Into Africa - Over

[Calcifer]

So either the SK lacks cop immunity, or HezLucky is a dirty, animal-eating bastard.
Hmmm...

Vote: Hezlucky

Yeah well I didn't edit anything out because she has been working on that post since before the thread opened. Then I previewed and saw Jil get dk'd too, but I felt it was better to leave our thoughts about them in the post.

Why, so you could look townier by having a longer post?
SCUM NO. 1 CAUGHT AND I HAVENT EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT READING THE GAME YET.
YESSS

[Calcifer]

Then what was your reasoning?

And I didn't need to read in order to hammer... A cop claiming a guilty on someone, with that someone responding with a claim in kind doesn't take 37 pages to figure out.

[Calcifer]

End of Day Vote Count

HezLucky (11) - Flavour Analysis, ZeL1nK, populartajo, vezokpiraka, GreyICE, DietyKabuto, Altilysian, curiouskarmadog, Amrun, Fate, Calcifer
curiouskarmadog (4) - HezLucky, earworm, Seacore, Cirno
Llamarble (3) - elvis_knits, Lowell, snarky
snarky (1) - evilpacman18

Not Voting (1) - Llamarble

11 to lynch.
Yours truly was the hammer, EK.

[Calcifer]

Ckd isn't scum and votes on him just make me angry.

Instead, I just want to lynch scum.

Vote: Seacore

[Calcifer]

I don't want brownish points, but I don't want the glory.

[Calcifer]

I DO want the glory.

[Calcifer]

Do I have to hammer? Or can I lead a scum wagon in a glorious fashion?

[Calcifer]

Don't scavenge while I am on V/LA >.>

[Calcifer]

vote: snarky

Snarky, what information did you get from the greyice wagon?

[Calcifer]

Didn't target z last night.

I'll out thoughts on ckd's claim after claims are done...

[Calcifer]

Snarky, will that post include all of the information gotten from the greyice lynch?

Seacore, why isn't cirno's stubbornness scummy?

[Calcifer]

Well, take a position on it then. Is it scummy or isn't it? Please show your work.

[Calcifer]

Seacore, don't ignore me.

And don't quicklynch yet... Ckd hasn't shot, so we'll just make tajo lurk until oblivion. If he refuses, we have confirmed scum and we still have the shot.

Flavour, don't rush the lynch when there's more to be done, scumbag.

[Calcifer]

Flavour, I hammered hez because he claimed a guilty on an uncounterclaimed daykiller. What does that have to do with what I'm accusing you of now?

Seacore, I don't care about your original intent. I'm telling you to take a stand on cirno's refusal.

CKD, I don't put too much faith in the actions of scum to clear another person. I will reread the interactions though. As for the lurker question, i would love for you to kill DK. It is impossible to get a read on someone who doesn't care about the game, and I don't trust someone who cares about the game to think things through in the later parts of the game. So the sooner that thing dies, the better.

[Calcifer]

Tajo, Ckd is an uncounterclaimed day killer. Do you honestly think that he is scum? If you think he is sk, then why do you think an sk would pull a trick like that?

[Calcifer]

I said you were rushing the lynch. Self-hammering is a viable strategy for scum in this situation, and do you honestly think that the momentum of a claimed guilty was going to just stop unless someone told it to?

Also, tajo... Why did you think giving z a doctor power would protect him from the nightkill?

[Calcifer]

So, to get this straight: tajo is an inventor who can give a 50% cop power, or who has a 50% chance of protecting someone? In other words, he's more of a 50% inventor that gives cop powers mingled with a faith healer? Sorry, not buying it.

Seacore, why are you refusing to take a position on Cirno? Is it really that big of a deal?

Cirno, why do you think Ckd sk would pull a gambit like that?

[Calcifer]

tajo, are you willing to lurk for 72 hours so ckd can shoot you?

[Calcifer]

Vote: Seacore

Your last comments on Cirno were your ISO #34 and ISO #35, and you fencesat even that. Getting a read should not be like pulling teeth, so put on your big boy pants and dedicate yourself to a read and explain it.

[Calcifer]

No. Quote your latest post on Cirno where you took a clear position on a read. There is absolutely no reason to be stubborn about a single read when all it takes it for you to say town or scum.

[Calcifer]

@Seacore: Not useful, and yet has no problem stating your reads when you can't state your own?

@vezok: vote tajo.

[Calcifer]

Lowell, what scenarios are you referring to?

Snarky, your conclusion on the greyice lynch doesn't make any sense. Why do you think scum would be incapable of defending someone they know is town?

FA, I don't understand what on earth you are talking about re: scum versus ckd. Why do you think scum are trying to get rid of him?

[Calcifer]

EBWOP: FA, how is tajo's play geared more towards getting rid of ckd as opposed to just surviving?

[Calcifer]

Scum do things like that in order to get town cred, especially when the momentum is heavily tilted towards a particular person. It's called white knighting...

Also wondering what you meant by "the claim fits too well"...

[Calcifer]

Elvis, you think that vigging a confirmed scum and getting another free lynch is bad because it increases the chance of dead town...? What?

It makes infinitely more sense for ckd to big tajo and then we have another lynch afterwards. Confirmed scum lynches are useless as far as wagon analysis goes, since the only move that makes sense for either alignment. Vigging tajo means that we have one scum down, and a shot at another one. Why is suggesting that a scummy move...?

[Calcifer]

Tajo getting vigged and me getting lynched is a better end result then tajo getting quicklynched.

[Calcifer]

If he doesn't comply, we have confirmed scum and he dies.
If he does lurk to the 72 hour mark, then we reexamine him.

It's worth the three days to test it, especially when we have snarky running around with nonsense reasoning and Seacore being scumcore...

[Calcifer]

I think EK is scummy in her own way, but the daytalking tell is not a big deal. Will comment on Seacore when I'm not in bio.

[Calcifer]

Llamarble, the town alliance list is not good :/

Personally, I think that we should vig DK. He's being useless in an active-lurky way since tajo has been outed, and I'm pretty damn sure he's scum because of it.

[Calcifer]

Also, take tajo off L-1 so he doesn't self-hammer. Wait until we have scavenger someone..

[Calcifer]

There was no reason to take the shot that quickly, but there's nothing we can do now...

Vote: tajo

[Calcifer]

EK and FA don't belong.

And I fail to see why hammering tajo when he was stalking the thread and ready to instahammer himself anyways makes me confirmed scum. There is nothing wrong with wanting the satisfaction of hammering scum and not letting that be taken from you...

There's not any scum motivation for hammering tajo if earworm's town anyways. If he's scum, then we can handle a misvig tomorrow and I would be happy to get shot.

[Calcifer]

@Llamarble: I presented both sides of the coin. Yes, I had a hunch that earworm would flip town, but how does that make me scum?

@EK: I hammered another scum, let us talk. Your reason for hammering is... lemons?

As for the good stuff,

Vote: Snarky

[Calcifer]

LUEditor's Note: The second instance of hammering in the response to EK should read: voting me.

[Calcifer]

Unvote, Vote: DeityKabuto

I'll be back later.
EK's case doesn't make any sense. She doesn't like my hammers? I liked them. They felt off? They felt right.
She's a good enough player to where she knows how to give reasoning for feelings...

[Calcifer]

Hmmm... Can I trade my life for Seacore's?

[Calcifer]

I am willing to lurk into being shot, but I don't intent to be caught off guard...

We also need a vig shot before we lynch

[Calcifer]

Cal, would like to hear some feedback from you..you said you would be okay with being vigged, but didnt want to be off guard...if you read the thread you would have seen that there was support for your vigging..so why did you post?...how do you feel like your game is going? do you think your presence in the game is helpful or hurtful? Who is scum?

I want to have final words on who to lynch when I die. Have I been playing a good game? Hell no. Have I been playing a vigworthy game? Hell no.

Seacore is as good as confirmed scum and needs instant righteous death. He is by far my surest scumread, and I would be glad to lurk to the death if you can A) kill him first and then shoot me, or B) promise me his death on a townflip from me.

[Calcifer]

and Calcifer feels so strongly about Seacore that he calls him confirmed scum. Does not compute.

Vote: Calcifer

You've never heard a townie use that kind of language? Honey, you need to get out more.

[Calcifer]

Another small theory RE calcifer. Calcifer was potentially going to be pushed into accepting a Day Vig from ckd. So calcifer first made an unreasonable request to put it off for a day, and then CKD finally dies, despite openly being a tool for the town for days.

First: Lowell was also going to be killed.
Second: Let's quote my unreasonable claim...

Cal, would like to hear some feedback from you..you said you would be okay with being vigged, but didnt want to be off guard...if you read the thread you would have seen that there was support for your vigging..so why did you post?...how do you feel like your game is going? do you think your presence in the game is helpful or hurtful? Who is scum?

I want to have final words on who to lynch when I die. Have I been playing a good game? Hell no. Have I been playing a vigworthy game? Hell no.

Seacore is as good as confirmed scum and needs instant righteous death. He is by far my surest scumread, and I would be glad to lurk to the death if you can A) kill him first and then shoot me, or B) promise me his death on a townflip from me.

Let's see... I wanted you to be killed first, or you to die after I'm shot. How is this unreasonable? Arrogant, maybe. But nothing more than that.

[Calcifer]

Amrum and Calcifer are scum.

Massclaim? I don't know what info it'll give us, but why not? so yeah, scummier first massclaim seems fine. We start with Amrum.

"I think the people with the most support for being lynched are scum."
HI SEACORE SCUMBUDDY

[Calcifer]

I mean, I will do it if everyone wants, but why shold I?
All town members are vt.

Soooo. Yeah. It's obvious. What a waste of time.

^Town.

If Amrun was scum, Amrun would've told her scumbuddies this during the night. And they would have let all the claiming happen, and it wouldn't have been a big deal. Unless EK truly believes scumAmrun just had an epiphany as soon as you called for a massclaim...?

[Calcifer]

I see a lot of timid people sniffing around looking for a "safe" compromise lynch of Lowell. This ain't congress, people. You've got to do your own thinking.

Half-assed defense that shows no forward thought at all?
Burn death death die.

[Calcifer]

I honestly don't remember exactly why I like snarky for a lynch except that I remember wanting it early and he's not really contributing much.

This is a not-so-subtle backoff of a distancing dance with snarky.
"So, guys? I suddenly don't remember anything about that snarky guy anymore, so I'm just gonna vote for a townie. See ya later!"

[Calcifer]

Looking over the live list, I don't have a town read on anybody. Maybe, grudgingly, Vezok.

It's not to say that I find everybody equally scummy or lynch worthy, but I wouldn't be surprised if anybody flips scum. Ugh.

"I don't have a townread on anyone, which means all options for lynching are open."

[Calcifer]

When somebody proposes a plan that has even half a chance of catching scum (and zero chance of hurting the town), you go along with it unless you're scum.

This is the same reasoning that "pegged" Cirno as scum. How is Amrun different?

[Calcifer]

However, Calcifer calling Amrun town is pretty bad, IMO.

This is a good sign that you're tunneling too hard.

[Calcifer]

I shall put my vote where it has always belonged

vote:Amrum

^this is what amrun is calling scum.
This. You don't see it?

[Calcifer]

wow more than one hyena?

Vote: Calcifer

for the same reasons as yesterday + calling Amrun town. Throw in a bad tunneling accusation at Elvis too.

A bad tunneling accusation at... scum? Do you see the problem with this?