Mini 1316 - Last Will Mafia IV (Over)

[hiplop]

vote fishythefish

he seems fishy

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VOTE: RHINOX His long posts feel like he knows they will be taken as townie, due to their length/passive aggression. Ultimately it feels forced, and its the best i have at this moment. He just doesnt feel right, at all.


last survivor is last on my list, fyi

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well hes pretty succinct, and he hasn't said much. He also has said he only has a phone, so I'm not sure how to fault him with that. Really not much of an opinion, though the one post was pretty *scummy* it felt FAKE

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Which post are you talking about? The one I pointed out in my vote of him or another?

A thing I noticed with SA at first is that he's talking about a whole lotta nothing. Which is what I pointed out in my original post and his floppy reasoning with the fishy attack. His last post definitely has that as well. If you look at that big paragraph, it's a bunch of fence sitting and jibberjabber. Why expand on the DDD/Nacho conflict if a) you have nothing to say and b ) DDD isn't even your top scum choice? Because it's an easy thing for scum to talk about, that's why.

SA's biggest scum ITT.

You know what, I gotta agree with you. Looking back he is being pretty sloppy. Though, atm I'm tempted to vote rhinox. Very very defensive. SA is going to hold my vote now, however. When he gets back or w/e hopefully he wont be as apathetic

VOTE: SA

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VOTE: RHINOX His long posts feel like he knows they will be taken as townie, due to their length/passive aggression. Ultimately it feels forced, and its the best i have at this moment. He just doesnt feel right, at all.


last survivor is last on my list, fyi

How is making a long post that you think will help people read you as town scummy?

Kortul needs to get his ass in here.

it didnt feel like it accomplished anything other than rhinox wanting to appear townie, that really isnt town behavior imo

[hiplop]

Back from where? And apathetic how?

i assumed you were gione b/c of computer thing.

[hiplop]

VOTE: RHINOX His long posts feel like he knows they will be taken as townie, due to their length/passive aggression. Ultimately it feels forced, and its the best i have at this moment. He just doesnt feel right, at all.


last survivor is last on my list, fyi

How is making a long post that you think will help people read you as town scummy?

Kortul needs to get his ass in here.

it didnt feel like it accomplished anything other than rhinox wanting to appear townie, that really isnt town behavior imo

When you're defending yourself, what other objectives should you have?

idk man. There's just something *off* in those posts

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you know, I'm starting to question my read on sleepless assassin. I've looked back and it kinda looks like over-reactions rather than a sound case. The flaws in everything can kind of be explained by his lack of computer (I know I kinda go into the same shell of a player whenever I am on a vacation, its difficult to keep up with a phone or whatever)

@everyone; Whats everyones thoughts on DDD, it just occurred to me that he is in this game, and he usually isnt this inactive is he? The posts he has made have been rather blah, too.

however, I am going to VOTE: Rhinox Quite simply there is something wrong here, it seems like you're attempting to emulate a townie, just feels very forced

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Post 54, mostly.

Eh when I only have my phone, i tend to pay less attention/answer stuff less. I get lazy, which I can see the lack of explanations and such having a relationship w/ that.

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on DDD I guess its just I can't remember anything he has said, very transparent (i guess he was here pretty much during RVS, so i can forgive this)

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so if you were to say why I am scum in a few sentences, how would you do that? All I see from you is "he voted rhinox", I have been on him for most of the game

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Why did you feel the need to make like 3 posts about it saying pretty much exactly the same thing before I came back to respond? Why did you unvote then revote me before I had said anything about it?

Its how I roll, i guess.

I revoted because you just becvame #2 w/ assassin, i changed my mind which put you back at #1

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I dunno, when I'm town, I really want to appear town.... I really don't agree with your vague case/vote on Rhinox.

Fair enough, honestly. I'm struggling to put my ideas accross, I suppose it could be considered a heavy gut case, but im pretty convinced.

Nacho "changing his playstyle" urks me. Its moreso the fact that hes talking about it.

Does anyone have a deep past with nachomama, that they would be able to meta him easily (before the playstyle change), I think he might be trying this to dodge a meta-gun.

[hiplop]

oh boy! Im getting lots of attention

I think hiplop is pretty likely town. He seems to be trying to catch scum, and his last point - that Nacho is avoiding his meta - is the sort of complicated scheme that town dream up and scum don't fake often.

Yep!

While going through his ISO today, i noticed that he never commented on Malee or funkybike1. hiplop, what are you reads (or just thoughts) on them?

Heavily neutral. Which kinda scares me, for that rarely happens. I have a feeling one of them is scum, I just lack the competence to pin point which one

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Hip, I find the "yep" a little weird. You basically got called a misguided townie and jumped all over agreeing with it.

Eh, the phrase dream up can have some negative connotation, I don't agree with this, however. Dreamers are what keep the world great.

DDD and Rhinox are scum, imo. Maybe even Nachomama instead of DDD. Nacho is doing what every player who has been "Scum-meta'd" does, "CHANGE THEIR PLAYSTYLE" in heavy air quotes (its more fashionable that way). And quite bluntly, I see a connection between rhinox and nacho. DDD feels independently scummy, some for his lurking, some for his actual posts.

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Also, why can't Rhinox, DDD, and Nacho be scum? You act like it has to be either DDD or Nacho.

Er, they can. I'm not arrogant enough to think I can pinpoint the scum team on my own!

Nothing on Malee or Funky then? I find it uncomfortable that you said you lacked the "competence" to pinpoint which one of them is scum, especially since now neither of them are scum. Also, I feel the connection between Rhinox and nacho can be explained in another way, but I'll let them explain it.

What more is there to say? I can hardly remember their existance. I feel one of them is likely scum, but how the fuck does one figure out which lurker is more scummy than another?

Nacho, my mind is lapsing atm, on the connection :\

On the latter, im working on it. I'm having to make a jump with this case, and I feel I need to make the bridge before doing so.

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hm.. its my impression that no one really has playstyles, they just post what comes to mind. I guess scum usually have one, however.

Something is just odd with this altercation, and I want to know what. Its like a sentence that doesnt fit in a book/tv show (ILL TAKE THIS CHIP AND ILL EAT IT), it stands out like a mountain of obscurity..like he put it there to safeguard himself

just doesnt work ahhh

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I mean like; I dont think anyone walks into a game and has "IM GOING TO OMGUS ALL GAME", this isnt really a game of pre-emptive strategy. Mostly based on instincts/word choice

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You dont get my point. I agree with you, which is why nacho is scummy. People dont just have a preset plan for the game, it makex no sense. Nacho defended his actions with saying he has a new strategy, so essentially its a useless excuse, and hes scum

[hiplop]

nacho/rhinox are my scum

and because people let them off the hook, not many share my views

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You dont get my point. I agree with you, which is why nacho is scummy. People dont just have a preset plan for the game, it makex no sense. Nacho defended his actions with saying he has a new strategy, so essentially its a useless excuse, and hes scum

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VOTE: Nachomama

die scum die

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rhinox said he was disappearing, nacho wagon gained a player/he became more interesting to you folk

@voting nacho

Why am I scum?

Read back. Been accused of saying it too many times already granted altest post seems genuine, still more scum than town

This seems like an idealist viewpoint. However, some players do consciously plan to play certain ways. Do you think players like Fate (jeez why do I keep thinking about Fate today) are REALLY ANGRY AND PISSED OFF ALL THE TIME AND THATS WHY THEY POST IN CAPS? No, its because its a predetermined playstyle they choose to do.

All rules have exceptions, was raised on english...gained this moral

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alice i have been pretty clear in saying nacho/rhinox are likely both scum. Fine with either's death. More steam/less active pursuit = vote nacho

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You're posts tell me you're most sure that I'm scum, but you're voting nacho now because there is more support and its easier to get him lynched. You even said not too long back that DDD might be scum instead of Nacho - what changed your mind there? This looks like textbook scum going with the flow to blend in with the most townies.

Sigh.

You, and nacho are about equal in my books. Can you really not grasp basic connotation? I used "maybe even DDD"...because my only thought on him is hes kinda lurky.

Double plus good.

Hopefully he will be an Unperson soon, eh Obrien?

Not when he is sure I'm scum, and he's been waffling back and forth over which of you or nacho is my partner.

ffs, i've said like 5 times you two are equal.

I said I was going to be away for 3 days.

Nice observation? I figured you were actual going to leave, not randomly become active?



Essentially rhinox's points are based on his lack of comprehension, i can't fucking reply to lack of competence

Then why make a definitive "nobody but scum have playstyles" statements? How do you know nacho isn't an exception to your rule?

CAN YOU REALLY NOT UNDERSTAND THIS? take a deep breath, and read back. I'm against him for using that as a *defense*, not for having a playstyle.

[hiplop]

do you really think its townie to keep to your reads completely and never veer off in the face of unorthodoxy? Scum are the one attempting to keep to a code, town's reads will generally fluctuate.

You can continue using wiki-based garbage as your offence though

I would like you to spend less time trying to insult me for having the audacity to question you, and more time addressing this, and what happened to your scumread on DDD who you were sure was scum with me in 218, and why your so convinced I'm scum based on 1 post 24hours into the game you felt was faked towniness, and what happened with your scumread on SA who you voted earlier in the game and seemed to just kind of drop (much like your DDD suspicions).

DDD is based off of

lurking

. Its not a very strong tell. Very weak, infact.

Rhinox is so blatantly scum here, its not even funny.

I was pointing that out in reference to how that is a crap reason to justify moving your vote off of me if you think I'm scum. Does going V/LA make me less scummy? Is there some questions or reactions you're looking to get out of me from your vote, which makes it pointless to leave it there while I'm V/LA? This doesn't make sense either because you're not questioning me and when I ask you why I'm scum you just tell me to read back and when I question you further you just ignore me. You seem content calling me scum based on the assumption that I am scum without having to justify your conclusion.

You and nacho are equal. you're were going to seemingly disappear, so my vote would be wasted for 4 days. Logical move is to vote the parallel, who is here.

When I read back to post 218/232/234/236, I see you saying that no one really has conscious playstyles they intend to conform to, except for scum. Thus, since nacho is claiming to be changing his playstyle, he must be scum because only scum have a pre-emptive playstyle in mind. so, you are against him having a playstyle, *and* for using it as a defense, I guess. But when Nacho first said he had changed his playstyle, I didn't see him as using it as a defense against a damning accusation, more as just an explaination. The majority of your posting on the subject is about how townies shouldn't have premeditated playstyles, not about using playstyles as a defense.

Perhaps you need glasses, then. For that is not what is there.

Anyways, that last paragraph isn't really part of the reason why I'm voting you. Its because you self-admittedly switched your vote to nacho because there's more momentum and support there. I feel that is a scum motivated mindset - townies want to argue vehemently for lynching their #1 suspect, not fold and switch to a secondary (oh sorry, I forgot we're equal now) suspect who happens to be more lynchable in your opinion.

You act as if I don't have anything other than him having votes.. holy shit you're mindset is black and white

[hiplop]

you know what?

VOTE: Rhinox

Nacho's latest post is very reasonable, and replies to my case in a pretty townie matter. Hes still my #2, but rhinox has usurped him greatly

Rhinox is trying pretty hard to paint me as scum, I see why hes doing it, to protect his scum ass

What wiki-based garbage am I using? do tell.

"He changed his reads, he scum lololol"
" He repeatef himself, he scum lololol"

other crap like that, its what your case on me is, mixed with survivalism

Hes clentching to a falseness, and he knows it. There isn't a shread of conviction within his posts, for he hasn't mastered that skill yet.

[hiplop]

hey instead of making good points lets just call everything that opposes us a scumclaim

im such a good scumhunter

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wise observation vincent

last it didnt really change my mind? hes a bit lower now, but not worth a vote. Mostly deadline-worthy stuff imo

[hiplop]

OK. I'm glad to say I've sorted out the hiplop/Rhinox situation. After hiplop answers a question, I'll tell you their alignments.

@hiplop:
- In post 218, DDD was on your scumlist. You later clarified that this was for lurking, which I will happily agree is a weak scumtell. Still, by 241 you had decided to focus on Nacho/Rhinox, though only Nacho of the three had posted in the meantime, and not in a way you criticised. What made you change your mind on things between these two posts?

More later.

It was more of a case that i realized DDD was just lurking, so he moved up to null. Rhinox was always in question.

Just more thinking, i guess for succinctness

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i have yet to make a mountain out of a molehill, folks.

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VOTE: Alice

mostly because of the post where he was talking about my vote switch, it was awkward as fuck.

Plus im bandwagonning, but that reason is why im doing said act

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goddamn, alice's latest post feels town.

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VOTE: moner

Eh, forced due to time restraint

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Got the prod

Honestly, this day needs to end. Macro is pretty clearly scum imo

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i think I see what Macro is getting at.

He's either scum or very fucking smart town, I'm not sure which though :\

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light macro on fire.

No longer smart town, suddenly buffoon scum

[hiplop]

i think I see what Macro is getting at.

He's either scum or very fucking smart town, I'm not sure which though :\

light macro on fire.

No longer smart town, suddenly buffoon scum

Just wondering, what has made him go from smart town to buffoon scum?

Figured he may have been a PGO/BP (or role of that caliber). Where he was hoping claiming a PR would eat the scumshot

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why is macro still alive?????

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Hiplop, do you think that the VT claim came from scum? If so, what were his motivations there?

yes. He claimed a Power role before, got caught lying then in desperation claimed vt...do you honestly not see scum motives there? And do you honestly think scum only ever claim PR's...ugh this game

him living makes literally no sense

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that isn't how this game works.

Its like "all people 3rd on a wagon are scum", if the scum know thats what people are looking for, they aren't going to do it. The guy was blatantly testing the waters w/ PR claim, claimed vanilla when no one bit

[hiplop]

that isn't how this game works.

Its like "all people 3rd on a wagon are scum", if the scum know thats what people are looking for, they aren't going to do it. The guy was blatantly testing the waters w/ PR claim, claimed vanilla when no one bit

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if needed I'll be able to hammer before deadline, i just dont get why macro is living

I have had a gut feeling on LS for a while, nothing major though.

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VOTE: lastsurvivor

Cant touch dis

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VOTE: macro

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LLAMA i'm here!

SO SORRY, was in the hospital. better now.

going to catch up

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Guys, macro pretty much claimed scum. He claimed a PR to stay alive ffs, then WIFOM'd the shit out of you.

It's very fucking clear, and he needs to die. His reads change constantly to fit his need, its not fucking townie

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Does anyone actually have any basis for thinking my read changes were convenient/scummy/whatever? (Except for me attempting to buddy voided into changing his read of me, because that's just stupid. I even joked about it... [refrains from swearing]) Answers from DCL, hiplop and kortul are needed.

Really, the pushing on me from DCL, Debonair, Kortul, hiplop and voided are what I'd expect from scum- using my predecessors' stuff aginst me while also pulling out stuff about me that's magically scummy to keep me as a target. Well except for Debonair. He's a special case, but he can go in the scumpile too. The problem though, is I really think only two of them can be scum. Three scum are not going to all illogically push one player (well I guess it's possible, but I don't think so). So there are likely three townies that are likely going to keep wanting to lynch me throughout. DCL maybe no and kortul could be night-killed, but they'd be the only ones that would not be 90% likely to tunnel on me for at least the next few days and they could even be the scum here.

@Kortul/hiplop/voided/debonair/DCL: Are you likely to continue seeing what I post as scummy or do you think you could come to see me as town? If you're town, please answer this question seriously. I understand what it's like to think someone scum and want to get rid of them for a clearer read of the game regardless of their alignment.

I honestly am thinking suggesting that I just be lynched, because no one is taking my reads seriously (defying the purpose of creating this alt in the first place). It's all like "Who cares if Voided is actually scummy or not? Macrophage saying he is is just not town!" And I've recently come to realise that no matter how obvtown I think I am, if it looks like I'll be lynched at some point in the game, then I will be unless I'm a PR. I'm getting really frustrated by this game and don't want to delay my lynch if it's inevitable.

Sorry about my rant, but please do answer any questions I've asked directed at you.

Very small chance of the town part,y ou are moving up though. But like you said you're kinda distracting me too (i really thinky ou're scum though)

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Honestly, I'm not even sure what to say - I've said my thing a bunch of times - ill be legitimately shocked if macro flips town

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hes never coming back, is he?

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@hiplop, you are becoming more active, it seems - what are your thoughts on other players?

Macro is scum, 4nxiety town, Rhinox Null-Scum, fishy null-town, kortul town, and alice Scum i think

[hiplop]

<3 <3 <3

THEY SAID YOU WOULD NEVER COME BACK

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CAN WE PLEASE JUST GET RID OF MACRO. This has gone on WAY too long, one of the days where a quick end is probably beneficial

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DDD's death isn't something I'm against, i was pretty vocal early on , I think. I'm open to hammer, just I believe we should wait a bit.

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I was chiefly pushing macro, and was on him CONSTANTLY.

the logic in a bus there is fucking crazy

fiahy is a good bet, i think.

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I hope so.

how did I react poorly to macros claim? he fucking claimed scum, and so I pushed him as such. Your attempt at mudslinging is showing desperation, major grasping at straws
VOTE: Fishy

Like other have said, he makes sense for scum.

[hiplop]

@hiplop: can you remember why you felt a theo vote was forced here?

Hm. I honestly think I may have thought the wagon was bigger than it actually was?

This looks very much like trying to save his partner. Given that Macro was the second candidate here, and he'd been railing against him so firmly, I struggle to believe hiplop was actually happy for DDD to die - if you thought Macro was scum, DDD was an obvious counterwagon. I think hiplop's a very decent candidate for bussing Macro.

No lynch = bad. NO ONE was wanting to lynch him, the supporters were fading on macro

The bits of your interaction I'd like explaining are the other bits. Firstly on day 1, when you voted him, why did you feel you needed to because of "time constraints", when your preferred lynch was equal with him? Secondly, and more importantly, on day 2 you railed against his lynch, saying that he'd claimed scum. So why on earth were you happy to settle for a DDD lynch?

DDD, Rhinox and macro have been my scum reads - when i felt macro was dying, in desperation i flipped

[hiplop]

@hiplop: How had Macrophage claimed scum?

He claimed a power role, when he got called out for it being illogical he cowarded out and claimed vanilla. That's blatant testing the waters, and the huge amount of WIFOM he pushed made it obvious

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the way it happened, there was no fucking way it came from town

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@hiplop: sure, the Macro wagon had dropped off a bit. But if you think he's claimed scum, I'm still struggling to see why, with 3 days to go, you gave up on the wagon. It's not like we were anywhere near getting a no lynch. With your professed reads, I'd expect you to have carried on pushing on Macro at that stage.

I guess i thought it was more likely for a nolynch than it really was

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mod, im in a big production so i'll have limited access until monday ! however i can still post before/after

catching up now

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VOTE: Magua

I don't think kortul is scum, and fishy doesnt seem to be dying (plus his latest posts have been pretty townie) Magua has been pretty snarky, which I think would come from scum here.

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I don't remember you being in Brightest day (very high margin of error though), and regardless I was scum in that game

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snarkiness may not be the right word, I suppose. I mean there's a harshness in the way you're

speaking

typing, which seems like angry scum saying DON'T LYNCH ME.

[hiplop]

Roit roit.

ah fuck, you're right. And based on some other games I read during scummy's, I think this just comes from you no matter the alignment

it's kinda connotation magua, but eh

UNVOTE: :\

[hiplop]

kinda

his recent posts seem a lot townier, like hes not a townread or anything just less scummy than before, and with the wagon not going anywhere i jumped off

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in this case I think its scum, in most cases though its town...just due there being more town players

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I really don't know who to vote for >_<

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VOTE: Sleepless

pretty much what Magua just said