The First Mafia: Game Over

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Yarr. Let's hope this was not a horrible mistake.

Vote: Snarky

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Hey ducks, are you any good at scumhunting?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I guess I won't sheep you then.

I'm also just going to complain that we haven't vigged any lurkers yet and then get back to reading again.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

hbu is how bout u

are you good at scumhunting?

I'm mostly good at not playing mafia (also: failing to draw scum roles) but I guess I have to say I'm good at scumhunting. I correctly identified the scum team in the only other game I played this year, so if you want to reverse-sheep me, it's ostensibly justifiable.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Katsuki, hypothetically, if I wanted you to execute Equinox, what would that require? You must know there's no way you got elected Leader for pro-town reasons.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I'm pretty sure Equinox's whole spiel about the leader dying if they execute a townie isn't true anyway (for one, in that case the only thing myko being vague about the fallout achieves is a nasty surprise for the first leader), so unless you particularly want to die, I don't think you should be trying to get execudted.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I doubt it works that way either.

Since when?

Hi guys I'm loopy on meds

What do you think of Equinox? Do you think the leader dies if they try to execute town?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

CES, is your snarky vote just a wagon vote or do you think he's scummy?

Just wagonning a little for the sake of it. He's not the worst lynch but he'd make a much better execution target.

I might switch over to a hiplopwagon in a few. Is UpTooLate supposed to be competent too?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

So yeah, if you think you're going to have questions for me that someone else can't answer, you might want to ask them soon.

1) Are you scum? (Please answer yes here regardless of your alignment.)
2) Why are you voting Snarky? (Easy question to get you warmed up.)
3) Why have we let Katsuki and Bulbazak create a 1v1 between themselves based on an obvious fake guilty? (You may assume leaders do die upon misexecuting for the purposes of your question)
4) Do you think "ostensibly" is a scummy word?
5) Did you get the idea that implo town-read bulbazak from something bulbazak said in your qt? (QTs were open for the first three days.)

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

What makes you think this was such an obvious fake guilty?

You mean beyond the fact that the baseline for a Katsuki guilty is for it to be obviously fake? How about the thing at the start of the town where he denied having received the pm about the votestealing? You don't make up nonsense on the side when you have concrete info to go off of. Or #388 where he basically says as much. In between, he behaves somewhat because the town was willing to give him what he wants but he never sounds like the guilty is real.

If he's town faking a guilty on Bulbazak-town, then, well, shame on Katsuki, and he can get his own head chopped.

At a certain point, which we really should've passed a few years ago, you have to take some responsibility for letting him get away with it.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Why do you want Equinox dead?

She's scum.

Reasons:
1) My gut says so.
2) Her #49 seems like classic scum overcompensation to me. How is TownEquinox not even a little happy that you've been made the Leader? You get unlynchability, definitely survive the night and a vig ability to boot (the vig ability looks less cool now, given that she didn't use it, but there was no reason to suppose Day 1 would last 12 pages then and there must have been some ambiguity in her mind as to what misexecuting would do) - that sounds pretty sweet. I think this makes much more sense as coming from ScumEquinox who doesn't want to seem happy that she became unlynchable, who thinks TownEquinox wouldn't be that happy because the unlynchability & untargettability are clearly much weaker in the hands of town than as scum (whereas actual TownEquinox wouldn't have that comparison in mind) and who may already have had the plan of saying "I didn't execute anyone because of the potential consequences" in mind.
3) She's got plenty of experience with you but she still quite willingly let you become so you can execute someone is probably just town, knowing that the rest of town is going to hold you responsible for it. Her latest explanation in #632 just highlights that she really doesn't seem worried about the possibility that's she helped unleash a town-on-town 1vs1.
4) Her failure to understand your reference to ending the game today in #301 is probably feigned ignorance.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Vote: hiplop

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Given that you think the guilty was so obviously fake, what do you make of PJ's blind acceptance of it up to now, especially when he then attacks me for accepting Katsuki's claim d1 at face value?

Well, obviously, but I've got enough experience with Djelibeybi to know that he's not very good at dealing with town fakeclaims, in a very similar way to you actually - he can't help but try to make sense of things that are best left ignored.

What

is

the reference? I feel like you think it is important, but I can't understand where you're coming from.

He says "end the game today" and then suggests killing two people. It's pretty straightforward - the only sense in which it's not is in that it assumes 3 scum, which I would expect any townie to default in a 15p game (but in my experience scum are more cautious to defaulting to some piece of knowledge which they have).

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Honestly if you think im avoiding the game and am not just busy, that is pre low? Im essentually a camp counselor this week

Okay. I am committing 100% to blowing off plans tonight to fuck up scum tonight.

I think those two quotes speak for themselves.

DGb, you should vote for hiplop. I'll ask you questions if you do.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I'm not as convinced as CES that myko wouldn't manage to slip 4 scum into a 15 player game.

The execution mechanic definitely makes it more viable, but 3 scum would always be my starting point.

coggy are you still scumreading equinox?

Yarr.

Cogito Ergo Sum, please detail why you think Katsuki's guilty result is a fake claim.

Because it's Katsuki. Why would you ever believe the boy who cried wolf when they're not taking the whole thing particularly seriously (see the vote stealing thing) nor do they acknowledge that they have a tendency to lie about this sort of thing? It just reads exactly like a standard fake Katsuki guilty.

(I also think Bulbazak is probably town here, which helps, but I'm aware that you don't and I don't really want to argue about Bulbazak's motivations.)

The fact is, Katsuki has had ample opportunity to back away from the claim if it is fake given that he has been elected Leader, and he has not done so. As you argued yourself, if he is faking he has probably already gotten what he wanted (i.e., to be Leader). So why keep up the charade?

But he hasn't kept up the charade. My impression of his posts after becoming leader is that they have tacitly acknowledged that he just thinks Bulbazak is really scummy - he certainly seemed to take my suggestion of executing Equinox seriously.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I think that, given the rate at which replacements have been happening Today, we should play it safe and lynch hiplop posthaste.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

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[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Are people voting hiplop actually thinking his vague positions on things are scummy, or are we just trying to get some scumhunting out of him?

I think he's likely to be scum and I want a flip.

194 strikes me as kind of an odd thing to say about a partner given the state of the wagon at the time.

It's even odder if you look at what kts had actually said up until that point.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Please stop trying to kill the game, lalala. It'd be appreciated.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Can we lynch hiplopscumwhoisnoteventrying now please?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

cogito basically told me to fuck off? so i did? for a bit.

Sorry I got a little annoyed with you. I just don't get why we haven't lynched hiplop yet.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Leader: SpyreX

I need to re-read but this seems like the safest pair of hands for that power to be in.

Snarky's reaction to the tracker guilty makes a lot more sense if he knew scum didn't kill Errant, so he would be my choice of execution.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Given that implosion already claimed tracker, doesn't seem like there's much of a downside to a mass claim, no. I say we start with Snarky.

Ces i reaaaaaly would prefer not simply because the vote stealing is a might fine useful.

It's more fun than useful, really. We can certainly win this game but I don't think we can really afford to let Katsuki kill whomever he wants if we want to do so.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I saw Katsuki ordered the errant kill.

And you didn't ask Katsuki whether he did or not?

I'm not fully sure as to what's going on but I definitely want a leader change.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Soldier

Katsuki next.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

What is our timeline? If we're getting close I'll take leader. I've got some serious questions

We've got another 10 days, so we don't need to do anything drastic.

What we do need (besides Katsuki to participate in the mass claim) is for people to actually place some leader votes down.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

You're on a vanity leaderwagon!!!!

We'll see whether or not that is true when more people have placed their leadervotes.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Snarky, who did you target Night 1?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Hiplop

Why did you pick hiplop?

Also, why didn't you ask Katsuki about him ordering a kill on EP?

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

1.) Cogito Ergo Sum, were you asked to perform any executions over the course of the game (including Night One)? I will have follow-up questions.

None on Night 1 (hence my complaint that no lurkers had been vigged when I replaced in) and then Bulbazak+EP Night 1 (I obeyed both).

We're halfway through the leader phase and 4 people are still not voting for leader.

For real guys on the leader change, I'm okay with PJ, Implosion (grudgingly, but), or myself. I will not vote a leader outside of this.

What do you think of Katsuki? Because by making this pledge, all you're doing is helping Katsuki stay put in the Leader role.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

If Snarky's a Mafia Soldier, he would've known EP had been executed and Katsuki'd be the obvious culprit (certainly, I assumed it was Katsuki). Given the amount of Town Soldiers, a second Mafia Soldier wouldn't surprise me. That also explains why he didn't question Katsuki on the EP execution.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

I was assuming Katsuki was given the option of executing EP because the slot didn't kill anyone while leader and that that would also be the consequence for disobeying.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Yeah, I don't think we can afford to execute both Snarky and Katsuki when there might still be a Mafia Soldier. Given the full scope of the execution power, 3 scum left is definitely possible. If we mislynch Today and SS and Katsuki aren't both scum, then we risk the Mafia Soldier blocking the kill on the scum one and we end up with 6 alive, 3 scum. And if they're both scum, then lynching Katsuki and executing SS leaves us in a pretty good position.

So we just lynch Katsuki?