Mini 1492: Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets GAME OVER

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, you've inherited stale town read of Syr from day 1.

Thoughts about the game?

It's a shame he couldn't leave while the read was fresh

I think it's strange that people are suspecting you at this point due to meta reasons; what's going on?

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, you've inherited stale town read of Syr from day 1.

Thoughts about the game?

It's a shame he couldn't leave while the read was fresh

I think it's strange that people are suspecting you at this point due to meta reasons; what's going on?

Says Oil Tycoons. What's strange about it?

I expect for you to be attacked when people aren't familiar with your play, not when they are. Having trouble with the game?

[Nachomamma8]

Now I'm not sure. Are you caught up?

Hell no.

[Nachomamma8]

Well, yes, depending on context, but I don't care about that.

VOTE: lngrr

Tonally, the passive voice is very strange there, and strange how he went out of the way to say that without remarking on squilly's alignment.

This interaction with LNGGEGRRRR reads town. Amrun has this tendency to go from interrogation to interrogation as town to a level that doesn't mesh with her scum gameplan of sticking below the surface.

Firstly, it's sloppy because it doesn't make any sense whatsoever. They may have been voting each other a lot, but what else can you say? If you think it's because they are a trio, you're either an insanely paranoid Townie or scum looking for as many people as possible to incriminate. You're trying to use that as a scum-tell when none of them have even flipped scum yet.

Secondly, I don't like the self-meta. You're trying to use your behaviour in the past as a "Get out of Jail Free" card, and self-meta is scummy in its own right.

Thirdly, I have a feeling from your interactions with Amrun that one of you is probably scum. And I'm feeling you more.

And ditto on this response to LNGRGEERRRR by Fegelein.

Jason, start playing the game.

And here my townread on Amrun is reaffirmed already.

I regret having you as an early scum-read now.

Also like this post; it's the type of thing that would be awkward for scum to say (oh i'm sad i pushed you as scum because you look really town now) but is a pretty natural thing to say as town.

Welcome to the Town-reads, don't do anything to make me doubt you.

Also looks town for the same reasons.

Liking Amrun, Channel and Fegelin for town.

These are the same people I would be townreading and that makes me happy.

I see where people say Squilly was scum-hunting, but it still seems like the kind of fake scum hunting scum like to do.

This is an awkward comment and seems to be framed more towards throwing doubt on the townread as opposed to actually determining alignment. As town, I don't think she'd be afraid to say "I don't think he's scumhunting".

ChannelDelibird - Town
Amrun - Town
Fegelein - Town

Unfortunately, this doesn't have the same effect when other people have already beat you to it.

I really want to post but I have nothing to contribute. I have weak, aggregate reads on four players and doubt the correctness of all of them.

I appreciate the honesty!

Not anymore. I was feeling kinda heebie jeebie about how easily Amrun and CDB started working with each other after that early "Amrun is scum" crap in RVS, but that last post by CDB gave me a raging hardon, so I'm not as concerned about him anymore.

How quickly do they usually sort each other? (I used to sort Nacho on the basis of 3-4 early day 1 posts. Then he had to go and eliminate his tells. :/)

I love when I replace into a game and people talk about how awesome I am.

Pedit: Oh, is that what you meant by timing? Makes a hell of a lot more sense.

Pedit2: You know you want to vote Stubbs nao, fery.

Yep. Checking vote count. And it's 3

Vote: Stubbs

This vote is not so likely from ffery-scum at all. I can see her sheeping Syryana onto her scumpartner, yes. But usually bussing is a bit of a big deal for her (since she has the tendency to set her scumpartners up for endgame scenarios instead of endgaming others herself), so the fact that she so immediately sheeped Syryana sheeping CDB's case is a good town tell for me.

Will take a look at CDB's links for his case. Still think Jason is scum, and it is not just his activity level, it is what he posted when he did post. Definitely not getting good vibrations here, unlike the Beach Boys song.

Fery has cut down on the amount she has posted but what she has posted definitely feels like town fery not scum fery.

feeling good about Amrun and CDB too.

yeah that whole Rach is scum, oh wait she posted a list, Rach is town bothers me too....

Rach is reading town for this post. It's light, it's easy. I also feel she's more likely to complain about people reading her as scum as town than she is when she's caught scum.

I like the case on Stubbs, I'll think about it more while

I'm on V/LA for today

.

I didn't really like this.

Now that that's over, I can say for sure that yeah Stubbs is pretty scummy. The case in 200 currently has me convinced; 157 in particular stands out to me as awful. But I won't be voting him until he can reply to all this.

This is sort of weak. I figured if you were gonna think the case over then you would have more stuff, but maybe I'm wrong on that.

Tempted to put Stubbs at L-1. Much as I thought Squilly was scummy, and Marquis is pinging oddly, that Stubbs and LnGrrrR are on the wagon makes me uneasy. Whereas I like nearly all of the Stubbs wagon participants. Will see what Stubbs has to say when he gets back in here.

Don't like this either; talking about two other scumvibes yet not following up on any of them to any extent whatsoever was awkward and scummy.

Stubbs, what's your rationale for voting Squilly-slot over JasonWazza?

Pressure votes don't seem to work on Jason.

But if he's a scum read, he's a scum read and thus worth voting. And pressure votes without follow-up pressure aren't super-useful.

VOTE: Stubbs

L-1

Question-answer-vote transition is weak as shit.

rachtown.

Why did you read Rach town here? Marquis question?

I don't think I've played with town-Jason, but his pointed comments and veneer of...being infalliable? are reminiscent of his scum play from the large Mainstream game where he snowed us town. I don't have town reads on Marquis or LnGrrrR, but I don't trust Jason at all right now.

UNVOTE: Stubbs
VOTE: JasonWazza

Had Marquis and LnEEETGGGGRRRRAAAGH scumreads earlier, but ends up settling on the strongest player out of the punch for paranoia reasons?

Two JOAT claims. Could be town-town, town-scum, or scum-scum. Considering how much sense either of them makes is kind of the point. Jason not addressing the other JOAT claim is sketchy, and I'd rather not speculate further until he does, as it seems like we have more time now.

Didn't mind this initially, but continuing reading brings us to:

I was really looking forward to playing this game, I read the Harry Potter books more than twice. I'll post in more detail once I catch up but upon a skim, the first thing I noticed was that Stubbs claimed Colin Creevey giving justification as "protecting Harry from accusations." This isn't true. Colin follows Harry around with a camera and takes pictures despite the fact that Harry doesn't want it. He is annoying more than protective. He even gossips about Harry being the heir of slytherin (I need to double check the last point). Whatever he does, there is no "protection" no matter how much I stretch it. I think the claim is fake.

There's no way in hell a replacement comes in and attempts to renew interest in his scumbuddy when there are so many options and free town lynches available to him.

2 JOATs though seems rather odd? I have never played in a game with 2 JOATS before have you CDB?

Rach attacking what could be a free out given to her by CDB is also pretty town, considering the whole "not bussing" meta.

The role PMs in Nexus's philosopher's stone game were a bit unusual. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 3#p5126063

The wierdest one was peeves as the the vanilla cop because despite him causing chaos, hogwarts is his home and he wants to protect it. The protection part is not true but peeves makes sense as vanilla cop because he is always snooping around. I am a little undecided on the Colin Creevey claim but between Creevey and Filch, I find it much more likely Filch is the JOAT considering he helps out a lot with miscellaneous stuff. I'll think on it though.

I dig this followup.

Also leaning town on Amrun.

What made your Amrun read stale here?

Toomai responding with the graph within 18 minutes is pretty strong evidence of him being town, I think.

I liked #549. I could see the makings of a move against penguin in her previous posts, so it's good to see the culmination of that.

#570 by Amrun is reassuring.

@Syryana, does Ffery look scummy to you?

For what it's worth, Syryana told me that he was reading ffery as town but I might be called to defend her honor. His townread on her didn't go stale at all.

No, seriously, who's the high hanging fruit you think I should be scum reading?

The low hanging fruit I was concerned about was pretty much Squilly/Marquis. The rest is just too much fencesitting; you seemed to have come around to a stubbs scumread, but it didn't seem like you were moving to lynch him.

he would withhold on his graphs and charts despite people saying that he wasn't contributing. He had a ton of behind-the-scenes work that he only posted after I prodded him. I am close to 100% certain that he is town.

I'm not as confident, but the graph didn't sell me last time I played with him and I still feel pretty good about him, just want to see something more.

As the net starts to close on Stubbs Syr and ffery put votes down on Stubbs (post 207, post 208,) but after Stubbs claims (post 257) Syryana vigorously opposes any effort to restart the d1 bandwagon (post 376, post 437, post 443.)

It seems an odd move as a scumteam to have a voting block bussing method of your scumbuddy. Syryana did defend Stubbs day 1 based on the strong JOAT claim, which was not something that should have been touched day 1. Leaving night to give us a hint of their identities was just a good move.

was white-knighting fferylt (strongly)

That's what usually happens when Syr or I or Cabd gets a strong townread on ffery; sometimes her slow moving style is interpreted as scummy in the MS meta, townffery is gold, so protect her we must.

The biggest thing for me is that despite ffery's defense of him, he doesn't seem to let go of the suspicion.

Ffery has a tendency to townread people who attack her.

[Nachomamma8]

Why is your townread on Amrun re-affirmed when when she tells Jason to start playing the game?

Similar interactions with Jason in a recently completed game, Achievement Unlocked Mafia. She got aggravated by him being quiet and attacked him early on.

2) What games have you played with Rach as town and scum? (I want to see in what way she is more likely to complain about being scumread as town).

The most prominent example is Con Mafia (currently ongoing but we can talk about it), where we have out-of-thread communication if we want it and the first thing she says is "Why are people scumreading us? NS prod dodges at either alignment... etc, etc." I've never seen her respond to suspicion like that as scum.

I'll dig up some games we've played together later; I'm headed out for a little while at the moment.

[Nachomamma8]

This is how my reads list is looking at the moment, ffery:

TOWN:
fferyllt
F-16
JasonWazza
Amrun

NULL(ish):
Toomai
MSG

SCUM:
penguin_alien

More good stuff when I return!

[Nachomamma8]

Please note if that is the case with ffery here or you are actually very sure that she is town.

I am actually very sure that she is town. She did fool the hell out of me once so I'm probably going to wait until we have some in thread interaction to step it up to the ride-or-die level, but she's pretty town right now and I'm not just trying to link up.

Based on your defense of ffery and hers of Syr, and Syr's of ffery, I am seeing both of you as a package deal. I can't see one of you being scum and one town unless you are badly fooling someone you are closely familiar with.

This is fine.

Nacho thinks I'm scum for hedging in early game. Mm-hm. I'd like to think we've played enough games at this point that he'd expect that kind of hesitancy out of me as any alignment.

Hesitancy, sure. But usually when you're hesitating, you make your thought process very clear and the transition makes sense; how you went from Jason/Squilly/LnGrrrR suspects to voting Stubbs to leaving stubbs didn't really make sense.

RachMarie and MSG are town.

What sold you on MSG town?

my unease with Nacho's read of me

Why else do you think I'm scum?

Reading his game with Nacho in more detail, it seems like it only takes 10 minutes or so to do the graph ("not counting the time to adjust reads for each post" - I wonder how long this takes).

It bothers me that he didn't explain that the graph didn't take him that long after he posted it. While effort=town wasn't as explicit this time, it was still there, but he sort of just ignored the townread you got on him from it.

[Nachomamma8]

Amrun, Nacho, I want your opinion on this and if you disagree, I would like to know your reasoning.

I'm doing some rereading as we speak.

[Nachomamma8]

Town

fferyllt

- Reread ffery, crossed my Ts and dotted my Is. This is the town ffery that has come to play with us today. The strongest towntell for me is the excessive interaction with Syryana; ffery tends to avoid those types of things as scum unless she absolutely has to do them, and Syryana who lurks and occasionally disappears isn't someone who I'd expect her to buddy up hard to as scum. There's also a couple of small subtleties that I pick up on and I appreciate a lot; I liked fferyllt's questioning of Stubbs in #160 and #171 just because she asked a question in Stubbs's reads list, slept on it, asked another question about the same post later which shows her rereading and digging through the old parts of the threads. Response to her townread by Syryana in #197 is good and natural; in Mafia Xenologue when Oil Tycoons declared a townread on her, she literally disappeared and let Cabd talk to us for a while, so the fact she handled it so nonchalantly is a good sign. I like the Stubbs vote not only because of similar smooth Syryana interactions, but because the trajectory on it was good; her comment on CDB's Stubbs-case shows that she was leading up to that vote, which I liked.

Amrun

- I thought her early game interactions were very town and followed pretty much to a T what I'd expect from town Amrun, especially with the LnGrrr suspicion early on. Heading the attack on Stubbs under CDB's banner was town as fuck, though; I've never seen scum lynch scum using night kill analysis (I've seen them try to lynch town, though). Then there's the LnGRREEEWWAAR$RR death, which would be a mislynch she had set

and I'm so town at this point that it's actually funny that scum can't even kill me unless they want to leave Jason alive, which is even FUNNIER. (This doesn't happen often, so let me revel in it, okay?)

Is additionally town as fuck to the point where if I had any doubts I would wipe them all away.

F-16:

I've seen F-16 scum in a few places, and this isn't it. For in thread reasons and in thread reasons alone, he's town for attacking Stubbs's JOAT claim as he comes into the game, his reads are players are crazy comprehensive and he's been one of the players in game that has put serious, serious effort into gamesolving. He's very receptive to comments about his reads, he drew on nexus's other games for a strong (and accurate) analysis of other games, and has sealed off his options so solidly as scum that he's gonna have to pull off some wild readflips in the future in order to pull a win off. He's very likely town.

JasonWazza:

Twin JOAT claims mean that jason-scum isn't really worth considering. I also have an idea here that I'll get into in a sec.

RachMarie:

I liked #131 a lot, actually. Jumping on a strong scumread early is extremely rare for Rach-scum, so it's reassuring to see her push a good scumread early. Her approach to Marquis is practically a mirror of how she approached him during Con Mafia. I like #603 (maybe all adult characters are PRs?) not necessarily because of its accuracy, but because it doesn't seem like something Rach would come up with to attack a scumbuddy at all. Her observation about F-16's role making him even townier than he already is is a good observation; it's likely that scum don't have a PR in addition to Basilisk & JOAT, so if F-16 needed any additions to his town town townness, there's that.

MSG:

As of now, I think that MSG's paranoia on ffery is probably real and he is probably town (thanks to ffery's latest read on him). However, fferyllt's main reputation is for a good towngame, not a good scumgame, and why I usually find paranoia a towntell from people who are from that forum because it's a ballsy move to draw specific attention to themselves. The problem is that most scumgames that succeed around her in those sites are scumgames that incorporate paranoid of ffery into the equation; I fooled her in a chat game essentially by acting paranoid of her, steadily ramping up that paranoia when she wasn't around, then fakeclaiming a cop innocent on her to finally pull myself off. Buldermar managed to get past her by faking paranoia of her and eventually got her mislynched. Most people off-site tend to play their games around her, whether they are town or scum. Here's MSG pops in every once in a while to express paranoia of ffery and vote where he's supposed to, but there's not really a moment where he works around her; the only time he asks for her reads is to make sure that her read on Syryana is solid. I definitely agree with ffery in that his paranoia seems like paranoia seems like town paranoia, but I have a healthy respect for off-site scumgames and the progression on his read on ffery would not be impossible to pull.

Toomai:

Toomai's a player who sort of fell behind, his reads are OK, but he's never really pushed them in the least bit (except for a tiny push on JW over Stubbs ), and hasn't really shown the same level of scumhunting that he showed in Newbie 1324. In that game, he was willing to call out logic he didn't agree with, push a top suspect very strongly, and when he was lost, had the knowledge to follow players he trusted. Here, there's no signs of that; there's a couple pushes on people for not being that active, but nothing more.

penguin_alien:

I think that penguin is likely scum, but I don't think she's the lynch for today since she can be confirmed as town with a Basilisk lynch today. I currently think she's scum because of a few weird pushes (Squilly push for one, Stubbs for two).

Not sure I'll be able to post in this thread again before deadline, so voting my strongest scum read.

VOTE: Stubbs

@Jason,

Here's the plan. Either scumhunt, or give results, or no protection for you, because you haven't done one towny thing yet this game.

@Rach, what are your current reads.

@PA, you had Stubbs and I as pinging scumdar yesterDay. Who is pinging now?

.

My thoughts on scum blocking Stubbs still stand from earlier. I don't think you're scum since, like I said, it makes little sense for you to start undermining CDB and then NK him. Maybe if he was a threat to others on your team and flips bear that out, but it's a point against you being scum. Your hop on Toomai is lazy, but not necessarily scummy, and it does seem to have prodded him into activity.

MSG spends a lot of time asking for other's opinions in a way that comes off as him looking for someone to sheep blame-free. He almost never gives opinions on other people's play; instead he asks them to see what they think of said people. I'd quote it from his ISO, but it's an easy read for anyone who cares to do so.

VOTE: MSG

This transition also looks weird to me. I understand the want to sort of figure people out, push suspects and all that good stuff but in this situation penguin has a strong scumread, puts the vote down at the end of the day and talks about it at the start of the next one: were you just trying to get him to be active?

Scum

Vote: Toomai

[Nachomamma8]

small thought:
jason's voyeur is pretty much useless, but it can be used to confirm him as scum (since he's 100% not a scum JOAT).
F-16's fruit vendor is pretty much useless, but is a confirmable action that can be seen by voyeur, no? so jason sticks his voyeur down some place handy (preferably penguin_alien, so that other possible roles can use their action on someone who is not town). F-16 gives his fruit to penguin_alien OR someone else, jason claims what he saw. then f-16 or the fruit bearer can confirm/deny his claim; penguin has no real reason to lie or else she'll be power lynched the following day.

[Nachomamma8]

F-16 you gonna maybe give penguin fruit?

[Nachomamma8]

[Dramatic overacting]Oh woe is me, all this WIFOM will be the obvious downfall for me[/Dramatic overacting]

Just pick a target, don't even make him answer a question like that.

Target is still penguin. The question was making sure he was acknowledging what we were doing.

Nacho, can you explain exactly what you are referring to when you said that he was "pushing a top suspect strongly?" I see no push.

lolguy and nintendo pushes, mostly. lolguy was an early game push and he pushed the hell out of that; someone posted something he agreed with and he immediately voted him. He left voting lolguy/nintendo for a little while to try to "shake himself of conf-bias", and he wasn't afraid to follow a vote onto a wagon when he agreed with the case. Contrast that to his behavior around stubbs, where he thought about the case while he was on V/LA, came back, still didn't push it or definitively agree with it; he's practically been afraid to use his vote this game where he didn't really have a problem using it before.

It is not balanced in any way. All your posts towards ffery, Amrun, and Rach for instance are overwhelmingly positive and understanding. Your posts towards Oriole/MSG, Toomai, and Penguin are negative, accusatory, and discrediting. For example, you say you like that ffery had the same townreads (Amrun, CDB, Feg) as you. Then you point out Oriole's post a few posts later and say that it doesn't have the same effect that ffery's post had because it came a few posts later.

I have a tendency to attack strong suspects in a catchup as soon as they are formed, and this particular catchup was made after I lost my initial one. I defend strong townreads strongly in most situations, and I tunnel strong scumreads. I'm only willing to express doubts on either of these stages in middle grounds; oftentimes, town do really town things when they perceive your read as one of two extremes.

The oriole point in particular is because that set of townreads from another player means a different thing entirely. I hydra with ffery and play a shit ton of games with her, and I know things that she would see as town. Her picking up on these things and announcing them in thread are good because it feels like she's trying to sort the game in the same way I am. Oriole coming up with those townreads, however, is more suspicious; by that time, someone had already deposited reads in thread, so oriole is sheeping someone else's reasoning. I also don't use differing reads as a scumtell for players unless I know them pretty well; a strong attack on me from this point by someone like Rach would be far different than if ffery were to attack me.

ughhh right lol

Thats what I get for posting with a massive headache bah

(this is in addition to the toothache)

What are your thoughts on this game?

[Nachomamma8]

I also don't use differing reads as a scumtell for players unless I know them pretty well; a strong attack on me from this point by someone like Rach would be far different than if ffery were to attack me.

How so?

Rach calling me scum and attacking the shit out of me would be something that scumRach is extremely unlikely to do. You calling me scum and attacking the shit out of me would be something different entirely; it's a move I wouldn't expect, but it would be a move that I'd have to analyze and wouldn't be able to write off as "oh she's attacking me she's town".

Well alright I'll slap together a big-o list.

I like the start of this; interested in seeing where this is going.

I actually think fferyllt is being aggressive in a different way than normal for her town game. It's a less productive aggression? I'm not sure, and it's late, almost 2 AM; I'll come back to this tomorrow (or, well, later today...)

being too aggressive to be ffery's towngame is something i've never heard before

Not bleeding with time right now, so I'll be back soon.

[Nachomamma8]

But she makes a huge case on me Day Two, doesn't vote.

Why does this matter?

Also when did I do that Nacho? I usually assume you are town early on then narrow you down later though until I am more confident you are town, I tend to take you with a fair pound of salt.

That was a hypothetical.

[Nachomamma8]

Nachomamma8: unchanged, still null

I've been bleeding content since I replaced in; what is this?

fferyllt is more overtly aggressive and less bridge-buildy than normal?

Why do you dislike fferyllt case on you without a vote then? It doesn't seem aggressive if she's not using her vote to lynch the hell out of you; it seems more like a sorting than anything, which is not that aggressive and decently bridge-buildy. Do you disagree?

not seeing town-Nacho based on other games of actually playing with him,

What does town-Nacho look like, exactly?

The aggression I was talking about stems from that--she's saying things that sound like they probe the game state, but it's all past tense.

This is not being overly aggressive; this is talking about old things that don't matter and I don't think ffery is doing that either.

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho, the degree to which you're defending me is freaking me out.

Why would it?

[Nachomamma8]

The only people who have done anything worth anything lately are you, me, and F-16. I'm not interested in talking things out with you at the moment, and instead am waiting for Toomai to finish reads and MSG replacement to arrive and do things. Why else are you paranoid of me?

[Nachomamma8]

Who do you want to vote?

[Nachomamma8]

If anything, most of Nacho's posts are swingy-null (as opposed to static-null).

Break them down, then. What are the your scumleans/townleans in my individual posts?

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho why so concerned with fery being a tad paranoid? I would think it would be understandable. You are a very good player who knows how to blend in well as scum, as well as being a very solid town player. Hence my comment about how I generally start out putting you in the town pile but take you with a grain of salt. I can understand her paranoia.

I was mostly just trying to see where it was coming from.

[Nachomamma8]

you're thinking msg/toomai, then?

[Nachomamma8]

you're thinking msg/toomai, then?

^^Rach.

Not gonna lie I've currently lost most interest in this game, pending that replacement. If it wasn't MSG I would be voting him just for being my bottomest read with 5-ish days in the deadline.

I don't actually understand why you're voting him right now.

Nacho, how sure are you about Toomai being scum?

He's a strong scumread at this point.

[Nachomamma8]

You had him as null when you first came in. What changed that he is a strong scumread now?

Nacho, how sure are you about Toomai being scum?

He's a strong scumread at this point.

Why?

I've been rethinking my read on MSG/JacobSavage lately, and I'm feeling a lot better about that slot being town.

[Nachomamma8]

I'm finding that most players (of the handful at MS who have played with me extensively elsewhere) are pretty suspicious of my play style at MS on first encounter. In some cases, even after they have played a game or two with me here, they're still paranoid about my tendencies toward slow-ish starts and dithering.

Sure, but why do you think that the type of paranoia MSG had was impossible to fake? How do you think he would interact with you as scum?

give up

I'm not giving up. I'm saying that if the purpose of my lynch is for information, then I'm fine with that and won't bother wasting time defending against it.

You're a good lynch because you're highly likely to be scum. A town flip would be informative, but not so informative where it's better than a scum lynch.

You had him as null when you first came in. What changed that he is a strong scumread now?

Mostly confidence in you/ffery. Her townread on him hasn't wavered for a while so if she's not seeing even glimpses of him being scum, then I believe her for now.

Nacho, ffery thoughts on Toomai's deathwish?

He tries to discredit the attack against him by saying that he's being lynched for informational purposes, which I don't like. It's also strange that he wouldn't be interested in explaining the read on me; it's not a defense, it's just an explanation of his read which I feel wouldn't be so difficult to get out of him as town. It seems like he's just resigned as scum and accepting his lynch because it's getting close to inevitable at this point.

VOTE PA

Not the only reason, by any means, but I don't like the WIFOM she's dumping onto the Toomai wagon.

She's not the basilisk, meaning she can be cleared if we lynch the basilisk somewhere else. Toomai is likely scum even if penguin is scum. Why lynch penguin?

[Nachomamma8]

I'm a reads-based player. Pretty sure you know that. I want to lynch my strongest scum read. Do you really think finding the basilisk should be our priority today?

Erm, finding the not-basilisk. Yes, I do.

[Nachomamma8]

You're suggesting to focus on players who could be either scum.

Is this a reasonable description?

Yes.

It occured to me that the Basilisk may be undetectable, given how it moves through the walls and no one's any the wiser. So penguin_alien might not actually be cleared as it.

This makes sense flavorwise, but it doesn't really make sense balancewise.

[Nachomamma8]

Toomai, this isn't an information lynch. Is this all you're planning on giving us as far as final thoughts go?

[Nachomamma8]

I'm very confused

What was your result?

[Nachomamma8]

I am Dobby the Malfoy cop.
penguin_alien is not a Malfoy.

[Nachomamma8]

Could scum have a one shot redirector or somethin? I iz confuzed????

What?

Vote: JacobSavage

[Nachomamma8]

P_A is confirmed not basilisk. Now she's confirmed town.
My other checks were Stubbs N1 and Toomai N2.

[Nachomamma8]

Could scum have a one shot redirector or somethin? I iz confuzed????

What?

Vote: JacobSavage

Why JacobSavage?

PoE.
Who are your suspects?

[Nachomamma8]

I'm Draco Malfoy, and I am town.

I'm assuming your papa's a scumbag, then.

[Nachomamma8]

Jason and I both have weak investigative abilities.

[Nachomamma8]

What sort of investigative power do you think I have as scum? Tracker/Rolecop are the only two scum investigative roles I can think of off the top of my head and Tracker/Rolecop + pseudo strongman + Scum JOAT seems pretty scumsided to me, especially since town doesn't really have much in the way of power.

[Nachomamma8]

Well, Amrun claiming to be a Malfoy but likely not Mafia makes Nacho's claim make more sense. And all our PRs are likely out; why not nail everyone down?

I don't see massclaiming doing anything interesting, honestly.

So do you think a Malfoy could not be scum?

I can't see Amrun making a claim like that as scum, no.

Yeah, this has pretty much put my concerns about Nacho to rest.

How is your JS townread looking?

I'll tell you when I actually read the thread.

Everyone's waiting on you.

[Nachomamma8]

What has changed since then? Is it purely PoE based on your investigation of PA?

Investigation of PA and lynch of Toomai shaked things up to the point where I'm not willing to trust your read of MSG so much anymore. Especially when I've been hit in the face with mantis's paranoia of you (which left her getting extremely concerned about you but not ignoring the rest of the game like MSG). I'm having trouble even getting a suspect #2 from the rubble (Rach-scum would be pretty fucking surprising although she looks the most likely at the moment), so I'm surprised you're having trouble letting go of that townread, honestly.

[Nachomamma8]

Mantis has orders of magnitude more mutual game experience with me. She's also way more familiar with MS meta and MS denizens that MSG is. The sum total of MSG's play experience at MS is his short time in this game.

Comparing their play doesn't really make sense IMO.

It does to a point. Hence why I'm comparing their play to a point.

Nachomamma8, are you still town-reading fferyllt?

My townread there is dying out fairly quickly.

[Nachomamma8]

PoE = JacobSavage + ?

[Nachomamma8]

Nacho/Jason

[Nachomamma8]

PoE = JacobSavage + ?

Rach. Though the earlier back and forth between Amrun and Jason makes me nervous, mostly about Jason.

Do you think there's a chance of Amrun being scum?

[Nachomamma8]

Not really, no.

[Nachomamma8]

Mind taking me back through your case on Amrun-town?

[Nachomamma8]

Which is why this:

PA how can you be so sure that all our PRs are out?

Let us not set anything in stone ok?

Bad enough we have so many already claimed.


Meanwhile

a vote


VOTE: JacobSavage

feel pretty good about this one being scum...

makes me leery. I'd expect RachMarie to be thinking about this as town.

I agree that this is weird.

[Nachomamma8]

You might have just broken the game, Rach.

[Nachomamma8]

You're town because I forgot to submit my N2 action and there's no way in hell you would know that if you were scum since I lied about it in thread. Jason and PA are town.

We have one mislynch to spare; coincidentally, there is one town in {Amrun, ffery, JacobSavage}.

[Nachomamma8]

Heh.

I think this is autowin, then.

The three PR claims are cross validated. It's freaking me out a little balance-wise, though.

And I have no choice but to doubt my Amrun read now, unless one of the claimed PRs is scum.

What on earth is this line of thought?

[Nachomamma8]

Half of me is kind of like it could easily be RM / Nacho but that doesn't really feel right.

The paranoid part says JW /Nacho.

iN my view it has to be Rach, and Amrun personally,

[Nachomamma8]

The only thing that could possibly be accomplished is if there is some reason to doubt any of the PRs. Rach would have to be a scum tracker who followed me not once, but TWICE after she found me going nowhere the first time. This makes absolutely no sense.

Jason would have to be a scum Voyeur (unless Nexus gave the scumteam two Scum JOATS, which is a hell no type of situation), who ended up counterclaiming his partner after being run up immediately after him, and also had Stubbs claiming a strong JOAT while he claimed a more reasonable weak JOAT.

Nacho-scum requires me not using my rolecop N2 (while killing a fruit vendor) and partners not submitting it for me, then pretty much forcing myself to clear her and not looking for power roles anywhere else although we would be expecting a town more powerful than fruit vendor/JOAT. It also requires pseudo strongman and rolecop and scum JOAT against a three close to useless roles and a tracker, which seems like shitty balance to me.

PA is town unless the pseudo strongman is also a ninja, which is also ridiculously unbalanced.

[Nachomamma8]

What does this do you your Amrun read, and how comfortable are you with the town group?

My amrun townread is holding up better than my townread on you.
I'd expect you to be either A) confident in autowin and moving things along, or B) attacking the cleared group in a way that makes sense. You've been throwing vague suspicion around constantly, but nothing overly impressive/worrisome.

[Nachomamma8]

Yep.

[Nachomamma8]

fferyllt is not a malfoy.
lucky:

The only thing that could possibly be accomplished is if there is some reason to doubt any of the PRs. Rach would have to be a scum tracker who followed me not once, but TWICE after she found me going nowhere the first time. This makes absolutely no sense.

Jason would have to be a scum Voyeur (unless Nexus gave the scumteam two Scum JOATS, which is a hell no type of situation), who ended up counterclaiming his partner after being run up immediately after him, and also had Stubbs claiming a strong JOAT while he claimed a more reasonable weak JOAT.

Nacho-scum requires me not using my rolecop N2 (while killing a fruit vendor) and partners not submitting it for me, then pretty much forcing myself to clear her and not looking for power roles anywhere else although we would be expecting a town more powerful than fruit vendor/JOAT. It also requires pseudo strongman and rolecop and scum JOAT against a three close to useless roles and a tracker, which seems like shitty balance to me.

PA is town unless the pseudo strongman is also a ninja, which is also ridiculously unbalanced.

the relevant bit is that pa/you/me are all pretty much confirmed town except in ridiculous scenarios, and amrun/fferyllt are the scumteam.

Vote: Amrun

and I think I'm going to lynch Amrun first so that I have more time to talk to ffery-scum who was probably amazed that I was reading her wrong this game.

[Nachomamma8]

I feel perfectly fine about it.

[Nachomamma8]

Lucky, two scum left.

[Nachomamma8]

The only thing that could possibly be accomplished is if there is some reason to doubt any of the PRs. Rach would have to be a scum tracker who followed me not once, but TWICE after she found me going nowhere the first time. This makes absolutely no sense.

Jason would have to be a scum Voyeur (unless Nexus gave the scumteam two Scum JOATS, which is a hell no type of situation), who ended up counterclaiming his partner after being run up immediately after him, and also had Stubbs claiming a strong JOAT while he claimed a more reasonable weak JOAT.

Nacho-scum requires me not using my rolecop N2 (while killing a fruit vendor) and partners not submitting it for me, then pretty much forcing myself to clear her and not looking for power roles anywhere else although we would be expecting a town more powerful than fruit vendor/JOAT. It also requires pseudo strongman and rolecop and scum JOAT against a three close to useless roles and a tracker, which seems like shitty balance to me.

PA is town unless the pseudo strongman is also a ninja, which is also ridiculously unbalanced.

also, what do you think about this?

[Nachomamma8]

ffery, what are your prospects of winning this lylo, do you think? I'm thinking you're looking for a bunch of cracks, can't really find them... is that why you've reverted into your helpful "say things that aren't lies but don't actually say anything about the elephant in the room" scum meta?

[Nachomamma8]

Vote: fferyllt

I figured you'd want more discussion.

[Nachomamma8]

Lucky isn't a Malfoy.

[Nachomamma8]

Vote: Amrun

[Nachomamma8]

Because our slots are both pretty much confirmed town and Amrun's is not.

[Nachomamma8]

Scum power so far has been a pseudo strongman, a scum JOAT, and ???. It is likely that this power is not that strong, considering scum JOAT and psuedo-strongman are strong as fuck. I was confirmed by Jason's voyeur to be targetting penguin alien with an investigative role, and confirmed by Rach to be going nowhere N2 and targetting penguin alien N3. Thus, if I am scum, I need to be either a tracker or a rolecop, but that doesn't make sense because all of the scum power roles have likely been revealed.

[Nachomamma8]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctUvNaNE6Y8

My girlfriend says this sounds like elevator music, I tend to agree.

[Nachomamma8]

I investigated you night three, went nowhere night 2.

[Nachomamma8]

Jesus, F-16.

[Nachomamma8]

I'm v/la every weekend -- obviously I wasn't going to post. Nacho knows that, too.

when lucky went "I'm gonna hammer Amrun at the end of the weekend" I was pretty fucking happy.