Star Wars Mafia (Game Over)

[Scott Brosius]

Vote: hp [leaves]

That's annoying to type out.

Who else is happy we are ignoring Eps 1-3?

[Scott Brosius]

I'm NOT happy that we're ignoring 1-3.

vote: Scott Brosius

for suggesting it.

There's always one. DID YOU LIKE DARTH MAUL AND HIS COOL LIGHTSABER?

[Scott Brosius]

I am convinced that Episode 1 was created simply to make a stupid racing video game.

[Scott Brosius]

Here, will catch up.

[Scott Brosius]

Why is everyone claiming? Why did you claim Kast? Why are you revealing who you want to kill?

[Scott Brosius]

Here, will catch up.

Why is everyone claiming? Why did you claim Kast? Why are you revealing who you want to kill?

It took you one day to catch up and post this?

Not much has happened besides the weird claims.

[Scott Brosius]

----

@ hp [leaves]

: How is any mason claim easily verifiable? Especially in this: a totally themed, flavored game. How do we know there aren't multiple mafia teams, multiple mason teams, etc? 2HC and Wolf could easily be a scum duo just trying to screw with our minds.

And if they are lying scum, the situation with them will probably resolve itself anyway.

You are rolefishing to the extreme trying to get a better idea of the setup. This also applies to ToonFighter, however you jumped on the idea afterward which makes it worse.

Unvote
Vote: ReaperCharlie

[Scott Brosius]

Again, I already explicitly stated that I will shoot today and gave my reasons. If people want some input in who I shoot, then speak up with your reasons. If I don't hear anything good, I'm gonna shoot hp. You guys have something like 7-8 hours to speak up. If I hear something interesting or convincing, then I may extend this time,

otherwise I'm shooting tonight.

I assume you are talking about RL time, unless you forgot your claim of Day Vig

[Scott Brosius]

Okay, caught up now. Reck, you need to calm your storm. The only other time I've seen you this jumpy and anxious has been in Halo where we were scum together. Wonder what that could mean here? Hmmm....

Either way, I'd like to throw my two cents in here. Scott Brosius in iso has as many posts as me, and has contributed even less. A rolefishing accusation is the only scumhunting he's done so far, and it's an easy claim for scum to make.

Unvote, Vote: Scott Brosius

Uses history to support Reck being scum, but votes elsewhere.

Hmmm....

[Scott Brosius]

Okay, caught up now. Reck, you need to calm your storm. The only other time I've seen you this jumpy and anxious has been in Halo where we were scum together. Wonder what that could mean here? Hmmm....

Either way, I'd like to throw my two cents in here. Scott Brosius in iso has as many posts as me, and has contributed even less. A rolefishing accusation is the only scumhunting he's done so far, and it's an easy claim for scum to make.

Unvote, Vote: Scott Brosius

Uses history to support Reck being scum, but votes elsewhere.

Hmmm....

To explain, he calls out Reck for behavior similar to when he was scum in another game, but then votes me for having contributed less (lol) than him. This could be standard scum-distancing, chastising a player yet voting another.

[Scott Brosius]

Vote: hp[leaves]

Something clearly fishy about his survival. I doubt the mod is just playing the game along. The most likely situation is immunity of some kind (whether only can be killed via lynch, immune to day-kills)

[Scott Brosius]

This is the weakest defense I have ever seen, and yet you don't even back it up with your vote. Sorry but that seems particularly scummy to me.

Unvote, Vote: Scott Brosius

Why are you apologizing as you vote? It's like you don't believe what you are saying.

[Scott Brosius]

Uhhh, really? You're willing to lynch someone because the

flavor

doesn't quite work out in your head? This is a bullshit reason to jump on the wagon - reeks of paranoid scum who just wants a reason to lynch someone.

Unvote; Vote: wolf

And this seems like a BS attempt to stall this wagon. Wolf is claimed mason, there is no point going after him today.

[Scott Brosius]

Uhhh, really? You're willing to lynch someone because the

flavor

doesn't quite work out in your head? This is a bullshit reason to jump on the wagon - reeks of paranoid scum who just wants a reason to lynch someone.

Unvote; Vote: wolf

And this seems like a BS attempt to stall this wagon. Wolf is claimed mason, there is no point going after him today.

I stand corrected about wagon stalling, thought you were on the hp wagon.

[Scott Brosius]

v/la few days

[Scott Brosius]

Vote: Wreck Star

In iso, you read as even scummier than normal. Trust me on this one.

You are being as useless as D1.

Vote: bv310

In terms of setup, I agree with farside about the 2 kills more likely being SK/scum rather than 2 scum teams.

Can we stop with these soft claims? If you are a role and feel its time to claim, then claim.

[Scott Brosius]

*ringring* Hi kettle, it's the pot. You're black. *click*

Do you believe Cry's Claim? Why/why not? What are your thoughts regarding his choice {and thought process} for investigation? What do you think of his unsolicated result on farside? How about his setup speculation? What about Slicey's question regarding your position on the wagon yesterday?

Granted my participation has not been stellar, but certainly better than bv.

D1 we received a vote on me for lack of participation (more pot calling kettle black) then a switch to hp.

D2 we receive a vote for Wreck and a refusal to back it up.

That is it for him.

I voted hp since he was clearly bulletproof after Kast shot him.

The Cry claim could be an attempt to isolate farside for himself to get the stun grenade. I do not think it's worth pursuing today for a lynch (either farside or CMAR)

@RP:

To me, finding scum is more important than finding the setup/flavor. I find it more of a distraction than anything.

Can we stop with these soft claims? If you are a role and feel its time to claim, then claim.

This is definitely role-fishing. I was criticized for doing this earlier but mine was to find out how Kast's role could be utilized to help us out, and to keep an (at that time) possibly innocent HP from getting dayvig'd. But this is different. This is definitely the scummy type of role-fishing.


Your logic totally seems like scumlogic, and I think you were trying to launch the bv310 wagon in a hurry before attention gets put on you or your scumchums.

Vote: Scott Brosius

We just had a very convenient soft-claim about farside being town who just happened to have a bounty placed on him. You don't want to know more about CMAR's role who just happened to investigate someone he thought was town who has the bounty?

[Scott Brosius]

The Cry claim could be an attempt to isolate farside for himself to get the stun grenade. I do not think it's worth pursuing today for a lynch (either farside or CMAR)

How in the hell would I get the stun grenade by posting my results?

If you are not what you claim, it is very easy. Pretend you have a town result on farside and kill at night.

[Scott Brosius]

Now Reck placed the vote on bv and not myself, for everyone voting for a lurker, why are you voting for that person vice people like...

DragonsofSummer
VRK
Toon Fighter
Scott

?

I feel like the others are just not posting (as opposed to actual lurking), while bv is attempting to play. The latter is more interesting/scummy as it cannot just be blamed on v/la or whatever. Also his random ISO on you revealing scum without explanation and then his disappearance don't sit well with me.

The idea to lynch CMAR is bad. If we are doing it because even if we lynch CMAR and he flips town, we then have a confirmed townie in farside, given the bounty, I do not see farside living through the night. So then we basically waste a lynch.

[Scott Brosius]

Yes, obviously was not referring to myself.

[Scott Brosius]

Let me clarify, my participation was less than stellar D1 I will acknowledge, but another game I was in just ended so I have been participating more. I don't think it's fair that I get lumped in with people who have posted 4 times.

[Scott Brosius]

Ugh I always hate voting Dana as someone previously mentioned because he is always scummy regardless of role.

[Scott Brosius]

Yep. I noticed that too. If either the Scott or dana bandwagon takes off, and one of them flips scum, we should lynch the other the following day - hopefully killing two birds with one stone.

Setting up tomorrow's lynches doesn't sit well with me. Seems like scum-planning more than anything.

As for my defense of dana, I am simply saying (as someone else said as well) I offered that in my experience, dana always acts very scummy regardless of role.

[Scott Brosius]

I really don't see bv lying. I think hypothesizing on ridiculous gambits is just distracting and gets away from scum-hunting.

This post to me seems very fitting if there are 2 scum groups, and Wreck is worried about the other scum group getting a leg up. He seems awfully worried about a SOG fakeclaim.

What?

The point was if I flip scum, and it comes back on SOG, he could be like "oh, I'm XXX power role, I wanted to stay hidden yesterday". If SOG gets dayvigged and flips VT, I'm auto-liar. If he flips scum, it means I wasn't lying. If he flips a power role, it's also PROBABLY means I wasn't lying.

I'm convinced there's either a framer or a bus driver.

@ooba- What Star Wars character would be tracker scum?

RC- Your thoughts on every player are not helpful. Your only town reads are confirmed claimed players, and you are suspicious of everyone else.

Given that I seriously doubt bv is lying, I am placing my vote with his result. Vigging either of them will provide a similar amount of information I feel.

Unvote
Vote: Wreck Star

[Scott Brosius]

Thank you bv, this clears so much for me.

The SOG bounty is interesting. Scum are definitely placing the bounty with Greedo flipping scum. Would scum place a bounty on there own scummate? I doubt it. If there are two scum teams, SOG is definitely in one. If there is one, I highly doubt there is. Right now, I'm thinking two scum teams, and thus:

Vote: semioldguy

I don't understand the dana suspicion at all. He's one of my stronger town reads IMHO.

Well, you could be in Greedo's team, and by posting it you are trying to get people to kill the player you suspect. I don't like that play one bit.

vote: Slicey

You wrote this post as if you know there are two scum groups. Also I don't like your vote on him based on an unlikely scenario. It's a really weak reason for a vote. Would you vote anyone that votes SOG? Because the same scenario according to you would apply to anyone voting him.

You also had the brilliant idea of lynching CMAR when he claimed yesterday which was ridiculously bad

Vote: Toon Fighter

I don't see how I'm defending Wreck in 490. bv had been lurky/useless then randomly placed a vote citing iso without details.

I asked for people to stop softclaiming in 490. I fail to see how that is rolefishing.

Not a fan of d3x's vote, no substance just some ramblings about Kast who said he doesn't have a second shot.

[Scott Brosius]

Looking back at RC is our best bet to find more scum since he was so chatty and was never in danger of being lynched. My suspicions of ToonFighter and d3x stand.

[Scott Brosius]

For the moment, I'm sticking with my vote from yesterday. ToonFighter at deadline has had votes on, nobody, nobody, and Slicey. He has been weak on participation and certainly not helpful to the town.

Vote: Toon Fighter

[Scott Brosius]

Scumlist:

semioldguy

- very likely scum (behavior)

Wreck Star

- very likely scum - claimed investigation results

Scott Brosius

- very likely scum (behavior)

Suspicious of:

d3x - Seems very wily, posts in spurts but lays low when things flare up. Possible scum.
Toon Fighter - Seems like he's lurking. Possible scum.
danakillsu - Tried too hard to crucify CMAR a few pages ago. Possible scum.
Slicey - Seems surprisingly like me, eager to contribute and scumhunt. Getting weird vibes though, don't know why.
FC Groningen - Still suspicious of him from Day one. Has gotten very quiet, possibly to avoid another wagon.

Neutral read:

ooba - Seems well-intentioned enough, and seems townish to me.
Dragon Phoenix - Ditto ooba, but needs to post more.

Near-confirmed (claimed) town:

farside22

- shows as townie by claimed investigation results (though some things she's done have really rubbed me the wrong way)

Kast

- claimed town, known dayvig ability

CryMeARiver

- claimed townie, claimed investigation results

bv310

- claimed townie, claimed investigation results

Town:

wolframnhart

Too Inactive to read:

Vel-Rahn Koon
AlmasterGM
DragonsofSummer

Just quoting this for easier reference.

[Scott Brosius]

That's a pretty convenient return to the game ToonFighter. Absolutely no scum hunting, just defending attacks against him.

[Scott Brosius]

Well, I was attacked, can't I defend myself? I will scumhunt in the future.

You can, it's just been your only participation. You only seem willing to participate when you are being attacked.

[Scott Brosius]

Dana always comes off pretty scummy in my experience.

[Scott Brosius]

Okay, just trying to see where you're coming from.

Not really sure who the last member is of the Jabba mafia, but I am pretty sure that both TF and Scott are in Imperial Mafia. I definitely don't think it's dana though.

I don't see how you are making this connection. I was the first on TF today and was the only one calling him out yesterday.

[Scott Brosius]

got prodded, posting

I am inclined to believe d3x's claim. He does seem frustrated with all the votes on him, but I would be too in his case. His character is oddly minor, so it may be a fakeclaim, but, as mine is also very minor, I can believe it.

dana seems odd. He slowly puts pressure on d3x to get his claim, saying that his claim is better if it comes at L-2. That isn't scummy per se, but it can be somewhat suspicous. Seeing as I believe d3x's claim and don't want to be accused of NOT bandwagoning today, I shall

unvote, vote: dana

Yawn, fencesitting and openly admitting to not wanting to appear scummy.

[Scott Brosius]

See, I think bv should investigate you d3x, not dana. It seems you are pushing the dana investigation pretty hard....too hard perhaps.

I got this impression as well.

[Scott Brosius]

Not necessarily. He had plenty of time, there was no reason to post 1061, so he could simply check. If anything, I would expect scum to be more careful.

If this is not a mod error (I once misspelled the name of a role in one of my games, although it was a small error - it got the recipient lynched) it IS extremely sloppy play one way or the other.

I agree with this. I think there are some opportunistic scum on this wagon and don't like it at all. Cases are built all day and someone replaces in and is going to get lynched in 1.5 pages. Seems like BOTH scum groups are jumping on this one.

[Scott Brosius]

So, I attempted to investigate d3x last night, and got a result of "you are unable to determine his alignment". I gather from this that he is the Emperor, and as such needs to be lynched. I'll elaborate later, when I'm not on an iPod.

vote: d3x

Isn't it possible you just got roleblocked? Although I'm not sure why you haven't been roleblocked on other days if a scum group has that capability.

[Scott Brosius]

Sigh, more softclaims. You may as well claim now.

[Scott Brosius]

Given the kind of townies that have been flipping, I am skeptical about d3x's claim. The townies have been pilots or directly part of the alliance. Ewoks although helpful in ROTJ, are not really part of the alliance. It seems like a weaker fakeclaim, especially with the kind of characters that have flipped alliance the past 2 lynches. Here is a list of the townies or townies who have limited PR.

Madine- officer for the alliance
Janson- alliance pilot
Willard- officer for the alliance
Porkins- alliance pilot

Unconfirmed
Klivian- alliance pilot
Darklighter- alliance pilot


So it seems we have a theme for the alliance VTs. Ewok claim does not fit in with this.

If people want me to claim I will.

Vote: d3x

[Scott Brosius]

Updated List:

ooba
Dragon Phoenix
Slicey
LynchMePls

d3x - claimed an ewok of all things! Wicket.
vezopiraka - claimed Derek Klivian. VT.
danakillsu - claimed Biggs Darklighter, Alliance Pilot (One-Shot Busdriver)

If D3x flips empire, there have been a few people who have been distancing from d3x. If he flips empire, dana has determined to be good and was on d3x for days. DP has also been frequently on the d3x wagons. That leaves Slicey, LMP, ooba, KTB. KTB was on the earlier d3x wagons, not as of late. So I will narrow it down to ooba, LMP, Slicey.

Slicey- Has defended d3x, never placed a vote on him. Has only mentioned him twice, once to mention he feels he is town, another to say he is not planning on voting d3x or dana (ends up voting dana later on)

LMP- Introduced the pilot/leader case, but doesn't put a vote on d3x. Puts a vote on him earlier in the game, yet admits he is willing to unvote to prolong a day.

ooba-

While I agree with d3x = scum, I think you agree that his interactions ala the SoG lynch make it more likely for him to be empire scum. Assuming at least 3-3, our best move is to hunt for the remaining Jabba scum right?

I really don't like this post. First he claims that d3x=scum, but has never voted for d3x. Also the selective scum-hunting suggestion in that post is peculiar, especially if d3x flips empire. Based on this, I think ooba is the most likely candidate to to d3x's partner.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Toon Fighter

(8) - Scott Brosius, Slicey, LynchMePls, Kast, ooba, vezopiraka, d3x, BlazezRb

BlazezRb

(7) - bv310, Kthxbye, LynchMePls, wolframnhart, ooba, vezopiraka, d3x

Those are the past 2 lynches of townies. LMP, vezo, d3x, ooba have been on both.

LMP- Pretty early on both lynches, neutral read
vezo-Lateish on both lynches, but I believe his strange claim
d3x- Put TF at L-1 and hammered Blaze. Both townies.
ooba- Middle-late of both wagons, cause for concern.

Actually, its pretty weird that the end of the wagons line up perfectly both days in the same order.

@d3x- Honestly the droids only boost the theory. It just adds more very very obvious alliance members that are included in this game, whereas the ewoks are not. I'm not quite sure how I'm stretching the truth.

Taking everything into consideration, I am still fine with my vote, but ooba is my second choice to lynch today.

[Scott Brosius]

Are we actually calling for a mass claim? What is the deal here? I'm not claiming just based on dana's request.

[Scott Brosius]

I am Ackbar, VT. I am good at detecting tarps.

[Scott Brosius]

Yeah, with all the name claims now, d3x's seems very off. What's the flavor for Wickett? BTW, Kthx, Chewy was a fakeclaim used by Wreck Star.

I don't like DP's claim, for obvious reasons. I really think we should lynch him or Vezo today.

So his claim seems "very off" but you want to lynch 2 other people today.

If d3x flips empire, Slicey seems likely to be his partner.

[Scott Brosius]

Alright folks, here's what I've been thinking.

d3x claimed way early when he was at L-1. Assuming there are 3 scum/anti-town players left, they would have all claimed very recently. Discussion about d3x's claim being 'off' happened BEFORE the mass name claim. If I were scum, and d3x was indeed town, with all the debate surrounding d3x's claim, I sure as hell would claim a pilot or an officer of the republic. This would bring even more heat on the d3x claim. My suggestion for today would be to lynch DP. If he flips scum, then it lends some credit to my theory on this. If he flips what he claimed however, then I'd be all for a d3x lynch tomorrow. This is part WIFOM, I know, but it's a logical move for scum.

This is not really part WIFOM, it's fully WIFOM. We most likely have a botched claim. Is it possible that some pilots/alliance fighters are fake claiming? Yes. But it is clear that the ewok does not fit in with the flavor of this game as at least most if not all of the VT/minor PR roles are going to be true. There aren't that many scum left that they could create this alliance pilot/fighter theme.

Tons of AtE in d3x's recent posts, much more than the last time he was at L-2 when he claimed. Not really sure what to make of it.

Let's see, I've been calling d3x town almost this entire game, and I really haven't seen him do anything scummy. His name claim seems a bit off. To me, that's not enough justification for a lynch, compared to DP and Vezo.

But what besides Vezo's claim is scummy? If it is just his claim, why are you for a vezo lynch yet not a d3x lynch? Also second ooba's request for your "knowledge" of his claim.

[Scott Brosius]

GD it all. The only part of your last post that makes me want more discussion is the people on your wagon.....None of whom I'd call town and in fact many of whom I've called scum.

Unvote

till others get a chance to weigh in. I'd also like to hear ooba's promised post before we lynch today.

I don't get this. As I've said before, it shouldn't matter much who's on the wagon. Slicey's town, you're town, I've been confirmed town, and I believe d3x is Scum mafia. Why does it matter if Lynchmepls is also on the wagon? Just because some suspicious people are on the wagon, you're not going to lynch someone who almost everything else against them? As far as hearing ooba's post, fine, but I expect to see you back on the wagon if he says nothing important about DP, because I'm getting tired of the cold feet. Just remember, Scum mafia wants Empire mafia lynched just as much as town does, so let's take advantage of that instead of having misgivings about it.

Wait why is Slicey town? Also nobody is confirmed until they flip.

[Scott Brosius]

Does anyone need MORE town flips that shows that d3x's claim does not fit with this flavor? My secondary choices today would be Slicey or LMP. Just some initial thoughts, I need to look at the past few days again.

vote: d3x

We got really lucky with ooba. I guess there are still 2 scum groups lurking with the 2 kills.

[Scott Brosius]

Does anyone need MORE town flips that shows that d3x's claim does not fit with this flavor?

I can't wait for PostGame...

Why? In the slim chance you are an e-wok, are you really that excited to rub it in my face that I was wrong? Really pro-town behavior.

I assume we should discredit ooba's fakeclaim theory given his flip.

[Scott Brosius]

@Gut/Suspicion/Whatever-
Ooba flipping Tarkin as an "Imperial Interrogator" once again rings all kinds of bells that Dana's conviction that Tarkin was an Interrogator responsible for Jabba's death by Torture is based on private information.

WIFOM ahead but why as emperor would dana give everyone else (especially given 2 scum groups) a hint about the Empire's setup.

To clarify my ooba comment above, it's possible (and would make more sense) that he made up his own fakeclaim to go along with the flavor. So anything he said about fakeclaims could have no basis at all.

[Scott Brosius]

@Scott- What is the case against me? That my RoleName doesn't fit some theme that instantly makes me Scum? How the hell am I supposed to defend against that when I am telling the truth? Multiple cases have been built against me and I've responded to them {aside from ImpScumooba's which was really flippy and relied heavily on connections to players that are alive}. Your reaction is to thus Vote me based off of my RoleName while your contribution has been all but nill this game? I think you said it best...

Really pro-town behavior.

There is no defense. We have had 5 flips with a theme (6 including my claim but only I can confirm that). 4 (counting myself) as VT Alliance fighers/pilots/generals. You claimed early before this theme was established. It doesn't fit.

This doesn't help either

So, I attempted to investigate d3x last night, and got a result of "you are unable to determine his alignment". I gather from this that he is the Emperor, and as such needs to be lynched. I'll elaborate later, when I'm not on an iPod.

vote: d3x

--------------------------------------------

Lets look at the past 3 town lynches

Toon Fighter (8) -

Scott Brosius

, Slicey, LynchMePls, Kast,

ooba

, vezopiraka, d3x,

BlazezRb

BlazezRb (7) -

bv310

, Kthxbye, LynchMePls,

wolframnhart

,

ooba

, vezopiraka, d3x
Dragon Phoenix (7) - Slicey, LynchMePls, d3x, Kast, danakillsu,

bv310

, vezokpiraka

d3x and vezo have been on all 3 lynches. Both toward the end of all three wagons (except d3x for DP yesterday). This actually implicates vezo more than I thought as well.

-------------------------------------------

@Scott-

WIFOM ahead but why as emperor would dana give everyone else (especially given 2 scum groups) a hint about the Empire's setup.

Two thoughts:
-I did not speculate on Dana as Emperor; I explicitly speculated on Dana as a potential

Scum

manipulator. Your assumption similarly raises flags...I need to think about why you would make that assumption...

There was a Godfather on Jabba team, it is likely the scum teams are balanced. Since a Godfather has not flipped, it seems rather obvious that it is going to be the Emperor. Dana has been cleared by bv, therefore he is most likely not on the Jabba team. Therefore the only role is the investigation immune Empire player which is probably Palpatine.

I may or may not have internet until Friday for the record.

[Scott Brosius]

Given the flavor of the kill, it is obvious the Emperor remains and that Jabba's team is done.

I am still up for a d3x or vezo lynch. We really need to hear from Slicey today though.

[Scott Brosius]

Well looking at the past 3 town lynches, its not just that vezo and d3x were on all of them, its the timing of it as well. vezo is really bad as he is the hammer or late on the wagon every time and honestly never with much of a reason. d3x was a bit earlier on the DP wagon but has still been on all 3 town lynches. LMP has also been on all 3 town lynches, although earlier than the other 2, still something to note.

I have only been scum once, it was over a year ago in the first game I played on this site, probably not going to be very helpful. As wolf says, if your case on me is my play style, it really doesn't hold any water, as this is how I usually play. However, first link is town game, second is the scum game.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 52&t=13537
http://www.mafiascum.net/archive/viewto ... 35562ac7c9


Just updating this

Lets look at the past 3 town lynches

Toon Fighter (8) -

Scott Brosius

, Slicey, LynchMePls,

Kast

,

ooba

, vezopiraka, d3x,

BlazezRb

BlazezRb (7) -

bv310

, Kthxbye, LynchMePls,

wolframnhart

,

ooba

, vezopiraka, d3x
Dragon Phoenix (7) - Slicey, LynchMePls, d3x,

Kast

,

danakillsu

,

bv310

, vezokpiraka

d3x and vezo have been on all 3 lynches. Both toward the end of all three wagons (except d3x for DP yesterday). This actually implicates vezo more than I thought as well.

[Scott Brosius]

And you leave off KTB why?

Also everyone has claimed already correct?

[Scott Brosius]

ooba's play definitely strikes me as someone who is capable of bussing their partner.

SoG is not our lynch today. Apart from the WS claim, all I had on him was the muddying of waters with him doubting wolf who was a claimed mason. With the Obi-wan claim sounding true, I do think there are better candidates available for today's lynch.

Noting that ooba was on SoG, but unvoted when he was at L-2. So he has distanced from his one Empire partner. Actually he addresses d3x in a similar manner in this post (by saying he's scummy but not actually placing a vote)

What I am saying is that bv's result is not indicative of d3x's alignment. I find the entire wagon which built up suspicious.

I really don't like it when people do this. Could you please give your read on d3x? You can't always stay off a wagon just because of the other people on it. If he's scum, he's scum, and the other people on his wagon might be scum of an opposing party.

I've given my read of d3x on D4 - I had a strong empire read on him and saw links between him and Slicey.

I am "staying" off the wagon because of the following reasons
- We need d3x to weigh in. If he's scum, he might have very useful information for town. (ala WS on SoG)
- I think the investigation result is null. I want all the people who jumped onto the wagon to tell me if they have other reasons to vote d3x than the result. Even if you assume opposing scum on the wagon, weak reasoning might point to inside information.

KTB, given the new info, how do you feel about your earlier case below?

The following posts really rub me the wrong way knowing what we know:

I would also recommend Claiming, sog. You're at L-2 atm.

Looks like 'hey, get a fake claim in there buddy. This bounty on you is screwing us'.

Why would we have a flip without a faction if there was more then one scum group?

Dunno. I like playing 'out guess the Mod' almost as much as I like setup speculation {which is ultimately the same game}. I don't really see much worth in it. If you'd really like to debate the matter, I suggest you talk with those hell bent on believing there are 2 Scum Groups. I just said I'm not ruling out the possibility.

How do you feel about a Quick Lynch {I don't like it}? Do you think it's more beneficial to the Town than actual discussion {I do not, I believe it stifles conversation}? Do you think the bounty of sog is playing a role in the speed of this wagon {I definitely do and am worried about it}? Do you feel that it is having a positive or negative effect on the Wagon {negative, everyone is gunning for that shield}? What do you think of Scott's TF Vote {I don't like it, though I'm not a fan of TF's Slicey Vote either}?

Preview Edit:

@AGM- I don't see the benefits

to

speculate on setup. ScumHunting is ScumHunting whether you have 1, 2 or 5 Scum Groups. I believe looking for connections and interactions before concrete confirmation of multiple ScumGroups is ultimately less beneficial than ScumHunting. I also believe that prematurely, it is very distracting in a game like this. Too many people are only too eager to nerd out about what Groups could potentially be out there.

Once a second faction is flipped, looking into connections will be much more beneficial, imo. This of course does not include looking for connections to known Scum.

Taking what we know now (that there are indeed 2 scum groups) this looks like d3x trying to convince us that we should only worry about one. At the time of this post, we only knew Jabba's group existed. Has me thinking d3x is on the dark side of the force.

Take note of him 'not liking the quick lynch', trying to continue the day in hopes of getting Vader off the hook with 'more conversation', worry over the bounty, and the big one 'everyone is gunning for the shield'. Really? The way I read it was everyone wanted our investigative role to have it...

I'll take the L-1 Vote. I'm announcing my intent so there isn't a simulpost that f*s this up.

UnVote

Vote:semioldguy

Remember those notes above? Well in the next 2 posts by d3x we have him going with the flow. If everyone is gunning for the shield, why would you then put the L-1 down? If you don't think the bounty on sog was a good thing and think it was a mistake, then why do this? If you thought conversation was going to be stifled due to this lynch happening fast, the why did you participate? How do your actions of getting on the band wagon halt the quick lynch?

I'm down for a Scott investigation. If he's not Scum {doubtful} then he's only going to serve to continue distracting the Town with their suspicions. Also, I decided to join the Wagon due to a number of reasons. I realized that cooler heads won't prevail in terms of more discussion {ie-slowing the Day a bit}. Also, I agree with the plan to give bv the Bounty abilities and the extra info about farside's RB helps a lot of doubt I had.

Here I think you realize people will be asking the questions I have asked and you try to preemptively answer them. With everything else, it looks like an investigation of someone not on your side of the scum coin is a good idea so of course you're "down" for it. Another reason you could be "down" for a SB investigation is if he's your Godfather. Of course, in my experience you wouldn't know he's the Godfather unless he told you his role flat out OR he told you he's the emperor and you guessed as much. As for your reasons for joining the bandwagon.... Is 'if you can't beat em, join em' a good mentality and scum hunting method?

All in all, I think you just wanted to make sure you were on the wagon of a scum buddy who was going down anyway.

Vote: d3x

I'm not voting to put d3x at L-1 as we shouldn't have another day pass without some people posting.

[Scott Brosius]

I already claimed but I am Ackbar VT.

[Scott Brosius]

Vote: d3x

L-1

[Scott Brosius]

This is true, although I doubt we're going to get much from him even if we wait.

Unvote

[Scott Brosius]

As predicted, a post worth waiting from vezo.

KTB- I agreed with the peculiar interactions between SOG and d3x that you laid out in that post, and the seemingly scummy intentions behind them. I don't understand if d3x flips town, you are looking right at me due to that post. I'm not following the logic.

We're not going to get anything better from vezo, so I'm back aboard

Vote: d3x

L-1

[Scott Brosius]

I really have nothing new to add. Fine with lynching d3x or vezo. I'll wait to see if wolf does something and then vote for one of them.

Pretty much this, although would prefer the d3x lynch.

[Scott Brosius]

Could try and get a deceased player in this game to replace if wolf vanishes?

[Scott Brosius]

My point is you can lynch me and d3x and still have one day left.

The game will not end when you lynch me. It will end when you lynch d3x.

I'm pretty sure this has already been pointed out, but aren't these contradicting? Even so, the first quote still doesn't make much sense.

Since I'm probably very under-informed, I will not hammer yet.
Can someone bring up the main points against d3x and his roleclaim(s)?

His roleclaim is E-wok specifically Wicket. VT if I recall correctly.

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 0#p2341300 sums up d3x's case.

Vezo's case is general unhelpfulness and a pretty quick trigger finger after vanishing for days.

[Scott Brosius]

Um, what?

[Scott Brosius]

Why are you posting pictures of the emperor and claiming things are complete? You do realize yours is the only vote on me? This seems like a major slip-up. Did you think you hammered me based on

Vote Count:
Slicey (0) -
LynchMePls (0) -
Scott Brosius (1) -

me having a 1 next to my name? And now you are confident you won? This is exactly how it reads.

Vote LynchMePls

[Scott Brosius]

Show me where Slicey voted me?

[Scott Brosius]

Well I figured that once the mod came back. Posting from his phone, typos are certainly possible, so I wasn't going to take your word for it.