Mafia in La-La Land (Game over!)

[DeasVail]

Or at least a ~those within dreams~ massclaim, which is almost everybody anyway.

[DeasVail]

Hmm ok then.

I don't see why it would be bad though.

[DeasVail]

Well there are players who make sense as town PRs to me, but if they're not then I would consider them as scum.

Also, I feel like it would just make everything a bit clearer and I don't really see any consequence.

[DeasVail]

4nx, why didn't you share your opinion on a massclaim?

[DeasVail]

Nacho, wasn't petapan's attitude to the Rach lynch pretty much the same as mine though? I know that I wanted to lynch from a dream.

[DeasVail]

Jarvis, can you explain the Staeg-town thing?

[DeasVail]

I'm sorry, I'm not getting it.

[DeasVail]

I was probably 2nd or something on N, I started the Staeg wagon and I was ~middle of Rach.

What's your point though?

PEdit: Ohhhh, does that work with previous days?

[DeasVail]

Actually I don't think it would work with Day 1.

[DeasVail]

That was with anyone voting town, but the first vote thing sounds more likely.

Ok, well Shii was the first on my wagon Day 1 and she wasn't in the dream (and let's skip the part where we speculate over whether I'm town or not, thanks)

Maybe the wagon would need to be a certain size?

Hmm, and Staeg was first on the Konowa wagon Day 1, and that was pretty big.

PEdit: Yeah, I don't think it quite works.

[DeasVail]

I wouldn't mind a 4nx claim honestly.

[DeasVail]

What do you mean?

[DeasVail]

4nx, can you claim?

[DeasVail]

Wait peta, why are the dreams true regardless of the dreamer's alignment?

[DeasVail]

I'm not sure about the dreams being confirmed regardless of alignment thing, because if scum choose them, I think it could be how it is with only one of the dreams being correct. (Please tell me if I'm missing something though, as I'm often quite derpy with these things).

I was thinking Staeg would be a decent lynch because if he's scum then Woo! and we know not to necessarily trust his dream, and if he's town then it's confirmed and we narrow down the other dream too. This is not valid if the dreams are confirmed anyway though.

In other news, I'm ok with a 4nx lynch, but I don't really find him (or anyone else actually) particularly scummy. Well, except N, but then there's stuff that makes me think he's town so ugh.

I'd probably prefer 4nx over Peta though.

[DeasVail]

Should I hammer?

[DeasVail]

Hmm, Ill hammer tonight (Aus time) probably.

[DeasVail]

Vote: 4nxi3ty

[DeasVail]

I still don't know whether to trust the Staeg dream. I'll probably think a bit more about it tomorrow.

[DeasVail]

Actually, N, why didn't you post much toward the end of the previous day?

[DeasVail]

Well, you didn't post for almost 3 days before the deadline. Was it because you were keeping up but didn't have much to add, or because you weren't able to read at all?

[DeasVail]

Well I won't tolerate such neglect of my feelings again! If I catch you going over 24 hours without a post, our acquaintanceship is over. OVER!

But seriously, why are you agreeing with lynching Staeg today for reasons I mentioned yesterday?

[DeasVail]

Nacho, I'm still not sure. Obviously Peta was saying it could be trusted, but I'm not sure about the reasoning behind that, although if Staeg is scum, it obviously could be all town. What do you think?

Actually, if there is no scum in the dream it means either greygnarl is scum (unlikely imo) or there's another scum in greygnarl's. So, if Staeg is scum it's probably with someone else in the greygnarl dream, and therefore there's scum in N/Jarvis anyway regardless of Staeg's alignment. This completely falls apart if greygnarl is scum, but he's my strongest townread, so what do people think of lynching N/Jarvis? (I'd probably go with N here)

Also Nacho, regarding N, which answer was I feeding him? His answers have not been particularly suspicious, but I'm interested in his response to my most recent question.

[DeasVail]

Actually, that's also assuming that Staeg-scum would do an all-town dream, so scratch that.

The problem I see is that if Nacho/Peta are both town, I'd strongly suspect the dream being all-town, but we can't lynch both without losing if it's 2 scum left (I think).

N and Staeg are probably the most scummy/least town to me, so I'm thinking of just going with one of them, although I probably should reread Nacho/Peta.

[DeasVail]

Why doesn't it matter?

[DeasVail]

I want your opinion, which is why I asked. If there's some reason you don't want to give it, that's fine though.

Also, what is your read of me?

[DeasVail]

Did you? I mustn't have understood it at the time, but I'm sure having that in the back of my mind must have helped me understand Jarvis's post. Or are you upset you're not getting any credit?

Just so everyone knows: the idea I'm following today, that of lynching Staeg, was actually originally put forward by DeasVail and not Jarvis, as I had originally thought. I apologise for any inconveniences caused.

I was actually getting at why you didn't pick up on it if you were reading, but thank you. You are most kind.

[DeasVail]

And yeah, N's probably town.

Vote: Staeg

[DeasVail]

Town.

So then, can we not bother worrying about feeding me answers and all that and just get along?

[DeasVail]

I've decided that I don't.

[DeasVail]

I don't have anything to add; just checking in so DV doesn't feel abandoned.

<3

[DeasVail]

Should we no lynch?

[DeasVail]

Vote: No Lynch

[DeasVail]

Vote: N

[DeasVail]

Don't you find the idea of yelling obscenities at each other for an entire day too exciting to wait for?

[DeasVail]

Do you feel a lack of confidence in your scumhunting ability?

Are you worried that your decision could cost us the game?

Are you scum?

If any of these apply, I have an offer too good to resist! Due to the low turnout of the scumread contest, my vote is still up for grabs! All you have to do is vote for N and you can control my vote in a future game day!

Oh, and N is scum, so just in case that's your kind of thing, you can vote for him for that I guess.

[DeasVail]

who do you think is scum out of me/petapan/empking?

I don't know. To be honest I don't really want to think about it if I'm just going to be lynched today anyway.

If it's looking like N will be lynched and people actually want my thoughts, then I'd be happy to do it.

[DeasVail]

Why not though? Would it really help you better read me?

[DeasVail]

Eh, I will tonight.

[DeasVail]

Oh, that possibility never occurred to me!

No wait, I will be alive tomorrow because the remaining scum will want my vote too!

[DeasVail]

Post 487, in which he lists him as his top town read.

Top of the list doesn't mean top townread.

Peta, I was scum in [semi-redacted] and also in an offsite game with MS players during the crash. I also have a scum game on an alt from April-ish(?) that I'd slightly prefer not linking to, but I can if you want it.

[DeasVail]

Well I have time now, so I'll start:

Nacho ISO:

I remember having a weak townread on seastorm Day 1, but nothing seems that scummy or townish to me now.

One thing I've never been sure about was his certainty that scum chose the dreams in 1594. At first I thought it could've been a scumslip, but then I realised that the way Quilford worded the thing about dream selection made it make sense, so would likely be what someone thought replacing in to the game and trying to understand the mechanic. Reading over it again though, it still doesn't feel quite right, but I'm not sure.

Q:

If we started a game now with you scum and me-town would you buddy me?

Q:

Had you played with Rach before this game?

In 1690 Nacho votes for Rach. Before this the only vote on her is from PV who's not really pushing it, and Equinox and Peta both vote for 4nx with me saying I probably will. However, N says that he wouldn't mind a Rach lynch, and then Nacho votes for Rach, with N doing so a post later. I guess it's possible that it's some kind of double bus, but I don't think this happening is likely with Nacho-scum considering the lack of support for a Rach lynch before then.

Q:

Why did you not say what you thought of Staeg and whether the dream could be trusted.

Generally Nacho seems townish and although I'm not sure about the first thing, I think the vote for Rach makes him likely town.

Peta ISO:

Switch from Kondi, who he seems to pretty keen on, to manho/N is interesting, but I don't know what to make of it. (I think manho might have had one vote at this stage).

I think the way he votes for KoC in 783 is what scum would do trying to bus in a town way.

Ok no, I don't see the jump onto Bitmap coming from scum, but I read Shii as supertown, so I've got a towntell wrong somewhere.

984- saying that Rach shouldn't be cleared seems unnatural, and the type of thing scum would do to distance.

1058 and 1061 are interesting, but I don't know if it means he's a buddy or town.

Hmm, I'll stop there for now. Might get to do more tonight, but I don't know.

Empking, can we not lynch me?

[DeasVail]

Oh and peta, just in case I don't post again/forget, I'll also ask. You seem nicer here than you are usually. Is there a reason for that?

[DeasVail]

Just realised another thing that I think makes Nacho likely town, but I'd still like answers to my questions.

Back to Peta:

-So generally he doesn't seem as town to me as Nacho (or Shii who I've just had a quick look at). The initial KoC vote also seems like a bus, but I don't think it's very likely that he'd switch to Bitmap like he did, as it would look too much like counterwagoning to his PoV.

-Reading over 1058 again, I think it's exaggerated compared to 1061, but I think it's the type of thing scum would say to have a 'strong' opinion on their buddy.

-There's an interaction between peta and N starting here that looks like a distancing attempt, considering that he has a townread on N and although he is a bit abrasive as town in my experience anyway, I don't really notice him being so to anyone else here.
It actually continues for longer than I first realised.

-Oh so Nacho's already posted on it. I know there's the issue of me still not being quite mod-confirmed town, but what do you think of it now if N is scum? (@Nacho btw)
Also, I think that the "dw about the associations, they're a waste of time." is something scum would say here.

There are things I find townish, but there's not really much that I think he couldn't do as scum and I actually think the N thing makes him quite likely a partner. The bitmap thing still bugs me though.

Empking:

The main thing that bugs me is that he wasn't killed last night, when I completely expected him to be. I don't think I'm going to place too much importance on this though.

Empking is eh. I don't think I can read him well, but although I'm not as confident in Shii-town as I was, I still have trouble seeing his posts coming from scum. I'll probably think more on Emp tomorrow if I get time, but if I had to pick it right now, I'd probably go with peta.

So...would it be too much to hope for you all feeling too guilty to vote for me now?

[DeasVail]

I realise there are enough reasons why non-Empking-scum would leave him alive that I don't want to make too many assumptions. Really, it probably works with any of you.

You because peta was more suspicious of Empking than you, and Peta because Empking townread him. And obviously Empking because why would he kill himself?

I will think more on Empking later though.

[DeasVail]

The N/peta interactions do look like scum-scum to me, that's the thing.

Also, could you answer my earlier questions?

[DeasVail]

Can you link me to a game of yours with Rach-town before you replaced in here? (If one such game exists)

[DeasVail]

The N/peta interactions do look like scum-scum to me, that's the thing.

Why, exactly?

Can you link me to a game of yours with Rach-town before you replaced in here? (If one such game exists)

Newbie 1211 is one that I can think of off the top of my head. I can't quite think of any others right now.

The interaction I mentioned just seemed exaggerated to me, as if the purpose behind it was trying to distance.

I could see their posts today being from buddies too, but I don't know if they're more likely buddies because of them.

I've been pretty busy the last two days though, so I still need to look at Empking properly.

[DeasVail]

Do you guys want me to vote DV today or tomorrow?

Who is this directed at?

[DeasVail]

Also, Empking, what did you think of Jarvis from Day 5 onwards?

[DeasVail]

I had another look, but I still don't know. I might try again now. And now there's something that's making me think Nacho-scum, so yeah...

[DeasVail]

The most I can say about Empking is that the Jarvis kill slightly indicates him being scum because his last mention of Jarvis was saying he was scum.

Also not sure what to make of his posts today. I feel like there are reasons for posting as he has as scum, but I could easily see scum acting as you/Nacho have as well.

Empking, why did you post 2051?

The thing though, is that I keep going back to Shii and really think he's town.

[DeasVail]

Because if you're town then scum would perhaps think it likely you'd vote Jarvis --> killing me instead.

Actually, if Peta's scum, then a kill on me would have made a lot more sense than a kill on Jarvis.

[DeasVail]

Do you guys want me to vote DV today or tomorrow?

Who is this directed at?

N, can you answer this? It's not scummy if you do.

[DeasVail]

Oh N...

Can someone else ask him then?

[DeasVail]

Ah ok. Well, considering that Nacho already answered that, and you think Empking is scum, why didn't you just ask Peta?

@Nacho: Er, I thought he didn't answer because of the whole pretending I'm scum thing.

[DeasVail]

VOTE DV AND LOOK FOR SCUM IN US THREE

[DeasVail]

Ok well that was useless (but I don't know if I should have expected otherwise). Anyway, I thought that thing may have indicated Nacho-scum because N didn't seem that interested in his opinion (enough to ignore caps) and his question was obviously to the town, so would be more likely to ignore Nacho's opinion if he was a scumbuddy.

However, I'm starting to think this is pretty weak, especially since there are a few other things which point to Nacho-town. I'll probably write a quick post of my thoughts on each and hopefully make some sort of recommendation? Although, please, if you don't care what I think, say so.

[DeasVail]

I actually think the reasoning was alright without N being scum though.

[DeasVail]

Thanks peta!

I was going to say that I think this makes him town with Empking saying he thought I was scum, but I'm becoming all paranoid. I think I'm leaning Empking now, but I'll probably go over things again quickly and finalise tonight.

PEdit: Oh...

[DeasVail]

Yeah, I completely agree.

[DeasVail]

In the scum QT you get to watch me make a complete fool of myself.

Thanks for modding Quilford! It's a shame you didn't get to mod this completely (and it would've been nice to see the flavour in full), but I'm glad you made it back. I liked the dreamt/undreamt role modifiers and the setup, although with the mod errors I don't know whether the dreams would have had a significant impact or not with things being normal.

Arrrgggh! That was so stressful. I want to say thanks so much to Nacho for replacing in and being awesome. I was so happy when I saw that you were. Also, Equinox scared me so much.

I'm so lucky that you guys in the dead QT were dead.

And sorry N.

[DeasVail]

It was great getting to be scum with you Rach. I also saw what you did in the dead QT haha.

[DeasVail]

And happy birthday!!!