Mini 1867 -- TBD Mafia [game over]

[Desperado]

VOTE: McMenno

^serious vote is serious

[Desperado]

So....McMenno????

[Desperado]

hmmmm



nah

[Desperado]

Is Lane town?

Could be ya.

Find scum intent in mcmeemo posting.

Faking the PR; no meaningful response to his wagon; no thoughts on dreal responding to his wagon for him.

[Desperado]

Even if everyone answered truthfully both on the questionnaire and in their answers here I don't think we'd be able to deduce anything from that information. We don't know what kind of assumptions xyzzy was making to interpret the data and make design decisions.

I don't know if it's necessarily anti-town, mainly because merely discussing this issue can provide alignment indicators, but I do think it could end up dominating the discussion and give scum an easy IIoA avenue.

[Desperado]

Ya that's kind of weird. I was going to say that it's kind of similar to what I said but it's really not.

[Desperado]

um

lane is town as shit

[Desperado]

Still feeling really good about a McMenno vote

[Desperado]

So scum are or are not on you currently?

[Desperado]

you call that effort on a snarky lynch???

noooo, again, that is you just framing a narrative how you want to see it

HORRIBLY OBVIOUSLY TOO

um

No it's not. "Participate or die" cannot be interpreted any other way than as a threat to vote him for lurking.

[Desperado]

you're literally SITTING THERE WAITING TO FIND ANYTHING YOU CAN TO TWIST IT INTO SOMETHING ELSE

AND DOING ACTUALLY NOTHING OF YOUR OWN

So is he sitting there waiting to twist what you say into something else, or is he doing nothing of his own?

[Desperado]

I don't even think Dreal is scum. If he IS scum exhibiting this level of town paranoia, I would be highly impressed. Has anyone played with him before?

[Desperado]

???

Explain to me how I'm wrong.

[Desperado]

My thoughts concern the second part Re: McMenno. Note that Narna's request was for Desperado to point out things about McMenno's posts that had scum motivation. However, two out of the three reasons Desperado gives imply that a lack of specific posting from McMenno is scummy. (The PR thing is up in the air, since we are talking about "McMeme-o" after all. I'm not going to digress to argue the strength of this reason.) McMenno didn't have a meaningful response to his wagon, but neither did Davsto, and Davsto's was bigger. The last reason is misapplied to the actual situation, so I cannot discern whether it is bogus scum reasoning or an honest mistake. However, I can explain the misapplication. Drealmerz wasn't responding to the McMenno wagon per se, he was responding to Lane questioning him about his own concern for the wagon.

When a player is wagoned he has four options:

1) Ignore it and do nothing else
2) Ignore it and continue scumhunting
3) Address it and do nothing else
4) Address it and continue scumhunting

1) and 3) lean scum, 2) and 4) lean town. McMenno and Davsto clearly reacted differently to their wagons so I'm curious what leads you to suggest that I'm "misapplying" anything here.

As for the last bit, Drealmerz questioned multiple McMenno votes--that is a response to the McMenno wagon, by definition. He carried a conversation on with lane regarding it, but if another player goes out of his way to question multiple votes on my town slot in RVS, I would want to know why and I would expect other townies to feel similarly.

The last sentence pings me because (1) it reads as fence-sitting about the discussion as a whole, whereas most (active) players have taken a hard stance on it, and (2) KainTepes and drealmerz had just gone through a lengthy back-and-forth about the discussion at hand, but Desperado doesn't elaborate about what, if any "alignment indicators" he picked up on from their exchange -- this begs the questions
-If the KainTepes/drealmerz exchange didn't provide any alignment indicators (side note: I think it did), what type of indicators should we actually be searching for with regards to the questionnaire-reveal discussion? &
-If the exchange did provide alignment indicators, why didn't Desperado share these at the time? Why bring up the fact that the discussion can provide alignment indicators if you aren't going to talk about them?

Up to now Kain and Dreal are the only people truly engaging the questionnaire discussion and I have shared my Dreal read so I'm not really sure where you're going with this.

[Desperado]

If you're not voting davsto, you're wrong.

Lane is a good choice otherwise though.

"Snarky steps back up to the plate down 0-2 in the count, and the pitch..."

[Desperado]

I mean twou ouf thouse points are literally I was nout oun at the time sou I've resigned to him being either a lyncher oun me our bad scum

Are they?

I will OUVERTHROUW this nefarious brit

VOTE: mcmenno

why the vote on mcmenno?

VOTE: McMenno

mcmenno, did you poop inside or something?

are you nout oumgusing, davstou

You're active lurking, you aren't outwardly attempting to game solve or help anyone else do so, and I want you dead.

[Desperado]

@ zefriend: "Hell, he even voted himself" come on. Davsto self voted in RVS. Once RVS was over, he began scumhunting. McMenno has not.

I don't care if there was a bigger wagon on someone else, I care that McMenno didn't care to comment on the votes on him, or on dreal's questioning of the votes on him, or on lane's questioning of dreals' questioning. McMenno was a key player in the early game and he doesn't have any thoughts on anything that happened. He's scum.

As for your last point, the alignment indicators are still going. The questionnaire discussion isn't over. Dreal was suggesting that we should never talk about it ever, I was suggesting that we should because even if the information isn't trustworthy or relevant, each players' response to it will be meaningful. Saying my methodology is bunk when it isn't even remotely close to be complete is pretty silly.

[Desperado]

lane wants to be a mod
lane should sign up to mod

I mean...3/10 of frank's post game in pre game. 2 more are prod dodges. And now he won't be active for another 8 days, at least?

[Desperado]

You know, when the deadline is

[Desperado]

You forgot the third option--the theory is correct but results are still being collected as testing is still ongoing.

[Desperado]

Also the day after my sons bday

Awesome man, enjoy his birthday.

....what does that have to do with the fact that you will have essentially not played the entire day phase tho?

[Desperado]

Idk why you're being so dodgy about this.

What am I being dodgy about? You're asking me for reads I don't have.

[Desperado]

I do have reads. Zefriend wants reads that are specifically related to the questionnaire discussion.

[Desperado]

Read my ISO then man, I'm not even sure what we're talking about anymore.

[Desperado]

If you've read my ISO then you would have seen the reads I've seen fit to divulge. They are reads I feel strongly enough about to give and support if necessary. If I haven't given a read on someone, it's because they don't lean one way or the other yet, or there's conflicting information, or any other of a number of reasons why I wouldn't have given a read on someone yet.

[Desperado]

Kain - I'd question anyone who has a clear read here

Narna - He's gotten several top town reads; I haven't seen anything either way

[Desperado]

ATTENTION; ALL THREE OF THE CURRENT WAGONS ARE ON TOWN.

[Desperado]

What do you think of Narna's tone and approach to the game? They seem to be narrating more than giving opinions (with a few exceptions) and playing it rather safe in general. In my quick Iso of them, I saw a lot of almost content, but not much that really had anything to it.

Aye. That doesn't make them scum, either, but the hard townreads raise eyebrows for sure.

[Desperado]

Can you elaborate on this?

Think I already have. Lane, dreal, and davsto are all town.

[Desperado]

"none of you have actually changed your votes since the last votecount," says the omnipotent voice in the sky, "but there's a couple of prods in the mod notes, so here's another votecount!"

"what the fuck is a votecount, and what the fuck is a mod notes," says everyone in exasperation simultaneously. it's actually pretty impressive.

"well," says the voice in the sky, "wait until I tell you about 'pedits'. that'll blow your minds."

votecount 1.08

3 players voting for drealmerz7 (Davsto, Aristophanes, lane0168)
3 players voting for lane0168 (Narna, drealmerz7, FrankJaeger)
2 players voting for Davsto (McMenno, SnarkySnowman)
1 player voting for McMenno (Desperado)
1 player voting for Desperado (ɀefiend)
1 player voting for ɀefiend (Azral)
1 player voting for Azral (KainTepes)

1 player not voting (Gamma Emerald)

with 13 players alive, it takes 7 votes to lynch

the day will end in (expired on 2017-01-23 18:00:00)

mod notes: Gamma Emerald is V/LA until January 17 and has been prodded. Narna and Davsto have been prodded. p-edit: Davsto was able to post in the thread in the like 2 minutes between me sending the prod and making this post. good job, Davsto.

Davsto wagon is definitely the worst. Like, early contender for Worst Wagon of the Year.

Frank's vote on lane looks the worst, for sure. Dreal and Narna have at least been open about why they think lane is scum, they're just mistaken.

@ Davsto and lane; stop voting dreal and help me lynch McMenno, ya?

[Desperado]

Do you think scum are active or lurking?

[Desperado]

In this particular game.

[Desperado]

{Azral, Frank, Snarky, McMenno}

2 scum here I reckon

[Desperado]

you didn't address my point

I don't care if McMenno has been lynchbait in the past or whatever your experience with him. In this game his active lurking and lack of engagement are scummy.

[Desperado]

Is Lane town?

Could be ya.

Find scum intent in mcmeemo posting.

Faking the PR; no meaningful response to his wagon; no thoughts on dreal responding to his wagon for him.

um

lane is town as shit

My thoughts concern the second part Re: McMenno. Note that Narna's request was for Desperado to point out things about McMenno's posts that had scum motivation. However, two out of the three reasons Desperado gives imply that a lack of specific posting from McMenno is scummy. (The PR thing is up in the air, since we are talking about "McMeme-o" after all. I'm not going to digress to argue the strength of this reason.) McMenno didn't have a meaningful response to his wagon, but neither did Davsto, and Davsto's was bigger. The last reason is misapplied to the actual situation, so I cannot discern whether it is bogus scum reasoning or an honest mistake. However, I can explain the misapplication. Drealmerz wasn't responding to the McMenno wagon per se, he was responding to Lane questioning him about his own concern for the wagon.

When a player is wagoned he has four options:

1) Ignore it and do nothing else
2) Ignore it and continue scumhunting
3) Address it and do nothing else
4) Address it and continue scumhunting

1) and 3) lean scum, 2) and 4) lean town. McMenno and Davsto clearly reacted differently to their wagons so I'm curious what leads you to suggest that I'm "misapplying" anything here.

As for the last bit, Drealmerz questioned multiple McMenno votes--that is a response to the McMenno wagon, by definition. He carried a conversation on with lane regarding it, but if another player goes out of his way to question multiple votes on my town slot in RVS, I would want to know why and I would expect other townies to feel similarly.

The last sentence pings me because (1) it reads as fence-sitting about the discussion as a whole, whereas most (active) players have taken a hard stance on it, and (2) KainTepes and drealmerz had just gone through a lengthy back-and-forth about the discussion at hand, but Desperado doesn't elaborate about what, if any "alignment indicators" he picked up on from their exchange -- this begs the questions
-If the KainTepes/drealmerz exchange didn't provide any alignment indicators (side note: I think it did), what type of indicators should we actually be searching for with regards to the questionnaire-reveal discussion? &
-If the exchange did provide alignment indicators, why didn't Desperado share these at the time? Why bring up the fact that the discussion can provide alignment indicators if you aren't going to talk about them?

Up to now Kain and Dreal are the only people truly engaging the questionnaire discussion and I have shared my Dreal read so I'm not really sure where you're going with this.

If you're not voting davsto, you're wrong.

Lane is a good choice otherwise though.

"Snarky steps back up to the plate down 0-2 in the count, and the pitch..."

[Desperado]

Me consistently townreading the three leading wagons and then declaring all three of the leading wagons being on town (with the implication being that we should go another direction) isn't elaborating on it?

[Desperado]

you are evading

why is it scummy here and not at other times?

what makes it scummy here

how can I learn to differentiate between the two? tell me what you see is what I'm asking

quit evading

Not following your meta read that amounts to "he gets lynched a lot d1" doesn't mean I'm evading. I legitimately don't care.

It's not a matter of learning to differentiate, it's a matter of lynching what's scummy. And being active while not adding anything substantive, especially when you should be a part of the discussion but you aren't, is scummy.

[Desperado]

Me consistently townreading the three leading wagons and then declaring all three of the leading wagons being on town (with the implication being that we should go another direction) isn't elaborating on it?

I don't see the town motivation from Dreal. Lane I agree with, and Dav I'm still sorting but want to play with longer, so not voting there.

Tell me fhy you townread them.

Everything that occurred between he and Kain was town. I said this at the time.

I'm really not being cagey about any of this so I don't understand why people keep making me repeat myself.

[Desperado]

@ Dreal, relax man. I'm not evading anything.

McMenno is active lurking and is not even bothering to attempt to solve the game.

^Scumtells. I think he's scum. I want to lynch him for playing this game in a scummy way, because that's what you fucking do in Mafia. You lynch people who do scummy things.

Him lurking in a previous game and flipping town is irrelevant.

[Desperado]

No, I'm not. I've developed town reads on three players, a vote count was posted that showed those three as the only wagons with more than one vote, and I wanted to call attention to everyone that all of the leading wagons are shit.

^What is cagey about this?

[Desperado]

I've said repeatedly that I don't care if he's lurked as town before.

What do you make of him contradicting your meta read?

[Desperado]

Just stop, dreal. I am reading your words. I do not care if you've seen him lurk as town before. That doesn't make him town this game!

What do you make of McMenno contradicting exactly what we're discussing right now?

[Desperado]

I have explained why McMenno's active lurking is scummy multiple times.

[Desperado]

Perhaps you could try ISOing me and then ctrl+Fing "mcmenno" and then following my progression on him. That might clue you in.

[Desperado]

oh ok

[Desperado]

No, I mean you're projecting your own interpretation onto Desp's posts to try to make sense of his read. But without Desp actually saying the words, that's all it is and quite likely to be wrong. Is he the type to recommend we just policy lynch all the active lurkers? I kind of doubt it.

Is that what I'm doing tho?

Cuz...I'm pretty sure it isn't.

[Desperado]

I'm pushing McMenno and not Frank or Snarky because McMenno is lurking AND he's doing it in a scummy way AND he isn't trying to solve the game AND all of the key players thus far look town to me so my working theory is that scum saw the dreal vs kain > dreal vs lane > dreal vs davsto (is anyone seeing a pattern here???? dreal isn't scum) battles and said "hahahaha NOP"

[Desperado]

Dreal I'm sorry man, I've said it three or four times. I can't say it any other way. If 554 doesn't explain it then just move on and tilt someone else's windmill.

[Desperado]

Don Quixote, tilting at windmills

[Desperado]

OK, so if not McMenno and not lane, then who?

Azral?

[Desperado]

no

They're both town. Who else?

[Desperado]

I could vote Snarky. He only has 6 posts and 390 and 440 are two of the worst posts in the whole game.

[Desperado]

It's meant more as a signal that we aren't going to lynch either one today so who can we agree on.

[Desperado]

OK, 489 is two days old and absolutely nothing has changed. We have five days.

@ Azral, KainTepes, zefriend, dreal, Gamma:

Why aren't you voting one of dreal/lane/davsto? Your wagon/non vote is doing nothing but you also aren't doing anything to diffuse the leading wagons.

@ Davsto, lane

Seriously, stop voting dreal. Look elsewhere.

@ Narna

Your lane vote blows and you've offered two alternatives "if lane doesn't have any takers." Well, we're here.

[Desperado]

I've given my reasons for not voting the leading wagons and for why McMenno is scum and I'm not willing to let it go. Dreal's been at 3 votes for over a week. It's not happening and you aren't pressuring him.

[Desperado]

... Did you just suggest dreal as a viable wagon? And then ask why we're voting there? Cause that's weird.

No, I'm asking the 5 people who aren't voting one of the leading wagons why they aren't voting the leading wagons.

[Desperado]

So you don't think any of dreal, lane, I, zefiend, Azral or Aristophanes are scum? And you're too stubborn to push a lynch which at least has a good chance of flipping scum and instead will push a lynch that you're certain is scum but is unlikely to flip?

I could vote Azral, but I don't feel compelled to switch my vote right now, especially if the leading wagons disperse as I anticipate they will, which will obviously change the voting landscape.

[Desperado]

does this really strike you as a game where scum are concerned about looking busy???

[Desperado]

@ Lane I get it man, really. But Narna isn't getting lynched today either.

[Desperado]

Narna is scumediating a dispute that doesn't even exist.

He wasn't "throwing shade," he misunderstood what I said and then asked a question about it, which I answered.

[Desperado]

It doesn't matter how many times you say it, he did not twist my words. He was confused so he asked me what I said. He didn't throw shade, he didn't approach me with hostility, and he also responded to my question to him constructively as well. Then I cleared up the confusion and we moved along.

[Desperado]

OK, 489 is two days old and absolutely nothing has changed. We have five days.

@ Azral, KainTepes, zefriend, dreal, Gamma:

Why aren't you voting one of dreal/lane/davsto? Your wagon/non vote is doing nothing but you also aren't doing anything to diffuse the leading wagons.

@ Davsto, lane

Seriously, stop voting dreal. Look elsewhere.

@ Narna

Your lane vote blows and you've offered two alternatives "if lane doesn't have any takers." Well, we're here.

"why aren't you guys voting dreal lane or davsto"

"why are you guys voting dreal"

... Did you just suggest dreal as a viable wagon? And then ask why we're voting there? Cause that's weird.

What's id lynch Frank for his bs case on me. And I'd vote Narna if it was worth it.

But I'm staying in dreal, because I'm not voting davsto, and I'm not voting myself. Like you said. 5 days

Here you go, Narna.

[Desperado]

lol

[Desperado]

@ dreal, zefriend, Narna, KainTepes, lane

Look at that VC. Frank and Ari are gone until deadline. Three slots are useless piles of lurk.

If you're doing the math in your head, that means there's 8 active slots and it takes 7 to lynch. It's also been like pulling teeth getting this McMenno wagon going...if he's town and the scum aren't lurking, I don't think that would be the case.

Let's coalesce around this lynch and start moving forward, yeah?

[Desperado]

@ dreal, zefriend, Narna, KainTepes, lane

Look at that VC. Frank and Ari are gone until deadline. Three slots are useless piles of lurk.

If you're doing the math in your head, that means there's 8 active slots and it takes 7 to lynch. It's also been like pulling teeth getting this McMenno wagon going...if he's town and the scum aren't lurking, I don't think that would be the case.

Let's coalesce around this lynch and start moving forward, yeah?

[Desperado]

I dunno, this smells like a trap. Why out Ari?

What kind of trap does it smell like?

[Desperado]

Sweet!

Now vote the claimed survivor so we can move on.

[Desperado]

That vote count literally makes me weep for humanity

[Desperado]

I don't think that will be necessary.

[Desperado]

he claimed survivor

[Desperado]

you know, an anti-town role

[Desperado]

oh

you're claiming scum? or...???

[Desperado]

9v2v2 is effectively 9v4, McMenno and Ari are just traitors that aren't actually aligned with scum. Lynching them is absolutely advancing your wincon if you are town.

[Desperado]

We lynch McMenno to avoid anyone else claiming or costing us a mislynch, and then we ignore Ari until we're forced in to lynching him or risking a loss. It's 8v2v1 tomorrow, which gives town two mislynches.

[Desperado]

or he's just scum!

so many reasons

[Desperado]

Kain

[Desperado]

Vote McMenno

[Desperado]

lololololololol

[Desperado]

I think it's safe to assume that Dreal shot Lane, scum shot Dreal, and a third party (likely town vig) shot Ari.

It is now 7v2 or maybe even 7v1. I think a mass claim would just about end the game.

[Desperado]

My preferred order would be:

Frank
Snarky
Narna
Azral
KainTepes
Alisae
zefriend
Davsto

[Desperado]

He was pretty town

[Desperado]

Can you be more specific?

[Desperado]

VOTE: Snarky

[Desperado]

Really no need Ali. We can finish the mass claim and win right now.

[Desperado]

Sure if you want to start and popcorn it

[Desperado]

Ya I hear you about being cocky but when you elimanate two factions in the first two phases of the game and then get a guilty, I mean...

[Desperado]

i really just want to mass claim, especially to account for the 3rd kill. if it's town, the game truly is over

[Desperado]

Unvote

i don't care how we do it, mass claim is optimal with zefriend's guilty

[Desperado]

either the game ends or it's 7v1 going in to night and we mass claim tomorrow anyway

[Desperado]

VOTE: snarky

bro why did you even join this game

[Desperado]

jesus christ man

who next???

[Desperado]

ok cool

it's your turn

let's hear it

[Desperado]

LOL WHAT THE FUCK

[Desperado]

presumably 2 of the factions are gone, town is 1, we have 4 factions left. You read 7 correctly.

Oh you're just completely bullshitting

[Desperado]

So I have a weird role, it's basically a town game-ender / lyncher. So if it's just town and one faction left, I auto-win for the town. I also got info on how many non-town factions there are, and there are 7. Scum, survivalist, SK, ???, ???, and ???, ??? (i'm filling in blanks, I don't know the ???s). I get extra game info on those factions + some hidden ability if I personally hammer davsto.

tl;dr massclaim shouldn't win the game we still have to scumhunt

And lynching for the info may be a bad idea if we have that much scum left and davsto is town :/ I don't win upon making that lynch

presumably 2 of the factions are gone, town is 1, we have 4 factions left. You read 7 correctly." class="postlink">presumably 2 of the factions are gone, town is 1, we have 4 factions left. You read 7 correctly.

[Desperado]

It's not real, he's already forgotten his fakeclaim lol

[Desperado]

Ya, I am.

[Desperado]

Azral, you've been popcorned. Where you at bro

[Desperado]

MFW Snarky's claim is the most believable so far

[Desperado]

zefriend, how often to you gambit? I did not take you for that kind of player.

Why snarky?

Be more specific about the reads you gathered from your reaction test. I know you're more than capable of it so the lack of depth here is a huge red flag.

[Desperado]

hey

CANE TEEEEEPS

!!!!!!

CLAIM BRO!!!

[Desperado]

*fart*

[Desperado]

[Desperado]

is that all you do kain?

[Desperado]

like, when you check the person's answers...what happens????

[Desperado]

oh ok

you need to popcorn to someone else

is it me?

[Desperado]

I'm a Mason.

Narna, your turn.

[Desperado]

:iiam:

[Desperado]

btw Desperado you're fun to play with
<3

<3

still getting back in to the swing of things

drawing conftown helps!

[Desperado]

also, narna isn't my mason partner lmao

i think narna is scum

[Desperado]

nah

[Desperado]

Desperado - Mason
Davsto - Mason Vig
Narna - Census Taker?
Alisae - Watcher
Azral - Vig
KainTepes - Questionnaire Checker
Zefriend - Questionnaire Cop
SnarkySnowman - Informed Lyncher
Frank - Conditional Doctor

[Desperado]

So no one can account for Azral's shot not killing, which means Snarky is kill immune or Azral is lying.

[Desperado]

And Azral not wanting to lynch Snarky suggests the latter lol

[Desperado]

but he didn't claim bp

unless i missed that

[Desperado]

So I have a weird role, it's basically a town game-ender / lyncher. So if it's just town and one faction left, I auto-win for the town. I also got info on how many non-town factions there are, and there are 7. Scum, survivalist, SK, ???, ???, and ???, ??? (i'm filling in blanks, I don't know the ???s). I get extra game info on those factions + some hidden ability if I personally hammer davsto.

tl;dr massclaim shouldn't win the game we still have to scumhunt

And lynching for the info may be a bad idea if we have that much scum left and davsto is town :/ I don't win upon making that lynch

Don't forget possibility of doctor / jk / busdriver / nexus / lightningrod giver / any other number of roles that could change the kill direction. I'm pretty sure I'm not BP.

Also now we have two normal roles...

[Desperado]

Vote: Azral

[Desperado]

lmao this dude has masons on 2nd tier

good job great effort

[Desperado]

still 100% ok with killing narna

[Desperado]

It would be a pretty shitty groupscum kill, but there are potentially a fuckton of third party in this game. If you only have the one shot like Ari, then I think locking down a mason claim with it would be solid. This compounds with Desperado pushing for the massclaim which makes the masonry a lower priority nk target. You two still seem town from your play, but this isn't the game to treat masons as confirm town.

lmao i pushed for a mass claim when we had a fucking cop guilty out

you know, when we had 3 confirmed town and one scum left, maximum

you're so goddamn scummy

[Desperado]

>3 confirmed town and one scum left maximum

Sorry what? I get the 3 confirmed town from your perspective but what do you mean by the other part

if you had flipped scum there would only be one scum left, max. any more would mean we started with an SK, three group scum, and a two man survivor team, which means it would have been 7 v 3 v 2 v 1

ps i dont trust anything you say. your information suggests it was two man survivor team + sk + one scum + three other third parties (four if you go by what you said originally), which means it would have been....6v2v1v1v1v1v1(v1)?

lol

[Desperado]

im always here babe

[Desperado]

because davsto is confirmed town

[Desperado]

because davsto is confirmed town

Hi please quote / link me where we know this from

pretty sure that would get me modkilled

[Desperado]

which would still ironically confirm davsto as town

[Desperado]

i think snarky's just lying

mainly because i don't think half the playerlist prefers 3rd party, that's crazytalk

[Desperado]

So you admit roles aren't random!
This is progress.

i don't remember suggesting otherwise

[Desperado]

oh the mod is a faction too now?

another town faction??????????

just stop bro

[Desperado]

So I have a weird role, it's basically a town game-ender / lyncher. So if it's just town and one faction left, I auto-win for the town. I also got info on how many non-town factions there are, and there are 7. Scum, survivalist, SK, ???, ???, and ???, ??? (i'm filling in blanks, I don't know the ???s). I get extra game info on those factions + some hidden ability if I personally hammer davsto.

tl;dr massclaim shouldn't win the game we still have to scumhunt

And lynching for the info may be a bad idea if we have that much scum left and davsto is town :/ I don't win upon making that lynch

presumably 2 of the factions are gone, town is 1, we have 4 factions left. You read 7 correctly.

you're saying it's not real because I derped and forgot town was included in those factions

excuse me if I had to reread my complicated ass role pm again

i think snarky's just lying

mainly because i don't think half the playerlist prefers 3rd party, that's crazytalk

We've seen SK + 3p team + assume groupscum + town, that's 4. there could be another 3p, another town faction, and the mod to make 7. Like there are lots of ways for this to be true.

Do you think I'd make that shit up? Like I know it's ridiculous, and I feel like I'm pretty knowledgeable when it comes to setup stuff, I wouldn't make something like this up and expect it to be believable as a fakeclaim :T

[Desperado]

First you knew how many non-town factions there were, then town was one of the seven factions, and now you think the seven factions includes two distinct town factions (???) and the mod (???????????)

[Desperado]

Desperado, what's your personal read on that? Believable?


(I admit I got watcher and tracker confused in my head for a bit.)

i mean it sounds nice

a full watcher in this setup is kinda dumb tho

[Desperado]

such as?

[Desperado]

also im really creeped out how this game went from dead to 100 during the mass claim to dead again

[Desperado]

unvote
vote: alisae

[Desperado]

alisae's been at l-1 for like

ages

[Desperado]

hey look deadline is 14 hours away

[Desperado]

DESPERADO IT'S BEEN 12 HOURS!

ya

that's a really really long time

[Desperado]

you have to admit, the kid has heart

[Desperado]

Vote: Azral

[Desperado]

FYI I don't give a fuck about trying to convince anyone I'm town.

VOTE: Kain Tepes
Seems like the most likely suspect from here (though I'd love for him to make a case on someone else).

one-shot scum vig

interesting

[Desperado]

vote: snarkysnowman

[Desperado]

you're seriously speccing davsto and i as scum, still?

[Desperado]

so we're scum with azral? or a 2nd team? or what?

[Desperado]

theres no way the game started with four scum wtf are you talking about

[Desperado]

7v4v2 is not a thing that happened and i have no idea why you think it is

[Desperado]

btw i'm voting snarky, not you, so i'm not sure where you're getting any of this shit

[Desperado]

narna your role being semi confirmable doesnt even make it town so who gives a shit

[Desperado]

We can compromise on Snarky today since the masons are basically absent right now.

I'll cop Frank just to be sure, then we lynch Narna. If I die, lynch Frank then lynch Narna anyway.

VOTE: SnarkySnowman

????

[Desperado]

what the fuck are davsto and i if we aren't town exactly??

we have two flipped scum and two flipped survivors. are you seriously suggesting this game started 7v2v2v2 or 7v4v2 or what??????????

[Desperado]

They did not claim Mason, the lamented NOT claiming Mason's after they had already been outted.

[Desperado]

And yes a 0 person faction makes total sense, yup

[Desperado]

what I don't understand is what any of you have to gain from pushing us. You can only mislynch one of us and there haven't been any deaths in two nights so what's the point?

[Desperado]

and there's no way we are in LYLO right now

[Desperado]

Narna/zefriend is not town/town.

[Desperado]

If we lynch zefriend either he's scum so yay! Or he's town and we get three clears from it.

[Desperado]

I wasn't pushing you so why would you want to lynch me?

This is objectively bad play. Lynching Snarky gives me another invest, guaranteed (or else Frank comes under suspicion). If I get NK'd, town gets 3 clears anyway.

Snarky is 1)admitted non-Town 2)trying to lynch the Cop 3)caught lying [twice]

Let's not drag this Day out.

lol why would you need to be pushing me for me to lynch you?

if you're real your flip offers the most information of anyone in the entire game and that isn't really disputable. it confirms the masons and kain tepes as town. i shouldnt have to explain to you why that would be beneficial.

[Desperado]

+ you can also just be scum lying

[Desperado]

A faction with 0 to start that ends with people later is called the dead. That would be amusing and also line up with Narnas info and explain my own info some.

Where are you getting 3 clears from though? I'm all for the lynch yes, but zefiend claimed 1 result on a dead person, 1 result on davsto, and one on KT. He also claimed a result on me. If he faked one, why could he not have faked another?

Either way I suspect it to be a scum slot anyway. We can lynch one of desp/dav too but I think zefiend is a good start.

davsto + desperado + kain tepes

1 + 1 + 1 = 3

[Desperado]

yeah you can die at any point snarky

[Desperado]

you and narna are both pretty clearly doing whatever you can to keep other slots lynchable

[Desperado]

And our masons are wierdly silent

Davsto is Vla and I havent been silent at all...

[Desperado]

I'm trying to lynch other slots, shocker. Snarky is making a good amount of sense, and even the Davsto part of his role is fitting into my current suspicions about this game.

you and narna are both pretty clearly doing whatever you can to keep other slots lynchable

You're trying to make slots that aren't yourself lynchable too. Pretty sure that's what mafia players do, regardless of alignment.

I think I've been pretty clear on my reads though. To put succinctly:

SCUM {zefiend}
SCUM POSSIBLE {Davsto Desp}
NOT SURE / NO CONTENT {KT}
TOWN {Frank Narna}

zefiend's reason for wanting me lynched is because there's a lyncher aspect in my role. He wants the easy lynch because all he has to do is say "LOL SNARKY IS 3P EZ LYNCH" and he doesn't have to do anything else to get to night, and tomorrow say "oh fuck guys snarky was town also I faked my last cop result to focus us LOL"

--- <--the point




---- ---- <--your heads

[Desperado]

vote: narna

[Desperado]

or

[Desperado]

vote: frank

[Desperado]

unvote

[Desperado]

i mean the game is basically over at this point

zef isnt scum

we're masons

narna, frank

why should we kill the other one first?

[Desperado]

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Desperado]

VOTE: McMenno

^serious vote is serious

My preferred order would be:

Frank
Snarky
Narna
Azral
KainTepes
Alisae
zefriend
Davsto

yo my reads were on fire this game

[Desperado]

this setup was not very town friendly either

7v3v1v1v1

pretty crazy to think what could have happened if n1 had gone differently