Go Play in Traffic! (Game over!)

[yabbaguy]

The only policy lynch I would harbor is on those who throw the white flag. ("Bah, this game is stupid, lynch me all you want.") Lynching claimed millers = stupid, but not scummy.

Also, my claim is total BS, and didn't expect anyone to follow suit, BS or not. Wow.

Why not?

[yabbaguy]

Oh by the way, I'm policy voting anyone who starts the RQS. I've never seen a concrete example where it works.

Nor the RVS, really. I just like being argumentative to start the game since, well, we're arguing.

[yabbaguy]

Twomz, please give an example of where someone else has huggled in their first post.

No one else better come anywhere near this topic until he answers it.

[yabbaguy]

BTW, would someone kindly replace into Spades so that StrangerCoug can finally claim he's finished a Mish Mash? Thanks.

[yabbaguy]

Imitation isn't flattery?

(Good night. I'm tired.)

[yabbaguy]

Ani is winning this argument by miles, but I'm still not prepared to call Sens scum, just stubborn. Is anyone actually serious about pushing this wagon home right now?

Putting a naive miller (so to speak) is a bastard mod move, IMO. I wouldn't hate Coug for it, but he might. Do you think you have an answer one way or the other Shattered, or are you just asking out of randomness?

@Pitt: Pigeon was a serious claim at the time? Do you really think you were the spark to ani's claim and this game?

---

I have one suspect in mind already, but slamming a Vote on them or hinting at who is under said suspicion would be an error.

[yabbaguy]

Powerrole.

[yabbaguy]

@Jacob: I dunno either. Nobody's claimed it anyway, so it's probably not around. (Nor should anyone)

@Shattered: the debate is moot since the issue is not whether or not a miller is hiding, it's whether the one making himself is obvious is actually what he says he is. Unless you think Coug would go one way or the other normally, which honestly, I don't think I can outguess.

Angry Truck Driver actually sounds

very

plausible, at the moment. I don't think ani has the stones to falseclaim miller either. Loaded compliment yes, but my initial speculation is he's Town.

[yabbaguy]

That's a bad post to simul with.

Leafsnail, Town is not supposed to be categorically 100% transparent all the time. The reason I am not voting now is because the tell I am pursuing on said player is not full-fletched yet. The case is too weak right now to call it and put money on it, as it would be dismissed as rubbish.

I promise you will understand my situation in a moment whether I vote or don't.

[yabbaguy]

That combined with the strange doublepost makes shattered look like someone who cares about his rate of activity more than catching up on content. fos shattered

The inference you're drawing makes no sense to me.

[yabbaguy]

@Leafsnail-77: I'm not stating my suspicion. If you want to go cry about it to the rest of the Town and wagon me over it, be my guest. The case isn't developed enough, and there is much more to be gained by waiting. It crumbles the instant I mention it or even who.

I'm choking on all the words you're putting in my mouth here. It's not a matter of fearing having the case dismissed at all.

@Fate: Why are YOU on the Sens wagon? You have been riding the coattails of it forever and have not once stated an as-complete-as-can-be reason for wanting him lynched beyond some random quip about policy lynching.

[yabbaguy]

@Fate-95 (Cc- Riceballtail): It is possible to start a wagon and then lazily ride the coattails of it because you have stated one reason that is underdeveloped. Granted, this was waaaay back in the RVS, but surely your case is a bit more developed now. All I wanted to know was your reasoning for being on board still. Simple question.

@Leafsnail: First off, you have to Unvote, Vote yabbaguy for it to count. That's why mod is "forgetting" your vote. Have you missed the two instances where StrangerCoug has told you your vote isn't counting?

The words being put in my mouth are the following:

It looks a lot more like you're just trying to avoid attention or scrutiny from the person you'd vote.

Which is not at all true. This is a big sign of tunnelvisioning, because you are manipulating everything I say to the scummiest extent possible. I don't use buzzwords for propaganda's sake (which is scummy indeed if you're saying them baselessly), I say them because I mean them. You're tunnelvisioning.

Yes, I misspoke, it

was

a matter of having the case dismissed, so that line shouldn't have been in there. Since you're biting my ass every other second though, which is not appreciated, I'll consider my hand forced and throw this out there.

I was about to vote JacobSavage for active lurking up to this point. I wanted to observe him a little longer and see if he was going to keep the trend up. I hid this because I wanted him to continue playing as candidly as he has been, and seeing his normal behavior. By now revealing this information, he is probably going to, town or scum, step up his gameplay. I would expect a town player in his position to eventually become more invested in the game whilst a scum player would continue to be worthless. Now I can no longer gauge this tell.

However, the fact that Riceballtail has just hopped on a wagon without even offering any reasoning of his own is fascinating. Yes, it's my wagon, but it's ridiculously uncalled for wagon hopping no matter how you slice it.

Rice, what are your problems with me? You've voted me over a factual inaccuracy, it seems, and it wasn't even inaccurate as stated above.

Vote: Riceballtail

[yabbaguy]

But how is it possibly putting words into your mouth? I am saying what your actions look like to me. Indeed, your pointless over defence of this makes me think it even more.

leafsnail, tunnelvisioning IS putting words in my mouth, I claim, since by manipulating things to the scummiest extent, you are manipulating words to the scummiest extent. I do have pro-town reasons for doing things.

-Your initial reason for voting me was that I was being too non-transparent for your liking.
-I gave you a reason, I said that I wanted to ensure that the consistency of the tell proved true. (And it does... in the way I loathe the most. I'll find ways to get Jacob to answer questions, though.)
-You reply instead with. "I think it's [scummy interpretation]" instead, without any reason for why my explanation is any less plausible.
-You are completely blotting out my explanations. I am innocent until proven guilty, in other words, why am I lying, or why is your explanation more probable?
-Tunnelvisioning.

Overdefensiveness, I can't explain myself against. I don't know what I'm being accused of.

---

You've shown no evidence of me manipulating ANYTHING. All you quoted was me saying what your actions looked like to me. All this stuff you've drawn from it is complete bullcrap... not to mention the horribly scummy way you've phrased it.

Now I claim I have, if it wasn't clear before. Also, I can't defend myself against "horribly scummy phrasings" if I don't know what you're mentioning.

So you mispoke and then accused me of misrepping for not magically knowing you had done so? Again, bullshit.

Huh? You biting my ass stems from hounding me over "c'mon, just tell us the suspicion, it won't do a thing, c'mon." Different things.

You were so worked up about someone active lurking on page 3? Really?

I do not get emotionally excited if I can help it. It is a mistake if I do.

The way you wrote that post tells me a lot, leafsnail. I have the hunch that you are getting a bit too emotionally invested in ratting me out. Unlike your last post, which had at least structured (albeit inaccurate) points about what you were quoting, this time you've resorted to baseless claims that mean nothing to me, and therefore I cannot defend.

Serpahim is much better than Sens, IMO. Also, from experience, haven't people also called a RBT D1 lynch policy as well?

Are you implying Riceballtail has a generally anti-town meta?

[yabbaguy]

Damn it, when did I start getting sloppy?

Ah, well. Fixed.

Fate (1): Toogeloo, Pittbunny

[yabbaguy]

Lowell has an anti-town meta, I'll tell you that. Still readable, but it's tough.

[yabbaguy]

The Yabbaguy Games Database has all my games (see sig).

What are you looking to research in particular?

[yabbaguy]

I do not get emotionally excited if I can help it. It is a mistake if I do.

Shoddy reply to leafsnail. Trying again.

I'm just saying that at the time, it was an as-serious-as-can-be suspicion that I declared I was interested in pursuing. It's not a matter of getting worked up, I just figured there was more to be gained by waiting.

(Fix your capitalization on my name, btw, and I'll fix it on yours.)

[yabbaguy]

O188: Tweed Mafia

Lowell was Vanilla Townie in this game. Things to gleam from this are that he lurks a lot and posts very minimally. Yet when you get down to what he's actually saying, it actually is rather pro-town. There is a difference between Lowell here and Lowell as scum, which obviously isn't reflected in activity much.

Someone else described it (I don't know when or who) as Lowell always playing with the motto "what's the scummiest way I can say this pro-town thing."

And that's enough of my mini-sermon.

[yabbaguy]

@Riceballtaill: If this game had been going on for 48 hours, which you realize, why did you call my lynch nearly sealed right from the get-go?

[yabbaguy]

I have no problems with white knighting. I think one of the most common mislynches is the lynch of a player who has a generally anti-town meta. I'm being pro-town by at least flagging this fact. People who are naive to the fact are prone to going headfirst just because you do your lurking. Note: lurking is bad, but it at least needs to be acknowledged when someone is generally anti-town.

Is cross-defending scummy to you? Why did it seem weird?

Pitt- I'm noticing your comments are becoming a bit fluffy. Who is your biggest suspect?

Jacob- List of suspects please. I don't believe in licenses to completely blow off D1 without giving

some

sort of input.

[yabbaguy]

Which becomes immediately irrelevant if scum have falseclaim PMs. I think that's a likely scenario.

[yabbaguy]

Sometimes the people who scumhunt by trolling (Fate) are the biggest geniuses when reactions like Shattered's ISO-8 come out brimming with emotion like that. I think beneath that lashing out of emotion, there's fear that he's about to be flipped as scum by someone he perceives to be an idiot. I'd like a claim from him as well, but I think he's a good choice.

Let's not lynch though even after the claim *just* yet. Starbuck wants to reread and Twomz (that I know of off-hand) could use a tad more content. I also demand an explanation from Riceballtail on why I'm being voted that doesn't lamely borrow from LOLcats. It's not fair to me to be voted like that.

leafs: I've offered explanations in my posts already why what I do is pro-town. It's your burden of proof why my explanations are implausible. It's not flailing, it's not "batting away", it's called prove why I'm wrong or forget it. Don't you dare personally attack me and say I don't know how to play this game.

You're also tunneling because you have failed to give direct acknowledgment of ANY other player in the game- all you've said is "L-1 speedwagons are stupid" (this one isn't) and that's about the extent of it. I'm completely deflecting here, but you're not looking. You instead have locked onto me solely because I had what you believed to be a flawed strategy, and now whenever I try to explain it and all your other accusations, instead of saying "Well that's false because [blank]" you instead say "Really? To me it looks like [blank]" without once mentioning my stance on the issue.

I'm not going to explain this again, leafs. You're going to be a detriment to us in endgame if you continue to belligerently go after one person and twist all words to the scummiest extent possible and not acknowledge town POVs. They are there. I'm saying them. Or am I crazy?

And I never called you scum. Or hinted at calling you scum. Why is this suddenly becoming one of the points of your debate?

End rant.

[yabbaguy]

Why no nameclaim?

[yabbaguy]

Also - stop speculating about what power roles are. NOW. You're either scum or giving scum information.

But it also gives town information, or just allows us to shed light on the situation. Why is this anti-town?

If you [Chrono] don't trust your own read to find scum, why do you trust it to work out Fate's alignment when you regard him as a better player than yourself?

Is this scumhunting or critiquing a player's playstyle?

@Shattered Viewpoint: Is Fate's case really contrived to the point of scumminess?

Kunkstar beat me to questioning RBT about all that good stuff.

@Starbuck: Lowell said he had inhibitions about SV having a falseclaim PM. Why did you vote him anyway?

@all: Why is the possibility of scum having nameclaims being totally dismissed? While mod has run two large theme games, none of the roles in those games could be nameclaimed (exception: Nekometa), and thus scum couldn't have fakeclaims. Why wouldn't the mod have a fakeclaim this time through, seeing as all the roles are named?

The reason I think SV is scum is simply due to the emotional reactions he exhibited towards Fate (unnecessarily- I think blowing up like that is a speculative scumtell), and the fact that it looks too much like OMGUS to me to be voting Fate the way he did.

Am I missing something? If not...

Unvote, Vote: Shattered Viewpoint

[yabbaguy]

Think game balance. Forcing the scum to come up with some street object that is perchance not in the list of X vanilla PMs sent out is a ridiculously daunting task. The only fair thing to do, I would argue, is give scum a fighting chance by giving them a fake nameclaim.

If we massclaimed (Note: Let's not), I'm sure everyone would come up with a different role name.

I don't see SC dropping safeclaims, but I don't see the harm even if he did.

This has to do with SV being cleared just because he nameclaimed convincingly. Do you see where I'm going with this?

[yabbaguy]

I can't wait to tear RBT to shreds tomorrow. See you tomorrow when I'm more awake.

[yabbaguy]

RBT could very well be scum just for the reasoning he's put out as to why I'm scum. It's ridiculously contrived. The following quotes are all his posts.

Too much discussion about safeclaims/massclaiming (paranoia much?)

Not scummy. Read my post again, and realize that I am actually using this as a means of at least saying that SV is not clear simply because he gave a claim. In addition to "_____ much?" being a ridiculous cliche that needs to DIAF, paranoia just isn't there. I don't know how it's scummy, and I don't know how you derive the fact that I am paranoid scum from that.

pushing a terrible wagon on SV

Unacceptably baseless accusation. Please try again.

outguessing the mod

Which is a subset of the first accusation about safeclaims. Why is that scummy? Why is it wrong, even?

@Yabba: How do you know that scum would have to come up with street object names?

OMG ROLEFISH. OH. MY. GOD. ROLEFISH.

FakeGod goes way up on the town-o-meter for catching you out on that.

I-I mean, why? Why would you ask such a question?

@Toog: You realize he claimed stoplight, not street lamp, right? I don't see where you got that latter name from.

Also, school's lightening up a tad, but I don't know if that will last.

Shattered Viewpoint is giving off vibes of a townie whose case is being pushed on him unreasonably. Considering that I would agree that the case is not airtight right now (although it was best at the time), and now I have a far greater suspect, I think it's time to roll out a new wagon.

I mean, in retrospect, anyone would hate to be trolled into a lynch. I agree with Pittbunny there. This is also in agreement with RBT that the wagon is sub-par, but that doesn't mar one bit the fact that his vote on me is asinine if mine is terrible.

Unvote, Vote: Riceballtail

*prepares for the predictable barrage of "OMG VOTEHOPPER" remarks*

[yabbaguy]

Tired from prom I went to. Sorry about falling behind- so this'll be quick.

I don't see why JacobSavage is being called out on the lie (Starbuck "waving the BS flag"). Why is that?

Still need to read Starbuck's case, haven't gotten around to that yet.

Pittbunny's vote on Fate looks scummier and scummier the more he clings to it. That and his coasting through the Day doesn't sit well with me.

@Shattered-352: ???

@Twomz: RBT and I are not town bickering. He's going after me on what I think is a serious case for him, and yet the reasoning behind it is contrived to the point of ridiculousness. I'll have more on it later, but I'd be curious to see where that remark comes from.

More later. I think Riceballtail and Pittbunny are scum, and Shattered Viewpoint is still a big question mark in my head.

[yabbaguy]

Uncertainty is pro-town. Scrambling trying to find someone to lynch is pro-town.

[yabbaguy]

I said one of two, did I not?

Such an unfair remark considering you don't state which one of the two.

[yabbaguy]

Kunk, why did you cut off the Day? You realize there are pro-town benefits to waiting, right?

Riceballtail and Pittbunny are likely scum. You can't examine RBT's posts simply because there's nothing to go off of- you simply have to observe that he hasn't responded to my latest post and is basically unopinionated throughout. I just can't believe that it's his meta to ignore everything. I just can't. At minimum, it's a utility lynch.

Also, RBT completely contrived a case on me, and also baselessly called someone town here:

SV is town, and you need to actually try and scumhunt now Fate.

Some Mafia have a curious tendency to act pro-town by providing their opinions in the form of their known information, subconsciously or otherwise, and usually do it with no basis or rationale. If that is true, I have reason to believe SV is not Mafia.

Hay gaiz, we has a person to scrutinize for tomorrow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-B7c7U7buI

DANGER. SUSPICION DEFLECTION DETECTED.

At the same time, Pitt has been willing to swing with just about any wagon, which I find scummy (Do I have to state evidence?). Advancing wagons baselessly is NOT pro-town, and I don't think there's any way it can be believed to be that way. It's also suspect that Pitt called L-1 a vote too soon and forced a claim.

@Shattered Viewpoint: You pretty positively looked like you were throwing the hammer. Did you feel like waiting was necessary?

@Fate: Why didn't you Unvote if you thought you wanted to wait? Bv being on a wagon, you and everyone else on board are liable if a lynch occurs prematurely.

[yabbaguy]

I have been extinguished. Farewell.

[yabbaguy]

Dead thread is required reading.

More thoughts later.

[yabbaguy]

I don't think I caught any of the scum at any time, probably because the anti-town malarkey from multiple players made my head spin. That always happens to me in games I die N1 anyway, so that's fine.

I cannot believe that the lot of you succumbed to confirmation bias by playing Follow the Fate after SBUX's lynch. Good, at least this extrovert is Town, but those who voluntarily put themselves under the rule of a tyrant deserve whatever fate they receive.

Easiest way to tell Leafs is emotionally compromised whilst voting me: he can't pay attention to the fact he had to unvote first. I still get a rise out of that. Anyway...

I guess that would make me a horrible vig, but I think Jacob's kills were reasonable choices. Good for him for remembering to duck N5 even if Town could've had the lynch and the vigkill, too.

CMAR, you should've at least stuck with the fake investigate even if he was on V/LA. That may very well have cost us the game. And then, yeah, the twilight was just really, really strange ensuing that. Writing cases up overNight doesn't mean that you know who's in play, it just lists everyone, and then you omit whoever dies. That's not a slip by any means, (clearly now).

Twomz, well done completely driving Town the wrong way (NL was a mistake, and I'm sure you knew that). I personally would've gone with GF speculation, but both routes work, esp. considering you were claiming CMAR was full of crap before. I take back what I said post-mortem.

[yabbaguy]

You... kind of are a loser (actually, you're neither) when you break mod rules. Technically you made your worst play ever by getting yourself forced out.

If you deemed yourself an almighty deity, then got yourself bumped out, you only have yourself to blame for making Town lose.

[yabbaguy]

It's there. And you're just as much a hot topic as well.

[yabbaguy]

Here. In SC's post, it was right above the list of Night Actions.

[yabbaguy]

Sorry to be raining on the hate parade, but I think it's in poor taste to air dirty laundry out in public like that, Andrius. Unless someone was personally a jerk that everyone hates, it's really best to leave it in the thread and not trumpet it to the rest of the world. You're entitled to avoid all games with him, but let the rest of MS think of him as a moron on their own if that's how you think people should feel.

Yes, CMAR made blunders. Firstly, so did you. Secondly, he just doesn't deserve that.