Large Normal 200 - Big Round Numbers - Game Over
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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First read I have after 60 posts is creature kinda scum, Alisae kinda scum and Gin kinda town.
58 is a strong indicator, this isn't the Creature I know, and his push on Gin/Pine in 28 is eh. Not sure whether it's sarcastic or not tbh.
Alisae is acting kinda weird. Hard to word, will get around to a proper read if it becomes relevant.
Uzi kinda town (78)
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what the fuck is this post lmao ahahahahaha
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aaaahahahahahhahahahhahahahahahahhahahhahahhahahah
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Ircher townpoints.
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Notable. Definitely reads like Alisae genuinely standing up for their friend for non-alignment reasons.
sweeet debi plays yugioh <3
i like debi in general
i like too many people in this game tbh
Uzi -really- town as of 118
119
Alright I hope I'm not the only one who saw this. Wraith intends to imply that Debi is scum, because they have a foreknowledge of the setup (how many scum there are), and then pushes that it's multiball. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if it's multiball, surely scum aren't informed how many other teams there are or how many scum are on those teams, so how would Debi have that foreknowledge? I would waive this as Wraith just making a mistake if he didn't pull the multiball assumption out of his ass-- That implies to me that -he- knows it's multiball. 'Foreknowledge of the setup'.
Debi wasn't even being that serious with the 9/10 split, she said the following:
And beyond that never even implied that they believed there was multiball. Really suss, strongest scumread as of this post.Debi wrote:So just for the sake of it, lets say we had 10 towns in this game, and 9 scum, it is unlikely but go with it.
The fact that Debi didn't call on that to defend herself gives her massive townpoints, regardless of Wraith's alignment.
Edit:nvm, she did later, but it still wasn't her go-to. I believe that quote only makes sense coming from scumDebi if they left it precisely to call back on it later as an out, and her only mentioning it later reads as if she forgot she put it in at first, re-read her post and realized she could use it to defend herself. The kinda thing town would do.
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Holy fuck lynch this
Setup regardless, Alisae and Wraith are scummy af so far.
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Holy fuck sheep this
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This too
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HOLY FUCK LYNCH THIS
feeling a dunn kyouko hs townblock rn tbhm2k wrote:VOTE: Alisae
FoS:Wraith
Alisae is like
Really fucking obvscum as of 187
Like fuck, L Y N C H T H I S
It's not just lynchbaity play either, I like to think I have a basic grasp of their personality so far.
POOTIS wrote:Wraith townlean
Alisae Wraith scumteam, slam-dunk lynches lets gooooooAlly Oop wrote:Wraith is currently gut. He's probably also one of my "gun to my head town" reads.
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SUPER SCUMMY
REALLY GOING IN HARD FOR THE DERPCLEAR I SEEEcho wrote:Also, what the hell is single/multiball?
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Debi -really town-
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@RBGin plays kinda lynchbaity. Not paying much attention tot he slot atm, but keep that in mind.
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ok everybody agrees with me i guess
nothing happens for a few pages
I think we'll get along just fine, Pine.Pine wrote:I'm 100% okay with an Alisae lynch, even if it's a pretty quick one. I'm recently kind of coming around to the notion that long days, especially D1s, are completely counterproductive, so a lynch of Aliscum with some policy motive peppered in suits me just fine.
458
This is the funniest thing I've read all day.
And I'm all caught up.
Alisae -really- scummy. Creature -really- scummy. Wraith kinda scummy.
Any questions?
@RB explain Gin wagon to me?nah-
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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rb - idk
Alisae - scummy af
ssbm_Kyouko - townlean, post moar
TheRealGin-N-Tonic - idk
Lil Uzi Vert - town
Gamma Emerald - post moar, likely flake slot tbh
Zachstralkita - literally nothing
Creature - scummy
drealmerz7 - lol
Ircher - towny
Pine - towny kinda
Human Sequencer - lol
-Grey- - idk
Wraith - scummy af
SlickDilinger - great post my dude
Debi - town af
EchoVision - scummy
Dunnstral - idk can't ever read dunn fuck you
All Alone - lol
Feel free to ask my reasoning on any of these, if I miss it, ask again.nah-
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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I did some meta on you to formulate my read of you in Wave, and I'm pretty sure I have a strong handle of your personality by now.
Creature knows I can read him as scum, and he's scared I'll be able to get an accurate read on him and convince town of his scumminess.
Compare how he reacted to my read of him to anybody else who scumread him previously (Grey, Alisae) and realize how desperate he is to discredit my read. Really doubling down on it, boys.nah-
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Except I literally did that in Wave. I had only known of the existence of a player named Creature for one in real life day, and then came with a correct read of his alignment in about two hours.
Required reading: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p8592390 and onward. Just iso HS/Creature.
You're saying I shouldn't post my scumread on you, because it's a trust tell. What motivation would I have for not posting my reads as I have them?
Literally all I've done is post that I scumread you. I've barely even said why (I will admit I had flaky, subjective reasoning, but that's becoming a lot less true the more I interact with you). townCreature would be interested in why I scumread him, and use it as leverage to try and understand my slot better. Creature isn't confrontational. scumCreature is scared. He's doing his best to discredit my read, because he's aware it's legitimate and scared of me pushing it into a lynch, which is why he's going against his confrontational personality to discredit my reads-- out of desperation.
He's dismissed my reads as sucky, called it a trust tell and implied that I'm scum with ulterior motive all one after the other. What's the town motivation for this? Creature doesn't have one, because he didn't do -any- of this to anybody else who scumread him. It's not like I was pushing him any harder than anybody else, either (although I am now), he was an aside in my wallpost and under 'scummy' in my readslist.
VOTE: Creature
PEDIT: I did not do that. I don't believe in that kind of meta read. I think understanding somebody's personality is the first step to understanding what drives them and motivates them as -both- factions. It's not about what you do as town or scum. It's about the kind of person you are and how you would react to this very situation as town or scum.
PEDIT2: Creature, Wraith, Echovision (has anybody else even scumread that slot?)
>implying lynchbait are always townnah-
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So am I scum pushing a mislynch, or town misinterpreting things?
Why did you ask the question you asked in 528? It seems like you're looking for support in your scumread, and you imply in 525 that I may have scummy ulterior motives. That doesn't jive with a Human that's 'misinterpreting things'.
He's dismissed my reads as sucky, called it a trust tell and implied that I'm scum with ulterior motive all one after the other. What's the town motivation for this?nah-
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M O R E D I S C R E D I TIn post 533, Creature wrote:I bet your meta is off one or two town games.nah-
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I don't think I really need to explain why this interaction comes off as scummy for Creature, and us going on and on about it will shit up the thread and won't promote any better reads. So I'll let others weigh in on what they think.
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Not true. Scum can conceivably have -some- foreknowledge, but not -all- foreknowledge. Scum don't know about serial killers, for example.
Worth noting Grey was defending Debi (probtown) and attacking Wraith (probscum) though.
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I like the push on Alisae (and the push on wraith) because I believe they're correct, but being right=/=being town, especially when Grey might not even be right.
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Push on rb though is stupid. Wording slips are almost useless usually, and this one in particular is also quite asinine.
440 444 447
Very townie interaction. No real scum motivation, and comes off as genuine scumhunting.
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Very stupid post tbh.
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I agree, and I think Grey admitting that he's unsure about what that frustration would come from as a good sign. On the other hand, it could be interpreted as Grey just trying to discredit Alisae further, but I don't buy into that so much, partly because I believe Alisae is scum, and partly because I believe Grey believes Alisae is scum.
That's pretty much all I found commentable. Don't understand the RB push at all, unless Grey buys into the idea that this is either a 19p game with 3 scum (lol) or a multiball game.
I think the latter is likely what Grey expects, and this is why I asked him to explain the push on rb, because it changes my read on his push from "????" to "Ah, ok, kinda townie". Grey isn't an idiot, and he probably has fine reasons for scumreading RB.
I get the feeling the motivation behind 528 is some sort of gambit revolving around this.
If that's the case, I've gotta ask where you got the multiball idea from, apart from like 4-5 players (off the top of my head) mentioning it as a possibility. I don't really think it's a given right now, unless Wraith flips scum.
Grey is probably town.
PEDIT @CREATURE:
lolLet's test:
If you know my meta very well, how do I play as town and how do I play as scum?
'Summarize 50+ games up with a statement of how I play as each alignment (something that changes fluidly)'
No thx. It's not about 'x does y as scum/town' as I said earlier. It's about understanding your personality, and how you're likely to react to certain situations, and what motivates you in others.nah-
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@Grey Yeah, I thought as much. I'm just a little wary that you buy into it so easily.
It being multiball heavily incriminates Ircher, Creature, Wraith and kinda incriminates you and RB.
In fact if it's multiball, Creature and Wraith become even slam-dunkier lynches than they were before.
@Ircher <3nah-
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He was the first player to speculate multiball 106.
It doesn't check out, and he wasn't really properly discussing it. Especially falls apart when you consider that he actually ignored most of the discussion about it when it picked up steam.
I just searched the thread for 'Multiball' and put him in the list because he bought it up first. I rescind that, I was wrong.nah-
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I'll do a readout a la 556 on those two tomorrow, it's late and I'm tired and they take mental energy. Throw me a bone =.="In post 626, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:
I liked your catch-up post but I'm not following your reads on Ircher and Echo. Could you go in depth on them a bit more?In post 513, Human Sequencer wrote:-readslist snip-
Feel free to ask my reasoning on any of these, if I miss it, ask again.nah-
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Lynchbait wrote:Hey! I'm scum!Pine! Let's push lynch bait and add nothing as I hide on this wagon and keep on saying "Alisae is scum" without saying why? Great fucking plan!Lynchbait wrote:Town points for both of ywall for seeing past lynch bait instead of hopping on.scumAlisae wrote:I am town lynchbait please don't lynch me!nah-
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Associations are for post-flip. Stop trying to derail my reads, because you know they're correct. Especially when multiball is still a possibility, which a scumflip (hint: You) would confirm.
Creature scummy, unsure on votecount, can't be fucked figuring out votecount, etc.
Thanks for reminding me, though, because I'm pretty sure this isn't a hammer regardless.
VOTE: Alisaenah-
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I say this not because I'm trying to be snarky, I say this because you're right and it's a bad habit I have and need to break out of.In post 654, Human Sequencer wrote:@Zach
Alright, I've added Alisae along with Ircher and Echo on my wallpost to-do list for tomorrow.
The correct answer is always readout wallposts!nah-
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748
more good posts
still null/idk on pine
not voting dreamer from literally one post without giving it a really close look, and i've got other slots with one million posts i could sift through instead
speaking of which, wall time, ircher firstnah-
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79
This isn't a scumread I think is particularly likely to come from scum. It reads more like townIrcher coming up with a bit of a stretchy scumread than scumIrcher doing the same.
106
Same. Reads far more like townIrcher going down the wrong track, as opposed to scumIrcher trying to start a wagon or something. Based on an understanding of Ircher's personality (I hesitate to use the word 'Meta' again, lmao), I read his tunnel on Debi genuine.
141[/post]146[/post]
Ircher picks up on the same thing I did 18 pages later. His logic is valid, and this incriminating Wraith is something I can (and did) absolutely get behind. If Wraith flips scum, Ircher is likely town, and Wraith is one of my higher scumreads atm.
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Ircher wants to hear Dunn's opinion on Debi's slot. Town motivation is understanding Dunn's read on Debi for two reasons
1. Try and sort Dunn
2. Try and sort Debi
Ircher takes the points of other players' on board while formulating his reads, and the only scum motivation is 'Trying to look like town' and 'Understanding Dunn's perspective to manipulate him better'. I don't see the latter coming from scumIrcher at all, and I don't think this is the way scumIrcher would go about the former.
Worth noting Dunn never elaborated (not that that necessarily incriminates Dunn) and that Ircher never pushed him for it.
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I really doubt scumIrcher would bother to mention this, unless Creature/Ircher is a scumteam and Ircher was interested in using this particular post for towncredit later, and I really highly doubt that's the kind of thing Ircher would do.
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Reads genuine. He believes in his conviction, and does some minimal backpedaling, admitting that perhaps he was a little forefront with it, but still believes in it logically, which is a good sign. The logic is sound, and I doubt scumIrcher would do his half-backpedal without going the whole way and admitting that he was wrong to begin with.
567
Ircher again proving that he's interested in how other people read his scumreads. Supports his questioning earlier w/ Dunn.
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Same.
At this point, I'm pretty convinced Ircher is town. Does anybody else wanna point me to any posts they find particularly incriminating they made? Uzi in particular. I hope my logic was written well enough for you to understand.nah-
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See I originally thought his comment on single/multiball was him going for a derpclear because it read dishonest as fuck, but the more he posts the more I see it's in-line with how he posts. I misunderstood the way he posts, and interpreted that aside comment as a blatant lie. Him defending Debi's misunderstanding as 'human error' is towny, even if untrue.
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Reads genuine. The fact that he says nothing has pinged him in 7 pages reads as a good sign, to me. I'm not really sure though.
Not much of a wallpost I guess, but that's all I found commentable. Currently sitting on null.nah-
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twenty bajillion posts later rb is innocent child
checks out with his actions, and i buy into his motivations (even though it's irrelevant because he's innocent child lmao)
bdsm_tokyo is the best thing i've heard all week
might be able to get on board with a gin wagon, need to look at the slot closer
i think ircher's pants-on-head stupid push on rb is far more consistent with 'memeing and angry townIrcher' than 'scumIrcher trying to push a mislynch', and i don't buy that he was intentionally going for that look as scum in this particular instance
How come you came in agreeing 2/2 for me but then say "eh I can't read dunn anyway"us agreeing does not make you town, you making posts that are consistent with you being town make you townnah-
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don't remember where it was said, but Creature said it'd be a good idea to cycle through lurker slots early, and despite it being creature (scumread waning, need a readout wallpost tbh) i heartily agree, considering how many mislynches we have (i'm not used to this luxury in a normal game) and how killer lurker slots are closer to the end of the game.
though i do agree its a better idea to lynch scum.
VOTE: All Alone
wagon i can best get behind atm, blatantly bad iso that doesn't even need a readout to parse.nah-
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hey it looks like i ended up alright after allIt's not really meta, it's more like an intuitive understanding of their personality. It's not about things they specifically do as town or scum it's about how their overall persona comes across and the context of things they say.
i came to this conclusion independently daddy, are you proud of me?nah-
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Yknow I really gotta disagree with you there, Wraith. We have oodles of information to comb over already, and every fucking scumread I have disappears into 'eh kinda null'. Alisae is doing this now as I iso her, despite her still being a valid lynch in my eyes. Large games are fucking hard and I need to learn how to adapt to them.
How many scum is there reasonable to be in this game? 19p, probably like 5 scum, assuming singleball? I know from the spec earlier that 9 is asinine, but I know nothing about gamebalance. I just wanna know if I should be worried about not having many scumreads at this point. The only other 'large' game I've played in only had 17 players, one who was a non-issue, and even that was enough to confuse my reads. There was only 3 scum in that game, but the setup was different there so eh.
The less scum there are the more confident I am in cycling through lurker slots. Unreadable slots with no posts are much better to get rid of early or force-replace out before the thread becomes too big rather than have sitting around as a liability later in the game.
RB tells me Dreamer is scum, and he's lurky as fuck, so I'm fine sheeping that.
Mod confirmed town RB seems like an automatic town win tbh.
VOTE: Dreamer
Alisae is kinda weird. I get a lot of 'well this is obvtown' from her, and a lot of 'well this is obvscum' from her, and everything inbetween.
I really don't think there's anything wrong with a utility lynch at this point in the game. Crucify me.nah-
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lmoaIn post 1136, -Grey- wrote:Damn, Gamma.
i'm glad 'bleeding town' has caught on :XIn post 1145, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:Pine get in this thread, you're the only EMT I know and Gamma needs a serious blood transfusion for how much town he's bleeding.
ya i see itIn post 1154, Dunnstral wrote:Now take a look at my 1055 @hs
what do you wanna talk about
its obv you're going somewhere with this (that or just reaction test memeing) but i don't know where that is so i'm gonna have to ask you to spell your questioning out morenah-
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1199
nah bruv just can't read you
had no idea where you were in the micro, just sheeped vedith and scum was obvs so it didn't matter
had no idea where you were in large dance and you ended up brutally assfucking me because of it (fwiw i had pretty much the exact same read on you in both games, townlean)
every step of the way in every game with you has been '?' pretty much
this looks like gin trying to pull off his devil-may-care attitude he exemplifies as town, but he just can't do it. it reads dishonest as fuck.In post 1216, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:RB has yet to present a case so even if he's IC I can give fuck all what he thinks. Being IC doesn't make you god and it doesn't mean I have to kiss his ass.
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really like this post boys
it checks out and i don't get a sense of dishonesty from it at all. really doubt this is scum.
zach vs. gin is interesting. zach is town, rb is town, and they're both pretty on-ball. gin himself is getting looked at right now.nah-
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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no, i mean your tone reads dishonest in that post, not what you expressed/the content in that post. it looks like you were trying to feign the general attitude you take as town, and that has absolutely died down with your last three posts. in fact, your inconsistent tone is a great reason for me to scumread you atm.In post 1234, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:Human, it's impossible for it to express dishonesty. It would be dishonest to say I didn't care about RB's thoughts on me but also ask him over and over about his case, after he was confirmed mind you. I was only on his ass asking about his case because I didn't know his alignment and thought he was scum pushing a quicklynch with no basis.
Also there isn't actually any point in arguing with an IC, he's confirmed so why would he start arguments with one player. In general it's best he lets the rest of the players argue as that lets the argument help indicate the alignment of two in question, otherwise it's a one-sided battle and you can't get much information of it.
I do have to ask why it's scummy to ignore a player, who you know is town, and scum reads you but hasn't said anything damning about you? If anything I'd say it would have been scummy to try and appease RB and try to make him like me after being on his ass instead of vice versa.
did you really miss my true intentions with that post? i doubt it. more likely i think is scumGin finding something shoddier to defend himself against, so he can write more about it and look townier in his response when his inconsistent tone sells him as scum anyway.
at the time of that readslist, zach had made 11 (eleven) posts. his iso was empty as fuck, and i had nothing to go off of. since then he's done enough to convince me that he's probably town. i never said he was confirmed, but that makes a nice little nibble for you to latch on to to discredit my argument that i see you've gone and done.nah-
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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1192
another example of his fake, inconsistent tone
this just doesn't read as realistic coming from Gin's mouth. it's really telling that he switched to a more logical and concise tone as soon as i voiced reason to scumread him, i feel like scumGin started shitting himself when I got on his trail because he knows about my mafia ability (or rather luck in our recent game[ongoing]) and realizing whatever he's doing atm isn't working.Grow the fuck up and stop thinking people are mind readers and give context so people can actually follow what you're thinking.
1155
i also don't understand how anybody could scumread this, but on the other hand perhaps my personal perspective is swaying this one
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eeegh on the other hand his read on me bleeds town pretty hard
don't like his read on pine at all though tbh, did you ever end up settling on a read for ircher?nah-
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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i was very interested in your response here, and that's because what you said about ongoing games is a very convenient way to just dodge out of having to defend yourself.
when i rightfully said you don't have to mention ongoing games at all, i was interested to see if you'd take that as an invitation to elaborate on your thought processes or to see if you'd bury deeper into your shell.
you did the latter, but the way you did it actually gives me a little bit of pause.
regardless, please do elaborate. the ongoing game is mostly irrelevant, it was a one note footnote, and choosing to blanket it over my entire argument has a very enticing scum motivation for scumGin.nah-
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scum
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Human Sequencer allMafia Scumall
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