Mini 1435 - Jimmy Neutron Mafia

[mozamis]

starts the first bandwagon, and an OMGUS?

VOTE BT

[mozamis]

Oh, and hey Fuzzy

[mozamis]

Catching up. (I'm GMT btw, so may post at different times from some of you).
Not loving Mathdino's "Don't policy lynch Keybladewielder, but be suspicous of him" stuff. Looks like Mathdino trying to stir up suspicions without actually voting for Keyblade.

VOTE MATHDINO

[mozamis]

Lol at the mum and dad stuff.

[mozamis]

Elyse is scum for voting picking the easiest vote and BT is scum for following her.

Why no vote then?

[mozamis]

@Actor: I don't get your p50 amd p51 either. You say "can we get rid of KBW?", and then you say you don't like the trashing of kbw? Please explain.
Not going to do a full list of reads yet, too early to tell. Until more people post anyway. Really not liking the policy lynch stuff. Seems like a good excuse to way lay town down a dead end. Easy scum tactic.

[mozamis]

Actually, before we vote, shouldn't we decide who gets the invention?

Fuzzy looks pretty town so far, asking lots of questions which he did when he was town in a previous game.

INVENTION: FUZZY

[mozamis]

I want it to go to someone who would be targeted at night since I think the jet-pack is a commuter type of thing..

Why?

[mozamis]

and hey monkey!

[mozamis]

Mom feels that Salamance's concerns are genuine at this point. how he's going on with the argument seems legit, though as stated he's far from conf. town.

it's likely that's he's doing it for appearances

but until there is some proof of that, I won't look into him further.

I don't understand this. Salamance's policy lynch concerns are genuine. But it's "likely he's doing it for appearances?" Seems a contradiction. Please explain.

[mozamis]

@Salamance: why the unvote? He is nowhere near a lynch, and yet you seem worried about it. Why? (and are you saying your invention vote was RVS?)

[mozamis]

@ Grandi: p38 looks like he's trying to get the game going in right direction, i.e get people to scum hunt. He's asked a whole bunch of questions, iso him.

[mozamis]

@Salamance: why the unvote? He is nowhere near a lynch, and yet you seem worried about it. Why? (and are you saying your invention vote was RVS?)

Sal, please respond.

[mozamis]

wanna get my reads as clear as pos -AA, am I right in thinking that Mom thinks Mathdino is town, but Dad thinks he is scum?

[mozamis]

No. Only played one game with Fuzzy, in which he was town. He seems to be playing in a similar way was my point. Not just asking questions, but engaged with the game and seems to be actually scum hunting. As opposed to stuff like talking about the pros and cons of a policy lynch, which I don't like as scum love to use that sort of stuff to sidetrack town.
But yeah, since my "meta" on Fuzz amounts to one game, it doesn't count for much. But it's good enough for a provisional day 1 read.

[mozamis]

Who has gangsta called scum though? He called Sal scummy, but in fact revised his read. Not really following you.

[mozamis]

Catching up and skimming, but yeah BT looks pretty town. If he is scum we're probably in trouble, but that seems unlikely at this stage. So:

UNVOTE INVENTION
INVENTION: BT

[mozamis]

Yeah, gonna have to:

UNVOTE

The main case against Dino as I see it was basically why say "don't policy this lynch guy, although he is bad". Which to me seemed a way of getting a tangetial policy lynch discussion going, as well as making KBW automatically a bit suspect.
But Dino makes a good point about reverse psychology being an ineffective way to get KBW lynched. I'm having a hard time believing that Dino, as scum, would KICK OFF DAY 1 with such a bizarre gambit. If he was scum, and he knows that KBW can sometimes be mislynch bait, then why not stay quiet and let KBW give himself enough rope?
Yeah, it doesn't add up. Plus, he's been pretty calm under fire. He doesn't look like squirming scum.

[mozamis]

Also willing to vote BT for president invention, but that would be the I-1, so holding off for a bit.


Also willing to vote BT for president invention, but that would be the I-1, so holding off for a bit.

Why though? If you think the guy is town, why not just vote for him?
Don't like this, looks a bit like scum worried that a townie might get the invention. Hedging his bets.

VOTE GRANDI

[mozamis]

However, on the topic of Elyse, it's entirely possible that she's scum capitalising on a townie's slip-ups. I honestly don't think GD's behaviour prior to her original case was that scummy. So if we do lynch either of them, and they flip town, we lynch the other.

Not loving this either. Looks like real fence sitting and it doesn't seem like you really care who gets lynhced. WHo do yiu actually think is more scummy out of the two? And why do you seem so sure that they are not both town? Or both scum?

[mozamis]

what Mom is concerned about is the fact that her top two reads already started to attack each other, bussing is likely, but I'm not entirely sure that's the case. I agree with the argument sounding like a TvS argument.

What I'm concerned about is that we still haven't had a vote from you.

[mozamis]

@AA and who are your "top 2 reads"?

[mozamis]

Scum reads Gangsta, You are Mom's top two scum reads and Dad here somewhat agrees. Capiche.

Though Dad Personally prefers Salamence for one of the scum.

My bad, should have read ahead.
Although I'm still not quite sure what you mean? Gansta and who are 2 top scum reads?

[mozamis]

Try not to answer questions for others. If they have a good townie answer, better if they give it themselves, if they don't, you shouldn't give them one.

This is horrible. Blatantly trying to make Dino look scummy without actually saying so.
Happy with my vote. More pressure on Grandi please.

[mozamis]

Mozamis, can you shrink down your reasons to suspect grandi? Like, a paragraph or two?

see post 250 and p255. He's hedging,and insinuating scuminess without saying so or voting.
@ Gangsta, thanks for clarification.
I'm not convinced by this pressure on Gangsta. He smells more like noob town than noob scum to me.

[mozamis]

A gangsta and Dino scum team, perhaps? If so, they're making it way too obvious, or at least gangsta is.

Why? Gangsta has agreed with some of Dino's stuff, but that in itself makes me think they are unlikely scum buddies. Scum tend to be a bit more cautious than that.

[mozamis]

@BT - that was earlier on about Dino and the "don't policy lynch KBW" stuff.

[mozamis]

Backtracking and then fluff.

She clearly did accuse you of backtracking not changing your mind Gangsta.

[mozamis]

UNVOTE

@Grandi - fair enough, it just would have been good if you had given that explanation when you made that invention post. Maybe we were at cross purposes on the other "answering other peoples questions" thing as well. I thought you were trying to make it look like Dino was putting words in Monkey's mouth or something.
Anyway, I understand where you are coming from now.

[mozamis]

@Grandi - I understood what you were saying, sure, but I thought you were trying to make Dino look suspicious.
Obviously I can't take what you say at face value.

[mozamis]

I never voted BT.

Could you answer some of the accusations against you?
Until you do,

VOTE SALAMANCE

[mozamis]

and is KBW on V/LA or what? I thought AA said he was, but looking at his profile it doesn't say so.

[mozamis]

Need more form Zero as well.

[mozamis]

I personally like to vote after most of the town has decided who they're suspicious of

@AA this is the sort of thing that makes me think he is noob town. He is basically openly saying "Yeah, I like to see which way the wind is blowing before I vote". Yeah it gets WIFOMY, but I have hard time seeing scum being so brazen about that.

[mozamis]

So, you're arguing against a premature argument with a premature argument?

Though what does this mean?

[mozamis]

The main thing that worries me about Gangsta is that he is too defensive. He seems to think Else is scum, and yet most of that post was defending himself, rather than attacking else.
However, he is still in my town pile for now.

[mozamis]

Been re-reading about the Salamance stuff, and Dino's post 216 was the stand out:

Salamence's claim that his vote was RVS really looks like a flat out lie.

Salamance finally responds above in p325:

As much as it was seemed to be treated as an actual policy lynch wagon start, I did mean to play it as RVS, while fishing to see reactions. Take that as you would like.

This just doesn't tally with what you said at the time though (my bolding):

Point I am saying is that trolls need to be disposed of before they ruin the game.

If this guy is a troll then something needs to be done before we end the day.

I also state that we are not letting KBW grab any inventions.

VOTE: KBW

There's just no way in the world you meant this as RVS, or a reaction test. You were quite clear that you were voting KBW because he might be a troll.
So to me it seems very clear that Dino is on to something here, and Salamance is lying about why he voted KBW.
And he then votes for Dino...OMGUS much?
My vote stays.

[mozamis]

Don't nit pick. He attacked you, and you're now voting for him. My point stands.

[mozamis]

Not going to vote Salamence because we still have other options, but I want him to properly respond to the cases made against him.

Top scum read at the moment.

He's been very clear that he finds you very suspicious. In no way is that "sitting on the fence".

[mozamis]

@Zaradi - in no way was my position on Dino "fence sitting". This is the end of my post where I conclude that it seems UNLIKELY that Dino is scum. I thought that was pretty clear. You're either scum misrepping or confused.

Yeah, it doesn't add up. Plus, he's been pretty calm under fire. He doesn't look like squirming scum.

She starts off by saying that Dino is scummy for trying to reverse psych his way to a KBW mislynch,

No. Read my post again. The first part of my post was in the PAST tense -"i thought dino might HAVE BEEN scum 'cos..." etc
The second paragraph is then saying "But i don't believe he is NOW, for these reasons".

In other words, that post was 1) Saying what my position on Dino was
2)Saying what it was now.

So, yeah you're either totally misrepping me or didn't understand that post.

And yeah, I already explained my position on Grandi. He said something I thought looked dodgy. I voted for him. He explained himself ok. I unvoted for him.
Voting for people when they do something suspicious is how this game works. And yeah, I unvote people when i think their defence sounds town. Thats how I play, deal with it.
@AA -we gonna get a vote off you at some point?

[mozamis]

@monkey, why do you think AA is town?

[mozamis]

still not totally happy with all this gangsta/elysee"town v scum" stuff. Seems a false dichotomy. Could well be the usual town on town argument that happens nearly every game.

[mozamis]

well maybe it's just a possibilty that's all I'm saying. Time and time again on day 1 I see these big arguments which turn out to be town vs town. But yeah I dunno.

[mozamis]

hey bacde

[mozamis]

Salamance.

[mozamis]

Elyse I'll accept you as town if you vote the invention to go to me

LOL yeah good plan

[mozamis]

I'm pretty sure you're town

you should vote the invention to go to me and not scum-butt BT

He's seemed pretty town to me so far, so can't do that. Plus KBW was null, so i don't know about you yet. I looked at that post Fuzzy mentioned and I'm not really seeing it as scummy. Looked like he thought Sal was scummy, and Zaradi was scummy, so he voted Zaradi.

[mozamis]

bacde, do you seriously think Elsye is bussing gangsta?

[mozamis]

cuz Elyse and BT are town so why would I keep tunneling them?

You just said Elsye was bussing Gangsta, now she's town? Explain.

[mozamis]

Its confusing as fuck tho bacde.

[mozamis]

Why aren't people voting for Salamance? Those not voting for him, please explain. It still looks to me like he lied about the whole "Oh, me saying lets policy lynch KBW was just RVS" thing. Just seems like BS to me.

[mozamis]

@ Fuzzy - read this post again. here
Ok, he doesn't actually say "lets policy lynch this guy no matter what", but if you read this post and his next few it's as clear as day that he wants to. And there is NO WAY this can be interpreted as an RVS vote which is what he claims here (near the bottom of the post).
The point is, he is now claiming that he didn't want a policy lynch on KBW, it was just part of RVS -and also a "reaction test".

The only thing in his favour is he might be town back tracking. He might have started off wanting a policy lynch. Then other people pointed out that wasn't very town. Then he might have thought "shit, yeah, maybe that was hasty, i need to change my position", and used the rvs as a cover. It sounds a bit unlikey, but it IS possible. I've seen town get into these muddles before.
Bottom line is though, that this is day 1 and this is the best lead I've got, so I'm hoping that he is scum lying as opposed to muddled town.

[mozamis]

Annoying that BT replaced out, he was my strongest town read. As Elyse says, from a purely logical standpoint feel I should keep my vote on him. But, as Dino says, I don't want to keep my vote on an unknown player.
I'll probably invention AA, as they seem pretty town APART FROM THEIR NO VOTE. AA, why are you still not voting?

[mozamis]

ah sorry that whole post was about voting the invention. so bt was my strongest town read=vote him the invention

[mozamis]

AA i think I can see, but why Elysee? She's more null to me atm.

[mozamis]

@ AA - as I said, you look pretty town to me, so I'm obviously not that suspicious of you. I'm more frustrated with you. You're one of my stronger town reads, and you're not voting. We need to vote to put pressure on scum. Try and see it from my perspective. I'm suspicious of Salamance. One more vote on him, and if he is scum, he might start to crack under the pressure. At the moment he doesn't really need to respond, 'cos he knows he is not in immediate danger of being lynched.
So yeah, it would be good if you voted.

And yeah, KBW...

[mozamis]

AA seems more likely town than Elysee. Elysee has mainly tunnelled on Gangsta, whereas AA has asked more questions and gvven more analysis on more of the game.

UNVOTE INVENTION
INVENTION AA

[mozamis]

Burden of proof is on you Bacde to prove to us you are town. We can't just take your word for it. So yeah, you can vote the invention for yourself, but I can't really see the point.

[mozamis]

I'm not trying to prove to you I'm town

read what we are discussing

I'm saying that its a townie thing to do to vote the invention to go to yourself

yet Monkey seems to be using it as a scumtell

I can't speak for Monkey. I don't take voting the invention for yourself to be town or scummy (as Fuzzy said, that's basically WIFOM). It's just that you appeared to be saying "Yeah, I know I'm town so I'll invention vote myself, and everyone else should too! Cos I know I'm town...". I was pointing out that, just like calling someone scum without a reason is unlikely to convince anyone else, saying you're town without saying why isn't likely to convince anyone either.

[mozamis]

22 pages of info tho.

[mozamis]

@ bacde - sorry I think I messed up. I thought you were talking about voting the invention for yourself. But you were talking about Sal, yeah?

[mozamis]

lol yeah i was reading but you voted the invention for yourself earlier i thought you were talking about that. Even though you blatantly unvoted yourself.
So yeah, MOZFAIL lol

[mozamis]

Why do you think Dino is scum?

[mozamis]

derpa herpa

[mozamis]

Could do I guess. Worried that he's just noob town though. Need to get the invention sorted first as well.

[mozamis]

respomding to your 548.

[mozamis]

looked through your ISO Bacde and I couln't see a reason why you are voting gangsta? Explain.

[mozamis]

I'll consider voting for Gangsta soon if no one else votes Sal. Game is stalling. Partly 'cos of the holidays probably, but partly 'cos no one is under any pressure. No incentive for scum to post at all if there isn't a wagon on them.

[mozamis]

@Garandi - yeah good point about Dino casting aspersions on Gangsta without voting for him (that is what you're saying, right?). The problem I still have is Dino's policy lynch stuff at the beginning. Why would he as scum do that, why didn't he (if he "knew" KBW was a troll) just keep quiet and let town policy the troll on its own?

[mozamis]

and yeah you are right about Zero, he is lurking. Need Gangsta to get in here as well and defend himself.

[mozamis]

Prods needed as well.

@MOD YOU PROD ZARADI AND GANGSTA PLEASE?

[mozamis]

*COULD

[mozamis]

yeah grandi thoughts on invention?

[mozamis]

I'm game. That was a curious post from Zero, agreeing with Bacde but not voting Fuzzy. A real "hedgy" post.

VOTE ZERO

[mozamis]

You talking about "Zero agreeing with Bacde"?

[mozamis]

Big surprise from AA, and even bigger surprise from Sal. Who did I criticise for not voting? AA. Who have I spent most of the game voting for? Sal.


oh, and how is criticising AA - who most have read as town - the same as me having "done nothing but agree with what others have said"? Likewise Gangsta has been one of the most popular wagons/suspects all game. I'm one of the few that have given him the benefit of the doubt. How is that agreeing with what others have said?
And on Gangsta, how is not agreeing with everyone else the same as defending him?
Sorry if I haven't agreed with you or just gone along with everyone else. I actually like to scumhunt, which involves questioning other people's reads, thinking for myself and yeah sometimes i agree with other people as well
You're either not reading properly AA, confused or scum misrepping.

[mozamis]

@ Bacde lol you obviouly haven't see me get mislynched before. It always winds me up when people get the wrong end of the stick. I know I'm innocent, and it always frustrates me when other people can't see it.

[mozamis]

I'll consider voting for Gangsta soon if no one else votes Sal. Game is stalling. Partly 'cos of the holidays probably, but partly 'cos no one is under any pressure. No incentive for scum to post at all if there isn't a wagon on them.

[mozamis]

Yeah, we need to pressure the guy, he is only at L-4.

VOTE GANGSTA

[mozamis]

again, post 563. Are you reading the thread? As you say, "null-town" was how i read him for a while. Not a very certain read. But yeah I want to pressurise him, and I didn't like his defensiveness as I said earlier, so of course I voted for him. You should too, as opposed to parking your vote on me.

[mozamis]

hang on, not long ago you suggested that by me NOT voting for him, I was trying to protect Gangsta? Now I AM voting for him, Gangsta is town? Don't like that at all, seems like you are trying to make me look bad no matter what I do. And at the same time distance yourself from a gangsta lynch which I thought you were in favour of.

[mozamis]

I'm disagreeing with you, not being "defensive". Calm down.

[mozamis]

I'm also not entirely sure where his Zero vote came from. I'm not seeing much of a case coming from him, and

it seems to me that he is trying to protect Gangsta

I also never said that you were trying to protect gangsta

Try again.

[mozamis]

This is what I mean about you not paying attention to the thread AA.

[mozamis]

@MOD I'm not voting twice

@Gangsta - why no vote?

[mozamis]

@ Mathdino so you don't like AA but think she's town? Explain.

[mozamis]

I'm pointing out a change in AA's behavior. I never discredited her case. Nice misrep though.

I'm thinking she might have got more confident in her reads 'cos she got the invention. Bit of an ego trip.

[mozamis]

yeah good spot Grandi. Last couple of Mini Normal's I played there were 3 scum though so I don't know if that's a scum slip or just a result of what Dino is used to. You played many mini games Dino?

[mozamis]

he might just have got muddled though. seems a pretty big slip otherwise.

[mozamis]

Though fuzzy hasn't voted for you, so what do you mean?

[mozamis]

nah, forget that, my bad. I thought you said "fuzzy sheeped" not "wanting to sheep that case", shouldn't skim read.
Is it the fact that he wanted to sheep the case, but didn't that you find scummy, or just the fact that he agreed with Monkey about you?

[mozamis]

throughout the game, he has soft-defended Gangsta, then he proceeds to fence-sit on him then states that he'd be willing to vote for him if need be, and only does so when I park my one on him.

"soft defended" = thought Gangsta might be allowed the benefit of the doubt midway through day 1.
"fence sit" =unsure of Gangsta. Frankly, I'm suspicious of anyone who has "cast iron" reads day 1. So yeah, I was unsure of Gangsta.
"only does so when I park my one him" - post hoc, ergo propter hoc fallacy. "Oh, Moz voted for Gangsta after I voted for Moz, so there must be a connection between the 2 events." Just no. I clearly stated I was thinking of voting for Gangsta before you voted for me. So another bit of dodgy misrepping or just not bothering to read from you.

[mozamis]

I'm defintely getting a bit suspicious of AA now. She's been tunnelling for a while now, and doesn't seem to be listening to anything I'm saying. I'm pretty sure I've responded to most, if not all of those points already and yet she repeats them? I expect better critical thinking from town.
I'm not loving how she's ignoring the Mathdino and Gangsta stuff either.
Also, interesting choice of phrase from AA a few posts back "...park my vote on you". To me, this suggests she has no intention whatsoever of changing her mind, which looks a bit scummy to me.
If she hadn't seemed quite town earlier on, I'd be tempted to vote her now. But she's in the null pile for now.
More importantly, we really need Mathdino and Gangsta to post.

[mozamis]

now, you are saying I'm scum because I'm

I just said you were in the "null pile"...

[mozamis]

mom can see the "slip" though I'm not buying it.

Don't like this. Looks like you're trying "handwave" the Dino stuff. "not buying it" just sounds a bit dismissive to me.

yes,

I have no intention of changing my vote

, which is why I seldom vote. how is that scummy?

If you've no intention of changing your vote, how on earth can I be expected to reply to your "case"? I feel like I've already responded to your case several times anyway - but to me it just sounds like you've given up scum hunting and are just gonna vote for me whatever I say. Also, it sounds like a great excuse for you to ignore the Dino and Gangsta stuff. You've just planted your vote and have no intention of changing it.
Great townie attitude

[mozamis]

Agree with Grandi, I think its unlikely that scum would make such a blunder. It's possible, and as Grandi said his defence hasn't been that convincing, but I think Gangsta is still a better bet. Anyway, I can't see myself hammering Dino unless he says something much worse.

[mozamis]

bacde voted three times lol maybe you counted that.
P:edit hang on u got it i think

[mozamis]

MonkeyMan: I literally just said that we shouldn't policy lynch KBW. To quote my first post: "Please resist the urge to policy lynch him."

What I'm saying is that at some point, scum are going to try to waste a lynch on him; it's happened before. Don't do it unless you actually think he's scum. Since he's pretty unreadable, I suggested that the cop investigate just in case he's actually scum.

The debate was then about whether he was trying reverse psychology etc.
Although am I getting you wrong here - u said "policy vigging" -I'm assuming u meant "Policy lynching"?

[mozamis]

any thoughts on anything at all?

[mozamis]

Agree re: Dino and Gangsta.

@Mod: standard practice when someone replaces out is to leave all the votes the same.

[mozamis]

no probs

[mozamis]

gangsta.

[mozamis]

For what reasons? I've ISO'd you, and you never said whether you thought Dino slipped or not.

[mozamis]

thanks mod appreciated.
Don't like the fact that Dino has disappeared when under pressure.

[mozamis]

yeah maybe. but what about that policy lynch stuff early on? Why would he as scum alert us all to the fact that kbw was a troll?

[mozamis]

Still think Gangsta's scum. Still, we can't have a no lynch so the options seem to be Fuzzy, Dino or a random lurker lynch. Random lurker lynch is random. The worst thing about Dino to my mind is that he hasn't posted since he's been under pressure. But I'm not convinced he "slipped", and apart from doubts early on about his "don't policy lynch KBW" stuff, he hasn't looked that scummy.
So P.O.E gonna have to vote Fuzzy. He has done absolutely no scum hunting for a long time, and this stuff about "sorry I haven't posted, I thought I was dead" could be scum BS.

VOTE FUZZY

[mozamis]

Did have twelve or so hours left Grandi. Why the quick hammer?
Still, at least it's not a no-lynch which is something.

[mozamis]

@ AA - First, try and calm down. I know you've been tunnelling like mad on me for a while now, but try and think objectively.
Think about the FACTS that you know, and try and think logically about what happened last night.
Also, look at the few posts just before the lynch, hopefully that will point you in the right direction.

I'm suspicious of monkey though. His case on Dino was weak. And now he seems quite eager to vote me without a full discussion, looks a bit opportunistic. He seems a bit too easily convinced by AA's claim. I would expect a townie to be a bit more doubtful. After all, we don't know for sure whether AA is telling the truth or not.

VOTE MONKEYMAN.

[mozamis]

I'm too scared that we're not going to get a lynch through.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Mathdino

Someone should hammer.

Can't see this really coming from scum. She seemed genuinely worried we might not get a lynch, and her request for a hammer looks town. Doubt that scum would be quite so bold as to ask for a hammer on someone they knew to be town.

VOTE INVENTION: ELYSE

[mozamis]

I'm slightly confused about AA's invention. Basically, it looks like it gave her tracking abilities. So AA, could you explain why you said to people don't PR target you cos it might not work?

oh, I should mention that all town PR's that want to target me tonight, don't. It's likely to not go through

I can't see why you as a temporary tracker would also have role blocking abilities.

[mozamis]

Unless I missed it, AA has not claimed his PR. He just claimed his item.

Ah, maybe I misunderstood then. I was assuming AA was talking about the invention, that there was something about the invention that role blocked people.

[mozamis]

Yeah, I'm Betty Quinlan, the Nurse. I'm getting this from the Jimmy Neutron wiki, as I haven't seen the show (barring a few clips from youtube which I watched pregame) but apparently she is Jimmy's first love interest
Anyway, I breadcrumbed it in one of my early posts:

N

ot going to do a full list of reads yet, too early to tell.

U

ntil more people post anyway.

R

eally not liking the policy lynch stuff.

S

eems like a good excuse to way lay town down a dead end.

E

asy scum tactic.

I'm basically a back up Doc. If there is a doc, and they die, I take over. If there is a doc, and they are still alive, I have no power. Likewise if there is no doc, I am powerless.
Obviously I protected Grandi last night.

[mozamis]

I was told I could attempt to protect someone every night. Which makes sense because if the doc gets vigged or something, I take over.

[mozamis]

Invention: Guille

Moza, that's a bull-shit claim, and even if you were the Nurse why would you protect Grandi? You had him as one of your suspects

as for my invention, yes. It gave us tacking abilities. Not once have I stated that I had any capabilities of blocking anyone, just that roles don't affect us should they target us.

You'll forgive me for not being too surprised AA, but ever since your remark aboout "having no intention of changing your vote", you've lost a fair bit of credibility in my eyes. Grandi was one of my suspects early on, but I was reading him as town for at least the last half of day 1, as you must know. Yeah, the problem I have with your invention is that why did the invention give you tracking powers, and the ability to nullify any PR's used against you? It's the invention I'm talking about, not your role. If you could just state precisely what the invention did, as opposed to being vague, that would help.
And Fuzzy, think about Elyse and the invention...

[mozamis]

@Elyse -you already got the invention, and fuzzy voted for me. I was trying to tell him not to lynch anyone before you decided whether to use the invention before end of day. Remember you can use the invention whenever you want. If the invention gives you some sort of day power or something, obviously we don't the end of the day to occur before you actually get it from the Mod.

[mozamis]

If by some miracles he's not then we just lynch AA.

I think this is too hasty. When I flip town, don't automatically assume AA is scum. It's an almost certainty that she is telling the truth about the invention (I protected Grandi, she tracked me to Grandi's. She could be scum making that up, but that seems incredibly unlikely. On that note, of course theoretically I could be scum fakeclaiming. Although personally I think I would just flat out deny the charge that I was ever at Grandi's if I were scum and try and claim AA was lying, since that would be a damn sight easier.)
But I'm not getting a scum vibe from her. Yes, she misrepped me and admitted to it. But her defence was:

Mom is very sleepy sometimes and she has a forgetfullness problem with what she's said when she's sleepy. I am similar so you'll have to forgive obvious inconsistancies like that one.

To me that smells more of incompetent town rather than scum. Scum more likely to deny misrepping me as opposed to admitting it. So yeah I don't think she's a great asset to the town, but not necessarily scum.
Point is anyway that she could well just be town telling the truth.
I'm still more worried about Monkey and Fuzzy.
Monkey had no doubts at all about AA's claim, and a townie would have some doubt.
Fuzzy trying to get a lynch before the invention has a chance to get used is certainly anti-town.

Main point: if I get lynched, don't assume AA is scum.

[mozamis]

I'm not really sold on Elyse right now, but we need to give the invention to someone, so:

Invention: Elyse

By my count, Sal's vote was the invention hammer. Which makes monkey's vote irrelevent. Either he has bungled or looking for town cred by going with the crowd. Monkey,please explain.

[mozamis]

I am more town today

I grow townier and townier with every passing second

lol Bacde. And actually AA posts like this can be revealing so please don't tell people to shut up.It's hard to see scum posting like that, I can't see scum cracking jokes at this stage of the game.
@ Bacde Anyway, you certainly seem a lot more relaxed than that game we played when you were scum. And I'm voting Monkey, he's likely scum I think. His case on Dino was really weak. And he's the only person that hasn't wanted to discuss AA's tracking last night.
This isn't a newb game, we all know that trackers don't confirm anyone's role, just where they went.
And yet Monkey had no hesitation at all in voting for me, BEFORE I confirmed AA was telling the truth about where I went. At that stage, she could have been making it up. A townie would be much more sceptical and would have waited to see what I said.
So yeah, get on the monkey wagon.

[mozamis]

Yes, it very much DOES matter that I confirmed AA was telling the truth about the invention, because before that you could not have been sure whether she was making it up or not. But no, you had no HESITATION at all in buying what AA said. Only scum would do that, a townie couldn't know whether she was bullshitting about the invention or not.

[mozamis]

Yeah well I wasn't too excited when I got my role pm either. (apart from the pic which is kinda funny). But yeah I wish I was something a bit more cool like a cop or doc or something because it doesn't seem like a great role IMO.

[mozamis]

Looks like I'm gonna be lynched. Although maybe Elsye's invention might clear me, xray might be investigative.
Although if so it might be more useful to lynch me for the info and use the invention on someone else.
Thoughts?

[mozamis]

Ah my bad monkey Sal voted twice for the invention, so you were the hammer.

[mozamis]

I'd rather not lynch town, but, tbh, the nurse claim seems off. I don't doubt that you may have gotten the Nurse, but I don't think that's your ability. It fits

too

well. I mean, I'm Jimmy, but I'm VT.

I don't really understand this. I'm the Nurse, and the nurse is my ability but whatever.
I'm off to bed. Selfishly, I'm kinda hoping Elysee's invention might clear me, but if not at least this lynch should tell us something.
Monkey prob scum.
AA, Elysee prob town.
Guille town cos of BT but he's now lurking so null-town.
Gangsta null-scum. Looked scummy, but we need to give his replacement a chance.
Everyone else null.
So i guess I'd go for monkey, Gangsta and one other. Maybe HD's slot? Vaguely remember Bacde making a good point about HD looking lurkery scum.

[mozamis]

@Elysee - You just to have decide who is most likely scum, no other considerations matter. (like vig Gangsta cos he's not likely to get replaced? Granted he's likely scum, but vigging someone 'cos they may or may not be replaced is not good enough).
So vig whoever you think is best bet for scum.
Obvioulsy, I think Monkey is the best choice.

[mozamis]

Obviously I'm not keen on it, but I think vigging me or monkey makes sense from a logical standpoint. I'd clearly prefer it if monkey got vigged, as I think he'll flip scum. One scum down, and town don't lose a PR.
However, if you vig me, then at least you should lynch monkey, so we will at least hopefully end the day one scum down.

[mozamis]

she said in 1096 that she sent it in.

[mozamis]

bah! go scum!

[mozamis]

Also, AI, please in the future get a backup mod. You shouldn't have missed my NK Night 2 and the game should of lasted so long.

Wow. I was gonna say something about the Mods lack of involvement, but missing the NK, bloody hell. Think you should have replaced out early on mod, you didnt reply to several of my pm's and in general I didn't feel you were at all involved in the game. Maybe you had some serious real life stuff going on. But replace out if you know you havent really got the time.

All in all, a disappointing game. The theme looked great but yeah...it didn't deliver. Partly cos I had didnt really have much support and felt I was doing it on my own.
Partly the game was a let down though due to my own fault. Me doing the night kill was a real noob error. With AA having the invention and possibly a PR as well and suspecting me strongly I should have kept my head down. Annoying, becuase up until then I felt I had done quite well in what I was considering my first "proper" game as scum. ( I dicked around in three games a few years ago, but this was my first game as scum since I came back to mafiascum). Annoying though. Because although massive props must go to Ms Marangal in this game, I thought I had done quite well in persuading everyone else to ignore her. It does seem very hard in mafia, even if you actually catch scum, to persuade other people that you are right. But yeah, apart from her, no one seemed to suspect me, apart from Salamance. Which as it turned out could have been a godsend what with with the Godmother thing. So I kinda feel that scum could have had a chance going into day 2 if I hadn't messed the nightkill up.
But hey ho. We were a very inexperienced scum team (discounting Ghostlin, who came in and did a great job considering the circumstances) so I don't think we did that badly. But yeah noob scum vs experienced town...there was probably only ever gonna be one winner.
But well played town, and well played Ms Marangal!

ps here is the scum quick topic here
On the nurse claim, I thought it people would say "wow, thats such a shit power role, scum would never make that up", thought that would be better than claiming cop or doc. Only Elyse got that. But I guess it was too obscure a claim, really. Maybe it would have gone down better if I had not been tracked to the corpse lol

[mozamis]

So were doc, cop and 2 masons? I thought AA was maybe a PR with her "don't use power roel on me tonight people". I still don't really get that, since the invention didn't protect her. Or was she in fact asking people to protect her? It didn't matter, there was no way were killing her that night, much as I really, really wanted to. Iwas shitting bricks every time she posted lol
And good to see you again Ghosty! Thanks for trying hard, it was appreciated. There was a brief moment was a couple of people unvoted you when I thought "shit, he might pull it off" but alas, it was not tobe. Still, good on yer.
Oh and Zero, the self hammer man...town were quite divided, and with the mod never showing up, there was always a chance your lynch could have unravelled. Never give up!

P:edit - yeah, maybe we should have gone for the inventions. But I was worried that it would look really scummy to try and cliam the invention. Thought I would go for the "get town points by sheeping the most popular candidate" approach.

[mozamis]

*so town were doc etc

[mozamis]

Yeah, I was glad that you replaced out cos you looked good. You Grandi and AA were towns best players in this game IMO.

[mozamis]

lol I don't think you were lynched fuzzy
And thanks for kind words Elyse, it was fun playing with you

[mozamis]

You needed to be more involved though, it was very frustrating. Numerous times I asked you questions and you didn't get back to me. And various lynches and incention lynches you just werent around.
And if your back up mod had real life stuff going on, he wasn't a back up mod.