Mafia 49: SpeedyKQ's Big New York Game - Game over!

[MrBuddyLee]

Pooky hasn't done anything remarkably scummy. Therefore, time spent discussing him in particular is for the most part wasted. Time spent discussing those discussing him is nearly as wasted. And there have been at least five comments discussing people discussing people discussing Pooky.

If I were scum right now I'd be participating in all the meta-Pookying to drag the day out until people get weary and jump on the wrong person for a quick, urge-satisfying lynch. Oh wait, I'm replacing MOS, who was doing just that.

Vote: MrBuddyLee

I've read the thread a few times, but give me a few more to come up with a slightly more logical vote.

[MrBuddyLee]

Nah, the way I see it, people are scummy either way if they're participating on the alliance side or spending a ton of time railing against it. Either distracts from the actual task at hand. As an example, MOS was making his points on principle/friendship, because he wasn't scum. Anyone suspecting him due to his position regarding Pooky was wrong. There's a case to be made that the level of metagaming was inappropriate, but the place for that argument is in another thread.

[MrBuddyLee]

Well, the Max bandwagon is obviously the hot topic of conversation so I'll go with it. I went to look at his posts to find evidence to defend or contradict an "irrational townie alive is better than scum alive" hypothesis. One of the first Max posts staring me in the face was:

Reason for wagoning Pooky because we need to get rid of someone soon otherwise I'll get bored as all of my games are still on day 1.

and then:

The only problem is hat I have yet to have a game where I'm mafia so hat might be why I'm bored

Early in the game Max's one vote is not going to mean a lot, but it won't be long before it does. If we don't boot him now, he'll lynch the wrong person soon enough out of boredom. He's probably town from the tone of his posts, but I don't see losing him as a huge loss. I recommend we look for another target first.

[MrBuddyLee]

Mastermind of Sin did me no favors by asking you to all become one with the Pookiness. Please feel free to do that on your own time, really. Now to clamber out of this grave he dug...

Nominees for

Scantest Contribution to an Admittedly Annoying NY Game

ameliaslay
Machiavellian mafia
raj
viking
Rhox

And the winner is:

FOS: Rhox!

Uncontested Winner of the

What Wonders a Good's Night Sleep Can Work

Award:

friday 9:40pm
can we focus on lynching Pooky pls?

saturday 10:51am
unvote, vote Max

saturday 12:28pm
i see no reason not to finish (Max) off irght now :goodposting:

Congratulations to

FOS: BabyJesus

for switching over to Max 1 hr 35 minutes after the first vote count to show Max in the lead.

And my choice for craplogic of the week award:

Pooky is impossible to get a read on, so unless there is a cop saying he is scum you tend not to lynch him.

Therefore, Max should go as he is wagonning a useless cause.

Choices, choices.

unvote, Vote: armlx

[MrBuddyLee]

Yeah, chiding people to

focus

on one bandwagon and then flippantly flopping to the next and pushing speedlynch twelve hours later is bizarre behavior to me. But I'm new, and maybe you see this kind of inconsistent behavior all the time round here. Spare me your rolleyes, it's quite a reasonable observation I made.

[MrBuddyLee]

Actually, and I laugh out loud to do this...

I realize what you meant by the rolleyes... you were trying to make the point that armlx's action wasn't as rotten as bj's and i misread your intent. And when I reviewed both of their posts I found this gem from the day before bj's flip-flop:

Thursday 6pm

Wanting to let pooky go now is bad. Max is pretty clearly a townie, I'm shocked that many people are voting him.

I don't want to be accused of being led around by the nose, or look scummy by flip-flopping in the span of five minutes. But I have to be honest, that breaks a tie much better than my previous tiebreaker that armlx's content was primarily apple polishing.

FOS: armlx

unvote, vote: BabyJesus

[MrBuddyLee]

um, shit. can I get a raincheck on those huggles til after the game's over?

[MrBuddyLee]

easy train

pot, kettle, somethingsomething

I think I'm safe from receiving your vote until seven others shift first, so until then, let's be pals.

[MrBuddyLee]

you're scum with Mos, aka BuddyLee, aren't you?

pretty sure

X

[MrBuddyLee]

pretty sure you're missing something

[MrBuddyLee]

Reason for wagoning Pooky because we need to get rid of someone soon otherwise I'll get bored

COME ON 1 MORE PESON THEN I HAVE THE SAME AMOUNT OF VOTES AS POOKY

The only problem is hat I have yet to have a game where I'm mafia so hat might be why I'm bored

I'll jump on the MAXbandwagon when I find an excuse

then

fos everyone not voting pooky
Max is pretty clearly town, I'm shocked you'd vote for him.

then

I vote he should die for acting like a martyr.

unvote vote:keys

then

(paraphrased)speedlynch Max

Yeah, I read your posts, and I think your wagon shift was radical and out of proportion to that particular comment of Max's, particularly in the context of his general lunacy.

Don't get me wrong, there are other people acting significantly untown at this point, but I felt that your attack on Max was stark and hypocritical. You a) criticized him for a rapid vote-shift, when your own shift was just as stunning, and b) criticized him for finding fault with a self-vote when you were clearly willing to criticize my own self-vote.

[MrBuddyLee]

I don't see Nightfall as scummy yet. He seemed all along to be genuinely upset that some people would have an inherent advantage over others in this game not because of their skill but because of their friends. He took it to an extreme well past when Pooky was an easy lynch target, which says to me he did it on principle.

[MrBuddyLee]

Finally, I had noted MBL's throwing suspicion around in every which way; but his accusations have all had merit, so I can't see any reason to believe that he isn't pro-town.

Yeah, thanks for noticing. The only way I could think of to dig out of this hole I got dropped into was to analyze and report in quantity and hope my comments resonate.

[MrBuddyLee]

Attaboy Max... give us some more after tea.

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote, vote: armlx

Eight of your eleven posts have involved and/or invoked Pooky. I'm new, but I'd say that's either a scumtell or an obsession.

Also, you said the reason for the Maxwagon is his wagonhop onto Pooky. Actually, only five of the fourteen votes on Max were for your stated reason. I think more people may have just found him odd, irrational or useless.

amrmlx: wagonhop
mos: no reason
glork: no reason
timmy: wagonhop
raj: no reason
SD: no reason
greyjoy: max is annoying
pooky: no reason
bj: max's flop to keys
fritz: no reason
mafia: no reason
glork: wagonhop
ibaesha: wagonhop, strangeness
viking: wagonhop

[MrBuddyLee]

http://www.mafiascum.net/cgi-bin/wiki.p ... reviations

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote armlx, vote: BrianMcQueso

Are you related to the Mayor?

[MrBuddyLee]

Well, this early in the game I think a doc could just as easily claim vanilla town and get away with it. I think such a claim would be better for the town. Claiming doctor this early does nothing but possibly save his own skin or force the real doc out of hiding, neither of which are good for the town.

Thus BJ's vote, which I'm not entirely sure I disagree with.

[MrBuddyLee]

That said, though I think he's scum, he will probably be killed tonight, so I think we should be spending our votes elsewhere. Now, if he survives tonight (especially if there's only one kill), then I would definitely be voting him tomorrow.

If I was scum, I would consider not touching him tonight. Tomorrow, he's alive and gets lynched by an angry mob and scum gets two kills for the price of one. In a game this size, does leaving a doctor alive for an extra turn really hurt the bad guys that much?

[MrBuddyLee]

my exiting role

The irony of this misspelling is delicious.

Bacde, would like to hear more from you on everything.

help im a bug and Greyjoy, something about the tones of your posts strikes me as odd, can't put my finger on it.

Pooky, is BabyJesus really the best place for your vote right now? I imagine you have an instinct telling you there's a better place for it.

Keys: no posts for a week. Prod please.

Tamuz, not a useful comment from you outside the HA/MOS issue. You're more insightful than this and clearly lying low. Why?

raj: no posts in 5 days. You complained there were no posts of substance but you've given us none. Pony up.

ibaesha, 11 posts on the HA issue in three days, then not a word since then. A vote comfortably placed on Max. Lurking seems unlike you.

Nightfall, 16 posts on the HA issue and not much of value otherwise.

Unvote McQueso, vote: Nightfall.

You've criticized the use of an alliance in this game, but pretty much your entire "contribution" has been to drone on about the alliance. If you're going to be prolific, be usefully prolific. As someone said in my last game, "We already have one Fritzler here."

I think we need more input from some of these people before we move on to night.

[MrBuddyLee]

vote: raj

for jubilance and lack of analysis when hammering a doc.

[MrBuddyLee]

Well, this early in the game I think a doc could just as easily claim vanilla town and get away with it. I think such a claim would be better for the town.

my exiting role states I am vanilla townie and I win when all mafia are eliminated. I GOT THE MOST IMPORTANT ROLE

Just pointing out the coincidence, don't know if it's significant or not...

Uh, sorry, no.

Trying to out the doctor is in fact very very scummy. Especially when you've already claimed doctor, as it makes me think that, hey, you're probably not the real one.

vote: MM

.

unvote raj, vote: help im a bug

for insinuating this was any kind of rational, reasoned out attempt to out a doctor. I agree it was a stupid post, but stupid =/= scummy. A few posts before this, you said it was a best to leave claimed doctors alone. If this post by M-M was your reason for changing your mind, it's a flimsy one.

I'm moving my raj vote in the off chance Fritzler has some solid info behind his comment.

[MrBuddyLee]

MM suggesting Max might be a doctor,

because

Max claimed townie, when MM had already claimed doctor himself, is pretty weird. HIAB mentioned this as well. It wasn't just about an apparent attempt to out the doctor.

Weird. Totally agree there. Good enough reason to change your mind about lynching the doctor? Smelled funny to me.

[MrBuddyLee]

I think you have your eye on me in every game, T, and I turn up town

[MrBuddyLee]

Hey, analysis of one out of 23 people, that's a good start.

being i had 12 other people doing it before me i didnt see the need.

I think it's scummy to pass the blame. I imagine people like to see reasoning before you vote so they know why YOU did it, not why everyone else did.

But hey, if Fritzler says you're cool...

[MrBuddyLee]

Hey Max, your roleclaim doesn't appear to have helped you. If you want to stay alive, I have a suggestion. Re-read the thread and give us your thoughts on as many people as possible.

[MrBuddyLee]

um, I was told that when I fill my punchcard I get a free churro.

[MrBuddyLee]

One more thing: Like I said before atm even the smallest reason is enough to get me vote someone.

The third person to do so if I recall correctly, a hot spot for scum.

That's fking stupid. How is third person a hot spot for scum in when it's still 12votes to lynch.

unvote help im a bug, vote: Twito

For hypocrisy. I'm voting for you on principle, even though I don't think you're necessarily scummiest at this point. Man, your logic is all over the place, and then you accuse people of being too dense to follow it.

[MrBuddyLee]

I actually Am thinking about changing my vote to you can you please give me a reason not to

Imo blaming someone has scummy behavior seems to be good scum tactic and often used. Seen that in many games. You rarely catch the real scum by lynching guy with scummy behavior.

*facepalm*

[MrBuddyLee]

I've been on Twito because he's all over the place with bizarro logic and sucking all the air out of this thread. If he's not scum, he's making it tougher for us to find them.

unvote Twito.

I just don't think he's scum right now, and if he is, I have faith that he'll let us know sooner or later.

[MrBuddyLee]

Outstanding reading comprehension... what's the contradiction?

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote help im a bug, vote: Twito

For hypocrisy. I'm voting for you on principle, even though I don't think you're necessarily scummiest at this point. Man, your logic is all over the place, and then you accuse people of being too dense to follow it.

then

I've been on Twito because he's all over the place with bizarro logic and sucking all the air out of this thread. If he's not scum, he's making it tougher for us to find them.

unvote Twito.

I just don't think he's scum right now, and if he is, I have faith that he'll let us know sooner or later.

Yeah, terribly inconsistent. Next time I'll try to make sure the words overlap when you hold them up to bright light.

[MrBuddyLee]

Repeated from 619, Tamuz.

unvote help im a bug, vote: Twito

For hypocrisy. I'm voting for you on principle, even though I don't think you're necessarily scummiest at this point. Man, your logic is all over the place, and then you accuse people of being too dense to follow it.

then

I've been on Twito because he's all over the place with bizarro logic and sucking all the air out of this thread. If he's not scum, he's making it tougher for us to find them.

unvote Twito.

I just don't think he's scum right now, and if he is, I have faith that he'll let us know sooner or later.

Yeah, terribly inconsistent. Next time I'll try to make sure the words overlap when you hold them up to bright light.

[MrBuddyLee]

When I voted him I said I didn't think he was scummiest, I voted because he was distracting everyone with a bunch of pap. And I just unvoted him because I still don't think he's terribly scummy, just odd, and I'd rather not see another townie lynched.

You could have gotten that explanation by reading the post I posted twice, I think.

[MrBuddyLee]

You're a paragon of scumhunting Tamuz lol. You've had your vote on me the entire game and a total of like 1 1/2 insightful comments over a span of a month. I'll give you credit for persistence, and I do owe you all a better vote, so thanks for reminding me to be more proactive.

[MrBuddyLee]

I voted you randomly to see if I get blamed of bandwagoning when voting someone without votes on him.

Seriously, who writes your material?

[MrBuddyLee]

Day one, vikingfan was ok voting Max, who he said could very well be "an overeager townie":

if they turn up town that's not so bad... overeager townies still don't help the town

then switches to M-M, says (1)his style's so bad he'll die eventually anyway, (2)justifies that killing a doc wouldn't be so bad cause the game's big enough to absorb a mistake, and (3)suggests a vig so as not to waste a lynch.

M-M dies town doctor.

Day two, vikingfan jumps on Max immediately. Weird quote:

vote Max Best play on the board at the moment, though I wish MM had played smarter and not pulled his stupid gambit...that didn't help much.

Looks like an ass covering non-sequitur to me.

30 hours after dawn of day2:

I'm not sure we need this much debate

then a familiar set of arguments:

(1)it's safe to say that Max will be lynched eventually.
(2)we've got 23 players left so we're far from lynch or lose.
(3)Would it be worthwhile vigging Max

Deja vu.

More preemptive ass covering in consecutive posts in case Max turns up town:

And he does seem scummy...but that's what I thought about MM too...

Max is still giving me the same vibes as MM did yesterday- whether or not that's good is a different question.

And then hopped off Max's wagon and onto Twito's the moment it caught up.

Too bloodthirsty, too willing to kill someone he considers townish, didn't seem to learn anything from the D1 mistake.

vote: vikingfan

FOS: Spamwise

for coming across a tad too desperate to see someone lynched.

[MrBuddyLee]

When looking for innocents tomorrow:

I hope you remember MrBuddyLee protecting me today when it comes to voting tomorrow. It makes no sence for mafia to protect me atm(unless I'm mafia). And after I get lynched MrBuddyLee is gonna be kinda 'proven' pro-town.

And I thought huggles were the kiss of death in this game...

I'd like to come back to this side argument we're having (mostly around BuddyLee) tomorrow, but today I still think Twito's the lynch.

Feel free to examine my posts, I'll even summarize them and the posts of others commenting on me for you and try to answer your questions proactively:

Finally, I had noted MBL's throwing suspicion around in every which way; but his accusations have all had merit, so I can't see any reason to believe that he isn't pro-town.

You say you voted him even though you thought he wasn't the scummiest? Well that my friend is scummy. You should have been more proactive in finding scum instead of bandwagoning someone you thought wasn't scummy.

He's hopped votes a lot, hasn't he?

On MrBuddyLee: I thought he was scum at first glance of his posts, but then I changed my mind after a closer look. I'm still undecided, but I think Twito is a better lynch today.

"This is Twito's scummy behavior. He's not helping. But I'll unvote him." That's the contradiction.

So I've hopped votes a fair amount, but most if not all have been for good reasons. I placed a vote on Twito to send a message to him that his posting style was destructive, regardless of whether he's scum or town. When he got close to lynch (9/12) I backed off my vote because as I said when I voted for him, I don't think he's the scummiest guy around, just bizarre and not consistently logical.

As we've learned from M-M, scummy behavior doesn't necessarily constitute a person being scum, but I would argue that the correct practice is to lynch them anyway.

STD, Ameliaslay, Glork, KellyChen, Pooky, Coron and Greyjoy expressed hesitance about this strategy. Glork and STD recently got fed up with Twito's lunacy and voted him.

BJ and Spamwise explicitly supported BMQ's proposal.

I think if you don't believe someone's scum, you shouldn't lynch them unless they absolutely inhibit your ability to hunt scum. My first game of Mafia, Fritzler came across as unhelpful at first and I was tempted to vote for him until I metagamed and realized he often comes across as unhelpful, especially to newbs. If Twito's always manic regardless of alignment, I don't see that as a good reason to vote to lynch him.

ps. Twito, if you're scum and you're setting me up to follow you to the gallows...

[MrBuddyLee]

OK MrScumBuddyLee just ignored me and went off randomly on vikingfan to move attention. Scum tactic of avoidance and distraction.

I'm holding my vote resolutely.

Do you have a role limitation where you can only read every third post or something?

[MrBuddyLee]

You were in an awful hurry to off Max at the start of today... you said we didn't really need to debate it for very long. Weren't you concerned that if we killed him and he was town we'd have gained next to no information today?

[MrBuddyLee]

*pours out a 40 and accepts the huggle raincheck*

What a way to go out.

On a related note, let's find another townie to run up guys, this is fun. Max would be ideal.

vote: Max

FOS: BMQ

[MrBuddyLee]

Cause I think it's sweet that we're two for two nailing townies people think are newbie townies playing poorly and I think we could easily nail a third today. My money's on the trifecta.

If you don't groove with that strategy, I think examining the two deadtowniewagons would be a fine place to start looking for scum.

[MrBuddyLee]

Check post #666 for a summary of vikingfan's d1 and d2. He explained his actions a few posts later.

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote Max, vote KellyChen

[MrBuddyLee]

sheesh.

unvote: Kelly Chen

[MrBuddyLee]

Any or all of them, except these:

He is suspecting the man making a shield for Pooky.

This is where people agree with me and start voting MoS for his slightly idiotic and overcompulsive defense of pooky.

you not only have given me a scummy feeling about you, but you have the history of MoS's posting

OK MrScumBuddyLee just ignored me and went off randomly on vikingfan to move attention. Scum tactic of avoidance and distraction.

Are you just going easy on him(Twito) because he is your scumbuddy

I had the gut feeling on MoS

So your evidence against me was a gut feel based on MoS's protection of Pooky.

Then it was for pointing out vikingfan's behavior, which others have recently agreed was curious.

Then it was because I unvoted Twito cause I thought Twito was town.

STEEEEEEERIKE THREE!!!!!!

ps. I still don't find you scummy, just bizarre. Feel free to find a post of yours that actually contains tangible evidence people should read about my scumminess... if you can find one...

[MrBuddyLee]

Vote: MrBuddyLee

Vote: MrBuddyLee

Still feel he's scum.

vote: MrScumBuddyLee

Read my posts, any of them or all of them...

Vote MrBuddyLee

Been explained, plus my spidy-senses are tingling (j/k).

Been explained, armlx?

[MrBuddyLee]

Yeah, Glork and Tamuz, the new Crockett and Tubbs.

End-of-Day Vote Counts:
12 twito (BabyJesus, BrianMcQueso, armlx, Spamwise, vikingfan, help im a bug, rajrhcpfreak, Fritzler, Save The Dragons, Glork, Kelly Chen, Ameliaslay)

11 Machiavellian-Mafia (Max, Kelly Chen, Ameliaslay, Save The Dragons, XGreyjoyX, BrianMcQueso, BabyJesus, vikingfan, armlx, help im a bug, Tamuz)

Bang-up job guys.

[MrBuddyLee]

Add ibaesha and raj to that M-M day-end wagon.

[MrBuddyLee]

Bah, triple post. For those too lazy to compare, the people on both badwagons:

BMQ
Save the Dragons
armlx
Kelly Chen
vikingfan
raj
BJ
help im a bug

[MrBuddyLee]

Nope, I haven't hidden from anything, I've let it hang out by placing votes and FOSes on the people I find suspicious. Here's the list of my non-joke votes/FOSes:

BMQ
BJ
armlx
BJ
armlx
Nightfall
raj
help im a bug
Twito
vikingfan
Spamwise
BMQ
KellyChen

Curiously, it resembles the list of people who have lynched both a doctor and a townie this game. So I'm pleased with my judgment so far, and frankly I think yours stinks this game, Tamuz.

[MrBuddyLee]

Finally, I had noted MBL's throwing suspicion around in every which way; but his accusations have all had merit, so I can't see any reason to believe that he isn't pro-town.

Hmm, you can't have it both ways. Did my accusations to that point have merit or were they deviously engineered to point fingers at the future bandwagonners of a townie?

your certainty in both lynches and suspicion-casting on their voters

before the lynches/alignments were made public by the mod

contribute to my uneasiness towards you.

I just reread my posts, and there's no certainty there about M-M or Twito before their lynches. Just my best assessments. You need to read more carefully before you make such baseless accusations, Glork.

[MrBuddyLee]

What alarms me is the fact that you basically didn't weigh in on the wagons at all, either way. You never spoke up against either lynch -- you only looked at people who were on the bandwagon(s). But you never voiced your support for the lynch.

Hmm, funny, the following quotes all look like me weighing in on four bandwagons, including the two in question. Are you saying I'm psychic scum and knew to comment on some and not others cause I knew which would end in lynches?

(on M-M wagon)In a game this size, does leaving a doctor alive for an extra turn really hurt the bad guys that much?

Hey Max, your roleclaim doesn't appear to have helped you. If you want to stay alive, I have a suggestion. Re-read the thread and give us your thoughts on as many people as possible.

(On Nightfall wagon)I don't see Nightfall as scummy yet. He seemed all along to be genuinely upset

(On Maxwagon)Early in the game Max's one vote is not going to mean a lot, but it won't be long before it does. If we don't boot him now, he'll lynch the wrong person soon enough out of boredom. He's probably town from the tone of his posts, but I don't see losing him as a huge loss. I recommend we look for another target first.

(On Twitowagon)When I voted him I said I didn't think he was scummiest, I voted because he was distracting everyone with a bunch of pap. And I just unvoted him because I still don't think he's terribly scummy, just odd, and I'd rather not see another townie lynched.

you seemed to vote/FoS a lot of these people before their related lynch result was made public. It's almost as if you knew what the lynch result would be ahead of time and want to push the town towards future lynches.

Isn't that called good play, spotting sketchy lynches and drawing attention to the bandwagonners? It's called going out on a limb and being willing to state my opinion. Or, yeah, I could be psychic.

With regards to Twito, you voted him earlier for hypocrisy (Post 538) amidst one of the early pushes against him -- EVEN THOUGH YOU SAID HE WASN'T NECESSRAILY SCUMMY.

Hey Glork, you voted Max saying he's scum(170) then in (263) unvoted Max in the same post where you said he was "very scummy". Clearly you don't feel that there's a directly proportional relationship between scumminess and votes all the time either.

I don't want it both ways. It's called a revision of opinion. I noted your widespread voting/FoSing, though at the time I felt it wasn't necessarily scummy. Now, I've obviously revised my opinion of you.

So tell me then, do you still find my earlier posts relevant and insightful and the later ones scummy, are there some good some scummy, or have you revised your opinion to find the whole of my postings consistently scummy?

[MrBuddyLee]

Interestingly enough though, MrBuddyLee isn't voting for anyone. This is just a random thought, but doesn't that contradict what he was saying earlier.

Hmm?

[MrBuddyLee]

Vikingfan gave a lengthy response to my post targetting him. I wouldn't expect him to weigh in on me if he doesn't find me scummy.

Speaking of scummy, I haven't seen a scummier wagon than the one on me right now. Question is, which one of em's the sleaziest?

[MrBuddyLee]

I'm sticking with my vote on Kelly Chen until I get more evidence as to why I should switch.

While you're waiting, how bout giving your opinion of the sizable wagon on me right now?

[MrBuddyLee]

Fine, I'll wager my cat (<--MrBuddyLee) that there's at least one scum on my wagon right now, probably more than one. I'll run through em one at a time:

Tamuz

has been on MoS/me since the early days of the HuggleGate scandal. His posts contain thirteen pieces of evidence against me, some are repeats. The evidence includes:
* I(MoS) defended Pooky obsessively and compulsively
* I deflected attention from myself to vikingfan
* I voted then hopped off the wagon of my scumpartner Twito
* I hid from bandwagons of townies

Those reasons are all pretty much crap. The only accusation Tamuz has made that's meritworthy:

You say you voted him even though you thought he wasn't the scummiest? Well that my friend is scummy. You should have been more proactive in finding scum instead of bandwagoning someone you thought wasn't scummy.

I agree that such a vote could be interpreted as scummy, though I think my reason for the vote was a good one. More to the point of Tamuz's logic, one of his arguments above is that I was scummy for being "proactive in finding scum" by posting about vikingfan. It's silly to find me scummy for being proactive AND for not being proactive, Tamuz...

Tamuz, the fact that most all your evidence has been crap means you've spent three days focused in on me like a laser beam based on your gut feelings and hunches. Congrats on the solid use of time. I'm not sure whether you're scum or not... but the way you've picked two targets to go Javert on makes me think you're looking for excuses not to weigh in on other more substantive matters. If you're "convinced" I'm scum, you have no reason to put your neck on the line by voting elsewhere.

[MrBuddyLee]

rajrhcpfreak

wagonned Pooky, wagonned Max, hammered the doctor without a single word about the guy, voted me, wagonned Max, accused Glork of protecting Max, wagonned Twito, with evidence this time:

Oh yeah and I'm still not gonna RC and pressure won't make that happen. Another thing I actually feel more like voting ubertimmy coz atleast Spamwise postes something but not gonna switch my vote just yet.

That just radiates scumminess.

Then lurked for two weeks and popped up to place a 6th vote on my wagon.

My vote would be here if it weren't for other people's opinions.

[MrBuddyLee]

ubertimmy

voted max, STD, BJ for switching suddenly to the MaxWagon, then me for various reasons. Not much to go on, I don't have a problem with him other than the lack of posts.

Save the Dragons

voted Pooky specifically for the huggle/MoS thing, Max, MoS(me) also for the huggle thing, BJ for the MaxWagon thing, me because of something Tamuz pointed to, voted the doc in time for the hammer

D2 questioned kellychen for voting raj for the hammer, voted max, defended raj, voted spamwise (odd looking vote), suggested we back off max, saying that votes on newbiewagons should have more stated reasoning behind them, voted twito for being annoying and distracting and prolly more

d3 says he'd vote me but his major reason to do it is gone(pooky dead), defends kelly, then decides to vote me anyway.

He's posted a good deal of content and some arguments I like. He's wagonned a lot. He's voting for me for new reasons he hasn't stated, since his old ones are no longer relevant. He's defended a few people I don't think are scum. Meh, I don't know what to make of him.

armlx

voted Max for wagonning pooky, then pookied pook mcpook for pooking pookily, then stridently wagonned the doctor

d2 he started a wagon for max and handed out free tickets. then wagonned twito with reasoning:

CAn't change votes so much, so you FOS everyone? Tahts orful logic man....

then wagons me with stated reason:

Been explained, plus my spidy-senses are tingling (j/k).

Pointing to someone else's explanation as the only reason for your vote is lame, if not scummy. How Tamuz finds me more suspicious than armlx is mindboggling.

[MrBuddyLee]

ScumBuddyLee, what made you change your mind about twito's alignment?

Are you just going easy on him because he is your scumbuddy, or do you have no reason, you are just making one?

10.4 seconds of research there.

When I came into the game, my character had been shackled to Pooky by its actions. It had exhibited what STD called "borderline obsessive" behavior. That's a handicap I had to overcome--one none of you had. I commented as such:

Mastermind of Sin did me no favors by asking you to all become one with the Pookiness. Please feel free to do that on your own time, really. Now to clamber out of this grave he dug...

You found this scummy?

[MrBuddyLee]

Glork

voted Max, got off the bandwagon shocked at the speed of it. hinted he'd come back to max if his behavior continued. voted greyjoy for wagoning, didnt feel the pookywagon cause he got town vibes from pook, came back to max for wagonhop

Criticised and voted BJ for his MaxWagon hop, pointed at nightfall, noted mbl's activity, now has his eye on pooky.

indicates a desire to lynch max while keeping his vote on BJ, switched to M-M for asking for votes, got off the docwagon, said max was the right d1 lynch, criticises and votes BMQ for wagoning M-M.

d2, back to Max. Explains why he didnt speak out more aggressively against doc lynch. unvotes max, saying wagon too easy, votes raj for wagoning, spars with and votes bmq for wagoning twito,
wagons twito for moving beyond newb scumminess.

d3, votes buddylee, no explanation. defends kellychen, merges with another superdetective to form Glorkamuz! jokes that mbl wagon's a done deal, casts sinister light on mbl's knowledge of events before they occured d1/d2.

Glork's hallmark thus far has been to get on and then get off and criticise wagons. Max's, Pooky's, M-M's, MaxWagon II Return of Max, Twito's. Voted Max for wagoning. Voted greyjoy for wagoning. Voted BJ for wagoning. Voted raj for wagoning. Votes BMQ for wagoning.

Mercurial.

In general, being wary of wagons is a good thing. To be on most all of them and then criticise and vote the other riders once off resembles a strategy. The pattern says he'll be off my wagon and criticizing those of you on it by Friday.

[MrBuddyLee]

I think you're scum who knows which wagons were good and which ones were bad -- and that you weighed in accordingly. It doesn't take a psychic scumbag to go "hey, the people not listed in my role PM are probably not on my side."

You're suggesting that I chose which wagons to be on or not be on based on whether "my scumpartners" were on it already. My votes and number of people on each wagon before me:

armlx (0)
BJ (0)
armlx(1) Ameliaslay
Nightfall(0)
raj(0)
helpimabug(0)
Twito(4) BJ, mcqueso, armlx, spamwise
vikingfan(1) Coron
Max(sarcasm vote)
KellyChen (1) BJ

Rich evidence from which you drew that conclusion, Glork. I didn't choose my vote targets based on who was on them at the time, I chose them for behaviors which I almost always stated clearly. Your statement that I've been "weighing in accordingly" is your fabrication and is demonstrably false.

Also, according to your bizarre logic, an action I could have taken to avoid your suspicion today would have been to be on the doctor and Twito wagons.

(on M-M wagon)In a game this size, does leaving a doctor alive for an extra turn really hurt the bad guys that much?

What makes you assume that MM is in fact a doctor? The way you worded this question makes it appear as though you knew he was legit.
My point stands. You didn't say "a claimed doctor," which is what I would expect from a pro-town player. You called him a doctor, in a very matter-of-fact way. I still think you know who is scum and who isn't (for the obvious reason that you yourself are scum), and that you're trying to steer the town in the wrong direction.

Reread my quote. The start of that paragraph said, "If I were scum," and the quote you just took out of context was me hypothesizing about how scum would think, and they'd know he's probably a doc not a "claimed doc". This is another example of you digging really hard to find dirt on me and not reading carefully enough to get the real story.

Voting someone you don't think is scumy =/= not voting someone you think might be scum.
The former can contribute to a mislynch (by being part of the actualy lynchwagon or merely by giving the lynchwagon momentum). The latter is called caution.

You're right, if you don't pay attention and hop off the wagon in time, your vote is irresponsible. But I showed my vote was cautious by hopping off in time, and Glorkamuz called that scummy too.

Unvoting someone you find "very scummy", like you did, carries the opposite risk--of letting bad guys get away. Which is only risky if you're town.

Either you're scum who knew something, or you're an incredibly insightful pro-town player.

Well then, I see why you want to continue this town's rich tradition of lynching what appears to be incompetent scum.


It looks like you're trying to tailor a case to a chosen target instead of the other way around, which is super duper scummalicious. I like people who post alot, because it's pro-town: either you're doing good research and helping or you're doing bad research and painting a bullseye on yourself.

vote: Glork

[MrBuddyLee]

You know Raj you have only wagonned hammered wagoned, waggoned oh I forgot wagoned

Max, you've had some pretty good posts and some pretty bad posts in this game. On the good side, one where you analyzed Glork and one where you gave awards for people's behaviors.

Since people were kind enough to believe your claim after your bizarre behavior day one, I think it'd be great if you posted more content analyzing other people. You're not cleared in my mind, and you showing solid analysis is what's going to convince me.

[MrBuddyLee]

Fritz, if you're voting me so raj doesn't get lynched that's one thing. If you're voting because you find me scummy that's very different. Which one is it, and if so, why do you find me scummy?

[MrBuddyLee]

Fine, if you're a protown information role with info on raj your play here is a terrible one Fritz. You're hopping on a suspect wagon, which'll draw attention to you soon enough.

RAJ isn't scum guys.

Vote: Max

That's about the only reason I haven't voted raj, and I see no reason to trust you now that you've placed what I see as a suspect vote.

My vote's on Glork for presenting misleading evidence about me and not posting to retract. I don't find raj as scummy as some others on my wagon, but Fritzler's move here stinks to high hell of some kind of protection of him.

[MrBuddyLee]

That's about the only reason I haven't voted raj.

Correction: that's one of the main reasons I haven't voted raj, and the reason I unvoted him early D2. The other reason I haven't re-voted raj is because there are other people who've appeared scummier.

[MrBuddyLee]

From my perspective it looks like a move designed to get me lynched instead of raj.

[MrBuddyLee]

er, unless she's claiming power role, then I need to reread. i posted without refreshing to see that last post of hers... scratch my last post

[MrBuddyLee]

Glork, I think at least two of my rebuttals to your points merited your response. The first, where I countered your "selective-wagoning" accusation by proving that I have almost always been the first or second on someone:

armlx (0)
BJ (0)
armlx(1) Ameliaslay
Nightfall(0)
raj(0)
helpimabug(0)
Twito(4) BJ, mcqueso, armlx, spamwise
vikingfan(1) Coron
Max(sarcasm vote)
KellyChen (1) BJ

The second where you tried to make it sound like I made a verbal slip about the doctor, when I clearly did not:

Reread my quote. The start of that paragraph said, "If I were scum," and the quote you just took out of context was me hypothesizing about how scum would think, and they'd know he's probably a doc not a "claimed doc". This is another example of you digging really hard to find dirt on me and not reading carefully enough to get the real story.

If you want to let your false and misleading accusations stand, that's damning evidence that you don't care to see the right people lynched. As you say, is that so hard to figure out?

[MrBuddyLee]

can i drop the hammah? (on the doctor)
unvote, vote: twito
Vote: Kelly chen
unvote, vote: MBL

When a guy primarily speaks with his votes and he's 0-for-4...

unvote Glork, vote: Fritzler

[MrBuddyLee]

I agree with you, Glork, that's why I treated KellyChen as the third suspect vote Fritzler made, because she's essentially claimed a pro-town power role. But I want to go on record as pointing out Fritzler's suspicious play and see if anyone agrees. The vikingfan's a safe vote right now for people--I want to see who has the guts and common sense to vote Fritzler based on his record. People can always shift to vikingfan later if that wagon needs a boost.

[MrBuddyLee]

I'll be there if you need me... this is an important point to make though.

[MrBuddyLee]

but then we have to think... do we lynch another powerrole?

That's where the dilemma lies. What if she's not a powerrole and is attempting to get viking lynched for some other reason? Do we let her live? But if we let her live, how do we test it?

One of the two is scum, right? Kelly. Vikingfan. Kelly. Vikingfan. It's not rocket science.

[MrBuddyLee]

So you people voting for Kelly are operating on the theory that she's scum who came out of her cozy little hidey-hole to make a false accusation against one random townsperson? Think that one through...

[MrBuddyLee]

Yeah, I meant to say at least one of the two are scum, and that we should definitely lynch one of the two today.

[MrBuddyLee]

One of the two is scum, right? Kelly. Vikingfan. Kelly. Vikingfan. It's not rocket science.

unvote, vote MBL

I really hate this type of argument. So many things wrong with it.

I corrected myself. Besides:

Let me clarify that I have 0% doubt about vikingfan being scum.

0% doubt. From all appearances past and present, Kelly is a logical player. Therefore, if vikingfan dies an innocent, there are very few conceivable circumstances that would have allowed Kelly to be town and be wrong. And if she WAS wrong, then her statement of 0% doubt was incredibly irresponsible and she should probably die anyway. More likely, if vikingfan turns up innocent, Kelly's scum.

My statement you quote above wasn't technically correct to the T, but practically speaking, in this situation are we really going to assume the boundary case?

You're clearly trying to set up a lynch of me in the next day or two, because it's not happening today. Question is, is that setup appropriate given all my actions this game or is it a scummy setup?

[MrBuddyLee]

Why FOS those two and not Spamwise?

[MrBuddyLee]

I said it's a distinct possibility that Kelly would be vigged if VikingFan turns up town, especially considering a few players have already voiced the opinion that they're certain at least one of Kelly and VikingFan are scum.

If you're counting me as one of those people who's certain one or the other is scum, please take me off that list. It's conceivable but unlikely to me that {vikingfan is innocent and kelly is pro-town but made bad assumptions and thus a bad 100% statement.}

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote Fritzler, vote: vikingfan

FOS: {Fritzler/raj}, armlx, Tamuz

[MrBuddyLee]

*coughs*

[MrBuddyLee]

vote: armlx.

My reasons given yesterday.

*braces for Tamuz's vote*

[MrBuddyLee]

vote: armlx.

My reasons given yesterday.

*braces for Tamuz's vote*

I can't find that post anywhere. Could you point me in the right direction, pretty please?

posts 786, 787, 790, 794 for a rundown of the people on my wagon yesterday. Fritzler hopped on later for whatever reasons, so obviously legit townies found me scummy for some reason, but I found the stated reasoning by the rest of the wagoneers poor.

[MrBuddyLee]

I am a one-shot cop/vig. More or less if I target a scum with my ability they die, but if I target a townie they live.

I targetted MBL last night due to my suspicions. He is still alive and I recieved confirmation he is pro-town.

Curious use of your one-shot. Coron was the first to point to vikingfan with a vote and no analysis, and I posted my analysis a day or so later. I don't think it reads at all like scum faking an attack on their partner. So while I didn't consider myself cleared after viking's lynch, I'm surprised I was still at the top of anyone's list.

19 alive, 6 dead, total of 25 players, no evidence of multiple night killing groups after three nights. It must be a sizable mafia group. Alternate possibilities--we have incredibly lucky roleblockers or groups acting on alternate nights. It crossed my mind that the wagon on me persisted yesterday because one scum group thought I was a member of the other group. When kelly indicted vikingfan I'd think a lone scum group would have bailed onto either a kellywagon or a vikingwagon pronto.

[MrBuddyLee]

So Mariyta, you found the wagon on me yesterday to be well-founded? None of those people more suspicious than Max? What's your take on armlx's claim?

[MrBuddyLee]

Your hesitance to express an opinion on armlx, for one.

Your dismissal of Kelly's evidence yesterday, for another.

[MrBuddyLee]

I'm not hesitant to express an opinion. I said I don't see where the evidence against him is coming from. If by "hesitance" you mean I'm not agreeing with you, than by all means, vote me. Clearly, you are always correct, and could never be wrong.....

As to the "dismissal" of Kelly's evidence.... I still haven't really been able to find that evidence. Again, it seems like I'm being attacked because I don't agree with YOUR vote. Thank you, move along.

Actually, you have been hesitant to get off the fence with regards to armlx, as the quotes below demonstrate. You're not being attacked--that's an overreaction. You're being questioned because you backed the wrong horse yesterday. I think it's perfectly reasonable to do so.

No one expects you to agree with them, but we'd like some more meat from you. For example, your last five votes have been for the following stated reasons:
*I don't believe your claim Kelly, you must die
*OK Kelly, it's obvious the viking wagon is winning, count me in
*no stated reason
*throwaway vote for being called a him
*no stated reason

Not the kind of behavior that gets by without being questioned.

I would like to see a claim as well, but I'm not ready to vote yet.

I'm not convinced on the armlx thing yet. I would like to see some more from him.

Vote: Max

I'm not sure yet. I'm still trying to work through that. I'm trying to re-read things and get a feel for everyone. Right now, Max is the one that stands out, hence the vote. It may change.

[MrBuddyLee]

He

twice

pointed out that vikingfan had responded to the case against him... Once when I asked why vikingfan wasn't commenting on the bandwagons in progress:

Vikingfan gave a lengthy response to my post targetting him. I wouldn't expect him to weigh in on me if he doesn't find me scummy.

Speaking of scummy, I haven't seen a scummier wagon than the one on me right now. Question is, which one of em's the sleaziest?

For a reason I still don't understand (apparently a mistake?) MrBuddyLee suggested that (by claiming info on vikingfan) I was working to get himself deadline lynched rather than raj.

Then he voted Fritzler for a few days...

You asked specifically, "How come vikingfan didn't weigh in on MrBuddyLee" when he had recently weighed in on my post noting his behavior. I was just being fair, but I didn't think his defense was compelling.

I corrected myself about your vikingfan vote and your roleclaim two minutes after the post you noted:

6:20pm

From my perspective it looks like a move designed to get me lynched instead of raj.

6:22pm

er, unless she's claiming power role, then I need to reread. i posted without refreshing to see that last post of hers... scratch my last post

I voted Fritzler for a few days because he hopped off your wagon and on my wagon after you brought your info out. Earlier you'll note in several of my posts I thought he was representing cop, but once he hopped onto my wagon I thought it was possibly otherwise:

Fine, if you're a protown information role with info on raj your play here is a terrible one Fritz. You're hopping on a suspect wagon, which'll draw attention to you soon enough.

RAJ isn't scum guys.

That's about the only reason I haven't voted raj, and I see no reason to trust you now that you've placed what I see as a suspect vote.

I don't find raj as scummy as some others on my wagon, but Fritzler's move here stinks to high hell of some kind of protection of him.

You've gotta understand, from my perspective this wagon was forming on me and the wagoners were stating reasons that made no sense or weren't bothering to give reasons at all. At some point it registered that maybe Fritzler was pretending cop who'd gotten a result on raj, since they were both on my wagon.

Also, I'm pretty sure Fritz investigated raj and bj, and pooky too if he had a night zero investigation.

MBL, you seem to be very willing to state and elaborate on the reasoning behind a bandwagon you're not even voting on.

Are you suggesting I move my vote off of armlx and onto Mariyta?

[MrBuddyLee]

I find armlx significantly scummier based on his overall four day pattern of behavior. If his claim's true, then I'm wrong, but the fact he stayed on my wagon all day yesterday in light of Kelly's evidence, plus his decision to "use his claim" on me, made me suspicious. As Kelly said, my attitude towards vikingfan should have moved me down his list of suspects.

I think voting one person and expressing suspicion about others should be considered scummy only if the suspicions are poorly founded.

[MrBuddyLee]

So you think Armlx is scum who decided he'd attack you fiercly so that he could set up and claim this one-shot gig?

All I have to go on is that he wagoned M-M and Twito with pretty much no stated reasons and then chose to stick with his vote on me for no stated reasons over a vote for viking based on kelly's claim.

If his claim is true, then he made a bizarre choice there and didn't realize it would bite him in the ass today.

If his claim is false, then I think he made up his claim today after he saw the reasons people were voting for him.

[MrBuddyLee]

Look at it this way, MBL. If you are the scummiest player in the game to me, and I've been attacking you, why wouldn't I use a Vig/Cop ability against you? If I was right, you die as scum, and if I was wrong, I know you're legit.

I agree, but as Kelly mentioned, it's unexpected that he (and Tamuz) still found me the scummiest person in the game after viking was lynched as scum. You and Kelly didn't:

I find it a stretch to believe that MrBuddyLee and vikingfan were scum together...

Reading on, I see that MBL has raised the same points against VikingFan. Maybe I was wrong about that guy... Wink

I still think that the three points MBL and I brought up (about viking) are just inherently scummy. his response to Kelly... is not reasonable.

Armlx did, and Tamuz still finds me scummiest even though yet another piece of his evidence turned out to be terribly inaccurate:

OK MrScumBuddyLee just ignored me and went off randomly on vikingfan to move attention. Scum tactic of avoidance and distraction.

My oppinions haven't changed since D1, Viking. Whats the point of my continually stating that.

[MrBuddyLee]

I can't honestly believe that Max could be that nonsensical... but other than during that D1 push (which never went through anyway), nobody's really looked at him.

There's been plenty of material to work with since Twito got lynched. I agree we should be getting stronger opinions from Max.

Max, you owe us the goods mang. Who's scum?

So unless you believe she [Kelly] was scum who sacfriced her buddy

^is possible. Not exactly likely, but I wouldn't rule it out. I've pulled that stunt before as scum.

Can't rule it out, but it'd be a real ass move to out a partner who wasn't really on the chopping block at the time. If Kelly screwed viking that bad I imagine we'd have seen some steam coming out of his ears.

[MrBuddyLee]

Max, you've been completely unhelpful today. Please give us your suspicions and give us one or two reasons we shouldn't lynch you besides "HURR IM TOWN".

[MrBuddyLee]

Glork came after me for a while there with arguments that had that "decent, but cooked up" feeling to them. A lot of details were wrong, and he didn't seem to read the overall tone of my posts--was more looking for flaws that could lead to the next lynch. It wouldn't shock me in the least if he turned up scum, but there's always the chance that his research and :goodpostings: will bag us someone.

I don't really expect to be alive tomorrow, so I'll see if I can contribute anything worthwhile today. Rereading...

[MrBuddyLee]

I've heard "tech" is a cardplayer's term for "effective", or more loosely, "cool".

[MrBuddyLee]

I isolated Fortify's posts with the intent of defending him. After all, he'd attacked Glork, said reasonable things about the armlx wagon and directed the cop in a newbish but well-intentioned manner. But then I dove deeper into the murk:

(Glork, )To be honest your constant switching to vote Max when he seems like a popular choice seems a bit scummy to me.

A day later:

Is Max the lovable fool of the group or is he really the one pulling the strings?

FOS: Max

(and)
He's not strung up yet, but maybe it would be good to do so.
(and)
Max is getting strung up. Obviously many people feel he is scum. So I suspected you for defending him. Is that iron clad proof?

Summary: Fortify suspects Glork for convenient Maxwagoning, then the next day suspects Coron for defending Max.

It doesn't get any better than that, folks. Sorry, Fortify, but if you're town you cooked yourself. That kind of 180-degree flip-flop is only acceptable by town when accompanied by an elaborate claim involving spaceships and aliens bearing electric prods.

unvote Twito, vote: Fortify

[MrBuddyLee]

er,

unvote armlx, vote: Fortify

Yeah, Twito's scummy but since he's not in this game I'll cut him some slack.

[MrBuddyLee]

Mr. Buddy surely a wise man such as yourself must have figured out what happened. I figured that Glork was merely voting max in order push a hasty lynch and that was about it. However after reading more accusations on Max and

having him not say a word to defend himself

I realized that perhaps Glork and others were actually suspicious of him. Hence why I unvoted Glork but I am still rather suspicious of him considering he gave no reason as to why he jumped on Max. I believe I made mine clear, let me explain.

Just because Glork gave no reason for voting max (why I voted for him) doesn't mean the other people who have voted for him didn't. Many people explained their reasoning and brought up some pretty good points. So here we have Max under heavy accusation throughout this game and giving very poor meathods of defending himself. Then along comes Coron and defends Max for him. Why? This seemed pretty suspicious to me which is why I FOSed Coron and, as I mentioned before, if I was to FOS Coron for defending Mac it would only make sense to FOS Max as well. I've already said all of this, what is with the itchy trigger finger?

Post 1058 you said

Glork was scummy for wagoning Max.

Posts 1059-1071 (13 posts) were not notable other than:

Sorry for not posting but My inernet was down so HI everyone again I'll be posting this in all my games then I'll come back and read the thread

(and yet one of your cited reasons for suddenly suspecting Max was his failure to defend himself? He said he was rereading--seems a bit unfair of you.)
and two quick votes on Max and Coron's indication of a possible incoming Maxwagon and quality sarcasm.

Post 1074 you said

Coron was scummy for defending Max.

So you changed your mind on Max because a wagon was forming on him. You may have decided to go back and read more carefully because the wagon was forming, but I find your FOS on Coron hypocritical. He was doing exactly what you'd been doing 24 hours earlier. Why not suggest he read the thread like you did instead of FOSing him?

One possible explanation is that you're playing a little wild but with good intentions. Another is that you're indiscriminating scum. It's good that you're expressing suspicions--I'm just suggesting that you try to found them in fact before, not after, you post them.

[MrBuddyLee]

Half of getting out of a wagon is defending yourself, half of the trick is finding a better target for choo choo. Embracing your own death, not so much.

[MrBuddyLee]

MOD I have unvoted GLORK Just wanted to let you know.

I don't see the reasoning for an armlx lynch. Just have our confirmed cop investigate him tonight

Who are your top three suspects right now? And how do you explain the quotes above in light of your copness?

[MrBuddyLee]

I think Glork was the bookie pick of the day.

[MrBuddyLee]

chugga chugga

Vote: Save the Dragons

fos

read my mind

[MrBuddyLee]

Lets see, I don't like the way Glork blew himself up to seem incredibly important and anti-scum in post 1154. He makes himself seem much more valuable than he actually was in the lynch of a known scum.

Tamuz is a smart man. You should follow us to victory. (:

Glork and Tamuz are on the lynch. That's really all the explanation you need.

Like I said, we're in consensus now. It's a done deal, really.

QFT? LOL. WTF?

ps. C'mon, Tamuz, just vote for me, for old times' sake.

[MrBuddyLee]

Been waiting to see who would figure that out... Glork, you may be town after all.

[MrBuddyLee]

i also dont like MBL's reply, as to me it leaves 2 choices:

A) if MBL figured out a lead pointing towards a possible scum and he didn't mention it then he is probably scum.

B) if MBL had not figured it out than he just lied, also a scummy move.

FoS: MBL

Think (A) over again and get back to me.

[MrBuddyLee]

Rushing headlong into accusations isn't always the best way to get info. You do that, and people usually get in line, choo choo. I'd rather see people surmise for themselves that Max was likely the bookie target and draw conclusions based on that possibility.

[MrBuddyLee]

I'm starting to give up hope on this game, as everyone is just bandwagoning recklessly.

We've nailed two scum in a row. I think you have a valid point about the behaviors of some, but why get despondent? STD's not dead yet because not everyone's a reckless bandwagoner. His lynch is clearly not a cut and dried situation.

looking at these VCs, I'm definitely thinking that the big pushes against Pooky and M-M probably had some scum buried in the middle of them.

Ya think? If this turns out to be true, your pro-town credentials will be just about bulletproof.

5 Max (Mariyta, armlx, Ameliaslay, Save The Dragons, SpamWise)

Other than Spam, this is wagon-o-scumminess. Or laziness. Max has been the easy vote for three days now. Right after this vote count, the Fortify wagon got rolling and Mariyta chose to FOS Fortify instead of voting him. She's dismissed Kelly's evidence on vikingfan, she's waffled on armlx, she got suckered on to a train of kellychen. She directed this to HelpImaConfirmedScum:

Just trying to jump on the voting train, Hiab?

Isolate her posts and take a look-see. Not rich with pro-towny goodness. It almost looks like she's getting paid to be on the winning wagon.

[MrBuddyLee]

STD, the last three people you voted for were voted for no stated reason. Hardly convincing when you're on the rack. I think everyone would like to know who you suspect and why, and if it's convincing, maybe they'll hop off.

[MrBuddyLee]

vote: STD

[MrBuddyLee]

I voted STD to make it a horserace and see who jumps on to finish one of them off. I also think armlx's behavior makes him look like town who gave up, though it's possible he's just scummy scum playin possum.

[MrBuddyLee]

Unofficial

vote count

7 armlx (gmk, SpamWise, BabyJesus, Coron, Save The Dragons, Tamuz, Max)
8 Save The Dragons (Glork, Cogito Ergo Sum, ubertimmy, rajrhcpfreak, slaking_master, Mariyta, MrBuddyLee, BrianMcQueso)

2 not voting (Ameliaslay, armlx)

9 to lynch

[MrBuddyLee]

unvote STD

[MrBuddyLee]

vote: armlx

[MrBuddyLee]

I like the makeup of the armlx wagon better.

I reviewed both of their post histories. Voting histories. Neither looks particularly pro-town. I'll take the wagon with gmk, SpamWise, BabyJesus and Coron on it.

[MrBuddyLee]

Why does it particularly matter if I'm confirmed?

[MrBuddyLee]

That looks suspiciously like an "oh well, go scum!"

[MrBuddyLee]

armlx, you haven't been helpful in a month. Who are the remaining scum?

[MrBuddyLee]

I just... don't know what to think at this point. It seems too simple to lynch Armlx. But... what else is there?

*sigh*

vote: BMQ

[MrBuddyLee]

The tone of your post really didn't sound right to me. I'd think pro-town would have the get-up-and-go to ask some questions and drag out some info on their own instead of being resigned to their fate.

It's odd that you would describe my one vote as "trying to start a bandwagon on you." Of all the people in this game to rail on about unfounded votes, I think I'm pretty low on the list based on D1-Dx behavior and discussions.

[MrBuddyLee]

*shakes fist*

[MrBuddyLee]

the only thing that explains my actions is that am a plain townie.

thats why i am lurking and not really caring about the game. im sorry. most of you that have played with me knows that i wouldnt be playing like this if i had a halfway intresting role.

this is my least fav role.

Please try to care about the games you play. Indifference looks scummy and ends up wrecking the game for everyone else.