Mini 1488: Lucid Dreamers Mafia (Game Over)

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote: Mutleyddmc

.

[Haschel Cedricson]

@ MafiaSSK: it amused me for someone to be at L-2 this early. Also you can call me Gaiden.

What's funny about it?

[Haschel Cedricson]

What's amusing about irresponsibility?

[Haschel Cedricson]

I was at L5. There were still people who hadn't voted. That could have easily been a quicklynch.

Not to mention somebody easily could have dreamed themselves an extra vote or something like that.

[Haschel Cedricson]

What SHOULD his reaction be?

[Haschel Cedricson]

"Oh i see now. no harm done."
Clearly this.

I wasn't asking you. Why did you answer a question meant for chkflip?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Does anyone want to state intent?

Intent to do what?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Seriously, though, explain.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I had a dream last night that Nat was scum. (a RL dream not one I made up)

That doesn't answer the "intent" question.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote: Guyett

[Haschel Cedricson]

Fascinating.

[Haschel Cedricson]

What do you have against Who?

Against

whom

.

Seriously though, this is a pretty crappy post.

[Haschel Cedricson]

So why vote him before he even gets to the thread?

It look(ed) like you're picking on the one non-unconfirmed who hasn't posted.

Frankly, Who should be picked on right now. He's alive and is posting in at least one other game, but he hasn't graced us with his presence yet.

[Haschel Cedricson]

EBWOP: The announcement about talking about on-going games specifically states that sort of sentence is okay.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Since GIF has already claimed a power, would it be advantageous for him to share his dream? I can see pros and cons of doing so.

All three of my dreams were random, but only one of them I was told had to be redone.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Also i'm pretty sure gif is town but if someone had a power to check his alignment today wouldn't be a good day to do it. I dreamed i was having a nice bbq with y'all but gif may have got food poisoning...

It appears GuyInFreezer was a popular guy last night, then, because in my dream he was my boss.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Gif was your boss? Did you get details on how that worked?

I have no idea what my dream did. Well, that's not true; I have a small idea what my dream did. But I don't know how or if GIF is affected.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Crosspost to all my games: Sorry for not posting; I got home from work yesterday with an awful headache/fever and was herded into bed immediately by my wife. Then today at work the Internet and phones have been down all morning and they just went back up. I'll try to take care of my work backlog and post this afternoon, but I'm afraid I can't make any promises. If I don't come back today, I'll definitely be here tomorrow.

[Haschel Cedricson]

@Guyett it's called a gambit / reaction test. Not sure that that is really considered lying but ok.

What was the gambit here? What reactions were you looking for?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Alright, what notable reactions did you see?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Unvote; Vote: ac

.

Looking at Guyett's list, I don't buy that almost half of the game is going to be mod-confirmed on the first day. The timing seems off to be an innocent-child type of power as well; why didn't Morgan Freeman say anything at the start of the day instead of waiting until people started to put pressure on ac?

Combined with points that Guyett has made and his response to my questions, I think AC is the best lynch today.

[Haschel Cedricson]

HC, do you think it's possible that ac dreamed to be "mod-confirmed" by Morgan Freeman when he was close to a lynch?

I doubt it, because ac wasn't close to a lynch. That being said, I have no idea how to interpret a lot of these dream results. So far we've seen people who knew exactly what their dream would do before they chose it, people who didn't know what their dream would do but were informed by the mod before the day started, and other people who all they know about their dream is that they sent one in. There seems to be no consistency as to how the dreams work, and I'm worried that we're confirming an awful lot of people as town using a mechanic we know surprisingly little about.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Haschel what's the deal with your votes on the votecount? Did you dream something to do that or did someone else?

I'm assuming it's due to the cadmium plating on my hands, but I don't know that for sure.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Guyett, why won't you answer his question?

Because I don't want to discuss things with scum.
Srsly vote me out and then work on my wagon.
I am being deliberately anti town to get as many scum on my wagon as possible

ahahahaha

Unvote; Vote: Guyett

[Haschel Cedricson]

Announcement

EVERYONE must address chkflip in their next post in some form or fashion (with something more than "hello chkflip", etc.).

chkflip
34100 Fake Street, Apt #4A
Anytown, USA 81009




Seriously, though, I've been neglecting this game and will put more energy into a reread today. chkflip, why do you trust Morgan Freeman?

[Haschel Cedricson]

I trust it a whole hell of a lot less now, if you're wondering.

I was wondering, and the fact that you brought it up before I could means townpoints for you.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Hasch, have you got a dream result from the mod?

Not unless you count my unvotes remaining visible on the votecount.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Hasch, have you got a dream result from the mod?

Not unless you count my unvotes remaining visible on the votecount.

Did the mod explain anything about your dream to you? What were the messages you got from the Mod after you sent in your three dreams?

Basically, I sent in three dreams. The mod told me (paraphrasing) that the first dream was good, he couldn't think of anything to do with the second, and that the third one was good. All responses were short with no details. I was told that I could modify the dreams if I wanted, but I said I'd just roll the dice with Dream #3.

There have been no further communications.

[Haschel Cedricson]

There have been no further communications.

Correction: I also got a PM telling me the day had started.

Anyhoo, I think I'm just going to share my dream since I don't see any harm in doing so and the rules just prevent quoting PMs FROM the mod, not TO the mod.

3) I am at work, sorting aircraft parts. I notice that somebody has mixed all the nuts together, and I have to check each one individually to see if it has a right-hand or left-hand thread. Then I sort them by size. Then I move on to the bolts. It turns out that the AN numbering system is being replaced by the MS numbering system, and my boss GuyInFreezer tells me that I will have to memorize how to convert AN numbers to MS numbers in order to keep my job. He gives me a test, but the bolt that I'm supposed to figure out the MS number for is actually an NAS bolt and therefore cannot be measured with the AN bolt gauge. In anger I attempt to tear the bolt in two, but only succeed in transfering the cadmium plating from the bolt to my hands.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Mutley you should sheep me.

Can you summarize the case on chkflip for me? Because I'm not seeing it at all.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Here, HC. Doing this so Guyett doesn't have to. <3

Spoiler: Chkflip Case

Mafia, you're trying pretty hard to look town or you're just more concerned than you should be. Nobody was going to let that happen.

Trying to grab some town reads by "talking" to the mafia.

I don't like anyone's play, mine included.

This is mostly fluff. He doesn't really contribute to anything here.

I've never played this setup before. Do Nightmares get dreams, too?

Worst fake townslip I have ever seen.

I trust Morgan Freeman.

Fluff. Doesn't really contribute to town.

Cases are scummy and I'm not good at writing them.

Bad excuse for not making cases.

We have two weeks; what's your rush?

Ok, nothing scummy here.

UNVOTE: Guyett
VOTE: Mutleyddmc

BUT WAIT. You asked what's the rush then you are suddenly okay with policy lynching Mut to go to night?

I don't want you to do it, I want Guyett to do it.

I'm not reading anything under that spoiler tag until Guyett answers.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Mutley you should sheep me.

Can you summarize the case on chkflip for me? Because I'm not seeing it at all.

That wasn't a rhetorical question, chief.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Dodging prod, probably won't post until tomorrow due to the holiday.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Yeah, after rereading baldeagle comes across as buddying hardcore. I disagree with Guyett's case on chkflip, but I understand it. Baldeagle's case feels forced, which is even more bizarre since he wasn't asked to give one. In addition, answering questions intended for other people is always scummy.

Unvote, Vote: Baldeagle

[Haschel Cedricson]

Will get caught up and post after football [/quote]

[Haschel Cedricson]

Here is my dream from last night:

My wife and I get on a plane to Rio de Janeiro. Upon our arrival, we decide to walk to our hotel. Unfortunately, we turned right instead of left when turning onto the main road, and we find ourselves out of town. For some reason we keep on walking until we see a sign that says "Up Ahead: Buenos Aires". Realizing our mistake, we walk all the way back to Rio de Janeiro. However, there is a customs booth on the way back, since we are now crossing from Argentina to Brazil (apparently Uruguay does not exist in this dream). I don't have my passport, but I play it cool and they let us in anyway. Now we're back in Rio de Janeiro and outside of our hotel is one of those inflatable "See how fast you can throw a baseball" games that they have at minor-league baseball games in the concourse. I decide to try it, throw the baseball impossibly fast, and win a stuffed animal for my wife.

I now have a stuffed animal that may or may not actually do anything.

I'm surprised how fast the Guyett wagon has formed today, especially in light of how yesterday it formed all the way to L-1 and then disintegrated.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Wait so Natirasha you don't want to lynch Guyett?

And you do? Why?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Vote: ac1983fan

for abdication of responsibility.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Haschel, I don't follow.
Like I voted because that's what I thought the confirmed town player wanted, and following a confirmed town player who is actually like really good at the game is usually a good strategy???

No, that's a bad strategy, unless that conftown player is also a cop or something.

It's also noting upon rereading that we only have Nat's word that the masons shared alignment, as SSK never said anything about that. So technically Nat is NOT conftown. (I agree that Nat is likely town).

[Haschel Cedricson]

This is really getting into a Mafia Discussion thing, but I've noticed that since I've came back to this site people are a lot more liberal with the phrase "confirmed town" than they should be. Confirmed means 100%.

[Haschel Cedricson]

EBWOP: Abdication of responsibility IS scummy play. Scum have a reason to do that, town doesn't.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Ironically Nat's revelation makes me feel better about him.

I don't like that Who posted without sharing his dream, but GIF makes an excellent point about not needing to spend two dreams in order to make the gambit work.

As for ac, in addition to his scummy play today I just noticed this post, which is so awful in retrospect I can't believe the town glossed over it. More votes on ac, please.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I've already shared both my dreams.

Well, yeah, but you did it BEFORE the post where most everybody else started to share, which happens to be the point where I started rereading, so it doesn't count*.

*By which I mean I am a dumbass.

[Haschel Cedricson]

What restrictions on chkflp?

Is there a list of what everyone's claimed their dream was?

announcement

For Day 2, if you vote chkflip and then un-vote, you will

not

be able to vote for chkflip again.

And nobody has compiled a list yet, but if they did, your dream wouldn't be on it.

[Haschel Cedricson]

A few thoughts while thinking about this game on my drive to work:

Morgan Freeman says that ac1983fan is not a Nightmare!

Announcement

EVERYONE must address chkflip in their next post in some form or fashion (with something more than "hello chkflip", etc.).

announcement

For Day 2, if you vote chkflip and then un-vote, you will

not

be able to vote for chkflip again.

why ac's dream outcome is scummy

Tag fixed. ~Zaicon

I like most of what you've contributed, but I"m not following this. Ac had nothing to do with the latter two dreams.

I'm sitting on a train. There's no sign of other human life in any direction that I can see. I'm alone on the train, but it moves forward, hurtling westward faster and faster and faster. What I can see outside of the train becomes a bright white blur, and the force shoves me deeper and deeper into my seat. But for one everlasting second, the train instantly slows down.

Or perhaps it's just time which slows only for me

. My body floats up to look through the window, and there's a junkyard, filled with the mangled corpses of old blue post office boxes. I have an eternity to stare them down, but the rust simply crusts over their bodies. And when I scream, letters pour out like blood, and the train speeds away.

it didn't because i didn't intend to slow down time

What did you intend it to do?

The more important question here is what were the other two dreams you submitted, and what would they have done?

i had no specific intention, i just like lucid dreamers and felt like typing something more in-depth and artsy than "i check guyett's hands to see if they are red or not"

but why? the purpose of the dream is to help you win this game of mafia not exercise your creative writing skills...

Full disclosure, every dream I submit to the mod is going to be based on an actual dream I have IRL, albeit occasionally with one of your names replacing whatever real-life person was in the dream. It's apparent that angling for specific powers isn't likely to work the way we want it to, and frankly I find it fun both seeing how the mod interprets a dream with no intent behindit, and occasionally forcing the mod to read a graphic description of a wet dream.

[Haschel Cedricson]

The more important question here is what were the other two dreams you submitted, and what would they have done?

By the by, Marquis, this wasn't a rhetorical question.

[Haschel Cedricson]

hey hc, maybe you should read the last posts i made.

i submitted one and only one intentionally ambiguous dream...

Sorry, I parsed this as "One of my dreams was intentionally ambiguous, but the other two were not."

[Haschel Cedricson]

Prod received. Work is somewhat busy today, but I'll try to get caught up.

No it's GIF and HC and/or Caled. Scum's action has been slowed down [...] HC just said his stuffed animal doesn't do anything yet. Would have thought that would have been picked up. Does no one else see the link?

For the record, I knew that the stuffed animal would possibly be useless when I picked it, and I assume the slowing down effect, whatever it is, would take place after the scum chose their dream.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Obviously I still support the AC lynch. Not going to vote yet until we discuss quicklynching, though.

I'm still waiting to hear some dream results; I'm going to pass on revealing my dream at this very moment.

PREVIEW EDIT: Shane, in theory if Safety is alive at the start of the night, he may get one more chance to dream.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Keeping other people honest.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Interesting.

I dreamt that I had started a lucrative business installing home security systems. In order to advertise my new business I printed up a bunch of coupons, tied them to balloons, and let them go. Eventually displaced found one of my balloons and I installed a free security system in his house. The coupon was also a Jamba Juice punchcard, so we celebrated his new security with smoothies.

The effect of this dream was that an alarm would alert me if anybody other than me targeted displaced last night. And guess what? The alarm did indeed go off.

So, somebody is lying about last night. Somebody is also lying about the night before last, due to the stuff being moved around Safety's house. At first I thought the latter may have been a flavor dream from the dead but if Nat is telling the truth then baldeagle didn't do that and I don't know why any of the other dead players would.

I've got a work project I need to finish this morning, but when I come back I think we have an excellent place to start.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Ugh, I just handmade a chart to see who could have broken into Safety or displaced's respective houses, and it doesn't look good. The only living players we know 100% is not lying is Guyett and Who. Everybody else is unconfirmed on BOTH nights.

Of particular interest today is caled and Nat. So far, we haven't seen any mariachi things. However, Nat claims to have commuted last night. So, if a mariachi shows up later today, we know that caled is telling the truth and Nat is lying. If a mariachi band DOESN'T show up, then we have some options:
1) Caled is lying, and Nat is telling the truth
2) Caled is lying, and Nat is also lying
3) Caled is telling the truth, and Nat is also telling the truth
4) Caled is telling the truth and was roleblocked, Nat is telling the truth
5) Caled is telling the truth and was roleblocked, Nat is lying

Post #986 confuses me a little bit, when Nat points out that no mariachi band has shown up. If Nat's telling the truth, then OF COURSE he shouldn't expect a mariachi band; he was busy commuting. Mentioning the current lack of mariachis as a strike against Caled seems incongruous.

If #5 is true, then that means Nat AND somebody else is lying, since one person targeted displaced and another person would have to do the blocking.

Anyhoo, moving on to the other players: I find it bizarre that after two nights of every successfully turning in their dreams, we all of a sudden have three people forget. And two of them are verified town. It's feasible that ac is lying in order to get out from faking a plausible unconfirmable dream.

Displaced hasn't communicated with Marquis yet, but I find it very unlikely that scum would target one of their own and then make up a fake dream, so I'm moving Displaced into the 90% town category.

I understand Shane's theory about Guyett and the GIF-slowdown dream, but find it highly unlikely.

I think we (and I include myself in this) are becoming too reliant on dreams and are putting normal scumhunting on the backburner. Time for a reread of the whole game.

[Haschel Cedricson]

:-/

That's what this game needs, more ambiguity.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Fuck, GIF was a modkill! Maybe he targeted displaced and set off the alarm! My whole theory on somebody definitely lying is worthless.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Wait, he was modkilled for lack of a replacement, so he didn't dream.

NEVER MIND, EVERYONE. THEORY IS BACK ON.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I went into this game promising myself that I was going to make an effort not to tunnel, but I can't help it; everything about ac makes me want to lynch him. Also, looking at the last minute Marquiswagon that changed the lynch from ac to Marquis, both Nat and caled look a little suspicious; it looks kind of like like the former pushed the latter into voting Marquis, and that was the vote that caused the wagon to snowball to a lynch.

Speaking of those two, still no mariachis. That doesn't actually help us determine either of their alignments.

Shane is a lazy lynch and I think everybody knows it.

Vote: ac

.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Is it relevant though?

It's relevant because if we can't explain it then somebody else is lying.

Lying about salad.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Maybe this is one of the flavor-related dreams from the dead?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Nope. It appears it was either flavor or would have required somebody to target me.

[Haschel Cedricson]

I'm pretty sure displaced is town, and that vote is awful.

I'm getting the feeling that Ac and Caled might be the scum team. That vote on displaced is pretty bad imo and reeks of chainsaw defending

I'm feeling that way too.

I want to see some dream interpretation from displaced.

Ironically this is correct; have you heard anything from Marquis, displaced?

[Haschel Cedricson]

Well, that's problematic, because I improved on my dream from yesterday so that part of my improved security system included me watching over closed-circuit TV. If anybody visited killerjester then not only would they trip the alarm but my television would switch from the NBA game I was watching to the CC feed. I saw caled interrupt my basketball game, which means Zaicon counted it as a visit so far as my dream went.

A few followups from yesterday that never got touched upon: killerjester, have you received ANY communication from Marquis? It looks like no mariachi band showed up, so which of the Nat/caled possibilities are probable?

Vote pending Guyett's reveal.

Personal note: I am packing my apartment in preparation for a move and will not have a ton of free time today, and a lot of the free time I have will be playing Pokemon Y, so I'll probably only be able to check in once or twice today. After that participation should be mostly normal.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Any reasonable reason, or just that you're afraid of me reading you?

Sure, caled targetted you last night and you claim to have dreamed a PGO, yet caled is still alive. We know caled is telling the truth about his dream because killerjester was also saved and confirmed this, and I saw caled target killerjester, which suggests the act of rescuing does indeed count as a target.

Furthermore, we know that SOMEBODY targetted displaced/killerjester the night before and lied about it, and you're one of the remaining players that could have done it.

Vote: goodmorning

[Haschel Cedricson]

My whole case on you is that this is MyLo and everyone's posted while you have three votes on you, so either scum are playing poorly and missed a hammer, or both scum are already voting you or you're scum.

See it's pretty suspicious that you'd assume Mod error over Haschel-scum. Especially when caled thinks she isn't seriously maimed, which could lend support to your claim that it doesn't count as a visit. The fact that you didn't immediately doubt Haschel's claim might be allusive to scum who knows Haschel isn't lying.

Agreeing with these.

Issues we need to resolve: does my dream count as a target or not?? HC says it does; mod thinks otherwise.

This suggests to me that caled is a scumbuddy desperately trying not to bus.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Speaking of things:

@Haschel: Why those targeting killerjester? Why not, say, Maemuki?

Because somebody targetted displaced/killerjester last night and lied about it; I figured that they might try again. Also, the game has been chock-full of people targeting Who/Maemuki for doc/bodyguard/protective purposes, so I doubted that would give me any useful information anyway.

From my perspective I don't see Guyett and Nat as both being scum, and GM is 100% caught in a lie.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Either I am lying or GM is lying. If I am lying then either my partner is GM, in which case the town should still lynch him, or my partner is Guyett. In addition to Guyett's pro-towniness in general, if Guyett is my partner then he deliberately chose a horrible dream by clearing a townsperson and shortening our list of potential mislynches unnecessarily.

Also, if your argument is that I should have shown up on my own monitor instead of caled, then wouldn't that be evidence that Zaicon considered the fire rescue to be a target on MY part? If so, then why am I not wounded? GM is lying about the mod saying it doesn't count because HE DIDN'T ACTUALLY DREAM ABOUT BEING A PGO.

[Haschel Cedricson]

caled, please tell me that for some reason you didn't have a vote yesterday. Last night I literally (not figuratively) dreamt about yelling at you for not hammering.

More thoughts after I finish up some work things.

[Haschel Cedricson]

EBWOP: Last night as in real-life nights, not game nights.

[Haschel Cedricson]

First off, I want to say that I'm happy with the outcome of this game. I'm not a particularly skilled scumplayer, so obviously I'm happy to have survived until the end, but usually I start decent and spiral into an awful talespin and here I felt I picked up my game as we went along. Even though several people (including myself) said that we were too focused on dream interpretation and not focused enough on traditional scumhunting, most of my lategame posts helped nudge the town into doing the former instead of the latter. My dreams, too, improved to take better care of the mechanic. Night 1I just submitted a few random dreams that I had recently had IRL. When we started Day 1 with two people basically confirmed town I realized I would have to focus my dreams more. Night 2 was terrified of everybody using investigative dreams so I made myself immune to cop investigations. An improvement, but still thinking too small. By the third night, I figured out how to best use the dream format to accomplish specific goals: roleblocking displaced while making me look pro-town in the process, and guaranteeing a kill on conftown Maemuki despite probable protective intervention*.

I think caled changed his dream at the last minute to make me the paramedic, and me not noticing that almost screwed us over. Luckily, by this point the town had started narrowing down potential scumpairs and since the only accurate pairing wasn't being discussed it wasn't too hard to talk my way out.

Nat, I was terrified of leaving you alive every night. I thought for sure I'd do something to remind you of me in Pick Your Partners that would give me away, and I knew that you were clever enough to come up with competent dreams every night. We got lucky that a lot of your dreams were ambiguous/unconfirmable, but that feeling was always there. In fact, I think caled wanted to kill you every night.

Also, in retrospect the turning point of this game was the GIF modkill. He was conftown, so killing him on our own would have been a gamble, and it got the numbers in our favor for today. Also, it let me make a fake EBWOP that got me on Nat's good side for the rest of the game.

Sorry about lurking at times, but that was a gamewide problem that sort of snowballed upon itself.

Anyhoo, I'm excited to see the dreams/dreams that could have been, and I enjoyed playing with all of you (even caled, despite me sending a PM to the mod yesterday consisting entirely of the word "AAAAAAAAA" repeated several times). Thanks for modding, Zaicon.



*Said intervention never came, which made me sad because the mind games in the town would have been hilarious.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Here's the Mafia QT, by the by.

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/eWCiv2XFkprS

[Haschel Cedricson]

I think a big thing with the town was that everyone was focused on making up random fucking dreams that did nothing instead of accomplishing stuff.

This is especially true. Day 1 had me terrified by how quickly two people became conftown with one more becoming probtown and then that Morgan Freeman thing happened. If the town had continued in that direction we would have had no chance.

[Haschel Cedricson]

And I rightly pointed out that that was

suspicious as fuck

.

I think what killerjester means is that the game should have contained a hammer from caled there.