Mini 1604 -- Zodiac Mafia (Game Over)
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VOTE: Juls
Our genders are opposed, so we have best compatibility in FFT. Maybe I'll do bonus damage. ^^-
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Rude. :[-
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Unvote; Vote: Witness Protection
Xayzeck is town.
I have been operating under the assumption that Juls's daykill is false, though I had already noticed the "fortunate" event. I do not think Juls would use an actual daykill that poorly. If it does end up being real, I suppose it increases the chance that she is scum, since her having the daykill is just random and has no balance considerations, but scum need an excuse to use the daykill in a hard-to-scrutinize way, but I can understand my first post being a way to justify that (e.g., because overexplained RVS votes are scummy, but in my case I think about FFT whenever I see Zodiac stuff so it's a unique situation). So in other words there is at least some way to account for it if she's scum maybe.
I was going to say that Elyse was unnatural for disliking my "reaction," but then also voting for Xayzeck for voting me subsequent to it, but I realize while in the process of re-quoting her that it was Xayzeck that she thought was unnatural, so nevermind there.-
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It is not random. Xayzeck had one of the better RVS votes and WP voted him for it. Scummy. Also, weird combination of friendly and confrontational. It's unsettling to read.
I went back and reread it after reading Peregrine's post.
I should say that I am assuming that Xayzeck's vote was not random. But even if it wasn't, there's no reason for WP to assume that, and his reaction is even more inappropriate if he infers that it was random, anyway, so.
Also this scenario played out differently than I expected it to in a somewhat recent game I think, so i am grain-of-salting it. But idk maybe a year or two ago I would be pretty confident about it.-
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In post 42, Dry-fit wrote:In post 39, Elyse wrote:I thought his reaction was OTT and weird.
Is that alignment indicative?
What are you trying to accomplish with this question?
You may wait for Elyse to respond I guess.-
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In post 45, Dry-fit wrote:In post 44, Iecerint wrote:You may wait for Elyse to respond I guess.
Gracious of you.
I am such a man.-
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Also, uhh, nevermind I guess. My complaint was going to be that she obviously thought it was alignment indicative because she wouldn't vote him otherwise.
Different strokes!-
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The dayvig should probably claim responsibility for their dayvig after they use it rather than before just in case scum can interfere with it in some way.
The most pro-town way to use a dayvig (other than killing claimed/proven scum) is to use it to grant the town an extra lynch. This means using it on someone who's at L-1 after people have weighed in. Just FYI at any town dayvig who is contemplating how to use it.-
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Further discussion about the dayvig will probably provide unnecessary information about the identity of the dayvig, so there is no reason for it to continue.-
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In post 74, Nachomamma8 wrote:In post 41, Iecerint wrote:since her having the daykill is just random and has no balance considerations, but scum need an excuse to use the daykill in a hard-to-scrutinize way
And shooting instantly is hard to scrutinize? Because I can think of a thousand things wrong with the shot if real and I'd be surprised if no one else could.
I literally explain that she is more likely to be scum if it is real later in this post.
In post 72, Iecerint wrote:The dayvig should probably claim responsibility for their dayvig after they use it rather than before just in case scum can interfere with it in some way.
What do you imagine scum can do to a dayvig?[/quote]
Maybe a dayblock? Maybe a daykill? Who the hell knows? Who cares?
The benefit of claiming after you use the dayvig is that it can't be tampered with. The disadvantage relative to claiming early is none unless there's something I'm not creative enough to imagine.-
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Quote tags messed up for the second one there.-
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In post 87, Juls wrote:Anywho...I agree with Nachomamma. If the day vig does not occur today then we must assume scum owns it. In fact, I suggest we put someone at L-1 and then force everyone to do exactly what I didKill: Soinsoto flush it out before the end of the day. You don't have to be swayed by "town" but you gotta shoot. Agreed? Good.
This is a good plan.-
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I had actually inferred that it was the second one, on the grounds that it forces scum to use the dayvig in a pro-town manner.-
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It doesn't really matter if we know how the vig was really. It's not as if alignment affects who got the vig (as far as we know), and I'm sure town will claim it after the fact either way.
w/e tho.-
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In post 109, Dry-fit wrote:Why is there a Witness Protection wagon again?
I'm voting him for his vote for Xayzeck.
Which. That's his whole iso.-
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Salamence, what type/manner of "connection" are you referring to?-
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In post 220, Iecerint wrote:Salamence, what type/manner of "connection" are you referring to?
I'm asking about the "connection" you alluded to between me and Juls.-
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That was because I RVS'd her.
My point is, like, is there any substance or inference in what you are saying? What is your point?-
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I find Toasty's posts poor and decisions anti-town.
Waiting for the mod to post I suppose, as that's relevant to interpreting the situation right now.-
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You should probably spell it out for people who aren't good at critical thinking.
That is, that it's the same as a not-dayvig claim.-
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In post 328, Dry-fit wrote:Iecerint what's your view on the Salamence wagon? You've kind of ignored it to this point.
burn are you happy with your vote on Juls?
I viewed it as a less-good WP wagon. Now I view it as a wagon I was never super crazy about that Toasty joined.-
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In post 348, Dry-fit wrote:In post 329, Iecerint wrote:In post 328, Dry-fit wrote:Iecerint what's your view on the Salamence wagon? You've kind of ignored it to this point.
burn are you happy with your vote on Juls?
I viewed it as a less-good WP wagon. Now I view it as a wagon I was never super crazy about that Toasty joined.
So do you have any other reads in this game? So far I've seen ToastyToast scum and Xayzeck town. That's it.
Yep, those are the main reads that are strong enough for me to remember after not looking at the game for a few days.-
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And now that I've caught up, that's about all I have to say on the topic. D:-
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In post 378, StrangerCoug wrote:In post 368, Elyse wrote:Why do you have such a problem with people townreading me?
How do you deduce that Xayzeck has a problem with people townreading you? He responded to this with a reasonable question and you blew him off.
Scummy post.-
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In post 380, StrangerCoug wrote:In what way? You can't just call an arbitrary post scummy.
1. "Arbitrary post"?
2. Your post is a question that is purely rhetorical; it is designed to discredit Elyse and win townpoints with Xayzeck rather than to learn alignments.-
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Xayzeck is town, though, so it's not troubling if he does scummy things until he's done like 10 of them.
/drunkpost-
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In post 396, StrangerCoug wrote:In post 386, Iecerint wrote:Xayzeck is town, though, so it's not troubling if he does scummy things until he's done like 10 of them.
How is that relevant to your attack on me? I think Xayzeck is town as well.
Caught for the wrong reasons.-
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@ Elyse -- I am not sure what Nacho's alignment is, but I would not entertain lynching him today simply on the basis of his activity.
I don't think it's particularly alarming that he has a scumread on me, if that's why you're asking me in particular. I've been kinda lurky in this game of late. I dunno if this is really a reliable scumtell for me, but I don't expect people to townread me particularly.-
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I didn't see that before.
I don't really understand what you find objectionable about the daykill stuff. I basically said that it was probably a fake daykill, but Juls was scum if it somehow wasn't a fake daykill. It was reasonable to point that out when I did because I would be dead in the unlikely event that it was a real daykill.
WP's one post was really bad while being a reach for a content-y vote (a compound scumpost) and nothing else in the game grabbed me enough to make me change my vote. I haven't really encouraged others to vote for him because he only had 1 post and I don't see it productive to keep others who aren't on-board from using their votes in productive ways that might help me notice other things about the game.-
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The why is that town Juls would never daykill me on page 1 because she is not an idiot. It's not rocket science.
What makes you think I find Elyse scummy? I actually found Elyse town prior to her fingering me, and I don't think (???) I've commented on any changed opinion in that regard. Also, I suspect the difference since that point is mostly related to her fingering me.
Toasty has done nothing to change my opinion about his slot and is not a non-player, so I see no reason to change my vote.-
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In post 438, Nachomamma8 wrote:In post 437, Iecerint wrote:The why is that town Juls would never daykill me on page 1 because she is not an idiot. It's not rocket science.
This is what would make sense and sounds much more honest than what you said at first.
No, it's the exact same thing as what I said at first. The only difference is that I additionally made an attempt to justify the corollary (i.e., "why would scumJuls do something so saliently scummy").
In post 439, Nachomamma8 wrote:In post 437, Iecerint wrote:Toasty has done nothing to change my opinion about his slot and is not a non-player, so I see no reason to change my vote.
You don't think the game has been stagnating lately?
That is neither here nor there?
Come vote for Toasty with me if you want.-
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Why the hell is everyone saying they think I'm scum while not voting for me? It's super awkward.
I went back to check my wagon status and I think I literally have 0 votes.-
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I said to stop going on about it because it narrows down the daykiller identity, which is either benign or allows scum to interfere with it.-
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@ TT - I think I should be obvier town by now, so I suppose so.-
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In post 461, Xayzeck wrote:In post 454, Iecerint wrote:See? Literally zero votes.
Do you want votes?
Because I'm pretty sure that could happen.
Nice total lack of votes you've got there.
Be a shame if something were to happen to it.-
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In post 466, Gemini Blind wrote:My comp just crashed in the middle of a big post so these next few are coming piece by piece.
In post 452, Iecerint wrote:Why the hell is everyone saying they think I'm scum while not voting for me? It's super awkward.
If I had a top 10 list of pet peeves from mafia players, this would be on it.
~STD
Complaining about not having votes, or people using rhetoric against a player without voting for him?
What is the significance of your "pet peeve" re: actual content in this game?-
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In post 471, StrangerCoug wrote:In post 463, Iecerint wrote:Nice total lack of votes you've got there.
Be a shame if something were to happen to it.
What is the point of this threat? All you're doing here is fear-mongering and telling us jack about why Xayzeck is scum. It's the exact same thing you did with me.
lol.
Xayzeck's post was saliently non-constructive. I was lampshading it. It should be super obvious.
It stood out to me because I had thought Xay thought I was town.-
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In post 477, Iecerint wrote:In post 471, StrangerCoug wrote:In post 463, Iecerint wrote:Nice total lack of votes you've got there.
Be a shame if something were to happen to it.
What is the point of this threat? All you're doing here is fear-mongering and telling us jack about why Xayzeck is scum. It's the exact same thing you did with me.
lol.
Xayzeck's post was saliently non-constructive. I was lampshading it. It should be super obvious.
It stood out to me because I had thought Xay thought I was town.
Oh, I see it's possible you just didn't understand what I meant at all.
Go back and read Xayzeck's post (the quoting of which you have removed for some reason). I am paraphrasing it.-
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...Did you read his post...?-
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In post 546, StrangerCoug wrote:
I don't buy his claim, if that is what you are asking. We agreed that the vig was to be used today and he wanted to save it for a guilty.
I was going to berate you for this, but I kind of agree with this, actually, having looked back at what Salamence posted during that time...I don't know why Salamence posted the stuff he did about the dayvig if he was the dayvig himself.-
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Salamence has posted in other games since I made my comment about his claim by way or StrangerCoug. I think he is avoiding this game and hoping that the reservations with his Cop claim will be ignored if he ignores this game.
Unvote; Vote: Salamence20
I think his discussion of the dayvig early D1 is inconsistent with what a town player who was the dayvig would say in that situation. The simplest explanation is that he viewed his dayvig status as part of his "scum" status and instead simply said things that he thought sounded town. If he were actually a town cop dayvig, he would either ignore the topic altogether or steer it elsewhere -- not set-up a situation where the dayvig awkwardly doesn't happen at L-1.-
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I have not evaluated the extent to which that is valid, but if it is, I figure it may implicate one of them given a scumflip, especially since Elyse had been under a bit of scrutiny already. It could also imply that Elyse had an uncommon-but-accurate read.
Pedit: It => PV/Xayzeck having more Salamence scrutiny than Elyse. I doubt Nacho would make it up tho so.-
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The major issue, as spelled out by I think 3 different players in this game, is how he talked about the daykill early game in light of his actually being the one who had the daykill.-
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In post 589, Gemini Blind wrote:In post 582, Iecerint wrote:It indeed referred to you.
That's what I thought.
You're an idiot.
If Salamence is my buddy, he's been a sinking ship all game and there's no fucking way I'm hitching my wagon to that.
~STD
Sorry about your hydra buddy, then.-
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Man that Salamance lynch was such a bad deadline lynch wasn't it we should all be ashamed.-
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Salamence was not lynched because of lame compromisey things. He was lynched because his claim did not make sense with earlier material he had posted in the thread.-
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Peregrine had a credible wagon yesterday?
I guess I forgot?-
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Gemini being killed was so dumb that I am inclined to believe that a kill was blocked and Gemini died by some other mechanism.-
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If they wanted to mislynch you, why would they shoot Elyse and kill Gemini -- both of whom were on your wagon yesterday?-
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