Mafia 60: Face-to-Face - Game over!
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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CES is more active than usual early, probably because Andrew's blood is in the water. His comments so far are consistently aligned towards attaining an Andrew lynch.
Andrew realizes a trick move went horribly bad, no alignment discernable from his panicked attempt to recover. His counterwagon attempt following Glork's CES vote is transparent. He then expresses indifference about suicide a couple times, and that's not a protown action. His vote on MGM is sound, however, his expressed logic for unvoting MGM leaves the door way too open for trivial unvote, possible scumpair association.
ChannelDbird wins the late to the table on the WIFOM issue award, after interim posts avoiding it.
Patrick reaching on the issue of the Andrewwagon. From then on sounds like protown Patrick again and makes appropriate observations.
Spectrumvoid with extreme and suspect protection of Andrew. Votes CES and oddly unvotes the next day for no apparent reason.
Thesp strings up Andrew in the guise of a lesson. He proceeds to base an argument against Andrew on very factual info with what sounds like little gut instinct behind it. Most recent argument: kill Andrew to keep him from cluttering the game, almost sounds like he's assuming Andrew's town. Takes offense at Nightfall's deflection of the AndrewS lynch. Has zeroed in on "the right lynch" for today, a tactical play.
Glork makes a magnificent suggestion and only one person bites. A little later on he belabors it in the middle of other more relevant arguments, knowing full well what insightful 11 answers he's going to get. Shows consistent and aggressive protection of Thesp for unknown and apparently unfounded reasons. Glork points out IH's illogical Ether/Andrew hypothesis immediately, is apparently not in flippant Glork mode. (Thesp simulposts same.)
IH is town until his overreaching attack on Ether, which doesn't make sense. She could easily be making a protown play or be scum sucking up to a townie, either of which IH doesn't appear to consider.
Ether good observations of who appears to be playing for the town win. Later on, a post showing more thoughtfulness and curiosity. I don't have a problem with her reasoned stance on Andrew. Good poke at sv.
MGM is the first to make the move I'd expect scum to make on Glork's play, regardless of Glork's alignment. Then he makes the mistake of saying:
which seems to be assuming the township of Andrew and Glork.MGM wrote:Granted, you might get a few scum on your bandwagon, but not because they're opportunists, it will be because you called the wagon on yourself
Nightfall votes Ether for protecting Andrew, without really explaining whether he thinks one or both are scum. Thin contribution.
Adele hops off the Andrewwagon as it's losing steam. This is the only note I took of Adele's play, meaning she's not playing or saying much.
At the end of my read I had no notes on Zindaras, and a reread confirmed his posts were all paper-thin.
vote: MGM, FOS: Andrewneed more from Nightfall, Adele, Zindy and Fritz. Ether, Patrick looking town.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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unvote, vote: spectrumvoid.You're avoiding saying anything noteworthy. Then again, neither was Zindy til someone noticed.
I'll be back on the MGMwagon in a sec, or maybe I won't.
In other news, the Thesp-Glork axis gives me hives. Fortunately, this crew doesn't have many sheep in it.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Either Glork really gets a kick out of being manic, or he's not sure if he can fake being analytically curious when he's scum so he covers by being irrational 80% of the time.
Either that or when he's useful he gets killed so he tried to be unhelpful for a day or two so he can actually make some endgames.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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My comment isn't sketchy if you read between the lines. I don't see how finding an unfounded unholy alliance creepy is hypocritical in the least, and I think there are more independent thinkers in this game than the average game.
Still waiting for the slightest hint of township from sv.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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This is a fallacy. A "good" player doesn't limit lynch discussion to one or two players far from the deadline. Thre's nothing realistic about giving the town less info to work with by narrowing the discussion.Patrick wrote:I tend to be more realistic now, and don't see IH being lynched in 3 days (although the deadline is gone now). I mean sure it's realistic timewise if a load of ppl switched their votes, but it seems that few ppl are interested in lynching IH, despite what I consider to be scummy play on his part.
I think everyone should take a stand on Andrew's silliness today. I think there'll be town on both sides of one issue (WIFOM issue) and unanimous on the other (suicidal tendencies issue). I think catching scumpartners of Andrew would have to be done by analyzing nuances, not their actual net stance on "Andrew".Patrick wrote:I do have another theory, which involves MBL and Andrew as scumbuddies. I had been going to ask Thesp why he had accused MBL of being scum, but instead decided to look back at the only substantial post MBL had made at the time, to see if there was anything in it. I noticed MBL linked several ppl to Andrew, while suggesting MgM as an alternative, bringing a load of others into the spotlight, while praising two players (myself and Ether) who have been somewhat defending Andrew. Also keeps a fairly noncommital stance on Andrew himself. Don't think it's strong enough to make a definite link, but Thesp always comes across as very sure of himself anyway.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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I checked back and didn't see where anyone asked you why you unvoted Glork. In my experience, scum's more likely to do things like reread to pre-emptively defend against possible attacks.Mgm wrote:After checking my own posts, it appears I haven't explained my reasoning for unvoting Glork.
Andrew, what's your take on spectrumvoid?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Consecutive posts:
Ether wrote:I haven't the slightest idea what's up with Mgm. I don't like him, but I like IH less.
Hmm.Ether wrote:Speaking of which, Mgm's posts give off a vibe of overwhelming stupid and I don't actually find them scummy. Hey, Thesp--whatwasyour alternate theory?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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IH isn't as aggressively insightful as I've seen him. His play is more flippant and he's hedging here and there.
Here's his first real serious vote:
This is the kind of mealy-mouthed argument scum would make for a lynch.IH wrote:I need to do a little reread to make sure, but pretty sure that MGM has been wishy washy, unhelpful, and "misread" the game a few times to many for my liking.
= | Lemme go through his posts first to make sure.
I prefer an MGM lynch/vig. I think IH is a solid scum candidate but not likely in conjunction with MGM.
unvote, vote: MGM
Thesp, why haven't you expressed an opinion on MGM? His play's noteworthy.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Adele
Most likely of anyone to be scum. Mealy-mouthed near-complete lack of genuine suspicions, and significantly, seemed to take for granted that sv was actually a vig before that was confirmed.
ChannelDelibird
Voting purely on WIFOM, then again when commenting on Glork. Lame, and near-total lack of curiosity.
Cogito Ergo Sum
Way more chirpy and active than usual. I've seen him be lazy town and SK. Significantly manipulative D1. Seemingly strategic push on Thesp.
Ether
Moved off of IH as soon as it was evident he was being vigged, in the same post in which she said she found IH's postings helpful in assessing another player. Bzzt, if you think someone's scum you look for the manipulation in their posts, not rely upon them for greater insight. Ether's also probably scum.
Fritzler
Early vote on Thesp could have been part of a coordinated pregame strat to get Thesp run up for a claim...
Glork
Makes a visible point of not being part of the Thespwagon attempt. Doesn't question sv or discourage her from claiming when she's run up to L-2 for pretty much no reason. Voted MGM yet wanted an IH vig. Good post today, but if he's scum he had to do that to head off flak from yesterday's poor show.
MgM
He's reading the thread more carefully than most. He said a few things that made no sense, but looks to be hunting for contradictions.
MrBuddyLee
Nightfall
Comments positively on the Vote Thesp activity without actually voting Thesp. Large quantity of analysis that looks genuine. Subtle defense of Glork, unapologetic about the Andrew lynch.
Patrick
Yet another person a little weird about Glork and the early Thesp-wagon attempt. Likes the Thesp list of 4 and lightheartedly attempts to narrow attention to that list. Seems to be reading the game more carefully than most.
Thesp
Voted Andrew, never moved it. Pushed it aggressively. Created a list of four and advocated a vig of the most "useless" one in this game. A lot of overt manipulation and leading of the town. Most notably, though he was pushy about his theories and his scumlist, he didn't try to derail the IH vig even though IH wasn't on his scumlist. Looks like scum happy with the bad vig decision, making a minimal alternate vig suggestion without really trying to make it happen. Aggressive when it suits, passive when it suits. Probably scum.
Zindaras
Defends andrew, decent analysis, subtly advocates a Thesp lynch if Andrew turns up town, satisfied with the IH vig.
Why were scum happy with the IH vig and pushing it/not fighting it? Cause he was an easy target, probably not for his suspicions, which were never driven home in a convincing manner.
The sheer amount of unusual attention paid to a Thespwagon D1 leads me to believe it was part of a scum strategy discussed N0. Whether or not Thesp was a part of it, it looks like scum saw the benefit in it, and if they didn't plan it ahead of time, it looks like some followed each others' leads in making it a notable D1 event.
vote: Thesp,mafia godfather recklessly unafraid of investigation N1 and drawing attention away from his babes of doom.FOS: Ether, Adeledialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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I think I typed that before I noticed Thesp's failure to contest the IH vig, which is the most glaring event in the game thus far. Read Adele's comments about sv after her claim though and you'll see why Adele stood out as scummiest before that observation about Thesp.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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This is borderline distractive from the meat of my post.Glork wrote:How, and in what order, did you go about compiling the results of your analysis?
As always, I isolate everyone's posts once a week or so and particularly after lynches, take notes on each of them, then fill in the holes with a start-to-finish read for context. I work alphabetically unless I'm short on time in which case I limit the analysis to my top 2-3 suspects.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Adele, your post on Ether moved the game forward. Your most recent post was twice as many words but doesn't appear to have stated anything particularly relevant to finding scum. Making neutral observations on Day 2 without attaching significant opinion to them is something I find detachedly scummy. Do you concur?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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I just see Thesp as curiously passive today. Does no one else notice this? It's as notable as Glork switching from manic mode to rational mode or Ether switching from present mode to absent mode.
Also, CES got more conservative today. CDB is trying to appear more active but isn't succeeding. All of these changes in response to the lynch and the night's events. The answer to WHO IS SCUM lies in that mess somewhere.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Another post by CDB attempting to appear more active.
Thesp, you asked why I wasn't voting CDB, which is a bold, somewhat manipulative question for you to ask considering I'm currently voting for you. I caught CDB as scum via a cop investigation in another game but I sat back and watched his play rather than blurt out that I had a result. He was significantly manipulative in that game, and I see him as significantly passive in this game. My read on him is lazy town. My vote's on you because while you're passive as well, your behavior change indicates a desire for self-preservation rather than town preservation. I suppose CDB's does as well, but your D1-D2 shift is stark and inexplicable. His play is consistently slack.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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CDB, the game was Wheel of Time.
Glork, I'd define active as not only posting, but posting substance. As an example, one is not active if they simply post a summary of events without analysis. That's trying to create the appearance of thoughtfulness and activity. Sometimes I find your manic play as an attempt to appear active, when actually you can coast through a day with that tactic and later explain it away as wily protown play instead of laziness. Sometimes you'll see Adele correct people's logic without making a statement on whether or not they're scummy--it's more conversational. Same concept.
CDB's posts don't appear to be hunting scum, or at the best, they're incomplete analyses that show limited curiosity. His reread categorizes the other eleven players according to his worldview, which is useful, except he leaves out MGM, Adele and me. At least two of those are people I see as somewhat in the spotlight. So we're left to wonder whether he's scum not truly curious about alignments or whether he's lazy town.
CES, why are you so focused on Glork's opinion of you? Your recent posts indicate you think he's scum, so wouldn't his opinion be moot in that case?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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This game can't proceed without Ether. She's on many people's lists of suspicions, and letting her skate for an entire day without comment would give her a distinct advantage if she's scum.
I think discussion should continue, and we shouldn't narrow our prospects too far without hearing from her. Supposedly that'll be soon.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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True, you have made plenty of comments on him before--I just woke up, read the thread and your post looked lazy-ish to me so I commented.
Your case against Mgm doesn't make it sound like you're significantly convinced:
Odd posts, not paying attention, obstinacy are mealy-mouthed reasons scum use to incriminate people they know aren't scum. Can you clarify your stance on Mgm please when you get the time? It's not like you haven't posted content, but it doesn't read clearly to me.Patrick wrote:I've read MgM's posts and some of the accusations against him. He's made some odd posts, and hasn't paid attention at times. As I noted before his attack on Glork was strange and felt like he was sticking to a rigid policy of just voting anyone suggesting no lynch. I don't know, there seems to be less going against him that I had first thought. I'm not sure I find him any worse than ppl like Adele or CDB.
MgM: I think the day 1 case against him was overstated. However, the defences he's used today for asking spectrumvoid to claim set off alarm bells with me. If you think someone is a powerole, you step up to defend them if needed. I am struggling to reconcile what MgM did with a pro town mindset. Interesting is how Adele said "Someone owes someone an apology, which seemed to be a way of avoiding taking a side. Last thing on Mgm is that his vote for Glork in post 465 felt strangely oppotunistic. More likely than average to be scum.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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There's a certain type of "confusion" that's a hallmark of scum, and it's typically the product of a careless read. Those dirty little bastards don't need to read at all to figure out who scum are, and their skims leave telltale signs.
Town skims for different things than scum, I'd say. Clearly it's not a universal tell. And at the worst, when you vote people for skimming, you encourage them to step up their game.
I think Ether should be replaced if she doesn't post immediately. Going on vacation followed by a promised and undelivered post upon return is understandable, but not entirely considerate.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Here's the thing about confusion:
"Bad" players will be confused as both town and scum. Moderate scumtell.
"Good" players, like Glork, pride themselves on attention to detail, and when they're confused in particular ways, it's less likely they're town and more likely they're lazy scum coasting while they catch up on homework or own some face in Magic. That's all I'm sayin, and I do think you can extend it to a lesser extent to more casual players.
Don't let Ether skate--no lynches yet!dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Ether, can you please go into depth about your opinions of Thesp? You say you don't find his false dilemma attacks scummy. And that you're empathetic with his singleminded D1 play for some reason? What seems genuinely protown about Thesp to you thus far?
Also, please elaborate on how/why Adele is "meh".
As for Nightfall, do you really see his significant efforts as scummy? I see sincerity of suspicion and uncertainty.
Also, can we have your opinions on the rest of the players?
CDB: What's your take on Adele and MGM?
CES: You do realize your behavior today is identical to the D1 behavior of Thesp, the guy you're trying to get lynched. Why shouldn't we be voting for you instead?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Any of you wagonny types... I think we're far enough into the game that if you're going to do that kinda shit, you should still accompany your votes with reasons.
For example, I foresee votes moving off Thesp right about now and I wanna know if that's because you don't find him scummy anymore or because you don't think he's lynchable today and are looking for a compromise target.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Ether, I think I can pinpoint your feelings on exactly one player by reading your post history. You've managed to couch just about everything in a rich pudding of ambiguity which, while delicious, doesn't help ascertain the alignment of the chef.
Thesp appears to be reading the game carefully and picking up on nuances, but I still don't like the way he presents his suspects primarily as mantra. Patrick's deliberated ambiguity caught my eye as well. Patrick, you asked me about MGM, who's the current alternative to a Thespwagon. I think MGM's shown a healthy interest in a fair number of players, unlike Ether and Thesp, but has also been significantly defensive. OMGUSsy as well, though I've never seen that as a scum trait. I wouldn't add a vote to lynch MGM at this point.
CDB, you haven't answered my question.
CES and Thesp, you never REALLY answered my question, so I'll restate: how do you see Thesp D1 and CES D2 behavior differing?
Adele, got a read on Fritz?
mFOS: Zindaras.Playing the lazy card for two weeks now, wagonhopping, not concerned with helping us ascertain his alignment.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Are you kidding me? After all this time, you come back to clarify the definition of "significant effort"? Ridiculously dilatory tactics this close to deadline.Ether wrote:Post 706, MBL wrote:As for Nightfall, do you really see his significant efforts as scummy? I see sincerity of suspicion and uncertainty.
No, I'm serious! I'd love to sort this out.Ether wrote:Please clarify what "significant effort" refers to if you want to know if I find it scummy in particular.
I'll respond in brief to highlight the incomprehensibility of your request. Nightfall's probably given us more analytical content to work with than any other player. The only problem at this point is that he's gone alphabetically and left out MGM->Zindy (5 players, 1-2 of whom are scummy). But if you do anything other than skim his posts, you'll see he's made evaluative remarks on dozens of specific passages, which 1) is a sign he's not lazy scum and 2) is more and more difficult to do and fake curiosity and uncertainty as the amount of analytical comment grows.
So I'll repeat the question. Can you please explain what pattern of deception you see in Nightfall's posts, Ether? Your consistent votes on him look to be for incredibly shaky reasons.
Ether wrote:unvote; vote: NightfallI really don't see any point whatsoever to his new posting style, and I probably still wouldn't if I was at the height of my mental health. A few paragraphs of personal opinion, please; I trust the filter for the rest.Ether wrote:Mgm is more scum than Thesp but less scum than Nightfall. Channel's somewhere up there if Nightfall and Mgm really can't provide leads, yeah, whatever. (Speaking of leads, Adele is meh; could somebody resummarize the Adele/Mgm connection?)
Not only were Nightfall's attacks on me stretchy, they were stretchyfrom other people. I don't see much in his PBPs, particularly the one on me... Anyway, this paragraph is getting long. Let's just kill him.vote: Nightfall)dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Looking at where all the votes are at the moment, and assuming Adele is cop, Thesp's stock goes down, my vote on Ether gives me less confidence, and Zindaras looks more appealing as a suspect. If we had five days to make this decision, I think I'd switch my vote to Zindaras, but with only a few hours til deadline I'm rooting for a stampede to Ether. Tough call, but I'm going to roll with the hypothesis that she's scum trying to coast by on appearances alone and pluck at the eyeballs of the weak sheep in the flock. Her ho-hum assault on Nightfall is the clincher--read it yourselves and see if it leaves an aggressive scumhunting aftertaste on your palate.
If Thesp gets lynched and turns up town, I think it's fairly clear who gets run up tomorrow. If he's scum, I think Zindy and Glork have some splainin to do. I suppose I will as well, to a lesser extent.
I'll try to post again before deadline--there's a lot to process in light of the two possible confirmed innocents. Everyone please weigh in.
Adele, why didn't you investigate Thesp last night?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Glork wrote:I could probably be persuaded to move to Thesp if I don't get my way, though.Glork wrote:Since that initial list has posted, MGM/Adele have risen to the top of my list. My Ether suspicion is in something of a stasis, and Thesp/CDB have slipped a bit.Glork wrote:Right now, I don't plan on moving to Thesp unless we get another deadline and we need a lynch on somebody.Glork wrote:Guys, I don't think Thesp is the play.
A lot of interest in the Thesp topic and yet somewhat uncharacteristic waffling.Glork wrote:I want MGM or Adele killed dead today. Period. I'm at the point where I don't think I'd even support a Thespwagon for the sake of attaining a lynch. If we have to NL, so be it.
I also think Glork has been particularly gentlemanly towards Ether despite her exhibiting the kind of play that he typically goes after aggressively.
Plus, he hasn't called me stupid yet this game, which is a very bad sign imo.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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No vote from Fritz to start the day is uncharacteristic--looks like he's waiting to see where things move. Also not impressive that his vote was on Adele at the end of yesterday. Worse, Patrick's was on MGM, and Patrick checked in to discuss but chose not to move his vote. His attempt to coast past that error on his part without an apology makes him AND Thesp look a little suspect, and makes Zindy look a little less suspicious. I would expect the difficulty finishing off Thesp if there were two scum laying off his wagon end of day yesterday.
Thesp, what do you think of Fritz, Ether and Patrick, Glork, CES and their end-of-day behavior yesterday? If you are town, you must have a unique perspective on behavior surrounding your wagon yesterday.
Fritz, you hammer, it's your thing. Why the hesitation to hammer Thesp?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Would you be referring to this interaction:Thesp wrote:I find it intriguing. I don't think Fritzler is scum (in particular, in your initial paragraph for both of us to be scum would require unusual interaction in thread).
or one of the interactions where Fritz says you're a terrible lynch? Please clarify, Thesp, cause your comment looks like the kind of flippant thing a partner of Fritz would say to brush past his blatant protection of you if you're both scum. I see no unusual interaction between the two of you that indicates there's no way you're aligned.Thesp wrote:I still think he's town for other outweighing reasons that I don't care to divulge.
OK wait. So the most reasonable explanation is that you're town and all three scum were already on your wagon, and the remaining five or six townies all had genuine doubts about your guilt to the point of foregoing a lynch altogether? (Making them look FOSable in the process) Cause the way I see it, it's much more likely that you're scum and your scumpartners weren't willing to pile on. Ether in particular REALLY tried to make it sound like she was all set to hop aboard your train, and then just inexplicably DIDN'T. And Fritzler and Patrick appeared so paralyzed by the situation that they didn't even bother to move their votes off the cop and her confirmed innocent because they had two alternatives:Thesp wrote:I also think "difficulty finishing me off" yesterday may be attribued to townies having genuine concerns about not lynching me, timing, or a combination thereof. Also note while you argue there might be "difficulty finishing off Thesp if there were two scum laying off his wagon end of day yesterday", inversely it would have been easier for scum to have finished me offif they weren't already on it. (I doubt scum would have gotten much serious attention yesterday if they'd placed the final vote on me, using the need firsomelynch as an excuse.) Notably, that notches down a bit of suspicion of Ether for not voting me.
1) Move off and onto YOU.
2) Move off and onto someone we had no chance of lynching, which would make them look nearly as bad.
Town wouldn't worry about appearances as much and would move the vote, imo. One of those two could be an accident, TWO in the same 48 hour span is WAY too coincidental, which would imply that you're scum with at least one of the three of them.
We're talking about players here who hammer for a living, and often for kicks. The fact that they didn't, and behaved the way they did, stinks to high hell, which does not reflect well upon you, Thesp.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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This looks REALLY bad, Patrick. I could ask you in a pedantic manner to explain the differences between the various failures-to-hammer, but it's so flagrantly obvious at this point that I won't beat the dead horse.Patrick wrote:Please explain why you've voted me, and FoSed Fritz, yet you've said nothing about Ether and MBL. Yes, MBL could also have hammered. And now he pops up and is critisising others for not doing so.
MBL - Please explain ASAP why you're critisising people who didn't hammer Thesp, even though you didn't hammer him either. Your Ether vote was pretty useless; it's not as if she was ever going to be lynched when it was within her power to hammer Thesp.
As for my own failure to hammer, I'm a conservative player and would generally prefer to no-lynch rather than hammer a good player I'm not certain enough is scum. I tend to believe that scum will be caught by more aggressive means and not by HOPING a lynch is successful. If Thesp is town, he'd be a valuable asset to lose, and that factors in as well.
My Ether vote useless? That's positively laughable and a pretty downright scummy thing for you to say, Patrick. Considering that Ether was the 2nd leading vote-getter at the time, you'd have to be implying that in general, everyone should abandon the #2 to pile on the #1 wagon at the end of a day or else their vote's useless and scummy. I'll also note that Thesp slipped onto the Etherwagon end of day, which could have easily been distancing in case he got hammered as scum, AND Ether avoided hammering Thesp even though she said she probably would.
Useless vote? Hugely disproportionate, reaching attack by you, Patrick. To insinuate that I lose my right to attack by not hammering OR that the various failures to hammer are equivalent in any way is bizarre.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Patrick, you seem to be missing the point entirely and perhaps intentionally because it's so damning.
We find scum by watching your votes and vote movement.
You had a vote on MgM and an FOS on Zindaras. Adele claimed cop with an innocent on MgM with very little time left. WHERE/WHETHER you moved your vote off MgM to near deadline would give us a ton of information on you and the person you moved to. You posted, indicating awareness of the situation, and that you had a decision to make:
Ether had several votes on her, and despite you indicating suspicion of her, you chose NOT to move your vote off MgM and onto Ether. Or onto your most recent FOS, Zindaras. You left it on MgM, which, absent any indication you think he's the godfather, is a sign of nervous paralysis on your part.Patrick wrote:Still not wild about a Thesp lynch, and pondering how disasterous no lynching would be with an even number. It would make a roleblocker less useful I suppose. Ether and Zindaras definitely need looking at more tomorrow. Both lurking more than usual. Zindaras feels like he's always changing his mind and then providing poor reasons for it, or just saying it's gut feeling. I don't particularly feel like he has the thought process, then changes his suspicions, more the other way round; he changes his suspicions then tags something on to justify it. It doesn't feel natural. If it wasn't obvious, I didn't like his attack on me at all, and noticed he's still not provided any examples of what he's accused me of.
I'll be around again before the deadline.
In your 87th post, you waffled about the pros and cons of lynching the claimed cop and curiously didn't take a stand on that issue, leaving the door open. You stated plainly you didn't want to lynch Thesp, and said you'd vote for Zindaras but no one would follow you so you didn't vote him. It looks like a post looking for traction on any of several things:
1) Looking for support in finishing off the claimed cop
2) Pre-emptively looking for an alternative to Thesp, who was the alternative to Adele
3) Looking for people to vote Zindaras so you wouldn't stand out like a sore thumb there (or alternatively, weak distancing from Zindaras)
You should tell us very plainly:
why didn't you move your vote to anyone yesterday before sunset?dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Andrew made the nolynch suggestion. Glork seconded it, I believe, Andrew got wagoned, and that's what MGM was referring to here:Glork wrote:Interesting interpretation of MGM -- claims that MGM assumes Glork/Andrew to be pro-town. Mind explaining this, MBL?
The first assumption of a townie would be that Andrew's scum who made a scummy suggestion. But MGM here implies that Andrew might get a few scum on the wagon, which is not really expected if Andrew is scum himself.MGM wrote:Granted, you might get a few scum on your bandwagon, but not because they're opportunists, it will be because you called the wagon on yourself
Stated another way, I would have expected MGM's comment on the behavior to be more along the lines of:
imaginary MGM wrote:Suggesting that is scummy, and anyone who's not somewhat suspect of your behavior or considering voting you may very well be scum protecting you.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Glork, I've been working on that but I'll give you preliminary thoughts to chew on considering I'm not happy with the directions things are headed.
I'm not pleased with the whole "woohoo Thesp didn't get lynched, he's town" sentiment. I can literally hear the collective scum sigh of relief on that one, and now they're boldly pressing on to other targets and pretending like Thesp is off the table for some reason. It sits REALLY wrong with me and the content of his posts does not explain this phenomenon in my opinion.
Ether doesn't look town at all to me, CES bothers me, Zindaras bothers me, and the CDB wagon looks suspiciously scum-driven so I'm reading the fine print on that one.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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Also, I think the cat's out of the bag on this one so I can spread the love on this bit of advice.
A godfather might shoot for high visibility on D1 depending on their normal playstyle. D2 however they'd almost certainly shoot for high profile in order to possibly pull investigations away from any of their scumpartners who might be in trouble. That behavior would be expected to possibly reverse or at least cease to be a priority when Adele claimed.
There are a few players who appear to fit this profile of ramping it up D2. See if you can spot them...dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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Taking the hypothesis that either Ether and/or Thesp is scum, which I believe is significantly likely to be true, that would mean that their scumpartners would be feverishly working on alternate wagons. Does that mean everyone on alternate wagons is scum? No, duh, cause it takes as many townies as scum to lynch a townie at this point. But if people are softpedaling Ether and Thesp and shuffling feet towards CDB I'm watching them.Glork wrote:Explain this. Thesp and I have pushed CDB the most by far, and Fritz hopped aboard recently. A few other people have expressed passing suspicions of CDB, but nobody else has decided to ride the gravy train. You call Ether, CES, and Zindaras suspicions -- and none of them have expressed much suspicion of CDB (if any at all). Yet you think CDB's wagon is "suspiciously scum-driven"?
Just how many scums do you think are in this game?
The CDB wagon looks to me like people ignoring the elephants in the room to swat a bee. He also does not smell like a rose, but when Thesp and Fritz move on him like that--two people I saw potential alignment in yesterday--I'm wary.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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That's L-1 by the way. And yeah, he'sdefinitelythe right lynch today.
If CDB turns up town and I die tonight, go after the people who pushed his wagon for certain. Do NOT let them off the hook.
If he comes up scum and I'm dead, look into Nightfall, CES, Zindy and eventually MgM later in the game.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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I'm pretty sure I'm right on this one but if I'm not, Fritz or Thesp is taking the fall, not me.
Seriously, everyone who checks this thread should reread CDB's posts carefully and give their thoughts. There's something significant in there but I missed it the first two times through.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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ohoho, now wait a minute. Was that L-1 too close for comfort? Did I call your bluff on your bus attempt?
I'm going to hold you to that promise to lynch CDB regardless of how things play out. I've seen this play before in Light's Out and it didn't end well there. And before you ask as usual if I'm being dense, the answer is no.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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MrBuddyLee Slightly better than 50-50
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If CDB turns up town I really don't expect you, Thesp or Fritz to die overnight. If he turns up scum, Thesp'll be the most confirmed town due to the persistent 3-day push. His railing on CDB doesn't look like busing to me, even though you suggested earlier today that you saw a link between them.
I have notes on Glork and Thesp that are now somewhat irrelevant thanks to CDB and his poor choice of words. I found Glork to be overly protective of Thesp and I found Thesp to have an overly narrow focus, which I don't see as protown.
Time to pipe down and let others chime in. Sorry.dialing in mildly protown reads since 2006-
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