Mini 1898 - Inception Mafia - The Hub (GAME OVER)

[MathBlade]

Meh. Water bridge. I literally outed me and my scum partner. If you out 2/3rds your team ya kinda probably should lose.

[Infinity 324]

You guys weren't conf scum to us though. We still had to cop you and hiraki was largely an info lynch for me.

[Not Chara]

Mainly the way you approached reading people and solving the game. I could tell there were things going on in your head that you didn't state outright. There were probably other things, but I'd have to look back.

appreciate the answer. i want to do whatever it is i did a second time.

Infinity: i was scumreading you some for your opinion that it was townsided. i see it was justified in hindsight, but at the time i thought you might know something the town who were discouraged didn't, and didn't have that bias that town might have. of course i should have been more discerning and gerry is the proof.

[Infinity 324]

Without the infinite cop it would've been a lot better though, to be fair.

[Infinity 324]

I'll put it this way: if there was even a little suspicion on gerry town probably would've won without the cop.

[MathBlade]

Town played well IMHO setup problems aside. Game was still fun.

[inspectorscout]

I reserved the post so I will repost it there but

First thing: I really haven't had much time lately, and modding a game like this was really hard. Without dunn, impossible. I'm sorry for delay, you were better at deadlines than me

Next, setup. I missed the cop. Reviewers missed it. FA made an error. Because of it, the game was insanely unbalanced. After everything, we should have given scum factionals. Cop should have been adjusted.

To fix the setup, we gave scum a factional, but by then it was too late. We are really sorry for that.

Lastly, I also apologize for the several mod errors. I have learned that, if you comod a game, EVERYTHING has to be standardized and written down somewhere. In a game like this, that was nearly impossible, and that caused some confusion.

I do believe that the dream mechanic, if worked on, does have potential. I'm happy some of you want to use it and improve it, and I would love to see how you use it.

Thanks for the comments on the flavor, I worked p long on it. There is more unused subconscious flavor in the design pt, which I will release soon.

Thanks, and sorry for our mistakes! Respect to the scumteam who kept playing, even after they knew they were boned.

[MathBlade]

I just hope everyone had fun. If that happened this game was a success.

[Frozen Angel]

You guys weren't conf scum to us though. We still had to cop you and hiraki was largely an info lynch for me.

Thats the thing that went wrong

information should be kept secret. that made the game unbalance a little bit.

@inspec : you did great, I just wished if you guys had more time when running this.

The game was far away from what I had in mind - perfection wise I try to make sure that won't be the way my games will end if I ever mod any

[Frozen Angel]

I'll put it this way: if there was even a little suspicion on gerry town probably would've won without the cop.

It wasn't that imbalanced that you're telling this like a fact I call this 60-40 in favor of town and that's enough balance imo, mafia has to use deception and skills

[Not Chara]

anyone who would like to discuss the dream mechanic further and how it could be improved should definitely do so here or contact me about it.

[Not Chara]

scout: thanks for tolerating my, what, 20 PMs in the last 48 hours of the game?

[Neko Tail]

Heh
I've known worse
When you're designing your game, you can ask me as a reviewer.

Scum hss 24 hours to request redactions before it gets released. No, dreaming will not extend that deadline.

[Infinity 324]

I'll put it this way: if there was even a little suspicion on gerry town probably would've won without the cop.

It wasn't that imbalanced that you're telling this like a fact I call this 60-40 in favor of town and that's enough balance imo, mafia has to use deception and skills

I said probably. You're allowed to disagree

[Infinity 324]

anyone who would like to discuss the dream mechanic further and how it could be improved should definitely do so here or contact me about it.

I'd consider not having the kick mechanic. It makes dreaming a more serious and makes things a little less complicated.

[Not Chara]

Heh
I've known worse
When you're designing your game, you can ask me as a reviewer.

Scum hss 24 hours to request redactions before it gets released. No, dreaming will not extend that deadline.

hahaha, don't say that. i'll take it as a challenge.

and thank you! i'll ask when that time comes and hope you have time.

pedit: noted. i'll think about alternatives.

[Infinity 324]

The most important thing I would say is to make it less complex and less about mechanics and more about scumhunting.

[Not Chara]

I'm considering something that involves just giving every player their own private thread they always have read/write access to in addition to a public main thread. As players entered/left a subconscious they would get access or lose it.
So it would lose the Inception-esque levels aspect, which could lower the complexity.

I'm heavily inspired by this game, don't get me wrong. It had fantastic component ideas.

[Infinity 324]

That could be interesting. And then depending on the player's role, something different could happen in each dream. Kind of like in this game.

[Not Chara]

oh god, i'm writing with sentence capitals in the document and it leaked onto a site-post. i have to go to bed before i make any more blunders involving my crafted posting style.

pedit: yes, that's the idea.
i'll see how exploring Psychonauts flavour gives me ideas on what would be fun for people.

[Not Chara]

this is just the perfect excuse to finally get Psychonauts for PC.
i'm tempted to put Binding of Isaac on hold and concentrate here, but it might be better to have a more normal mini theme under my belt before attempting to run something with so many PTs.

everyone: i did have fun! even if my mood wasn't the best all of the way through the game.

[Dunnstral]

I was very confused by this game when I started out

[Varsoon]

I don't see enough people prostrating themselves before me.

Yeah, the oversight on the Cop and Reviver roles made this nearly unwinnable by scum by design, which is kind of annoying, especially because I put in a fair amount of work independent of those role interactions.

Unfortunately, outside of those problem roles (which could've randomly rolled into scum hands, talk about SWING), this setup is insanely scum-oriented. I love the concept of going into dreams, but losing at a small deadline, the nature of people being left OUT of a dream, and scum having knowledge of more things that happen deeper in a dream--not to mention abusable kick mechanics, etc.--all of this just works to make this way harder for town to win independent of roles.

PRAISE: I think both teams playing around controlling a cool public mechanic is great. You flavored this awesomely. The execution isn't my favorite, but it is -cool-. Huge congrats to FA for coming up with a lot of this and to Neko and Dunn for running this monstrosity. I know how crazy it can be to run a game with such a complex mechanic at the center of things.

SUGGESTIONS: If I were to make an iteration of this setup, I'd make it a 2-player scumteam, only tell town there are no third party (that way town can't limbo-game the scum numbers the way we did), and give the scum team a few factional abilities. I like the idea of randomly rolled abilities, but I think it'd be much more interesting if those 'afflictions' had some public aspect to them besides their names. Not even getting what the afflictions did on a flip was also a bit of a headache. I'd rework the kick mechanics, how dreaming works, and how players retain viewership of dreams. Honestly, a lot of my fixes would put more work on the moderation side of things, which seems already pretty strained. I think the biggest issue with this game was time being such a huge factor--which makes a ton of flavor sense, but doesn't equate to something fun for anyone to play around as is. Even missing a few hours and then ending up in a new dream made the game near-impossible to keep up with and the delay between a lynch/action and moderator action could prove to be an issue, too. The biggest thing is just designing roles that ARE NOT time sensitive, because I'd be kicking myself in the ass if I was playing a role like McMenno's, got the chance to use it, then lost that opportunity because I wasn't online at the right time. In short, this might work really great as a 24-hour blitz sort of game or even a face-to-face variant.

[Varsoon]

Not Chara, you were a boss. Your play in this game easily swung this into town's favor and kept us from hitting too much apathy/confusion and losing because of that.

Like I said, if you were scum, you deserved the win 100%.

-V

[Varsoon]

I will still hold that my Hiraki push and kick-out were a big winning factor and that's the sort of role interaction and play that should be rewarded in this game, not just copping the right people.

Fuck cops, man, they ruin any game.
Don't put cops in your game.
Cop is a shit role.