Saki Achiga-hen episode of side-A Mafia [OK]

[Voidedmafia]

I think I'll take the same path as Varsoon.

[Voidedmafia]

[Voidedmafia]

Can I get passing credit now?

P-edit: not amused yet.

[Voidedmafia]

or

I can vote Bulgescience

that seems better

Meh.

[Voidedmafia]

Professor (is that "g" a typo?), enlighten me.

P-EDIT: what Pie said.

[Voidedmafia]

Joy.

I can kinda-sorta buy Varsoon jumping to conclusions based on previous experience with Notsci. Although if hydras could not slip that'd be nice.

Kuro, Varsoon did answer your question. I find this denial suspect.

Vote: Kuro

[Voidedmafia]

Also, while I'm only playing in this game right now, I'm expecting to be co-modding a Large sometime down the line. I'm also going to be busy with work and college most of the time, though I will do my best to be active when I have the time. If/when my hours change I will try to inform you guys.

[Voidedmafia]

from what I do know about Varsoon based on what I hear and (what I think) I've seen he's confident enough to play without really thinking things through. I will probably defer more to Notsci or nacho, or anyone else who knows him better than me but I do like him based on the fact that he isn't really willing to follow me, and for similar reasons I like both you and voided.

This isn't following for me.

I am sorry Voided-senpai, but he didn't. All he did was state 2 things, one that Benjamin-san had been policy lynched in previous games, and two that there was a fast growing wagon on him during RVS... which is something that always happens in RVS, so im still in the dark about how he got policy lynch out of that.

First off, Voided-senpai? I'm not nearly old enough on this site nor experienced enough to be called senpai, nor am I particularly keen on it as flavor text.

Secondly, the connection is Benjamin has been PL'd before>a fast wagon grows on him (even if it's RVS)>smells like a possible quicklynch>Hold up, people! If Varsoon's experience with Notsci is accurate, it's not a bad jump to make, although it's a very hasty one.

can I just call Varsoon and Prof both scum or is it too early to be cocky about things

It's never too early to be cocky, but maybe too early to be openly cocky. If that makes sense.

I feel like if I keep posting, my real reads will become known before I can talk to mastin about it!

but, maybe.

If my history with her is an indication, it's going to happen anyways.

@Kuro: An excuse for... what?
The wagon on you has formed because of what I've outlined--your reactions to my response fly in the face of the reality of the game.

I do not know, and honestly, i do not care either anymore, nor care about your reasons for thinking Benjamin-san was a policy lynch.
Also do not act like you're the one that formed the wagon on me, you just sheeped voided's reason.

Funny, I don't see any sort of indication Varsoon's taking credit for it. I like this wagon more.

And even more, given how hard Kuro is going on this.

[Voidedmafia]

I don't understand any of the last 4 posts...

Say hello to Metal Sonic.

Btw, are you drunk yet, MS?

Lufan had tons of posts to discuss, plenty of people to take a stance on. Instead he chose to comment on Mac's post about his attempts to become a hot mess of a boozehound.

Why?

Me and my vote say because he's scum avoiding the game moving at a steady clip. And that it's very possible that one of his buddies was under at least SOME scrutiny at the time, and felt too awkward to drive convo elsewhere but also wasn't willing to bus quite yet.

Possible. I'll keep this in mind.

So you could get behind it even though you completely missed the point, but you won't because you need to fry a bigger fish that you aren't particularly frying?

It's like all these reasons are just rolling in!

@Voided...in what world does "the wagon on you has formed because of what I've outlined" not constitute as taking credit...

I saw it more as credit for it being a thing, not forming it.

[Voidedmafia]

The people getting scrutiny at that point in time were varsoon and the hydra of marangal-mastin. And mastin appears to be in the middle of a summer map, so just varsoon and mara, really. My current working theory is that lufan is scum with one of the two of those.

There's also absolutely no way you could actually be thinking I'm scum with my entrance.

dead serious about this.

Because?

Also, Voided feels like he's talking out of the side of his mouth for the sake of looking involved.

'scuse me from having to post after you've already talked for a page.

Which is good because I started town reading you before that, lol.

So you're townreading him more now?

[Voidedmafia]

That's nice. Now do something.

[Voidedmafia]

This is pretty clearly town-mara!

he may not be looking up new meta, but he knows enough about me as a person and supposedly has a mental binder of mine.

pedit:
VOTE: Kuro

...I have no idea what Town-Mara is supposed to look like. Excuse me if I take this with a grain of salt.

Marquis, not really. At your Ceph>Lufan thing.

[Voidedmafia]

I don't mind at all but ceph found it pretty recognizable ( I think) and nacho should soon, to. Cabd has known me longer than ceph and better so why should I not expect him to catch it?

I...guess?

Why kuro over lufan?

[Voidedmafia]

...ms
ms
please tell me i didn't get it wrong

I'm pretty sure it's all been MS.

[Voidedmafia]

Kuro is fucking town, everyone on her wagon: go and stay go.

Yeahno. Explain.

Also, fuck no you don't have a restriction.

Blanket nulls for Singer, Marquis, and Benjamin due to meta-stuff that I'm not really in the know about (nor want to read up on). Need more, so sticking on scum.

(points for realizing something, people)

p-edit: Also, that reasoning for Benjamin-town is kinda silly

[Voidedmafia]

Reasoning? I didn't give any reasoning.

I was referring to Kuro's post.

Do you not see the similarities between cabds reason for scum-reading lufan and his own play so far?

Why is this supposed similarity important?

1. Regarding kuro. She kept harping on varsoon over the policy lynch thing, and I would agree with her statements over varsoons. Varsoon didnt quite answer her question. The fact that she didn't back off her varsoon read despite the pressure against her and her wagon is townie imo. Also considering that during my read through I felt scum pings from varsoon, seeing kuro against him reinforced a town read on her. As for the post I quoted of hers, I quoted it for a reason. I find her confidence townie; I like that tongue in check, cocksure attitude, and frankly I expect scum to be more milquetoast.

Also also read her more recent posts; they're good.

2. Of course I don't have a post restriction, I said as much when I claimed it. I mean. What? Oh yeah post restriction, I have a post restriction. Yes.

Varsoon did answer he question quite clearly. I mean, what part of " coupled with the ways in which players joined without much input had me leaning that the wagon was likely a quick RVS wagon and may have some members who are voting it for policy reasons" didn't answer Kuro's question? The problem is that she's saying one thing but the facts say something different. And I find it hard to look town by harping on a question that was already answered.

What scum pings from Varsoon?

I can be tongue-in-cheek and cocksure when I've been scum. That's not really a point in her favor, at least by itself.

No they aren't. She doesn't respond well to Chandra, for one thing. Also, her attempt to re-state her "case" on Varsoon didn't do anything beyond showing her denial and discrediting his analysis.

To answer your question. I have played 2 games with lufan. This is what lufan does. Lufan does not play mafia. Lufan observes mafia, and fluff posts just enough to avoid prods. If he has a role, he pays just enough attention to submit a night action, maybe.

.......

...Hoo, boy, this ain't gonna be fun.

Post 311 is better, although I don't see why an intent to change playstyles warrants a townread (and why Varsoon and Cabd, who say as much as well, either get scumread or not mentioned at all). Also don't think Kuro's responses are good, but I suppose some measure of respect can be found in sticking to your guns.

I like Bins more in his argument with Singer.

The three different spoilers are different phases of my push/interaction with him that has already happened this far I feel like it's pretty important to note that in the first spoiler, I've already started to push him, but he hasn't gotten involved with the game at all. He hasn't interacted with people, and just put up his disclaimers (which is something I could have also very, very easily done but it does absolutely nothing) and is just overall lack luster. It's also pretty interesting that he did notice that there was stuff lufan could have commented on from the first page stuff he failed to comment on himself and that in the second spoiler, I've already had been suggesting his lynch. He says himself that I'm "pushing his mislynch" which suggests that he feels like I'm not going to back off on this.

In the second spoiler he's become more active, and more analytical of game-state which is what I wanted from the beginning and I was pretty content with itwhich lead to my unvote in the third spoiler, hoping he would keep the momentum up but I feel like he's stopped analyzing players. If he actually thinks I'm scum with Lufan, there's no reason for him to not push me. There is no reason for him to not try and find scum-intent in my post. I don't feel like he's really looking into varsoon, either who is apparently his other pick for scum with lufan.

Okay, this makes more sense.

Do you think people aren't looking into Varsoon because of what Kuro has already said? (This may be a late question, but still)

[Voidedmafia]

Am I crazy to be thinking he has zero productivity in the first and third spoiler?

No?

VOTE: Cabd
You seem different than the Cabd I've played with before, and it feels more like you're trying to hide something.

Like what?

I explained it before, i didn't like lufan-san either, but i said it was better to lynch someone like Mr Evil Face Man over someone with zero content, so your read is basically "he's scummy as either alignment so we shouldn't lynch him"?

Varsoon is easier to type, yknow.

And if that's Elbirn's conclusion, the correct choice is to lynch him anyways to force him to change, not go "meh, it's lufan" and encourage it.

Nobody else is going to comment on Lufan doing nothing more than blind sheeping mara's emotional hissy fit then proceeding to burn any sense of credibility by commenting on literally nothing else in the game?

I'm gonna comment but you gotta let me post first.

I still feel better about Bins. Although I agree with Cabd there's a lot of Bins and Singer reading far more into each other's posts than necessary, I think singer comes off as town pouncing too early.

[Voidedmafia]

Does that mean you think she's more town than I am? That you don't think we're the same alignment? That's a really vague statement for a really in depth argument we just had, and you're doing both of us a disservice by not being more specific on your thoughts that could help us parse each other out in the future...or yourself for that matter.

You both are town getting way too deep into each other than necessary. Bins feels more town than you, but you're both town.

I didn't call either of you scum, so I don't see where you two having opposite alignments IMO can be a thing. And are you asking me to give some big review on that? Because I really don't want to.

There was plenty of discussion before then and like I told Voided, you're doing us a disservice by not only avoiding commenting on it, but also using it as an excuse for not commenting on it (and "going silent").

You posted that entire argument while I was at work! How am I supposed to comment on it then when I can't access the internet?

I mean, that's what this looks like. And my post-argument comments aren't going to look very inspired because I'm not posting in the moment, anyways.

Fuck reading arguments or listening to logic or thinking with your head, just talk a lot of shit. That always works.

Vars. Stop. Now.

P-EDIT: So you think Cabd's playing some kind of aloof know-it-all game with Prog, etc., Lufan?

[Voidedmafia]

I actually agree with that, i just don't see any gain from lynching a player with Zero Content, unless he flips scum in which case at least we're advancing towards our win con. Although at the very least there is some sort of content now so i wouldn't be opposed to lynching him.

I don't think he has enough content to be in the no-lynch zone. He's in town purgatory right now, rather.

And if that's Elbirn's conclusion, the correct choice is to lynch him anyways to force him to change, not go "meh, it's lufan" and encourage it.

I actually agree with that, i just don't see any gain from lynching a player with Zero Content, unless he flips scum in which case at least we're advancing towards our win con. Although at the very least there is some sort of content now so i wouldn't be opposed to lynching him.

Have something to say, Chandra?

[Voidedmafia]

I don't think he has enough content to be in the no-lynch zone. He's in town purgatory right now, rather.

Where did i say that he was in the no-lynch zone?
He's done at least 2 things that Cabd-san already pointed out, Voted for him and sheeped Emotion-sensei, those are stances and content that he inadvertly or purposefully generated.

Actually, what DID this mean:

Although at the very least there is some sort of content now so i wouldn't be opposed to lynching him

So you don't like his content?

P-EDIT: Lufan, why do you think so? Also, why are you focusing on only this?

And Singer, I'm not quite parsing this.

[Voidedmafia]

So you don't like his content?

I didnt like what he was doing, as i agreed with Cabd about his post, but i didnt want to lynch a Zero Content player. He now has content, and i didnt like the content he generated either, so i still dont like him, but now i wouldn't mind lynching him.

Ah, okay. Parsing failure on my part.

What about Bins? Did you give a read on him?

P-EDIT: Why, Marq?

[Voidedmafia]

I think so because I've seen him pull this off before. He can seem to know nothing, but know the solution, or he seems to know it all, but never really knew anything at all, and tends to be wrong. Why am I only focusing on this? Because he's one of the few players I actually can understand quickly, due to him being one of the two players who helped me learn how to play. I'm learning the rest as I go.

...Okay, I guess?

@Varsoon...I already admitted I was wrong about why I was town-reading you.

I also classified "mislynch" speaking from your point of view that IF YOU ARE TOWN then to stop AtEing because it's not doing anyone any favors and makes me feel like you're just putting on a show.

But whatever, I was trying to get Nacho around to talk about your wagon that he's barely discussed despite being on it and he's not even around to discuss it right now. I don't like how quiet he's been comparatively (yes I know it's barely been open 24 hours but still) since I've only recently seen him as a town leader and this is quite the opposite.

unvote
vote: Marquis

Wait, why'd you vote Marquis?

[Voidedmafia]

SINGER IS TOWN
I JUST

I DON'T BLAME HER
FOR VOTING YOU
FOR JUST
HER REASONING ON THAT IS GOOD ACTUALLY
so it's kind of refreshing??

i need
to ban myself from caps
people think I'm screaming
its just my loud internal dialogue

Okay. So...what reasoning was that?

[Voidedmafia]

Did you say Kuro was town?

[Voidedmafia]

hey
hey voided why did you fixate

What?

You asked us to point you at a thing. I'm pointing. What's the problem?

as in why do you care
emphasis on the you

Kuro mentioned the lack of a visible reason, I checked back, noticed that there wasn't a reason listed when singer did vote (at least not that I saw), so I wanna know.

Why are you acting like this is a bad thing?

voided she's going to yell at you for not reading

beware

For not reading what? I'm not going to log every single post everyone makes nor be expected to remember them on a moment's notice. If there isn't a reason within a couple pages of the vote (if not when the vote is placed), then you can't get mad at me for asking why you're voting.

i don't think voided's incessant yet weak interrogation tactics are genuine
like
they look exactly like a scum-designed constant-activity-without-rubbing-anyone-the-wrong-way choice of pursuit
and from his general tone/feel this game there's been absolutely nothing rubbing me the good way either

I'm not a pusher. Never really have been. Although I haven't been able find anything I feel I can really commentate on, anyways.

[Voidedmafia]

(Well, specifically in-the-moment commenting. Because, yknow, hard to do that in a classroom or at work since I don't have access to the internet.)

[Voidedmafia]

I am not sure what varsoon has to do with my post there, or kuro?

I am also not very sure why you're asking me this question? I feel like Varsoon is being put on a hot plate and I don't actually understand why. I feel like he's around, and one of the people who are interacting with everyone else

the kuro-varsoon interaction is weird, and I feel like she was pushing a baseless push against him re-iso'ing both of them. At least initially and I can't really follow her

You said he wasn't pushing Varsoon anymore, I was asking if you think that it's because of what was going on between Varsoon, Kuro, and myself.

Who do you think I should be asking, then?

Do you think the baseless push is alignment-indicative?

[Voidedmafia]

Not really seeing your problem with the 1st quote.

[Voidedmafia]

Like, you basically said "point me somewhere". I pointed you somewhere and you're biting my finger. What the hell?

P-EDIT: You're not really answering his last sentence.

[Voidedmafia]

1st sentence is at Marquis, 2nd at Lufan.

[Voidedmafia]

Mastin, y u put in more effort when we're not hyraing? You make me supersad.

[Voidedmafia]

(well, not that you're going to see that for about 1-2 days, but still)

(But not to me. Could be scum for stuff like 122, but otherwise has looked fine.)

So, what about her thing re: Varsoon, again?

[Voidedmafia]

And rather don't like the sudden pressure there.

On Lufan?

[Voidedmafia]

Go with the read that feels most correct.

Though, on that note, I am feeling slightly better about Kuro, so I'll

unvote

Vote Nacho

Why aren't you here?

[Voidedmafia]

Variety of reasons. Real-life circumstances, dynamics with hydra partners (hydraing with you was mostly a "Sure, why not?" thing if I recall), dynamics with the playerlist, and role. (I actually know how to play this role! Well, sort-of.)

Now you make me even more sad. *sniff*

Well, yes, but I was more talking about the sudden re-emergence of the pressure on notty just when notty was becoming obvtown.

Maybe I wasn't paying attention, but I don't remember there being pressure on Notscience.

I haven't been an active presence because I'm actively trying not to add to the clutter of the game because it's a tiny bit of a problem at this point and I'd really love to play with Xtoxm, who won't be able to continue playing if it continues at this pace.

I think you can give at least a one-liner comment every few minutes. That shouldn't add too much clutter.

[Voidedmafia]

And rather don't like the sudden pressure there.

Okay, I stand corrected. I think Not did fine there, though.

I don't want to clutter up the game, so I've tried to refrain from commenting on things as they happen, but;
Cabd, those reads are surprisingly lackluster.
I'd like you to elaborate on, well, pretty much all of them. At least a sentence would be fine?
I don't understand why you're pushing Lufan so strongly.
I don't get what puts Bins, Voided, and I in such a low boat and what makes farside, singer, chandra, kuro, and pie so strongly townread by you.
From where I am, I'd almost flip your entire reads-list.
Which, eh, may be indicative that we're not on the same team, here.

While I suppose I should be happy that I'm a townread, I'm not sure what makes pie be a townread, either. or G&S.

I get his Lufan push, though.

I don't want to clutter up the game, so I've tried to refrain from commenting on things as they happen, but;
Cabd, those reads are surprisingly lackluster.
I'd like you to elaborate on, well, pretty much all of them. At least a sentence would be fine?
I don't understand why you're pushing Lufan so strongly.
I don't get what puts Bins, Voided, and I in such a low boat and what makes farside, singer, chandra, kuro, and pie so strongly townread by you.
From where I am, I'd almost flip your entire reads-list.
Which, eh, may be indicative that we're not on the same team, here.

While I suppose I should be happy that I'm a townread, I'm not sure what makes pie be a townread, either. or G&S.

I get his Lufan push, though.

VOTE: Cabd
At least until my 518 gets responded to.
Kuro, don't think this means you're off the hook.

I actually think Kuro looks better now.

unvote

I feel like my vote would be going on one of the non-posters, so I'm not going to vote just yet. I get pulls to vote Cabd, but I don't feel like doing that just yet.

Voidedmafia<--Maybe it's been too long since I've seen his scumgame, but this REALLY feels like his hydra game with me.

It's been too long because EVERY GAME SINCE I CAME BACK has been a town game. Seriously, my last scumgame was Shadows and Lights, and that was 1 1/2 years ago.

[Voidedmafia]

If it makes you feel better, I absolutely loved what hydraing we HAVE done. 'Sides, chose you as a co-mod for good reason! You're different than me, and different is a good thing.

Well, that's fine, but it just hurts a little to think I was a hydra of convenience than of an active "yeah, I want to hydra with you!"

[Voidedmafia]

Oh, I mean, something something... [insert protown comment]

[insert suspicions raised comment]

[Voidedmafia]

Voided-san I would like to know why did your read on me change. Since i don't think i've done anything different other than stop voting Varsoon to vote... someone you said you're townreading?.

I've never voted singer?

Like, until I voted Nacho my only vote had been on you. Speaking of you, though, if I think about your play and completely ignore what happened early on, you're on the town side. Factoring that in, you're still town but on the null side. Essentially out of my want-to-lynch range for the time being.

[Voidedmafia]

Although I also have a light townread on singer.

P-EDIT: Oh, I thought you were talking about me.

Anyways, it wasn't your vote, it's more your play from then. I like the majority of the things you talk about that aren't Varsoon, but cringe whenever you do talk about Varsoon, so.

[Voidedmafia]

Now as for lufan. I get my stance on him sucks. But fact is I am not confident in him being scum, and therefore I'm not touching him with a 30 foot pole. You guys wanna wagon him, that's great. I'm gonna be over here, not doing that. I don't think the way to get him to improve is Pl lynch him, I think he needs to be engaged and asked questions.

Well, was he engaged before and still acted that way?

so elbirn is obviously town...

I mean, I guess I'm okay with that because that was moonlogic-y enough to look town, but I'm not sure about obvtown.

[Voidedmafia]

I have found Bins' reactions to have needless quantities of fakeable ATE; I don't like the number of players jumping in to defend her; some of her points have been very exaggerated and accused singer of things she was not doing. I am, however, considering other options.

I agree that Bins was accusing Singer of some things Singer wasn't doing, but I also think that Singer was doing the same as well, and that Bins wasn't doing it out of fake AtE.

I don't see how you could be townreading some of the players at the bottom of Cabd's list. I can see Bins, actually, and that is about it.

I wonder if Varsoon thinks lufan is really town.

I don't find your alleged confusion genuine. Obviously, bussing exists, and chances are not all of your reads are going to be right all the time. No one is this cocky.

Except you?

Are you suggesting that Kuro is being really confident in her three scumreads and is masking it with confusion? Otherwise I don't really get everything except the first part of this quote (about the confusion)

[Voidedmafia]

This isn't making me townread you, if that's what you were going for.

I'm not understanding what you're doing here at all, Chandra. Your aggression (or standoffish-ness, I guess) appears pointless and not to get a read but to just get a rise. I don't like it.

...

Seems like it's normal here for people to give unexplained votes? u.u

UNVOTE: singer-chan
VOTE: Nachomamma-san

Voting people without reason in hopes to get a reaction is a thing. It's not a thing I personally agree with, but it's a thing.

He'll talk if you talk to him. I just feel like he's an enigma and I generally don't understand him personally. Uhm. Look in my games for "paradise lost". Me and lufan were there. I started off wanting him dead, then 180'd on him after another game with him started (Rick and morty mafia) and I saw him acting the same way. Town-equinox reached out to him pretty strongly, but if in recall correctly I was left scratching my head at that point.

Wait, you got a 180 based on an ongoing (at the time) game?

[Voidedmafia]

Hi pidgey! You are town, so that's cool

Pidgey's intro feels underwhelming. Why is he town?

Hey far are you townreading marquis?

Not directed at me, but I don't. In fairness, though, it's just as likely a knee-jerk read based on his sudden and not-really-explained scumread on me (I mean, he's explained it, but there's been no follow-up to my questions for elaboration, so)

I DONT KNOW

lately

everyone is just
"not making sense"

but like 100000% more scummy than singer's confusingness.

Why do you think it doesn't make sense to vote with a scumspect? I mean, it seems straightforward to me.

[Voidedmafia]

If you think it's from town why does it matter if it makes sense or not?

Because it should make sense for everyone else trying to follow your logic to understand it instead of being gibberish that they're just supposed to nod and accept.

I was kinda hoping there were posts in between mine. Oh well.

[Voidedmafia]

meanwhile can someone explain to me the nacho-wagon?

Think it relates to how not-there Nacho's been. Specifically in that he's been here to place votes but hasn't really been posting under the guise of "not cluttering up the thread for Xtoxm". And kinda disappearing when kuro asked him to explain his vote on Varsoon.

[Voidedmafia]

I think it's generally agreed he's under the radar.

Does his reason of wanting to play with Xtoxm stand up to you, though?

[Voidedmafia]

can we please stop defending bins every time one person votes her

i get you have townreads on her

that's not a reason to shut down every interaction and make sure not one vote blemishes her gentle little soul isn't she so precious

let things happen

Wait, who did this?

Response to your later post after class.

[Voidedmafia]

LA for an indeterminate amount of time, may be upped to full replacement.

Not in the mood to talk right now, Chandra. I might get back with you later.

[Voidedmafia]

Rescind that LA

Maybe so. You asked for reasons, you got reasons.

Don't know how anyone could think that at this stage

Do you see me thinking I've nailed three scum to the point of "one of my scumreads is voting the other and IM JUST SO CONFUSED I CANT THINK OF ONE THING THAT COULD EXPLAIN THIS OMGGGG"

You will not see me trying to peg entire teams at once. I can be cocky about individual reads, but no matter how sure I am that three players are scum, yeah, I know they probably aren't all correct. That's just being realistic.

I think there are two obvious conclusions and if someone can't come to either of them I have to think they just aren't thinking critically.

Well, I'm not going to stop doing it. It produces results sometimes. I'm still learning.

His thoughts seem pretty real to me. Some were deeper than they needed to be. He is reminding me of our first game together with the voluminous and off the cuff posting.

That's fine.

Regarding Kuro, do you think this has hints of tryhard scum that I believe Profgessor mentioned before?

re: ZZZX I'm not telling you to stop, just try to have a point behind it.

mostly benji, but he isn't the only one

Do you think these sudden hard defenses lean one way or the other?

VOTE: pidgey

Intro posts are fking scummy

So...what makes it different from, say, lufan's?

Yea reading xto ISO id like to see more thought from him because his post are definitely an empty vast of nothingness.

xtoxm's posts may be a pit of nothing, but it feels more like a pit of nothing born from not being here, rather than Nacho's pit of nothing born from actively avoiding everything that's going on.

[Voidedmafia]

I'm serious, by the way.

Though usually I'm not, but pidgey shot up into my scumreads. Just would like you to know

Like, I'm not thrilled about it, either, but not to the point I think he's scum.

Vote singer with me

Vote for a better future

Eh, no.

Well I didn't see that coming.

I'm not even remotely good at this game, nor do I have any illusions about that, and I value the thoughts of everyone I find town (protip that includes you)

I don't even have a good explanation for saying "those reads suck" aside from "I'm hard defending those two specifically and being a cock while I'm at it as emphasis." I'm not even mad. Im not trying to be mean. Your reads are fine. I'm just pretty sure sonic and pie are senpaii's and am expressing my disagreement.

Remind me why Pie and Sonic are supposed to be obvtown again?

[Voidedmafia]

yeah? what about the game?

seems like gin and sonic is beginning to be the most popular bar in town

Not really. Your averseness to the game is telling in a bad way.

I actually quite like seeing Metal Sonic's posts. It always helps me to get a better read on him.
Baccano! Mafia just ended with a lynch on Metal Sonic's slot. I was one of the few players who, through reading what might seem like nonsense, was able to discern he was town. I should've pushed my gut read there stronger and insisted on it. Defaulting to reading his fluff as scum-fluff or discouraging his play is only going to inhibit us.

In my opinion, letting Metal Sonic continue to post unhinged while keeping a discerning eye on his content will make his alignment pretty clear.

Okay, so, like, how the fuck am I supposed to understand what the hell he means, then?! I don't have the Sonic Rosetta Stone that I can cross-reference to English!

i'm serious now btw!! what was i thinking!!!!

So...what the hell was the point of voting me, then?

[Voidedmafia]

Vote: Nacho

This is still good at the moment.

P-EDIT: I agree, the vote seems nonsensical. Marquis has looked nonsensical most of this game, anyways.

[Voidedmafia]

BTW, Marquis, I'm still waiting on you to answer my question to you in 492

[Voidedmafia]

xtoxm's posts may be a pit of nothing, but it feels more like a pit of nothing born from not being here, rather than Nacho's pit of nothing born from actively avoiding everything that's going on.

I resent that. I have an made effort to read every night, and give the opinions I do have, despite the thread billowing out 28 pages in 3 days.[/quote]
Sure, but 6-7 posts in 28 pages? (even allowing that we've only been at it for 3-4 days)

Also has a bit to do with the fact that you're gating Nacho from playing, essentially.

P-EDIT: ANSWER MY QUESTION, FFS!

[Voidedmafia]

@Marquis...the problem I have with your 654 and 460 is that you don't really explain why you think I'm town compared to scum because you've never really seen my scum game, so comparing me to "finding another Titus" works under your assumption I'm town which should be easy to explain past "level of commitment isn't scum-singer" if you're making such a comparison. My paranoia is that you're giving such an easy read on me and catering to that game to confirm that read in order to keep me at bay.

Marquis looks like he's been all over the place this game to me, e.g. his voting pattern concerning me. Can you help me understand this, as someone who has a semblance of recent experience with him?

@Bins...you say in 462 that my reasoning for voting Marquis is good when I never really gave one? What about my "reason" was good...which Voided asked (and you never answered as far as I can tell), and then Marquis gives a weird town-ish read on you with no explanation in 466...

because it was pretty obvious given i was there in the whole argument
and also didn't like his comments

In what argument? You vs. Singer? What does that have to do with voting Marquis?

[Voidedmafia]

singer found a new titus
*popcorn*

btw if it wasn't clear singer is obvtown and whatever it is that's going on rn pls stop

So, just to be sure I'm understanding correctly, you found it suspect that Marquis obvtowned Singer from your argument?

A.) Why?
B.) If you did, why didn't you vote him until much later?

[Voidedmafia]

Tl;dr- What do you think of someone usually residing in the lurkmass, claiming to be better late or if pressured, suddenly being active early?

Either its an attempt to break the trend to be good early and late-game, or it's indicative of a different alignment where he would be better simply because of the information he'd have aka being scum. Idk if there's enough from him to really say which way it goes, though, or if there's possibly a third option.

Tl;dr- What do you think of his engagement with Mara and the game as a whole?

Idk if it speaks more of him than of me, but the most I recall is his interaction with Mara. And in some ways he did look worse off. But now he's said tat he's had crash issues at work(?), though that might be more for recent things than with what happened before. It's hard to really say much of anything about him because after that I think he basically disappeared. It looks suspect because he's not there, but maybe there's something else to it?

Tl;dr- What do you think of his early post restriction claim thing, as well as his interactions regarding bins and lufan?

Hated it.

Bins I don't remember. I dislike that he says that lufan is an enigma and essentially is a lurksack throughout the game, and advises us to talk to him, but doesn't seem to have done much to do the same, so...

Tl;dr- Thoughts on them both tunneling Cabd?

Seems town? I mean, if it was Mastin I'd kinda think it was more town than scum because I don't really see the narrative to it (or maybe I don't have the entire picture, so eh). It's just annoying that they aren't

there

as of late (I mean, they voted nacho with a pair of wonky posts, but).

Also, Mastin, please don't place too much emphasis on our recent games together in part because you've known I was town in every single one. And because I haven't been scum in nearly 2 years. Read me for me, now that we're actually playing separately.

I have nothing really to say, bulge thinks voided is town.

This makes me feel...deficient for some reason.

His interactions are still weird, and I do agree that it looks like he's trying to abate you.

Who's "you"?

Btw, even though I didn't include the full thing, why does the lack of spam make Sonic and marquis at total opposites? Why couldn't they be on the same team and agree that spamming would be counter-productive?

Okay, so this is a read that's bothering me. Farside is a rampant tunneler, by her own admission. In Survivor, we had tribal votes at the end of each phase- these were secret, so it was proposed in order to limit scum's effectiveness that we all blockvote. When we brought this to that tribe, she ignored it because she was that adamant in her reads. I don't see why someone who gets so adamant in their reads as town, would avoid voting someone because A) Another scumread was voting them, or B) Because I said so?

If this is true, then it does look concerning. Not much else to say other than I agree that more questioning is needed here.

[Voidedmafia]

Oh lordy, I see you, Notty. Took me a while to realize that was the post directed at me, lol. I read it all, so I'll pick it apart individually when I'm back on a computer after we win this Gold Cup game.

Oh...oh, okay. Now some of it makes more sense (like the Marquis part).

Still want responses to what I said, though.

[Voidedmafia]

The issue I had was that in the Nightless game, Nacho had no issue becoming the frontrunner and keeping up activity in such an explosive game. I've NEVER seen him play a game this passively as either alignment, so the activity isn't the issue, it's the excuse that he doesn't want to add to the explosiveness even if it's at a detriment to the town's ability to read him.

I don't really mind being a frontrunner as either alignment. I'm not cutting off my activity because I'm going to have trouble keeping up (I won't). I'm not planning on posting so little that no one can ever read me (as far as the big picture goes, my very low content posting lasted for four days?). I'm not planning on posting so little that it won't be like people aren't playing with me (if I'm excited to play with Xtoxm, it doesn't make sense for me to just sort of lurk the game out).

I sort of take issue with the fact that people believe that my legitimate scum strategy coming into this game was to wave a big flag around and go "look at me! I'm gonna lurk!", but I don't necessarily mind the bandwagon on me, it's what I expect when I'm playing differently than I usually do. I'd really prefer *not* to be lynched here since nothing I've done here was actually scummy (not alarmingly townie, but also not scummy), but if a lurker lynch is what the town desires, then OK.

So what exactly is this new gameplay supposed to be then? Because all I see is a player who has refused to interact even when directly asked for 4 days straight.

[Voidedmafia]

I'll be back to my regular schedule sometime this weekend, so pretty please don't kill me while I'm gone.

Would also like to return to not seeing stronger townreads vote me.

Considering the way you're acting, it's not unfounded.

Am acctually feeling weird about metal not trying to itneract with me at all

@METAL FOS

i dont think you can drink during ramadhan...

no sonic club for you

That's stupid.

Well, hi again.

Thoughts on anyone that's not Cabd, go.

[Voidedmafia]

I'm here. Just had a bad day yesterday. Am I missing anything?

719.

They have a mentor/mentee relationship, thoughts on that?

Might be because I just woke up, but what import is there in this?

Many people said this is how lufan just is and cadb still is pushing that lynch and not talking about other reads.
It's easy to go for the lurker lynch which is how I thought about what nacho presented.

That doesn't make them any less suspicious.

mentor/mentee relationships are special

that side, he did ignore that I've also solely been pushing only cabd and hadn't really actually reached out/tried to really sort or make a read on some of the other people in this game

So, do you want us to vote you, then?

[Voidedmafia]

EG there is import, but I'm not going to explain it now.

What EG?

I'm not really sure how he moved into town reading her in 517, despite apparently still scum reading her in 396.

Also, as weird as this is, I feel like it means that he has gears going on in his head and that he's probably thinking things through

Maybe so, but that doesn't excuse the fact it took him until just about now to start talking.

How does cabd has that many votes again? What's the case?

Little of anything after interacting with Profgessor in the first pages, and his only push was on lufan.

[Voidedmafia]

Three pages behind but uh... I actually forgot lufan was one of my old pokemon site people and tbh nothing about him is particularly remarkable? I couldn't actually tell you his playstyle whatsoever. I was actually treating him as somebody I remembered maybe playing a newbie game with or something here on ms.

Drinking code red, waking up, catching up.

I'm...honestly not sure if this is town-cover-up or scum-cover-up, and it makes me feel sad because I feel like it should definitely be one way or the other.

Xtoxm is probably town

Why? Because of the above post

Sonic is probly not town.

Why? Because of the above post.

So you remember I'm a lolsenior with no way I'm dropping my jokes... YAY!

Yeah, let's do away with this soon.

[Voidedmafia]

Scum usually have more scum reads than town.
One of the main reasons I'm townreading both him and Elbrin.

And his townreads align with mine.

Who's? Xtoxm's?

I still think Nachomamma-san's the better lynch, his post regarding Cabd felt dishonest.

It's like everything around Cabd feels dishonest, really.

[Voidedmafia]

I'm reading over both of their isos, and Cabds push on lufan reads more and more like bullshit the more I think about it. Lufan's isn't exactly great but he at least took the time to put a gutread into words, whereas cabd just...bleh. it reads awkward and forced.

Cabd, please explain your post 396. Why are Varsy-baby and Mara scumspects but only if lufan is scum? Cuz to me it looks like some kind of crap added on to a read to give it more "credibility".

"The case on either of you is weaker than the case on him" (paraphrased). The case on two random unassociated people is weaker than your case on one guy, which could be summed up as "he hasn't done anything"?

I'm not a fan of how you're whitewashing Cabd's case, as threadbare as it is. I don't really care for the associations he's trying to make or the reasons for it, but he did have a reason for those.

Nacho - most probably not scum with Varsoon... um, so in 741 you said Cabod was pushing lufan because "the reason [lufan] was lurking is because his scum buddy came under fire early" when he only said it's "very possible" that was the case, in 141... it's not a backbone for his case and you're making it seem like it is.

So, what is the backbone of the case to you, then? His insistence on lufan choosing that one post to talk about over everything else?

[Voidedmafia]

Sonic is just town. I have reason to believe that. If you think otherwise, I'm willing to listen.

So, what parts of Sonic's posts are you reading that's giving you this?

if I told you my reads on Varsoon and Cabd are my initial reads from ~800 posts ago and they have done literally nothing to change them, how would you react to that

Be almost completely unsurprised because they haven't done much of anything after then. Well, Cabd gave his four strongest townreads, but.

I've been prodded.

Dunno about Mara, but I'm quite liking Bitmap for town 'round here.

You have really low standards here, Mastin. Like, really low.

finally
I have the top

Itt we learn that pie's frustrated with being a sub.

(I'm sorry, someone had to say it.)

REALLY, MASTIN?! REALLY?!

[Voidedmafia]

The thing is...
If Nachomamma-san's issue with Cabd-senpai's vote was it's reasoning behind it, Cabd-senpai explained that ages ago, why just start pushing him now, instead of before.
And coincidentially his read on Mr Evil Face Man changed the momment Varsoon's wagon disintegrated.

Because he couldn't get away with not posting anymore, that's why. Having the semblance of a serious wagon does that.

It did? Huh. Also, what's with both "Evil Face Man" and "Varsoon"?

I don't see why she deserves the label "tryhard" compared to any other active player in the game. And I'm not scumreading her strongly anymore if at all.

I suspect it was for how she went after Varsoon, although I saw it more as scum stuck with a read they had to push more than tryhard-ness.

for the example of a bad player.... look up!

Nope, lookin' right at a bad player, right here.

I like Chandra as town.

[Voidedmafia]

oh

ew

VOTE: Marquis

yeah, I'm going to go here.

From ipie's stuff, I take it?

Why do you feel this way?

Well, there's the entire thing with Lufan to start with. I didn't really look at it the first time, but after Profgessor brought it up again I noticed how sleazy it looked, especially coupled with the fact that Cabd didn't comment on most of the things he accuses lufan of not commenting on. (And even if you say that hypocrisy isn't a scumtell, it certainly does nothing for your case to decry someone for not doing something when you never did it either). It also felt like it was an attempt at deflection away from Mara's pressure on him, like when people do something stupid to try and shut up all the jeerers (that's not the best example, but I hope you get what I mean).

In a similar vein, his townread of the hydra also looks like some slight appeasement, although in this case his reasons for townreading them do feel more substantial. I still feel like squinting suspiciously at it, but it's not a read overly worth contesting.

sometimes I feel that people asking for reasons why someone is townreading me are actually just scum finding reasons to not townread me

Or it's because I don't fucking know what they're talking about.

[Voidedmafia]

Also, nacho

and possibly everyone else

are you guys unhappy with his content afterwards because I'm pretty happy with what he's put out after his reachout to me.

Who?

[Voidedmafia]

That is true. But I feel like.... how can lufan be familiar enough with Cabds play to make a judgement call the way he has, and yet apparently cabd doesn't know who he is. I feel that in order for lufan to accurately make that call, he would have had to have played enough games with cabd to be a familiar face.... perhaps I'm looking at it from the wrong angle, and lufan's judgement isn't solid, as they haven't played enough games together, it is thus perfectly reasonable for cabd to not remember him, hence it's all perfectly reasonable and I'm trying to get blood from a stone over here.

You aware Lufan has explicitly mentioned how much experience he and Cabd have together, and that Cabd corrected himself right?

@Nacho/Voided - my understanding was it was a combination lurker-read turned into a scumread because lufan was... voting Cabd...

I guess that works, but I'm pretty sure Cabd held a lufan scumread before lufan actually voted Cabd.

@Voided - reads on Marquis and Varsoon, go

Marquis: scummy side of null; his claim that he doesn't like my posting is okay enough, but not something I have the perspective to really look at, while his initial reasons (which I don't think he's completely rescinded) are obtuse and don't really follow. (again, he asked for a place to point, I point him at Kuro, he suddenly acts like I'm leading him to an electric fence and figuratively bites my hand while claiming I'm fixating).

Varsoon: Town side of null. Though he was town early on, then the lack of activity dulled the read. the semantical hubbub with IPie did nothing for the read, probly soured it more because of how pointless that was.

[Voidedmafia]

I dunno.

You seem to have a little bit more time than he, and you're considerably more underwhelming

That doesn't make it scum to have a differing opinion, necessarily.

Folks...

you

. You're going to behave. Right?

that was me announcing my return, in case anyone let that fly over their heads.

will sync up with sonic and maybe do some reading and see where i'm at

Who are you?

Pidgey I guess I'm okay with as town.
Sonic's still fuck-if-I-know.
I'm kinda warming up to Nacho a bit, although most pickings now aren't all that great.
Farside is replacement pending.
I'm kinda holding out on a read on Mara and Mastin, although gut wants me to just say town because I've hydra'd with Mastin twice already. Also trying not to give too much townpoints for the case on Cabd, and stuff. We'll see.
I'm perfectly okay with removing Hermit, though!

Vote: Constatine

[Voidedmafia]

Since Marquis dissipated, all her replacements have been getting put on the chopping block, and unfortunately enough for me, I've replaced her twice. Don't blv me, then go do some research so you can prove me correct.

I haven't actually read the thread, bcus 'ain't nobody got time for that', but I am assuming I have 5 votes on me bcus she site flaked. If your reasons for voting for Marquis are solely policy, then I would stop, because this thread is really slow and we need to start discussing on a lynch that isn't PL.

Ell. Oh. Fucking. Ell.

This is pretty scummy.

His entire intro up to this point (which is three posts, but still) is scummy.

Really? If you were scumreading me because I've been lurking and you expected differently, I wouldn't expect that to change much based on my offerings lately.

mrrrrph.

[Voidedmafia]

I really don't like how he came out of the woodwork to push the Marquis wagon once The Hermit replaced in.
In my experience, when someone replaces in, usually wagons on that person dissipate--it seemed like an attempt to keep that from happening.
Before that, Voided was voting Nacho, but Nacho's been pretty transparent about their play and I don't really understand Voided's vote there either. Felt like part of a sensationalist kind of wagon that cropped up on Nacho--at the time, the Nacho wagon was at 5 with Xtoxm, Bitmap, Profgessor Emotion, Kuro Matsumi, farside22

He mentions earlier that Marquis has been a bit all over the place, but the timing of the vote here (after Marquis replaces out, not giving any real reasons for the Hermit vote) reads really foul to me.

It was a vote because of his actions in a previous game (omg VM uses meta!), but his posts afterwards (at least, up to this point) don't make me feel better. Sure, it sounds all indifferent and obstinate and tough-guy-ish and it may look like strong town, but it doesn't make me feel like he's got anything to back it up. It's a façade of a good place hiding a derelict home.

Okay, yes, that sounds flowery, but the general point is there's nothing to match his attempts.

Also, Marquis's replace-out had no effect on my vote, if that's what you're implying or saying. The read in part comes from what Marquis has done (and hasn't done), but dropped due to Hermit.

Nacho's explained his positions and reasons for voting in a way that makes clear sense. While his initial vote on me did not seem to have any clear intent, he later qualified why he was voting for me and made it clear. Since then, his machinations have had clear explanations. I don't find myself wondering why he's playing the way he's playing or why he's voting a player, because he's explained it and his explanation makes sense from a town mindset.

You said that cabd-town analyzing the game and cabd-scum analyzing the game have differences; What are those differences?

I guess that works.

And as far as this game is concerned, I am probably the one here who can read him the best. I am the one who's played with him multiple times, and I'm the one who's witnessed his habits regarding posting and such. I think Virtue of that alone should be pretty much enough to invalidate any reason anyone else may have for cabd-scum

...It's not.

Easier answer is that you're just scum and you're affecting a read for one of several reasons.

Or he's town who's placing far too much trust in her ability to read Cabd.

And I'm willing to give some benefit of the doubt for people who can have such high levels of interaction with another player. But at the same time I'm not going to just blindly trust that read. It's like saying you're really powerful without mentioning the feats to back it up: Nothing but hot air.

[Voidedmafia]

Varsoon-san please stop harassing Emotion-sensei with your scummy lies
Emotion-sensei gave you their reasons, you're just looking for any way to attack them now!
On other news, i didn't like Constantine-san voting their townread!
Nacho-san's scum too, his weird vote switch from Varsoon-san looks like they are buddies.

Mara tries to claim that she can really read Cabd and goes on about how much she's lived with him, etc., but gives no games to substantiate this deep level of understanding, either as town or scum. And you think Varsoon's scum for calling her out on it?

Maybe I'd vote Voided as well, probably not. I agree that his vote in me was sensationalist, I don't understand why he is townreading me, but I did like his misplaced pride in getting me to post content.

I don't think I was the sole reason you got to post? I mean, I'd like to think the wagon got you to come back, sensationalist or not, but I'm not claiming I was the guy who did it.

and me liking him as a person has no bearing on how I read him in mafia. I'm more inclined to give him time to participate, then not but I'm not inclined to read him as town just because he's cabd for the same reason I'm not inclined to read you as town just because you're nacho.

And maybe not as intimately as others do, but I know enough to get a solid read off him via meta more at least somewhat realiably

This looks contradictory.

Also, to the last sentence, that doesn't translate to getting others to believe your read.

Am I the only one who thinks the replacement shouldn't inherit the votes of the person he replaced?

Only if the replacement is read as better than the replaced. Also, you weren't even in lynch range, why are you worried?

Especially if Nacho is able to cute said slowness as the reason for his lack of passion and being very in the red on the passion-o-meter.

This is a hilarious typo, btw.

I wouldn't say this slew of posts ignited a Cabd-townread in me, but I do understand his lufan push a lot better and it makes more sense now.

[Voidedmafia]

Also can anyone make a case for the Marquis slot that doesn't include meta and does include morive? I'm having issues following the reasoning behind that wagon, it feels to me like its currently scum splitting mine and his wagons.


I'd like to burn those wagons to the ground and rebuild actual scum lynches from the ashes, but I can't do it alone folks.

well, it's on the other page but I explain why I dislike Hermit. And it hasn't changed in the 4-ish pages since then.

If you drop the vote on lufan and drop him for the rest of today, I'll drop my self-imposed post restriction for the rest of the day.

If this is serious, it's shitty and you're an idiot.

Done, on the condition we revisit it tomorrow; I'm not going to let my non-supported strong opinions derail an otherwise productive session. Deal?

Goes either way in my head (town/scum-wise). I still don't like that Nacho has to accept some sort of deal to get "active", though.

[Voidedmafia]

was punched with a pint of apathy

will bring the moolah later

~sonic

Dude, people are paying for you every time.

[Voidedmafia]

Why?

Because there should be no world where your activity is predicated on someone giving up their reads. Cabd should not have to bargain his push on someone to get you to post more. I certainly see no town motivation to it.

Vote: Nacho

Jokes though

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Voidedmafia

And...?

How is it that I, practically only posting from my commutes, am managing to out-content (note: not outpost, gin and sonic is a testament to that...) most people in the game?

Are you just saying that or does it make anyone scum?

I'm curious as to who he's talking about.

So I can dig this
but why did ya move to Chandra instead? What's the sauce?

Fair point, this.

[Voidedmafia]

Actually yeah, fuck, he doesn't just unvote kuro, he feigns confusion over "ho hum which one of these lurkers am I going to vote"

Voided you slippery eel

I was unvoting Nacho, not Kuro?

I mean, I have done that thing where you forget who you're was voting and unvote to reset, but that wasn't the case here.

[Voidedmafia]

aw man, you think he's trying to rob us?

Why the hell would I rob you in secret when I could just publically complain?

(Besides, at this rate I'm gonna be your designated driver whether I want to be or not <_<)

[Voidedmafia]

I think there's a more than fair chance, I mean he was snooping around here real shady-like the other day. Kept asking me where I would keep a safe if I owned one, and what I'd use for a combination.

I might have let slip that I don't trust safes, money eating metal monsters they be, and that I keep all of my money in my sock.

And I mean I'm just not comfortable with him knowing that

Dude, who the hell are you talking about? I haven't been snooping around

anywhere

.

Quit spewing your lies with your drinks. It's unsightly.

[Voidedmafia]

Yeah you unvoted nacho whilst believing you were unvoting kuro. Unless you want me to believe that you kept a vote on Nacho for 20 minutes and then decided he wasn't worth voting any more due to an offhand comment about Kuro...?

Or I just unvoted Nacho?

[Voidedmafia]

I'm purposefully manipulating my activity, as I've said many times up to this point. Why is it scum motivation to use activity to get a player to stop a push that I feel is antitown and additionally obfuscating my read on him? What does his willingness to take the deal tell you?

Because you're trying to say "hey, either you stop or I'll just lurk or whatever", and just because the push is obscuring your read doesn't make the attempt any less wrong. Also see where I don't think that should be something traded like that, anyways.

It tells me that seeing you be active is more important than his read or his push. Which I suppose is somewhat town-motivated but still feels like a bad deal. And even if I want you to be more active as well I don't see why he has to trade away a push to do it.

That's not what I was accusing you of, but good job at fulfilling what I actually was accusing you of.

Same.

P-edit: Right. Well, I'm just gonna leave you on the wrong island, k?

Vote: Hermit

[Voidedmafia]

...P-Edit was supposed to go below the vote.

[Voidedmafia]

I'm back. And sleepy. but mostly back and in the black?

Eh, my energy is in the red.

Hi Cabd vote voided, it's good fun

Hermit's better.

So what do you call the chandra wagon which consisted solely of himself and nacho, and at a time when the voided wagon already had Hermit and Xtoxm on it?

To be completely fair to Varsoon, Hermit's vote on me is essentially an OMGUS vote, and xtoxm's only somewhat less. It's not exactly the most lucrative of wagoners to hop on with.

FUCK never mind I remembered wrong. Belay thst entire last post.

What, Varsoon is town for not voting Constantine?

Kuro's more certainly town, though.

[Voidedmafia]

Threw this snippet to mastin, and I asked her if I was crazy. It was clear to me what he was trying to get out of the bargain and I couldn't/can't understand how someone couldn't see some town motivations in it unless they weren't looking past the surface.

What did you think the reason for doing this was?

I don't know. It's just incomprehensible to me that anyone would say "Hey, you do X and I'll step up my activity" because it almost seems like it's fishing for an excuse to not do so.

Besides, Mastin should know I can be really dense <_<.

So, if you ended up seeing someone who was tunneling another person while not really giving out thoughts on other people, or didn't really seem to have other scum-reads, you're saying you wouldn't mind them staying in that state and you're saying you wouldn't do anything to possibly get them to do other things in the game?

I think this self-imposed restriction he has is somewhat important to him, otherwise he wouldn't keep it and I think he's saying that Cabd taking a step back and looking at other options for scum is important enough for him to drop the restriction.

I wouldn't want them to stay in that state, no. I guess in that light it's more of "I'll step up if you step up". Which still feels icky because that kind of step-up shouldn't be there at all (hah <_<), but it makes more sense.

Important or not, I don't get what it's meant to do.

So you think he's inexperienced scum who doesn't know what he's doing? (Despite having been a player for a while). I also disagree with this sentiment, but he could be scum for other reasons.

To be fair, it's been a year and a half since I've pulled scum. I could be rusty!

In more seriousness, though, Elbirn, do you think I'm quoting everything for the purpose of obfuscation? I feel like I've tried to explain myself when I should and elaborated on my reads either on my own or when asked. I'm not going to say that everything I quote is going to lead somewhere because it's not. If I manage to point out something or ask a question that gets heads to turn a look more closely, I consider my job done. Maybe it'll lead to a full push, maybe it'll lead to it dropping off either because the person in question took too long to answer or because I lose track of my push as the days go by. It just depends.

[Voidedmafia]

Hello, all

It looks like I have lots of material to read and ponder to catch up with the rest of you, but I'm happy to be here and I will get through everything as quickly as I can. Meanwhile, if my predecessor had a vote out there,

Unvote

.

Regards,
Jazz

Who is this, a GreyICE alt?

(Probly not, but still. It's the same person just black-painted or something. Blackscaled?)

I believe that Elbirn has caught Voidedmafia.

I also believe that Kuro has caught Varsoon.

Xtoxm and Sonic are still scumposting, too.

VOTE: Voidedmafia

Caught me doing what? Posting?

His argument about my posting I'm going to otherwise ignore, but what do you think he's caught re: my votes? Let's say that he's right and I, for whatever reason, unvote Nacho almost as soon as I voted him. I mean, sure? Maybe I forgot I was voting Nacho. Maybe I found something either between those posts or earlier than that that I unvoted for? It seems more odd to me that you'd jump to "his vote on Nacho wasn't real" over anything else that makes more sense.

And his amendment makes even less sense than more. First of all, Nacho WAS lurking around that time, so for all Elbirn knows I was unvoting for that particular reason (and that was part of it). Second of all, I don't see how you get "Which lurker am I gonna vote" out of "I don't want to vote because I feel I'm just going to be voting a lurker". It's a big stretch at best in my wording, and shows more that Elbirn is looking for a reason to justify what he thinks is a sketchy post.

[Voidedmafia]

I wish I had fewer scumreads on this wagon. It is literally elbirn and scumreads. :X

What about the Constantine wagon?

[Voidedmafia]

I'm not sober enough to find it
but if it you link it in will read it through and consider your wisdom

Either way honestly I'm scared that we can't build a new wagon from scratch and push it to lynch

Because I feel generous. Plus I was lynched D1 so there's not the entire game to read! (if you want that, read We Didn't Playtest This)

Either way honestly I'm scared that we can't build a new wagon from scratch and push it to lynch

Let's lynch Scum Varsoon then!

Varsoon isn't happening today, Kuro. It's me or Hermit. Or Chandra. (And I obviously don't want it to be me.)

I've read like 10 of Voided's posts on thst gamr and I already realize I'm an asshole

Fuck I'll vote chandra just lemme read voided again tomorrow, without my bias of thinking he's scum, to really cement it

Oh, you reached it. I'll still link it anyways cuz I feel lazy.

I'm glad Nacho's putting in more effort, though.

(it's 12:30, I'll post more later.)

[Voidedmafia]

even though i was apathetic as fuck, i still remember catching you

I don't remember you "catching" me in Shadows and Lights.

you are like mastina. you can post a wall with 0 content in it

Because I didn't mention reads or something?

I mean, we're discussing how I feel about Nacho. How is that not contentful?

*reads list*
lol

I'm not scum on there? Then why're ya pushing me? Eh? Eh?

I have no problems with Chandra voting Sonic, though.

[Voidedmafia]

What about Hermit? Sonic? Me?

[Voidedmafia]

I'm just going to sit here voting scum while you guys let the scumteam dictate the mislynch of the day.

You sitting on the wagon like this is getting counterproductive. Your stances on Varsoon and Nacho are already well-documented (albeit weaker than the fervor you're putting into getting them lynch), but it should be absolutely clear by now that you don't have any support for your desired wagon.

You had a really great chance to make Voided your counterwagon.
Why didn't you?

Isn't Chandra a counterwagon to

me

?

To be a counterwagon you have to be wagon that formed against a pre-established one, so...

As far as this goes, I can't do a whole lot of this without putting a big red X on his back

I think that if he's town he can handle it, Mara.

Yeah, it's nuts, like, woah, I'm opposed to a bad lynch nominee from the scumread I'm voting.
Insane.

It's like you're not even reading all my posts about how I think we don't need a vanity wagon right now and any wagon this close to deadline needs really good justification/casework/people backing it.

Either that or you are reading my posts and you just choose to neglect what I'm writing for whatever suits your push on me.

I don't think it's just that because multiple people have been telling her to stop the wagon yet she's refused to budge. It's sheer confidence bordering on arrogance that she has no intention of losing, and I'm beginning to doubt that we'll be able to budge her. But try we must since she's one of the active people here.

[Voidedmafia]

Im gonna announce a small V/LA because of EVO weekend! See you guys on monday at most.

"Hey guys I'll be back after deadline ends, have fun killing each other"

Come on
xtom is a saint compared to this guy

Wait, EVO is this weekend? Better look out for Quarters-Finals vods soon.

I'm just going to sit here voting scum while you guys let the scumteam dictate the mislynch of the day.

You sitting on the wagon like this is getting counterproductive. Your stances on Varsoon and Nacho are already well-documented (albeit weaker than the fervor you're putting into getting them lynch), but it should be absolutely clear by now that you don't have any support for your desired wagon.

You had a really great chance to make Voided your counterwagon.
Why didn't you?

Isn't Chandra a counterwagon to

me

?

To be a counterwagon you have to be wagon that formed against a pre-established one, so...

As far as this goes, I can't do a whole lot of this without putting a big red X on his back

I think that if he's town he can handle it, Mara.

also, have you never played a large? two days to get 11 votes on a person is hard, and no-lynches have happened in the past because people have stated things you've recently said about two days being alot of time

Hell, I know WDPT has a slight anomaly with the D1 Jackel wagon, but that was aided by the fact that Jackel completely flubbed his tracker claim and more than half the playlist was active enough to get that wagon through. That realy isn't the case here. And/or the people who are are at odds with each other. Any viable wagon right now needs every vote they can get, but people like you aren't doing it for whatever inane, stubborn reason.

because rl things are totally not as important as mafia.

*Google evo weekend*
*it's a videogame tournament or something*
*"real life"*

Unless pidgey comes jn here with proof that he's a participant and pro vidya gamer, I don't buy it

You cannot seriously be pushing that someone is making up VLA

QFT from Chandra.

[Voidedmafia]

It's funny how the person not wanting me to stay on a vanity wagon is sitting on a vanity wagon.

...A leading wagon is not a vanity wagon.

why do you think so? and why do think Chandra would pick a counterwagon and not help push it? why Xtomx when others, such as voided or constantine would be considerably easier wagon to push and already has multiple votes on the wagon?

Could be avoiding a bus. I'm aware Chandra's said he'd bus Hermit if he thought it'd go through, but still.

And yes i know you already explained that... but if he was that towny for you, i can't think of any sort of reason for this...

Blinded by emotion? I've done votes like that, so you don't really have a reason to scratch that.

Also, I'm not voting Varsoon today.

[Voidedmafia]

get support other than me and i'll come back

But Hermit seems so enticing...

Pedit: so? that happened before he was half-claimed

yet he's still pushing there!

He doesn't believe the half-claim. What's the problem here?

specially because im 95% sure im wrong with the info i have.

EBWODP: 95% sure im correct*

Pffft.

P-EDIT: Because you're lazy and not here, that's why.

[Voidedmafia]

As a side note, Kuro's post is pretty l33t, at least. Heh.

[Voidedmafia]

Spoiler: Because I'm nice like that (also related to Kuro vs. varsoon, btw)

Actually this makes me think Chandra-chan is most likely town.

Why? Because Varsoon hopped off?

The closest thing to something that caused a scumread on Chandra would be your comment on 866... which was proved it was more of you making fun of english and Voided's words were correct, soooo in the end you still got nothing, then this:

Is your point here that there's a lack of reasons given for Varsoon to scumread Chandra? If you read the last line in 408, I think why he doesn't like Chandra is clear. The rest is fluid from there.

Ok:

I don't get what puts

Bins,

Voided

, and I

in such a low boat

and what makes farside, singer, chandra, kuro, and pie so strongly townread by you.

^
Hole
v

Chandra and

Voided are my biggest pings on-wagon.

Did Varsoon think I was town before this post? Why can't it be that Varsoon doesn't understand why Cabd (I think it was Cabd) had me as scum?

Elbirn, that's what I'm saying--Chandra was quickly becoming a vanity wagon with no reasonable chance of being a lynch before the upcoming deadline.
You proved that Voided actually has a chance at being lynched in the time we have left.
I gave that my backing, to make it even more of a reality.

You never voted Voided until Elbirn mentioned him, which is when his wagon was forming, You spent all the time vote parking Cabd who was hot at the time.
Like see the vote count at the top of the page this post was made, he was voting Cabd, and mentioned stuff about Voided, but didnt want to vote him.
This is his next mention of Voided.

Voided's got no votes now that you're voting Cabd, I believe.

Yet he doesnt mind wagoning Chandra when Chandra was only being voted by Nacho?
Like his scumreads always seem to be the most voted person, sans Chandra who was called in by Nacho, who im suspecting to be his partner.

991 was specifically in response to Hermit's question about how many votes I had, so I don't see what it has to do with anything. Like, are you suggesting that it has some connection to Hermit's desire to vote me? Because it can kinda go either way.

^So i make fun of it.

The fact that it's a P-EDIT lessens the point here because Varsoon may not have known that Nacho was going to vote Chandra right then. Even factoring in a possible daychat ability (which I doubt exists, but yknow.

This is false, the posts were simply taken out of ctrl+F in your ISO for Voided and Chandra respectively.

...Which is

exactly his point

.

P-Edit: AS I SAID, IT'S NOT A ROLE, JEESH

Then there's no reason to hide it, now is there?

[Voidedmafia]

His "i'd flip your entire reads list" alludes to he thinking you were town yes.

"Almost". Not an absolute entire, but almost entire.

I think this is actually indicative of PR play

If it was PR play wouldn't it be curbed from the get-go instead of curbed upon pressure? Or perhaps curbed once one too many townreads started rolling in?

Was just showing that he wasn't there because there were no votes there.

So if there were no votes, why would he vote me?

There is for me!

Which is what?

P-EDIT: Just vote Hermit, will ya?

[Voidedmafia]

...okay...

[Voidedmafia]

Wow, you guys got busy in the last two hours.

post traumatic stress disorder

More like "I don't remember you being in Shadows and Lights at all"

I just don't see why we should lynch that slot over Xtoxm.

Vice versa for me.

What information does Constantine give us?

well, Constantine gives some info on me, while Xtoxm gives some info on you. That's about it.

[Voidedmafia]

Sorry i'm underage, and my mom always says to not talk with people that smell to alcohol.

Also it's surprising how i point stuff that i didn't like about Varsoon play and everyone calls me a tunneler, yet Sonic's been pushing people on nothing yet he gets support, at least i know next time i join a game here to just do nothing but post fluff, vote someone and then i'll get support.

Hey, don't you put me in with that crowd!

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Bitmap

There. If we're stuck with a worthless policy lynch, this is it. I'm going to sit here and whatever happens happens.

...Fuck no.

Get your vote somewhere productive.

[Voidedmafia]

I think in part it has to do with the fact that Chandra's still actually talking to people.

[Voidedmafia]

ms

Is Nacho town?

He's been pretty shitty until he wall posted stuff on Chandra scum and voided town

Then he unvoted Chandra

Whatever, issue dealt with

Wait, when the hell did I become town?

if that is really some sort of stupid dayvig, you're literally retarded

Don't do that.

As of page 70 I feel like this is a huge clash of wills and egos that I can't separate. I'll read 71-current when I get off work and have my nap later today.

[Voidedmafia]

HERESY, CHANDRA! HERESY!

Also, I'd yell "BOOYAH" and tell the reticent joiners to suck it, but due to pp. 70-91 and my admitted non-importance to the wagon I'm not going to.

Speaking of those pages, I feel half-tempted to blanket suspect everyone who didn't want to join the Hermit wagon, but instead I'll say Sonic's probly scum.

Vote: Sonic

[Voidedmafia]

vote pidgey

beep boop

Can we not wagon someone who is just not here and instead go for someone who actively spewed a lot of posts but really didn't nor doesn't say much of anything at all?

That was a cool development.

Vote: Nacho

I feel a little less ire over this than a pidgey wagon (it's more "meh" than anything), but I really don't want to re-read 70-91 to try and tease out whether or not I'd support this should a Sonic wagon fall through.

VOTE: pidgey

o and to celebrate the death of one of the scum of our society,

free drinks for everyone on the hermit wagon

No.

I have the belief that the mass roleblocker person is town

he stopped the NK

Effectively we just skipped a night.

everything's fine, there's nothing to worry about

Lol.

Effing lol.

Can we kill this, please?

Anyway given a likely mass RB that explains the no-kill, I prefer Nacho to pidgey

I don't get how one correlates to the other.

I have no idea why a mass RB is a thing unless Sonic is seriously claiming not-claiming he did it.

[Voidedmafia]

You have no reason to defend a Pidgey lynch right now.

You don't think Sonic is scum, or that I'm misplacing my vote?

You have no reason to defend a Pidgey lynch right now.

^
This is really agreeable.
How can you oppose to that wagon? Especially with just a "he's not here" reasoning?

Sonic is a much more subversive entity in this game right now.

Oh yea

Me and ns are town

MArquis tried pulling that dirty trick on both of us lol

yeahnoyou'renot.

oh yea Marquis was pulling something funny to me+ ns

Oh really? What was this, perchance?

[Voidedmafia]

Vote: pidgey

It feels lovely to have the freedom to lurk again!

Fuck no, you aren't. Both the vote and the statement.

Since I didn't get the chance to get my initial reads out on Day 1 due to the late timing of me replacing in and the insane speed of the thread at the time, I'll do that now. On the Town side, I've got Singer, Varsoon, Sonic, Chandra, and Elbirn. On the Scum side, I've got Nacho, Cabd, and maybe Pidgey. Everyone else is somewhere in between at present.

Vote: Nacho

Regards,
Jazz

Reasons for all of those. Especially Sonic.

Voidedmafia — Pretty good stance, man. Probably town. I'm too lazy to quote because the posts are big.

First of all, I'm trying to lower them down to 5 quotes at most (unless I'm doing a case response or something). I think my posts are certainly more quoteable than they used to be.

Secondly, while I agree that I had a stance against Hermit, I'm kinda curious as to why you think it's a good stance. Partially because it was initially policy-turned-actual-scumerad due to Hermit's complete lack of participation and content, partially because I had literally almost no influence on the rest of the wagon.

Voided- Sheeping bulge and singer.

Not really. It may look that way because I was third on there, but I wasn't sheeping them.

[Voidedmafia]

Though, on the subject of Benjamin's reads, I agree with the Wisdom and Sonic observations.

I don't like Voided and Chandra that much but I wanna see if I'm just completely stupid this game.
:/

A bit.

but anyway I don't think I missed much so let's just lynch pidgey and everything will be fine forever

But Sonic needs to die more...

Yeah and he tried to soft defend Marquis at some point but he didn't really get behind it

Yes, that's how I read it as well, particularly posts 955, 957, 1066, 1132, 1217, 1239, 1247, 1533.

Regards,
Jazz

Will check...either tomorrow night or Friday, when I'm not beset by the League Challenger Series, writing my last paper for this class, and getting sucked into reading the Trope Pantheon. And then reading the stories related to that because I'm a sucker for 'em. If this is true, I'm not as opposed to a nacho wagon as I stated, but I still want Sonic to go first.

Same for Pidgey if he soft-defended Marquis and/or called Marquis town.

[Voidedmafia]

*in other news*

Voided desperately tries to derail Pidgey wagon

It's hard to say I'm "derailing it" when I simply want it delayed a day. Besides, other than potentially having associations with Marquis I'm not sure why we're lynching him other than lurking.

This might be in part because I don't remember his posts at all, but.

Voided is def. town due to this (but we already knew that).

Thanks for giving me happy feels, I guess, but I don't see where you got that read started.

Gives a scumread on Nacho but decides to stay on Voided.

How does that tell go? Vote town, suspect scumbuddy?

@voided - how about we lynch someone who

hasn't

been here and hasn't said much of anything at all

that seems better to me

And which is worse? Dragging a game down due to non-attendance, or dragging it down by practically drowning everyone else in your posts?

[Voidedmafia]

And it's because you stuck with it. Unlike, say, Wisdom. You can PL bus your partner. But you wouldn't do it until death.
This townread is more enforced by Hermit and Marquis' stances on you.

I think we can agree those were some fucking weird interactions. At least on Marquis's end.

that's why my favorite players are pie

I don't know if I should take this as a compliment or

You shouldn't.

Yeah, none of Marquis' posts looks like buddying and the townread was pretty empty, he never defended sonic either, and even voted him at some point.

And what about Sonic toward Marquis? Wasn't Sonic against the Hermit wagon?

[Voidedmafia]

And what about Sonic toward Marquis? Wasn't Sonic against the Hermit wagon?

Maybe! (too lazy to read sonic's ISO right now, im pretty sure it has a ton of posts) I only remember sonic wanted Chandra dead with all his might.

That sounds vaguely right (and if Sonic is scum I'd say Chandra's pretty darn town).

[Voidedmafia]

I am sheeping their read on you

A.) Specify, then.

B.) Why?

Voided

The length of your posts are a crime against humanity

Your avatar too

You jelly?

So, can someone smarter than me explain how apparently varsoons stark opposition to hermit lynch is town? Ty.

Because he wasn't discrediting it while saying h would want to join

He wasnt degrading it as a pl

What Benji said. I'm assuming the inverse (voting and not trying to insert ways to weasel out) is why I'm being townread by some.

[Voidedmafia]

It's not a race wisdom

how about both of you shove this somewhere dark, yah?

He "caught" Marquis over some null bullshit on like page 5 or whatever. And pushes it all day. No one's that confident of scum on D1. I figure the plan was to distance until Marquis flaked and Hermit replaced, who various people seem to have called a good policy* lynch so he bussed for real.

*no offence @Hermit if you're reading, just an observation

Okay, so what sort of towncred would Nacho even gain from it?

This is really interesting!!

No it isn't.

I actually like Xtoxm's point.
but yeah this
VOTE: Nachomamma8
I'll probably just get blocked tonight again /anyway/.

What gain is there for doing that play, then? Nacho wasn't steadfastly against it nor steadfastly for it, which may be points against him regardless, but that particular point rings very hollow because I don't really see what Nacho-scum really gains from bussing someone who at least was going to be unhelpful even to his own team and at most was going down D1-2 anyways. It's not going to help him today, it's not going to help him tomorrow, it's not even going to help at LyLo. And I know that Nacho isn't stupid enough to do so willy-nilly either. So either he has a plan of some sort--in which case you'd best enlighten me as to what the long-term goals are--or this isn't indicative of Nacho scum (or at the very least a Nacho/Hermit team).

[Voidedmafia]

Did my phone just auto correct vla to Vladimir..

Nacho is a good pick for his shit push on me. He knows i'm lynchbait and the rest of you don't, and he went for me.

You've shown absolutely no interest in scumhunting since your return. I expected something implying you being even minorly interested in who is scum and for what reasons and seeing if you still got it, but there hasn't been any of the excitement I expected to see as a result.

This is also very true. Ever since the day started he's just been sitting on his Nacho read and focusing on Nacho, without any sort of comment on anyone else. It's attempting to do stuff without any real backing to it.

except that im not being antagonistic? im just the jolly bartender

The jolly bartender who's yelling out the window at the well-kept gentlemen walking by and calling them shit for no reason while they're just minding their own business?

we are lynching sonic, xtoxm or nacho today

we can lynch varsoon after that depending on what they flip

We're not lynching sonic or xtoxm

Why?

I don't know about you, but I think I'm getting decent content from him

and no, we're down a scum so I want him alive. I'm not scum-reading him, and he's the last person I want to mislynch

This better be Mara because if it's Mastin I'm gonna cry now.

[Voidedmafia]

Heading to class. Be back in about 3 hours.

[Voidedmafia]

Why?

because they're not scum?

You keep pushing MS like it's the first time you play with him, wtf?

It still looks shitty and terrible, anyways.

Also reminding me of HUB1 a little, although it's not entirely clear because I don't know if he has a PR or not.

what's wrong with wanting to keep a potential town player who I know is powerful, and I know will likely die at some point before lylo alive?

I don't have a problem with that, just sad that mastin wouldn't have me that high despite being that sure (at least, so long as she isn't paying attention to my request to not hold my previous three games too high due to all of them being town)

Yes, Mara, really.

Get off your tunnel.

Sounds like what I'd do. I don't see it as alignment-indicative.

He confused Constantine with Cabd

It indicates he hasn't read all that well, yes. Not seeing a townslip.

[Voidedmafia]

I actually fucking agree with that sentiment, Mara

But do you agree or disagree that nacho not being obvtown is a scum tell?

Disagree.

It indicates he hasn't read all that well, yes. Not seeing a townslip.

his buddy got lynched and he thinks that was cabd instead?

I've forgotten my buddy before and thought it was someone else. Granted, my buddy didn't get lynched or anything, but I don't think the fact Hermit got lynched has any impact here. Forgetting who was lynched is not a townslip by any stretch.

Ever think I might be doing it

because

Profgressor isn't likely to be lynched?
C'mon.

I figured that out already, though I'm also squinting suspiciously because I'm not sure what it's supposed to do or if it'll be good or bad.

The only people I like on the Nacho wagon are Singer, Varsoon, and Sakura. Bitmap's null due to lurking, Wisdom I just don't like right now (can't make up my mind on his alignment, but I don't like him), Jazz is just kinda there (in part because he hasn't posted much), and Sonic I obviously want lynched.

P-EDIT: Don't read LN's, cliff notes?

[Voidedmafia]

And then this game's stalling... literally got nothing else to say other than i still want nacho dead.
Really guys we got scum D1 it's not the time to start getting apathetic.

I caught up from page 105-ish or so a few days ago, but when I read through those pages I just couldn't decide whether or not the posts leaned one way or another or if I was just deluding myself. Which is fucking annoying.

Although, me being proactive in mafia hasn't really been something I'm used to doing.

Still kinda feel like the Nacho wagon shouldn't exist right now, at least until Xtoxm flips town since it seems likely that they're opposing alignments.

xtoxm: Other than that it seems to be the two of you pushing each other for meta reasons IIRC? The fact that Nacho's the only read you're really pushing.

[Voidedmafia]

If that statement was based in fact, you might have been part way to having a point.

Why are you pushing him then? Who else have you pushed?

[Voidedmafia]

everyones a scummy, scummy scum fuck

Mara. You're drunk. Go to sleep. Or get home safely first if you have to.

You shouldn't post when you're drunk.
When Xtomx countered Voided's argument i went to look at his ISO to verify if it was true or not, and then i found out that indeed, Nacho's not the only person that he's pushed, he even accused notty of busing, among others, i got a townread out of that. Also i love how no one actually decided to counter his Nacho case (aside from Nacho himself, but Nacho-scum wouldn't admit to being scum either way).

I don't remember what his case is or where it is, hence why I asked. Although I'd prefer him to answer me.

[Voidedmafia]

ow

i don't care about this game right now

bye!

HEY! COME BACK HERE!

[Voidedmafia]

. Abcd is V/LA until July 27.

Wait, who the fuck--oh, wait, this is Cabd, ain't it?

[Voidedmafia]

I'd rather he not...

[Voidedmafia]

1968 just feels way too weird to be a turnaround. Although, if I view in the guise of Nacho maybe trying to set up for the turn should Hermit post again and then just going "fuck it" and voting afterwards, it makes more sense.

[Voidedmafia]

He might be talking about me, honestly. And/or Chandra.

Although, I do agree with Wisdom that simply being on a scum lynch doesn't really count as a point in your favor.

[Voidedmafia]

It's prolly more than 20

@Voided Do you believe he put.in such effort that it's warranted to say he saved the town from lynching you?

Me? I believe so. At the very least he helped stop the wagon from growing any further.

As for Chandra, I don't think he did.

[Voidedmafia]

Mara I'm expecting an apology after the flip

And if he flips town we lynch xtoxm fast and hard, yah?

[Voidedmafia]

I just feel Xtoxm has been too singular today.

P-EDIT: Mastin better not have left. I joined because of her.

P-EDIT2: What, exactly, did he do that was so out there, vampirate?

[Voidedmafia]

im glad we have xtoxm around to be super protown, idk what we would do without him

Not sure if sarcastic?

[Voidedmafia]

Im just wary of the last 2 votes, Vampirate's vote is completely null however, if nacho flips scum im townreading everyone in the wagon pre-case.

I can see this, though it won't be full townreads for me (unless they were already strong town to begin with).

[Voidedmafia]

I'm guessing it means you can't choose your target.

VOTE: Benji

You have literally no reason and no grounds to make this vote.

Profgessor and MS are scum. I've already talked about why, but if anyone needs a refresh, let me know.

I only agree on the latter.

try claiming guilty on me so that I can counterclaim you

Because that worked SO WELL for you the last time you got into a claim 1v1?

I should consider scumhunting based on who I would investigate if I were a cop rather than who I think is scummiest.

I seem to be remarkably good at it.

It might help, yeah.

Vote: Ipie

[Voidedmafia]

When was that last time claim 1v1?

HUB1. Against me.

Rolling around at the speed of sound~

Got places to go, gotta follow my rainbow~

I had put on my tin foil hat and was crafting a conspiracy where wisdom just scum slipped but then I realized it didn't make any fucking sense for him to say anything here if he were scum

Him trying to insist it's 3rd party speaks to something.

A townie dies, a tracker pulls up the killer, and you "get notified you got shot", and the first thing on your mind is Ipie got hit by 3rd party? That shows being self-conscious of there being another scum role in the game. A townie reaction would be "I got shot last night, dunno by who" not "OH SCUM SHOT ME SO IM TOTES TOWN"

Oh, there's that something.

Of course, I don't have a problem with extrapolating that there's a 3rd party in the game, but I do have a problem with immediately trying to place who tried to kill whom.

[Voidedmafia]

Welp, not really sad to see Sonic go, but that kinda puts a damper on things since he was my next scumread.

Why is Xtoxm town, again?

[Voidedmafia]

Jazz, where are you?

(I'd also ask where's vampirate but that one's being replaced, so)

Also, I really don't get the hate for ZZZX.

[Voidedmafia]

btw if anyone has the flavor of Kuro Matsumi they should probably pop out sooner or later.

For reasons related to you having an alt named such or no?

Wait, the mod didn't confirm me?

^
Btw if this never gets confirmed by the mod as he's implying this might be indicative of Varsoon-scum.

What, exactly was Set up the Pins supposed to even do?

Also his reaction to me PoEing him out as "OH SHE MIGHT BE GODFATHER" is as screwed up as everything. Specially because Touhou Upick 2 happened.

His reaction to that was quite poor, I agree.

My bad I should just sheep play that I think is bad, you're right.
Fuck me for speaking my mind
I must be scum even though I literally said Lynch me first if you're going to be idiots and not play the fucking game.

You're slipping, Vars.

[Voidedmafia]

Like, really, Vars is completely focused on the "PoE" part and ignoring the reachouts here.

[Voidedmafia]

I don't think it's ridiculous to stand by the fact that I actually want to play the fucking game instead of throwing.

I have less of a problem with you being against PoE and more with the fact that you spent all this time ranting about Sakura trying to do PoE and ignoring the multiple times she directly asked you explain why her reads were faulty or otherwise discuss them. It doesn't read as being completely genuine. (Sure, I buy that you have annoyance with it given what seems to be personal experience--and I'm not going to read all of Xenosaga to confirm it--your reaction is too overblown to be 100% legit.)

Also, when I said you were slipping I meant you were slipping down from town to scum.

P-EDIT: wat.

[Voidedmafia]

The baggage. It's so heavy, so real...

What interactions with Pie make Varsoon town?

[Voidedmafia]

Jazzmyn, where are you...

[Voidedmafia]

Am I the only one who thinks that town seems way too strong for the scum power we've seen?

Maybe?

I'm trying to avoid setup stuff after We Didn't Playtest This.

[Voidedmafia]

But thats just me. And the fact that you guys are literally trying to race for the fastest large in 2015 doesnt help either. If it wad another typical lsrge we would still be deciding on that day 1 lynch

I'll be happy as fuck when 90+-page D1s aren't standard anymore because that means there's less chance of being left behind either generally or because you happen to be away when a burst of activity happens and can't be in the moment.

I'm also coming around to the idea of lynching Xtox.

Unless you doubt Chandra, we'll do that tomorrow.

P-EDIT: He was honestly V/LA that entire time Benjamin. Of course, for right now he has no excuse, but it's equally unfair to bunch him into a lurkerlynchlist just because the past day and a half or so went by too fast for him to even be there.

[Voidedmafia]

in-game day and a half, of coruse.

[Voidedmafia]

ZZZX does this in every game. I'm not really sure why anyone's surprised. If he's not planning on actually catching up at least enough to understand the game (i.e. hey I was in KY for a week and now have family in town, hence the aforementioned public V/LA), he should just replace out. Doing anything but either of those options is just anti-town. Of course he should know this by now and continues to not do anything about it.

Anyway, why Jazz isn't lynched yet on a double day is beyond me.

vote: Jazz

There was a

reason

I hadn't hammered yet!

And what the fuck do you mean, double day?

[Voidedmafia]

It's absurdly strange that we have a tracker in this game, and scum have no way to mitigate it. They had a way around the rolestop. We have two cops, which admittedly it's strange but what's bugging me is-

At least, no way that we know of.

[Voidedmafia]

if they had a way, why wouldn't they have used it?

maybe it's just a comically townsided setup

or maybe there's no protective role

Pieguyn's not that stupid.

[Voidedmafia]

Lots of pages to catch up, not going to be surprised if these questions get answered for me as I read.

Maybe it shouldn't be ruled out that Chandra double bussed. After all, the second track result came only when there was already a wagon on Jazz.

Shame we can't confirm if he knew it was happening.

I can think of this scenario; Chandra plans to bus Jazz but Jazz takes someone with him at L-1 (he was a dayvig) however Jazz was V/LA so Chandra wanted to delay the bussing until he is back so he delayed announcing the tracking.

Sakura, any idea what the condition for the dayvig could be based on flavor?

Possible, but it said it was conditional, and we don't know if those conditions were even met. For all we know this was exactly their plan or Jazz was just one day or whatever away from using it.

Anyway, who the fuck would kill notty or skybird, and im thinking skybird might've been scum kill due to being a replacement, but eh... idk, both kills seem to be weird for a vig...

Does it make more sense from a SK instead of a vig? Killing Benjamin makes some sense for a SK, but I agree skybird makes no sense for mafia unless it's for PR-hunting.

(I'm assuming killed=mafia and eliminated=SK/vig, though it can be interchangeable at this point.

[Voidedmafia]

nah it wasn't no result

N1 was a no result

voided was a result, the result was none

Wait, so who'd you target N1?

The Benjamin kill kinda makes sense - xtoxm got an ability result on him as opposed to the vanilla on Voided so they knew he had an ability. Of course there's the question of why Benjamin over Chandra, which again makes me think Chandra could also be scum.

oh, duh, the global rolestop.

Though, if Chandra is just a tracker, If scum don't think that Chandra will track the kill again it's possible they'd leave him alive (or they'd leave him alive for exactly what you said. Seems unnecessary, though).

guessing singers the vig/sk as she's the only person who doesn't want me dead

That's a stupid way to mark a vig/sk.

[Voidedmafia]

no he already survived multiple nights why would he go now?

no dead protective roles either

This is silly.

At least my thought for why he's alive involves some level of scum intention instead of invoking the gambler's fallacy that because Chandra's alive now he'll be alive tomorrow.

because i don't see scum quickhammering jazz

Get back in your alt.

Though this makes sense.

oh right

yeah i was annoyed when you dipped i needed your town read on me

and fucking nacho replaced

almost cost me the game

i scraped it tho

...what? What is this referring to and why does it relate to this game?

I presume I am alive because the scum assume I have protection.

Which they could easily be correct about.

I have a non-incriminating result on voided.

Based on my role and night actions, something feels really off with that post.

Night actions, sure, but your role?

[Voidedmafia]

well idk what my result means tbh

I'm pretty sure it means that player has no flavor ability.

Not sure what else it could be.

Anyway, Teru's ability relies on winning a hand, and then her next hand will score slightly higher than the previous one, and then the next will be higher, and so on, so basically a cumulative ability of some sorts.

maybe when scum die he gets stronger? Would explain the bussing

What mod in their right mind would make a role that promotes scum to intentionally make their game harder via losing members? Unless it's simply being on a scum lynch so there's a chance to get stronger simply by joining when a lynch seems inevitable instead by actively shoving your partner into the ground.

Could be!, It could also mean everytime a mislynch happens.

This makes more sense than Wisdom's.

Anyway just in case i die, i wanted to leave this info here for the non-flavor experts, i still have no fricken idea of who the SK might be flavor wise, but if it's a vig, it might be Miyanaga Saki herself (since she was a vig in the first game).

Why would you fucking volunteer this information before it's claimed??

I don't see what this is going to affect.

[Voidedmafia]

Oh, went digging and found my role Pm. I'm Sagimori Arata and I'm part of Agachi's team or something.
Told you it was a japanese-as-heck name.
Why can't I be T.K. or Dann of Thursday?

Because it's not as cool, that's why.

Can you tell me what 'dora' is/means?

Bonus tiles that give you extra points at the end of a hand.
There are 3 types of Dora.
The initial Dora is revealed by flipping a tile face up at the start of a match.
The Red Dora, which are tiles that are red tinted.
The Kan Dora, which are additional dora tiles that are flipped face up every time a player makes a kan (4 of a kind).
The Ura Dora, are the tiles below the flipped dora that only count if the player won after declaring riichi

For red Dora, that's for the honor tiles like Pei, Chun, etc?

(I'm tracking the main saki and Akagi right now, so I have some knowledge of Mahjong terms, but I'm not super-knowledgeable.

Do not waste the fucking cop shot on Chandra.

...Sounds like it'd be anti-town. Or it's just Bitmap upping Chandra to near-conftown

[Voidedmafia]

Can confirm.
Killed: vig
Eliminated: mafia

So...role-related? VCA? Nothing in the past 10 pages gave me any indication one way or the other.

d next day's lynch you earned an extra nightkill. For obvious reasons, it was easier to bet on a partner's lynch and bus them.

That's still essentially a 1-1 trade. Yes, it's 1 scum for 2 town, but in the early days (especially in a 20+ large) it does little for a scumteam IMO. Like, it'd work around the 14-10 player point, but before or after that there's either too many or too few town for it to be worth it.

And in this game, let's assume there are 5 scum. 3 are dead right now, leaving hypo-scum Chandra and one other partner (I'll use xtoxm for practicality). It's 2 scum against 14 or so town right now. Chandra's ability would have to be pretty fucking powerful at almost every increment to make bussing worth it.

[Voidedmafia]

Agree with a ZZZX lynch. Slightly less with Xtoxm. Don't care for Chandra right now.

Vote: ZZZX

[Voidedmafia]

14. Nachomamma8 - Town n4+ Redirector

I had completely missed this flip. Does anyone else think this points to scum having stronger roles later in the game?

Possibly.

ZZZX: Alright, then who should we lynch in your opinion? Who should we lynch of the 3-4 names being bandied about (Chandra, xtoxm, you, maybe Wisdom?)?

[Voidedmafia]

No, honor tiles are different, red dora are just 5 wan, 5 pin and 5 sou that are colored red, there's an aditional red 5 pin on top of that forming 4 red dora, most people use the red dora rule, but it's not always there, so if you see any 5 that's red colored instead of it's usual color it's a red dora. If you want to learn mahjong i could link you some vids (4 part walkthrough lasting a total of 3-4 hours) of a guy explaining how to play mahjong from the ground up (and some parts can be skipped if you aren't interested in playing real life mahjong).

I'm not overly interested in playing real life mahjong (maybe casually on internet sites or something, but not anything serious). If I could have a basic understanding of terms and be able to roughly understand which hand between two players is better, I'll be good and stick to reading manga about Mahjong. Like Saki and Akagi!

[Voidedmafia]

Am i really the only one here seeing the odd thing about this guy going V/LA for a week (which is an extremely long time) and complaining that we aren't townreading him, and also demanding a case?

No, you aren't. It's really grating.

I do feel bad about Sonic, though. I wast getting the same scum vibes but I just could shake the unknown feeling. I should've just shot Varsoon or ZZZX then. =/

Wait, is this referring to here or to Purple, cuz this is either a vig-slip, SK-slip, or scumslip.

In the first hand of games, Teru almost never wins as she surveys her opponents with her Shoumakyou or the mirror ability. With this she is able to see her opponents' innate abilities and habits. This makes her very astute, and allows her to easily counter her opponents (if they play like how the mirror suggests they will).

Does this reminds you of a certain someone's ability?

No because I honestly haven't been tracking flavor names.

No i just mean that the videos have parts where it teaches you how to set up the table for mahjong and everything (which are irrelevant if you're are watching an anime or playing it on videogames), you can also learn all terms there (Like, Pon, Chi, Tenpai, Ron, etc) as well as all Yakus.
Tho you can always ask us.
And you'll learn to not say the word Chiitoitsu near pieguy *runs*

I've memorized at least those four terms (and Tsumo and Kan), but probly not the Yaku stuff.

and why not say that?

[Voidedmafia]

Was 3851 it?

[Voidedmafia]

Signs and Void levels of town!

This was my crumb when Benji asked me how town I was. The relevance was that I was also a vig in that game.

I have not read nor will I read Signs and Void thus that has no bearing on me.

Thank you for the rest, though. Be town, Singer.

Pie: Was that, like, an online game you played?

[Voidedmafia]

Sakura, Pie, whoever.

[Voidedmafia]

dont care if im lynched but can we get a move on

voided L-1 me?

What, so you can self-hammer?

Thanks, but no thanks.

[Voidedmafia]

I am. Patient, that is.

unvote

[Voidedmafia]

Because I want to talk to Mastin.

[Voidedmafia]

She has her priorities. So long as Mara lets her know this game exists, she'll get to it in her own time.

[Voidedmafia]

Whoa holy shit 30 more pages...

I'm...probably going to read them all because I'm like that but no guarantees I'll get anything out of them.

[Voidedmafia]

Easy 1 scum remaining, suppose that scum is a ninja and is tracked nowhere during the night of a night kill.
Is that person conf town to you?

Without suspicion of a Ninja in the first place, I'd probably say so. If there was already suspicion that a ninja existed, then no.

so like
We had this whole mod meta moment where you all jumped down my throat because there couldn't possibly be a Godfather in pieguyn's game
but you think there could be a ninja, which is just Godfather by a different name?

Ninja can still be caught by cops, can't they? They're just not trackable or watchable.

VOTE: Singer
Whyyyyy wouldn't we at this point?
At this point, if Singer is a goddamn third party, they're going to kill the conf-town and not kill the scum because otherwise they lose they lose so hardcore on the scum team being all gone and the game still going

Okay, I'm a day away from when this first came down and I forget easily, but why is Singer SK instead of town? Kills? Play?

@Wisdom: Yes, unless they are for sure limited-shot and already blew their load.
Because FUCK that sort of swing being in the hands of someone who has proven they just wanna kill town PRs.

So, who other than you would've believed that Sonic was a cop based on those Xiao Xiao crumbs? Because unless you started crumbing for him or he crumbed something else for us...

[Voidedmafia]

that made no sense. Singer has consistently shot her scumreads. Not PRs.

SK can hunt scum too
All da flips being from PRs is just a handy coincidence, huh

Are you really harping on this? Really?

Okay, fuck it, you wanna know my big dumb secret ability?
It's fucking nothing. Literally.
I've been faking all this time hoping to draw an NK, but apparently even with two goddamn killers out there I can't
That's how useless I am, I guess.
I saw my role pm and thought that the whole bowlings/pins pun would be funny and if I announced a MYSTERIOUS power in-thread, scum would come and get me or it'd get some sort of worthwhile reaction. Didn't Profgessor say I was 'cleared' because of my action and response? I never got that.

I'm actually not fine with being vig'd, because I want the vig, if it is a vig, to hit scum.
At the same time, though, if I have to be dead for town to 'solve' the game or some shit, I'll take the hit.

Yknow, I've been feeling townvibes from Varsoon from posts like these that just have this sort of genuine frustration about something. There have been posts (or streams of posts) where I've felt the opposite, but I don't feel like this is a bad post. Slightly annoyed that it was a bluff, but that's not alignment indicative to me.

setup balance + mod in first post says theres a 3rd party

just because shes playing like a vig doesnt change the fact town need to kill it to win

No it doesn't. Saying that such things are public knowledge is NOT an implication that it exists, and you're being stupid if you think that's any sort of conclusive evidence.

but clearly most people agree with me which is why im not being voted

...what?

I mean...what?

My mind just broke trying to comprehend the troll logic here.

[Voidedmafia]

I just looked at the alive list for a comment to ZZZX. Now I feel stupid.

[Voidedmafia]

I'M STILL READING THE REST OF THE GAME GODDAMMIT!

[Voidedmafia]

Singer has PROVEN they are a liability to town by killing the town they've killed so far. I want to lynch that.

Again, the fact she had three misshots does not mean she's incapable of shooting scum in the following nights.

A man kills your father.
The same man kills your mother.
The same man kills your only sibling.
Today, that man tells you that he's just trying to kill a killer who is running around in your house.
Why the fuck do you trust that man not to just kill you?

I don't, that's why I put that man on a hopefully not-so-wild goose chase for a killer outside your house that desperately wants to get in to kill you. Because it's better to let them try to duke it out while you call the cops and bust their asses (and grab your own gun).

...Okay, maybe that's not relevant to here, but my point is that you have a level of valid concern but until the enemy I don't know is the enemy I know (or the enemy I know is dead) and let them kill each other.

I still don't even believe Singer's a SK anyways.

@Sakura:
That's EXACTLY what happened.
Singer killed a townie
Then Singer killed another townie
And then Singer killed ANOTHER townie
And then Singer said, "I know I killed all these townies, but trust me, I am trying to hit scum"

So the fact that they were scumreads of hers she shot means nothing? Because shooting town because YOLO is pretty different from shooting town you thought were scum and were wrong about.

Voidedmafia: zzzx was vla but can't catch up so he is scum but lets say I agree with lynching him 6 posts later without explanation. From a top town read to a crashed wtf scum read

What? My lynchpool is (Xtoxm, Wisdom, ZZZX, with singer as an outlier in the event that she actually is SK) because the others are townreads. I'm iffy on Wisdom, so it's you or Xtoxm.

Scum reads

Yet you voted Xtoxm?

(okay, last pseudocatchup post because I don't think I can separate the fact we won with being objective about my "catchup".)

[Voidedmafia]

(Nah, this is fun.)

If voided was a goon, i'd think he would have made a kill N4 unless their partner is a goon, on top of that just from interactions with flipped scum, he's probably town as well, are you taking all this in mind in your reads?

I...actually, if there's no ninja I would probably do this.

A goon flipped already. They don't have another.

Honest mod-question: Why not include another goon? Maybe not in this game, but.

Yes. That's who I think the last two scum are.

So you mean that Chandra's busing her last scum mate? or do i remember wrong?

That's fucking suicidal.

also - if he's scum with xtoxm Voided was a safeclaim for a "went nowhere" track.

...True.

Hey Sakura, come to think of it;

Why did they have Jazz make the kill? He was a dayvig that needed to survive and he was someone who was suspected enough - why risk losing him?

Maybe that points to him not actually doing it?

This is actually really interesting..

Wait, so you're suggesting that Chandra-scum just up and decided to bus Jazz-scum for

no fucking reason

? (okay, maybe not you, but just to everyone in general).

THis points more to Chandra being town.

[Voidedmafia]

the scum's counter to me is the fact that they can just shoot me anytime they feel like it

But...that's not really an answer to why they'd leave you alive for so long?

Like, it makes sense up to D3 or so, but D4 it'd have to be like "okay, Chandra has got to go". UNLESS there's a good reason to believe the tracker isn't a threat.

global roleblock

presumably it does not target

Probably.

Ugh. Guess I won't get my Singer lynch.
Singer, have you payed any attention to my discussion with (or rather, at) Wisdom regarding rubbing it in postgame that your shots are bad and you should feel bad and really why did you ever shoot anyone are you a compulsive vig did you really think AND pride your own shots over the idea you could be wrong what the heck you have a kill count that is scum-worthy but you think people shouldn't give you flak over it and let you just keep on keeping on?

I think we can lynch Chandra and solve, like, 99% of this paranoia.
Singer can kill Xtoxm, since Wisdom is apparently BP?
That's what's good, imo.

I feel like the reality is that we'll mislynch, singer will kill me (fantastic shot, 10/10, gonna go get my shit ready for the face painting session) and town will shit the bed.
VOTE: Chandra

Because shooting your scumreads and being wrong isn't a fucking death knell?

Like, jeez.

Also, no. Don't lynch Chandra.

Because, frankly, if I survive to the next day, I'm calling it now:
Chandra 'tracks' me to the kill or some equally annoying rubbish.

Well, we'd lynch you because she hasn't been wrong yet, but then we'd lynch Chandra with all fire when she's wrong.

[Voidedmafia]

Fuck you sakura, throw this game without me man
Voided is the last scum
gg

OMG HOW'D YOU KNOW?!

Also, I literally do not understand what is going on from Xtoxm's lynch to page 187. And probly to the end of the game.

Actually since we're going to do bitmap's plan, my idea was to try to shift the scum kill away from Elbirn so he could get a clear since a weak jailkeeper that isn't going to act anymore isn't a threat to scum over the conftown making plans (me) or with a role (bitmap) so he could get a clear on his own while making scum think he wouldn't target anyone.

He could target me?

Yeah I'm convinced there's a scum redirector so I'm sitting on my hands tonight. If scum wants me dead they'll nightkill me.

Why would there be when nacho was a redirector?

Oh, okay. Well. That makes the last 10 pages seem worthless.

[Voidedmafia]

sakura, no. Yes, Ceph did a great job, that can't be denied, but town was still OP. Scum had literally nothing. The rolecop was nerfed, the dayvig's condition would never activate, and the strongman was just 1-shot and the most it could have done would be kill the bulletproof. Now consider all the roles town had.

Actually, this is a fair point. Especially after I read the dayvig's conditions.

(But then I'm not the best at game balancing so take my words with a grain of salt).

Now commence the lols cuz I just reached my first post in 30-some pages.

[Voidedmafia]

Whoa holy shit 30 more pages...

I'm...probably going to read them all because I'm like that but no guarantees I'll get anything out of them.

Who do you think is scum?

SAKURA, ZZZX, AND...UHHH, VARSOON MAYBE!

SINGER IS THE OUTLIER ALONG WITH BITMAP!

I'M SO TOWN!

...yay?

And the worst part about this is we know this is your town play.

SHADDUP I'M NOT REALLY THAT SORRY I DON'T READ AHEAD IS IT SO WRONG I DON'T WANT TO BE SPOILED?!

It's paradox prime all over again!

Paradox Prime? What happened there?

Yeah, lol, I was under the impression that Voided knew the game was over but wanted to catch up and post despite that, getting two cents in, lol

I saw that the title had "[OK]" instead of the deadline so I knew

something

was up, I just didn't realize it was the game being over so I just continued as usual.

[Voidedmafia]

I STILL REGRET NOTHING!

[Voidedmafia]

Where did that even start?