Mini 1884 Danganronpa: Trigger Happy Havoc Mafia (Game Over)

[xyzzy]

VOTE: nahdia

assuming someone here has Byakuya as their role, that person is deffo scum. just sayin

[xyzzy]

VOTE: nahdia

assuming someone here has Byakuya as their role, that person is deffo scum. just sayin

Why? Byakuya isn't a culprit or the mastermind.

yeah but he's a shitnerd

[xyzzy]

also I assume there's not actually any direct correlation between factions and flavor because then the game would be breakable by mass claiming which character we are, which would be... sub par

[xyzzy]

the title of the thread??? I don't understand what purpose that would serve

[xyzzy]

also I assume there's not actually any direct correlation between factions and flavor because then the game would be breakable by mass claiming which character we are, which would be... sub par

Fakeclaims.

true. I actually had to go check just now how many characters there were and it was several more than I'd remembered, which makes it plausible that each non-town player has a unique fake claim given to them by the mod. in my mind I thought there were like 15 students, which would make giving each scum a fake claim very unlikely in a 13-player game, but I was off on that number.

I have a hunch that there still won't be that direct correlation, though. probably just a random-ish selection of characters

[xyzzy]

I claim non town

Cracked under the pressure, another scum caught.

"another"? you're getting ahead of yourself

[xyzzy]

anyway: firebringer is town. he fake claimed to throw scum off his trail

[xyzzy]

rude

[xyzzy]

what other reads though

[xyzzy]

i think in general xyzzy's posts have been putting it on a bit thick.

I tend to do that early game. it's half over thinking minor details and half being overly jokey about everything.

in general though I don't think it's reasonable to interpret things like making educated guesses about how flavor might tie in as scummy??? like if I were scum, it would be to my advantage to make sure actual discussion of anything gets stalled as long as possible

also my girlfriend just saw that I am in a mafia game about

Danganronpa

and called me a "huge fuckin' nerd". wow. rude

[xyzzy]

VOTE: nahdia

assuming someone here has Byakuya as their role, that person is deffo scum. just sayin

also I assume there's not actually any direct correlation between factions and flavor because then the game would be breakable by mass claiming which character we are, which would be... sub par

How did you get from "Byakuya is scum" to "no correlation between faction and flavor"????

the first statement was pretty obviously a joke

[xyzzy]

oh hey a doublevoter hi there

Dunnstral, can you confirm that the votecount is correct there

[xyzzy]

hmm.

[xyzzy]

hi

sup

[xyzzy]

Zach is doing nothing so far, could anyone with more experience with him explain if that is normal behavior for him?

in the other game I've played with him (mini normal 1787), he acted similarly and was town.

[xyzzy]

I'm drawing pretty much entirely from memory, and that was... 9-10 months ago? but a quick perusal of your ISO here doesn't give me a scum vibe from what I remember playing with you.

[xyzzy]

I actually think it's more likely we have 2 mafia and traitor. Has anyone else thought of this possibility?

I don't understand what would cause you to come to that conclusion.

I'm curious whether there's gonna be an Alter Ego in this game now???

also hi Alisae!

[xyzzy]

I feel like we're probably better off just scum hunting rather than trying to use something like Alisae's ability, but if we don't have a viable lynch candidate by the end of the day, I'm okay with going with that option.

[xyzzy]

I sometimes go back and reread like 10 pages at a time and write some analysis on what's typically about 10-20% of the posts so far. I'm doing that now. I'll post it in a bit. it'll also have a reads list!

[xyzzy]

13 (Shendu) -- I'm not a fan of this vote, for reasons I can't quite put a finger on
18 (Firebringer) -- Firebringer is town because of this post
24 (Nahdia) -- I don't think someone who's scum would make this post
26 (Shendu) -- Shendu is already reaching a lot
38 (gerryoat) -- I feel like if I were scum in this game, there's at least a chance that I'd try to avoid anyone seriously analyzing me by roleplaying really hard. 39 suggests that this is the sort of thing gerryoat does in a lot of games, so I'm not inclined to call it a scum tell, but I think it would make it easy to avoid actually looking at the substance of his posts.
46 (StarveVenom/Almost50) -- another post I don't quite like for reasons I can't put my finger on
52 (StarveVenom/Almost50) -- this feels town.
53 (Nahdia) -- I'm inclined to believe that the thing with Firebringer claiming scum is a town tell at best and a null tell at worst, and that overanalyzing it is probably a mistake.
68 (Zachstralkita) -- please do!!!
70 (xSoniaNevermindx) -- not the best first post I've ever seen.
74 (Nahdia) -- the whole exchange between StarveVenom and Nahdia makes both of them feel relatively town to me, but Nahdia moreso.
84 (Firebringer) -- I'm not a fan of this post. I'm not sure whether it's because it's scummy or because shipping real people (even when it's completely jokingly) is gross.
106 (notscience) "why are you being wagoned?" -- imo it's because I overanalyze probably pointless details in the early game a lot, and it tends to look awkward/fake.
108 (notscience) -- something doesn't feel right about this "99.9% sure" assertion regarding which characters compose the scum team.
111 (Nahdia) -- when that happens on page 100 it's scummy; when it happens on page 1, it's because there's very little to discuss.
126 (Firebringer) -- what game have we even played together? I don't recall this
128 (All Alone) -- this vote feels like a severe overreaction.
134 (Firebringer) -- Firebringer continues to feel town to me.
142 (Shendu) -- I get good vibes from the second half of this post.
148 (xSoniaNevermindx) -- this whole string of posts feels pretty scummy to me.
159 (Not_Mafia) -- I wish this post were more substantial, but it doesn't feel scummy to me.
175 (Zachstralkita) -- this is a town post.
186 (Firebringer) -- this is some weird speculation!
187 (Alisae) -- dropping this claim this early is a town tell.
190 (gerryoat) -- I feel like it's a little weird that there are people assuming that whomever killed TellTaleHeart is scum . if they're either a town day vig or a third party player, then they would have strong reason not to claim responsibility for the kill. an argument could definitely be made that the flavor suggests we won't have any town killing roles, but I feel like there's a lot of weird assumptions here.
192 (gerryoat) -- this is a bizarre fucking post.
214 (gerryoat) -- I'm getting the sense that gerryoat specifically wants people to believe that scum was responsible for that kill, which is weird.
216 (Alisae) -- Alisae is probably town.
224 (Alisae) -- which part of my post 197 do you think is rolefishing?
225 (gerryoat) -- I think it's worth noting that there's absolutely nothing in the death scene there that actually suggests any of the flavor things that you're implying.
240 (Firebringer) -- I agree with this conclusion.
244 (Alisae) -- hey, Alisae, why didn't you mention the fact that your role applies to daykills as well from the very beginning?
251 (Alisae) -- this is a valid point; it's extremely unlikely that someone would come up with that fakeclaim that quickly.

town
Firebringer
Nahdia, Alisae, Zachstralkita, Not_Mafia
Almost50, Shendu
All_Alone, xSoniaNevermindx, notscience
gerryoat
scum

[xyzzy]

VOTE: gerryoat

[xyzzy]

btw

[xyzzy]

xyzzy the alter ego comment came off as a bit role fishy to me.
Also I said I had to die in the day in 210 so I thought I was implying here daykill was okay too. Why does it matter that I didn't say it later.

Also Fire is not town for 18. Let's not townread people for shit reasons.
Link: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=69859

@46 + 52
>Doesn't like a post
>Thinks their town in a post later.

@84 why are you saying this considering he's your highest townread?

@214 why do you think scum garry would say this?

how familiar are you with the flavor here? basically, Alter Ego is an AI version of Chihiro who offers help to the rest of the characters after Chihiro's death, so I doubt anything Alter Ego-related in the game now would actually be connected to any living players.

re:210, I was asking why you didn't mention that before the daykill happened; 210 was after that had happened.

re:18, that was a pretty loose gut read, but that's the sense I got from it.

re:46/52, just because I find one post from a particular player scummy doesn't mean I'm going to find every single post from that player scummy; noting which posts stand out to me in which way seems more useful than focusing on just the good or just the bad

re:84, same thing. even the player who I see as Most Town is probably going to have at least one thing I find a little off.

re:214, I think this could plausibly be from third party gerryoak. scum gerryoak probably wouldn't have a good reason to do that, but that doesn't make it a town tell by any means under the circumstances.

How is that a town post xyzzy? LMAO


I mean I'm glad you know I'm town but

it just feels town to me, I can't really put my finger on it. idk sometimes I just feel ways about things

VOTE: Shendu


Narrative seems manufactured tbh

Uh huh.

@Xyzzy:

Why is Not_Mafia a townlean? What do you find towny about 159?

I just feel like if I were mafia making that post I would try to either a)add some sort of fake justification for it so it feels ~defensible~ or b)not make the statement sound so confident.

I don't like the post above me!

can you offer any further obligation on this?

1. gerryoat
2. XSoniaNevermindx
3. Zachstralkita

4. Almost50

5. Nahdia

6. notscience

7. Shendu

8. Firebringer

9. Not_Mafia
10. xyzzy
11. All Alone

12. Alisae

All Alone is up my tier list, xyzzy has fallen down.

VOTE: Zach

I don't understand how to interpret this list!!!

the Zachstralkita wagon feels a little out of nowhere. I'm not sure yet how I feel about it.

[xyzzy]

question for anyone who cares to answer: if someone other than you or me was lynched, who would you want it to be?

[xyzzy]

on the one hand, I'd be totally okay with a notscience lynch, but on the other hand, 2/3 people on it are people I'm scum reading. hmmmmmmmmmmmm

[xyzzy]

Why do you even need to state that? Seems like theatre instead of actual internal debate. Why not ask the scumreads why they are voting notscience?

I'm a lot more interested in knowing what the people I'm

not

scum reading think of the notscience wagon. it's possible my read on notscience is wrong and that my other scum reads are right, in which case your suggestion would result in bad data.

[xyzzy]

2 deaths so far, Alisae wants to be lynched because of a semi-investigative role that triggers on death that occurs during the day, Firebringer is town, some people are scum, game is not bastard

[xyzzy]

okay but why intentionally ruin it immediately

[xyzzy]

yeah 4 whole minutes gee

[xyzzy]

notscience, just to clarify, if you target a vanilla goon with your vanilla cop power, does it return a vanilla result, or is it only vanilla townies that return that result?

[xyzzy]

this conversation between Firebringer and MariaR is incredibly unproductive

p-edit: I've hit the submit button 3 times now and every time there's a new post
p-edit: 4 times

[xyzzy]

re: theorizing about more deaths today, I think it's definitely notable that we've had 2 deaths during day 1 and that both of the players who've died so far had powers that worked during the day, including one that exclusively worked during the day, on top of Alisae's claim. also, I only just noticed this, but it's interesting that the second death didn't extend the deadline, which implies some mechanical difference between the two of them.

[xyzzy]

I completely forgot about that

[xyzzy]

xyzzy explain your townread on me or i will break my vow of lynching alisae today.

I just find a lot of the posts you've made really... genuine-y? my town reads are usually "here's a vibe I have" whereas my scum reads are usually "these are specific posts that seem off to me"

[xyzzy]

I can absolutely promise you we're not gonna no lynch

[xyzzy]

yeah post 707 isn't a very great post

it's setup theorizing-type stuff, but none of it is specifically scummy, and I don't think the assertion that those posts are just there to fuel paranoia is accurate.

[xyzzy]

well, I'm town, so obviously lynching me is a mistake, so how about I just kill someone who I'm scum reading who other people have also scum read?

VOTE: shendu

hopefully this is the right choice!

[xyzzy]

on the first day, if I vote for someone on the last cycle, they automatically die. same is true for second day and second to last and so on. so we're in twilight now. sorry for the lack of clarity, typing on my phone

[xyzzy]

Celestia Ludenberg.

also I'm not convinced at this point the information we stand to gain from lynching you is worth it

[xyzzy]

I lied slightly in my claim to try to draw a scumkill to myself (assuming there was a scumkill, which I was speculating there might not be yesterday), because the role as I described it is probably too powerful for anyone to be comfortable with me being left alive, but that didn't work, so I don't particularly see any reason to keep up the lie. my ability is 1-shot and it starts at the 11th cycle rather than being specifically based on which day it is.

ideally, I was hoping to avoid being high on anyone's town reads so that I wouldn't be a strong scum read, because if the game came down to 3 players left with me, another town player, and a scum player, all I'd need to do is convince the other town player to hold off on voting until the very last minute and it'd be an auto-town win, but I also had the contingency plan of using it if a)I risked being lynched myself or b)we risked no lynching. obviously, I ended up having to do that, so since I'm effectively vanilla now, I claimed in such a way as to hopefully convince scum to kill me.

I'd say what we should do today is wait until the 11th cycle begins, and then I'll self-vote to prove that me saying that my previous claim was a partial lie isn't some kind of further gambit.

at this point my strongest scumread is gerryoat; I considered voting for him at the end of the day yesterday, but I decided that going with someone who others had scumread was probably better for the town as a whole. that being said, it's probably a good idea to lynch Alisae today.

[xyzzy]

Celestia Ludenberg.

[xyzzy]

unless we only have 2 scum, we're in mylo now, which means an Alisae lynch is no longer safe. so that's a thing to keep in mind.

also cool all my scum reads in this have have been hot garbage

[xyzzy]

Scum is Zach and xyzxyzxyzyxzyzyxyxyzxyzxyzyxyzxyzxyzxyzyxzyxzyxyzyzyzyxyzxyzxyzxyzxyzyxyzxyzxyxyzx

I feel like this is scum!NM taking the easy way out.

I kinda feel the same way

[xyzzy]

I also feel like beeboy is flying completely under the radar and I'm uncomfortable with that

[xyzzy]

let's not lynch Zachstralkita b/c that's dumb ok

[xyzzy]

nice

[xyzzy]

Zachstralkita what do you think about each of the people on your wagon right now?

[xyzzy]

I've been town reading both Firebringer and Zachstralkita but MariaR makes a really compelling argument for them being scum together... hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[xyzzy]

the point she made in 1205 is a really strong one

[xyzzy]

that's a pretty severe overreaction there. I haven't even committed to a vote yet, so that vote just feels really jumpy.

[xyzzy]

content soon

same

[xyzzy]

given that we're in lylo (unless for some reason there's no kill tonight), I think a mass claim might be a good idea. it's also possible that no lynching is the right choice today.

[xyzzy]

Well Fire. The game is in your hands.
I doubt scum are going to wait to use their daykill and if they do it's going to be on you.
I'd use it on NM?

I think I agree with all of this.

[xyzzy]

it's possible that the mafia still have a daykill even at lylo, in which case this plan just results in a loss if Firebringer hits someone who's town, but I feel like the correct move here is for Firebringer to desperad...ize someone

I have to imagine that there's no daykill at lylo though because that would just be really dumb

[xyzzy]

yeah that would make literally no sense at all

[xyzzy]

Not_Mafia, why would Alisae have claimed that way as scum?

also, who do you think the other scum is? why do you think the rest of the players are town?

[xyzzy]

tbh if it is a bluff I'll kind of be suspicious of Firebringer but I really don't think it's a bluff because that would be a terrible bluff to make this late in the game

[xyzzy]

tbh if it is a bluff I'll kind of be suspicious of Firebringer but I really don't think it's a bluff because that would be a terrible bluff to make this late in the game

holy moly

????? what do you mean

[xyzzy]

fair enough

[xyzzy]

because if so it stifled discussion of the game at a pretty critical point. like if he claimed Desperado and targeted a kill at someone but it was actually all just a goof then that would mean a significant amount of time got spent discussing something completely pointless when we don't have time to waste

I'm not saying it would be Absolutely For Sure Scummy because I'd want to hear what he had to say about it before drawing any conclusions, but it would be something that slowed the game down

[xyzzy]

welp

[xyzzy]

I would disagree that he slowed discussion down

we spent a couple pages and a couple days discussing very little else besides that

I don't think "did Firebringer waste time by doing that" is a discussion where either of us is bound to make an argument that sways the other's opinion until we get an explanation from him though

p-edit: okay I can see the logic behind doing that, Firebringer. and I don't think I can reasonably cast aspersions on someone for strategic fake claiming in an attempt to get a scum kill to move in the right direction, given that I did that twilight of day one. what's your actual role?

[xyzzy]

Not_Mafia, why would Alisae have claimed that way as scum?

I just realized I never got an answer to this, and I'd also like to direct the question to MariaR

[xyzzy]

I just realized I misread MariaR's last post; I saw "Nahdia" and my brain interpreted it as "Alisae"

whoops

[xyzzy]

I'd be really frustrated if this was 2 serial killers, because that would make this game just objectively not a game of mafia, because then there's no informed minority. so I hope that possibility isn't the case. I hope, though, that any competent reviewer would give that a huge red flag, and if they somehow approved it, I'd hope it would come with the caveat of advertising the game as being a bastard game.

also, the way my role worked was, once the 11th broadcast cycle started, if I was voting for someone already or if I voted for someone at any point after that, they would be lynched and the day would end. it's sort of a pseudo-1-shot day vigilante, with caveats based on when it can be used each day and that I can't vote for anyone without killing them once it's active and that it ends the day.

I could for Almost50 largely because he was someone who has already very nearly gotten lynched, and while I was starting to scum read him myself at that point, I didn't really feel like it would be in the town's best interest to pick someone just because

I

thought they were scum—because I effectively robbed the town of lynching someone, just going off of my gut seemed like a really bad plan.

p-edit: hooray for confirmation that the 2 serial killers theory is invalid \('_')/

[xyzzy]

yeah

also I mixed up Almost50 and Shendu in that last post, whoops. I had to go back and check the OP because I honestly couldn't remember everything that happened day 1, and I read the wrong name, I think mostly due to the fact that the bright yellow for most of the dead players is impossible to read on mafSilver. possibly also related it's the fact that it's 6:45 am and I have not slept yet???

[xyzzy]

I'm gonna ISO and write a post by post thing for N_M because he's by far the person I have the least read on. I might do the same for other people later?

[xyzzy]

that didn't take long because Not_Mafia hasn't made very many posts at all and almost all of them are just him hopping on whatever wagon is in vogue at the moment

Spoiler:

VOTE: All Alone

All Alone is All Scum

this is one of the few votes he makes that isn't 1)completely inexplicable or 2)bandwagoning, but he makes no effort to push that slot at all for the rest of the game, which makes it feel really half-hearted

I have like no reads can someone scum it up please?

this is really lazy, but I'm conflicted about it; I feel like it would be really easy for him as scum to at least just pick a name out of a hat and say "I'm town reading so-and-so". saying that you have absolutely no reads almost feels too blatant to be scummy in a way? I could be misreading the situation here

VOTE: xuxyxzxzzxyuxzxyxzxcyxzxxyxxxzxyU

this is the first of a number of opportunistic wagon votes with absolutely no other contribution.

VOTE: ns

[xyzyzyzxyzyxyzyxyxyzyxyxyyxyxyzyx[/v]

these are more of those.

Whatever I'm hammering for real

VOTE: NotScience

I kind of like this vote? idk it's certainly something scum could do but I feel like this type of baiting a reaction by faking a hammer feels town.

VOTE: alisae

this is technically a wagon vote, although I feel like votes on Alisae day 1 should be treated as a unique case? like they're not necessarily scum motivated

VOTE: Shendu

more opportunistic wagon voting.

I know how to catch scum NM.
First people need to interact with him.

Interaction is icky

is this typical N_M play? I don't know his meta, but this seems to suggest that this total lack of interaction is kind of a schtick, in which case... ugh, that would be annoying.

VOTE: Nahdia

out of all the opportunistic wagon votes, this is the one I like the least. like to to his ISO and ctrl-f Nahdia. 1339 posts into the game and his only reaction with them was an RVS vote, and this just feels... very artificial

Goodbye Firebringer

I don't really know how to interpret this post, but it's probably the most important post in terms of getting a read on him.

I think that's the first vote on me all game xD

Is this something town keeps track of?

this is literally the first post he's made that doesn't feel extremely half-hearted.

I went from "not sure how to feel about N_M" to "ready to lynch him" really quickly tbh. the fact that he's made so few contributions made me not really notice him until now?

VOTE: Not_Mafia

[xyzzy]

I just checked and the only person Almost50 expressed any town read on who's still alive is Alisae. I think it's worth considering who he might've targeted, since they had to be scum and are therefore still alive.

[xyzzy]

well yes obviously he didn't use it on notscience or Shendu. there's a very slim chance he used it on Alisae, though, as unlikely as I find that. in general, though, we should assume it got used on someone he was town reading, because that's the tactically correct play for that role.

[xyzzy]

also I assume there's not actually any direct correlation between factions and flavor because then the game would be breakable by mass claiming which character we are, which would be... sub par

Fakeclaims.

true. I actually had to go check just now how many characters there were and it was several more than I'd remembered, which makes it plausible that each non-town player has a unique fake claim given to them by the mod. in my mind I thought there were like 15 students, which would make giving each scum a fake claim very unlikely in a 13-player game, but I was off on that number.

I have a hunch that there still won't be that direct correlation, though. probably just a random-ish selection of characters

Why don't you just say you have a Scummy sounding character but you claim Town?

Btw, AS ALWAYS, I have no idea about the flavour. I just love to play themed games none-the-less.

alisae is town for the claim
gerryoat's kill theory is dumb he's town for thinking it
zach dumbtold really bad
VOTE: Zachstralkita

I don't even know what you're talking about but I feel something is off about Zach in this game.

VOTE: Zach

I think Shendu is Creature guys.

Aren't we all? You funny little creature

Why are you Town reading notty?

Someone's not reading!

these are all the posts where he interacts with non-dead people other than Alisae, btw. the majority of his posts are talking to Alisae.

[xyzzy]

Alright class, it's Execution Time!

Role Call

Zachstralkita (5): MariaR, Alisae, Accountant, Firebringer, Nahdia
xyzzy (1): Not_Mafia

Not Voting (2): xyzzy, Zachstralkita

With 8 players it takes 5 to lynch

Zachstralkita has been lynched

unfortunately, due to how my role ended day 1, this is probably the only votecount that can really provide any really fruitful information. it'd probably be worthwhile to put together a list of every vote for confirmed town players, but that's not something I personally have the time to do at the moment. maybe later?

but fwiw I feel like you all should treat me and Not_Mafia as being very unlikely to be mafia together; the odds that literally everyone on this wagon was town feels really low, and we were the only ones not voting for him.

p-edit: that's a really, really good point, MariaR. Alisae's claim preceded Almost50 even replacing into the game. I guess that pretty much guarantees that he didn't target him...

[xyzzy]

it's too 3 am for me to try to figure out who I should treat as confirmed town based on voting last night. I'll do that when it's less 3 am than it is right now

one question, though: Nahdia wrote this post:

THE PAGE KEEPS CRASHING AS I TRY TO POST WHAT'S HAPPENING

was anyone else having difficulty at that time making posts go through? because if so that throws off a lot of that and analysis

[xyzzy]

so since she hasn't hammered I can treat MariaR as confirmed town

also Nahdia hasn't ever been at L-1 today, so any PoE based on that assumption is invalid

[xyzzy]

oh yeah Alisae has been in my "basically confirmed town" category all day but I guess that makes it Official

[xyzzy]

my vote for Not_Mafia is based almost entirely on his ISO being terrible

[xyzzy]

I think it would've made a lot of sense to switch the scum daykills to days 2 and 3. that would've nudged the town power up by a bit. theoretically, a 2:11 setup where the town has a lot of power but the mafia gets significantly more kills than usual can work, but it would've worked out better if a scum win relied on them being able to hold out for a day or two rather than them getting a big advantage early on.