Mini 1953: XP Mafia (Game Over)

[Ghostlin]

Vote: Raya36

Because it's my least favorite part of the game, RVS.

[Ghostlin]

Not everyone enjoys shitting up the thread to get the game to begin, NMS. Although, the irony of Sempai already noticing me isn't lost on me. Does that mean I'm the tsundere?

[Ghostlin]

why does that mean you vote raya?

ftr, I fucking hate RVS too, and often break it ASAP

....Because I chose a name at random? Not even a randomizer. I'm like going 'I can't be bothered to even roll dice right now and I don't know 90% of this player list, so...this one.'

I just could barely bother to care, I'm waiting for us to be able to really be able to interact with shit.

[Ghostlin]

I'm one of those people who hates voting no lynch outside of a mylo situation. It's anti-town and mostly anti-wincon. It may not matter anyway, I guess we're voting to block versus actually VOTING.

Preview: No, I literally don't give a shit about this part of the game.

I do care what you might feel about me not caring considering that might go somewhere.

[Ghostlin]

Maki sounds pointlessly fatalistic considering if we block correctly we could deprive scum XP to activate any powers; and upgrades. We could also pressure a player to stop them from getting their role upgraded, which is also a mechanic in this game.

[h]Maki Harukawa[/h]

Sorry, but this is so fucking anti-town it kind of hurts.

[Ghostlin]

HURT: Mari Harukawa

[Ghostlin]

Really, guys, if we don't have a voting mechanic, we should be using a blocking one to track wagons and reads so we can detect lying scums in future Days. It's really a shitty idea to just end the day.

[Ghostlin]

I can't tell if Maria is bad or just chainsawing gerry

Probably chainsawing with the eagerness to end the day earlier.

[Ghostlin]

I like Vijay's arguments and am getting a Town read off them.

I am also content with my block on Maki; the gerry and NMS fight seems to be a bunch of crap fighting: gerry seems to be one of those players that's like your little brother that gets in your bubble really close: "I'm not touching you. I'm not touching you. MOM, he hit me." I'm super not buying the SR crap as anything more than gut.

LMS, what are your feelings on Maki?

[Ghostlin]

as long as I haven't given off the "omg this guy is a jerk" impression, I'm happy

This reads 'I want people to like me' which seems overly concerned about image in this game.

It's a game. While I don't believe in insulting folks directly, I am fond of the swears and attacking crap logic; and it's really nothing personal. Most of the time. I've flipped tables before; but I dare you to find a scummer that hasn't. I don't hate people in this game, I've never played with most of you (except mastina).

This just seems bizarrely appeasing and again, caring what people think.

[Ghostlin]

^See, this is much better. I can WORK with this. People who care too much about not coming off as an asshole aren't going to push in the direction needed to push in, at the very least, and are afraid to use it as a scumsonia at the very worst. Is it a highscumread? Fuck no. Is it something that might ping me on page 10 of Day 1 when you have literally fucking anything elses? Sure.

[Ghostlin]

I don't agree with that, fundamentally. At all. Yes, working together and admitting you're wrong is one thing, but going 'hey, guys, this is a cheeky scumfuck and we should lynch it' for example when everyone else seems to be reticent because they want to lynch 'better' scum, or refusing to stick your ground on position and being a bit of an ass about it reeks Town to me.

[Ghostlin]

Maki seems to be trying to deflect suspicion anyway she can, a position she adopted after trying to end Day on page 3; you seem to be powertunnelling, but that's not a scum thing particular when you've caught scum, and Vijay's provided the most cogent commentary as probably the most protown read of the three of you.

The one I don't understand is gerry vs. LMS; I can't read either one, even though I know mastina (although I don't know Jae). You wanna help with some insight I'm missing there?

[Ghostlin]

247: Now I understand you. Although I've never done that. *cough*often. *cough*in many games.

[Ghostlin]

So briefly: I think Ginnige's town and the whole "they didn't understand my read" is sorta asinine, but I'm finding the SR thing kinda asinine too, if null.

[Ghostlin]

I'd adore the opportunity to sort the other 7 players in this game, tho. Where are you guys?

[Ghostlin]

Dreal: the real question is what are the protown and antitown reasons Ginnigie would be fishing for role info, and is it likely to be more one than the other? Because I see no really good reason to out PRs day 1...

[Ghostlin]

I'm literally now confused, which generally comes when I'm trying to post between stuff since I'm trying to post while doing school stuff. Also, if yurkin was rolefishing, the last post reads as pretty fucking deflection-y.

[Ghostlin]

It feels like sarcasm while at the same time an attempt to slip suspicion to maki for some reason. Idk if its deliberate but it is scummy.

In other news, Eevielution Army gets a town cookie and is probably town (although we need more posts from someone who's not Jae/gerry/Ginngie/me/Maki/Dreal/NMS).

[Ghostlin]

Dreal: if you're really willing to block gerry or maki, why are you still on 'end the day' as an option? Ending the day garners us no information.

[Ghostlin]

NMS, how is you screaming about gerry anything but noise at this point? He's not going down today, at least right fucking now. YES, you can scumread him, but Yurkin seems to be the play right now. What do you feel about Yurkin?

[Ghostlin]

Oh, I totally missed the LMS/gerry fight shitting up the thread. Thanks. [/sarcasm]

[Ghostlin]

544: Gerry: one of the posts you quoted was me bitching at NMS to focus on an actual block today instead of you; the other was sarcastic bitching about the two of you shitting up the thread. Yes, I've done a lot of bitching, but those pieces of bitching are at least complimentary.

[Ghostlin]

Also, Ginngie's last two posts are EXACTLY how the fuck I'm feeling about the entire NMS/Gerry fight.

[Ghostlin]

except for gerry

Weren't you scum reading gerry? Why wouldn't you block him?

[Ghostlin]

HURT: yurkin. I'm not necessarily buying the NMS meta case, their refusal to talk about most anything else is turning me off, and yurkin's role fish/sarcastic reply already turned me off.

[Ghostlin]

Yurkin is at B-1, fyi.

[Ghostlin]

Ok, I actually do tr you... I misspoke

Let's focus the vote between NMS and Gerry today, I don't like the Yurkin votes as I don't think that really helps us, come make this happen with me

Block: Gerry

Why are you trying to pinch us into voting between 2 players? What's your read on them is it TvS to you I don't get why it must be these 2

Yeah, rereading this thread, I'm not sure why we were setting up this false dichotomy. There's a number of options that aren't NMS/gerry/yurkin related as of this post.

[Ghostlin]

I know it feels like NMS/gerry are the important people in this thread but you know, others might be playing this game too.

[Ghostlin]

Well, considering I started the day on Maki, it's pretty safe to say I've tried at least ONE of the other options route, and I find yurkin scummy, unlike NMS or gerry which is unproductive. And I sure as fuck don't want to vote you or Ginngie, who I find town.

[Ghostlin]

So Maki gets to play kingmaker, unless my math's completely off (blockmaker?) with Eevie's vote.

[Ghostlin]

[Block] yurkin (6)- gerryoat, Vijarada, Vaxkiller, Raya36, Ginngie, Ghostlin
[Block] gerryoat (6)- NoticeMeSenpai, drealmerz7, Dunnstral, yurkin, Assemblerotws, EeveeLution Army

This is wrong and I fixed it for you, but since you blocked Gerry, it doesn't matter anyway.

[Ghostlin]

Although whatever happened to "I'll block anyone...except Gerry"?

[Ghostlin]

ah, the "will be kept separately from the lynch vote" made me think there was possibly a lynch going on

soya, HURT: gerryoat, if you not voting to block same player as D1, I want to know why

This is anti-town and stupid.

thanks for telling us, scum, what did you have to do to accumulate enough to make the kill?

sounding to me like dunn+gerry have discussed some things over Night

This is anti-town, stupid, and making me question if dreal isn't actually gerry's partner. This attack is not only over the top, it can be debunked as stupid by reading the fucking rules thread.

It is public knowledge that the Mafia's factional kill costs XP to carry out.

That's post

two

of this thread. It took me

five seconds

to find.

this is one of those games where I have a whole big pile of "don't care if this dies / would vote it for lynch" and we can't even lynch

the horror...the horror....

I find vij, maki, gerry, ghost, assembler of the weak sauce, yurkin, eevee, dunnstral, all worth dead-ifying

soya, I'm easy, let's goooo

raya, where you at?!

i refuse to believe there is only 3 maf this game. i can barely tr anyone this game

*sings* ~Both of these things are exactly like the other. Both of these things are scum keeping their options opeeennn...can you tell me which one of these two should be blocked today before I finish my song?~ It's literally the same thought, the same lack of scum hunting...

Why aren't we blocking dreal today? He voted to End Day 1, something I gave Maki shit for. He's on the shittest of our three options, self-watcher. If I look up 'anti-town' in the MS dictionary, I can probably find a picture of dreal underneath it.

HURT: dreal

[Ghostlin]

Vote: Rolecop.

[Ghostlin]

This is anti-town, stupid, and making me question if dreal isn't actually gerry's partner. This attack is not only over the top, it can be debunked as stupid by reading the fucking rules thread.

so you think i'm mafia now?

Yes.

Or to put it another way, I was ignoring certain signs because to me...Your fight with NMS was just noise. It didn't inform me of your play style; but after reading post after post of how you've been complaining people have not been interacting with you that it made me realize...you're not really doing much, are you? And you're looking for excuses to not do much. Now, I do not believe you're as scum as dreal is right now; I would really much rather block/lynch dreal, but your trajectory is worsening while, for a good example, Dunn's is increasing. He's running through implications, making plans, trying to actively solve this game; and I thought he'd be a worthless slot that we'd have to deal with Day 2.

Now, I'm pretty shit sure that someone is going to snarkly point out that dreal and gerry always do this, and to them I say, 'so fucking what?' If it smells like a scum and looks like a scum, then you might as well lynch it.

[Ghostlin]

This is anti-town, stupid, and making me question if dreal isn't actually gerry's partner. This attack is not only over the top, it can be debunked as stupid by reading the fucking rules thread.

so you think i'm mafia now?

Yes.

Or to put it another way, I was ignoring certain signs because to me...Your fight with NMS was just noise. It didn't inform me of your play style; but after reading post after post of how you've been complaining people have not been interacting with you that it made me realize...you're not really doing much, are you? And you're looking for excuses to not do much. Now, I do not believe you're as scum as dreal is right now; I would really much rather block/lynch dreal, but your trajectory is worsening while, for a good example, Dunn's is increasing. He's running through implications, making plans, trying to actively solve this game; and I thought he'd be a worthless slot that we'd have to deal with Day 2.

Now, I'm pretty shit sure that someone is going to snarkly point out that dreal and gerry always do this, and to them I say, 'so fucking what?' If it smells like a scum and looks like a scum, then you might as well lynch it.

so why don't you SR NMS? they were the one who started the argument making the noise, all i did was defend myself. but what is it that "i always do?"

Because I have some experience with mastina, and if I'm going to accept you're scum, it's really quite possible that NMS is Town. Why? Because mastina hates the bus. She even wrote a think piece on the whole thing for the goddamn wiki: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Stop_Bussing!

The relevant section here:

Towns win because of bussing!
And an incredible number of scum wins are a result of not bussing.

Or more accurately, strategically bussing. Which doesn't mean, "Oh, you're clearly going down, so I'll get the towncred by joining your lynch". That's not strategy; it's stupidity: you'll get no towncred from it. I also don't mean, "hardcore tunnel on a scumbuddy"; that's also painfully transparent to any half-way competent town. Strategy means running the risk-reward carefully.

In fact, there's a game where I played Mason with her here: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=30724. She spent a not-considerable amount of time in the dead thread laughing at at the scums because they powerbussed most of them dead. She might be scum and you be Town except for a rather uncomfortable fact that NMS as a

hydra has done more scumhunting

than you. I think she'd rather literally eat shit than participate in what would be an amount of powerbussing on you.

The only other scenario is somehow you're both Town and this was a Town v. Town fight all along. So? I don't have any proof that you're town, and your behavior is making me go 'mmm...looks like scum.' If the whole 'might be Town, better not vote/block' I'd get exactly nothing fucking done. So when you're done OMGUS speculating because I couldn't choose a side Day 1, enjoy the possibility that I'll be rooting for you eating rope when we finally get a lynch, with dreal.

[Ghostlin]

so you two think that im scum with dreal who is tunneling me? lol

this game is laughably bad

You don't think dreal would powerbus? Heck, it wouldn't really be a powerbus, it'd be a power drive by with the number of people he's apparently OK with seeing dead.

[Ghostlin]

so what makes me groupscum over SK then by that logic?

Why would it matter, both scums and SK are anti town and should eat flaming rope.

[Ghostlin]

because you're talking about me busing...

Right, to debunk Gerry's assertion that you'd NOT be scum together.

Let me frame this another way: I can easily believe you'd manufacture town cred by bussing gerry and being right about it because gerry's really a popular target and has made himself one since Day 1, hence the block. But if you were an SK (which doesn't exist

explicitly

in this game, so your question makes even less sense) bussing a scum, it wouldn't matter because in that universe

you're both scum

.

This is sort of like asking 'if I'm a different scum faction in a muitiball, would that give you pause?' No, unless I'm deliberately playing in the way, in the chance that Hell froze over and I needed your faction alive, you're still both scum.

I don't believe in chaining SKs/other mafia. They're still scum.

[Ghostlin]

A consideration then, and hopefully something to actually talk about:

I have a theory that the reason we've not lynched yet is for balance/game utility concerns. Normally, at the start of Day 3, there'd be 4 people dead; 2 lynches, 2 scum shots (ignoring the existence of a Town Vig, or an SK) The game would be at nine players alive, and if town mislynches twice, it'd normally be 6:3.

In this game, it'll be 8:3 (without some surprise), which is eleven people alive. I feel the reason why this is is that upgrading is an important (crucial) part of this game. Hence why all the Day blocking the first 2 Day cycles. You hit scum, they can't upgrade. (There's another consideration since the game rules tell us the factional kill costs XP, but I'll get to that in a minute).

So the blocks aren't here to make us hate the mod/our lives because we really want to lynch, but it allows unblocked players to gather XP to upgrade so they can actually do it Night 3 if they want. With 11 alive, by Day 3:

--If both blocks hit scum, town will most likely have nearly 7 people to upgrade (Gin probably used her power last night); scum will have 0--they have to spend XP to NK, and maybe MAYBE won't be able to kill Night 2 (we don't know what powers the mod gave scum).

--If a block hits a scum and a town, town will most likely have nearly 6 people to upgrade; scum maybe have 1, again with the above considerations.

--If BOTH blocks hit Town, town will most likely have nearly 5 people to upgrade; scum might have 2, but definitely will have 1.

This ignores other factors, but they can be accounted for.

I would argue, then,

most

of the Town, should do the following:
*Vote for the best ability to use post Upgrade if your role upgraded turns out to be limited utility--I think that's Role Cop. I think Fruit Vendor is a funny role, but I'm not sure it helps us here, for example.
*Train tonight.
*Upgrade Night 3.

The exception is if you have a role NOW with already awesome utility that costs XP and you have the XP to do it, you should; this includes most protective/blocking roles and investigative roles that return alignment relevant information (Cop, Gunsmith, etc).

[Ghostlin]

^ And you guys can't handle me?

[Ghostlin]

assemblerotws: otws = of the weak sauce

you are now assembler of the weak sauce

Stupidest joke about names I've seen so far, although I intend to level out of weaksauce.

@mod please prod NoticeMeSenpai, Vaxkiller, Ginngie, Assemblerotws, and yourself.

It hasn't been long enough for me to get prodded.

@mod Between these two posts by Assemlerotws, was there ever a time where he would have been eligible to receive a prod as outlined in the rules?

Does this matter? People spacing the game's existence doesn't seem to be alignment indicative.

[Ghostlin]

I don't like that mastina is alive and ginggie/dunnn are dead.

Why? The majority of NMS's play has been screaming how scum gerry is. The longer Gerry remains alive and NMS does, the more noise it generates for scum to hide in.

Mastina's not such an epic mafia god that scum wouldn't use that WIFOM.

[Ghostlin]

Is dreal scum? We dont AUTOMATICALLY get exp at teh start of the day. You have to train to get it.

he could be

I frankly don't give two fucks about "could".

Scum use "could" to cover all sort of scum sins. Do you think he IS?

[Ghostlin]

I feel like I've missed nothing game important; dreal's setup spec doesn't get us any scum, a cogent block or anything else. And while I *hate* the night kill speculation from Vax (re: why is NMS alive), us shitting ourselves back and forth forever is getting nothing done.

HURT: Dreal

[Ghostlin]

crickets today, no one has anything to say about anything that happened?

The only thing I have to say is your NMS concern seems fake; dreal's engaging in fruitless setup spec and is still scum.

[Ghostlin]

I like setup spec btw, and think it can be useful, but also recognize it has time and place

however, with practically nothing else going on in the game, I'm not sure exactly:

what is your beef with the setup spec? why is it an issue that I did it when it was simply a aftereffect of vax doing it?

I sorta hate the entire conversation, if you want to be honest, so it might be an aftereffect of Vax starting it, you continuing it, and me not having good reads on both of you, yours bleeding over from Day 2.

[Ghostlin]

it's an interesting experiment

again I think it would have gone better with shorter block Days

kudos to the mod still for coming up with it, will see how it all shapes up after game

It's really hard to be active since we CAN'T see the effectiveness of our blocks where we CAN see the effectiveness of lynches. Meanwhile scum get to sorta rate how effective their NKs been by the flips. It's a demoralizing situation for the Town.

[Ghostlin]

yo, fuckers, why aren't you voting?

Mod didn't give me the 'block a player twice' role. Kinda wish they did.

[Ghostlin]

Well done, gerry and mastina. Sorry I got bombed.

[Ghostlin]

You have upgraded your role and gained a new ability!
The first time you would be killed, you will instead survive

@mod...why didn't this apply to Vax's ltnch? That "killed" him.

@Maki...when you faked friendly with gerry why didn't that set off any alarms towards gerry? How would he know you were town? Why would he play along as town knowing you were lying to everyone?

I can confirm we shot Vax N3; it failed, hence why my and yurkin's corpse were the only things found D4.