55 pages!
![Eek :eek:](./images/smilies/icon_eek.gif)
I will read and comment on what sticks out to me (if anyone wants my opinion of something specific, you're going to have to ask).
-AH
Yeah, I feel the same way. I have to stop here for now.JDodge wrote:I'll post here once I find my big, big, bottle of ibuprofen.
I only had a limited time to make my last post. I'll get caught up by tomorrow.UltimaAvalon wrote:Anti: you know Deadline is in 3 days, right? Hurry the fuck up maybe?
OK, just so that everyone is on the same page:danakillsu wrote:@ Xite and Robbnva
Why are you so sure that scum has a Roleblocker? I don't know why anyone would assume this and then vote me because if it. As I mentioned above, there could easily be a busdriver instead.
Flameaxe wrote:Players Not Alive (6):
18) Furcolow - Vanilla Townie - Lynched Day One
19) Johnny Rotten DavidParker - Vanilla Townie Killed Night One
15) Nhammen - Mafia Goon - Killed Night One
8) Mysterio - Doctor - Lynched Day Two
6) Wickedestjr - Mason - Killed Night Two
12) Benmage - Mafia Roleblocker - Killed Night Two
This vote doesn't have much merit and seems pretty forced to me. It also reeks of OMGUS.DemonHybrid wrote:Sorry, I skimmed through that whole thing.
I don't see how danakillsu's claim a few days ago was OBVIOUSLY fake, especially after DP's flip. I can understand Reck's reasoning with that, but I don't necessarily agree with all of his reads. For example, I find Poro one of the scummiest people here, so don't associate him with Reck as far as reads go. However, I do feel like dana's faking it now that this WIFOM bullcrap has been going on.
So, yeah, you seem to know a lot about dana's role. This in particular stands out:
You seem to know a little too much.When dana flips scum, I'd like him to be lynched.
Unvote, Vote: evilpacman18
Since watcher is a normal role, it wouldn't be unreasonable to think that there's one in this game; a conservative scumteam could have been deterred by the thought of a watcher.Bunnylover wrote:Actually no. I'm more then sure in this large game number their will be a mafia roleblocker, who could possible stop him from invistgating. I would suggest if we have a tracker to track him to see if he visits anyone, or if he is visit by someone, I think it works both way right?
I don't know about that example you gave... I've never actually seen that happen and I don't think someone would be reckless enough to actually attempt such a gambit.Xite91 wrote:Also, think of it this way, if we keep the "cop" around a bit longer and he tells us his reads, we can get something from it when he does die whether he flips town OR scum. Oftentimes, if scum claims a cop and stays alive, he will inno a townie or two, then one of his scumbuddies, and then call guilty on a scumbuddy. A stronger form of bussing. Yes, this is VERY WIFOMY, but I'm just saying, it is more beneficial for us to keep him around right now.
Please don't condescend.flinter wrote:For once, try to take this game as a game of possibilities. It makes your scumhunting more accurate.
I'm not sure what you're referring to here...evilpacman wrote:This is faulty logic and a baseless accusation.
Fail quotient of this paragraph = 100%Kise wrote:I don't think it's wrong to lynch dana at this point. Roleblocking a claimed cop for 2 nights would make sense if Benmage & nhammen are not aligned with dana. Xite's iffy stance on the matter is noteworthy, and could implicate him later if dana flips scum.
Kise wrote:D2, I mentioned that out of Mysterio and Wraith, Wraith was the likelier one to be scum, and also a viable bus for his scumbuddies. The combination of Benmage (known scum) and Xite (probable scum if dana is scum) on Wraith's wagon makes my little "equation" add up, so to speak. If I can run my mouth (err, fingers) for a bit, I think a reasonable lynch sequence would be dana > xite > wraith, if and ONLY IF the former player(s) in the sequence flip scum. It comes down to being one of those scenarios where there's no questions asked. Just do it.
lolwat?Robb wrote:Kise I think lynching Dana can be postponed one day,I do like the fact you are looking for the godfather.
That wasn't my point. You said you liked the fact that Kise was "looking for the godfather" (whatever that means). What's there to really like about "looking" for a particular scum power role? If I told you I was "looking for a mafia framer" would you be impressed?Robbnva wrote:@antihero - I have never been in a large game without a GF so thinking that it's possible isn't a stretch.
What, did you read Xite's post 1715 and decide to quit posting before the wagon formed?Robb wrote:Whatever, I'm done with your shit for real
I won't be back til I'm prodded, Xite I'd you are town you fail
What's with this then?Bunny wrote:No, I believe Kise knew Dana was the cop.
Kise [url=https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?p=2529671#p2529671]1652[/url] wrote:I don't think it's wrong to lynch dana at this point. Roleblocking a claimed cop for 2 nights would make sense if Benmage & nhammen are not aligned with dana. Xite's iffy stance on the matter is noteworthy, and could implicate him later if dana flips scum.
D2, I mentioned that out of Mysterio and Wraith, Wraith was the likelier one to be scum, and also a viable bus for his scumbuddies. The combination of Benmage (known scum) and Xite (probable scum if dana is scum) on Wraith's wagon makes my little "equation" add up, so to speak. If I can run my mouth (err, fingers) for a bit, I think a reasonable lynch sequence would be dana > xite > wraith, if and ONLY IF the former player(s) in the sequence flip scum. It comes down to being one of those scenarios where there's no questions asked. Just do it.
I haven't forgotten about you, Poro. For the time being, there are other.. more interesting developments. I was wrong about Wicked, so, who knows whether I'm wrong with you. That would mean my Godfather-hunting skills are not perfected like I thought they were. BTW, I still need students to take under my wing
...is this referring to Shanba's post? Because if it is, you fail.evilpacman18 wrote:That was... logical OMGUS... >_<
---Shanba wrote:Bloody hell, how is it even OMGUS anyway? As far as I know, he's not yet expressed any suspicion of me.
Yeah, bunny. A lynch today wouldn't be the result of a whole game of scumminess. We're just picking on you because of yesterday.Bunny wrote:MME, I am expecting a quick lynch on myself from viewing that alone to happen.
"In all honesty" is a phrase that's pretty good at tipping you off that what you're about to read is a complete lie.Bunnylover wrote:In all honesty, this is all fluff. I just want Porochaz to stop lurking or for the mod to announce his V/LA or something.
The clumsy buddying makes me lol.singer wrote:Also, Wraith, you're right about the WIFOM thing. It seems like he was doing plenty of both: calling dana "scummy as hell" but never fully accepting the wagon on him, THEN deciding he's innocent and using WIFOM. Thanks for pointing that out.
singer wrote:Oh, and these are just some examples from the first half of his ISO. Keep looking at it. It's kind of...entertaining.
These don't seem to serve any useful scumhunting purposes, and are quite condescending.singer wrote:Sorry if that's not what you wanted to hear.
What is your case, then?singersigner wrote:1. Xite asked for examples, so I gave them to him. That wasn't my case.
OK, after "only contributing more", the sentence ceases to make sense. Please elucidate.2. I agree with Wraith's case, only contributing more, in the overall scheme of things, of why I feel like I can no longer trust Xite's analysis of the game.
Well, you pooh-poohed his wagon.3. Did I say Bunny's behavior was ok?
1) you're pulling out a random quote that's not really buddying/piggybacking before I had to do my 50+ page catchup, so who's grasping at things now?4. Hmm...you didn't notice my "blatant buddying" with Wraith in my ISO#35? It makes me feel like you're grasping at things to make me look scummier now that I've actually put myself out there to make a case against someone.
Great5. You're right, I let my emotions get the best of me sometimes, but that doesn't mean that I have to agree with the way others do the same.
The difference is, Xite isn't pointing out everyone else's aggression and calling it scummy (which you have yet to explain, by the way).6. You're pointing out the one thing that's condescending in my post, and completely overlooking all the other condescending comments of Xite's...who has consistently made them this entire game.
I choose... OMGUS!I really don't like that you're doing that. It's called misrepping...or hypocrisy. You choose.
Wait...what about singer? All I got from Wraith was:pacman wrote:Wraith has tried to jump on Gorrad's, Xite's, and Bunnylover's wagon today. Appeasing everybody? Oh and singer so he sounds original a bit.
Wraith wrote:Singer has been pretty townie all game (flinter probably less so but that's not the point).
While I don't think what Bunny is saying applies to Wraith, bunny's line of reasoning seems valid to me (:? did I actually just type that?). Super-mega-hardcore tunneling on a scumbuddy can in fact be a good scumtell. Also, I don't believe that was the "whole case." This pooh-pooh post by singer is active lurking. More scumpoints for you.singersigner wrote:So let me get this straight. Your whole case on Wraith is that youBunnylover wrote:I would say you are the one who are bussing. You keep bringing up the fact that you were pushing for Dana lynch, trying to earn townie points for knowing a person was scum.
Vote: Wraiththinkhe's bussing. Not that he's actually done anything scummy? Alriiight...
Still waiting on this, Wraith.Antihero wrote:Also, how would you being town imply that Xite is scum?
more active lurking.singer wrote:Wraith, stop with the AtE.
First off, the "in one sentence" thing was just so that I didn't get a wall of text.singersigner wrote:Someone asked me to sum up my case on Xite in one sentence...
In response to that, I feel it's kind of ridiculous to ask someone to sum it up "in one sentence," but here goes:
I feel that Xite has been abrasive (anti-town) and somewhat hypocritical (when it comes to how people react emotionally-not the strongest part, but adds to it), and I don't buy his interaction with Dana this game, as it seems like he was only protecting his scum-buddy.
Congrats on getting engaged.singer wrote:This whole dana WIFOM thing is making me sick...we need a votecount...I just got engaged...that is all for now.
OK, so why didn't you say that at the time or vote accordingly?singersigner wrote:Actually, the whole WIFOM thing I was speaking of was Xite's defense of Dana. And if you want to look at my questioning, find the post where I was very much questioning why he wasn't roleblocked, etc. I agreed with those questioning Dana's claim, but never with Xite's defense of it.
Here it is:singer wrote:Where did I say Xite's defense was in deference to Frank? I'd like a quote, please.
singer wrote:Bunnylover's too easy right now. I think people are overlooking Xite's defence of Dana, on D3 AND D1(D1 was more of a deterrence to the Frank wagon than a defense of Dana).VOTE: Xite91
I'm interested in seeing how he'll blow up at this one, since that's all I've seen him do this game.
Oh, yes. Because scum can't bus.singersigner wrote:That was simply D1. The difference between me and Xite was that Xite was never on the Dana wagon,
So, you agreed with the case on frank, and you're now using the frank wagon against Xite?singer D1 wrote:@Nhammen/Xite's WoT: QFT.
At this point, there's not a whole lot of new information/questions I can bring to the table, but I agree with hiphop (/Xite's response) about the bandwagons. With this many people, chances are a mislynch (unless obvscumslip) will occur, so the best way to extort more reactions is by finishing a bandwagon D1, and seeing where that leads us in the next day.
From what I can tell, Dana's case on Frank is weak, and if they're a scum-pair, it's only to distance himself later, saying, "no hey, look what I did. why would I vote for my scum-buddy??" Unless Dana can provide a better defense of himself, or a better case on someone else, I'm going to VOTE: danakillsu, putting him at L-2 by my votecount.
@Xite...I find myself inclined to agree with your case on Frank, but for now I suppose we will have to wait and see what happens.
And damn you people, you couldn't have spread your responses a little thinner while I was at band camp all day?? That was a lot to catch up on! lol.
Do you have any evidence to support this?singer wrote:and I believe it's because he didn't want to bus his partner.
This is a hackneyed argument that really doesn't have much merit. Try again, please.singer wrote:D2 and 3 brought in more WIFOM defense.
What?singer wrote:I would've expected a better case for not lynching Dana at that point, and he couldn't present one.
Am I missing something here?singer wrote:I actually did say it at the time. But my votes don't come until I feel like I'm confident enough in them.Say what you want about "not being confident enough to lynch Dana"...but that's how I feel. I made a mistake with Mysterio, if you remember, butI didn't think I made a mistake with Dana, nor do I think I'm making one now.
No.singersigner wrote:You're missing the point about Xite not giving any attention to Dana's scummy play at all, but after his cop-claim, I didn't want to lynch. I explained exactly why I didn't have a problem potentially mislynching D1, and now I'm using the information we got from it later. Do you see how that sort of thing works?
Wait ... what? Convince me to do what? Unvote you?singer wrote:I actually don't have to convince you anymore, since I'm fairly certain you won't be swayed. If you don't agree, that's fine. We'll see what happens from there.
*looks back at Flameaxe's vote count*singer wrote:I did vote Dana (D3)...not sure what you're getting at...
Then why wasn't this feeling accompanied by a vote, like it is now? The point still stands unless I somehow missed a vote you say you made yesterday.singer wrote:The last part, sorry, that was awkward...I was just talking about when I vote for someone. Frank was a null-tell->scum for me, but I felt it was more beneficial to finish a wagon, than drag the day on with people wondering who/what/when/where/why to vote after 40+ pages. I was wrong about Mysterio, but felt strong enough to put a vote on him.By D3, I felt Dana's claim no longer added up, and felt no qualms about lynching him.I feel the same about Xite. Aside from RVS, I won't just put a vote on someone unless I feel strongly about it (without implying that I was making a point for pressure).
Notice how singer doesn't say anything about how she thinks Wraith is scum.singersigner wrote:But for sake of not evading your question, I'll say that Wraith has been under scrutiny almost since the beginning. It's time to see who was right.DemonHybrid wrote:Why?singersigner wrote:VOTE: Wraith
... may I please have the summarized version of this post? I don't know what point you're trying to make here.Porochaz wrote:Well, Im glad your quoting this post.
The dana wagon was a good one. However classic scumtell alert "HEY EVERYONE LOOK AT ME PUTTING SOMEONE AT L-1 ONE"/"HEY LOOK EVERYONE HE IS AT L-1 NOW!" "IM NOT GOING TO UNVOTE HIM MYSELF JUST IN CASE, IM JUST GOING TO TELL EVERYONE ELSE NOT TO VOTE, BECAUSE IM SO TOWNIE LULZ". You see what Im getting at? Someone hammers then you can be a ll likeI told you not to voteand try and look all townie. When in the end the onus was on you because you didn't unvote in the first place.
Also you said "let him speak" I was giving him that chance. Argument = void. I think so.
As for the other post, lets say you are in a small locked room with a very hungry crocodile. You have a stick which you may hit him across the head with. You hit him once, he ignores you. So you think "this is fun, I'll do it again" well inevitably the hungry croc will stop ignoring you and eventually eat you. Its the same thing here. You did it in an ongoing involving both of us, and its the second time you have done it here, and I have no doubt you have done it in other games as well. There has to be a point where you think, "huh, this seems to have people second guessing about me. Maybe I could use this as scum". I admit I have seen you do this as town as some fucked up idea that its in the their best interests. Your readiness to flip onto that idea is whats now making it suspicious. You do it too often.
Ummm, no. This isn't true. But that's a matter of my personal opinion.singersigner wrote:Classic scum reaction IF I didn't actually respond to his question.
orly?singer wrote:You're also twisting my words.
singer wrote:The connotation is not the same, and it's funny that either 1. you think it is, or 2. you're purposefully doing that to make me look bad to anyone who isn't smart enough to realize what you're doing. You choose. I don't mind.
All I had to do was read the thread. It really wasn't that hard.singer wrote:You're gunna have to try harder than that if you want to really accuse me of anything scummy.
Not only weak, butsinger wrote:My case may not have been the strongest...but what are you buildingyourcase off of? The fact that myonecase was weak? That's not scummy; that just means that my initial gut was wrong.
I know this was directed at DH and I don't know about DH's reasons, but I have to say that this certainly isn't the reason for my vote. If anyone wants to know the reason for my vote, I first invite you to go back and look at singer's reasoning for the Xite vote yesterday. This is a good place to start.evilpacman18 wrote:Oh wait so you're voting singer just because she had an incorrect read on Xite?DemonHybrid wrote:I never said anything about someone killing someone. Holy poisoned wine, Batman!
My post isn't a defense of DH. I'm trying to get you all to really look at singer's motivations throughout this game (I don't think anyone's done so). She's been under the radar up until yesterday, when she emerged to jump on the Xite wagon.evilpacman18 wrote:I don't have any scumread on you at all but isn't an unnecessary defense the exact same way Dana's D1 started?Antihero wrote:I know this was directed at DH and I don't know about DH's reasons, but I have to say that this certainly isn't the reason for my vote. If anyone wants to know the reason for my vote, I first invite you to go back and look at singer's reasoning for the Xite vote yesterday. This is a good place to start.evilpacman18 wrote:Oh wait so you're voting singer just because she had an incorrect read on Xite?DemonHybrid wrote:I never said anything about someone killing someone. Holy poisoned wine, Batman!
...which is so bad, you don't have a response to it. I think that's pretty telling.singersigner wrote:Probably because not everyone agrees with your oh-so-amazing-case.Antihero wrote:The lack of singer votes is making me rage.
singer wrote:I think you're just bitter.
Why would you even say this? Shanba said why your situation was different right in the quote. "But she calls them both scummy and stupid and repeatedly tries to intimate this is some kind of bussing play."singersigner wrote:Ok, I thiiink I can see where you're coming from. The only thing that strikes me as odd with this statement is that you very clearly understand a lot of people got sucked into the same thing...but I still fail to understand how my situation was so different.Shanba wrote:Ok, so I can be convinced on to a singersigner wagon. There's a couple of things that strike me the wrong way, both of which are related to dana. Firstly, during day 1, singer (like a lot of people) gets drawn into the dana vs frank dichotomy thing. But she calls them both scummy and stupid and repeatedly tries to intimate this is some kind of bussing play. At the time she was doing this, it looked like dana was the one going down, so linking dana and frank would be a pretty smart move as scum. Combined with the fact that I don't really see how it looks like bussing at all, that's a serious question mark frowny face thing.
Oh, so now that it you think it might work in your favor, you start comparing yourself to Xite and how she acted towards dana.singer wrote:Uh...what? Reads change. I gave him the benefit of the doubt (JUST LIKE XITE) on D2, especially given that we hadn't had a legitimate CC.
OMGUS much? And how is flinter flailing?DemonHybrid wrote:Unvote, Vote: Flinter. We lynch EPM after this, but I like the pressure on Flinter now. There's no way that you can try to flailingly back up such a bad case and be pro-town in the least.
It's hard to read stuff that doesn't exist.DH wrote:Way to be opportunistic. Did you even read my case on flinter?
I'm cool with it, but the mod and/or Poro might not be.flinter wrote:I wonder, would Porochaz be able to replace? Shanba obvious can't because there might be a third mason. Porochaz would have to reread less of the game if he agreed. Would any of the players be opposed to this?Flameaxe wrote:Another quick night.
Prozac - Vanilla Townie - Killed Night Six
Shanba - Mason - Killed Night Six
That leaves six alive, which makes it 4 votes to lynch, and 3 votes for a no lynch.
Deadline:Nov 11th.
I'm not sure how any of these (maybe except #4) are "confirmed."evilpacman wrote:Confirmed information
1. DH is scum and will be lynched today.
2. Ether can not be the SK and could only possibly be scum if we have more than one scum left.
3. I'm town.
4. The player count is either 4 town, 1 scum, 1 SK or 3 town, 2 scum, 1 SK.
EtherDent wrote:80%, right? He killed the cop, too, directly leading to Danakillsu's lynch.
-Ether
Actually, me killing you didn't have anything to do with dana. Your posts contained nothing but active lurking and self-defense for the first two days; it looked like you were really trying to stay in the background (and you did a good job, too).Benmage wrote:No Dana, you can take full credit for the loss tho.
JDodge had meEtherDent wrote:To be fair, danakillsu caused me to falsely confirm JDodge/pacman as town. Dunno if it was intentional, but hey, it worked.
DH wrote:Let's keep the SK alive for a while if we ever do find out who he is; he can help us kill town twice as fast.
This. I was convinced Ether was the last scum. flinter was willing to let me win, and Wraith came off as indifferent (also more likely to let me win), that led me to kill EPM.evilpacman18 wrote:Actually Ether just said that... they... would have voted Anti. So with my vote, Ether's, and Wraith's on Anti, I would have won.