifying your stance.
For now:Unvote, Vote: IceyThe price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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GI, do you have any knowledge of MS bidding on Ninja and succeeding or failing? I currently hold Governor and I have no intention of chucking a Benmage with it however if everyone believes it's best to burn it now I'll do so.
We're not lynching Ghostlin today, it's a big no-no, he has one more cop inspection. We let him use that tonight and then proceed to work forward from there depending on the answer to the question Seacore asks.The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.-
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Ethos Goon
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