Mini 1712: Clue Master Detectives Mafia II - Game Over

[farside22]

Why did you say you were concerned about toog's claim then call him towns few post later?

Claiming items holds people accountable though. If we can make sure items are hidden from scum, then we might want to do that. Decisions should be thought about. I am thinking about how to do this. If Varsoon sees this and wants to claim our room, so be it.

I am also concerned about Toog claiming dropped. I might have a way to verify as we shot the gun. (We didn't want to shoot N1). These are things we must discuss as a hydra, because if we play it wrong, it really helps scum. We don't want scum getting Toog's item.

I agree with pretty much all that Mollie is saying.
I don't know why Titus claimed our character, but I don't agree that it's meaningless busywork.
I also really don't like being broken down to 'Titus' or 'Varsoon'. We are something more. Saying, "Ooooh, lynch Titus!" is some ole bullshit.

We are in the Gazebo. We started in the Courtyard.
We went there because we figured not many other people/scum would.
I can't say that I'm a master of this system. I'm still trying to figure out exactly how everything works, so bear with me.
We shouldn't claim items or dropped status, imo. I think it enables too much scum-info.
I'm town-reading toog for claiming dropped; that looks like a legitimate townslip to me.

P-EDIT:
Looks like Titus already said most this stuff. Gosh. I don't agree about her Items stance, but maybe I need to re-read the rules.

VOTE: BBT
I actually don't mind piling on here. Apparently our vote is already here? Jeeze, I should pay more attention.
Anyway. This is me confirming I'm cool with this vote. BBT is playing very hands-off and inoffensive. I also like the other folks on the wagon. Feels good to me.

-V

[farside22]

I'm brunette and I started in the dining room
Toog and Mollie are strong town reads.

[farside22]

Talking it over, Toog, what was your item?

It was the Wrench. It allows the user to move to any room they wish, and any action used on them will miss.

Claiming what the item does is aweful.

[farside22]

@Farside
-I think he was "concerned" that I said I left an item behind, not that I was scum, because he follows up that sentence immediately with "We don't want scum getting Toog's weapon."

Possible but my item went somewhere I don't know where, I assumed that was known, especially as the player claimed he shot a gun.

[farside22]

@Farside22: Why so? Claiming item effect seems like useful info for town. Scum doesn't have any real control over what items they get, as far as I am aware, since dropped items appear in random rooms.

Yeah, I don't care.
I'm not giving info to the scum to let them know what item helps them and what item screws them over.

[farside22]

@Gammagooey: What's got you wanting to vote us/hesitant to join on?
You don't agree that BBT's initial reluctance/giving in looks a bit weird?
What are your thoughts on other players/my own interaction with mollie?

@Farside22: Different heads here, yo.
Titus is all second-guessy and wants to be really thorough.
I've got more confidence than that and am willing to make mistakes.
Maybe Titus is seeing something I'm not with the dropped item shenanigans, but I think Toog's claimed drop is genuine and a town-sort-of-thing to say.
Now that I'm mulling it over, I could see Titus second-guessing it as an attempt to avoid blame for a possible kill (scum need items to kill, I forgot this), but there was a certain verisimilitude to the dropped item claim that I don't think it was faked at all.
Why the strong town read on mollie? I don't like her aggressiveness. It reminds me of my first really painful breakup.

@Toog: Thanks. Titus wants to figure out how similar/different this setup is from the previous one, too.
I, honestly, think the item list should have been public, but, eh, it is what it is.
Did you use the wrench or were you just forced to drop it randomly/because of the gunshot?

-V

Mollie is an aggressive player.
You will have her on your ass for awhile. Get used to it.

Vote: gamma

[farside22]

But, Farside, scum literally has no control over what items they pick up. :/
Why the gamma vote?
I don't know why, but I suppose I usually don't think of mollie being aggressive except for some scum instances (Xeno mafia, iirc). Maybe it's just not directed at me all the time? I can't handle that sort of aggressive engagement--it doesn't seek answers, it just shit-talks and twists words, and that's fucked up.

@Mollie: Were did I write that I agree with all Titus is saying? I've remember agreeing with what you were saying earlier about wanting to not claim held items/items at all.
That was before I re-read and realized that dropped items go to random places, so it's not as big a deal to claim dropped stuff.

Why do you want to know what the items do.
Tell me the town reasoning behind it.

I'm betting money the comment about Mollie's town game isn't true.

[farside22]

I voted gamma because he reads wishy washy and talks about waiting for others and just reads nervous to me.

[farside22]

this 1 is for far:

I love this song!!
<3

@Farside22: Well, we could, at least, try to figure out the setup and hold players accountable for their actions. It would help to PoE clear some people, I'd imagine.
I don't see how claiming dropped items hurts town. :/
Also, I'm not lying about my feelings on Mollie. Doubt me as much as you want, that's my experience on the matter. I'm not relying on it for my reads, I'm not a fan of meta, and I don't take game notes or any crap like that.

-V

I don't see it helpful day one. After a night and if there is a kill we should come back to this subject.
I have a reason why and the simple thing is to see if someone is lying.

[farside22]

@Farside, Testing Toog. If Toog did drop a weapon then anyone who had that item could counterclaim. If items didn't match, then Toog knowing an item someone else possessed would indicate town Toog.

@Toog where did you start?

That's nice.

[farside22]

That's sarcasm by the way.

[farside22]

Toog: I give you permission to tell the hydra to f-off

[farside22]

i thought you did varsoona. but how can you say that titus wants "all the info on the table" when she was reluctant to say what room you guys were in? room knowledge is what scum has and town doesn't so it makes sense to claim what room you were whereas claiming items doesn't. <----- that helps scum not town.

and you are straight up lying about me not being aggressive or somehow being unaware of it cos in our very first game together I bullied the fuck out of pple to get them to lynch fery hydra on d1. who was scum btw!

@ far

gamma doesn't seem nervous to me, he is just being cautious. it takes a while for him to warm up in games and having said that, I have no read on him yet.

also no really, shroedinger are scum. there is zero town motivation in wanting pple to claim items and not rooms. zilch. none. nada. god in the first game beli and I felt like it was xmas when pple started claiming items and what they did.

You don't find his lack of vote odd or how the hydra bring him up but haven't voted anyone.

Just something I'm noting for now till others post

[farside22]

Why you being vague with your reads

[farside22]

@farside

,
I don't see benefit in talking about my townread and not realllllly scumreading anyone yet.
Are you finding Schro scummy or weird? Finding it hard to tell from your ISO.

Both.

Also,

Just something I'm noting for now till others post

Can you talk at me about this?
What exactly is bothering you with mollie here?

I'm bothered by the hydra and gamma, not Mollie.

Mollie: I posted where I stated n0 already. I'm in the kitchen now.

[farside22]

And now I'm caught up.

Varsoon: I don't see a bennifit to claiming what the items do. I think holding the info back will help more to weed out liars.

Second I'm not sure what to think of the hydra. The pissy attitude seems odd coming from varsoon.my gut says they are town.

Kmd: why did you vote for the hydra?

[farside22]

far I think your gut ate bad pizza.

I don't think so.

Something struck me and I need time to go back and reread.

Second I'm not sure what to think of the hydra. The pissy attitude seems odd coming from varsoon.my gut says they are town.

I know asking to explain a gutread is dumb, but if you could articulate whenabouts in the game you flipped this read and any specific posts that stand out to you I'd appreciate it.

I'm bothered by the hydra and gamma, not Mollie.

I'm not sure I understand the point of what you were asking mollie then?

town can only move to rooms that are adjacent to their own or unless they have an item that lets them move to rooms not adjacent to the 1 they were in. scum can move to any room they want. plus there is an item that will let you see who is in the room with you or in the adjacent rooms. scum will want to try to distance themselves from the room where the nk took place and any adjacent rooms.

if I am not mistaken, scum can only kill some1 in the room they are in or adjacent to

, that is where the 'moving to any room they want to' power comes in handy. capisce?

I figured there would have to be some mechanic that would make the room tracing stuff advantageous, just wanted to make sure.
Wrt the bolded, wouldn't you have known that given that you were mafia in the last game? :S

1) see above comment to Mollie
2) Mollie was saying gamma's play was normal. I was just explaining my issue to her about the spot.

[farside22]

I'm thoroughly interested in hearing hiplop's rebuttal!

Side note, those were some pretty fast votes on hiplop by people who have had almost no impact on this game so far. If what I suspect is true (Shrodinger and Mollie are both town), I suspect that scum are riding out the big fish fights and I'm willing to bet one of them just bussed their buddy here to save face.

This was my thinking. That was why I wanted to read back and see who said what

[farside22]

I took issue with this vote because it says so little coming from kmd

I have a theory about Toog dropping the item, but it wouldn't be a good idea to reveal it. Under this theory, toog could be either town or scum with town being a little more likely.

hi kmd! 

Hello.

Can someone make a list of room claims?

Vote schro

Umadbro?

[farside22]

I have a lot to say but not a lot of time right now.
Right now my issue is im scum reading kmd and sm now.
Cheet is a big fat question mark to me.
At first I was wary of Hiplop but sm quick vote after fighting with Mollie then following her looks pretty scum.

Vote: shro

Everything else is going to have to wait

[farside22]

Farside, when you have time can you explain why you're scum reading Kmd please?

Yea, maybe not tonight but I'm free tomorrow (Thursday)

[farside22]

My issues with KMD are that he is asking a lot of questions but I don't see a lot of thought process coming from him.
Most of the post he made are just a questions.
When I asked why he scum read the hydra all he said was his reaction was over the top towards Mollie and it was the scummiest thing he read. It really doesn't give a lot to me and I felt null about the response.
But when he explained where he was in reads with all his questions and I just felt he was over explaining himself to be ready for any other question asked.
The best way I can say this is that my gut twitches and I feel like he is trying too hard to look town with all his questions to players.

[farside22]

Im pretty caught up. I started zoning out here and there reading the hydra's long post.
I could give you the short version of what I read but it was pretty much just crap.
I had a few questions.

Mollie my dearest love, I failed you! I didn't realize my day one location and n0 location were different.

VOTE: SM

lining up mislynches. I believe mollie is town, I'm stupid and mollies town. Plan was likely to lynch me with mollies info then lynch her when I flip town.

Why was lining up lynches the one thing that had you scum read the slot when you said you were town reading them prior to this vote?

Typo there, we shot the revolver N0.
Regardless, we don't have that shit no more.

-V

Why would you random shot N0?

[farside22]

BBT: If you are around can you explain your town read of kmd please.

[farside22]

Okay. I have about 3 scum reads and one null read so I'm good to drop it for now.

[farside22]

@Farside: We shot the revolver Night zero because we didn't want to be forced to use it on N1. At the time, I believed we would be able to hold onto the revolver even after we shot it. After I got the PM that it was dropped, for a moment I thought that we could go back and pick it up. I quickly realized that shooting it wasted the shot and dropped it to a random room. Not that it matters, as it seems plenty of people dropped their items thanks to a loud bang.

@Mollie: Sigh. Glad you're continuing to lie about my item stance and this hydra's entire stance on rooms. Of course you're doing it in full caps and bold. I've pointed out how this is untrue and even quoted my own posts for you, but I guess it's not easy to get a lynch telling the truth about us, is it? Honestly, if you pull this in any other game I play with you, I'm just going to replace out on the spot. It's not fun. It makes me want to react in a very personal and aggressive way, which is also not fun. I like you a lot, mollie. You're a player that I think is really good, and seeing you play like this is disheartening (if you are town) and worthless (if you are scum). Keep driving your literal-lies policy lynch, I guess.

I don't want to implode here, so if you guys want anything from me while I'm at L-1, you should ask for it.
As much as I do enjoy this game and have enjoyed playing, I feel very depressed and worn down.
LOL ATE THO AMIRITE HAHAHA VARSOON ATE GET IT I'M JUST FOOLIN' YA, I CAN'T ACTUALLY BE UPSET! HAHAHA
:/

-V

This is where I'm confused.
N0 there is no info, no way to know who you are shooting but you did that rather then figure out who is in the room and if they should be shot.
How does that make sense over being forced to use it n1?

[farside22]

Also while I'm asking, which room did you shot at?

[farside22]

We were in courtyard at N0, I believe.
And we were told that shooting the gun on N0 would not kill anyone but still use a bullet/use.

Okay but that still doesn't explain why you used it. You also said you didn't realize using it would mean you drop it.
So why would using it n0 mean you don't have it n1?
What was the point of using it at all?

[farside22]

Oh, wow, actually, that's a great post from KMD. Good stuff. Not just because you seem level-headed about us, but I like the questions you're putting out at BBT and shos.

@BBT: Gonna play the ole 'You never read me right' card now?
First time for everything, eh?

@Farside: I've been over this, but, once again, for clarity.
Initially, we wanted to actually use the Revolver to shoot a player on Night 2. We figured we'd have enough info to make an informed kill with it by then.
I read the rule that items had to be used within any two night set--you can't just hold/not use an item two nights in a row.
The Revolver said that it would not kill anyone if used on Night 0. So we decided then to use it on Night 0.
I was under the impression we would still have it, not kill anyone, and be able to take another shot on Night 2.
I then thought that when we dropped an item, it dropped in the previous room. I quickly realized this wasn't the case and the Revolver had been ported to a random room.

So, in short, my reason for using the revolver was because I thought that doing so at Night 0 would mean we could wait until Night 2 to actually use it.
If I knew better, I would have pushed to not use the revolver at all, solely to keep it on our person, and then drop it rather than use it on Night 1 if we weren't sure of scum.
But, alas, I'm an idiot. So, there's that.

-V

So you want me to believe you half read the rules of the game.....
No
Just no

[farside22]

Here is what I see and kmd can explain why he is defending the varsoon/titus hydra after.

They claimed to shot n0 saying they didn't want to be forced to shot n1.
They apparently read the rules enough to know items needed to be used by 2 night phases or be lost but didn't read it would be dropped.
Second they have made rediculous pushes at players for weak reason and comes across desperate.

Oh and for fun I'm quoting the actual rule that SM is saying as a reason why they shot.

The player cannot hold an item for more than two(2) days. On the second night in possession of the item,

the player must use or drop the item.

Once an item is dropped or used they will appear on a random room.
The players use the items before dying.
When the player dies the item is automatically dropped.
Items that are not picked up will remain in their respective rooms over the course of the night.

The fact that dropping an item it right fucking after knowing how long you can possess an item confirms my scum read of the pair

[farside22]

i dont think he'll flip town bbt

[farside22]

You don't think their latest posts sound town at all?

No.

[farside22]

far you're hilarious <3

This is I typically feel during my day.

[farside22]

I'm just going to post this again till someone explains why they are town reading the hydra based on this:

Oh, wow, actually, that's a great post from KMD. Good stuff. Not just because you seem level-headed about us, but I like the questions you're putting out at BBT and shos.

@BBT: Gonna play the ole 'You never read me right' card now?
First time for everything, eh?

@Farside: I've been over this, but, once again, for clarity.
Initially, we wanted to actually use the Revolver to shoot a player on Night 2. We figured we'd have enough info to make an informed kill with it by then.
I read the rule that items had to be used within any two night set--you can't just hold/not use an item two nights in a row.
The Revolver said that it would not kill anyone if used on Night 0. So we decided then to use it on Night 0.
I was under the impression we would still have it, not kill anyone, and be able to take another shot on Night 2.
I then thought that when we dropped an item, it dropped in the previous room. I quickly realized this wasn't the case and the Revolver had been ported to a random room.

So, in short, my reason for using the revolver was because I thought that doing so at Night 0 would mean we could wait until Night 2 to actually use it.
If I knew better, I would have pushed to not use the revolver at all, solely to keep it on our person, and then drop it rather than use it on Night 1 if we weren't sure of scum.
But, alas, I'm an idiot. So, there's that.

-V

So you want me to believe you half read the rules of the game.....
No
Just no

Here is what I see and kmd can explain why he is defending the varsoon/titus hydra after.

They claimed to shot n0 saying they didn't want to be forced to shot n1.
They apparently read the rules enough to know items needed to be used by 2 night phases or be lost but didn't read it would be dropped.
Second they have made rediculous pushes at players for weak reason and comes across desperate.

Oh and for fun I'm quoting the actual rule that SM is saying as a reason why they shot.

The player cannot hold an item for more than two(2) days. On the second night in possession of the item,

the player must use or drop the item.

Once an item is dropped or used they will appear on a random room.
The players use the items before dying.
When the player dies the item is automatically dropped.
Items that are not picked up will remain in their respective rooms over the course of the night.

The fact that dropping an item it right fucking after knowing how long you can possess an item confirms my scum read of the pair

[farside22]

I didn't unvote Hiplop, I unvoted SM.

I unvoted because as much as I hate like 40 page D1s I don't want to go into D2 having like 3 reads.

Post 246 you voted hiplop. You are not currently voting hiplop. Why?

Gamma, here's a list of what looked town in Schro's 353:
-the point about BBT switching his vote off of someone he believes has a guilty on them being unnatural is a good one.
-the hunting scum on the leading wagon comes off very "here's who and why" rather than "everyone is out to get me". It's logical. It makes sense. It's level headed. And it looks the same as I'd imagine it would look if the wagon was on someone else.
-laying out all of the info and analyzing it shows both transparency and a genuine attempt to solve the game.
-the attempt to get shos and toog to town read each other makes zero sense for scum, but perfect sense for town who has town reads on both slots.
-Effectively treating shos and toog as confirmed town makes no sense for scum, especially in such a small game. The more mislynch options, the better for scum. Of course a scum flip from either shos or toog would nullify this point and the one above it.
-sticking by wanting item claims when it's clear people find it scummy would be suboptimal for scum and Titus is smart enough to realize both that and the fact that it won't happen. She'd have given up on it by now as scum.

Farside, I get that there are good points against Schro. Hell, if I remember right I may have even made one or two myself. It's just I'm not sold. The town points seem to outweigh the scum ones. And hiplop is a better lynch. I don't at all buy that he just didn't care enough to include both rooms he's been in when roomclaiming. I don't buy that phone posting and rushing makes you stop caring about that. I just did my whole catchup on a phone today and believe me I cared. I mean if I'm wrong and Schro ends up being scum, so be it. I get that I'll look like a buddy but whatever. Town will still be in good shape.

Schro, I don't give two shits if my votes are "justifiable" to be perfectly honest. If I think I'm lynching scum, and I always think I'm lynching scum, the flip does all of the justifying for me. If I turn out to be wrong, meh. It happens to the best of us. If I was sure you were scum, then yes, maybe I'd hammer you. But not because people might approve. It would be because I expect red text in the Mod's last post of the day. And right now, I'm feeling that on hiplop. I think Mollie caught him in a lie. Also I don't hate you for the record. I like 95% of the people I've ever played a mafia game with.

This is crap.
You have 1 reason you stated why you think hippy is scum.
That's it and it was the past tense wording.
That is it.
Nothing more and that outweighs the bs that SM is saying.

[farside22]

i can do a quick off the top head

town
mollie
gamma
toog
shos

n
kmd
cheetory

s
shroedinger mislynch
bbt

?
farside

will explain them tomorrow, off to dreamland

Scum:
Shroeding
Kmd

Null:
Shoes
Chet

Everyone else is a town read.

[farside22]

@Storyteller/Mod: Sorry--I've been trying to pick up Titus' slips. I run an incognito second window with this game open, so my own likelihood of slipping is low, but I feel it is my responsibility to catch those of my partner as well. Thank you for your diligence.

@Farside: I don't understand how you can give us such a hard time for not understanding the rules completely, but then give Hiplop a pass over the whole room claim slip, and then go on to give KMD a hard time for being hard on Hiplop over that slip.
That doesn't make sense to me.
How can you be sympathetic to one honest mistake but not to another?
How can you feel vindicated in scumreading someone over an honest mistake, but then give another player shit for not realizing something could have been an honest mistake?
How can you have a bank account and access to the internet, but not want to order me a pizza?

This questions vex me so, Farside. Please answer them.

-V

My grammar sucks ass so that isn't a slip in my view.

[farside22]

Also hydra you have yet to explain how you read up to a certain point of the rules and just stopped reading after.

[farside22]

The first time I read the rules, I wasn't making huge note of them. I wasn't studying them or anything. Only a few things registered, or, really, stuck with me by the time that I actually got the Night 0 PM and started to talk about what to do with Titus.
Did you read Advance Wars?
Did you see how I did the same thing in Advance Wars?
Do you really think it's out of the realm of possibility that I made a -tiny- mistake here?
Is it seriously something that puts us at the top of your scumreads?

This bothers me. There's much better players to push and much better angles to push when it comes to my wagon.
I don't understand, Farside.
You haven't explained how my mistake is somehow more grievous than Hiplop's.

-V

Well you were the one who said you wanted to use the gun N0 because you didn't want to be forced to use it night 1.
Holding it as town makes more sense then using it when it's useless.
Did you think the scum may pick it up?
No
Did you read the rules
NO
Am I going to meta search you on this
no
Do I give a fuck
No
You want sympathy
Go look in the dictionary between shit and syphilis for it.

Except, I haven't been manipulating anything. I've been straightforward about it all.
If I wanted to pull the wool over people's eyes, I would just lie.
However, the idea that I'm lying about not understanding the rules in order to, what? Earn early towncred? Did you think this through? What does me lying about not understanding the rules at first accomplish at all for scum-me?
Again, I'm having hot flashbacks to Advance Wars. Scum pulled the same card on me; the whole 'AHA YOU ARE DEFINITELY SLIPPING/JUST LYING ABOUT NOT UNDERSTANDING THE RULES FOR TOWNCRED.'
Again, I'm not.

My mistake was stupid regardless of alignment, too. :/

I'm actually 0% chance of being scum, because I have a town role PM.
It doesn't bother you that Farside sees no difference between your mistake and mine, and actively pursues KMD over pushing on your mistake but stands by scum-reading me for mine?
It doesn't bother you that a hungry Varsoon goes without pizza for several weeks and you're the only one that can help?

-V

I think it's funny you call me town but think to just oversell a position because someone is scum reading you.
Would you like me to show the rules where it has the when night actions are used and dropped one more time for call your claim BS
This isn't fucking gramar issue in the fucking least.
It's you making a claim about what you did and why and I calling it fucking BS.
Big fucking difference.

[farside22]

I was in the Billiard room and used my item on the conservatory. My item forces someone who holds their item to drop it(poison) - decided to use it because obviously scum would try to hold their item to make a kill next night available.

Also, this makes no sense. Using items discards them, making them easier for scum to find and use. Holding items is the only true way to prevent scum from acquiring an item to kill with.

Yes, that is why I thought scum would hold N0, so I can force them to drop it if they do. You held.
But your reason for holding in 275 actually does make sense. that sucks.

Good. No you're understanding that disagreement isn't scummy.

Who do you want flipped out of the possible scum? Let's get us going.

I want Hiplop first.

~T

Why is hiplop scum?
What exactly makes him scum to you?

[farside22]

Mollie don't leave. I can deal with heckle and jeckle if you want.
No problem.

[farside22]

Should I bother mentioning that sm called Hiplop scum for a past tense comment and then calls him out for buddying Mollie.
Someone tell me how it makes sense for scum to buddy there scum buddy.
I could also mention that the scum read on Mollie is basically because mollie is being herself

[farside22]

Hi shoes.

How are you?
I'm tired but it's life you know. I'm going to do a bullet case like you asked the best I can without it being long.


*claims gun shot and why here, when pushed about the action here you can see they clearly read the rules about items daysread the whole thing they thought it dropped in the same room and they kept the item when used (rules show differently)
*they claim to shoot the ceiling which if you read the rules is not something you can target
*The issue with the mollie push is that originally reading Mollie as town and likely her thoughts when Mollie attacks the hydra the hydra comes up with pretty crappy reason's to scum read her here they were pushing item claims (which I find scummy by the way) but you can see in this game Varsoon has seen aggressive mollie beforeand talked with her to understand her better.

I could go on if you want but I'm a bit tired with the links right now.

[farside22]

and one day when I care I will do post preview.

mod please fix link above

~Done.

[farside22]

@Farside, you see that unless otherwise specified, the mod let us try to shoot the ceiling. If it was a verobten action, the mod would gave said no.

Yeah I think you lying

[farside22]

why is shos wanting a bullet point explanation for why we are reading some1 as scum when he is already reading them as scum

I didn't think too hard about it.
I did it mostly because I think the hydra is scum and thought posting the highlights only would lead to their lynch.

[farside22]

why is shos wanting a bullet point explanation for why we are reading some1 as scum when he is already reading them as scum

N0 night actions suggest, imo, that the schrodinger hydra is town

I sadly think the hydra is town

scum:
1. SM. I don't even need to explain by now.

lol this is pretty funny

I am very paranoid this game.
The fact that no other wagon at all is rising against either of SM and hiplop gives me wierd vibes. nobody is

defending

anyone. it's like we caught town doing shit as town always do, and scum are capitalizing on that and/or lurking while town fight town to the ground.

Also got the incredible paranoia that molliescum HELD the candlestick for later kills, and used her own scum info to "use" it and capitalize on hiplop's mishap.

I thought a few people defended sm and well I said I town read hippy.
No one agrees with me about kmd so I'll stick with sm till they are lynched.
Did you read my points or what?

[farside22]

I did, of course.
Those defenses aren't stubborn enough for me to consider them actually.

@frozone: in a scenario where mollie is scum, she knows where everyone is, so if there's a discrepancy she can say she used the candlestick while not having used it. etc. but let's keep paranoia for late game.


The mod has replied to me about the 'target the ceiling'. he said something that might be interpretted as "some items may shoot the ceiling".

Y_Y

Why?

[farside22]

Why are you scum reading the hydra shos?

[farside22]

3) We shoot the ceiling N0.

Titus love. Tell me.
When you PMed the mod (no quoting), who did you target?

The ceiling.

It's a scene in Clue.

This game is not based on the movie.

[farside22]

That's nice

[farside22]

I agree, let's lynch SM.

[farside22]

ftr far is worrying me

Idc

[farside22]

And I have to say farside is worrying me a bit too. Usually when we play we buddy each other, at least a little. I see almost nothing of that kind here at all. It's wierd, and she thinks other than me, so it's even wierder

That's because I'm not town reading you.

Idk about you but I saw 5 hours and couldn't get online to change my action, what makes you think the hydra isn't scum shooting n0?

[farside22]

mollie dont be paranoid girl

its obviously sm

I endorse this product and/or service

[farside22]

And again them saying they didn't want to be forced to use it n1 but not know it would be dropped is crap

[farside22]

why isn't shoe hammered yet

also if they flip scum toog is a likely partner cos of how they have been trying to clear each other through item usage all game!

Are you losing it?

[farside22]

Also, I asked mollie and others to provide reaosns gor scumreading schro because I was lazy and had no time and wanted help, not because i dont believe them.

Mollie, you need to either say shos or shcro, but not shoe, because that fits both

This was were I was confused.

I'll get to kmd post later

[farside22]

Okay I reread Hiplop because I misunderstood the situation and he's now a scum read.

[farside22]

I need an up to date Vote Count and then reasons from people why they aren't voting (assuming there is more than just myself holding a vote at the moment), as well as who they would be voting for if they had to put a vote down. Last I remember, hippy and SM were the only two people with Votes, and in all honesty, the game has been circular arguing itself for probably the last dozen pages now. Someone (anyone) really needs to be lynched soon for the sanity of the game.

Vote SM.

I think hiplop is town.

Mmmm after km d's last post I'm rethinking my read on Hiplop but Ina bright note it moved kmd up in my book so I have SM, shoes, Hiplop as my top 3 I do wonder what happened with toog, that's my paranioa speaking though

[farside22]

Please, do something worthwhile. I'm scumreading you because you've done nothing worthwhile in my eyes. You've sheeped the worst points and clutched on to the pettiest of arguments. I don't see any original effort coming from your slot unless it's flinging crap my way over something less-than-important about our slot. Any time that discussion started to veer away from my lynch, you've come into the thread to remind everyone to keep voting for me. Step your game up.

-V

Yeah no. Your slot doesn't get to lie continuously about me, ignore the questions I've asked you, and follow it up with whining that I haven't done enough.

You're still being intentionally vague about everything you're talking about.

You're saying that I've sheeped the worst points without saying what they are. You're saying I'm not being original with no specifics at all. (hint: I've come up with more actual reasons for you being scum than probably anyone in the game aside from maybe mollie)
You're saying the arguments are petty without actually addressing any of the individual arguments themselves.

You're clearly scum, and as much as you intend to whine about how much I'm pursuing you, I'm not going away.

I probably should have done more but it seems so painfully obvious I just can't understand how anyone is town reading the spot.

[farside22]

Shos you are going to have to explain how you go from scum reading to town reading a player.

[farside22]

Easy
You get a PM from the mod confurming what the player said

*sigh*
I am familiar with both of them and this is not fitting for me. The amount of AtE, for example, is HUGE. The amount of errors/mistakes/wierdness that the hydra causes does not fit.
If you want to go specifics, the incoherence for example as for the 'reasons' for using the revolver, and the whole "oh but the rules but the rules" thing that is really not clear for me - even that is enough.

So you just ignore the playstyle you commented about as scummy.

[farside22]

Mollie, what's your opinion of SM moving to the Gazebo? Doesn't that seem like a town motivated move? He purposely dropped his weapon AND he moved to a location that has limited choices for potentially performing Night Kills. That seems like a lot of pressure to put on your partner to perform any Night 1 Actions.

Is that all you really look at to determine who is scum and town?

[farside22]

Let's review, talking about what the items do is scummy as hell.
If people read the fucking rules it says the scum can use any item as a weapon.
The scum have 2 special fucking abilities that means going to some obscure room means Jack fucking shit.
The cases made by sm is crap, the player has lied 3 fucking times and they are still alive.

People can not be this dumb

[farside22]

People can not be this dumb

So what do I call you when I flip town, lazy farside?
It seems like you know how to do nothing this game but sheep my wagon and say "They're so obviously scum! Don't be a retard! Vote them! Their case is crap! I won't say how! I'll just talk shit and get a free pass for it!"

Step your game up.
Do something worth a shit for once.

-V

If you flip town, ill track you down and take your computer away.

[farside22]

I'll give you my address.
Seriously, though, I am town.
I've tried asking you, "What am I to do?"
and all I've gotten is "Die you scumshit"

What are your reads outside of me, farside?
What do you care to do besides sit idly on my wagon and act justified about it?

If it pleases you, I'll talk to you about why you're scumreading me, but I doubt that'll convince you, because you're so convinced you're right and I'm either scum or retarded.
Asshole.

-V

Shos is suspect. I asked him some questions and his story does not add up.
Hiplop is on my scumdar because I can't see how he got confused by the question asked about n0.

[farside22]

if you want to talk, why did you wait to vote Hiplop?
Why are you attacking those that are scum reading you?

[farside22]

I've thought briefly of changing my vote but the thought goes out completely because I've played with both players and they don't get whiny as town.

[farside22]

VOTE: Schrodinger Mislynch

That's hammer right?

Please tell me that's a hammer.

Why did you hammer?

[farside22]

I think my biggest issue with SM is they both played with Mollie but they think she is scum. Like WTF.

[farside22]

I moved to the trophy room last night.
Who is where right now?

Also my vote is leaning on hiplop or bbt today.

[farside22]

I think it's funny the two people I call scum vote for me and say nothing about anyone else.

[farside22]

I have some good info regarding items and all. Can probably find who was the killer.

Everyone who HAD an item for use last night, please claim, and which item

Also I should be in kitchen range too if memory serves righr.

N0: had item
N1: had no item

[farside22]

I think it's funny the two people I call scum vote for me and say nothing about anyone else.

fwiw I called you scum before you called me scum

Facts:

I have a lot to say but not a lot of time right now.
Right now my issue is im scum reading kmd and sm now.
Cheet is a big fat question mark to me.
At first I was wary of Hiplop but sm quick vote after fighting with Mollie then following her looks pretty scum.

Vote: shro

Everything else is going to have to wait

I'd say bbt/kmd I agree on. Not sure on farside. I think gamma and toog are both town, too.

SM, shos and farside are the ones im most skeptical of

i can do a quick off the top head

town
mollie
gamma
toog
shos

n
kmd
cheetory

s
shroedinger mislynch
bbt

?
farside

will explain them tomorrow, off to dreamland

Not a chance in hell you did there.

[farside22]

Also I wonder why hiplop you said nothing about BBT and his hammer there?

[farside22]

Okay I reread Hiplop because I misunderstood the situation and he's now a scum read.

And here I officially call hiplop scum.
Someone else can dig around to hiplop actually calling me scum instead of the wishy washy responses there.

[farside22]

Everyone please claim if you had an item last night. I can confirm stuff.

Done.

[farside22]

Toog: did you have an item night 1?

[farside22]

Yeah that totally makes sense.

[farside22]

Bbt: Why did you hammer a town read and say nothing all day 1?

[farside22]

guys this is not town farside

usually she CONSTANTLY thinks about every perspective

here shes very self interested and doesnt look at the bigger picture much

Yes I am.
I'm lynched, flip town and note I am scum reading you, sm scum read you and Mollie caught you in a lie.
Once I flip town you are confirmed scum.

Vote: Hiplop

Also that comment from Hiplop is inaccurate as hell.

[farside22]

Oh and bbt is pretty much confirmed scum buddy since Hiplop is not bothering to push him but has us as scum together because magic

[farside22]

^saying anything like "confirmed scum buddy" after yesterday's clusterfuck seems pretty dumb

also I might not actually get to this tonight due to general busyness, but I'll try. Might have to wait til Wednesday night though. If it helps atm cheet's slow hop on and shos's "this person isn't scum because of this minor role thing even though theyve been completely incoherent for the entire game" feel like the reactions most likely to come from scum, but that's not really anything solid against them.

They are avoiding discussing each other.
And the hammer by bbt after lurking day 1 is scummy as shit.

Rebuttle?

[farside22]

Oh and bbt is right about SM making the game unplayable. Flooding the game with AtE and saying that everyone's lying about them instead of actually addressing any of the points against them made them absolutely need to die. not to mention not giving a shit about who to lynch as long as it's in *this specific 40% of the game*

like serrrrriously.

That's totally believable to say after the lynch.
You want to search his bbt ISO for saying anything prior?

[farside22]

For those missing it.
Here is bbt push on SM.
Tell me when you see him pushing them as town.

Nobody should be claiming items.

VOTE: Schrodinger

Right, and given scum can move to any room they like....

If we can make sure items are hidden from scum, then we might want to do that.

I am also concerned about Toog claiming dropped. I might have a way to verify as we shot the gun. (We didn't want to shoot N1).

I mean, it's pretty easy. We just don't claim items.

Why did you decide to shoot the gun N0 and not N1? Did you know the effects of the gun shot?

So if everyone claims items, then scum cannot kill unless they find the gun and/or teleport.

Is the gun the only item scum can kill with?

BBT is playing very hands-off and inoffensive.

What?

I voted gamma because he reads wishy washy and talks about waiting for others and just reads nervous to me.

I feel like your reasons for SM being scum are stronger than Garmr so I'm wondering why your vote isn't on SM...

I don't see how claiming dropped items hurts town. :/

Because scum are looking for items. Scum NEED items. Finding out what items are in the game AND what they do benefits scum massively.

Also, can you summarize for me in like two sentences why you think Schro is scum and not null and stuff!

I think Mollie has been fairly clear on why they she thinks SM are scum...I'm not sure why you're acting like it hasn't been stated. Multiple times.

And, honestly, pushing us over Titus' reluctance to claim room (when we may have a damn good reason not to and Titus made sure she wanted to talk to me about room claiming before doing it without my permission) is all sorts of fucked sideways.

Umm, so this doesn't make sense. You push for room claims but were reluctant to claim your own room because 'damn good reason'. How do you know other people were not in the same position? Given you were somewhat reluctant to claim your room I find it very strange that you push the idea for other people to claim what room they were in.

this is a super bad argument given that there are two scum in the game and throwing one in a corner for town cred is perfectly viable while keeping the other in a place where they'll likely have a few kills.

Vote:shos

Wow. You're so reluctant to vote SM...what's up with that?

BBT, Scum can kill with any item. We knew the effects (I posted them in thread). Scum have a "go get item" once per game.

Is this information somewhere for me to see? How do we know scum can kill with any item? Also, you claimed earlier (38), that scum can only kill with the gun. What am I missing?

VOTE: shos guy is throwing me off

What is 'throwing you off'?

Umm, town reading you and Toog.

Also town reading, though not as strongly, Cheetory. Tentative town read on Kmd as well but need more from him.

Scum reading Hiplop and SM.

Would lynch Shos because he isn't doing anything. And anyone I haven't mentioned has made no impression on me.

PEdit - Mollie, I fail to see how you're town reading Hiplop. His 94 quite clearly shows he did not misunderstand anything as he is trying to imply.

VOTE: SM

Didn't start of game get extended because scum thought they could kill someone N0?

I bet you fired gun to kill someone.

Which probably means scum thought they could kill someone N0 and therefore fired a gun.

Yeah. Have it.

I didn't unvote Hiplop, I unvoted SM.

I unvoted because as much as I hate like 40 page D1s I don't want to go into D2 having like 3 reads.

VOTE: Schrodinger Mislynch

That's hammer right?

Please tell me that's a hammer.

[farside22]

Wow that case by Hiplop is awesome.

[farside22]

Farside, any chance you have the time to make a table with all the info and stuff?

I might do that myself if I find the time come evening~

I'm busy till Thursday.
I can tell you I'm 90% sure Hiplop hasnt claimed n1 and is avoiding the subject

[farside22]

what did you expect lol

Nothing, just pointing out all he says over and over is im scum

[farside22]

lol I just noticed that too. why 90%?

I didn't look back and my memory seems like shit these days so I'm not 100% he hadn't claimed but I felt relatively certain.
Just note I'm having a bad day at work and feeling my lowest

[farside22]

Hey Toog,

You mean hammer someone who was making the game unplayable? FWIW, I was town reading SM when I hammered them.

Why is my vote bad and what earlier suspicions did you have?

Your vote is horrible because you don't seem to care about making cases, and apparently you seem to think it's ok to absolve yourself of any guilt in your actions.

And I was voting you for 90% of Day 1, and you should know why since you ducked out when you got any pressure at all, only to resurface to hammer a town read of mine. I mean I literally had my vote on you for almost the entire day and gave my reasons as to why I think you are scum, so either you didn't read the game at all, are completely oblivious, or are trying to make it look like I'm the one with the insubstantial content.

Also the fact I just posted a bunch of quotes showing he was scum reading the spot and Hiplop but you know whatever lie helps bbt.

[farside22]

Just waiting on kmd and frozone to claim if they had an item night 1.
@toog: shos asked what item you had.

[farside22]

I'm going to use my favorite quote moment here.

I'm sorry I can't hear you bbt over you far is scum for no fucking reason mantra.

Yeah that feels good.

[farside22]

Farside is scum for misrepping me and lack of scum hunting.

[farside22]

Points back to quote wall of bbt's day 1 post
Looks at bbt
Calls bbt a lying sack of crap
Returns back to work

[farside22]

BBT, you honestly believe farside isn't scumhunting? And if you were townreading the Titus hydra at any point, you didn't communicate that very well. And if you were skimming for votes and not reading, how did your read completely 180 like that and why did you hammer anyway?

Let me know if you want links to his games because I could show how unlike town he is.

[farside22]

Like you showed evidence this game about me.
Sure let me do that.

[farside22]

Can you fuys vote hiplopplease

I already did.

[farside22]

I was in the kitchen

[farside22]

We should claim where we are today.
I have a thought.

I'm currently in the trophy room.

[farside22]

N0 had dagger heard shot and dropped it.
N1 no item

[farside22]

I don't know about telling scum what the items do.
Shos; Does the wrench still do something with blood on it?

[farside22]

Yup. I can still evade death tonight and fly anywhere.

Also, I just saw the Clue movie, so much fun!

I love that movie!

Okay just wanted to check.
The dagger protects a player or a room but can not be used on yourself.

[farside22]

I used it n0 thinking scum could kill. I saw the pm too late about no kills on N0

[farside22]

Scum is almost definitely lying about their room. That's why we should lynch hiplop

This

[farside22]

Hiplop is far, far from a VI

[farside22]

It sucks. No ones going to listen to me b/c of that mistake early game.

THIS IS NOT TOWN FARSIDE. AT ALL. LIKE NOT EVEN A LITTLE BIT

eta: @ hippy - far said in a recent completed game that she has been mixing up her meta but her thoughts come from a town stance. I can link the game and mebbe find the post where she said this if you want. her thinking is too much like my own and I feel far in her posts and I feel calm when I read them. town moes in herds and it doesn't feel like she is trying to disperse the herd (scum) it feels like she is kind of trying to pull them together she is just more subtle about it.

Yawn

[farside22]

mod: please fix quote tag above

~Done

[farside22]

that means nothing to me!

to me meta isnt an intentional thing. its the accidental/instinctual things that separate alignment

this is oppurtunistic farside!
a

Mollie mentioned it because I did it in a game we finished, where I was town.
How is this close to my scum game, mr. Let you use some fake meta reason.

[farside22]

Which game? Mebbe I will take a look!

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=62237

I'm still waiting for your response to my question.

far, whats your read on shos/bbt?

something is weird w/ those 2

Bbt is scum.
What seems weird?

[farside22]

Although I feel similar about your slot - your room mix up makes me think you have to be scum. But I liked some of your recent posting and that makes me think you could be town - I'm a sucker for AtE though.

Struggling to get into this because of the shitfest that was D1.

Yeah I'm calling this bs
Hippy has done nothing and in your past game you would look at more then emotion

farside, cojmpare this game to jojos! Its basically identical with the way you're trying to steer lynches. Too close for comfort.

Hes just an odd fellow, maybe? Like hammering a town read (even though SM was the scummiest slot I've ever seen and stand by that 100%), wagon hopping etc. Like traditionally scummy but I kinda think his other posting is town

hes like oppurtunistic town in my head and that is a weird place

Not even close.
I steer lynches as town so that be a weak ass point and you know better

[farside22]

I don't usually hammer a town read but I was really looking forward to this game and couldn't get into D1 at all. It was just a 20 page back and forth between Mollie and SM and it was just impossible. I realised I had no reads and barely knew who was in the game outside of 4, maybe 5, people. That shit needed to stop straight away.

I don't think I'm wagon hopping. All of my votes have reasoning - or reasoning can be deduced by the context of the vote.

Yet doing nothing day 2.
And I'm just going to point out you said nothing about town reading the spot till you were called out for the hammer.
Convient

[farside22]

Right I have one question; what is the scum motivation behind claiming I was town reading a slot I hammered?

Tell me more about my master plan.

To look town.

More meta please Farside.

Nice dodge

[farside22]

Although I feel similar about your slot - your room mix up makes me think you have to be scum. But I liked some of your recent posting and that makes me think you could be town - I'm a sucker for AtE though.

Struggling to get into this because of the shitfest that was D1.

Yeah I'm calling this bs
Hippy has done nothing and in your past game you would look at more then emotion

farside, cojmpare this game to jojos! Its basically identical with the way you're trying to steer lynches. Too close for comfort.

Hes just an odd fellow, maybe? Like hammering a town read (even though SM was the scummiest slot I've ever seen and stand by that 100%), wagon hopping etc. Like traditionally scummy but I kinda think his other posting is town

hes like oppurtunistic town in my head and that is a weird place

Not even close.
I steer lynches as town so that be a weak ass point and you know better

you're also a bit snarkier than usual. Your tone isn't quite as open as usual. The only game you haven't been like that is where you've been scum

either you're playing entirely different in this ONE town game, or you're scum. The second option makes more sense to me.

Yeah I'm totally not snarky as town
liar
That link for those not clicking is a recent game hippy and I was in.

[farside22]

I mean, you're acting as if I needed reasoning to join that wagon. I could quite easily have hammered and stuck with the read that they were scum due to all of my earlier posting that you quoted - why would I create aggro for myself if I were scum?

Let's see doing a favor to help the town reads as kissing ass
Never changing your view without explaining again why = profit.

I have no problem lynching Farside - after Toog.

Why is trog scum exactly?

[farside22]

God help me if no one else reads the bbt/hippy interaction fake as hell

[farside22]

Is that because we're both town and you're scum and we have nailed your buddy Farside as scum as well so you need to lynch us?

Yawn

[farside22]

Tired?

I could laugh but your reaction to toog is boring.
No I'm going to wait before I explain anything about you and hippy.

[farside22]

Others to post

[farside22]

It ended with nothing resolved

[farside22]

Shos: toog said he dropped n0. You think he is lying?
He was the first to mention the bang and dropping the item, which matched the wording I have.

[farside22]

On lunch so I have about ten minutes before returning to death, trying to get on top of things but it's not really working lol.
I just wanted to quickly ask:

He was the first to mention the bang and dropping the item, which matched the wording I have.

Were you also under the impression at one point that the bang was what forced you to drop your item?
-cheet.

Before I read the rules I thought the bang was responsible due to the wording.

I mean, I'm struggling to get into the game so I really don't mind.

Farside has to go after me though.

[farside22]

I really don't see this game progressing

[farside22]

Whatever

Vote: bbt

[farside22]

yea, really don't like far/toog.

Okay fine

Vote: hippy

Is that L-1?

Please lynch Farside tomorrow. She is scum.

Hiplop, I fail to see how you can dislike both of them so much and yet stay on my wagon.

No I'm not.
Why is hippy not a scum read from you is just not making any sense to me

[farside22]

You know I'm not scum but whatever.

[farside22]

v/la for 3 to 5 days

[farside22]

@bbt-no seriously. Post some substantial reasons for why you think the things you do in this game, or you are going to die and can join titus in the group of people who literally can't post coherent reasons for what they're saying to save their fucking lives.

I endorse this product and/or service

Is it wrong that I expect better from BBT as scum or town?
I don't think so.

[farside22]

No, it's not. I would be embarrassed if people who I had played with thought this was my regular level of play. I can only apologize to town - Day one just ruined me.

Although, anyone who really knows my game would know I'd be trying much harder as scum. But whatever, it is what it is.

I think that is the only reason I'm not voting you.
Just vote hippy, he is scum, I'm not.

[farside22]

It could be but honestly it is an expectation thing where I respect BBT more then he realizes

[farside22]

Sorry I've been busy.
I will be around tomorrow.

[farside22]

So can we lynch hiplop

[farside22]

Hippy is scum for lying.
Let's move on

[farside22]

But seriously hip fakes concern about the bbt wagon but keeps his vote there?
Give me a break shos.

[farside22]

Here is hip's comment about the votes on bbt.

yea, really don't like far/toog.

Here is the shitty fucking reason for not moving

where am i suppose to vote? im not in a favourable town position to really persuade you guys to vote my way. i think far/toog could be scum

my third read is bbt, he has a wagon, so im settling bcause of the shitty nature of my position

The reason for his scum read is so weak that I'm down for 1 for 1 at this point

[farside22]

VOTE: farside

come at me

Already have

[farside22]

Sup bitches

Hey UT, vote hippy he is scum.

[farside22]

Hiplop said he was in a room n0.
He said it twice.
He did change his story till Mollie called him out.
After that his points are bad and his scum hunting is less then normal

[farside22]

Ugh.

Alright shos I don't know what to think.
I'm thinking toog mostly because I had an item last night and held it. Heard the loud bang and still was able to hold my item

[farside22]

I am also in the Drawing Room. I had no item at the start of the Night Phase. KMD, did you use your Lead Pipe, and if so, on whom did you use it?

gamma was my vote going into today; I didn't like the delivery of his vote on hiplop. He seems like an odd nightkill because I think he would have easily been mislynch fodder

If I'm not mistaken, we are in MyLo, correct?


Analysis wise...
shos moved to the Kitchen and found the Wrench. gamma and frozone/MS wouldn't have found an item if they were itemless since only one item can be in a room at a time.
I'm assuming KMD moved to the Dining Room and found the Lead Pipe. I didn't find an item, so I'm assuming KMD picked up the Lead Pipe from the Dining Room.
Farside was claimed no item and in the Trophy Room.
BBT was claimed no item and in the Carriage House.

Having had the Revolver myself at one point, I do know that it can kill in any room with a 40% chance. Anyone other than BBT I believe was in range of the Kitchen. BBT *might* have been able to take the shot on a gamble, but why not just kill farside? So, here's the breakdown for me. I know that I didn't have the Revolver yesterday. I was forced to drop it when I moved to the Dining Room because I didn't specifically say I was going to hold on to it. I believe shos had the Wrench because of the claim that it had blood on it, and the way he went about questioning hiplop, therefore I don't believe Frozone/Metal had the Revolver since he couldn't have obtained it when shos picked up the item first. I also believe KMD has the lead pipe, because I didn't pick up anything when moving to the Dining Room, and I don't see any reason to lie about picking up the lead pipe. This leaves my pool of suspects to be either Farside or BBT that made the kill. Since I don't believe scum BBT risks shooting at 40% on the kitchen, I'm leaning voting Farside here.

Vote: Farside

I thought you said you had the revolver day3

[farside22]

Toog, why so sure BBT is scum?

I'm not

sure,

like I have proof or anything, but he's my biggest suspect based on activity since yesterday.

Current reads list:

Town
Farside
KMD
shos
gamma
Frozone
hiplop
BBT
Scum



I had the Revolver yesterday.

What night was this?

Kmd: you said there are 4 bullets left?

[farside22]

N0 had dagger heard shot and dropped it.
N1 no item

This is Farside's claimed item possessions. I doubt scum would claim to have had the murder item in their possession the night of the kill.

Your claiming I was next to the room that had the player was murdered and I held my item which is not the revolver.

[farside22]

Farside, any updates on your reads?

I need to verify something but I thought sl said there was 5 bullets left and toog claimed to drop it but he never said why so I'm looking at him.

[farside22]

Metal Sonic, those reads. I understand why we disagree on shos. I think he's showing town motivation. You think he's faking it for town cred. Fair enough. But BBT. He takes pride in his scum game. You think he'd play like this, get bored, and replace out as scum? I don't. Talk to me about farside and toog. Why are they town?

Toog, I used the lead pipe the night before last. Had no item last night. I figured if hiplop was lying about his room, he could be anywhere, so I took a shot in the dark and tried blocking him. That's why I asked if he took an action. I should have asked much earlier in the day, but *shrug*. He turned out to be town anyway, somehow, so it was a wasted action.

Having had the Revolver myself at one point, I do know that it can kill in any room with a 40% chance. 

^this is true.

Toog, I'm not saying you are wrong in doing so, but can you explain to me, because you pointed out LYLO, why you voted farside immediately and never considered no lynch considering we have an even number?

What does the lead pipe do.

Also I'm in the carriage house.

Everyone else should be room claiming

[farside22]

Toog is lying by the way. The day he dropped his item was n0 and that was the night Schroeder had the gun and shot the ceiling

[farside22]

Correct. 4 bullets. Was Toog the only other person to claim to have the revolver? We've had two nights since Titus used one bullet. I mean, there's a pretty good chance scum didn't claim it and killed gamma with it last night. I wouldn't think that would implicate Toog. He'd know that it says how many bullets it has, so if anything, it should point to him being town.

Lead pipe is effectively a roleblock. Blocks items from being used.

I'll let Toog respond to your last post before I say anything on it but I feel like I remember something in his favor there

He said he dropped it because of a loud bang.

[farside22]

DEAD: Gammagooey (

Madame Rose

,

Town

)

Found shot dead in the Kitchen.

Flavor Scene later.

Day 3 Begins: Deadline Thursday, October 29, 2015, 09:30 pm UCT -4

Toog with revolver.

Vote: toog

[farside22]

I also don't believe you "forgot" to hold an item twice

[farside22]

There was a revolver.
Gamma says shot.
That isn't making stuff up

[farside22]

I thought you said you had the revolver day3

It's Day 3 now. KMD has the Revolver.

Toog, why so sure BBT is scum?

I'm not

sure,

like I have proof or anything, but he's my biggest suspect based on activity since yesterday.

Current reads list:

Town
Farside
KMD
shos
gamma
Frozone
hiplop
BBT
Scum



I had the Revolver yesterday.

What night was this?

Kmd: you said there are 4 bullets left?

That was said yesterday, Day 2.

N0 had dagger heard shot and dropped it.
N1 no item

This is Farside's claimed item possessions. I doubt scum would claim to have had the murder item in their possession the night of the kill.

Your claiming I was next to the room that had the player was murdered and I held my item which is not the revolver.

Metal asked me if you claimed to have the Revolver. I posted the last thing I remember you saying about your items, and then mentioned that whoever had the Revolver was not likely going to claim it. I am of course insinuating that I thought you had the revolver because my POE lead me to believe it was the case. KMD claiming to not have had an item last night and that his Lead Pipe was two Nights ago actually puts a hole in my POE, but I'm standing by my analysis at the moment anyways.

Farside, any updates on your reads?

I need to verify something but I thought sl said there was 5 bullets left and toog claimed to drop it but he never said why so I'm looking at him.

I did state why. For the first two nights, I was simply stating "I move to this location." I was assuming I was taking my item with me each time, but I never stated what I was doing with my item.

On Night 0, I dropped the Wrench, and moved from the Conservatory to the Drawing Room where I found the Revolver. I did not intentionally drop the Wrench, and for a time, I thought it was due to the Poison that it was dropped. Day 1, I had the Revolver in my possession with 5 Bullets in it. Night 1, I moved from the Drawing Room to the Dining Room, in the process dropping the Revolver, which I had no intention of dropping. The mod PM'd me and reminded me that if I did not specifically state I was holding items, that I would auto-drop them, which was what happened in both the case of the Wrench and the Revolver.

I had no item Day 2, and last night I moved from the Dining Room back to the Drawing Room. Everyone was congregated around the Kitchen, and my intention is to get as far from there as I can at the moment. I believe that since we are all moving in a tight area in the Kitchen Corner, items aren't getting shuffled very efficiently, and it's likely a lot of items are on the opposite side of the house that is not getting any traffic.

Toog had the wrench n0 claimed to drop it and claimed the revolver with the same story.
2 players are dead that were killed with those items and his scum read is based on location not a scum read.

Anyone believing that story from toog at this point is scum or dumb

[farside22]

We also don't know who had the revolver and I doubt Toog would have even truthfully told us he had it the previous night and then used it for a kill last night. If he was doing that:
1)Why not use it N1?
2)Why not claim no item when he had it?

You are basically assuming he's the worst scum player ever. It's like coming into the thread on Day 2 of an open setup with a scum RB and no town RB and saying "hey guys I blocked XXXXX".

No one broadcasts the fact that they are scum.

Well

Almost no one. And I don't think Toog is that type.

Last night's kill pretty much had to be someone who picked up the revolver after Toog dropped it. That or he used it to kill Mollie, but flavor and Shos' info implies that was done with the wrench.

So for Toog to be scum:
A) He told us he had the revolver, waited a night to use it, and lied about accidently dropping the wrench N0 for no reason
Or
B) He had the revolver, didn't use it, and his scumbuddy picked it up after him and used it.

Toog is pretty much clear for the reasons that you are using to vote him.

[farside22]

I forgot to respond but he claimed day 1. He dropped the item do to a gun shot.
Found out that wasn't true and he forgot to send in hold and that did the same thing again night 1.
You seriously think anyone should buy that?

[farside22]

I agree with kmd. Farside you are making some serious accusations here

You believe in coincidences?

[farside22]

Ok maybe not that obvious


Yes, I do believe in coincidences.

Considering Steven universe were titus "knew" your role in the game I want you to explain why you believe toog.

[farside22]

What case?
Literally it was POE and next to X.
Followed by kmd that says that my read on toog is fake

[farside22]

Spoiler: game map

Player	N0	D1/N1	D2/N2	D3/N3	D4/N4	Additional Info
Schrodinger's Mislynch	Courtyard. Used revolver - shot ceiling.	Gazebo. Had candlestick.	DEAD.	DEAD.	DEAD.	Lynched D1.
pirate mollie	Library. Had and used candlestick, confirmed locations of Cheetory6 and Schrodinger's Mislynch.. Did not see Hiplop.	Kitchen.	DEAD.	DEAD.	DEAD.	Killed N1.
				DEAD.	DEAD.	Lynched D2.
				DEAD.	DEAD.	Killed N2.
LIVING PLAYERS:
shos	Billiard Room. Was actually in the Studio N0. Used poison on Library.	Library.	Kitchen. Has wrench - it has blood on it.
farside22	Dining Room. Had dagger, used.	Kitchen..	Trophy Room. Claimed holding item	in carriage house, held same item
Gammagooey	Drawing Room.	Dining Room.
Cheetory6	Kitchen.	Had no item.
Toogeloo	Conservatory. Held wrench -> was force dropped. (by Shos' poison?)	Drawing Room. Had the Revolver.
BlueBloodedToffee	Carriage Room.	Courtyard.
Kmd4390	Trophy Room.	Kitchen. Had Lead Pipe.	Dining Room.
hiplop	Initially claimed Courtyard. Then claimed Fountain.	Courtyard.	Drawing Room.

Item use:

Dagger

- protects a player or a room; can't be used on self

Poison

- target will drop the item it holds IF it chooses to hold it

Wrench

- user commutes, and can move anywhere on the map

Rope

-

Revolver

- Kills target. Has 6 bullets(5 after SM's ceiling shot)

Lead Pipe

-

Candlestick

- Shows to the user who is in the room with him and who is in adjacent rooms

Lateat update was ages ago

Also Im holding the dagger so the person saying I was next to the player and must have killed gammy should be asking if there is a cc

[farside22]

Shos you still around because I have a question for you

[farside22]

I am around only when Im in the apartments wifi
Why djdnt you ask in that poat?

Ms love im practically half conftown fpr funding the wrench the other night

Well here is my thoughts for a moment.

I think Toog is scum. Obviously with some post going on and my claim scum could hammer if it was any combo of UT or MS.
Not really trusting MS to be honest.
But Toog says he thought BBT was scum but instead of using that with yesterday he jumped on a weak reason to vote for me.
Still not caring about a CC either since my claim I noted.

But what I think is to do a no lynch but I think everyone needs to claim the rooms they are in today. IE: What room is everyone in as of day 3

Since really no other players have claimed items except me, you, toog and kmd I'm curious about those around that have not to ever claimed to receive or see an item since the game begin.

[farside22]

The more I think about this.

Unvote

[farside22]

Fozone was pretty MIA and you just read as sidelining to keep an argument going

[farside22]

Also saying you agree without explaining much you know always looks scummy to me

[farside22]

And toog asking for knowledge on the wrench is scummy too.

You realize that if I were scum, I'd know whether you used the Wrench or not, because you likely wouldn't be anywhere near the Kitchen in all likelihood. Nice dodge though. Just trying to prove that a shitty case is a shitty case, like when you attempted to paint me as scum on Day 1 for attempting to hold the Wrench in the first place (since only scum would hold on to items ).

How would you know he used the wrench as either alignment?

[farside22]

I asked him if he used the Wrench, I don't know for sure, but if I were scum, I'd know simply because he'd probably end up in a room he wasn't adjacent to. He thinks I'm scummy for asking if he used the Wrench, when in reality, as scum I wouldn't need to likely ask.

In one way if he has the wrench he can use it to be someone else but I don't see how it is scummy.

Shos you want to explain why toog's question is scummy?

[farside22]

Kmd- one miskill gets us an extra lynch. Hence no reaapn to NL.

Far - what qiestopn?

I asked him if he used the Wrench, I don't know for sure, but if I were scum, I'd know simply because he'd probably end up in a room he wasn't adjacent to. He thinks I'm scummy for asking if he used the Wrench, when in reality, as scum I wouldn't need to likely ask.

[farside22]

Before we no lynch can everyone please say where they are currently

[farside22]

Sorry

[farside22]

Toog/ms that is my final awnser to scum team.

Vote: no lynch

[farside22]

farside's play is shit and piss lately (no offense love) and I see votes piling there and I like that.

I fully expect to die tonight as the one person being widely townread. So when I'm gone take the time and work veeeery carefully guys.

No ones play this game is good.
That's not a joke.

[farside22]

Well I'm not scum and lynching a townie that can protect a player is pretty dumb.
More power to you

[farside22]

N0 had dagger heard shot and dropped it.
N1 no item

This is Farside's claimed item possessions. I doubt scum would claim to have had the murder item in their possession the night of the kill.

wait wtf?

farside why the fuck did you drop your doccing item on N0?

And are you saying that you have the dagger AGAIN?

Also this is the link to the previous game if anyone needs. We need to lynch scum to make this game longer than the other! lol
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=26324

I used the item N0 because I thought scum could kill and didn't get the memo till it was too late to change.
Yes I got the dagger again.
I got it night 2. I still have it.
No one else claimed an item so unless someone wants to fake a CC you should know I'm telling the truth

[farside22]

I said I dropped it because that was what the pm said I recieved that game day

[farside22]

I didn't know where anyone was so I ised it n0 on the drawing room.


Huh I didn't notice it said any player. Just looked and that's what it does. Which means I can protect any player anywhere.

[farside22]

know? not at all. your partner may have it. for all I know, or you. Still: why did you not use the dagger last night? and didn'y you say you DROPPED the dagger N0?

more from the QT:
The dagger can be used on any player. Which means that it does not need to be used on an Adjacent player.

Who else is a scum read if you believe this.
Because I still say MS do to meta.

[farside22]

WHY DID YOU NOT USE IT LAST NIGHT

I didn't know I could use it on anyone, anywhere.
I know that sounds shitty but I tend to half read things these days

[farside22]

That still does not explain shit.

Not everyone claimed where they were so I had no clue where I should use the dagger at.
Duh

[farside22]

Idc I'm telling the truth so you will just appologies after the game.

[farside22]

Metal Sonic, yes I have the revolver. Claimed that at the beginning of the day.

Toog, I'm not sure why you think I want to lynch Metal Sonic and shoot you considering I was voting Farside before the no lynch discussion.

Soooooo all in allI think we should lynch toog and have kmd shoot farside.but I'm still compiling and reading

Why'd you say this and not the other way around? My shot is only 40% accurate in that case where lynching farside but shooting toog would be 100%. Do you want me to miss or something?

I think me and Sonic slot should be safely called town

Why?

KMD. looking back, how do you think the hiplop wagon went through?

Well, my vote is obvious. I took mollie's result as a guilty. The rest depends on Farside's alignment. If she's town, she also believed hiplop to be scum. In that case, UT probably lazysheeped as scum. Gamma saw the momentum swing and said fuck it. And toog's hammer doesn't say much about him. If farside is scum, she took advantage of my tunnel, UT's lazysheep could be either town or scum and Gamma/toog are still the same. What do you think?

If you just got into a game and people told you to vote X because there's a guilty on him. Do you vote or just ask explanation?

I'd want to know details of what the guilty is and I'd want to know why the person wasn't lynched already. I feel like the only reason not to ask is if the guilty is on your scumbuddy and you want your name on the wagon for VCA.

Just shot ms when I flip town.

I know this boy like that back of my hand. He is not town.
The worse part about UT is he replaced BBT that did nothing this game either.
It's just makes me hate playing when I see others doing fuck all.
I still say toog is scum. I'd bet on ms for sure as scum.

[farside22]

So you'd be willing to switch to Metal Sonic?

yes.

But I still think a no lynch is best.

you said that... but i kicked your ass so hard in steven universe.. of couse you're going to get paranoid about me

It has nothing to do with that.

[farside22]

Hey Metal Sonic. What is your best guess at the scum team?

Heya, I think it's shos and bbt/UT, the bbt+ut slot has been consistently not in the game/apathetic, and a second time makes me think it could be a result of a role pm rather than the player

Shos is being overly helpful and that's part of his scum meta

You seemed content with your read on me and the bad case from Toog.
What happened with that?

[farside22]

What are you talking about?

the fact that two of my town reads are pushing you? Yeah I'm keeping that in mind. If it's not shos then you

You called me town, then said toog/kmd had a point, I asked what it was, your response, zilch

[farside22]

In yhat case you better shoot scum :/
If you are scum not with farside then itll be game over - youll just kill me and get it done.
If you are town and farside flips town, shoot ms or ut.

Still saying shoot m's.
Hope scum doesn't have the rope, im assuming by all the carefulness with my lynch scum doesnt

[farside22]

okay whatever I'm done

I think it's in farside/shos/kmd

toog and ms are strong townreads

This is so bad I wonder why you bother playing.
Kmd mayyyyybe scum but MS is for sure scum.
If kmd is scum my lynch means scum win.

Me I just don't care

[farside22]

On a completely unrelated note, UT if your town I really am curious to know why you bother playing mafia.
I have seen you do my trolling then playing that it really makes me wonder why you join games.

[farside22]

This is definitely not the fun player farside that I like playing with. I'm happy to lynch you, love

by now she's just trying to make her partner look good. All her posts should be treated as wifom when she flips.

The only reason there is a wagon is because I don't feel like arguing.

I'll flip town then you can just shove it.

[farside22]

okay whatever I'm done

I think it's in farside/shos/kmd

toog and ms are strong townreads

This is so bad I wonder why you bother playing.
Kmd mayyyyybe scum but MS is for sure scum.
If kmd is scum my lynch means scum win.

Me I just don't care

why is MS scum?

Lets see,

He said I was town and toog was town.
Then when the pressure was on me, suddenly wow good points by town and kmd. (What points he doesn't say)
He agree's with a no lynch, but hey look no one else is doing it so I'm going to unvote and wait it out and say nothing while players argue.

That is so classically scum play it's like the 101 of how to play scum and survive.

On a completely unrelated note, UT if your town I really am curious to know why you bother playing mafia.
I have seen you do my trolling then playing that it really makes me wonder why you join games.

seriously though, spare everyone the histrionics. I've heard everything from "you're literally the worst player ever" to "UT MVP" many times over. you're not going to get under my skin.

I just want a response when the game ends.

[farside22]

ok Farside you spamming that I am confirmed scum sounds like BS scum tunneling to me

I have given you many chances but since UT has Towned up a bit I am going to wing it

VOTE: farside (L-1) someone hammer

What ever you say scummy butt, I'm just responding to questions asked.

[farside22]

What are you talking about?

the fact that two of my town reads are pushing you? Yeah I'm keeping that in mind. If it's not shos then you

You called me town, then said toog/kmd had a point, I asked what it was, your response, zilch

And I'm just going to remind people about this.


Okay you can lynch me know.
Just a reminder about MS so KMD can shot him when I flip town.

[farside22]

I wasn't keeping count, I'm still town either way.
shoot MS

[farside22]

VOTE COUNT 3.03

With 6 alive it's 4 votes to Lynch.

Voting for:

shos(0):
farside22(2):

Toogeloo, shos

Toogeloo(0):
Metal Sonic(0):
Kmd4390(0):
Untrop Tripod(0):

No Lynch(2):

Metal Sonic, farside22

Not voting (2): Kmd4390, Untrod Tripod

Deadline is in (expired on 2015-10-29 09:30:00)

Yup, kmd voted and MS hammered.

Pretty much predictable scum behavior with shit reasons from scum MS there.

Good luck town.

Pretty sure it won't happen but I hope town can turn it around.

[farside22]

So, if you flip town, KMD is likely going to shoot the revolver tonight. She can target me at 100% hit rate, or she can shoot someone else at 40% chance. If she kills town it's automatically game over. What are the odds scum don't have an item to kill with tonight regardless?

If Scumside had the only item in scum hands, her partner may not have an ability to kill tonight.

You should explain your town read on ms tomorrow.

I just want a response when the game ends.

okay. if I'm wrong the response is "I misread you. sorry. I'm not perfect and I never claimed to be."

So should you.

That hammer was scummy and weak and anyone with half a brain should see that

[farside22]

So, if you flip town, KMD is likely going to shoot the revolver tonight. She can target me at 100% hit rate, or she can shoot someone else at 40% chance. If she kills town it's automatically game over. What are the odds scum don't have an item to kill with tonight regardles

,
I wasn't aware of my sex change...

The better comment is why he isn't saying shooting him would lose the game for the town, but that because he's scum, like I said

[farside22]

I'm not confident.
It's hard being confident when my reads have sucked most of this game but I feel comfortable with my scum reads.

[farside22]

Yeah I've got things to consider, including your flip. But if you are town, it means there is at least one scum in toog/UT/shos. If I figure it's Toog, the 100% accuracy is worth the trade off for my confidence Metal is scum because shooting and missing Metal can result in a scum win if they kill successfully which only requires one of them to have an item.

I thought about shos. I mean if he thought I might be scum, I'd think he'd push hard for my lynch over farside's because of the revolver.

In regards to shos his push reasoning was based solely on my claim for my item.
As I said neither MS or BBT ever claimed to recieve an item and how likely is that really?

Hint: none.

[farside22]

But in seriousness shot toog or ms.
Idc what he fucking says about the l-1.
That shit is weak.
In regards to shot sucess shot toog because he was s scum too

[farside22]

lol I really don't have any items

I find it hard to believe the whole game you never had one

[farside22]

lol I really don't have any items

it was an accident

anyway you were going to die eventually anyway

You were going to kill me.

I'm not talking this day phase, but I still think your lying

[farside22]

believe whatever you want, I wouldn't lie about that even if I was scum and you should've known that

You realize the number of item vs rooms and players left in the game and the player you replaced never had an item ever.


Right.
Pfft

[farside22]

ok Farside you spamming that I am confirmed scum sounds like BS scum tunneling to me

I have given you many chances but since UT has Towned up a bit I am going to wing it

VOTE: farside (L-1) someone hammer

And this vote and reasoning is a lie so saying never lying is a joke

[farside22]

cheet was circling in the kitchen and dining room. he walked backwards into rooms with no items

Why are we even arguing about this

Items dropped or used can end up anywhere.

[farside22]

Also because I'm town and I brlieve ms is scum.