Lynch the Wolves (Game Over)

[Vecna]

that's 2 people wanting to lynch mathblade while saying it's flipping town

the fuck is wrong with you

Im saying im at 55-45 roughly, and it answers a lot of questions to flip the slot.

Also, Hi im Vecna, im mechanically towncleared by two different people

[Vecna]

Also, no matter who the scum is, it is nearly guaranteed at this point that there is at least one of them that is putting on, or has put on, quite a great show.

[Vecna]

I tried to read what lead to the d1 lynch and then talked to people who were expressing a titus scumread cause I felt RC was pretty much town!RC all the way

the vampire was around talking about his claim so I ISO'd him to catch what his claim was and talked about that

what's weird about any of it?

How do you distinguish between a town RC and a scum RC?

Please do tell, im intrigued

you think he is indistinguishable? RC is a wolfy wolf who plays all his cards way too aggressively and pushes for scum wincon like hell. I don't have a soulread on him or anything but the posts I read didn't look like agenda-driven TMI spewing wolf. he made a very dense, very bad w/w conditional read on d1 that I have a hard time he'd think is a good idea to say it as a wolf, and I find his interactions with cheeky where he is almost begging to be townread more aligned with his town self and not the slimy manipulative stuff he does as a wolf.

I can be wrong but it's where I'm at.

Interesting. I like your observations, however I think theres a bit more to it.

The thing that weirds me out is, if there indeed is no incentive for scum to push to eliminate town in the hood, then what scum motivation is left for a scum RC to go all-in so hard on Mathblade? Especially since if the slot is town, apparently its a tracker that wanted to be flipped just to pretend he tracked Math while he couldve never gotten the result he claimed to have gotten. But then again, maybe thats just what he wanted us to think, although I doubt his planning really goes that deep. He normally doesnt really strike me as the planning scum player, but one that banks on persuasion and intimidation.

ok I'm confused. so titus is a tracker. titus claims to have tracked mathblade while in a neighborhood with mathblade, and wants to flip herself so that... what? I don't follow. why is titus' claim impossible?

Try and read RC's day 2 stuff. Id actually be interested in your views on that stuff. Titus replaced RC after the mod dumped hiss ass out for toxicity

[Vecna]

I guess

Does this mean youre on board for a mass-claim type of thing and you wanna help me try and solve this puzzle?

[Vecna]

I want you to care

[Vecna]

If you say its a bad idea, ill take your word for it and leave it alone. You've shown great judgement her today, and I need your help to solve this shit. Were pretty much on the same line of thinking here, I feel.

[Vecna]

Like, if RC was indeed scum and he turned another game into a toxic wasteland to satiate his win%, his team deserves to get destroyed here.

If he was right, and town, and Mathblade is scum, then I feel kinda bad for getting in his way and pissing him off so much that he did turn the game into a messy swamp, and I still wanna fix it.

If both the slots are town, then scum is just sitting back for the most part and having too easy a time watching the town tear itself apart. Still means theres likely some great performing scum in the Brians, nosferatu's and muffins in this game, but like, lets put their necks in a rope?

[Vecna]

So Hebi can clear you tonight? Excellent

[Vecna]

Be Mastina

Design a setup where town gets a vig
Counter it by giving scum a neighbourhood where they constantly have to convince the 3rd person to shoot town to also get extra killing actions. Make it so they cannot kill the third person, but they can try to bring in more gullible people

Or

Just design a neighbourhood filled with town. Add all these little subtle hints that there might very well be scum in there. Grab popcorn and watch as paranoia sweeps through the game.

Being a mod must be fun at times

[Vecna]

The thing is, if there is no scum PT, while there is a PT checker, that kinda borders on bastard if we do not get informed that scum doesnt have a PT, because that is rather far outside of the norm. Unless Hebi is scum ofcourse and the role is fake. Having a town PT checker with a scum team without a PT, without any way for town to know that shit......

Nah, not buying it.

[Vecna]

Also, the rabid argument is weak as fuck, because any werewolf knows its a werewolf, and is in human form most of the time. Where it can communicate.

[Vecna]

I tried to read what lead to the d1 lynch and then talked to people who were expressing a titus scumread cause I felt RC was pretty much town!RC all the way

the vampire was around talking about his claim so I ISO'd him to catch what his claim was and talked about that

what's weird about any of it?

How do you distinguish between a town RC and a scum RC?

Please do tell, im intrigued

you think he is indistinguishable? RC is a wolfy wolf who plays all his cards way too aggressively and pushes for scum wincon like hell. I don't have a soulread on him or anything but the posts I read didn't look like agenda-driven TMI spewing wolf. he made a very dense, very bad w/w conditional read on d1 that I have a hard time he'd think is a good idea to say it as a wolf, and I find his interactions with cheeky where he is almost begging to be townread more aligned with his town self and not the slimy manipulative stuff he does as a wolf.

I can be wrong but it's where I'm at.

Interesting. I like your observations, however I think theres a bit more to it.

The thing that weirds me out is, if there indeed is no incentive for scum to push to eliminate town in the hood, then what scum motivation is left for a scum RC to go all-in so hard on Mathblade? Especially since if the slot is town, apparently its a tracker that wanted to be flipped just to pretend he tracked Math while he couldve never gotten the result he claimed to have gotten. But then again, maybe thats just what he wanted us to think, although I doubt his planning really goes that deep. He normally doesnt really strike me as the planning scum player, but one that banks on persuasion and intimidation.

Time for a little experiment

HeWhoSwims - VT
zMuffinMan - SEER
Titus - TRACKER
Mathblade - LYNCHMOB
hebichan - PT COP
Gamma Emerald - LYNCHMOB
Brian Skies - LYNCHMOB
Vecna - VT
Oath - VAMPIRE

Ankamius
Nosferatu
ArcAngel9
Creature

So if Oath is telling the truth, we either have lying people in the neighbourhood with a double role/identity, or the VIG and rolestopper crapnanigans have to be in the 4 leftover people.

-MAYBE- it would help to force Titus to out who the vig is. That way we at least confirm that he really is a tracker, whether its a scum tracker or not, becomes less relevant, itll still be usefull information to solve the RC-gambit puzzle.

Those 4 slots are also quite likely to at least have 1 scum in them. If we can get more information there, it narrows the lynchpool down. If there is scum in there, scum also is much more likely to narrow down on the vig and a potential rolestopper - (they would know if there is one, since they are quite likely to have tried to kill Hebi).

Youre still really against a full-claim Ank? I think it might help us out quite a bit, especially if theres another potential VT that Hebi can clear in the pool of questionable people.

This is the stupidest thing I have heard.

What is so stupid about it?

[Vecna]

Also, what do you think of Ank claiming VT after that soft?

[Vecna]

Also, if Hebi is scum then HWS is definately scum with her. The only way it makes sense to claim that shit there as scum is to save HWS from certain death that was gonna come undoubtedly on D2 without that claim.

[Vecna]

The thing is, if there is no scum PT, while there is a PT checker, that kinda borders on bastard if we do not get informed that scum doesnt have a PT, because that is rather far outside of the norm. Unless Hebi is scum ofcourse and the role is fake. Having a town PT checker with a scum team without a PT, without any way for town to know that shit......

Nah, not buying it.

Again not bastard as I have cited a game that was approved where it didn’t exist and wasn’t bastard.
And town didn’t have a way to figure out that shit in game. They figured it out through deduction.

Did that game also have a PT cop?

[Vecna]

Hey, we ever hear of kiss?
Zmuffin cannot be a seer at all. His play is not consistent with that ever.
Also, where did Lady go?

Youre gonna have to explain that one Titus. Also what is kiss, except the act of rubbing lips and -that band-

[Vecna]

Still want titus to explain why the play is not consistent with being a seer

[Vecna]

Can you produce me a colourcoded christmass tree with your view of the gamestate GE?

[Vecna]

Still want titus to explain why the play is not consistent with being a seer

1) Zmuffin never suspected hebi
2) Zmuffin had no useful results
3) zmuffin only claimed under pressure

Yeah ok, I can get this reasoning.

The flip side though is that he did scan me N1, while it was still relevant, and he heavily softed that he had strong reasons to think I was town. The way it was softed, and the reasoning knowing Cheeky's recent familiarity with me, totally makes me buy that reasoning. Also, the lurking play does fit with how I would expect Cheeky to play a role like that.

Also I would expect Pro-Town-Titus (I like the sound of that) to totally account for the possibility that Zmuffin might not actually be a 2-shot seer, but an infinite-shot-seer that was forced to claim, which also would account for the outburst of anger afterwards.

I for one am still not convinced that the slot is scum. Not at all.

I might be wrong. But...yeah

[Vecna]

(hence my feeling this is more just scum-Titus looking for plausible reasoning to want the slot dead, instead of actually trying to read it)

[Vecna]

You mean that zmuffin claimed he had a possible result on you after hebi said you had no OT.

No before, on day2 - he was heavily hinting at it

[Vecna]

Third what?

[Vecna]

What did your result on Mathblade say specifically?

[Vecna]

Yes but no result as in he didnt visit anyone, or no result as in failed action

[Vecna]

So wolves might all be ascetic, have some sort of alpha wolf immunity aura......or youre just trying to lift along on the nonsense surrounding Oath's slot.

[Vecna]

VOTE: Mathblade

So is this

[Vecna]

The time left to actually lynch something is getting smaller n smaller

[Vecna]

also sure vecna, I'll read RC's d2 for you in a bit

Outcomes?

[Vecna]

Like the reason I don't put much stock in Vecna being double cleared despite believing both claims are probably true is because of how the setup is set up

It's probable that there is a traitor via Hebi

It's possible that there is a mafia-aligned via Muffin and can be implied via Oath

Why can't we have those two put together, it's a mindfuck I can see mastina pulling

Can I get a reads list from you? Just how confident are you Vecna is scum? I can see Vecna captializing on Math being how he is.

Actually, he's alive because of me. Maybe you should actually read up on some of the key moments in this game

[Vecna]

Soooo, can we like universally stop dicking aorund and make up our minds whether we lynch Titus or Mathblade?

We aint got that much time left

[Vecna]

someone that read RC recently, did he already scumread math d1? If titus and oath are both what they claim they are its possible that they were roleblocked...i guess

still somewhat weird to have a 3p rb, a town jailkeeper anf a scum rb, but its possible both got blocked because of predictions of where their abilities would go.

at any rate, Im starting to see more and more town-titus things, so im not sure if I still wanna lynch there.

its time for my pool to shift a bit.

gamma emerald is still a proper candidate for scum.
im completely uncertain about math, creature and brian. if it wasn't for the lynched flavour id swear the entire scumteam being in that hood would be a possibilty

[Vecna]

screw you scumteam, you moderately convincing bastards

[Vecna]

also titus, care to elaborate why youre still keeping up with me as a sxum potential? like how do you even see that as a mechanical possibility?

[Vecna]

im not sure where yiure getting from that ive been avouding muffin vs hebi.

i just dont want to lynch there, and rightfully so. also if either of them is scum i feel hebi is actually more likely

[Vecna]

both hebi and her first claim then because the only reason to fakeclim there in the spot she did was to protect her temmate from death for perfect win.....which i doubt happened.

as for your interpretation of my play, sorry but its nonsense. i havent had to react to anythibg since ive been cleared for a long time. it just feels like youre reaching for stuff that sounds nice or youre not actually reading what im doing. unless you wanna call actively push for a massclaim reactive or we i guess

[Vecna]

Also, ive been cleared of being in a pt and ive had an allignment check done on me. That would only not clear me if im like.....a traitor of which Muffin somehow knows im a traitor? Which scum never does. Or if im scum with both Hebi and Muffin, which is also rediculous.

So if you wanna talk about an absence of intelligence, please start making some sense in your stuff

[Vecna]

Guys, if we dont appoint some obv-town guy for sheeping we are guaranteed to only land on town today.

Would be nice if people started participating again so we can lynch a scumfuck. Deadline is soon

[Vecna]

Guys, if we dont appoint some obv-town guy for sheeping we are guaranteed to only land on town today.

Why don't you take the lead when you're doublecleared?

I would, and ive tried, but people just get pissed off with me.

Besides, I really dont have a clue. I have like zero hard townreads and fmpov everyone could be scum. Not a good position

[Vecna]

Guys, if we dont appoint some obv-town guy for sheeping we are guaranteed to only land on town today.

Why don't you take the lead when you're doublecleared?

I would, and ive tried, but people just get pissed off with me.

Besides, I really dont have a clue. I have like zero hard townreads and fmpov everyone could be scum. Not a good position

These two posts make no sense.
Let's sheep obvtown.

Doesn't say alignment at all of anyone.

Can we just lynch Vecna?

Honestly, its quite adorable how you keep poking at all little details just because you made up your mind I have to be scum, even with all the evidence going against it.....but youre not doing anyone any favours.

What happened to your usual approach of townblocking titus? It seems like youre just interested in painting whoever you can as a suspect to escape the lynch. If youre town here, youre not doing yourself or anyone else any favours with this type of nonsense.

[Vecna]

Another question; Titus, given your result, how come you havent gone over the Mathblade vs RC discussion looking at it from the point of view whether Mathblade seemed agitated because he knew RC was roleblocked?

[Vecna]

Nosferatu, how come youre still on an incredible vanity wagon thats not going to happen today? Deadline is approaching.

How do you feel about Titus, Ankamius and Gamma Emerald?

[Vecna]

Deadline for Day Three is Wednesday, August 8th, @ 3:00 PM PDT: 2 days, 14 hours, 37 minutes.

People we shouldnt lynch today:

Hebichan, for very obvious reasons
zMuffin, Because I think he's lying about it being a 2shot ability and he's gonna clear someone again tonight (compare it to all other abilities that do not have a limited number of charges, it doesnt fit within the setup - this is also a good argument for him being scum though) - aka scum will have to deal with it.

[Vecna]

Since im getting that annoying desperate feeling im just revisiting a bunch of my earlier reads, reading through their shit to see if how I felt at some point still jives with the gamestate

Townpool:
Lady Angel/Brian/Yuri slot - Yuuri Day 1 felt extremely town. The freeflowing thought patterns all screamed town. Nico and Vax didnt contribute anything. Brain I still felt was towny. He also felt way more antagonistic than ive seen him play as scum, but fuck meta I guess. The replace out also feels slightly like it was frustrated town to me personally, although the timing was really weird and wtf. This all jives quite well for me to be confident in townreading the slot for numerous reasons and not wanting it lynched.

HeWhoSwims - Weird slot. Was getting a lot of pressure on Day1, and wouldve been sure to be the day2 lynch, but Hebi cleared the slot. I townread the play on day1 slightly though, even though the reasons for it escape me now. Still, all this talk about traitors is nonsense. There -could- be one, but all the PT's are ample to get this slot and a PT cop (if its a real thing) lynched or questioned. If a hebi clear would be questioned, it makes a lot more sense to be doubting the hebi claim instead. People that think they can setup spec to that degree to state there has to be a traitor are kinda moronic, not because theyre 100% wrong, but because theyre trying to outguess the mod on such a small level that its rediculous without knowing all the details of the setup. Regardless, this slot will stay town for now, I guess - even though I havent been impressed with the play after getting cleared.

Ankamius - This slot im quite puzzled about. The constant use of emotion makes it particularly hard to read for me. I guess I can see it from some point that I agitate players with my playstyle, it has happened before. But at the same time theres a small gnawing feeling that it could be Broadwaytime. I dont recall Ankamius ever playing like this before. With everything I do, I get attacked for some reason from the slot. The weird claim by definition is calling for all type of questionmarks, especially since it now claims vt (although I guess it could still be a pt trying to hide, but it sure is weird). There have been plenty of genuine feelings though, the stuff surrounding Oath feels pretty fell thought out (and I would only ever expect this from town, or from tryhard scum protecting and planning around a teammate). Gun to my head the slot is still town, but im not certain and I feel the slot could fit in quite many scum configurations.

hebichan - Meh. Weird claim at a weird moment. Felt very town D1 so that was probably the correct interpretation. Could just be master-class fooling us all, and the contributions lately havent been very town-indicative, but I guess she's probably also bored and annoyed at the gamestate. Scumread me as she does in every game, even though she recognized I was playing to my town-meta.

Oath - Its still possible this slot just did the move where they go all-in for towncred. Replace in into a gamestate, try and push all wagons away from the 16 leading wagons on town. But Ankamius is probably correct in her interpretation. Its still possible GE and Oath are scum together I guess. But not very likely.

zMuffinMan - Talked about this slot a bunch already. I think its town much more likely than scum, but I could be mistaken. We should probably see what tomorrow brings. Im expecting the two shot thing about the ability is nonsense and we'll get another trick from our muffin.

Vecna - Im doing quite alright. Im making the observation that the further I get down these lists, the more bored I get with writing them, and the less insightfull each description gets.

Null / hard to read

Nosferatu - Says a lot of stuff that sounds towny. Still feels like its potentially scummy and just putting on a great show. Dont really have a very indepth read going on here. Could be the vig I guess. Plenty of people stating its obvious, im apparently missing quite a lot this game.

Toranaga - Who the fuck knows, 50/50 coinflip on allignment, none of the occupiers of the slot have done anything to give me a clue. The last posts from AA9 didnt sound insightfull at all, but for some reason I did have a strong scumread here, over which I got attacked quite a lot early game, then I develloped a minor townread, and im completely unsure about it now. The replacement seemed somewhat helpfull and willing to get involved, but I havent seen anything yet that is AI to me. Has some links to creature though. Looking back, a scumpairing of Creature + This slot is possible.

Creature - The reason I talked about the pairing is because Creature attacked me very uncharismatically on Day1. I did some quite weird pairings on D1 and he reacted with discrediting statements. 2 of the pairing have flipped town. There still is that lingering doubt. Creature's play this game is right in between his meta's where its slightly more involved than even in the finished transformers game, but hes still not doing certain things I know town-creature is capable of. Potential scum, but im still not sure whether its better than a 50/50

Titus - I dont feel like talking about Titus. For some reason we always fight. Its a shame really. Did some town-ping things I wont really go into. Did some scumthingies that everyone is aware of. Im not too sure either way. The roleblock claim feels weird and lazy. It could either explain a bunch of things if theres a Rb on the scumteam. Or its just scumtitus doing a "oh someone claimed to have a failed result, let me just claim the same on the night afterwards to try and make sense of what happened so far this game".

Scum suspects

MathBlade - The center of attention of the multiverse. Oh boy arent you happy Mathblade? Probably not. Theres a number of things that rubbed me the wrong way on this slot. Theres the happy puppy moment where he spotted Ankamius' claim. Thought he knew what it was supposed to be. Went through a whole lot of hollywooding about hiding his hood. CC'd the neighbouriser, which just feels all kinds of weird now looking back at it with all the details we have. 2 people that scumread the slot ended up rb'd in consecutive nights. Is doing a whole lot of hiding behind getting tunneled by two slots, and though there theres 600 posts, most of them are about getting tunneled, how youre feeling personally, and how Vecna is completely not understanding any of the stuff he does or is completely misinterpreting it. The funny thing about it? From none of it I get that agitated feeling that I always get from town Mathblade. At no point do I wanna pull my hair out. At no point does mathblade make me want to stab myself in the eyesocket. Guess its a compliment if youre town Math, because thats an improvement. Or it just means youre scum, and youre managing to talk yourself through all these attacks (which is quite formidable as well I guess). It still remains to be seen whether the weathering of the RC attack was just scum hiding behind the fact they * knew* it was a fakeclaim because they just roleblocked by your faction......or genuine frustration knowing that youre town and youre getting tunneled by all these chipotle-brains. Trying to meta you is probably gonna result in the wrong outcome. I think youre quite likely to be scum here, based purely on GUT, the content of your posts, and the way youre still alive. Also theres the thing where you didnt even once mention the fact that RC started fake-claiming on you because I dared him to. He went over the top on you because I said "you cannot do it without my help" and he wanted to prove me wrong. Yet all you could talk about was "oh woe, its a fakeclaim". You should probably eat a lynch by now. And then theres the thing where Mathblade used "Scum wanna take over the neighbourhood" all the time while he was getting tunneled. YET THAT WAS NOT EVEN POSSIBLE, yet he hid this little gem of knowledge from us because it suited his needs. Im completely baffled the other 3 in the hood never called him on that. So weird.

Gamma Emerald - The Aronis slot was so annoying. In a universe where Mathblade is scum it could still be town I guess. But my gut told me this slot was the most obvious scum in the game. My early game gut is way more often correct than wrong. Yet I once again did a classic move where I let the replacement talk me out of that idea. GE did some lines that I thought were probably towny. Im nowhere near sure that was correct. The enormous buddying and getting me to push on certain people just had so many red flags. The over-excitedness to just troll in plain sight and get away with it is a scum tactic mastered by so many people on this website (Rb/luv/that guy with the cartman avatar whose name escapes me), and I wish I wouldve just kept pushing it.

[Vecna]

I mean I'm rather frustrated we aren't getting obvious scum here, and I just can't rally town around anyone who might be a third scum. So fuck me.

Youre pushing on all the wrong people imo. But hey, maybe im just completely wrong, its possible I guess.

[Vecna]

im willing to lynch anyone in my null or scum pool, although im more happy with some over others.

But then again, you guys are both wrongly suspicious about me, so meh.

Titus, im just gonna do that thing and throw you an olive branch here, whether you take it is up to you - Youre barking up the wrong tree with me. Its understandable since you replaced in and probably missed a whole lot, but just know I had a lot of wrong reads on day1 and thats why im doubting everything atm. You stating im lacking a certain thing from civ mafia, I can understand it at some level, but its not really a fair comparison (in that game I had the entire scumteam nailed on day1, but noone was listening and then I got distracted by that guy day2).

[Vecna]

Its also very unlikely that both hebi and zMuffin are scum together

[Vecna]

Another question; Titus, given your result, how come you havent gone over the Mathblade vs RC discussion looking at it from the point of view whether Mathblade seemed agitated because he knew RC was roleblocked?

Because town!Math in that instance says impossible I roleblocked RC. Thus, if Math knew RC was blocked, we'd have Math claiming roleblocker and the missing blocks would not be here.

Also you missed my meaning here, I meant a scum Mathblade knowing RC was roleblocked by one of his teammates (which would also account for the Oath getting rb'd thing while trying to do shit to Hebi, although I dont know if that works with the normal way of action adjudication)

[Vecna]

Care to share what happened between waffling on math and wanting to lynch him though?

Like the whole thing is kinda annoying, but im just hoping my reasons for wanting it dead arent crap. Theres just so damn many of them by now.

[Vecna]

When all the town people were finally down to lynch mathblade

and then all the dodgy people push a lynch towards the guy that was the most obv-town in the entire game just because it got replaced a lot and people got confused.

We just switched from scum to town, and everyone threw their reads out the window. I wonder why.

Notice how creature asks me to lead, then when majority with me on a lynch somewhere he goes in a different direction

Nosferatu is suddenly willing to lynch his townread, while he's nowhere when asked about Mathblade

Toranaga's reason for voting there is also scummy as all hell.

[Vecna]

meh w/e do what u want I guess.

Even after all the replacements its the most obv-town slot in the game. Go and read Yuurei back again if u must and wonder if scum can fake that freeflow type of mindfull posting, and then wonder if replacements (although playing less and less, which comes with being a replacement) suddenly cause an allignment shift. Hint; they dont.

I veto this lynch

[Vecna]

So much weird shit happening here

Its like an episode of the x-files while youre on some major halucinogenic drug

[Vecna]

Yes, his shitty logic is totally a great reason to flee to a vanity wagon to invalidate the Math wagon.

Hurray for no longer having to buss? I do not think so

[Vecna]

Whatever shitty reason you wanna use to not lynch town is fine by me

[Vecna]

Also, if this shit flips town, youre not shooting anyone tonight in that hood, but youre inviting me into it to read into all the crap thats been going on there

[Vecna]

Kinda ironic though, were lynching the slot that was the most heavily townread of anyone in the game for the entirety of day1 and day2. Noone cares about that anymore, because a replacement for the slot is in, and it didnt do a proper catchup of 200 freaking pages.

Noone is noticing that a few scum were already bussing on Mathblade, but because it did a weakass appeal to emotion, they used it as an excuse to either unvote Math and go to a vanity wagon or jump ship to this wagon which theyve been heavily stating was town before.

And then you dare to complain that you no longer see any way for town to win.

[Vecna]

Gonna be funny to see this neighbourhood try and squirm through the boatloads of suspicions that are coming their way tomorrow.

If a town gets lynched by it tonight im lynching everyone in there, no exceptions

[Vecna]

i am imagining vecna snapping his keyboard in half and punching a hole in his monitor if this flips town

it's funny because all the slots i feel bad about jumped on it

Im not that angry, but this is the most stupid lynch we couldve done today

[Vecna]

The vig should just shoot in the neighbourhood. Either hit scum, or shut it down so scum cannot use it anymore and we have obv-lynches.

[Vecna]

Quite the comprehensive reading there. Yes I indeed insinuate there is two scum and 1 human left in the hood right now and that you just got saved by your scumbuddies

[Vecna]

You can prove me wrong and invite me to that hood of yours. I wanna see with my own eyes whether you've actually been obv-towning it up in there or what the shit is up

[Vecna]

blablabla

[Vecna]

The scumteam here is most likely Mathblade + Nosferatu + 2 out of the following 4: Ankamius/Creature/Gamma Emerald/Toranaga

that is all. Good job on pushing todays wagon on your vanity read though.

[Vecna]

I guess the same works if you replace Titus with Mathblade on there, but I feel the Mathblade variant is much more likely

[Vecna]

If theres any dodgy kill suggestion from Math/GE/Creature tonight, the remaining human in there better block any and all of them kill attempts.

[Vecna]

Sigh whatever

Please fucking vig me I want out of this game

This actually isnt a bad suggestion

[Vecna]

You thief of reason, lady of the night and ice cream hoarder your tunnel is beyond silly.

For I have seen into a vampire’s soul and it is tunneled.

I guess every vampire needs a bat cave.

Seriously.

Yes Creature was in the hood.

My post should tell you what you need to know.

This is nice btw... you should have waited for me to read it before going all in. I definitely got it.

Sorry I am really fucking tired of this game. Getting tunnelled by scum and a buddy you don’t want to out sucks. I am hoping scum kill me.

You think I have a buddy?

No you’re the buddy.

I didn’t want to out we had the same alignment

Hence buddy. I didn’t want to out you and I were buddies but you just wouldn’t stop.

What the shit is this lying? You tried to kill him last night, went all in on trying to lynch him with the hood. Then threw a tantrum in the tread how Brianskies stopped you. Why would you do that if you were a vampire?

[Vecna]

Like, there is some interplay between mafia, werewolves and what happened in the lynchmob yet again.

Oath, if your immunity got used up, its because the hood tried to lynch you. Not buying for a second that theres suddenly another thing that can kill.

Mafia killed Creature, werewolves killed HWS (and a somewhat logical explanation is also that they tried to kill him N2 is my guess)

[Vecna]

Oh right, neighborhood ceases to work if there's no human left

I think now that we know that creature was town, and Brianskies slot wasnt human, its safe to say that Gamma Emerald is also towncleared?

Unless this statement was some gambit, where scum convinced creature to say something that isnt true to measure reactions or whatever

[Vecna]

VOTE: Mathblade

Im really looking forward to your explanation why this slot isnt simply a werewolf Ank

[Vecna]

well

actually I don't think it clears gamma

it more depends on what happens tonight

The hood started with Gamma + Math + BrianSkies slot.

There had to be a human in there to begin with. BrianSkies and Mathblade are confirmed not human.

This also explains WHY mathblade never wanted to kill the GammaEmerald/Aronis slot; Because he knew the hood would stop functioning. Thats also why he had to get another obv-town in there - to stop the hood from going poof and outting them.

Mathblade

is

a

Wolf

[Vecna]

VOTE: Mathblade

Im really looking forward to your explanation why this slot isnt simply a werewolf Ank

honestly

call it a soul read

Im sorry, but a soul read is not gonna explain away all the inconsistencies.

[Vecna]

Like, I dont wanna agitate you yet again, but theres a pretty decent likelyhood that youre also a wolf having a stellar game, so ill take some liberties to state my opinion and all that

[Vecna]

And im pretty much convinced that Titus is mafia. He never tracked the vigilante, he just knew who his own team nightkilled so he could use that info to leverage not getting lynched.

RC being mafia, knowing to only having to lynch wolves, doing some basic logicing about the hood with his info.

Fits pretty well

[Vecna]

you realize that the yuurei slot was a MAFIA traitor right?

Yes, so non-human.

The hood started with 3 people remember. Two of which are now confirmed non-human (since mafiate apparently arent human - if they were they would have the exact same win condition as town).

[Vecna]

thats a good point, he doesnt, normally. Still, the werewolves might have more info that there is like a mafiate faction hunting them or whatever.

Mathblade is pretty good at mechanical deductions, so I wouldnt put it past him to logic his way to it.

either way, him not knowing at D1, and him wanting to play a deepcover game - having more humans in there to guarantee the hood to keep working is only good for him right? Hide in plain sight and all that.

[Vecna]

unless it blocks the recruit too, but I distantly remember it specifically being said to apply only to the kill?

Well creature literally stated the hood stops functioning. Im guessing with that he meant that it shuts down completely?

Guess it doesnt hurt to search for the quotes from the others since they never got called out on wrong details.

[Vecna]

Oh right, neighborhood ceases to work if there's no human left

oh? I didn't catch that and if it was someone else in the hood calling this out I'd have my own suspicions about someone being scum with creature who pulled him in to rock the vote but since it is him that is incredibly self-destructive

This was GE's statement about it

[Vecna]

Nos + Math + Hebi is a perfect fit?

Both Nos and Hebi were claiming to scumread Math, but when the moment supreme came, they both flocked to BrianSkies like a herd of doozy sheep

[Vecna]

I dont even know how it works number-wise with a scum faction, a vampire, an angel and wolves.

I guess even oath -could- be a wolf or whatever, but I dont see how that would work.

[Vecna]

Like there has to be at least 2 mafia out there right? Else they cannot really have a PT that a traitor will be denied access.

For it to be anywhere near balanced for wolves, id guess there also have to be 3 wolves in total then. Unless theyre absolute power-house PR type of wolves.

Maybe Mathblade was acting on having more information, and wolves indeed do not have a PT. Then it makes some sense to have Hebichan be a PT checker, so the wolves can track down the mafia-team. Mathblade is in the lynchmob, so that adds some interesting dynamic of the wolves having to communicate in-thread....but thats fine, because a PT cop doesnt seem very wolfy at first sight.

This setup sure is....something special

[Vecna]

Yes, the mafia should just claim and theyll basically be town masons since their wincon is shared with town

Theres probably only 1 or 2 vampires in here

Theres probably only ¬ 3 humans left at this point

The difference is, that if we lynch Mathblade today, then two of the kills can be aimed at wolves, while only 1 will be aimed at the mass of vampires/mafia/humans

So while I understand people will be afraid to claim, since they might get killed and all that, and loose because theres no people alive....we all are at that risk at the moment. But were simply ALL gonna loose to wolves if we do not cooperate here.

Sadly I think its highly likely that Oath actually is the only vampire here. Him having the BP ability kind of works as a single survivor type of deal

[Vecna]

this setup is fucking awkward mainly because I think the way to solve the game for town is to figure out who the mafia and 3Ps are as well as the wolves

yet the mafia and 3Ps have a vested interest in town not figuring out who they are while also themselves trying to figure out who wolves are

Yes, its actually brilliant design

But we have now reached a point where the our interest align, and we all need to take a risk here for joined victory.

If my assumption is correct, and GE is the remaining human in the hood, and Mathblade is a wolf, then we have 3 town-controlled lynches/kills today + tonight where we should be able to take out all the wolves in one big swoop.

[Vecna]

I wasn't fakeclaiming, I'm a human vanilla

Cmon now Ankamius, we all know this isnt true

[Vecna]

I have no idea lol. Im just finding it hard to fathom why that the guy in your slot before just claimed that weird soft as VT. "just for lulz"?

Anyways, if thats what you say you are, thats what you say you are I guess.

[Vecna]

I really feel the need to make a lot of colour trees with theorycrafting/setup deconstruction and all that good stuff..........but I really -should- wait for people to claim results.

So boring. So killing of my vibe.

[Vecna]

Either way, something really strange will have to happen for Mathblade to not be the optimal lynch today.

The reasoning that you want to "test" a vampire claim if youre a vampire yourself, after this vampire already proved that he could drain people, is all kinds of scummy. He just needed a neighbourhood kill that was still usefull to his faction, without flipping a towny. Removing the BP from a person youre not gonna get lynched is the next best thing. Besides, the only thing Mathblade was happy about is that he could find some story how his "softs" fit with the story he is now pushing. A classic scumtell.

Were lynching Mathblade and were finding some optimal way of directing GE, in such a way that they dont crossfire with mafia.

After we solve the setup that is ofcourse.

[Vecna]

You find that agreeable Ank?

[Vecna]

Ofcourse, were gonna unearth the entire wolfteam today and organize for them all to die before the next dawn

[Vecna]

Wish BrianSkies wouldve just claimed instead of replacing out. We wouldve been so much further along that way.

[Vecna]

Anyways just apply your own reasoning here, and your emotional state after seeing the flips.

You want to gamesolve. That is your only instinct here. That would also be the case for Mathblade if he was town. Instead he's focussed on self-preservation yet again, by going through his archive of drivel to see what fits his current narrative.

[Vecna]

Ok, so here's the order I propose things in:

step 1: Mafia claims, with their abilities (no results yet). Other mafia members confirm eachother
Step 2: People claim their full role and alignment. No lying here please. This will need to be a surgical strike where we utilize all our abilities in unison. We dont want any faction but the wolves to die. For that we need full information.
Step 3: Titus claims results. Any other people claim results/targets etc.

[Vecna]

Or how about you find actual scum if youre town?

Im not gonna respond to any of your squirming since its just a distraction.

If I decide youre getting lynched today, youre dead.

And confirming Oath does not confirm you. Not anywhere close. Coming up with some claim that changes more than I change my underwear isnt a particularly strong argument.

[Vecna]

Wish BrianSkies wouldve just claimed instead of replacing out. We wouldve been so much further along that way.

...
What you’re suggesting is literally broken.

Yuurei claims day one and says lynch me.

Depending upon size of mafia 2-3 confirmed town aligned players.

Then the PRs then confirm the rest.

It is stupid.

People ended up lynching a 3rd party that couldve townsided.

To save you.

2-3 people that have scumread you all game suddenly made it happen. The jig is up.

Claim your role and abilities. We're solving this shit today.

[Vecna]

Ill just gather the information from your corpse then, np

[Vecna]

I dont even know how it works number-wise with a scum faction, a vampire, an angel and wolves.

I guess even oath -could- be a wolf or whatever, but I dont see how that would work.

You dumbasses. Oath claimed correctly that their role PM is available on flip,

Gamma just confirms Oath which in proxy confirms me which in proxy confirms Vecna stupid or Vecna scum.

There is absolutely -NOTHING- that links you to Oath. Its these types of lies that make you obviously scum.

There is no way a SURVIVOR VAMPIRE would want to remove the BP of one of their own so that scum can instantly kill them. Especially not when they've been at the verge of getting lynched themselves all game.

[Vecna]

Everyone that is actually thinking Math is anything else than a wolf here has some required reading material for them.

The material being: Mathblade's reaction to Oath's claim. The way he pushed the slot as scum, untrustworthy, too OP for 3rd party etc.

Please tell me if that is how a vampire themselves would ever react to any of that.

[Vecna]

1:More rules about the lynchmob that werent brought up before? Really?

2: Scum couldnt kill Oath to begin with, because of the revive ability. NOW they can though

3: Yes, you've been hiding behind it quite well.

You didnt break anything open. Noone was considering Oath hostile. It just smells like its convenient as a scumclaim to try and survive.

Like an actual town-Mathblade wouldnt even be pushing to invite a vampire into that hood, since you need humans in there to keep it going and be town-controlled. This is all just a ploy for survival

[Vecna]

Hey Gamma, its time for a chat. You got some time?

[Vecna]

Yes Mathblade, but a wolf would also want to do that. It doesnt prove anything

[Vecna]

Like, you've been clinging all game that youre "obv-town" because of the actions of others, and because of stuff you have done that is in NO WAY alignment indicative. Every action you have done fits perfectly with what a wolf (that isnt completely braindead) would do.

Do you deny any of this?

[Vecna]

thats a good point, he doesnt, normally. Still, the werewolves might have more info that there is like a mafiate faction hunting them or whatever.

Mathblade is pretty good at mechanical deductions, so I wouldnt put it past him to logic his way to it.

either way, him not knowing at D1, and him wanting to play a deepcover game - having more humans in there to guarantee the hood to keep working is only good for him right? Hide in plain sight and all that.

Err mafia is human too
And I've got other games but if you post stuff at me I can probably respond for the time being

Did you confirm mafia being human wiht the mod?

Because thats not the answer I got from Mastina.

Also, are you a mafiate?

[Vecna]

We do not need to see Oath's fakeclaims. They add nothing, and prove nothing. Its been well established that all non-town factions have them (including even the angel)

[Vecna]

Like, you've been clinging all game that youre "obv-town" because of the actions of others, and because of stuff you have done that is in NO WAY alignment indicative. Every action you have done fits perfectly with what a wolf (that isnt completely braindead) would do.

Do you deny any of this?

....I can’t confirm or deny. I don’t know what wolves have or what they can do.

I lack the required information to answer this question.

Dude stop trying to force weakass towntells, its so blatantly scummy that it doesnt help you at all.

[Vecna]

I dont even know how it works number-wise with a scum faction, a vampire, an angel and wolves.

I guess even oath -could- be a wolf or whatever, but I dont see how that would work.

What fucks me up wrt to multiball is mastina said this game was built using Alisae modding style as a reference right? Well Alisae hates multiball with a fiery passion, so that just fucks me up. So honestly, I have no real expectations for any sort of sense from this setup anymore.

Its not multibal

Its everyone vs the wolves, with survivor factions.

Mafia is a survivor faction with nightkills and a PT that can win with town

Vampire's are a survivor faction with nightkills that win with town

Angel is a reverse survivor that somehow needs to make others survive.

This is also why the Mafia/Vampires whomever need to claim. We do not want to lynch Mafia here, like what happened yesterday. Its anti-wincon.

[Vecna]

Like, you've been clinging all game that youre "obv-town" because of the actions of others, and because of stuff you have done that is in NO WAY alignment indicative. Every action you have done fits perfectly with what a wolf (that isnt completely braindead) would do.

Do you deny any of this?

....I can’t confirm or deny. I don’t know what wolves have or what they can do.

I lack the required information to answer this question.

Dude stop trying to force weakass towntells, its so blatantly scummy that it doesnt help you at all.

Lol I don’t force anything

I just am dude

Give it up

No, too much inconsistencies. Stuff that doesnt fit. Stuff that doesnt go into the Math town behaviour. Maybe some of it can be explained, but most of it is exactly what a wolf would do.

[Vecna]

Me and Gamma. We submitted a lynch on Oath. I did it to confirm Oath. I made up some BS reason about too many groups so Oath would be confirmed. It’d be awesome if he quit tunneling the person who gave him cover for two days. Jesus.

Titus is so obviously scum.

Oath is a vampire and you’re never lynching him.

You have to lynch me first.

Wait so you claim Vampire too? What I'm confused about is why Oath has a safeclaim if he can win with the town.

Yes I do.

Go look at Oath’s role PM in the lynch mob.
Oath and I have safe claims in case people don’t believe us.

Go look at Oath’s three fake claims and post them paraphrased

@Gamma please go look at the lynchmob PT the last few posts

Wait, how do you get his fake-claims in your lynchmob PT?

[Vecna]

I dont even know how it works number-wise with a scum faction, a vampire, an angel and wolves.

I guess even oath -could- be a wolf or whatever, but I dont see how that would work.

What fucks me up wrt to multiball is mastina said this game was built using Alisae modding style as a reference right? Well Alisae hates multiball with a fiery passion, so that just fucks me up. So honestly, I have no real expectations for any sort of sense from this setup anymore.

Its not multibal

Its everyone vs the wolves, with survivor factions.

Mafia is a survivor faction with nightkills and a PT that can win with town

Vampire's are a survivor faction with nightkills that win with town

Angel is a reverse survivor that somehow needs to make others survive.

This is also why the Mafia/Vampires whomever need to claim. We do not want to lynch Mafia here, like what happened yesterday. Its anti-wincon.

Vampires for one don’t shoot people
Two Lady Angel flipped mafia traitor who inherits a shot
Three Vampires such as myself haven’t killed and can’t kill

Why are you pushing mass claim on such bad spec?

Oh yeah that’s right you’re scum.

VOTE: Vecna

Im pushing for mass-claim for very obvious reasons.

[Vecna]

I also received a PM with Oath's flip
Also I'm gonna bring this up: who thinks we don't have a vig and it's just the mafia?
As for mafia winning with town that feels so strange, but you know what I'm done trying to make sense of this setup.

We do not have a vig. Thats why Titus needs to get the fuck in here and spill the beans.

Still not sure whether its better to have Mafia claim before or after that though.

[Vecna]

I also received a PM with Oath's flip
Also I'm gonna bring this up: who thinks we don't have a vig and it's just the mafia?
As for mafia winning with town that feels so strange, but you know what I'm done trying to make sense of this setup.

And the fake claims are indeed Theif Hooker and ice cream lover

Like my first post.

Shazam! XD

Like, sure - this makes it more plausible why a human of the town would want to find out if Oath is for real. If you actually were a vampire, I still really dont get why you'd want to do this though.

Once again, fits better with a wolf, but ill give it a rest for now until later

[Vecna]

I also received a PM with Oath's flip
Also I'm gonna bring this up: who thinks we don't have a vig and it's just the mafia?
As for mafia winning with town that feels so strange, but you know what I'm done trying to make sense of this setup.

We do not have a vig. Thats why Titus needs to get the fuck in here and spill the beans.

Still not sure whether its better to have Mafia claim before or after that though.

We do it’s the mafia

Flail harder Vecna

Later

Lynch caught scum please.

Yes, its the mafia. How is it flailing for realizing that a vig and an entire faction with a factional kill are different things?

[Vecna]

Im not worried. I want them to claim so we do not hit them with a lynch or with a nightkill. And I want to sort your freaking slot.

[Vecna]

So heres the thing.

10 people left.

If Math is really telling the truth, we have 4 hardclears.

If Math is lying, and a wolf, it still clears GE/Oath so we have 3 clears

With mafia fullclaims, that puts us at 5-6 clears. Making it pretty much auto.

So if the freaking mafia can claim already, that'd be marvelous. Then we direct the mafia kill, the hood kill, and Oath's roleblock, and this game is done.

I doubt itll be that easy, but thats how it looks.

[Vecna]

Im not worried. I want them to claim so we do not hit them with a lynch or with a nightkill. And I want to sort your freaking slot.

We want zmuffin and hebi to claim result OR target first.

The vig and I already know each other so lol with that.

Ok, fair

[Vecna]

although that also sort of puts you in a convenient spot with your claim. I do hope youre mafia here, or shit will get more complicated than it has to be.

[Vecna]

Also, one of Hebi and Zmuffin better be a comfirmable non-wolf because I really dont wanna have to deal with this non-townclear bullshit

[Vecna]

Im not worried. I want them to claim so we do not hit them with a lynch or with a nightkill. And I want to sort your freaking slot.

Vecna is scum trying to find all the humans to kill. The proper way to do this is have someone go around and claim protective and if we don’t have any we can’t mass claim

Remember the wincon at least one human left alive

If there are 4 wolves then if only three humans left we lose
If there are 4 and a traitor then only four humans left we lose

Can we not game throw and just Lynch the scum wanting mass claim?

K thx bubye

You should probably go read that vampire role pm of Oath that youre also claiming to have. Vampires dont give a fuck if humans live. Neither do Mafia.

More wolf slipperies.

[Vecna]

Im not worried. I want them to claim so we do not hit them with a lynch or with a nightkill. And I want to sort your freaking slot.

We want zmuffin and hebi to claim result OR target first.

The vig and I already know each other so lol with that.

Ok, fair

Stupid

Muffin claimed two shot and will have no results

Maybe.....it was a fakeclaim of sorts? Any decent unlimited cop would claim to be out of shots when you feel compelled to claim. Either way, it dont matter. We can still wait for Hebi to claim, and zMuffin to come in here. Theres bound to be a mafia in the two of them id say.

[Vecna]

Im not worried. I want them to claim so we do not hit them with a lynch or with a nightkill. And I want to sort your freaking slot.

Vecna is scum trying to find all the humans to kill. The proper way to do this is have someone go around and claim protective and if we don’t have any we can’t mass claim

Remember the wincon at least one human left alive

If there are 4 wolves then if only three humans left we lose
If there are 4 and a traitor then only four humans left we lose

Can we not game throw and just Lynch the scum wanting mass claim?

K thx bubye

You should probably go read that vampire role pm of Oath that youre also claiming to have. Vampires dont give a fuck if humans live. Neither do Mafia.

More wolf slipperies.

Oh honey I have to have my food.

I require a human and a Vampire alive. I have to feed my minion.

So do mafia's count for that human living condition?

[Vecna]

Like literally fuck Mastina for this super hard wincon.

Like it’s goddamn impossible

Maybe you shouldnt be removing the revival of your partners then, and complain how hard it is to survive afterwards, eh?

[Vecna]

Youre pretty terrible at actually recognizing food then.

I do have to say, whether youre a wolf or an actual vampire here, its a pretty darn interesting devellopment

[Vecna]

.....but I still have the feeling this is still scum revelling in their clever fakeclaim and taking it a bit too far.

[Vecna]

So youre not afraid tracker Titus is gonna bust your entire plan open eh?

[Vecna]

I require a human and a Vampire alive. I have to feed my minion.

Um no it just says a vampire needs to live, not a vampire and a human

That’s Oath’s

Mine is I have to bring a human to end game to feed Oath so we can suck on his juicy corpse and then have a nation of vampires.

So Oath needs to survive? Or just either of you? This isnt making a lot of sense to me just yet. Spell it out.

[Vecna]

The setup is so weird though.

Like, we havent lynched a single wolf yet.......but if the mafia are the correct people, it still is probably a town/vampire/mafia autowin.

If the pieces are, as they (are trying to) appear to be.

[Vecna]

I require a human and a Vampire alive. I have to feed my minion.

Um no it just says a vampire needs to live, not a vampire and a human

That’s Oath’s

Mine is I have to bring a human to end game to feed Oath so we can suck on his juicy corpse and then have a nation of vampires.

So Oath needs to survive? Or just either of you? This isnt making a lot of sense to me just yet. Spell it out.

Me Oath and a human

So what would happen if the wolves eat Oath tonight? This doesnt even seem feasible, that you can loose at any point by a random bullet.

[Vecna]

The setup is so weird though.

Like, we havent lynched a single wolf yet.......but if the mafia are the correct people, it still is probably a town/vampire/mafia autowin.

If the pieces are, as they (are trying to) appear to be.

And if that is the case the setup is broken by mass claim D1

Sooooo there is something missing here.

So stop pushing mass claim that causes me to lose til we fucking figure it out,

Im pushing for the mafia to reveal themselves at the very least. Those can confirm eachother and reduce our lynchpool.

Besides, im afraid for you theres probably very little humans left by now - and theyre all in the open already anyway.

[Vecna]

Also, we need to have both mafia and your hood hit wolves tonight.

You'll still be at the mercy of the wolves not venge-killing Oath though. I really dont get why you thought it would be worth removing his revive just to confirm he's actually your pup.

[Vecna]

This vampire shenanigans might require some rethinking of likely setup spec though.

[Vecna]

Still a conf-town roleblocking threat......at any rate, im happy you pushed the bullseye away from the humans lol

[Vecna]

well fmpov that reason could just as well be that you dont actually know shit, so you need to know the roles of people first so you can just "confirm" whatever theyre stating

[Vecna]

Now please Oath.

Serve your daddy and we lynch Vecna.

His unprompted VT claim makes him scum.

Im really interested in hearing how youre still on about this. 2 Pr's have human villager confirming results on me.

[Vecna]

And if you really think your dodgy play hasnt given people a shitton of reasons to have valid scumreads on you, youre just back to your old self that you've been claiming all game has been gone.

[Vecna]

I am going to back off the mass claim idea though

REPEAT - NO MASS CLAIM

Considering that it seems as though even within factions we have different win cons. So although some of us can win together, it seems not all of us may have that motivation.

I am leaning towards believing MathBlade, but I don't know if that's just because I don't like being the lone Vampire and having a buddy is comforting. I need to re-read.

IS ANYONE FEELING LETHARGIC???

Dont out this info yet though. Whomever you rb'd, dont out this untill all the other information we want has been provided.

[Vecna]

Now please Oath.

Serve your daddy and we lynch Vecna.

His unprompted VT claim makes him scum.

Im really interested in hearing how youre still on about this. 2 Pr's have human villager confirming results on me.

Can you quote these confirmations please?

Hebichan claimed a PT cop and stated I do not have a PT
zMuffin claimed to use the seer ability on me N1, and stated I am a human

Sadly for me, one of the two is likely scum. Sadly for all of you, if that is indeed the case, that means you actually need to use your common sense to be able to divine my easily distinguishable town playstyle.

[Vecna]

Either way, we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.

[Vecna]

Im fine with lynching Titus, but were not doing it yet.

Need to have the mafia claim first.

[Vecna]

Besides, we still need to talk sense into Mathblade and actually have him hit a proper target tonight.

[Vecna]

Hebi, please unvote so were not getting any stupid blitz shenanigans

[Vecna]

VOTE: Titus


Titus has a PT guys.

Also, why didnt you scan Ank to get an inno?

[Vecna]

I'm still unsure why muffin refused to counter me here, is the next issue of discussion.

Probably because of the perceived difference in allignments

[Vecna]

So youre hard-claiming human, and not mafioso, correct Hebi? Just to get that out there.

[Vecna]

It's not interesting at all, because the first two results are public knowledge and the third is a fakeclaim that will be resolved.

Why track nos at all?

How is it public knowledge? Like an educated guess, sure - but what made you so sure?

[Vecna]

People really are hell-bent on connecting me to wolves through some interesting loops this game

[Vecna]

The real question is, why would the wolves not kill titus if they knew he was a town or mafia tracker telling the truth.

Why not kill Hebichan if she can actually reveal the people claiming VT.

Killing HWS of all people is just weird.

Theres also this thing how Titus didnt say anything about any other Hebi visits. Just coming out on D2 claiming no pt on a random person that is now confirmed town is hella risky if you dont actually have the PT role as a cop.

[Vecna]

So everyone is completely buying the Mathblade story of him being a Vampire lord playing dressup with the pitchfork crowd?

[Vecna]

So this is hopefully the part where Oath comes in and nails a wolf fucker to the wall by claiming RB on them, and invalidating their nonsense story.

N1 Titus claims a failed result on Math
N2 Oath claims a failed result on Hebi

Like, either there's some passive shit messing with their abilities, or the wolves suddenly forget to make proper use of their abilities to not allow a potential town Titus to track their shit to a kill?

[Vecna]

Still annoyed both the persons clearing me just couldnt be a mafia so this would all go down a bit easier.

[Vecna]

for muffin and hebi to both be scum that required wolves to have 2 investigatives which is a lil bit ???

Technically muffin doesnt have to be a seer at all, he didnt use any ability to get knowledge that wasnt public by the time he claimed it.

The only result Hebi got that wouldve been a gamble without actually having the PT cop power would be on HWS. I told her before she inspected me that I didnt have a PT

[Vecna]

Its probable. Im guessing wolves would have a hard time figuring out Nos was mafia if he indeed cannot be targeted by anything supernatural.

[Vecna]

Fmpov were still missing something though.

I doubt its as simple as Tora + Hebi + Muffin. And thats even if theres only 3 wolves

[Vecna]

omfg if hebi is scum im gonna lose it


ive been screaming in pt i should shoot her since d1

Been having a lot of solo conversations, have we?

[Vecna]

Btw

Toranaga is probably the wolf roleblocker

what makes you say this?

[Vecna]

So, shall we make a little plan for a surgical strike?

I guess im getting to a point where im fine just taking out Hebi + Muffin + Toga, with some contingencies in place if whoever we lynch of the three (preferably Hebi) flips town.

We could do something like;

Lynch hebi ---> wolf flip? Nos shoots Toga, hood lynches Muffin
----> town flip? Nos shoots toga, Mathblade gets his revenge on Titus slot and hoodlynches it.

[Vecna]

Can even throw some assignment for Oath in there to roleblock a likely scumlord to reduce the chance of interference I guess.

[Vecna]

No to lynching hebi

We should be neutralizing the roleblock asap

We need to be carefull with getting end-gamed though. We have a direct confrontation between Hebi and Titus, one of them is guaranteed a wolf. If Hebi flips town, we know to take out Titus.

If Tora flips town, were not completely sure where to aim the night abilities. Im open to suggestions I guess, but we can also just have Oath roleblock Tora to stop her from roleblocking someone else or w/e.

[Vecna]

And im stating all this knowing full well theres still a decent change that Math + Ank are in fact wolves together here. But whatever, im not anywhere near certain enough to pursue that now.

[Vecna]

Ankamius - VT
Nosferatu - Mafvig
Toranaga - ???? wolfy?
zMuffinMan - ???? Seer wolfy?
Titus - Tracker?
Vecna - VT
MathBlade - Vamp overlord
Gamma Emerald - VT lynchmob
hebichan - PT checker wolf?
Oath - Vamp minion

Scumteam option 1: Tora + Muffin + Hebi
Likely outcome of lynch/night action as proposed: 1 lynch (Hebi), 1 hoodlynch (Muffin/Titus), 1 wolfkill (?? some conftown), 1 mafia kill (Toga) -> 6 players remaining tomorrow. Likely outcome: 2 wolves dead minimum if assumptions are correct.

Scumteam option 2: Ank + Mathblade + Hebichan
Likely outcome of lynch/night action as proposed by Ankamius: 1 lynch (Tora), 1 hoodlynch (Hebi/Titus), 1 wolfkill (?? some conftown), 1 mafia kill (Muffin?) -> 6 players remaining tomorrow. Likely outcome: Mostly town deaths, possibility of getting endgamed by certain wolfteams.

Not sure how safe these plans are if Ank + Math are part of a scumteam here. Not sure how much I care. Guess we need to come up with a solid safe plan

[Vecna]

Was about to write another stinker of a post. cooler minds prevailed

[Vecna]

Im finally getting to experience that joyfull feeling again of being irritated by irrational Mathblade. Maybe he is townsided after all. Even with all the stuff that went down that really makes me want to ask Nos to just put a bullet there tonight.

Anyways, rationally speaking, why would Math go against the plan if it puts him one step closer to winning.

[Vecna]

From the wolf PT:

Ankamius: Shut up Mathblade, theyre giving us exactly what we want, dont agitate them
Mathblade: its ok, im just acting like a buffoon some more, itll work.
Hebichan: I dont wanna die, please dont let them lynch me

[Vecna]

Anyways, bedtime.

Dont do anything stupid while im gone

[Vecna]

One more post then;

Youre crumbs remind me of a game I did myself as scum.

I started the game by just spamming terrible ms paints. Plenty of pictures with tanks, players in the game, jaguars, parrots, the usual.

It was a janitor setup, and for some reason we only janned at like N3. It was some PR, like an inventor type of role or w/e.

Obviously, fakeclaiming that shit was easy. Just go back over like 5 pages of MS-paint spam, pick out a few, and make up a story that sounds semi-plausible on some level. Just talk a lot around it.

Just because you can attribute some meaning to 1-2 posts out of 800, dont make it a believable crumb.

[Vecna]

(especially not if you already used em before to explain something else away)

[Vecna]

I'm lynching titus or myself. I'm not voting anywhere else.

can you not
we get it you're emotional

chill the fuck down

Now that I know youre conf town-sided im suddenly a lot more happy with how you approached this game, and especially your comment-style

[Vecna]

does no one feel lethargic????

Time to out it id say. Unless it was Tora I guess

[Vecna]

There is something to be said about leaving both Hebi and Titus alive for tonight even. If one of them is indeed town, theyll get more results, and scum will have to deal with it somehow, or tomorrow will either get more easy or even more of a clusterfuck.

Ofcourse, not dealing with it gets excessively more dangerous if Math + Ank are scum here, and they get 2 wolf-controlled kills tonight (im not sure how much confidence im placing in GE to do anything useful in that hood, since so far it seems everyone has completely rolled over to whatever it is that Mathblade wants).

[Vecna]

God I hate all the replacements in these games so much. No accountability for anything on over half the slots. And that excludes Mathblade

[Vecna]

Random thoughts;
-Titus never even engaged with the Mathblade claim. I find that very strange
-A PT cop on the wolf team becomes a lot less useful when you take into account that both the mafia couldnt really be found by it (one being immune, the other being in the hood and not having a scum PT). The only use (besides town-cred) it would seem to have would be to find people that were neighbourized or the hood if it wasnt mass-claimed. Hebi being a wolf would suggest a higher likelyhood of Math telling the truth.
-A wolf watcher type of ability could potentially explain a wolf Titus knowing about Nos.
-There probably is some ability that made the wolves aware that HWS was in fact a doctor. Somehow they knew he probably fucked up their N2 kill. Maybe they logiced it out if they tried to kill Hebi on N2. Maybe theres some other explenation. Im not buying that the HWS was a random lucky hit.
-A 3 person wolf team without access to the hood seems like it would be so small, given only 1 mafia (which turns out is basically a vig with a replacement vig lined up). Fmpov a 4 person wolf team seems extremely unlikely in this setup.

[Vecna]

Afterthought:
It wouldnt surprise me greatly if it actually turns out RC and Mathblade are scum together. Its a far fetch, but not an impossible one. Wolves killed A50 N1. A50 was townreading Math apparently. A clash of styles in the PT, maybe over a fight of who to NK. Both ego's trying to take control, with RC going full-in to just bus his teammate for the cred so he could continue as a tracker that caught Mathblade, and just do whatever he wants strategically. Mathblade has said before he would never "allow" his teammate to bus him like that, but its not like he could stop RC if he wanted to do it. It explains quite a lot of things, but it has even bigger problems (like Titus knowing about nos).

The reason im even typing this......Theres all kinds of bussing going on if our scumpool is the scumpool. But what is their next step? How are they ever going to win this if our current scumpool is actually the pool

[Vecna]

God I hate all the replacements in these games so much. No accountability for anything on over half the slots. And that excludes Mathblade

I tried but the game thread is too long, the mechanics are all over the place and there's no one I really love playing with here. no excuse for sucking but it's a hard game to get into so I didn't.

I might work on it later today

I didnt mean it at a personal level, fyi - the people replacing out are the ones creating the problem, the people replacing in are the heroes and all that for even trying to help out.

Sometimes I wonder if a modkill wouldnt be a way more elegant solution. Also serves as a deterrant, because I sometimes get the feeling people flake as certain alignment.

[Vecna]

Hmmm I just realized a thing, and im kicking myself for not realizing this earlier.

It was super-simple for Titus to just GUESS who the mafia/vig was, in any of the following circumstances:
-She knows the alignment of Tora and muffin
-She is a wolf tracker that just tracked other people than who she claims, but in such a way that she could eliminate them from being the one who did the kill.

Lets face it, with only 9 slots who it couldve been, and a ton of information from like half of those about their role and visits, there are a ton of ways Titus couldve deduced that it was nosferatu even without beign able to actually track him.

Doesnt mean im stating she is more likely scum over Hebi (although I am actually starting to feel that way) - but just because he knew -TODAY- that nos was the mafia/vig after a ton of other shit was claimed.....it doesnt confirm anything at all.

[Vecna]

The truely hilarious thing is that people are actually starting to believe that im scum together with Hebi and muffin, and that we came up with a plan to have them both inno me. All the while theyre fine not even batting an eye at the most dubious player in the game, which has been directing kills onto town after town, and is now claiming to be a vampire that actually removed the BP on the one person he has to keep alive - all the while pretending to not understand why people are scumreading the slot.

Fmpov the only other possible solution is that all 3-4 scum are literally in muffin/toga/titus/Hebi.

Also, GE - it would be nice if you actually participate yourself and not just brainlessly sheep anything Mathblade tells you to do. In the best case he is what he claims and he will try and get you to mislynch on me tonight

[Vecna]

And ill once again point to the very distinct fact, that Titus, Ank and Hebi all saved Mathblade from the lynch last night.

Regardless of who the scum is, if you actually think its a good idea to flip me before flipping the person's innoing me......youre not being very bright. Id expect that shit from Mathblade with any alignment, not from the rest of you.

[Vecna]

im pretty sure i put forward that plan where we lynch hebi and shoot/neighbourhood lynch depending on that outcome.

If mathblade keeps up this shit Im also completely fine flipping the coin and lynching his ass and shutting down that hood though

[Vecna]

And ill once again point to the very distinct fact, that Titus, Ank and Hebi all saved Mathblade from the lynch last night.

Regardless of who the scum is, if you actually think its a good idea to flip me before flipping the person's innoing me......youre not being very bright. Id expect that shit from Mathblade with any alignment, not from the rest of you.

That’s actually SOP
Lynch the guilty before the cop claim every time
Same with an inno

Not in this scenario, where its a triangle, and your logic depends on "muffin + hebi + vecna are scum, and both of the former inno'd the latter".

[Vecna]

Oath, question....why did you try to roleblock GE (who is the same person as Aronis)

[Vecna]

indeed

gamma could also be scum

Apparently the neighborhood doesn't work without town in it and if Gamma isn't town, then...

Which Mathblade conveniently failed to mention for the first 2.5 gamedays, while he was getting tunneled and was using "scum trying to take over the hood" as an excuse.

Then Creature comes out and mentions it at some point, and GE goes "huh, didnt even know that". and Mathblade is trying to ignore the point made against him that he was trying to use scum take-over fear to stay alive.

[Vecna]

im just hoping Creature didnt misinterpret the ruling, and were now basing everything on false information

[Vecna]

indeed

gamma could also be scum

Apparently the neighborhood doesn't work without town in it and if Gamma isn't town, then...

Which Mathblade conveniently failed to mention for the first 2.5 gamedays, while he was getting tunneled and was using "scum trying to take over the hood" as an excuse.

Then Creature comes out and mentions it at some point, and GE goes "huh, didnt even know that". and Mathblade is trying to ignore the point made against him that he was trying to use scum take-over fear to stay alive.

It’s not a misinterpretation or mistake of the sort

You are literally trying anything to lynch me now.

Like dude. Scum were trying to get control of the hood.

I didn’t want to fucking tell them it was stupid. I wanted the outed scum.

Youre doing the same to me. I just have a lot more good reasons to do it to you

[Vecna]

No I dont think so

[Vecna]

I think im missing your point Ank. The take-away is that Gamma has been the only human in there untill creature got invited.

Human + mafia + vampire, or so the story goes

[Vecna]

Setups that have this much mechanical complexity going on are such a major pain in the ass as clueless vt

[Vecna]

Aronis : Did not receive any abilities
Hebi : was unsuccessful
Gamma : inconclusive flavor that basically states no result

Maybe ask the mod about it. I noticed some minor inconsistencies as well in VT's suddenly being named differently, maybe it was unintended

[Vecna]

So youre suddenly 100% believing Mathblade?

[Vecna]

I think we need to go back to the plan as it was proposed before. Lynching Muffin instead of Hebi is a possibility, in that it at least townclears me in the offchance it does flip town.

[Vecna]

If there is a passive on Hebi it would also invalidate Titus' result though

[Vecna]

I was guessing you meant passive like an immunity to non-killing actions or the like

[Vecna]

Ankamius, im gonna leave it to you to convince Mathblade that he is not allowed to lynch me tonight. Theres too much bad blood between us by now, and if history has taught me anything, the slot is not gonna listen anymore to a single thing I have to say. So in the case its telling the truth, itll be leaving it upto you to direct him to not throw the game.

[Vecna]

I think im missing your point Ank. The take-away is that Gamma has been the only human in there untill creature got invited.

Human + mafia + vampire, or so the story goes

i would think that mafia count as humans

Please, please please confirm that with the GM would you?

Its a rather important detail, because if it does Gamma is not clear at all like were assuming right now, and might be very much in need of lynching

[Vecna]

Look at all the flips again

Human is listed as an alignment and doesn't show up anywhere else in the PMs we have

It also doesn't show up in the mafia flip and the angel flip specifically says they are part of the green faction but aren't human

Mafia are not human.

This has also been my assumption.

Another notch for Mathblade is he hasnt been on top of this to figure it out as soon as the flip on Brian happened, and instantly reported back to us.

[Vecna]

So do mafia count as a threat to the town?

Cause my pm says we need to get rid of all threats to the town, not just wolves.

What the hell?

[Vecna]

town = human + mafia + vampie

Not from a technical point of view. Town = Humans + angel.

Mafia and vampires are something else.

Town counts on humans surviving
Mafia counts on mafia surviving
Vampires counts on vampires surviving (which is also pretty inconsistent with Math's claim)

[Vecna]

Im sayimg that youll do yourself a disservice not acknowledging that mafiate could very well be human. Nothing indicates that they aren't. You're using the absence of a thing to prove the status of another and obviously this game is odd. Im just saying its not 100% guaranteed that mafiate cant be human.

Oh derp

So Gamma may be town?

May not be town?

Yay sleepy brain

Ask the gm for confirmation already? Thats what she's there for. You have the power to 100% townclear the slot, and for some reason you havent yet done so.

[Vecna]

So do mafia count as a threat to the town?

Cause my pm says we need to get rid of all threats to the town, not just wolves.

What the hell?

yeah idk, either hebi painfully misread her role pm or her fakeclaim pm to the point where there's an entirely different sentence there, or she's just assuming what it looks like.

idk where she read that from, maybe accidentally from a different game cause i know for a fact wolves have fakeclaims with a vt role pm that she could've easily read from

Maybe she has a fakeclaim that looks a bit like the Angel's pm in that it has an alternate wincon.....

I actually think Hebi is more likely town than Titus here based on play.

Titus is good with mechanical shit. We do not know the wolves abilities. We do not know who the wolf team are. Dont underestimate the huge information advantage of the wolfteam.

Assuming Titus is town just because he knew you were killing people is a dumb-ass thing to do (imo).

[Vecna]

Anyways, im probably gonna get mislynched soon because im scumreading the entire thread at some point so ladida

[Vecna]

Im sayimg that youll do yourself a disservice not acknowledging that mafiate could very well be human. Nothing indicates that they aren't. You're using the absence of a thing to prove the status of another and obviously this game is odd. Im just saying its not 100% guaranteed that mafiate cant be human.

Oh derp

So Gamma may be town?

May not be town?

Yay sleepy brain

Ask the gm for confirmation already? Thats what she's there for. You have the power to 100% townclear the slot, and for some reason you havent yet done so.

in fact, fuck it, ill do it myself.

[Vecna]

what has me hung up is that I played dumb when titus hinted at it

she should have dropped it if she was scum, but she didn't

that sort of confidence is weird when I didn't shoot inside my scumreads for the most part

If titus is scum she has 2-3 teammates that she know cannot be mafia. If she is a scum tracker, she couldve tracker other people to exclude them from being able to be the mafia. If she is scum she has teammates that couldve used abilities to rule out people.

Honestly, even I had you down as most likely the person shooting people or a wolf by yesterday, and thats without any added information since im a VT.

[Vecna]

Like, im not saying Titus is confirmed scum. But saying she's confirmed town based off this one thing is really stupid imo.

Maybe the wolf team actually tried to kill you N2 and thats why they know you must be something special. Its not like town is gonna have a 2nd BP on top of Oath, so even then its a pretty simple deduction.

[Vecna]

what has me hung up is that I played dumb when titus hinted at it

she should have dropped it if she was scum, but she didn't

that sort of confidence is weird when I didn't shoot inside my scumreads for the most part

Also, im kind of annoyed youre scumreading me here for some reason. Like, please, get it together, because if I have to defend myself against getting lynched or shot in this stage of the game after all that has transpired this game is not going to end well.

[Vecna]

IMPORTANT IMPORTANT IMPORTANT

The mod just confirmed Lady angel WAS in fact considered a human.

So Gamma Emerald goes right back into the lynch pool. Which puts it right back as one of my highest scumreads.