Just Play the Hits uPick - Video Killed the Radio Star

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Confirm and will check role tonight

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Ok I'm caught up and ready to start playing.

lets get a vote on people who don't have any. Spread the wealth and all that.

VOTE: Assemblerotws

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Varsoon. We can trust each other if you like. Just saying.

Also I'm more so reading your vote as annoyed because Venmar is not explaining his reasoning. I saw the vote happen after CD called him out for "serious vote."

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That being said, I'll vote Venmar to see what all the seriousness is about.

VOTE: Venmar

I'm not claiming my full negative ability under any circumstances but I will say that I don't think mine is that awful for town if it is looked into after it happens.

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Ninja'd

I assume it was RVS still but like... how are we supposed to know for sure? Why did you switch to CD?

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Honestly, I don't see a case. What I do see is someone who I am slightly reading as town is pushing on someone who reads null grasping at what little information we have to push for more. You're defense, however, interests me.

Are you not at all worried about what could considered the first case of the game being presented against you? Using the "serious" RVS technique is well and good but... everyone does stuff like that. He isn't even voting you because of your serious vote, more so who you are voting.

Do you plan on addressing that? What made you RVS who you did?

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UNVOTE:

Hmm... I want to talk about something but I don't know who to talk with lol. I guess I need to go back and see who is in this game.

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Varsoon, on a scale of 1-10 with 1 being town and 10 being scum, what is Venmar at?

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tbh the main reason i'm not townreading venmar yet is i can see a pretty decent scum strategy of "do a thing that 1 or 2 people will obviously find scummy, and then whack them over the head with their stupidity and gain mad towncred for it"

You can? I'm not sure I see that as being viable.

Also I'll totally talk to you! What do you think about this push? Doesn't it feel a bit... aggressive with no real intention of pushing it. Granted, Varsoon's last post makes it more obvious that he doesn't intend to push it very hard.

I appreciate what you (Varsoon) are trying to do but I think it became very apparent you don't actually care if people vote Venmar with you and that's a problem. So much so that I questioned the townread I had on you.

Venmar, I hope to God you are getting good "reactions" because you need to start coming up with your own cases. Aren't you still voting CD?

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i do think varsoon's setup spec as-so-far and general attitude is townlike tho

I just saw this. Why do you think thats town? I actually read it as a little scummy. Well parts of it. It felt disingenuous.

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@Venmar: Ay, man, if that's the road you wanna take on this, alright.

^This was the point where I unvoted because now I see a person who I felt was going to aggressively push a scum read turn into someone who really doesn't care what ends up happening. His next post, he confirms that he has a stronger scum read but still thinks that Venmar is more likely scum then town. As town, I expect him to at least try and convince other people to vote with him.

I think Varsoon is smart enough to know backing off will hurt him now that he has admitted he actually has a scum read on Venmar. I'm just conflicted as to why he has that read at all based off his push.

Not a fan of Venmar's engagement with, or lack thereof, my vote/rationale on him.
Also not crazy about the whole "My serious vote was reaction-bait for someone to nitpick" angle he's playing.
Gonna stay parked right where it is.
Get got.

^This was the point of me thinking Varsoon was committing to this and I was willing to ride that wave and push reactions out of Venmar. I think him pushing aggressively is exactly where this push should have gone from a town perspective.

Moving on, Espeonage is null for me. The PR thing sounds more town then mafia but could easily be faked. Frankly, I would like more interaction at this point and less "I'm gonna do this kbye."

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@Deathnote: Oh, no, I very much want a lynch on Venmar. I just think I get way better info/interactions pushing him than my other scum candidates.

I would agree except... well read my other post.

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Ok looks like I went 2 posts over yesterday unless my confirm post doesn't count for that. I knew there was a posting rule but couldn't remember the exact numbers. I'll do better especially since I can't really post much during afternoon anyways.

i really don't like these two sentences. my lack of a vote change from a fucking rvs should be indicative enough that i haven't pinged scum on anyone's recent posting, and you turbo-rushing me for content seems forced when im doing what you asked me to do in the first place; address varsoon.

i want to see how others react to varsoon and i for sure and you haven't given anybody or anything enough time for that to happen yet so chill

I don't feel at all bad about turbo rushing you or anyone in this game for that matter. You should know that pressure is the easiest way to cause someone to slip up. It's why I ask lots of questions that often have already been asked.

Addressing the Venmar/Varsoon situation:

I have a hard time following it at this point. For a while, it was making sense but once they delved deeper into this 1st/2nd/3rd stuff (Which I haven't heard of before), I started to fall behind. Post 91 just looks like Fluff from Varsoon.

But you are a little right. I'm pushing you because you do react, and because I think your reactions are telling. Here's the thing (DeathNote, pay attention), I can go on all day about what I find scummy about a player and their play, but it takes two to tango. I don't have a ton of confidence in my ability to get other town players to really believe in a lynch (short of dumb gimmick gambits), but I do put a lot of stock in my capacity to get my scumreads to make posts that make what I'm seeing clear to the other players.

^This I do agree with. Pushing for reactions is the best way to play but both sides can do that. In a way, I think we play similarly... you just use bigger words then me

Reading through Mollies post... I can't meta anyone here honestly and probably won't ever make a meta argument but I am interested to see 2 people already counter Varsoon's meta play.

@Mollie - What posts from Venmar are defensive to you?

In post 66, Mathdino wrote:
lol i was sleep deprived when i read that

i understand now

okkkk so i think my negative ability is debilitating to the point of my entire role working significantly better as a scum role

like ability could actually ruin lategame

so bye bye abilities tbh
This feels kinda like a scumpost, like "I'll describe my role as kinda scummy to sliiiiide it in there as a thing that could be town"

I actually didn't like that post too much either but not for the reason you are describing. I thought of it more as "I can essentially claim VT and not worry about fake claiming." But maybe that is the point you are trying to make. It is a good set-up post from scum perspective but also entirely likely that town actually has debilitating negative roles. I'm not going to focus anymore on this but like that it was at least brought up.

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I'm back and catching up. I do like that the required posting style slows things down so I can read easier. I get very flustered going through 20 pages of fluff but I can see how people work better that way too. Easier to catch scum tells through interactions when they are allowed to interact more.

Speaking of which, I think there are a couple people who haven't posted yet. Is that correct?

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@DeathNote: My understanding is that the roles were created and then the alignments were randomised. Like, my neg ability is so potentially ruinous for town (at least IMO) that I think the benefit scum get out of just using it and claiming their neg ability is something else, far FAR outweighs the potential towncred I could get for getting up on stage and saying HEY GUYS I'M NOT USING MY NEGATIVE ABILITY LOOK AT HOW TOWN I AM. Which I accept is pretty much what I did there.

I'm not going to delve too deep into the theory crafting but don't you think its possible that Mafia have there own abilities and don't follow the format that we do?


After seeing how quick the Godel wagon is forming, I am reasonably sure there was a scumboi within those last 3 votes. Honestly, I am a bit shocked at the lack of reasoning... I get wanting to sheep but there is some pretty pathetic votes being tossed around. Elton stated his vote was Icky and I'm suppose to think that's good enough?

If you want to vote Godel for a shit vote, can you explain the shit part of the vote at least? I haven't seen that reasoning yet.

Update: Varsoon may not be confirmed town yet but he sure as hell is a man after my own heart. This is in conjunction to "Who the fuck cares about meta?"

You know what... I'm gonna post everything I see about this case against Godel and the wagon that follows so that maybe I can get people to see what I see.

Godel Case and Recent Votes

Spoiler: Initial Vote

Hey mathdino, I havent asked this yet but are you a mathblade alt?

VOTE: Vaxkiller

Did you not read the first post?

VOTE: Godel

dude's always scum, let's get a real wagon going

i also got my first choice even though i also lowkey wanted my 2nd

i assume napoleon is kesha

Godel votes Vax because if Vax had read all of the first page, he would have known that Mathblade helped design the game and thus couldn't be in the game. Is the vote serious? Fuck if I know but apparently it's scummy.

Spoiler: Hebi's Vote

Hey mathdino, I havent asked this yet but are you a mathblade alt?

VOTE: Vaxkiller

Did you not read the first post?

Hotter Take, post restrictions are garbage.

Anyhow, I missed the game opening, but after reading through and reading, I think your stated reasoning is kinda wacky, but the fact he vanished after the vax vote is sus.

So sure

VOTE: godel

First vote to follow is from Hebi which is... an ok vote actually but when followed up by this:

Spoiler: Hebi Response

FLAMING TAKE: any posts with a full paragraph are garbage

Godel is always not-that-active due to time zones and RL and shit. pls no discrediting my wagon with bad logic thx

You don't think that post is genuinely scummy?

I misread the post tbh.

Looking at it again, it does look like hes just trying to find an excuse to vote.

I'm going to read closer here before I post again.

Then I start to wonder if hebi is just voting to vote. "Oh I misread, yeah I agree with you!" This reads as scum budding town. How is voting during the RVS stage relate to just finding an excuse to vote? Thats more of what you just did, not what he did 1st post of the game.

Spoiler: Elton's Vote

I'm fine with vote: Godel for right now, his vote was icky

I've already explained this but to reiterate, I don't think Elton voted because he thinks Godel could be scum but I also just think it was a lazy town vote. Maybe I'm wrong.

Spoiler: Vax's Vote

Godel? I can dig.

[post=Gödel]Gödel[/post]

Still bothered that all of you are hailing someone I really don't know.

Final vote... geeze. The bandwagon is real with this one.

I guess what I'm trying to say is... that 2 of these imo are lazy town and 1 of these is opportunistic scum.

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Are you town reading Godel?

Irrelevant to my points but no. I would say null right now.

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Phone posting so i don't wanna get into this till tonight. Will say I'm in venmars side here as everything he has said this page is from town and makes for a much better case then godel shitty vote.

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Sorry I just can't respond right now. It's late and I had a pretty rough week. I will have so much more time starting Monday.

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Are you town reading Godel?

Irrelevant to my points but no. I would say null right now.

It is tho. Who breaks down and inspects the beginning's of a wagon on a null? I would get it if you were town reading them, but a null?

VOTE: DeathNote

No it isn't. I was analyzing the quick succession of 3 people voting and I was doing that because there was no case on Godel. His first post RVS vote wasn't enough to convince me that all of you voted reasonably. It was just another bandwagon that I felt had a strong chance of having scum on it and I'd rather look into that then figure out if Godel is scum or town from one post.

Godel was Null and I was challenging anyone (You included) for why they were voting him.

I like how you were working things out before cos it seemed you really were trying to solve but it looks like you are sucking up to venny and varsoona in a big big way considering they are the most vocal players rn. :/

Oh Mollie... this is a very very bad post. Sucking up to Venny and Varsoon? Question to the room.

@Everyone here - Did my post #148 look like it was me sucking up to the Double Vs? Let alone in a "big big way"?

Are you just trying to scare me off of following them because they created a case against you even tho no one is voting you yet for said case? Your reaction is far more defensive then anyone else's in the game thus far and not just to me but also to Venmar.



Anyways...

I'm interested in Vax swapping from Godel to me after my post. I would say it's too clever for scum to immediately pop off a shit wagon like that and onto the person calling them out, especially since I honestly believe Vax thinks I was scummy.

That narrows my vote to between Elton and Hebi.

VOTE: Hebichan

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It's Monday. That means I can start playing more from this point on. I'm reading up and see that Esp has posted and now there is a slight push against him. No comments on anything specific yet but will try to get up to date today.

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I have no qualms voting Dino at this point but I'm going to stay on Hebi for now. After going back through the game a bit, I'm pretty torn on how oblivious Hebi tends to be vs Dino actively focusing on smaller cases in comparison to bigger ones. I see it as potential scum faking a case on anything he can find.

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Feels like some real awkward positioning there, Deathnote. Why stick with Hebi over Dino?

Cause I'm voting who i think is scum vs who you think is scum. I just happen to agree that "yeah, dino might be scum and actually has votes so I'm willing to vote there when the time comes."

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I could go for a juicy DN vote. The other 2 are null yes.

Aaayyyyyyy

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i could jive with the idea that if godel is town, one of gamma/hebi is scum

problem is i can't really tell which one

wow reads like this are completely useless!
this is why I prefer to not have reads

Not useless. How am i supposed to know what you are thinking about the game unless you post it? Your vote history will only tell me so much.

I now know you think i am vote worthy which is more info i had the before. I also know that dino has conflicted views about hebi gamma being scum which i find more interesting if he flips scum.

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And... what is your gamma argument? All I see is that he has been "bothering" you.

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KK you doubled up on Napoleon.

The town read I'm most confused about is your read on SleepyKrew. How do you have a read on someone who is indifferent?

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Are those... not the same thing? Like there is nothing we can do to make mafia more entertaining then it is. I'm just saying that SK is a hard neutral for me right now just because he doesn't really give content and until flips happen I won't know much about him.

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Did the definition of OMGUS change? He isn't voting me nor do I feel threatened by him voting me. I'm not even suspicious of him, I am just saying that he is a hard null read because he gives bored one liners and clever little quips.

SK is just a more active napoleon or Assemble.

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I don't really care to debate anymore between which of us has a stronger connection to SK. I'm just pointing out that you gave a town read to someone I feel hasn't given much content and I wanted to know why.

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VOTE: MathDino

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Like I really really don't wanna be default lynched; the last time I was D1 mislynched was in Thesp's game with a similarly oldie playerlist (so thanks guys, I even see some of the exact same names).

What are some of those names? I can't just look up Thesp's game easily so either link me game or do tell please.

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re: KK's read on SK - i'm actually in agreement with kk that sleepykrew, though in my eyes not inherently town because of it, has clearly put more effort into the game than other contemporary players he's compared to. i actually think it's a really odd read to nitpick in this case.

I stated he was a more active version then Assemble and... someone? I can't remember. Point being, the comparison was what you just stated in that he put more effort into the game then those counterparts. I'm not sure why people keep repeating that statement.

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We are gonna lose sooooo much activity if Dino gets lynched lol.

I'll read this later when I get off work. Thanks for the reads.

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I still have time right? Birthday thing tonight but nothing happening tomorrow.

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Not my bday lol. Fate is in your hands esp but I'd rather you wait till i can catch up tomorrow.

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I'm sorry everyone my internet has been out. I see we're at DUELING WAGONS with 11 hours left. Anyone want to give me a cliff notes version of why I should vote with you

Mathdino's wagon is stupid because he's been one of the more activeand engaged players and yet people are completely ignoring his impact on the game state cos lolscumrole

This is poor reasoning. Nap would hold less an impact then Dino regardless of alignment.

Hammer happened and I apologize that I never got to really give the game thoughts. I'm not sold that Dino isn't possibly scum but I'm actually ok with the Nap pick too. The claim was fine until Gamma claimed to have a similar neg ability.

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Bummer. I had Hebi I guess...