Street Racers: New York (Game over!)

[Bumi]

Hello

[Bumi]

I will read what I missed over the next few days.

[Bumi]

OKAY, LET'S DO THIS SHIT.

Heather's scum. Sixx is scum. Thezmon is scum. Roger is possible scum. We're lynching one of them.

Roger is a new player and new players usually be townie's.
I am comfortable any of them. do we have day Vig kill?

How does any of this make sense?

[Bumi]

What is that doesn't make sense to you, more details pls.

Why are newbies usually townie?
Why do you ask about a day vig kill?

[Bumi]

ArcAngel is town.

[Bumi]

ArcAngel is town.

Sure I am.
so who are you suspects?

I haven't read so I don't know.

[Bumi]

I think Roger is town.

[Bumi]

And this is twice now that we have to ask, Bumi--you're reading now, but surely you have some sort of suspect.

Personally probably Parama + Nhammen but nothing more than gut about it.

I think Nj and Bride are town for their little interaction on page 2.

I think BirdAndBeast are town although their hyperaggression isn't really needed with this many people from a much slower paced site.

[Bumi]

I feel like Nhammen is playing the sheperd who guides the newbies when in reality he is guiding them to a slaughter house. I can't quite explain it but I don't like Nhammen's play.

Parama going for so much policy doesn't really mesh well with pro-town behavior/motivation in my opinion.

SoraAdvent's weak justifications for his actions like leaving backdoors does not sit well with me either.

VOTE: SoraAdvent

[Bumi]

I keep reading Thez's post but no thoughts ever come to my mind.

The only way I can see him as scum is with Aj because of Aj's defense of Thez.

I'll try reading again later.

[Bumi]

town lean on nhammen
town parama

Why do you view these two as town?

[Bumi]

I see Rogers post more so as lack of experience than him being scummy although his posts do seem to lack the basics of the game, he has said it was his first and unless your objective is plausibly eliminate him from continuing to play on the site, I don't see a reason to D1 lynch him. Simple as that.

I don't view this as scum Bird and Beast. Gonna have to do some convincing with this.

Just looks like another player looking out for another given their relative foreign background to this particular site.

[Bumi]

Do you have a reason? I don't have much experience with large games like this, but wouldn't it make more sense to take out an inactive on D1, seeing as the first lynch will probably be a townie and the inactive players don't contribute much anyway?

Irony abound, Apple. You've yet to give a reason for voting AJ the Epic, and he most certainly isn't an inactive player, so that can't be your reasoning.

I'm aware of that. It was mostly a reaction test, but I haven't really gotten one from him.
UNVOTE: Aj the Epic
My question was more of a general one. I would like to see some other peoples' voting habits before I decide to lynch an inactive.

No joke: it'd be easier to quote the parts of ArcAngel's posts which DON'T make me think town.

I don't see it. Arc is null for me. Maybe a hair South of null for #94, but it's not much. She could be removed from the game, and I would see no difference.

I really hate the mentality of this post to and the specific null leaning on Arc.

mod:

<cough>

#209

<cough>

<snip>

I kinda trust you on those words, but something just doesn't feel right about this post.

Que?

Bumi. Thezmon. You can't wander in casually and ignore the topic, or only wagon going.

I can and I did. Is that scummy to you?

I have more town reads this time around. I feel like I am better at finding town than I am at finding scum in general.

New town reads (Strongest to weakest): robert2424, minilibrarian, johnnyfrarr, unseencamo, heather

I don't know if Aj is willing to but heads with Bird like that as scum. This is also why I think Heather is town for her reaction to Bird's posts and accusations.

Still really no opinion of Thez.

(stares blankly)

I need a day off to clear my head.

[Bumi]

I think you are splitting hairs, Aj.

[Bumi]

That is a very bad vote Killer and you are very scummy for making it.

[Bumi]

I will. At a later point in time.

Mainly due to the fact that Arc is from India and things can get lost in translation. You can see some fumblings in her earlier posts. It looks like Killer is going after something easy to have his vote down.

[Bumi]

Nhammen, why does it matter that I have different reads from you? Why does it matter if I am a newbie or played on another site?

[Bumi]

I am here.

I am sorry I was busy with holiday related things.

I will return tomorrow at my fullest.

[Bumi]

So this game got a way from me...

[Bumi]

I really cannot be bothered to keep track of all these replacements.

I do have one question to all the replacements -

do you think your predecessor's play was pro-town oriented?

[Bumi]

@B&B - this will be my last direct response to anything you ask of me. Your style of play annoys me so much that I've considered a couple of times already just asking StrangerCoug to replace me. You've already chased off BoS (another one of our players) with your D1 antics. This game so far has forcibly reminded me why I didn't bother coming back to this site after the first game I played here last year. As for Thez, I honestly find him hard to read D1. But so far he hasn't exhibited any of the signs I've come to associate with him when he plays as scum. Perhaps I have an unfair advantage in this regard, since I've played with him for the past 2 years pretty solidly. But frankly I think you're all barking up the wrong tree with him. If he turns out to be scum, believe me I'll be surprised.

Personally I'm far more interested in looking at the motives of those who have voted for Thez purely for the sake of jumping on your wagon. As you'll notice, I currently have a vote on one such player. Anyone who places a vote and refuses to give a reason for said vote is behaving in an exceedingly scummy manner in my book. In the games I play people are expected to provide reasons for votes. If they don't, pretty much everyone else in the game will jump on them for it and if they continue to refuse to give a reason they usually start getting voted on. What I'm seeing in this game is one or two people declaring categorically that players X, Y and Z are 100% certifiable scum (when there is no way anyone could know such a thing), and everyone else following suit blindly. That's no way to play a mafia game.

I think this person is very very likely to be town now.

I would like payment for all the naysayers who did not like my slight town read on Heather earlier in the game.

[Bumi]

nhammen are lesser town reads.

I liked your list until I saw this name.

I then vomited in my mouth and swallowed it again.

(cackles)

Why is nhammen a town read of yours?

[Bumi]

do you think your predecessor's play was pro-town oriented?

I answer this for you: they will say yes

I don't really care about the answer.

[Bumi]

Appropriate.

!

babblings below

The mentally basically is, "I am town, so why would a fellow townie push so hard for my lynch?"

This is really very bad in my opinion.

It is more that your reads are different from most other players that have stated reads. And there is a connection to where you have played before. Do you read threads in the Mafia Discussion forum?

When you said this, which reads were different?

I'm not afraid to say my suspicions. Are you? Is there an underlying thought process that people who have different reads are more likely scum? You seem to be getting at that point without ever really raising it.

So come off it. Tell me. Why are you really asking these questions?

I played mafia on a different site for about the past 6 months. It is a different language so I never bother linking anyone to it. It also contains sensitive information that I would rather not share with the general populus.

Ummm, you may not care where people are from, but that is de-facto where your reads are. Maybe you are seeing this other site's meta as scummy, or maybe it is something else, but you have a scumlist that just so happens to include everyone from this other site. That would be quite the coincidence, don't you think?

Would he not be scummy by his own admission if the other site's meta is scummy as you say?

Or maybe he knows how to read them better and they are not following their traditional town play?

Why are you applying paranoia to his scumlist when you should be applying veracity to it?

Who is more legitimate and likely to be accurate of reads - a person who never played on their site, or a person who knows their meta?

---

Jacob is scummier than I remember.

---

Can someone tell me how this post doesn't strike some as so null it's scummy?

Hmm? Run that one by me again.

Slowly.

Let me get this straight. You voted me when you didn't think I was scum before? Nice. You didn't like your vote on me before, but voted for me anyway? Nice. Don't say I put words in your mouth, because you said it all in that last sentence (which I bolded just so you would make sure not to miss it).

Mountains...
...mole hills
This poem
an ode
to
you

If most people are like me, they probably got their role pm and went: "wait, this game _actually is_ about cars and such?" and maybe interest waned.

I think it is due to the different atmosphere of this site compared to the other site so many of the original players were from.

Parama is either TOWN or SCUM TRYHARD MODE.

You think he is trying? He is barely there in my opinion.

I guess his earlier posting...

Absolutely no reason scum Camo wasn't voting Scum Thez with that. And Im not sold on Camo's scumminess anyhow. Looks too derp.

Bang. There's a lil' piece of meta of unseencamo not being as derp as he's being here. He does think his actions through; here it looks like he got more shit for a vote than he thought he would, then embraced the "oh I'm just bad" play with the bullshit Thez vote. And it's the derp facade that camo utilized in order to hop onto thez that tells me that he isn't bussing.

Zitfe replaced camo, Idiotking replaced bride. Both are scum.
Librarian is scum for his "I think thez is scum. I've been consistent about this." crap which is less pushing for scum to get lynched and more about pushing his mislynch in a way that won't get him in too much trouble.

This completely oblierated my previous thoughts that Nacho's slot was not town.

I wish we could agree about some of our reads.

I don't agree with the wagon on Sixx. I invite you all to come onto my Nhammen wagon. He isn't really doing anything to further town getting more information.

[Bumi]

You look town for that post.

[Bumi]

Slysly get your glasses checked. I'm not scum and I highly doubt that BB and AA are scum.

If we are a team, lynch one of us? It would help you in the coming days surely? Why settle for someone else?

[Bumi]

I actually forgot my vote was on Nacho. I thought I moved it to Nhammen last big post I made.

derp

I don't want to move it to Nhammen anymore anyway...

VOTE: aj

[Bumi]

Darthe
What the fuck

Hold on

Fyi, I will be away fro the next 24 hours

[Bumi]

post #322 was shit though, I can't vote someone from India?

You are justifying something your predecessor did?

Parama, these are the types of responses I was looking for when I asked that question earlier about predecessor play.

Sly, yes I see that you adjusted your vote.

Is ad hom supposed to mean anything? It isn't a scumtell. Are you trying to spin it as such?

[Bumi]

Why? It is a personality tell more than anything. I could understand if I am not contributing and only attacking players but I am contributing.

[Bumi]

You had no case at that time I said the glasses comment.

I'm not even sure you have a case now.

[Bumi]

I should be less scummy in your mind. But I'm not? Are you tunnel visioned already?

[Bumi]

I should be less scummy in your mind. But I'm not? Are you tunnel visioned already?

Why should you be less scummy in my mind? Your AA love is indisputable.

Yup. You've got the blinders on.

What do you propose I do if I feel someone is town?

[Bumi]

Slysly did you seriously isolate KillerApple's vote on AA and say that was why I said his post was bad?

You are so fixated on seeing me as scum your psyche will only allow you to see me as scum.

[Bumi]

I misread SlySly's post. I could have sworn I said post in my response to Killer's vote.

I have no regrets to call ArcAngel town and I stand by that read.

[Bumi]

Slysly get your glasses checked.

Ad hom.

I'm not scum and I highly doubt that BB and AA are scum.

If we are a team, lynch one of us? It would help you in the coming days surely? Why settle for someone else?

As you can see my vote has been updated.

Why did you feel the need to make a case to accompany your vote? You clearly have strong feelings that we are a team. Why not vote one of us then and then back it up with the case?

[Bumi]

No.

Why did you call out the "team" when you could have voted AA to begin with?

I don't understand why there was a pause between calling out AA and then voting her.

[Bumi]

What does lit mean?

I wanted to clarify something I thought was peculiar. Is there a problem with me wanting more information?

[Bumi]

That's mean.

You reaffirmed my townread on your slot.

[Bumi]

Feel better!

[Bumi]

SlySly I still don't understand how I'm scum. Because I think ArcAngel is town?

[Bumi]

Sly answer my question please - why is it scummy that I have a town read on ArcAngel?

[Bumi]

Why is that scummy?

[Bumi]

Even if she is scum which I highly doubt why would I publicly defend her in this manner especially if it is according to you "multiball"?

(ponders)

What is multiball? I can't find any links. I assume more than one mafia group?

[Bumi]

What will you do when I flip town? Will you continue down this path that we three are buddies?

What will you do if ArcAngel flips town?

How is it irrelevant? I may be new to this site but I'm not entirely new to the concept of mafia the game. I know that you want your partners living longer than town. Why would I tie myself to someone so strongly so early in a game? Especially if another mafia faction exists?

[Bumi]

I think Sixx is our better choice today but Bumi could well be scum. Some odd reactions.

Really? In what way?

[Bumi]

Why would they?

[Bumi]

That is pretty unfortunate Bird.
My will to play has died because of other games. Jal knows one crushing defeat because it just ended.

[Bumi]

Guys I think I am going to replace out. I really don't have the motivation for a completely new game right now. Lynch me so SC doesn't have to find anymore replacements.

[Bumi]

I still think Aj is scum and AA + BB are town.

VOTE: Bumi

[Bumi]

I agree Jal is town.

[Bumi]

It's half and half that game. I'm just weak/depressed on general right now.

[Bumi]

I actually thought that was pretty townie considering how blatant he was being with his thoughts.

I like Nacho's analysis of Sixx and I am willing to place a vote there but I think Aj needs to be looked at too.

VOTE: Sixx

I thought that Sixx was town for her/his reaction to Thez about the buddying.

[Bumi]

Nachooo, talk to me

Also, why is nhammen town? Dont be fooled by his wall posts.

~Angry P.

Why do you think this now?

I think he is town for how he handled my probing.

[Bumi]

I'm not scum I just played very poorly

I think Aj is a good candidate for scum

Darthe is a dumb ass though for claiming.

[Bumi]

Darthe, was Bumi vouching for Sixx scum in your QT after his vote on Sixx in post 867?

The thing about Bumi, was that I was just in a game with him where he was totally wrong about the scum team. He listed all of the scum team as town, some with his highest read, he then went on to help lynch a town player and tunneled on town the next day and then we just lost.

Basically, he isn't the

greatest

of scum catchers.

We don't have day talk. And I didn't force Roger to do anything. I asked him his opinion about cars and people because my role PM says we know who the other people are but not the cars. That's why I thought Roger was likely town because he did what he said he was going to do.

I don't understand why Darthe claimed though unless to give his "case" more back bone


Yes I was louder but that was in a smaller game and during a different time in my life.

[Bumi]

Using my relatively recent inactivity against me isn't really a poor against me. Look at Mafiastuck where I was pretty much not around for the last week or so compared to my earlier play in that game.

Darthe is not lying about being a neighbor. Jacob, what possessed you to say that? I think his assumption that neighbors are more likely to be scum-town pairing is faulty since a neighborhood of two screws the pouch for scum so to speak.

Yes I tried to get more people to vote Nhammen but that is only because I honestly believed Sixx to be town. Darthe really killed the utility of our roles by claiming and coming after me.

If you are going to vote me for my defense of Sixx than do so. I have no defense to that accusation other than it was an honest mistake.

I could use Jal and I's recent games as examples that my scumhunting powers are pretty much abysmal but that'd probably make this a utility lynch and I'd die either way.

I stand behind townreads currently and encourage others to look at Aj.

[Bumi]

Poor = point, got confused with what I wanted to say there

[Bumi]

Hmmm... I forgot about that. Tough one. You did consider multiball before everyone else, but the logic you used for many of these wagons was quite sound, and also I don't think scum would have gone out and reminded me to consider them as a scumread. As scum, I would think that you would hope I'd forget about that. I know that if roles were reversed I would. Also, a lot depends on what I see during my catch up... which I still intend to do, although I have covered 2 out of 20 pages in the past 2 hours... But for the time being, that does not look as scummy as I had believed it would.

To point out, multiball makes it harder to catch scum teams. They have another team to find and can feign towniness more efficiently.

[Bumi]

Bumi: Why did you do a self-vote instead of just replacing out?

1. This game has already had a lot of replacements, I don't want to burden the mod with another one
2. This game is fairly long, I don't want to burden a player with reading this many pages
3. There is a light at the end of the road - I am happier than when I made that vote but I am still pretty busy. It might let up in a couple of weeks

Darthe, don't be like me. Don't warp your mind into thinking something is 100% when you only have your assumptions to rely on.

[Bumi]

I'm mainly interested in Aj because of his pressure on AA for what I thought was a rather innocuous comment and his pressure of Nj stating that he will crack under the pressure.

His comments invalidate any pressure he would hope to achieve. With his experience, wouldn't he have realized that?

[Bumi]

VOTE: Aj

Just now realized I wasn't voting him

I will look over Ztife over the next 4 hours

[Bumi]

I did not know that.

[Bumi]

Skimming the last few pages and seeing the votes + justification on Darthe make me want to clarify something.

Roger and I were given pre-game talk. Once the required amount of players confirmed Stranger closed the messaging service (Quick Topic) to new posts. We don't have daytalk that is true, but Rfer and I did have some short discussion prior to the game officially beginning.

We talked about the importance of cars actually. I think Darthe is likely town because of Roger's actions.

[Bumi]

i think what darthe does in his next post in regards to these post, will be telling.

Why say this?

[Bumi]

UNVOTE: Zifte
VOTE: Mini Liberian WAGOOOON

@Arc: I am just a Ninja in the night...

More information available now so you don't have to wagon for the sake of wagon-ing.

Bird, why did you vote ML?

[Bumi]

Darthe I want to slap you for that psychological analysis.

Edt: it keys off darthe's actions. Now they aren't "pure"

[Bumi]

We aren't neighbors because of our cars if that is what you are asking Llama.

[Bumi]

I really don't understand the way cars are connected to powers or if they are at all based on my pm

[Bumi]

So, unless you want to contend Darthe is scum-idiot, he's most likely town who thinks Bumi is scum.

I can get down with this reasoning.

UNVOTE: Darthe

VOTE: LlamaFluff for his predecessor's slip just prior to the modkill.

Where?

[Bumi]

Modkilled for saying what Parama said is not true?

[Bumi]

How did you get that from SC's post?

I thought it would be likely that what he said was true and that's why he was killed.

[Bumi]

I think you are jumping to conclusions, Sly.

Street racers fall into the bad driver category because they are dangerous to the public. Bad drivers could mean mot corrupt drivers too I guess. But that flavor makes sense as NYPD.

[Bumi]

Oh... Let me look at that again

[Bumi]

I actually think you might be onto something there.
Six never said he was a cop or state that he was a cop car other than stating he was a Jailkeeper... And even then the only "cop" aspects were the jail cell and handcuffs comment
VOTE: Llama

[Bumi]

I thought you were trying to explain something about multiple scum groups between cops and criminals as opposition to MRC or something.

[Bumi]

B&B, you still didn't answer my question. I told you exactly what's true: Scum will not claim anything but a power role today, especially if on the chopping block.

That's traditional play.

His claim is too weird to be scum.

[Bumi]

Plus if this does happen to be multiple scum groups then a universal backup is more likely town.

This is the first time mafia have flipped blue in my playing history.

[Bumi]

But if this is Llama-town, do your homework, guys, to demonstrate to me that theorem.

Two way street.

[Bumi]

If anybody is wiling to just plain have a Bumi-null lynch I'm open to it

What would that give you?

[Bumi]

Why would we need to worry about no lynch? There is no deadline.

You have abnormal fears. Why try to push through a compromise lynch when we have all the time in the world?

[Bumi]

A compromise is never going to land on scum just by the way.

[Bumi]

Triage? What does that word mean in this context?

[Bumi]

See the reason I think Parama slipped is that Sixx claimed Jailkeeper and in his claim post talked about being a literal Jailkeeper... His power came not from his car but from having the "cuffs and a cell" to put a stop to the dangerous driving. Parama then assumes that he his flavor is cop and he has a cop car when there was no indication that he drove a cop car or was flavorly a cop.

The no-fakeclaim stuff that Llama and Sly were going after is a little but erroneous. The mod made it noticeable in my PM at least that cars aren't why Darthe and I are neighbors. He made it noticeable that I didn't know Darthe's ride. Sixx could have feared a rolecop type ability that could snuff out fake claims if the car isn't legitimate.

Getting angry at Sly for thinking Sixx didn't have a fakeclaim when Sixx could have is a little mean and condescending. I don't see myself agreeing with any of what Llama said against Sly but then again I don't think Sly and I ever really saw the slip as a slip for the same reasons.

Nacho, after this weekend (Monday I have off) I can put more work into this game.

[Bumi]

Could the people still voting TML tell me why they are still on him?

[Bumi]

Jacob why are you voting ArcAngel?

[Bumi]

We are not lynching Ztife.

Jacob, the only post that redeemed you was 1938 because it is so close minded.

I am quite happy with my Llama vote. I also support any AJ wagon as well.

[Bumi]

Ok. Llama. Have it your way (tm).

The moment Ztife flips town, your ass is in the noose.

I want everyone to heed these words if they go through with this and Ztife turns up town.

[Bumi]

Ok. Llama. Have it your way (tm).

The moment Ztife flips town, your ass is in the noose.

I want everyone to heed these words if they go through with this and Ztife turns up town.

What if he is scum? You are going to self-vote or something in that case?

Nothing about his claim makes sense. Nothing about letting him LIVE make sense. His car is a doctor because its fast? Nah mines faster. He has a "medical toolbox" in the car that is a pseudo-ambulance? Nah.

You say your flavor isnt the strongest on neighbors, but it conflicts with itself?

Where did I ever say my flavor wasn't strongest about being neighbors?

[Bumi]

I'm never supporting a Ztife lynch.

Scum would be careful, like Sixx tried to do. They will make a claim in one post. Adding to the claim means Ztife is more likely town since he isn't afraid of fixing things. His lack of fear about claiming and fear of Sixx getting lynched make sense from a townie perspective.

Please quote this comment Llama. I'm old and I forget things. Seriously. Please quote it.

[Bumi]

Honestly your logic means that anyone driving a Mercedes SLK or an Audi R8 should be a doctor since they are faster... Do you not see how dumb that is?

[Bumi]

There are several things wrong with your analysis but I don't have the appropriate amount of time required to make a post displaying why.

I ask for lynch to be post-poned for a few real life days while I situate myself.

Llama, would you say a Ford Fiesta is not a face car?

[Bumi]

Face = fast

[Bumi]

Llama this is a yes or no and should be a quick response.

[Bumi]

Llama how familiar are you with drag racing and cars in general?

[Bumi]

...

[Bumi]

Problematic.

I will think about this over the next few days.

(stares blankly)

[Bumi]

Post tomorrow

[Bumi]

Excuse me?

[Bumi]

Aj are you voting me based on proficiency?