Mini 1702 - Time Travel Mafia - game over

[Jazzmyn]

Well, that was a pretty

ridiculous

clusterfail Day 1. Three hours, ~20 posts, and a lynch before many of the players could even get to the thread? Unreal. I don't think I have ever seen something like that happen outside of newbie games. And it doesn't really get us anywhere in terms of figuring out who the scum are, except to the extent that it would be reasonable to assume that there are one or two on that wagon.

I don't think that IceGuy's initial vote was bad as it just looked random as is usual at the beginning of a game. Zakk, as a double voter, you should have made it more clear that you were, in fact, a double voter. Your failure to do led to the quicklynch/quickhammer, although you weren't without help, obviously, and while you may not have foreseen it happening, you should have been more careful.

So, I think there is at least one scum among this group: Zakk, hiplop, Bella, Not_Mafia, and TheDominator (the latter didn't vote but went from 'null' at post 12 to 'it might have already been a hammer' at post 20, to 'intent to hammer' at post #21, which is just nuts/anti-town.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

So, I think there is at least one scum among this group: Zakk, hiplop, Bella, Not_Mafia, and TheDominator

I agree with this list, except that I would not include Not_Mafia in it. And Bella To a lesser extent.

If you assume that Zakk is scum, would any of the others be scum?

I don't assume that Zakk is scum, though, because even though I think he should have made it more clear that he was a double-voter, he did say the word "twice" which, if he was scum, why would he say even that much? Do you think that he would have to say something like that to make his double vote count, and that he was deliberately trying to make it vague in order to lead to a mislynch? It seems unlikely to me that a double-voter would be scum; I thought that was typically a town role.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

I thought the same thing as Klingon tho and I'm town

It doesn't look like you thought the same thing as Klingon, actually. I mean, Klingon appears to be have been quite aware of roles changing every day. See this post of Klingon's from earlier on Day 2:

I had none yesterday, I was Vanilla.

That shows that she was aware of the daily role/ability changes, even if you didn't grok it yourself.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

EBWOP (missed one in the multi-quote):
Which makes this:

VOTE: IceGuy

What the hell Townie reveals such an important role on Day 2???????

You're a Scum Roleblocker, I'll bet.

look rather disingenuous, don't you think?

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

VOTE: IceGuy

What the hell Townie reveals such an important role on Day 2???????

You're a Scum Roleblocker, I'll bet.

We all get a new role PM every new Day phase.

Klingon,
How do you reconcile these two posts? I mean, why would you call IceGuy scum for post-facto claiming a Day 1 role when you (apparently) knew that we get new role PMs every day?

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

My understanding is that the roles get somewhat rotated, meaning that if IceGuy were telling the truth, then "Town" has a Jailkeeper. And now Scum know it.

Also, I've known players to claim like that hoping for a counterclaim, or a setup argument, to cause a mislynch.

I am so very much not liking IceGuy right now.

If that is the case, why are you not equally suspicious of Guille (who has claimed today that he had a cop role yesterday)? What I am trying to understand is what is the difference between the two that induces you to call out IceGuy because of his claim while not commenting on Guille's claim?

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Sorry, I got called away unexpectedly and just got back now but I'm too exhausted to catch up on my games right now so it will have to wait until tomorrow (Tuesday) night. I'm just posting this quickly before hitting the sheets because I don't want to get prodded before I get home from work tomorrow.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Everybody showing up as MISSING here, please claim in the following order:
Klingoncelt first -> Jazzmyn second -> Persivul last

Does the order matter all that much for today? If so, I'll wait, but I'm here now and happy to claim my role from D1.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

EBWOP: For next day, I expect us to agree on a claiming order before any scumhunting happens.

This game allows us to share night actions between us which can potentially be great for town. Don't throw it away.

I agree with this so far. Once we know with more certainty about the way the daily roles are assigned, we may want to revisit (obviously if it turns out that there are significant downsides for town based upon what we learn tomorrow and ensuing days), but it seems to me like a decent enough suggestion/strategy for now.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

That'd be worth checking into

Interesting idea worth checking, so I checked into it (by looking at post 1 of the thread) and found this:

You can not vote no lynch.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

That'd be worth checking into

Interesting idea worth checking, so I checked into it (by looking at post 1 of the thread) and found this:

You can not vote no lynch.

Lol!

Regards,
Jazz

Please do not edit my posts to add your own comments without making it clear that you have added your own comments.

FTR, the "Lol!" that zakk purports to have "quoted" above was not mine, but zakk's.

Vote: zakk

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Seriously? Lolol

I was trying to say lol to your post and in my incompetent mobile phone incompetence I must have complimented you in the wrong place hierarchically within the quote tags

Le gasp

Yes, seriously, because you did the same thing in another game (that is, you added your own crap to a post of mine, without acknowledging your additions, in an attempt to misrepresent me) so I don't trust you when you do it here and attempt to shrug it off as "lolol, oops, I'm incompetent on my phone, I was really trying to compliment you". I can't say any more about it due to the ongoing game rule, apparently, but you know exactly what I'm talking about.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Jazzmyn, please claim. After that, Persivul.

I was VT on Day 1.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

dont like the push on zakk there, clearly a formatting mistake.

weird attempt to distance from dom wagon, i think

Nope, I am quite happy with the Dominator wagon and might join it; I also might join your wagon or Klingon's wagon, depending on how the discussion goes over the next few days. I was just annoyed at zakk for the reasons set out in my post and wanted to show (him) my annoyance.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Vote count:

Dominator (3) Hiplop, not_mafia, Maruchan
Zakk (1) dominator
iceguy (1) klingoncelt
Klingoncelt (2) iceguy, bella
Hiplop (1) guille
Maruchan (1) Zakk

10 alive, takes 6 to lynch
Deadline: (expired on 2015-08-13 17:00:00)

@Mod: is this votecount correct or did you miss my vote?

(Not that it matters much because I will be changing it, but I would like to figure out whether or not someone has stolen my vote or something.)

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

To whom this may consern,
Jazz why are you so formal in writing?
Regards,
TD37

Lol. I never really considered it 'formal' so much as 'polite' but I can see how it could be taken that way. I think I started 'signing' my posts as a means to remind myself to do my best to remain civil at all times (particularly when games would get pretty heated) and now it's just second nature to me.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Upon re-reading, I could vote either Dominator, hiplop, or Not_Mafia today. As between the three, I am a bit torn because I can see and agree with the most cogent arguments made against all three of them, particularly since I have drawn similar conclusions myself so far (although, admittedly, I didn't see the more detailed case on hiplop until guille pointed it out).

I would not vote for any of guille, IceGuy, or Yosarian today as I currently get pretty strong town reads from them. I am also disinclined to vote for any of the remaining players other than Dominator, hiplop, or Not_Mafia today after re-reading the thread from the beginning. The only other player who I might

consider

voting for today is Klingon, but I am content to leave that at present, given that there are other better choices and given that I am inclined to give some credence to guillle's take on Klingon at present, in light of my town read on him.

In short, this aligns with what I said previously in post 45:

So, I think there is at least one scum among this group: Zakk, hiplop, Bella, Not_Mafia, and TheDominator (the latter didn't vote but went from 'null' at post 12 to 'it might have already been a hammer' at post 20, to 'intent to hammer' at post #21, which is just nuts/anti-town.

And my reads since then have narrowed it down sufficiently for me at this point to vote for either Dominator, hiplop, or Not_Mafia, but the problem I am having is that two of my scum-reads are on the Dominator wagon and the other one is on the hiplop wagon.

Which means I am going to have to think about this a bit more.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

I am also taking this game a bit more seriously than I usually do

Why are you taking this game 'more seriously' than you usually take other games?

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Idk why not

That is not a satisfactory response at all.

My inquiry was serious, and was based upon your prior post, but your reply was not actually responsive in any meaningful fashion whatsoever.

You said in your previous post that you were taking this game more seriously than you usually do, and I asked you why you are taking this game more seriously than you usually do and you responded with, "Idk why not", which strikes me as a pretty non-responsive "response".

Is that really all you have to say about it?

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

So we have a Vig or SK in the game. I'm thinking it is more likely to be a Vig than a SK because of the unique nature of the game mechanics (that is, roles being reset every day). It seems to me that a SK role would not really be one that could be passed around to multiple players, so that would mean that it would be an exception to the role reset mechanism, which is kind of the main mechanism of the game. That said, I don't really know much about structuring games so perhaps it wouldn't be all that strange to make that kind of exception, but gut says Vig, not SK.

In any event, I'm going to have to go ISO-diving (and possibly meta-diving as well since I haven't played with most of the players before) to see what I can see in light of these flips.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

Please claim: Jazzmyn -> Bellaphant -> Yosarian2 -> guille2015 -> IceGuy

I was VT.

Updated current claims, therefore,

Klingoncelt - vig (targeted hiplop) (lol)
Yosarian2 -

MISSING

Jazzmyn - Vanilla Townie
Not_Mafia - flip non-flipped players (targeted FA_Q2, received town result)
IceGuy -

MISSING

Bellaphant -

MISSING

guille2015 -

MISSING

should be as above.

Remember this? Where Klingoncelt made a post that only really made sense when her role didn't rotate?

Also, I just noticed something:

In post 102, she backpedals by saying she thinks roles rotate.
In post 201, I post all claims.
In post 224, she calls me scum. If she would actually be a vig, she would've noticed by post 201 that roles can't rotate because there was no vig N1. At that point, her entire justification for voting me becomes moot. She keeps calling me scum, though.

You know what, I've seen enough. I know this might be LyLo, but I'm that confident.

VOTE: Klingoncelt

Hmm. It seems to me that you make some good points here (that I had not noticed or did not think of). I am not prepared to vote yet, though, given that we may very well be in LYLO. I would like to see the rest of the claims first.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

I am not convinced that IceGuy is scum as Klingon suggests. I do understand that he started the wagon on Bulbazoor on D-1 and that he also started the wagon on Dominator Day 2, but in the first instance, that looked like just a random D1 vote and it was others who turned it into a lynch within something like 20 posts and 3 hours, and in the second instance, Dominator did look pretty scummy and he even self-lynched, which also suggested scum in the end (despite the fact that he turned out to be town - really bad play by Dominator).

I would like to see the rest of the claims, since we've already pretty much committed to go down this path, and since it does not hurt us as town since we get new roles every day.

Updated current claims for Day 2/Night 2, therefore

Klingoncelt - vig (targeted hiplop) (lol)
Yosarian2 - MISSING
Jazzmyn - Vanilla Townie
Not_Mafia - flip non-flipped players (targeted FA_Q2, received town result)
IceGuy - MISSING
Bellaphant - Watcher, watched Klingon but nobody visited Klingon
guille2015 - MISSING

should be as above.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

If I have read everything correctly, IceGuy is the only player who has not yet claimed his role for Day 2/Night 2.

IceGuy, please claim.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

EBWOP: Oh, never mind. No sooner than I posted that, I saw that yourself as VT in the list contained in your last post. I didn't realize it was in there at first.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

EBWOP: Oh, never mind. No sooner than I posted that, I saw that

you added

yourself as VT in the list contained in your last post. I didn't realize it was in there at first.

Regards,
Jazz

Oops, I missed a couple of words there. Fixed.

Regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

...
Of course, in this game it didn't go that way, because my scum buddies didn't even try to speedlynch, heh. But IMHO that's an anomaly.

Part of that was due to RL because my house has been in a bit of turmoil since Thursday with a contractor ripping out all of the carpets upstairs, moving furniture into the other rooms to do so, laying new wood floors, moving furniture back to other rooms to rip out the rest of the rooms, etc., which displaced me somewhat, making it difficult to impossible to get online, and if that wasn't bad enough, my internet (and home phone because it's also through the cable company) went down on Saturday as well for no apparent reason. The combination made it a very difficult weekend, posting-wise, for me.

Part of it was also because of the role I drew for Night 3 (which, of course, we had not yet had the opportunity to discuss in our scumchat since the role PMs only came out in the morning and we had night chat but not day chat) so I knew that even in the absence of a town lynch on Day 3 we would still be in good shape (so long as I was alive to use the role, of course, but there was never any suspicion directed towards me by anyone so I was not in any danger of being lynched Day 3).

Still, I must have refreshed the last page dozens of times last night waiting/hoping to see one more vote on Klingon so that I could hammer (because two other players had expressed intent to vote her, one being Bella but it didn't look like Bella was around last night when I was). So, that next vote didn't happen before I went to bed, and it was all over by the time I woke up this morning with Bella's finely timed hammer. *smile*

Also, good game to all. It was fun. I do think that the D1 quicklynch gave us a huge advantage and I would like to play this setup again, and as town as well. Many thanks to farside for hosting.

Best regards,
Jazz

[Jazzmyn]

I may try it again one day.
Idk it was more of a game I created but didn't love and it shows in my flavor.

I think it is a fantastic

concept

though, and that it would be great to try it again with more detail and flavour and such. I absolutely love your idea of different eras/different roles, and I think the concept has great potential (if you're feeling up to it again some time in the future - or the past - lol. )

Regards,
Jazz