Perfectionist Mafia - Resultas

[FaerieLord]

Reading and crap

[FaerieLord]

I should have changed "reading and crap" to "reading the crap"

Firstly, you people talk way too much. Now some points

Snow White: Do you consider yourself a good new player, a bad new player a good experienced player or a bad experienced player. Answer from the above four choices.
Sanjay: Why are you protecting Lowell in 81? Is he your lover or are you just bored?
Dramonic: Do you think leading the town is scummy?
EtherealCookie: I like you. How do you feel to this?
Saberwolf: You talk too much. And your logic hurts my ear drums
Wickedejstr: Do you always talk so much nothing?
Mufasa: What's the point of a question?
My Milked Eek: Your 269 and 286 was funny. Good job

Reckoner is town
Allmightybob is town
My Milked Eek is town

All the rest suck

[FaerieLord]

I never said you talk loudly, now did I?

Do you think long posts are helpful or harmful to town?

[FaerieLord]

@Saber: Yeah I was addressing your earlier posts. Trend changed

Let me tell you what I think about long posts.

I think they're shit, especially if they're full of quotes, and especially if they're rebuttals.
But even if it's an ISO, I think it's shit
Even if it is a PBPA analysis, I think it's shit.

Go back to Snow White's long ass post. See how many people said "thoroughly read" and how many people used "skimmed" afterwards

I can basically write a load of shit, and nobody will say anything. Nobody really reads it. Everyone just tells their brain to stop working and skip it.

So they're not protown.

[FaerieLord]

I can do that.

[FaerieLord]

What?

Your posts have basically been back and forths on things we have already read
Or else, they were completely trivial questions

Point in case: Post 160

1: Don't make any attempt to do anything about it.

2: Just complains about it, without even giving feedback.

3: You aren't helping this game progress either.

Where you said the same thing three times. Were you trying to make your case seem more legit by adding more points?

Also,

Can everybody link their most recent town and scum games please? Thanks.

No. Search for yourself if you care that much, but I doubt games that far back can be used as meta towards me.

@Almightybob: Stop telling people how the correct way to play is. Believe it or not, you can play without posting long blocks of text

[FaerieLord]

FaerieLord, why do you feel like I am protecting Lowell in post 81?

Because you are?

Do you not like the explanation I have already given (that I was more interested in Wickedestjr's misread than I was in the slip Wickedestjr supposedly found)?

No I wasn't, on account of it was a deflective defense not an argumentative one

Death note, are you happy with the explanation you just gave in your last post, or are you just trying to put something together to make them stop badgering you? If it's the latter, do you think following popular opinion is pro-town?

[FaerieLord]

So what kind of answer do you expect?

I asked Wickedestjr because I wanted to. I wanted to because I was more interested in Wickedestjr's misread than I was in the slip. Better?

No, but I don't like rebutting back and forth, especially when I'm not going to follow up on it.

[FaerieLord]

FoS: FaerieLord

I've been waiting for his opinion on who's scum, but he has not yet given any. I find that very scummy.

Ok.

[FaerieLord]

FaerieLord - That's all you have to say?

Yes.

Here, I'll say something else too.

Vote: Snow White

I don't think she's the scummiest to be honest, but she's scummy and deadline is approaching and since we should be lynching, she's the more solid choice from the three.

[FaerieLord]

Oh joys. Yah. I figured this close to the deadline i was gonna have to claim but i had hoped people were coming around so basically stalling in the hope someone else might slip.

For some reason I just can't see this coming from a townie.

BTW. im aware there is likely one other cop out there as my sanity is not assured.

Why did you feel the need to say this? Surely if there was another cop, they would have been told the same. Also, this seems to contradict the role pm on the first page.

Regarding first: It's mostly the wording. "Someone else might slip." This is implying that she has previously slipped.

Regarding second: Quoting from first page - "You sanity is not confirmed."

[FaerieLord]

1: Yes
2: Which contradiction then? I thought you were pointing out the sanity part.

[FaerieLord]

I'm not unvoting the claimed cop because I can't see either sposh or BC being scum to be honest. I'm just seeing them both as lazy.

Let's do this for now

Unvote, Vote: xReckonerx

Mostly just a place holder vote, nobody will be lynching reckoner, and I've already said I find him town. This is just a placeholder until I can make up my mind

@Faerielord if i have not somehow messed up how have i got here?

Huh?

[FaerieLord]

It's not the thought Reckoner. It's the wording

"someone else might slip"

Implying, she already slipped.

[FaerieLord]

No.

Slip implies saying something you are not to say. How can someone that did not commit murder slip in the murder case? He has nothing to slip on.

[FaerieLord]

Do you mean snow white?

[FaerieLord]

i changed my mind

unvote;vote:BC

Now really?

Honestly, I was going to just waltz in and type

Unvote, Vote BC

and leave it at that, but the last few posts make me really want to vote for Snow White, because her last few posts have been horrible.

It's pretty blatantly obvious that SW is thinking "So if he flips to be town, they'll lynch me...shit!"

So

Unvote, Vote SW

[FaerieLord]

Ehh, either way. They're both die-ing. It's a matter of who will die first.

So

Vote: BloodCovenant

[FaerieLord]

Ugh @ post548.

So basically, the reason you don't want BC lynched is because you're scared that you're after him?

[FaerieLord]

I've been saying all along that I'd have preferred a Snow White lynch, but I lynched BC as I thought he'd flip town, so I'd get my choice for the lynch tomorrow

Apparently not, and I was wrong. I'm still not convinced Snow White is town, but let's wait for her results.

[FaerieLord]

I'd lynch the town cop if it meant that I'd lynch a scum with him

Without a doubt.

[FaerieLord]

@Faeirlord. You sound as if your honestly expecting results with a potential roleblocker in the house do you seriously think i would get results? Just the way you've phrased that doesnt sit well with me. Im on tone with Sanjay on this, you'd sacrafice the cop Day1 for a potential lynch on someone else the next day? What do you think of my claim since BC flipped Godfather? Why is it you are so skeptial and is there anything in particular you would like me to answer to.

Expecting results from a cop? You're kidding!

Also, yes, I'd happily sacrifice a potentially insane, possibly one-shot cop to lynch scum. Any bloody day.

I'm happier with your claim, hence why I didn't vote you (yet). Also, I am skeptical of you as I was pretty darn sure you were scum until yesterday, hence why I pushed for your lynch. I wouldn't go as far as saying that you're town now, especially with the no results part.

Here's a question. Did it say you're blocked, did the mod say no result or did you not use your ability. "No result" is pretty vague.

[FaerieLord]

I already explained, SW, that I temporarely removed him from my potential-scum-list since BC was voting him. Also, I don't like how FL immediately assumes the idea of SW being roleblocked is absolutely absurd... and, hmm, interesting that he chooses to attack SW on that front right off the bat.

How is it interesting that I'm attacking SW? I've been doing it throughout.

Also, I didn't say there couldn't be a role blocker but she made it seem like a big deal that I was expecting a result of some sort from her.
Hence my cynical comment.

Even "I was blocked" is a result. Saying nothing though, is not a result.

@Saber. I said i got no results. This being because i delibrately took no action last night.

Then why did you say no result? Why didn't you say "I didn't use my ability"?

Also, I don't get your last traitor theory

[FaerieLord]

Given that Mufasa just up and claimed when there wasn't really much need to and no-one was asking him to, I'm more likely to believe it. So I suggest we lynch MrSuave, and if he flips Town, lynch Mufasa.

That's actually a pretty good catch.

Same question to FaerieLord.

I don't really care all that much for the setup.
Especially in a bastard game, and the fact that the traitor cannot communicate with mafia in any way, making him about as dangerous as a survivor at this point.

The traitor is something we should be worrying about later in the game.
Right now, we should go for any potential scum roles. Such as the redirector.

Traitor tells might not be as important because we can't be sure there even is a traitor. But if there is a traitor the town has to lynch them to win, so they ARE important

Why are you so sure there is a traitor? You're choosing words like "the traitor"

[FaerieLord]

Why are you so sure there is a traitor?

I'm asking this because of your choice of language. "The traitor" indicates that there is one, which isn't knowledge anyone should have.

Also, why are you so keen on finding the traitor over the rest of the scum?

[FaerieLord]

@FaerieLord.

Where has Sanjay explicitly said "the traitor". He has not to my recollection said "the traitor" instead he has said "if there is a traitor then X,Y &Z".

It sounds as though your twisting Sanjay's words considering that Reck had asked what were Sanjay's ideas on the subject of a traitor.

See the post below you. Try to recollect better before you say I'm twisting
(On a different note, huzzah for spelling my name right )

@Sanjay. Yes.
And the fact that you seem to have an unhealthy obsession with getting the traitor

[FaerieLord]

drunk epiphanies ftw!

what was The point of Really showing us this, exactly? Are you trying to appear townie? I think you are just trying to appear townie without being pro-town. Tell me: do you think this is really gonna solve anything? OR what? please, let me know... im dying to hear.

Of this?
I think you were drunk?
And I think it's a rather horrible point considering we're waiting on these people to possibly CC. And considering we can prod these people, it actually seems like a pretty legit post.

[FaerieLord]

V/LA until Sunday Afternoon CET. I'll be on vacation

[FaerieLord]

Actually, could the two of you explain your reads on me? That would be solid.

No (if I had a scum read, I'd just vote)

Either way, I agree

Vote Mr. Suave

(Also, back from V/LA)

[FaerieLord]

Unvote, vote almightybob

I think Sanjay is actually right about this.

[FaerieLord]

I'm also very curious to hear about FL's vote on AlmightyBob. Please, FL. Enlighten us.

It's a placement vote. Almighty bob is towniest to me, so I'm placing it on him as a place holder

[FaerieLord]

Am I still voting Mufasa?

Unvote.

I want to hear what FaerieLord has to say.

Regarding what?

@Manho

Your case on reckoner is terrible.
Also, why do you ask if you should give a case?

[FaerieLord]

Again, I explained that the vote is simply a placeholder vote.

Or was it the second sentence?

[FaerieLord]

What's odd about it?

[FaerieLord]

FaerieLord, did you ever clarify what posts of mine you saw that showed either:

1) An inappropriate desire to get the traitor lynched (I have no idea what this would even be a tell for, by the way).
2) Evidence of me being certain that there was a traitor.

1) Err, from posts 53-74 in isolation there are 18 instances of the word traitor in your posts. Comparing with mine, they are focused in 22-25, all directed at you
2) You pointed this out yourself when you argued with me

[FaerieLord]

Hah, finally, someone found a good break I missed.

Unvote, Vote: Snow White

[FaerieLord]

This bothers me.

FL has done this a couple of times: kept pretty quiet and not contributed much, then reared his head to slap a vote down on a wagon that looks like it might have a bit of momentum.

I'm going back to reread him and see if there's a case to be made.

I've been saying I want SW dead for ages now.
I believe I said that I was never convinced

Let's explain each of your bw votes

1: Deadline was approaching, I found SW scummiest of the three. I voted for her. I don't think you can argue that I'd have enough time to build momentum on any other case when those three leads were pretty sold
2: Lynch > No Lynch. I didn't want the BC lynch, but I'd happily lynch a cop to lynch SW the next day. I was wrong about BC being a cop, to this I admitted
3: I misunderstood the redirector role, like what...9 other people?
4: See what I've been reiterating about thinking SW is scum

They're hardly unexplained. I just didn't bother spoonfeeding

Oh, and it should be noted that in the second one in that list, he was pretty keen to stick with SW - right until the last minute, when it was very obvious that nobody other than BC was dying D1.

Yes, because I thought SW was scum. Then I realized that I'd get to lynch her day 2 for a pretty nice price.
Day 1 would've been better, but that wasn't going to happen now was it?

[FaerieLord]

Yes, you have. I don't think I've seen you give any good reasons though, other than "I'm unconvinced".
I was fairly happy that SW was Town until dramonic highlighted that she didn't seem to know she had to predict her results. Since this is clearly the first time you've realised it too, I don't see your basis for wanting her dead all this time. I've been looking for any case in your posts, and all I see is stuff like "I was pretty sure SW was scum on D1" but with hardly any reasons.

If you're looking for reasons then give up on those.
The reasons are simply character tells and gut. They're not mistakes (like the one dramonic pointed out)
Reasons, that aren't slips, only help scum adapt their playstyle to stop looking scummy

I'll answer the questions

1. Wickedjster, followed by Sanjay at that point (actually there was lowell before both, but then I read I'd be replacing lowell as I was doing my reread)
2. It was never bussing. How many times do I have to say that I only lynched BC to lynch SW the next day?
3. Yeah, pity you were the only one that got it.

Regarding current affair, I'd still rather wait to see Sposh answer to this.

[FaerieLord]

The problem with this is it gives you impunity to vote for whoever you like, whenever you like, and never justify it. All you have to say is "I don't give reasons, that only helps the scum adapt".

Anyone can do this, reasons or not. Some just hide it behind walls of text.

This is strange. I thought Wicked and Sanjay were both pretty pro-Town on D1. I can't remember exactly when you replaced in though, so perhaps circumstances were different at the point in time. Still, odd.

I only thought three peeps were pro town, which I still hold to.

[FaerieLord]

I'm gonna hammer again then. I seem to find this rather fun :3

Vote: Sposh

[FaerieLord]

That was quick.
Can't say I don't like it.

[FaerieLord]

FaerieLord, is there a reason why you weren't on the Snow White wagon? You seemed quite ready to lynch Snow White the day before, and AlmightyBob flipping cop certainly shouldn't have deterred you.

It was one of the quickest wagons I'd ever seen. Had I the time to vote, I would've.

Also, rereading and all. I'll answer you soon manho

[FaerieLord]

Were you aware of the wagon and waiting to vote?

No, I was just unaware. By the time I read the thread, voting had happened

@Manho. Reread the votes in context. Both the votes for Sposh and BC were for one reason.
To lynch SW the next day. Granted I was wrong about SW, but I never pushed either of those wagons/

as i know i'm not the scum, FL is the scum or (dramonic, santos, (cookie/sanjay) are all scum). vote: FL

How did you get to that conclusion? I honestly cannot follow your logic

[FaerieLord]

assume that there exist a scum in each mislynch wagon, and from that assumption, i deduce that FL is the scum or (dramonic, santos, (cookie/sanjay) are all scum). i vote you as you have the highest chance to be the scum.

That is such a horrible assumption. There could exist one or two.
That's like me saying "I can assume that there are scum amongst us, and from that assumption I shall vote: x"

You're just stretching to try and find a reason to vote for someone to seem opinionated

i'll read the exact vote in context when i have time. but you are now saying that you hammer others to get SW lynched? there is no logic in it

Said the guy that came up with that beautiful assumption.
Of course it makes sense
Lynch a town to get a scum tomorrow
1 scum > 1 town
It's easy percentages

[FaerieLord]

read the post where i voted you. i've stated clearly the flow of the deduction.
there is scum in the set {FL, dramonic}
there is scum in the set {FL, santos}
there is scum in the set {FL, cookie, sanjay}
and there is scum in the set {Sanjay, MrSuave, Santos, dramonic}
if you(FL) is not the scum, then dramonic, santos, and (cookie or sanjay) had to be the 3 scums, which is really unlikely.
so i voted you.

Yes, but again. You're assuming a scum per wagon.
That's a big assumption.

In addition, even if an assumption is true, that doesn't mean it's built on correct premises. For example, I'm going to assume there is scum in the game. Therefore, I'll vote: x. My assumption is correct, but that does not mean that its a solid argument.

Also, I'm pretty sure we have by now concluded that there aren't 5 scums, due to the nature of the PMs. Yet you are assuming 5 scums BC, reckoner, dramonic, santos and {cookie or sanjay}. So obviously, it's really unlikely. It's pretty much false. Only two of those could be scum simultaneously.

i'll read the exact vote in context when i have time. but you are now saying that you hammer others to get SW lynched? there is no logic in it

Also, again you have obviously not yet seen the nature of the votes on BC and Sposh. Both were hammers in order to get to next day and lynch SW, so arguing that I was on the wagon is a pretty horrible argument.

but why not try to lynch the scum first?

Because the rest wanted to lynch the other first and it's a majority rule to lynch?

[FaerieLord]

forgot that BC is scum and we have two left. so we can't have those 3 all scum, and so you must be scum. my argument is valid and your example is invalid. and if you find my argument invalid, please give solid reasons instead of making irrelevance counter example.

So you now change from "really unlikely" to "can't have those 3 all scum"

And you're still assuming. That's a solid reason

if the people voting cannot make a lynch, it is not majority. note that we need more than half of the whole town to get someone lynched.

Yeah, simple maths does not elude me.
The lynch would have still happened. I just sped it up.
I gave reasons, you just seem to skim by them
again
and again
and again

i don't know the correct defination of "wagon", but you are among the people voting SW, BC... and my assumption is about who is voting but not who is on the wagon. and obviously you were voting those people.

You know what...screw this.
I'm bored repeating.

Enjoy your vote

[FaerieLord]

an argument is valid if the premises(assumption) imply the conclusion, and there is no counter example for the premises to be true while the conclusion is false. "you're still assuming" is not a solid reason for proving my arugment is false. also, "you're still assuming" is not a solid reason to prove my assumption is unlikely, maybe you need some solid data to prove my assumption false.

A wait, so if I argue "Santa Claus exists because working elves exist." There is no counter example, nobody can say in certainty that I've never seen working elves, so therefore Santa Claus is real. Good job.

Also, I cannot provide solid data against guesses. That's like asking me to provide solid data of the above elves.

Either way, to answer Santos.
Do you people seriously not see the context of my hammer? Can you simply read the posts above the hammers? BC was to lynch him to get to SW. I hammered Sposh too again to get to SW the next day. The only reason I wasn't on the SW wagon was because I didn't make it on time. I think I've been constantly against SW.

Also, I'm not saying manho is scum, i'm just saying that the argument is complete bullocks. When you base something on false or unsure deductions, you cannot assume a correct answer.

Let's put this in simple maths

x+7 = 12 or 13
Therefore x = 6, since it is 13.

Yet it could be 12, so x = 5.
Manho is ignoring this hypothetical 5, just to justify a hunch.

[FaerieLord]

@Santos. To be particularly honest I haven't been giving anyone enough attention throughout the game as I was fixed on SW. I'm trying to free some time to reread this game.

[FaerieLord]

I have answered it, I think.
Not a mason.

Also,

Vote: Santos

Just to remove my self vote.

[FaerieLord]

@Sanjay

"Solid choice from the three" refers to the three people that had a bandwagon on them.
I don't switch to anyone else because the deadline was approaching, I wanted a lynch and at that point it was between Snow White and BC, and I opted to believe BC. Thus my vote stayed in place

@manho
So now I'm "more-or-less neutral"?

[FaerieLord]

woah woah waoh... what's with the sudden BW on manho. I'm not against it, I just want to know why it's happening. the only catalyst I see for this is...

So are you saying he is, or are you just being non commital?

Also, V/LA access until friday on account of I barely have time to check the computer, let alone post.

[FaerieLord]

FL, did you miss my question about why you decided to use Santos as a placeholder vote?

Because he was one of the few who had no votes
So I voted him

Voting for obv. town for reasons isn't better than voting for possible scum on gut, Santos.

That's true

Unvote, Vote: Manho

Yeah, where is that guy?

Read my posts tyvm, I announced V/LA. Had school elections = I didn't get to sleep at home for an entire week.

and the wagon finally start after i unvote him.

So you were looking for bw targets?

[FaerieLord]

I find the power of "Choo, Choo" compelling :3