Random Mafia 2 Game Over

[Turbovolver]

OK, catching up...

[Turbovolver]

Psh no we don't.

At least a claim.

[Turbovolver]

Fair enough. We'll play it your way.

Though if I had my way the town would agree to lynch everyone but HezLucky simulatenously before the game starts...

I can see a HezLucky role that just tells everyone who to lynch for the day, and they have to
Have the mod send a PM to every player saying they have to cast the vote in their next post - now that would create chaos.



PS: Just so people know where I stand, I think XGreyjoyX is scummy. The only people he's seriously gone after have been Mathcam and Coron, who I don't think are very scummy. He also has lots of one-liner posts, many scummy. I'm happy to provide examples.

Three word name was also ringing some bells, I'll clarify this later.

[Turbovolver]

He's not getting here and getting enough unvotes in the next 24 hours. Let's just get on with it.

Cam

I don't see the problem in waiting.

[Turbovolver]

Yeah actually, when is the deadline? And is it a no lynch if nobody has the required votes?

I'm too lazy to check, and I have an excuse because I was a replacement.

[Turbovolver]

OK so I actually did go back and check.

-Days will last up to 3 weeks with a 1 week potential extension. If discussion lags, I will impose a deadline (in which case most votes results into a successful lynch, but only with more than 6 players alive). If discussion picks up, the deadline can be rescinded upon popular demand.

I don't know when the deadline is, but I don't think we'll have any problems lynching XGreyJoyX currently. So I'm still willing to give more time for a claim.

[Turbovolver]

Is there any reason to believe three word name is town?

[Turbovolver]

because I am not: scum, SK, cult, or any other anti-town group.

Even this reply is scummy to me. A genuine reply would feature more defensiveness, or questions, in my experience.

But I just did a huge PBPA in another game so I'll leave off analysing this guy till another time.

[Turbovolver]

woah! Shocked Fritzler has a multi-day-kill ability Shocked !?!?!?! that is broken into so many little tiny peices. at least he is almost definitely gonna be nightkilled by the mafia.

and to keep the flavor
random vote: flyingm00c0w
what could be more random than voting randomly at someone who has also voted randomly in random mafia?
Cool

Wow, this post sure is serious!

a cop claiming that he found scum? hmm... not much else to go on... besides the multi-day-kills... oh well
unvote
then i would vote but it looks like pooky is already over the edge. so...if pooky is town do we lynch the "cop"?

Not really much to say about this post.

So, basically because of a stupid Fritzer and a not-so-smart early cop claim, we have almost nothing to go off of, other than maybe a cop result and a tiny bit of voting paterns. I almost might as well random vote.

we bagged 2 mafia on day one. sounds good to me
1 from "stupid Fritzer" a multishot day vig( maybe sk( not likely))
1 from "a not-so-smart early cop claim" that got correct scum

i am wondering about how Pooky defended Mathcam... made it seem like mathcam and Pooky are scumbuddies to me

just my opinion

A little content, but I can see both alignments saying something like this so no conclusion.

Vote: Hezlucky

!!!!!!!!!

He's scum guys, let's do this.

how do you know he is scum?

I also find it odd that mathcam is suddenly a 1 shot. why didnt he say that he was a 1 shot on day one? why did pooky try so hard to make him seem innicent? did he even know that he was a one shot? if he knew he was a one shot then why did he use it as soon as possible?

I find it odd to say that he "turned out" to be a one shot. I looked back at some other games that had one shots and all of the role pms said that they were one shots.

FOS: mathcam

Suspecting Mathcam at this point was actually pretty fair enough.

He is scum, trust me on this one.

that isnt enough for my vote. I need more than "vote for this person, I am right".

OK.

quit looking big, look small, look at how he's posting look at the types of things he's posting. I personall for this like to use the help of mr. view all posts by.

I did just that. Hez doesn't have a whole lot of posts at the mo so it didn't take long. You really need to point out what you're getting at if you truly believe there to be a case against him at all.

agree completely with this

OK.

I think that in general 2x votes are pro-town abilities

I have seen a game where IIRC the SK had a double vote

OK.

a reread of the game (especially the last 2 pages) has lead me to

vote: Coron

for the following reasons
1. his "trust me he is scum" arguement (if it can be called that)
2. the "I am scum" slip (and how he calls it a mistype)
3. how there is really nothing that he can quote that says that hezlucky is scum
4. his reason that heslucky is scum really adds up to lynch all lurkers (and he was lurking too)
5. saying that asking the cop if he got scum is bad (why would he reveal the names of the innocents?)

1. What's wrong with this?
2. Coron never said it was a mistype (but I do admit Coron's explanation to Mathcam is dodgy as hell)
3. This isn't necessarily suspicious.
4. I thought he didn't have reasons? Isn't that what point 1 suggests?
5. Meh

alright at this point I feel it is in town's best intrest for me to claim.

I'm a 1-shot mass roleblocker. I block EVERYONE'S choice once night, this means you too scum.

So the deal is we lynch someone who is not me today, come back tomorrow and if night choices go thru you lynch me, otherwise we lynch another person who is not me.

Deal?

hmmm...

unvote

Fair enough response to claim.

I think that you should use the mass block whenever you feel like it

OK.

I think that you should use the mass block whenever you feel like it

:goodposting:

thx

OK.

now that I think about it. with the number of one shot roles you could really hurt the town if you blocked several one shot pro-town abilites. the mafia kill is the same each time but you can only use a one-shot ability once.

so what I am saying is that you should tell the town when you are going to use it so the one-shots wont loose their shot. but the mafia still lose their kill.

but this only works if their are more one shot pro-town abilites than repeatable pro-town abilites

Eww, theory. Hunt scum pls k thx.

@Lloyd: I knew that we already killed a one shot mafia. that is why I think that there are more 1shot protown abilitys (oneshot matyr ) than anti town abilitys
@XGreyjoyX: hez has the vote stealing not coron

what if we lynch someone other than coron today have him roleblock and then lynch someone. I think that it is pointless to lynch coron before we let him use his ability because it basically gives us another lynch.

OK (still eww theory though).

WoLG: you are forgetting 1shot roles for the town. there are probably more 1shot pro town roles then 1 shot mafia roles.

=/

WoLG: you are forgetting 1shot roles for the town. there are probably more 1shot pro town roles then 1 shot mafia roles.

So far we have 1 dead scum 1 shot and one claimed protown 1 shot. This assumption is unbased.

you + cam = 2 claimed protown 1-shots

=/

I hadnt thought about how it might not take the shot out of the 1-shots. that is indeed a possibility.

but i still think telling us is smart because I think that it is a good protown ability.

if you all insist on having an extra night then go ahead and lynch him. but I think that the day is more importaint than the night to the town.

All good sentiments, but he's still not contributing to anything serious.

Coron,

When you use your mass block, what happens if someone else roleblocks you?

Are you both blocked?

If not...Are blocks time sensitive, with the earlier block receiving higher priority?

I am curious about that as well.

And still...

hmm ibeasha mahes a good case (except for the case against me:P). but I find XGreyjoyX more suspicious than moocow. not enough to vote though but enough for a

FOS: XgreyjoyX

GreyJoy is now known town, which just makes this look more like cautious bandwagonning scum to me.

why?

This is aimed at Mathcam voting a lurker. Fair enough.

I think that ibeasha had more valid points against greyjoy and the arguement against me was bad because i am town and dont want to get lynched.

I dont see how that one quote against me is "a lot of interesting points"

"The argument was bad because I am town"? Yeah, no.

we need some major prodding or something

(like a scum)

=/

wow that was so scummy

FOS:XGreyjoyX

Actually yeah, Greyjoy does some suss stuff here... "Unvote... Oh good it worked!". But why only an FOS?

voting for the guy with the confirmed vote stealing ability (an ability that is almost always pro-town) and for voting for a lurker when you were lurking more.

...but these aren't really the reasons. A lurker voting a lurker isn't much of a scum tell usually =/

I just thought of something if coron is scum he could say that he is going to use his mass block, some pro-town people wouldn't send in roles. and the scum get to use their 1-shot ablities (if they have any) with little fear of getting roleblocked. but the downside of this for the scum is that coron would be lynched the next day. but if the scum had a 1shot lynch preventer then that could be some bad times for the town.

More theory stuff.

I currently think that greyjoy is our best bet not coron
and with the deadline looming activity should pick up

OK.

only because this game is dragging I will vote for the scummyst person

vote: XGreyjoyX

Finally puts his vote on. Why not long ago?

come on XGreyjoyX give us a claim. please.
if you dont everyone will lynch you. and you dont want that now do you?

This post gives me bad vibes.

because I am not: scum, SK, cult, or any other anti-town group.

This is so not a townie's typical reply to being attacked. He's not in the least bit peturbed, and is doing everything I can to be measured and calm. Scum tell.

go ahead analyse me all you want I dont really care what you find.

Done.

Not exactly a solid pro-town attitude there, TWN...but I actually found WOLG's first post of the day even more bizarre than TWN's posts. "Wow"? For what? The shortest night scene ever written? (No offense, armlx). Maybe you could explain, wolg?

Cam

I think he was awed by the fact theat someone died while noone was able to leave their houses

OK.

where is everybody?

could someone please explain why m00c0w is scum?

=/ Not sure about this.

--------------------------------------------

Pay attention to this

[65]
moocow 1st post: "I'm so confused" - Scummy, it's not that confusing. Fritz killed 2 people, one was scum. A FOS on Fritz (pretty doubtful Fritz is scum at this point) AND mentioning that Bad Idea mafia was a scum win.

If confused, why would he have gone and checked on Bad Idea Mafia. Newbie to the site, he checked it because he did read the thread, thoroughly. Plus, moocow isn't an inattentive player.

Yes, my point is that moocow saying he is confused is scummy because I don't believe he was confused at all. It was a fake reaction. Scum fake reactions.

Scummy 1st post vibes explained, kthx
---------------------------------------------------------------------
moocow: [117/118] - analysis of Pooky and mathcam. Note: this is after the Hammah! IMO - analysis posts after the hammer like this are prob scum trying to muddle the waters before night. (he noted that he was doing it knowingly) Notice, while Fritz’s blaringly obvious daykills were confusing, moocow gathers LOTS from a more complex issue: mathcam's results on Pooky (not innocent or guilty - weapons instead) and Pooky claiming doc, while at the same time trying to make mathcam out to be innocent.

1.

"Then again. Lloyd, you mentioned that it was suspicious that Pooky roleclaimed without a name. I'd like to point out that cam didn't offer up a name either. Can you give us one so we can be more confident in you, Cam?"

This is fishing. Fishing is scummy.

2. The possible scenarios. As I said in an earlier post, I feel that this was over the top. Essentially

someone trying to look pro-town when they're really not.

Also, take into account this was done in twilight. What was the point? And yet, he even answers 'what the point is'. If he was consciously doing something he knew was futile, why do it?
-------------------------------------------------------------
[217]- Oh look! Moocow is back, right after a claim. And I still think he's scummy! Imagine that.

He admits to keeping up with the discussion, but not participating because 'no one looked scummy'. (If no one knows by now, Ibby thinks people who don't find other people suspicious are suspicious!) And mentions how he thought Coron was possibly a Cop. This last thing is particularly telling with how moocow pops in right after the claim. Scum like claims.

Then he goes on to respond to me saying I have no 'real' reasons, yet I did. Then offers possibilities including 'paranoid cop' and asks if I know anything .. /fishing.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

That covers my case against moocow for the most part. I think everyone else is just following along for lack of anything better to do. And this game is rather slow...

thx.

vote: m00c0w

this game needs to be sped up

More bandwagonning.

why?

Aimed at Hez voting him. Meh.





So the main points I want addressed are:

- Why all the FOSes before the vote on GreyJoy?
- Showing very little interest in proper scum hunting (all of the posts that are "OK", "=/" or general theory)
- His response to me attacking him
- The list of five points you had that I refute up above

Really I'm no longer 100% on this guy being scum. I want to see his response.

[Turbovolver]

It would look worse then, yeah. I still think it's something worth explaining.

[Turbovolver]

Vote: three word name

Yeah, not happy.

[Turbovolver]

ok everyone on the me wagon!

unvote, vote: three word name

If you are town, tell me how this helps the town.

Self-votes have a chance of benefitting scum, but rarely town.

[Turbovolver]

I'm voting three word name, aren't I? Did I forget to unvote?

[Turbovolver]

I still think three word name is a better target, but I have to do a re-read on Moo. All I remember is when I read the game through when replacing he wasn't one of the ones who stuck out to me as scummy.

[Turbovolver]

OK, here's what I think of m00c0w's posting:

First few posts were reactions to Fritzler's daykills. They are a bit scummy, this phrase stood out:

Congratulate Fritzler for killing mafia..and also a townie??

That is something to be congratulated, actually.


Then he has some posts discussing possibilities with Mathcam and Pooky. I thought these posts were fair enough.


He comes back and says very little. Just asks people to clarify stuff without really providing anything of his own.

He says Coron should use the roleblock that night, because otherwise he's flaking on his claim. Eh.

Then he votes ibeasha for acting too pro-town, and it's really ridiculous. Seems like a poorly veiled OMGUS to me.

He gets defensive against Ibby, and then randomly unvotes because she summarised the thread.


That's his whole contribution, and I have to agree it's not looking good. A claim from moocow would be good.

FOS: m00c0w

If nobody else wants to lynch three word name, I'd be pretty happy to lynch this dude.

[Turbovolver]

I can definitely get behind a

vote: three word name

.

[Turbovolver]

My access is going to be limited from 30th June till 16th July. I will be posting from netcafes when I can, but I don't know when this will be. I'm sorry if this disrupts the game, and I hope it won't be necessary to replace me.

[Turbovolver]

I'm back everyone, but it's cold and early in the morning here so no major posting... just checking in.

[Turbovolver]

Actually Viper really is this unhelpful no matter what his alignment. I've seen him do the same thing as scum and as town.

Lloyd is sounding kinda paranoid in the last few posts I read of his. He mentions a few times that he was on the lynch of a scum, and even brings up that another musician that died was pro-town, which I'd say is almost craplogic.
However in my first newbie game Lloyd was town and also did this a little... is it a habit of his?

I think he misunderstood Viper's comment, "voting is bad for me". Lloyd, when you voted Viper for that 'contradiction' it looks like you thought Viper was saying his role made voting bad for him, but I think it more likely Viper was just being his usual unhelpful self.


I agree that letting Mathcam slide LAL-wise is probably best, but I'm confused that he would find lots of weapons on Lloyd and still might conclude him as innocent. Then again I don't see how doing what he's done here would really benefit scum, so it's not necessarily scummy either. I guess what I want to know is what your guilty investigation returned, if you are willing to divulge that information (and haven't already).

I'm going to go read all of Viper's posts, but I'm guessing nothing will jump out.

[Turbovolver]

OK lol I read all of Viper's posts. There's nothing there, even less than usual. He's statistically more likely to be town than not, so I won't be voting there.

Viper, please participate.

[Turbovolver]

Please elaborate on these statistics.

Statistics? There are more town players than there are scum players, therefore he's more likely to be town than scum.

That's independent of his behaviour this game, yes.
But I've seen him play this way as both town and scum, so I don't think conclusions can be made based on his behaviour.

I actually banned him from my little forum where we play mafia because he did this in one of my games as a townie, refused to post more when the

whole game

asked him to (the mod of the game in question actually threatened to lynch/modkill him just for not participating) and spamming up the rest of the forums with nothing.

When Viper behaves like this, it's not a scum tell. It's a Viper tell.

[Turbovolver]

But why? Viper is unhelpful, not scummy. You are suss Mr. Three Word Name

[Turbovolver]

Turbo seems to know too much. He apparently has some inkling of the scum vs town numbers.

Because I assumed there was more town than scum at the start of the game? I thought that was a pretty safe bet.

His defense of Viper implies he knows Viper's alignment, which I don't get at all. How the hell can anyone determine if Viper is town or not? His posting history surely doesn't say anything. His claim is also awful convenient at this stage of the game.

If his alignment cant be determined, what were you doing voting him until your last post?

Vote: ibaesha

Also, Turbo has twice now failed to answer my questions without pushing.

If I have, then sorry.

TURBO: If what you say about Viper is true, do you believe he should be replaced? ANSWER PLZ. KTHX.

If he still refuses to post (and post relevant stuff), then yes. He's basically just an extreme version of a lurker.

[Turbovolver]

The impression that you have not analyzed the thread, the people, and the circumstance we find ourselves in considering your behavior today.

Are you suggesting that going away on holidays and being absent is a scum tell? Because that's why I'm behind on things here.

And defending Viper? Not exactly, I just think we can do better here than to lynch a lurker. I'd like to know what all this supposed analysis of circumstance and people is, that leads you to getting a read on Viper... you said it yourself he hasn't posted anything which could give a read.

Because I assumed there was more town than scum at the start of the game? I thought that was a pretty safe bet.

So you're not taking into account the current game situation? How convenient.

To be honest, no I wasn't. I just figured if the game's still going then there is more town than scum alive. I didn't even know about the cult until you mentioned it.

[Turbovolver]

I have read some of today's posts, but I don't think I've read them all. I know I hadn't read the morning scene before, and that's why I didn't know someone cult was dead.

[Turbovolver]

I'm caught up now.



Three Word Name is scum of some flavour, I am pretty much sure of it. So hesitant to join the bandwagon on Viper late, but eager as anything when a new bandwagon comes along. Not to mention all of the other stuff I considered incriminating in my PBPA a while ago. I think he's probably an SK, as a 1-shot lynch protection would be a nice bonus ability and the mafia godfather is already dead.


I still think Ibaesha has majorly slipped up.

Viper and his predeccesor are very likely scum who have flown under the radar the entire game. His latest response helps NOTHING.

Here she calls him scum for having unhelpful responses.

How the hell can anyone determine if Viper is town or not? His posting history surely doesn't say anything.

Here she says because he's been so unhelpful, we have no idea about his alignment.

Looks like she changed her story slightly when she came after me and wanted to make a good argument. That is, she's not posting genuinely. Which I hold as the highest scum tell of all, and that's why she has my vote.



There were two kills last night, plus we know we have a cult. That suggests there is mafia, SK and cult leader all left. I'm not good at puzzling out these more theory-based situations... who are we trying to hit here to have a chance?

[Turbovolver]

IN THE CURRENT GAME STATE, SOMEONE WHO IS NOT HELPING THE TOWN AND HASN'T PROVIDED INPUT THROUGHOUT THE GAME IS MORE LIKELY TO BE SCUM THAN NOT.

In the current game state, pretty much anyone is more likely to be scum than not (if cult counts as scum).
The fact that we have a good chance of hitting someone anti-town might reduce the impact of the statement lurker-voting = bad, but it doesn't remove its relevance entirely.

My original statistics were probably wrong, yes. That doesn't mean we should lynch Viper over getting him replaced. That would be pretty hard to justify. I singled out Ibaesha because of the inconsistency (if you ask me, anyway), but everyone on his wagon has become a bit suspicious because voting for lurkers is bad form unless the mod states there'll be no replacements.

[Turbovolver]

@turbo: It seems to be like you are trying to build a false case against someone who is building up quite a case on you. 1. Your excuse about not reading the game, which is just stupid (Or showing that you already know who the town are due to your specific alignment), seems rather unlikely. 2. You said that we can do better than lynch a lurker, but the case against Viper isn't that he is a lurker (Again, you not reading the thread) it's that he has been generally unhelpful (similar to Lloyd). 3. After that, you come back saying that you've "caught up" and then go to attack TWN, trying to bring suspicion off of yourself.

1. I was distracted by all of that Lloyd roleclaim stuff. When I finished reading that I thought I was done, but I only glossed over the lynch and morning scenes.

2. First of all, you say in 1) that my not reading the thread was "unlikely" (instead I'm showing I know who the town are, supposedly), then you provide in 2) proof that I'm supposedly not reading the thread. Good job there.
And I'm sorry, but what is the difference between a lurker and someone who doesn't contribute helpful stuff? Sounds like semantics to me.

3. TWN is suspicious. Like I said, look at the way he's happy to jump on the small bandwagon (simply because I "wasn't reading the thread", as if that's even a scum tell) but so cautious about joining the bigger one.
If you're so sure that I'm scum just trying to shift attention away, why aren't you voting me?

[Turbovolver]

and btw: I AM voting you

My comment was aimed at WellOfLostGnomes

i jump on smaller bandwagons because they are less dangerous than the big ones the day shouldnt end quickly because i put someone 1 from lynch (and lloyd was feiling trigger happy)

So you are still considering Viper as scum?

[Turbovolver]

i am considering anyone as scum right now (except me(duh))

Unvote: ibaesha
Vote: Three Word Name

[Turbovolver]

ibaesha is the most confirmed? We have cult and SK to go along with the mafia, I don't think we can be ruling out people just because they pushed for the lynch of a scum.

[Turbovolver]

Lloyd's crazy like that.

I think it does point to him as being scum more than it doesn't, and I'm now especially finding it interesting that he claimed ibeasha town for dodgy reasons.

I think Lloyd is an expendable cult member, probably trying to sow misinformation in the event he gets lynched. That's the possibility that jumps out the most to me.

[Turbovolver]

three word name is definitely scum. If he

was

town, he's cult by now after that demonstration of his ability.

And it really wouldn't surprise me to see a one-shot lynch immune SK. Not to mention the stuff about how "scum would claim unlynchable", which he did until he was prodded into revealing his lie.

[Turbovolver]

EBWOP: Well prodded isn't exactly the right word, but go back and look for yourself.

[Turbovolver]

Hm. This is actually a pretty strong point against TWN. The one thing that lessens this is that if recruits lose their ability, then the cult doesn't have much use for him, and he's a pretty massive kill target. The cult would surely prefer innocuous townies who are going to be around forever. On that note, why isn't he dead? Either the scum groups are trying only to shoot each other, or this is another pretty strong mark against twn.

Why would it matter if he keeps his ability or not? The first reaction to lynch protection seems to be "yep, town", so I'd think cult would want him on their team (and killing scums would probably want him dead, not sure what happened there). I thought he said he only had one-shot lynch protection anyway (he was lying when he claimed fully unlynchable).

At this point...I think Turbovolver / Sotty7 and mathcam are in the same group, either scums or cult.

I don't know about Sotty, but I'm expecting a legit cop in the game and so without counterclaim, Mathcam is it.

[Turbovolver]

Yeah I know, what I meant by that was if she was avoiding Mathcam or whatever I don't know why.

[Turbovolver]

Mathcam's explanation there seems fair enough, but something else has been bothering me.

Mathcam, weren't you one of the original supporters of lynch all liars?

[Turbovolver]

Yes, I understand arguments against the concept of LAL. I'm not a big believer in it myself.

The point is, someone who advocates LAL shouldn't be lying. If the town were following LAL, Mathcam would be lynched as soon as he claimed he wasn't in fact one-shot.

[Turbovolver]

OK. I thought it was on your quiz but maybe I mis-remembered the question.

[Turbovolver]

A whole bunch of people on the site made quizzes about themselves, and Mathcam's had a question about a mafia phrase he subscribed to, IIRC. I thought the correct answer was LAL. The thread's somewhere in General Discussion I think.

[Turbovolver]

O.O

[Turbovolver]

LOL I'm popular 8)

[Turbovolver]

Heh, I would've made all those same arguments as town, and I really did gloss over the morning and night scene and not know about a cult. Ibby was right to keep the pressure up, though.


I didn't really like my chances this game... I replaced in with two mafia down and my partner m00c0w didn't seem to want to night talk to me and was soon lynched.

The scum had Mathcam picked as a liar straight away, and Sotty had been roleblocking him the whole time. I thought that was pretty cool. I'm not sure what tipped them off.


It says in the nightchoices list that Mathcam investigated me not Lloyd (on the night he wasn't blocked), if I'm understanding it right... Were you lying to us again, Cam?



Also thanks for having me get killed three different ways. That made my day.

[Turbovolver]

Nice game, armlx