Mini 1955: Perpetual MYLO III - Game Over!

[Chara]

what was this situation with wicked and how did this affect your reads on wicked and kunkstar day 1/2?

i don't feel like finding it, but i'm sure it's somewhere in the middle of my ISO, super-sleuth. the situation with Wicked is kunkstar being a Wicked counterwagon, and on day 1 i thought Wicked was town and kunkstar scum.
1023. just start reading there if you want to see what i was thinking on day 2.

[Chara]

If I voted Klunk how would that make you feel
@Lycan/Chara

what was the purpose of this question?

[Chara]

it's fine.
if kunk is scum, we win.
if kunk is town, i know the entire scumteam. even if i'm not believed, we have another mislynch, so we have two chances for me to be believed. we win.

i'm tired too, but scum is already feeling the loss. i'm sure they're trying their best, though.

[Chara]

it's almost like i thought kunkstar was scum until mid day 2 where i started to reconsider if he could be scum with both Wicked and Viomi, because it looked unlikely. so i put him in the townpile for then.

and then during today, i reconsidered the validity of that. no contradiction.

[Chara]

if you get a choice of who you lynch, you're implying they're all good choices, but that's simply untrue. you can only vote with wagon compositions you think are town.... unless you're actively pushing a mislynch.

...what?
of course she gets a choice. this logic makes no sense. or are you not considering that Kaede is unsure is a valid place to be as town?
if she's unsure of who's scum, she's obviously unsure of who is town.
honestly.

[Chara]

These shit reads make it impossible to work with you

anyone who tone reads knows i'm town. sorry Lycan.

[Chara]

WHICH IS IT?

Wicked voting kunkstar there is irrelevant, kunkstar is scum, and while i thought differently before and that he was unlikely scum given the flipped scum, i no longer think this.

are you... oh, my god. i'm so sorry, Lycan. i didn't realize you couldn't read.

[Chara]

(all 13 minutes of critical thought)

there was 0 minutes of critical thought, actually.

i suppose i could flip Maki too. but a Maki townflip says nothing and a kunkstar townflip gives the entire team.
more like they're scum together, so shrug.

[Chara]

If it's on scum it isn't going through because I'm not voting it.

this is why it's not going through. because you're town.

[Chara]

i know you're frustrated, but about 50% of town are dumb as hell. i'm in that group. i may not be right but i'm good at not getting mislynched.
and no, Lycan isn't scum either.

[Chara]

If it's on scum it isn't going through because I'm not voting it.

this is why it's not going through. because you're town.

Maki-Dunn bussing??

could you use more words so i know what you mean? sorry. it's late, i need the help.
are you asking if Maki and Dunm are scum together?

[Chara]

Who do you think is scum chara

If kunk is scum we have to assume scum won't vote him now

I ask because I didn't think maki dunn was a possible pair but we currently have neither of their votes and you're asserting lycan is town.

kunkstar is scum, but Lycan isn't voting him, and Lycan is town, so kunkstar isn't getting lynched. the fact that scum knows kunkstar is impossible to lynch thanks to Lycan is what makes analyzing the wagons so difficult.

but there are three options. one is Maki and Dunn were scum together and took a risk because both were at risk of being lynched already. this is my current theory but i haven't checked the validity of it yet beyond looking at my memory of events.

option 2 is you're scum who knows Lycan won't lynch kunkstar. don't really believe this is the case.
option 3 is it's Diamond instead, and frankly i believe that even less.

if kunkstar is town the playing field gets turned on its head.

[Chara]

option 2 and option 3 both include Maki as the other scum, forgot to say. outside chance of it being Dunn instead but i'm not worried about that.

[Chara]

UNVOTE:

[Chara]

would've been better if you'd just done it, Maki.

[Chara]

would've been better if you'd just done it, Maki.

If I was scum I would've auto hammered there I'm wondering if you would go back on Dunn

you as scum would've auto-hammered town kunkstar?

[Chara]

town kunkstar flips. Maki removes herself from the game. why would scum Maki be scared of that?

[Chara]

Lycan, can you answer my question?

[Chara]

it's not bait. i'm trying to figure it out. if i asked, i forgot. i don't care about Maki's answer, it doesn't help me.

[Chara]

Then why did you ask.
Did you magically expect me to say I'm scum or something

because i was asking the town. the question was never for you. apologies for not saying so, i thought referring to you in the third person would tell you i wasn't asking you.

[Chara]

test what theory??
i'm asking a question. i need to know if i can rule out town kunkstar and scum Maki or if that's a mistake.

[Chara]

... I thought you're saying Maki didn't make the obvious hammer because they're both scum? 'The theory' being that if you L-1 with Kaede online, it's a forced unvote from Maki. That doesn't account for any spoiling of the data, which is why I'm saying it's just as possible to be a mislynch to me.

Lycan. this is why i'm confused. i don't understand why scum Maki doesn't hammer town kunkstar there. how are you rationalizing it?
i guess it's because you both believe i'm scum, and that you're capable of lynching me, now that i think of it.

[Chara]

I feel like Maki was being overly cautious and that they aren't partners. If she unvotes at L-1 I'll hammer, but I'm quite likely just lynching you tomorrow for it.

ok, yes.
so this is what i thought too, initially. i guess being overly cautious could account for it and i shouldn't worry.

[Chara]

but, no. it still doesn't work. if kunk is town, Maki can't be scum. they have to be the same alignment, scum or town. because scum Maki hammers then sacrifices herself.
kunk could be scum with Maki town, but Maki can't be scum with kunk town.

[Chara]

...or he's scumreading us two and thus kunkstar is obviously not scum from his perspective?

pedit: was at Maki.

[Chara]

because Maki/me as scum means yes, kunkstar is not scum. but i'm town, so Maki/kunkstar is entirely possible.

[Chara]

Maybe. There's likely no good sacrifice for Maki with town Kunkstar. I'm imagining yourself, Diamond, or Shuichi. Diamond sacrifice is losing. Chara|Shuichi is unclear, but the slots are not as bad. It's a playable position if Maki thinks she can milk the L-1 for towncred.

she can't milk anything for towncred if you don't lynch kunkstar, which you were never going to.

[Chara]

Chara who is the third because I'm seeing some complications with scum kunkstar

it's either Dunn, Diamond, or Shuichi. there are problems with all of them.
if kunkstar is scum and Maki is town, though, you're scum.
but i find that unlikely.

[Chara]

Lycan, is Maki still scum if i'm town?

[Chara]

what i mean is. can you rationalize town kunkstar with town me and scum Maki?

[Chara]

ugh. i need to sleep, sorry.

[Chara]

VOTE: Maki

[Chara]

I don't know why we got a sudden stream of unvotes. It looks to me like we had it right.

it's probably just that kunkstar and Maki are both scum, and my paranoia was misplaced, but that means kunkstar/Maki/Dunnstral is the team.

[Chara]

this sort of play doesn't suit me at all, does it.
Shuichi: you're not in my mislynch pool. the only way i'd consider lynching you is if a bunch of flips presented me with a situation where you had to be scum. if you're not scum it just won't happen like that, so it's fine. i also would rather be proven right regarding my townread of you.

2110: you're... probably right.

i'm caught between kunkstar and Maki both being scum, and kunkstar being scum while Maki is town who insists on posting in such a way that i think she's scum having a laugh. or town having a laugh because she knows we're wrong about her. kunkstar being town while Maki is scum is... a strange situation. despite what Diamond says in 2110, even though i said it sounded right.
i'd just like a flip. can we even flip kunkstar?

Dunnstral: are you actually suggesting i'm scum with kunkstar? haha.
why is only Maki an acceptable lynch? there are three scum.

[Chara]

Sorry, it's just that we were discussing the possibility of Lycan town meaning scum Kunk never getting lynched then Maki comes in with the hammer threat and paranoia took the best out of me.

i'm quite annoyed that this happened to me, too. if Maki had actually hammered, it wouldn't have mattered.
kunkstar is scum and Maki is town, Lycan is scum in spite of my read. but Maki didn't hammer, and we only have her word that she would, so it's unclear.
it's entirely possible for kunkstar to be scum, Lycan to be town, and Maki to be scum with kunkstar. it would mean (ignore what i said last night, that was dumb) Dunnstral is absolutely the last buddy, and Maki didn't hammer her buddy.

the other situation is kunkstar scum, Maki town, and Lycan is scum with kunkstar. that still means Dunnstral is the buddy. it also means scum nearly lost there.

kunkstar/Maki/Dunnstral
kunkstar/Lycan/Dunnstral

if kunkstar is town then it opens up a bunch of unfortunate possibilities, but Lycan is also very likely town if that's the case.

this really isn't my style at all. :<

[Chara]

VOTE: kunkstar
kunkstar/Maki/Dunnstral. gross

[Chara]

what is it about this game that makes me hammer things? it's not something i really find myself doing, usually.
i suppose it's because i'm either on the front of the wagon or i don't vote on it at all, but in this game inaction means losing.

also, i did mean to say kunkstar/Lycan/Dunnstral, haha.

[Chara]

blaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah so she did.

[Chara]

Maki, make good on re-voting kunkstar or you're scum with him.

[Chara]

"don't go back on your scumreads, Chara. that's your problem, you lose confidence."
except i stuck fast to the wrong one. :<
sorry, kunkstar. i should have stayed where i was.

but, it isn't so bad. i believe we can win from here.

i had a large write-up of the state of things in this post, but i don't want to give scum a road map on how to wiggle out of things from here. so, that will wait until i've heard from more of you. :>

[Chara]

you don't see how choosing to reveal Dunnstral as scum doesn't help Maki not to get lynched?

[Chara]

you don't see how choosing to reveal Dunnstral as scum doesn't help Maki not to get lynched?

my god.
"you don't see how choosing to reveal Dunnstral as scum helps scum Maki not to get lynched."
that's what that should say. negation.

[Chara]

assuming Maki is scum here:
would you have suggested they sacrifice Maki instead? why sacrifice someone like Shuichi or myself, how would that be better?

[Chara]

considering there were players (like myself, and kunkstar) who thought that Maki refraining from hammering kunkstar and general uncertainty about his lynch made her more likely town, and Dunnstral and Maki were trying to get each other lynched yesterday, i'd argue that there's absolutely a reason for Dunnstral to be sacrificed and for an attempt to be made for scum Maki to survive.

[Chara]

Maki's going up on the towniness scale a little bit.
Kaede's looking null!scum.
Shuichi's moved up from scum to null/null!scum. I'll apprehensively trust him.

explain your change on Shuichi, please.

[Chara]

Well, it helps that you claimed scum in twilight and them changed your mind about leaving.

....?

[Chara]

I pray for a gg

This

i figured this was what you're referring to. i'm having trouble seeing it as a scumclaim.

[Chara]

Kaede isn't scum.
i'm not scum.
Shuichi is, if scum, putting on a rather good performance. he's also noticed the same thing i did earlier about the possibility of Diamond/Dunnstral.
Lycan and Maki are of opposite alignments or both town.
Maki, if scum with Dunnstral, has put on quite a show for little reward.
so we have Diamond/Lycan as my most likely team. Diamond/Maki as my second most likely team.
the only thing that bothers me about Diamond scum is why he would suddenly go back on his Shuichi scumread if Shuichi isn't his partner... it's a little odd. but it does put Diamond/Shuichi as the last possible team.
lynching Diamond appears to be the best choice. it's the wrong choice only if the team is Shuichi/Maki or Shuichi/Lycan.

i continue to want to be paranoid of Kaede, but i've decided to stop listening. she's town. if i go back on this later, i mean it, quote this post and tell me it's stupid.

this is where i'm at right now. is something wrong with what i've said?
good night, all.

[Chara]

if i disregard Maki scum here, as she really makes little sense when one considers everything surrounding Dunnstral, we're left with Diamond/Lycan, Diamond/Shuichi, and Shuichi/Lycan as teams to consider.
lynch one, if that person flips town scum is still forced to sacrifice another, and the remaining player is easily lynched. i'd like that to be the case.
this is without looking at their play more in-depth than what i remember of events.
if i'm being honest with myself, i find Shuichi and Maki are both sitting at the same spot in my mind.

[Chara]

if Shuichi is scum, and we lynch Diamond and he flips town, scum would have no choice but to sacrifice Shuichi and leave it between Maki and Lycan.
if Shuichi is town and Diamond is town, that would mean the team is the improbable Lycan/Maki, so i'm not considering it.
so two pairs of players, in the end. that was a whole lot of nothing.
now that i've settled that i suppose i'll go look at how they conducted themselves with flipped scum (only Dunnstral, really), later.

[Chara]

Hey chara, didnt you say D3 that a kunkstar town flip reveals the entire scum team?

i exaggerated the truth in the hopes scum would make a helpful sacrifice if i was wrong.
or maybe i was overconfident. probably the former, though. hindsight is 20/20, and if Maki is scum too i'll be kicking myself, but right now i believe i made the right decision, at least regarding kunkstar vs. Maki. if Maki is town and we'd mislynched her, we'd be in a very bad position today.

[Chara]

it does seem that way.
if i had to vote right now it would be with the assumption the team is Shuichi/Lycan.

[Chara]

Where did that come from?? I don't see what happened to change you off diamond.

Do you think his yelling at me yesterday is theater?

no, i'm thinking you're town.
what i meant to type was Diamond/Lycan. as i was writing that i was thinking "Shuichi feels town", but i have no idea why i typed your name there.

[Chara]

ah. it's because i wrote the post at 2:30 am. remind me to stop doing that.

[Chara]

I thought you said Shuichi's pred obvtowned. Where's that evolution, Chara?

Please also explain how I behave the way I do day 1 with Mulch and Michael while having Michael-Acid-Wicked as partners. Shouldn't any conclusion you come to attempt to reconcile that? It is like rather than perform gymnastics you cut right to the part where you head smash into a bar. There is no continuity or reasoning here

VOTE: Chara

why does my saying Shuichi's predecessor obvtowned only crop up now, and not during any of the discussion on day 3?

[Chara]

I'm keeping my vote on Lycan I think only 1 scum was on that end of day wagon so that makes Lycan scum in all cases who was wanting me to hammer Klunk and was defending Dunn

I suggest you all join me here

that he was using his scumread of you to completely ignore the possibility of scum Dunnstral only to immediately go back to voting you after Dunnstral flips scum is the sort of obviously terribly progression that is almost easy to miss because of it's blatancy.

not voting yet. in this situation it's possible for scum in a weaker position to grab the point and sacrifice themself, so i'd rather not vote until i'm sure.

Diamond/Shuichi was a team i was considering, but i'm not doing so anymore with Shuichi choosing to open with a Diamond vote when he knows i'm scumreading Diamond.
i'd apologize for my absence, but we've all been rather absent. :>

[Chara]

Seems like everyone, me included, have decided to be away.

where are you in your thoughts right now, Kaede?
as my only lock townread, you would be helpful.

[Chara]

VOTE: DiamondSentinel

[Chara]

Can you remind me where did you TR me Chara?

thought i answered this, but apparently did not hit send on the post.
i'm not sure there's a where. after your reaction to my push on you it became difficult to see you as scum. it progressed to a townread from there and i've decided not to run myself in circles considering scum!Kaede anymore. Maki's opinion on the matter helped with the decision, as well as your reaction to it.

[Chara]

Can't wait for Lycan to bail and I'll be clear

i think if he's scum his partner is Diamond. do you have someone else you're worried about?

[Chara]

and where will you lead the town next when i flip town, Lycan?

UCV's obvtowness was apparent, the fact that you explained more doesn't make it townier than my own opinion on him despite you pretending otherwise.
is your proposed team myself and Kaede, then?

[Chara]

there's a small, unfortunate scenario where Lycan is town who has ruffled himself into a bias against me that has miscoloured his perception of the

entire

game, to the point that he avoided the Dunn wagon because he thought Maki and i were scum, is now attempting to lead us to a town loss by continuing to push me despite his earlier extremely confident Maki scumread, and that we're all pretty much fucked unless i get lynched today if only to get his head on straight. because it's constantly

mylo

.
so, i just hope he's scum. even if my gut is telling me he is not, constantly.

[Chara]

if the above scenario is true, then i honestly don't know what it is i could have done differently. if the above is true, Lycan will surely blame me for a loss. at this point, it doesn't matter to me what he says in post.
why's Diamond town? there needs to be a reason that doesn't include "Chara is scum".
an explanation for the change in your Maki read is also needed, that doesn't include "Chara is scum", because i am frankly sick of that justification from you. did all of your rhetoric abour scum Maki just fly away in the wind?
if you were a player like Kaede, i wouldn't be questioning it this hard. if you were a player like me. but you're you, and i've seen how you work this game, so where do you decide it's your right to be followed when you were wrong on Dunnstral, wrong on me, and apparently you've decided you were wrong on Maki too?

[Chara]

Lycan talked on me talking to dimond and dunn dif and when I brought up valid points dunn and him both just plugged there ears

You can tell by my votes that I'm not considering you and Diamond anymore, but rather than everything I had said still being valid, this is absolutely not a wolf post, instead it is clear that the blood vessel that had burst in your brain has stopped any critical thinking.

it's a correct post. you didn't have any worthwhile justification for why Maki would treat a player she knows well differently from Diamond.

invariably, you don't understand the meaning of agreeing to disagree. if someone does not meet your standards of critical mafia play, mafia theory, they are scum or an idiot. if they don't play along, they're the ones who are trying not to work with you. there's no way to win except by playing within your narrow view.
you

still

maintain you were correct to call Viomi town as she was lynched.
at least those of us who thought Wicked was town can admit a misread. you can't even do that. you call a day 1 scum lynch a mistake. it's infuriating.

this doesn't apply if you're scum, and it's likely a bad idea to post because it doesn't help the game and is probably wrong in some parts because my memory has altered chains of events. oh well.
in the end i'm annoyed by your constant insults to the intelligence of other players. if you're scum i don't care. i find it a viable strategy to insult the intelligence of arguments. if you're town, it's alienating anyone who

would

have followed your doomed push on me.

[Chara]

anyway.

Diamond, more from you. Shuichi, who do you think Diamond's partner is?

[Chara]

could you try to care a little bit?

[Chara]

damn it, someone finally asked me a hard question.

here's the situation: i don't agree with most of his reads, and i was gut-townreading it for the most part. at this stage, it isn't enough. it's rather similar to how i felt about Dunnstral. little behaviour i've found overtly scummy, but no reason to really believe he's town. that would have been fine, but now we're here on day 4 and rather than engage on anything that had been presented, (your question for example) he chose to do nothing.
the fact i'm not sure is why i'm still here trying to figure things out.

[Chara]

You think scum decides to SR me when everyone else is TRing me?

i don't pretend to know Diamond's scumplay, but having scumreads that won't get lynched can be just another smokescreen
he isn't voting you. why not?

[Chara]

I mean sure, that's not a strong enough reason, but with his "gut reads" he could just go with the flow easily.

if there's no reason to change tactic (assuming it could be easy, yes), why do it?

[Chara]

at this point i'm just throwing spaghetti at the wall to see what sticks, but you've expressed paranoia in this thread of players pocketing you. scum could see that and try something else.
i'm not saying i have any reason to believe this is specifically what's happening, and i see why you feel how you do, but i don't consider it evidence he's town. it's got me thinking about it, though, which is helpful.

[Chara]

Me neither, but depending on who his hypothetical partner might be I have doubts that he'd just lay down and die, I mean if he's scum Dunn was his partner and i dont recall him doing anyhting to save him (tho I dont remember)

P-Edit: Didn't he flip his read on Shuichi?

i mean, pushing kunkstar and not Dunnstral could be considered saving Dunnstral.

he did. that's part of why i was suspicious of them being partners. i still find it odd, but now it's only odd on Diamond's side as Shuichi is now on Diamond's lynch wagon.

[Chara]

that Diamond hasn't done anything despite the votes on him is a good point. he could believe he's safe because even with Shuichi, myself, and Maki (who would likely join the wagon if it came to it), Diamond still isn't in danger of being lynched without your support.
or he's town and doesn't care. if it's that one he needs to care. or he's scum and feels lazy? i think the apathy could come from either alignment. maybe more from town but perhaps Diamond feels like he's lost.

also for several reasons i need to outline in my head for a second, i think the only way Shuichi is scum here is with Lycan.

[Chara]

I don't recall he pushing kunkstar very hard... just vote parking him.

hm, that's true. but in the end, Dunnstral didn't go past three votes, and after a point seemed to be safe from the lynch. Diamond might've felt intervention unnecessary as scum needed to remain hidden as best they could going forward, seeing as they had to get through three mislynches and two sacrifices from their own team.

my Shuichi/Lycan theory is made up of a lot of leaps of logic and gut feelings, but now i'm attached to it. i should probably disregard it, since there are an infinite number of reasons for why Shuichi could be feeling demotivated here, and half of them still have him being town attached.

[Chara]

Shuichi. if you don't believe Lycan is scum, please interact with his posting on me. i'm so tired of refuting it.

Maki gets the award for player whose stances are easiest to understand, make sense, and where i can see her thought process clearly and with feeling.
that isn't me putting down other players, i'm just feeling annoyed at Lycan's posting and appreciative of Maki's.

[Chara]

With Dunnstral as scum I have to eliminate one, and that is Diamond because my conclusions from Maki associations no longer made sense (they marked a clear difference in how she treated the two slots).

I would love to see an attempt to persuade me that Maki was bussing Dunn. Like, with analysis of how that interaction went down.

Although chances are the only thing that could possibly convince me is my own analysis and I should reread it.

the other thing a town Lycan here would need to do is explain why the difference in interaction isn't accounted for by Maki's being close to Dunnstral.

still waiting.
also ready to flip to Lycan, sure.

[Chara]

I'm laughing so hard because this is one of the most scum sided set ups ever and scum have put it so they'll have 2 clears in lylo if we fuck this up

to be fair to scum, they don't have a lot of nightkills.

[Chara]

for someone on about group dynamics, Lycan's posting being continually tone-deaf is what makes the thought of him being scum so

odd

to me. he has no friends here and isn't making any by asserting the same tired, disproven positions.

[Chara]

why's Kaede scum, Lycan?

[Chara]

Plus if Lycan is town and dies I am the clear of this game

i don't actually understand why you keep saying this

i don't understand it either. Maki's clear if Lycan is

scum

, sure.

[Chara]

I explained this. I'm super busy right now with the end of the semester. I'm trying to be more active, but I just remembered about this while writing my essay for English. I'm doing like a 5 minute catchup, max.

i actually meant it was a good point for you to be town, but considering your absence is based in rl i'm treating it as NAI.

is there a reason you haven't voted Lycan, Diamond?

[Chara]

sorry, ffery.
Lycan: so it's still me and Maki? when you answered about unvoting Maki and changing your vote to me it gave me the impression you were no longer scumreading her. evidently not the case.

[Chara]

i'm here too.

[Chara]

why no interaction with Kaede's posts, then?

[Chara]

Hmm, apparently I'm being prodded. Activity itself has hit the shitter though, so I still don't seen anything worth commenting on.

i was referring to this point earlier.

[Chara]

sorry, Shuichi. i've ended up just waiting on you.

[Chara]

That's all I got, sorry.

But that was your plan, wasn't it?

Maybe some of that was kind of your plan, maybe, please?

Chara, the Ultimate Impostor?
VOTE: Chara, I guess.

Shuichi...
now i have to go through all of this point by point, don't i?
blah.

[Chara]

For a second scum I'd still pick Diamond despite everything I found in his favor, I think.

I haven't thought on whether this pair makes sense and I don't plan to right now, I'm done thinking today.

it immediately doesn't make sense because i'm voting Diamond with you!!! come on!!

[Chara]

look, i do appreciate the massive amount of effort you've put in here, obviously.
i'm only annoyed because now i have to actually sit down and refute all of that effort. but not real annoyed, in-game annoyed.

[Chara]

I should make a note of this for later, as I know there will be places where I think Chara's behavior is too townie to suspect. By her own admission, perhaps I should cast a sidelong glance at these moments.

my only skill as town is looking town. drealmerz's Maplewood. my conversation with Ellibereth.
not the same thing as being ok at looking town as scum. that's because i'm reasonable.
if an honest answer to a question about my scumgame invalidates my

only

skill as town then what even is the point?
i don't really even know what to say here that would be convincing except i now feel like i've shot myself in the foot for saying that my scumgame is ok.
my scumgame is fine. i've also never won as scum by myself because it just doesn't hold up. the times i've won as scum were when i was in a hydra with Almost50 and leaned heavily on him.

[Chara]

i don't know how effective this will be, actually. i'm trying not to AtE, it's just disheartening.
but, honestly. are you really going to ignore all the times i've seemed far too townie to be scum because i said i was pretty townie as scum?
i'm talking like this to you because if you're town i'm pretty much fucked with this conclusion of yours. like. you're on a wagon with someone who, when i asked you to please respond to his arguments because i couldn't do it anymore, you said you found them impossible to interact with.

[Chara]

I find myself hoping the direction I'm hitting will survive contact with Chara supertownposting later on.

just take the supertownposting for what it is.

if this is the conclusion you're

hoping

for it's the conclusion you're going to hit!

[Chara]

i'm going through your quote walls and responding to them with my phone, i hope whoever is town in this game appreciates it.

[Chara]

I am confused as to how Chara migrated from Wicked hardtown to here.

i wonder if i should give up. i'm rapidly realizing i don't have much to say here. because the honest reply i can give is "i don't remember, it's been two weeks". maybe i said so in thread but my Wicked townread was because he looked town. that's all. i lost confidence in it.

[Chara]

Not unfair, but maybe frustrated with wrong-reasons-right-conclusion?

you agree with me, though. if i'd be frustrated as scum i'd be frustrated as town. this shouldn't be part of your case. ask yourself if you'd be frustrated with Lycan's moonlogic this game if it were directed at you.

[Chara]

Is it now? Not what you said before.

I should probably put this question to rest with meta, but ugh. Also I'm the worst fucking meta warrior on earth unless it's by experiential osmosis. I can't cut meta reads from whole cloth.

i said i was pretty good at looking town as scum. if you can quote me saying my scumgame is good or can get me scum wins (it can't), please do.

i was referencing a scumgame i was in with Wisdom. we lost. Almost and i got lynched in a hydra. i was supremely unhelpful to the team.

[Chara]

Fucking hell shit damn fuck. Is this just positioning to look town with Wicked going down anyway or what?

no, this is where i realized i was wrong. i'm an idiot so i didn't stick to this and lynched kunkstar later.
the fact that you appear to be annoyed whenever ny posting looks mildly towny tells me 2 things: 1) you started this wanting to be right about me being scum.
2) you're probably town.

[Chara]

Gather round and watch as this kunkstar read plummets off a bridge in 10 minutes flat!

ok, i get it. i've been kicking myself over not just staying on Dunnstral enough.
'gather round and watch as Shuichi convinces himself locktown is scum and draws defeat from the jaws of victory!'
...or something.
i don't blame you, i did the same thing this game.
hell, i did the same thing to Kaede earlier and she was rightfully upset about it.

i convinced myself kunkstar couldn't be scum with Wicked. by the time we got to where i mislynched kunkstar, i'd decided that it didn't matter who scum was bussing or not bussing because scum were

confirmed

to have bussed the hell out of this game. that's all. my reason for locktowning kunkstar evaporated.

[Chara]

No please stop towning thank you.

???

[Chara]

lost the quote but "i feel like day 3 Chara's reads were too fluid".
i don't know. i don't

know

. you've been doing exactly the same thing and you by your own admission know i'm like this! so why?

[Chara]

what is it about this game that makes me hammer things? it's not something i really find myself doing, usually.
i suppose it's because i'm either on the front of the wagon or i don't vote on it at all, but in this game inaction means losing.

also, i did mean to say kunkstar/Lycan/Dunnstral, haha.

Where did Maki go?

i thought kunkstar was scum here!! this isn't a point!! why would i think Maki is scum if i thought it was kunkstar!

[Chara]

i also thought Maki was voting kunkstar there. Kaede then tells me it wasn't hammer and Maki had unvoted.

[Chara]

there was less to go through than i thought. i expected more posts to actually be about me considering it ended with a vote there.
i agree Kaede is town but i've agreed with that for a while.

Maki/Lycan/Diamond
if i accept that you're town for this (and i almost don't want to, because scum Shuichi

has

to pull a big play or he loses), then it has to be one of those three
. Maki and Lycan aren't scum together meaning Diamond has to be scum.

who am i teamed with, Shuichi? you said Diamond was your first choice and Maki was your second. do you

really

think i'm partners with Diamond here? really?
the only conclusion of yours i can accept is that i'm scum with Maki. because me being scum with Lycan is hilarious, but also impossible. that's it.

[Chara]

there's also the fact that if i'm scum and Lycan is town, Lycan would be lynched already. no one is buying what he's selling. scum Chara has the easiest and most justified mislynch of Lycan. i could have powerlynched him on day 3 and come out of it with my towncred intact.

[Chara]

maybe this is a good thing. i don't think Shuichi can pull this off as scum. it'd be like Kaede being scum. i might've mislynched him otherwise and that would be just as bad as me being mislynched here.

[Chara]

but me getting mislynched here means scum Diamond gets got and then it's between Maki and Lycan. we could win that or it could result in a loss.

[Chara]

actually can you explain to me, Shuichi, what these things you found in Diamond's favour were? it's possible i just missed them in your walls, but i mainly see you calling him scum.

[Chara]

Shuichi, i finally have my laptop, please tell me you're here. i don't know if my drive to win will still be here in the morning.

[Chara]

ah, alright. see you later, then.
also my last post is silly, of course i'll be here tomorrow to try and solve this.
and don't say 'unfortunately'. :<

[Chara]

Lycan: out of game i take back whatever i said about me disliking you if you're town.
also, good night thread.

[Chara]

I literally called her scum a few posts previous to voting you and later said I voted you over push Maki because vote parking Maki wasn't going to be productive with all my posts ignored. Your feelings on the matter aren't grounded in reality.

how about 'my feelings on the matter were mistaken because i either missed or misread the relevant posts'?

[Chara]

1 day left. Shuichi my question about Diamond's alignment was important.

[Chara]

4. If there's no majority at deadline, there's no lynch. If this happens ONCE, the Mafia will be required to No-Kill on the following night. If this happens AGAIN, then the Mafia will get to make a Kill the following night.

so we can.

[Chara]

I meant the mentions of him in the Act 1 post.

But I guess it's all WIFOMy... :/

do you still think it's possible he's my partner? what about Maki?

[Chara]

Diamond is scum and he needs to be lynched today. i don't see a world where he's town if Shuichi is town. Diamond/Maki or Diamond/Lycan. at this point i find myself incapable of figuring out which of those two is more likely town but something wants me to say it's Lycan. i'd rather not have to make the decision at all.

i

suppose

if we lynch Maki today (or on another day as it seems we have one freebie), if she's town then the team is Lycan/Diamond anyway and scum can't get away. ignoring the voice in my head saying this could be an elaborate show from Shuichi but i'll be damned if i don't want to townread it.

[Chara]

I dunno. Can you tell me what scumpairs you think make sense and don't? You can include people you don't suspect.

assuming you're town, we have: Maki/Diamond, Diamond/Lycan. that's all.

[Chara]

and if Lycan is really and

definitely

town i can only conclude it's Maki/Diamond.

[Chara]

i know Maki looks odd if you consider Dunnstral. but the fact of the matter is scum didn't need one mislynch. they needed

three

. the only way to keep going is to do something that will be risky but ultimately make the surviving scum able to get those mislynches.

[Chara]

I mean I think there are some Kaede teams that make sense, she just isn't scum.

i mean, sure, but because she isn't scum we don't need to worry about those teams.

[Chara]

of course if i take Shuichi possibly being scum into account and him going for the win here, his partner could be Lycan or it could be Maki. feel free to tell me if either of those are impossible.
outside chance of Diamond/Shuichi, even though i'd dismissed it earlier.

pedit: and Diamond/Shuichi just fizzled, so never mind.

[Chara]

no, that would be silly. and probably impossible.
but if you're town then it's absolutely Diamond. i'm trying to preemptively prepare myself for being wrong, though. like with what we have here i just don't see another solution. i'm sure anyone who's in the dead thread who still cares is yelling at us.

[Chara]

10 hours to deadline. Maki? Kaede?

[Chara]

i suppose it isn't terrible if we go over. while i'm convinced at this point that Diamond is scum, if the extra time is enough for him to post thoughts it might be worth it in the case i'm wrong.
would rather just hammer him and be done with this game, though.

[Chara]

because Diamond/Maki and Diamond/Lycan are the only teams that make any sense, and i'm now townreading Shuichi.
in the end, that's all.
and Lycan, if scum, is never leaving the game, because if he's sacrificed then Maki becomes confirmed town, which is a loss for scum.

[Chara]

if Lycan's town it's Maki/Diamond anyway so i guess it would be safe..?

[Chara]

i am now in a position to hammer Lycan.
Diamond, are you keeping your vote there or moving it?

[Chara]

if he ends up not showing up i'll make a decision on my own.

[Chara]

Chara, there is no Diamond/Lycan team. Diamond is throwing here in that scenario.

i'm aware.

[Chara]

I should really get over my obsession with blame, but I don't like being called names in postgame.

i understand this.

[Chara]

Chara/Maki, Diamond/Maki.

Find me another sensible pair.

i can't find any. i'm unhappy with Maki scum because of Dunnstral, but it's all that's left.
Lycan has no possible partners except Shuichi, and if Shuichi is scum here then i give up. also i want to townread Lycan.

[Chara]

why would we do that?

[Chara]

he'll still want to lynch me.

[Chara]

he has. he says it's Maki.

[Chara]

he's saying two no lynches is a loss.

[Chara]

which it isn't, Lycan. it would put us in LyLo.

[Chara]

I know it's painful but I do think we should take at least the one NL here because we're just rushing even though none of us have a clue.

i have a very good clue. it's not Shuichi nor is it Kaede.
at least if we lynch Lycan here it'll mean he can't lose the game for us later.
it's Diamond/Maki.

[Chara]

They should use this as torture

i'm extremely sympathetic to your feelings but you have to admit this is probably funny to watch.

[Chara]

fake it til you make it, Shuichi.
i will happily lynch Maki, now. Kaede, will you do it?

[Chara]

i can put you in touch with her. she's very inspiring.

pedit: no, i don't.

[Chara]

Why Maki

because Shuichi is town, because Diamond isn't scum with Lycan, and because Lycan is town anyway.

[Chara]

i don't really have the energy to argue for why Lycan is town when he's doing his damnedest to make me want to just lynch him and try again tomorrow.

[Chara]

what makes me sad?

[Chara]

You wrote a giant post about how mean I am earlier in day when I pointed out that Maki was no efforting again

oh. i don't remember that being what i was responding to.
my post about how mean you are was to me. me me me. Chara only cares about itself.
VOTE: Maki Harukawa

[Chara]

*was about me, not to me.

[Chara]

at least i'm having fun with this again.

[Chara]

oh, you're right. well, telling you how mean you are was about me

let's run up Maki to L-1 so Lycan can dismiss his partner theory.

[Chara]

fighting against town, fighting against scum. love Perpetual Mylo.

[Chara]

Lycan why didn't i hammer you and sacrifice so Maki could try to win. better yet since no one will lynch me except you, why didn't i hammer you and sacrifice Maki?

[Chara]

It's not like I can trust you with the hammer with how poorly you have used it all game.

i wouldn't be hammering as i am voting her, but ok.
also if Diamond isn't scum then we can't win today anyway because he is not here.

[Chara]

Your options aren't binary. Playing scum's game for them does not interest me.

no, but voteparking on town so we can get no lynches besides you is your life's work.

[Chara]

and you are then playing scum's game for them because you're making yourself an inevitable mislynch scum can safely hop on.

[Chara]

i'm gonna be a little upset if Shuichi is scum here but, not that much. i should probably save the camaraderie for postgame, though.

[Chara]

same here.

[Chara]

i'm trying, Kaede. i don't know what else to say. i'll help you lynch Lycan if you want to because i don't think we can win while he's alive anyway.

[Chara]

Lycan, if you don't vote Maki in your next post i will hammer you. no hard feelings.

pedit: i'm aware Lycan isn't scum, Shuichi. i don't know what else to do. he's only scum if you are and you are not scum.

[Chara]

i can't get Kaede to vote anywhere else. Lycan needs to go.

[Chara]

Lycan, i know you're saying that you think the teams are Chara/Kaede and Chara/Maki but you have to understand this fact is not apparent looking at the plaintext of your posts, and you MUST get into the habit of being more clear.

[Chara]

Shuichi doesnt wanna lynch Lycan
I dont wanna lynch Maki/DS
Chara doesnt wanna lynch Shuichi
Lycan doesnt wanna lynch DS
Maki doesnt wanna lynch Chara
No one wants to lynch me except DS

Did I get that right?

sort of. it's not all of what i'm saying but sure.

[Chara]

weren't you the one who told me to be confident in my own reads, Maki?

[Chara]

DiamondSentinel was killed Night 4. He was Mafia.

yes.

obviously.

there is no reason to think he's town. i don't understand why you think this, Kaede. are you not townreading Shuichi?

[Chara]

Part of me wants to vote Dimond cause I see him as the likely scum in the 4 people but if I'm wrong I feel like I will fucking lose this game for town and I'll get laughed at zzz

i want to vote Diamond too. but we really cannot if Lycan is alive.
so scum Diamond gets away. no hard feelings but not my fault at this point.
VOTE: Diamond

[Chara]

Also when that happens I declare this game to be not my fault.

haha. high-five.

[Chara]

Lycan what does that post mean? i can't tell what you're saying i'm doing.

[Chara]

Wild 180s go!
VOTE: Chara

sure. why not.

[Chara]

Diamond if you're somehow town could you just. do your best and be active instead of reactive.

[Chara]

same here, Maki.

[Chara]

I mean after all you want Maki Diamond... what are you doing

trying to get a lynch on either is what i'm doing.

[Chara]

HOW IS THERE A LACK OF CONTENT DIAMOND

[Chara]

there just isn't any way Lycan is scum here. :< Shuichi isn't scum. he's just. bleeding town all over the place.

[Chara]

but Kaede voteparking Lycan and Lycan voteparking me and forcing me to purposefully mislynch Lycan and i just don't know if i want to do something like that even if it seems the only way to a win.

[Chara]

You're not trying hard to push Maki's viability. If it's Diamond who is his partner? Kaede already outlined she only cared about the self vote. Smash it or bring a bigger rock. It's not hard. Bringing up Shuichi is won't get her to consider other options.

Diamond's partner is Maki.
i don't have a bigger rock. Maki vs Dunnstral is a good reason to call Maki town. the reason i've had to accept she's scum anyway is because you're not scum. because Shuichi is not. and i could hammer you whenever i like.
Diamond not being town should be enough to lynch him. i don't know what else to do.

[Chara]

And what about that last "Lynch Diamond for information" piece? That bleeds scum all over the place with Lycan. I'm picking up Shuichi/Lycan vibes. If you do what Shuichi says and lynch me, you let Lycan get away. Yayyyyyyyyyyyyy

i don't think you understand that if either Lycan or Shuichi is sacridiced it confirms the other is scum.

[Chara]

Kaede if Lycan flips town will you listen to me?

pedit: i already believe Kaede is town. above question to you?

[Chara]

Maki, voting Lycan here would be trusting you. i can't promise i'll trust you after his townflip, but i can promise i won't autolynch you and will listen. how's that?

[Chara]

Oh wait except Lycan, because ???? oh right, FATALISM.

yes, as Shuichi said Diamond and Lycan just cannot be scumpartners because Diamond is trying to lynch Lycan, currently.

[Chara]

Just like Maki parked on Dunn most if not all of yesterday and you were like "OH SHE COULD BE SCUM"
Am i right?

Kaede it just isn't the same thing. if Diamond is scum with Lycan he is currently gamethrowing.
if Maki is scum with Dunnstral the two were banking on using their SvS to get the win because it was their only option to get the mislynches they needed.

[Chara]

Are you going to try and lynch me tomorrow, is that it?

Oh so lynching Chara/DS means there's gonna be a tomorrow? k then
VOTE: Shuichi

KAEDE.
both Shuichi and i are convinced we CAN'T get a lynch on Diamond. that's why there will be a tomorrow.

[Chara]

Maki, voting Lycan here would be trusting you. i can't promise i'll trust you after his townflip, but i can promise i won't autolynch you and will listen. how's that?

That's all I can ask really

alright then. :>
i'll do my best.
though Kaede is not voting him anymore, so i can't actually say that.

[Chara]

sorry that last post was confusing edit wise I'm trying to say scum want us to look for teams so they're bussing to look like it's an unlikely team

unfortunately i can't pretend to discount this any longer because it's possible.
fortunately i can still discount Lycan/Diamond because i was the one holding the hammer and Diamond knows how close i was to hammering Lycan.

[Chara]

I've found your posts all game to be town, but I have to consider it given the above.

(I've also found your refusal to vote Diamond despite apparently not having a strong townread on him confusing.)

honestly? it's hurting my townread of Kaede too.
and i want Maki to be town because she's just really easy to work with and i like her in general. which is silly bit there you have it.

[Chara]

What's the dif between me and Dunn being SvS banking on town changing wagons to scum Dimond/Lycan?

the difference is my stress level is at a 9 and if Kaede puts her vote back on Lycan right now i will hammer him.

[Chara]

actually no my stress level is at a 2 because this is just a game and i'm being silly.

pedit: yes, you're right.

[Chara]

i know we have more time but i also just want this game over. you know? i don't know if i can do another say. Shuichi's turnaround on me earlier told me my position is not as good as i'd thought and that i have to be on top of things to avoid being mislynched. i can't in good conscience stop trying to win if there's something i can do about it but i'm also tired of this.

[Chara]

do another *day.

[Chara]

take it as whatever you like, Kaede.
how about there's no conspiracy plot and i'm just completely confused as to why you refuse to vote Diamond.

[Chara]

if i'm scum i don't need to lynch you, Kaede. if i'm scum and you're town, you are not a threat because there are other mislynchable slots.
please take that into account?

[Chara]

How about you read my posts and see that I acknowledge that Wisdom said DS was lynchbait and defended him until scum NK'd him only to now.... try to lynch DS?

i know Wisdom said DS was lynchbait and defended him.
if you want to sheep all of Wisdom's reads then fine. will you really not reconsider? you don't think he was wrong on some of his reads?

[Chara]

Chara, I apologize for repeatedly randomly changing your gender.

it's fine, i know it's easy to slip. i appreciate the apology though.

[Chara]

Recall what happened yesterday?
Maki considered me scum coz i hadn't unvoted her, and Chara immediately went through the game to paint my posts as fake.

it had nothing to do with Maki's read on you and everything to do with feeling paranoid about your slot all on my own.

[Chara]

and again, scum Chara is not starved for mislynches.

at all

. i wouldn't need to go digging in locktownreads for mislynches.

[Chara]

Oh so you got paranoid again coincidentially with Shuichi saying im a potential partner?

i know you don't believe me so i don't know why i'm bothering but no, i had been considering you were scum due to not voting Diamond but now i see it's because Wisdom stated an early townread there.
thanks Wisdom.

[Chara]

if Maki ends up being town, by the way, it's Diamond/Shuichi. through nothing else besides other teams being impossible. i think.

[Chara]

ah, no. Lycan/Shuichi, of course.

[Chara]

but Shuichi is so

town

and i

want

Maki to be town but.

[Chara]

Wisdom saying DS was lynchbait doesn't make DS town, though. yes, Diamond's townplay gets him mislynched. that doesn't mean he can't be scum. if Wisdom were alive

now

and still held that opinion after experiencing the rest of the game, then i'd be comfortable trusting it.

[Chara]

but Shuichi is so

town

and i

want

Maki to be town but.

I rather you vote me and we lose by you thinking I'm scum then you just letting me slip by due to liking me I don't want that

don't worry, that's just me complaining. if i was going to lynch players i didn't like Lycan would be triple dead right about now.

[Chara]

i can't make myself lynch Lycan while thinking he's town any more than i could avoid lynching you just because i like your play.

[Chara]

ok, i'm going to take a break.
VOTE: Diamond
if we no lynch, it is what it is. i'll suck it up and keep trying if it happens.

[Chara]

But idgi, then why NK Wisdom if he was supposedly so wrong on DS? Wisdom would just defend him.

because Wisdom is a scary player to play scum against, so better to nightkill him before he fixes his reads, as they don't tend to stay the same during the entire game.
and even better to take him out when he's still townreading Diamond.

[Chara]

i'd go as far as to say that Wisdom just makes sense as a kill regardless of his reads. scum Diamond would know that if Diamond started making sense as scum, Wisdom would reconsider the townread.

[Chara]

i'm now convinced Kaede is town. if i start suspecting she's scum for the third time then Kaede, please quote this post. i mean it. i'll listen to myself.