BIOCHEMISTRY - game over, finally, it's only been 5 months

[Ankamius]

Hi guys.

What is the reasoning for Creature and Voices of Truth being wagoned?
What are the most important other things that have happened so far?
What else is at least somewhat important to look at?

[Ankamius]

I'm very curious whether that gambit has ever actually done anything or not, because I have never heard of it succeeding but have had it used on me at least 3-4 times now.

[Ankamius]

Oh hey, a third wagon. Add that to the list too.

[Ankamius]

I know how this setup works, SAD.

You're not fooling me with this.

[Ankamius]

Why should I vote Vecna?

[Ankamius]

Really, guys? I'm at the end of page 66 and a lot of the posts I'm seeing are useless for getting reads out of.

[Ankamius]

I haven't read a single post before I replaced in.

[Ankamius]

Is it scummy though?

Anyone would be infuriated with the way MoI pushes them by misrepping everything and thinking he knows their exact thought process (like not just as scum his pushes as town are equally as wtf)

I don't like these posts.

What are the most important other things that have happened so far?

We have established the four Neighborhoods in the game publicly.

How are you reading the members of your Neighborhood based on their content there so far Ank?

Nobody gave me any scum impressions based on neighborhood stuff; I'm okay with putting them on the backburner of the sorting list for right now.

@MoI, We can agree to disagree on Yume's/Kuror's play. Ank hasn't done anything either, which fits the scum MO. Do nothing while town rips itself apart and then whine when suspected and OMGUS.

VOTE: Voices of Truth

[Ankamius]

Sakura/MoI: the last time I played with Vecna, those same types of points were pinging me for a lot of the early game.

He flipped town.

[Ankamius]

[quote="In post 1698, Sakura Hana"][/quote]

What changed, exactly?

[Ankamius]

VOTE: beeboy

What changed, exactly?

[Ankamius]

Also, this is a highlight for Ankamius who just disappeared.

Blow it out your ass.

[Ankamius]

These CWs coming are mostly town actually hunting scum.

Expand on this.

[Ankamius]

No, I want you to expand on who is town and who is scum in that statement.

[Ankamius]

Mastina, let me know what I should go back and read when you've caught up because just from what I've seen since I replaced in, reading all of it is a waste of time.

[Ankamius]

And then sheep me on Titus.

[Ankamius]

No.

Not without a lot of cake.

[Ankamius]

You both should know that I don't blindly sheep.

If I'm not voting someone and not willing to switch to them, then I haven't been convinced on them.

[Ankamius]

Mastina: I meant throughout the game entirely.

[Ankamius]

I'm curious what you can come up with for why town are so disjointed though. That's something I want to figure out now too.

[Ankamius]

If the wagon wasn't locked on me, there would be much more info around.

It feels like any wagon that isn't me gets shut down as "counterwagon to scum" (bet scum must be one of the players that say that)

Let's say that RVS is now over and we start being serious.

Okay, now I'm starting to see why Creature is getting wagoned.

Still prefer Titus, though.

[Ankamius]

This MoI wagon is so bad that I'm willing to call MoI pretty solidly town solely from that.

[Ankamius]

Vecna, Creature, Vifam, Ser Arthur Dayne

Huh. No wonder this wagon smells so bad.

[Ankamius]

Go ahead and tell me why there's a wagon suddenly popping up on a slot with no reasoning whatsoever that also happens to hold two scumreads and two nullreads of mine.

[Ankamius]

Unpack that for me. Tell me exactly what you mean.

[Ankamius]

Because next day all town can analyse is stances on one single players rather than many. If there are multiple wagons, scum must decide whether to join or refrain from it, and this is where they start painting themselves red.

Are you being dense on purpose? Nothing you've been saying to me has had anything to do with what I've been saying to you.

[Ankamius]

OK, so what exactly is wrong with my interpretation of the wagon being scum-motivated then?

[Ankamius]

What you said sounds like it agrees with me more than not, so what exactly was the purpose of calling on me out on it?

[Ankamius]

This MoI wagon is so bad that I'm willing to call MoI pretty solidly town solely from that.

Vecna, Creature, Vifam, Ser Arthur Dayne

Huh. No wonder this wagon smells so bad.

Go ahead and tell me why there's a wagon suddenly popping up on a slot with no reasoning whatsoever that also happens to hold two scumreads and two nullreads of mine.

Unpack that for me. Tell me exactly what you mean.

This is not town giving thoughts on a wagon, this is scum defending a wagon knowing it's town.

I don't give thoughts on wagons I think are blatantly shit, I condemn them.

I haven't seen a single reason why an MoI wagon should be happening right now from a town perspective and the way you and Creature are trying to strongarm me down the moment I express as much is very fascinating.

[Ankamius]

Vifam: it should be obvious which two are null and which two are scum.

[Ankamius]

Go ahead and tell me why there's a wagon suddenly popping up on a slot with no reasoning whatsoever that also happens to hold two scumreads and two nullreads of mine.

Maybe read the game?

No.

[Ankamius]

My ISO has my thoughts on them.

I'd get the quotes, but I'm still at work.

[Ankamius]

Change my mind, Sakura.

[Ankamius]

I mean it's not like MoI has a lot of posts, you can ISO him fine and form your opinion based on that, but calling him town just because you dont like the people pushing him is kinda weird.

No it isn't? You should know by now how I hunt.

[Ankamius]

UNVOTE: Voices of Truth
VOTE: BigYoshiFan

[Ankamius]

Two reasons.

I'm scumreading BYF more than Creature.
I'm more confident that pushing BYF will lead to anything not useless than pushing Creature.

[Ankamius]

I already know what's going to happen if I push Creature: he'll spam the thread with more drivel and I'll have no idea ability to read the game state than I do now.

Most of the posts this game are already borderline useless, I'm not interesting in spawning more or wasting time pushing people that I already know are going to give me more of the same.

[Ankamius]

Yeah, and?

That doesn't address why I don't want to vote him.

[Ankamius]

Lol people are actually believing SAD's terrible case?

[Ankamius]

Vecna: I'm not reading through a thread I fully believe is a waste of time, so tell me the reasons on MoI being scum.

[Ankamius]

And use your own words. I don't want a quote wall unless it's your own posts.

[Ankamius]

Lol people are actually believing SAD's terrible case?

Who believed my case? Please point at least one person - because I've seen no one yet agree with and a few disagree.

Keep saying random scum things buddy.

Nobody has issues with it. That's more than telling enough.

[Ankamius]

Lol people are actually believing SAD's terrible case?

Who believed my case? Please point at least one person - because I've seen no one yet agree with and a few disagree.

Keep saying random scum things buddy.

Nobody has issues with it. That's more than telling enough.

No I just told you a few did.

Second you said people agreed with it, don't fucking move the goalpost. Point specific people who agreed.

BigYoshiFan is the main one. Everyone else is more indirectly agreeing mostly by having reads for similar things. Most of them were already in my scumreads anyway.

The only one I see a actively condemning it is MoI, who thinks those same people are scum anyway, so big fucking shocker, right?

[Ankamius]

Either way, your case is still terrible and at best proves you have no idea how I play the game.

[Ankamius]

MoI is likely town for picking up on why BYF is scum.

[Ankamius]

Thanks for realizing that my initial point was 'believe it isn't a scum case'

But ok. Like you said, you're not being sheeped, so I don't have a reason to shut it down.

[Ankamius]

This MoI wagon is so bad that I'm willing to call MoI pretty solidly town solely from that.

Vecna, Creature, Vifam, Ser Arthur Dayne

Huh. No wonder this wagon smells so bad.

Go ahead and tell me why there's a wagon suddenly popping up on a slot with no reasoning whatsoever that also happens to hold two scumreads and two nullreads of mine.

Unpack that for me. Tell me exactly what you mean.

This is not town giving thoughts on a wagon, this is scum defending a wagon knowing it's town.

Intriguing... Regardless, I like this read. May or may not be true, but I like the thought process.

This is agreeing?????

It literally says it may or may not be true and says he likes the fact I made this read, not the specific read itself.

Yeah Ank is scum.

Have you figured out why BigYoshiFan is scum yet or are you going to turn a blind eye to it and continue tunneling?

[Ankamius]

BYF isn't scum for being inactive. Don't put words in my mouth.

[Ankamius]

BYF isn't scum for being inactive. Don't put words in my mouth.

that wasn't directed at you.
Unless you're responding to someone else.

That was to SAD.

[Ankamius]

BYF isn't scum for being inactive. Don't put words in my mouth.

Why do you think he's scum?

Tone read based on his brief engagement with SAD. None of it sounds genuine at all.

[Ankamius]

And use your own words. I don't want a quote wall unless it's your own posts.

If you think im gonna rewrite it all just because you cba to check someone's iso + certain pages of this game, youre very much mistaken.

If you think I'm going to crawl over the entire game because you're not willing to show me why you specifically are scumreading them, then you're just as mistaken.

[Ankamius]

if(ankamius.Thinks("vecna will write again") && !ankamius.CanBeAssed())
{
ankamius.SetMistakenValue(true);
ankamius.SetMistakenModifier("very much");
}

if(vecna.Thinks("ank will crawl over game") && !vecna.WillShowReasoning())
{
vecna.SetMistakenValue(true);
vecna.SetMistakenModifier("just as");
}

im worried this wont compile.

I don't get it.

[Ankamius]

I'd like to know why you're misreading me, Spiffeh.

[Ankamius]

You don't know my town game anywhere near as well as you think you do, Spiffeh.

[Ankamius]

If you did, you would know exactly why I haven't read the game and outright refuse to.

You would also have a pretty good idea what I do when I don't have any foothold in the game.

[Ankamius]

Because it all comes down to meta and I know you well enough to know that you strongly believe you know how to read me.

Arguing with you about it is unlikely to have any significant effect this game and this approach is more likely to have an effect in future games.

[Ankamius]

I get direct reads from direct interaction and generally my reads when going through things I haven't personally been there for result in far weaker and worse reads.

My ability to get a foothold in the game depends on the way the game is functioning. This game is not functioning in a way that gives me anything to work off of, so I prod at anything that seems remotely interesting to me to see what happens.

[Ankamius]

BYF followed by SAD for scum. Creature is third but not as strong.

Gork is my only solid town read. MoI and the rest of my neighborhood are leaning town.

Rest is somewhere between "who the fuck knows" and "I'll sort later"

[Ankamius]

The way you handled Vecna vs MoI followed by your oddball push against me after I condemned the MoI wagon.

[Ankamius]

The Titus read was fake. The whole thing was a test.

[Ankamius]

About fucking time, Titus. Now I know you're town.

Moving on.

[Ankamius]

Titus: I was looking to see whether the shade you put on me when I replaced in was town or scum. That post plus neighborhood stuff gave me the answer.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Creature

@Ank, who said what in your hood that made you come around? Let's remove Creature now.

@Jiffy, Who were your townreads at the time of you claiming you had too many? (Post 2199)

Firebringer and Majiffy had comments on why you were scumreading my slot, but they made you look more scum until your response.

[Ankamius]

I guess Rem and Ram + Ankamius are scum on my wagon, everybody else is sorta reasonable.

I wasn't aware I was on your wagon. When did I join?

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Creature

@Ank, who said what in your hood that made you come around? Let's remove Creature now.

@Jiffy, Who were your townreads at the time of you claiming you had too many? (Post 2199)

Firebringer and Majiffy had comments on why you were scumreading my slot, but they made you look more scum until your response.

Why?

They said you were tunneling the previous slot holder, which was really bizarre for a reason that you would assume I'm doing scum things based on activity not even a day after I replaced in. I think one said you were absent or something too.

Either way, it didn't look as scummy as it did once you came in and immediately started pushing me based on my latest post on you up to that point.

[Ankamius]

I must have reached the activity conclusion by myself. Rest is correct.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: mastina

are you hitting on me?

~Rick

hot

UNVOTE: Voices of Truth
VOTE: BigYoshiFan

ohhhh NOW I see the sr

btw yes I've read a lot of this pages before but it's more like "glancing" now I'm reading
Pedit: Sure if you wanna look at it that way but anyone who votes BYF better have a guilty otherwise it's wrong
~Andrea

What exactly does "now I see the sr" mean? Are you talking about me or BYF?

[Ankamius]

Lol?

[Ankamius]

Feel free to go into why me scumreading BYF is apparently enough for everyone's scumreads on me to make sense.

[Ankamius]

I was already town reading MoI and I've only played with BYF once.

Who would you consider easy targets and who not? The amount of active people that aren't widely townread is high enough that its not a very reasonable angle to go on. Plus I have enough outs to go after people that are actually scum reading me and I decided to keep throwing them aside in favor of someone pretty much not on the radar at all.

So...?

[Ankamius]

Holy shit Ankamius is the counterwagon to Creature.

Vote: Creature

.
I actually think Creature should be lynched regardless of whether he's town or scum now.

It doesn't really matter, I'll eventually be blatantly town after the wagon inevitably stalls out.

[Ankamius]

I like how it's you recognizing a garbage wagon when you do it, but it's scum trying to dismantle a good one when I do it.

[Ankamius]

Man it's like you're doing the exact same thing I did and condemning me for it.

[Ankamius]

but it's scum trying to dismantle a good one when I do it.

Do you oppose someone's lynch because the players voting them are all scum or you actually townread that someone?

A combination of scum+null reads hopping on the wagon, the speed it took off with, and the laughably bad reasoning it took off with.

[Ankamius]

No seriously what wagon are you trying to dismantle. What have you done.

Are you talking about your own wagon???

Because comparing me defending creature wagon to you defending your own is LOL

UNVOTE: BigYoshiFan
VOTE: Ser Arthur Dayne

[Ankamius]

Ohhhh you're talking about MoI

Yeah that wagon defense was unnatural af. The creature eagon had been here the whole day and it's looking like it'll be the lynch. MoI wagon was a small flame that you jumped all over in a fake way.

That entire wagon was the most horrendous thing I've seen all day and the fact that nobody is willing to defend their vote and I got so much backlash from it is very telling.

[Ankamius]

Really guys?

[Ankamius]

Are we done spewing shit in the thread yet?

[Ankamius]

Sure, who's scum?

My reads haven't changed.

[Ankamius]

I'm OK with any of Creature/SAD/Majiffy solely for making the game unreadable the last ten pages.

[Ankamius]

Why is everyone scum reading my town reads

My question is not mainly this (though that too), but mostly, "Why is everyone townreading my scumreads?"

I'm OK with any of Creature/SAD/Majiffy solely for making the game unreadable the last ten pages.

All town

Stop drowning the thread in shit then. I'm not going to feel remorse for someone making the thread unreadable dying.

[Ankamius]

Case in point^

[Ankamius]

Its the same 3-4 slots that are constantly derailing the game. Creature is one of them.

[Ankamius]

I'm OK with any of Creature/SAD/Majiffy solely for making the game unreadable the last ten pages.

This is the most scummiest post I have ever read in my life.

I'm sure it would be to you considering you're one of the people making the thread completely unreadable.

[Ankamius]

but it's scum trying to dismantle a good one when I do it.

Do you oppose someone's lynch because the players voting them are all scum or you actually townread that someone?

A combination of scum+null reads hopping on the wagon, the speed it took off with, and the laughably bad reasoning it took off with.

Still ignoring the fact I told them there were well documented reasons, but that he was just too lazy to read up on them.

Now its suddenly laughably bad reasoning?

So DID YOU, or DID YOU NOT read up on it ank?

The reasoning I saw was laughably bad.

If anyone seriously wanted the wagon pushed through, it wouldn't be this difficult to get people's reasoning on why they joined the wagon.

Plus keep in mind I said "took off with." You know... the reasons that trigger a wagon starting. I was around for that one.

[Ankamius]

Btw yeah the point you make about Ank is exactly the gut vibe I got. For someone who just replaced in and doesn't have strong reads how does he get that strong feeling against the MoI wagon? Feels so fake like a scum knowing he is defending a townie.

Welcome to my towngame.

[Ankamius]

I don't have a read on RnR right now. I'll take a rain check on that one.

[Ankamius]

Just a quick glance at the vote count tells me that a Creature lynch is far better than a Rem and Ram lynch.

[Ankamius]

Neither is anywhere near as good as a SAD lynch, though.

[Ankamius]

Someone please vig Ank.

You're not going to win a 1v1.

[Ankamius]

Just a quick glance at the vote count tells me that a Creature lynch is far better than a Rem and Ram lynch.

thats a weird way to scumhunt!

I don't really want to lynch either of them. I wasn't kidding when I said the only reason I'd be okay with Creature being lynched is because he spams the thread.

[Ankamius]

Ankamius continues to ignore the thread.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

What exactly do you want me to not ignore?

[Ankamius]

Ankamius continues to ignore the thread.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

What exactly do you want me to not ignore?

People's points towards why Creature is town.
But you already answered that you're just lynching him because of the spam, which is a PL.

I don't understand why people keep thinking I'm on the Creature wagon when I'm pretty clearly not.

[Ankamius]

It doesn't indicate that I'm voting either of them, though.

[Ankamius]

And?

[Ankamius]

Go ahead and explain why that makes sense as scum play, because I can't see it unless Creature is also scum.

[Ankamius]

This wagon speed, though.

[Ankamius]

This wagon speed, though.

wagon speed is NAI.

I know. I'm more amazed than anything.

[Ankamius]

Ankamius' posts aren't particularly scummy.

I saw him constantly doubtcasting clears coming with the existence of a "godfather", guess what? He was town.

I also had the correct mindset of not taking anything for granted.

The only problem was that Mathblade and I are almost hard-coded to scumread each other. It singlehandedly lost a game right after that one.

[Ankamius]

...Seeing the updated list of votes, I'm not a fan of either wagon.

[Ankamius]

I think we're still lynching town here.

[Ankamius]

Higher amount of iffy to nullscum reads than nulltown-town reads.

[Ankamius]

Ank earlier you said you really disliked how the MoI wagon took off

But here you don't really seem to have a problem with how the Gin wagon took off

What's the difference?

The difference is that when the MoI wagon started, the only reasoning I saw was blatantly terrible and yet it got a bunch of votes added onto it immediately.

I'm aware there's reasons for beeboy being scumread and it doesn't look as scummy even though I'm just as unconvinced by them.

[Ankamius]

People realized that I'm town.

[Ankamius]

People realized that I'm town.

I'll give you a hint as to what one of my biggest town tells is:

If a wagon starts on me then stalls out completely, I'm town.
If a wagon starts and people lose interest in it quickly, I'm town.
If a wagon starts on me and it feels like trying to push it through is impossible even with a lot of players having scum reads on me, I'm town.

If a wagon starts on me and it gains steam over time and multiple people are getting bigger and bigger scum reads on me over time, I'm scum.

You misread me in our only other game, so you should be aware that apathy and sniping at seemingly random things is not a scum tell. Your confidence in this is really bizarre.

[Ankamius]

Self-referential meta gets me so moist

Would you like more? I'm always happy to please.

[Ankamius]

gahhhhh

I still don't like any of these wagons.

[Ankamius]

What are mastina's reads exactly?

[Ankamius]

Well, clearly things have changed since that post if she's thinking that the Gin wagon shouldn't be going through so adamantly.

[Ankamius]

I'll get to this soon, but I'll remove the facade now that its obvious it won't get me anywhere in this game anymore.

[Ankamius]

I said this in the neighborhood but I found it really weird that Ank had such different reactions for the sudden MoI wagon and sudden Gin wagon

She made a huge fuss about how the MoI wagon came out of nowhere but the Gin wagon took off in a way that objectively looked MUCH worse

If wagon speed was such an issue earlier then why is it suddenly NAI when Gin is getting wagoned?

It seems to me like she saw her buddy going down but didn't want to jump in and save him because it would look bad after he flipped

Like all her posts around the Gin wagon look forced and uncomfortable and have a completely different tune when she defended MoI

Here's my other response to this first:

Ank earlier you said you really disliked how the MoI wagon took off

But here you don't really seem to have a problem with how the Gin wagon took off

What's the difference?

The difference is that when the MoI wagon started, the only reasoning I saw was blatantly terrible and yet it got a bunch of votes added onto it immediately.

I'm aware there's reasons for beeboy being scumread and it doesn't look as scummy even though I'm just as unconvinced by them.

But let me unpack this even more:

There was no reasoning given for MoI beyond "he vanished" by Vecna on his V/LA followed by "hey let's just test more wagons" as the reasoning for it becoming a wagon in the first place. I was aware for a while that multiple people were already lowkey scumreading Beeboy and the reasoning for wagoning him from Gin's actions look a lot more genuine.

And I really don't care if there were reasons given for MoI before I replaced in. If anything, the fact that I got resistance when asking for why he was scum beyond what I saw makes the wagon look even worse.

[Ankamius]

I'm surprised SAD is dead actually

I'm not. He was the obvious choice for a myriad of reasons. Among them, his accuracy.

However, in spite of me saying that, in spite of me saying he was accurate, I'm going to slightly defy his last will. Rem is almost assuredly town. While I

could

lynch MoI today, what I

REALLY

want to do is this:
VOTE: Ankamius.

I'll work on explaining a full list of reasons later.
But suffice to say: Ankamius is one of my top suspects, was one of SAD's top suspects, and there's plenty behind this backing it.

I'm very interested in hearing your reasoning, because you're one of the few people in this game I expect to have good accuracy in reading me.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Sakura Hana

[Ankamius]

I said this in the neighborhood but I found it really weird that Ank had such different reactions for the sudden MoI wagon and sudden Gin wagon

She made a huge fuss about how the MoI wagon came out of nowhere but the Gin wagon took off in a way that objectively looked MUCH worse

If wagon speed was such an issue earlier then why is it suddenly NAI when Gin is getting wagoned?

It seems to me like she saw her buddy going down but didn't want to jump in and save him because it would look bad after he flipped

Like all her posts around the Gin wagon look forced and uncomfortable and have a completely different tune when she defended MoI

Ank started in neighborhood saying gin was a town flip.
When it turned out not she said there was bidders
Pointed at vecna and I think MOI? Need to double check last one.

Then just defended themselves for rest of it.

-Rick

This post is disturbingly wrong.

I did initially post saying Gin was likely to flip town.
I never once said that Gin was bussed. That's literally what

you

said in the middle of my analysis.
My point on Vecna was that he was most likely to be the scumread I was wrong on. I never once said anything aboit MoI.
I only started defending myself after MariaR pretty blatantly tried to stop us from communicating from each other after I started dumping my thoughts in the neighborhood.

[Ankamius]

I'm surprised SAD is dead actually

I'm not. He was the obvious choice for a myriad of reasons. Among them, his accuracy.

I was going to mention this before, but I would very much like to know your reasoning for this too.

[Ankamius]

Your interactions towards me always indicated a stronger read than "slightly town."

What exactly was your read and why?

[Ankamius]

This post is disturbingly wrong.
I did initially post saying Gin was likely to flip town. I never once said that Gin was bussed. That's literally what

you

said in the middle of my analysis. My point on Vecna was that he was most likely to be the scumread I was wrong on. I never once said anything aboit MoI.
I only started defending myself after MariaR pretty blatantly tried to stop us from communicating from each other after I started dumping my thoughts in the neighborhood.

Actually I think this post is a scumclaim from Ankamius, thanks to a scumtell in this post which is basically always right, if I'm remembering the tell correctly. I won't highlight which part is the literal scumclaim, but I'm pretty sure that this is something Ankamius only says as scum. I'll verify as soon as I can.

Please do, I want to know if you're town that doesn't remember how I play or scum feigning a scumread.

[Ankamius]

Ank why is Sakura scum?

A combination of how she interacted towards the Beeboy slot and her interactions with me.

[Ankamius]

I did tell fire to stop talking to Ank cause I didn't want Ank fishing for info
~Andrea

What precedent was there for that? You started trying to shut it down after I outright started posting my thoughts without asking for anything from anyone else.

[Ankamius]

Then what exactly are these posts?

Holy shit Ankamius is the counterwagon to Creature.

Vote: Creature

.
I actually think Creature should be lynched regardless of whether he's town or scum now.

Seriously me/Maria/Spiffeh scumreading the slot should be more than enough evidence for you unless people think we're all scum.

Actually I am firmly of the opinion that Ankamius is town, yet being wagoned almost or entirely by town.

The name in question on the wagon is Creature.
And the Creature wagon is itself a question.

I want to know if we have dueling town wagons or a scum wagon and a town wagon, because it makes a difference for analysis. In particular, if Creature is town then my working assumption is scum didn't care which of Creature/Ankamius got lynched; if Creature is scum, then the lack of support behind the Ankamius counterwagon tells me that scum did not go out of their way to directly save him.

Thus, why I want to lynch Creature regardless of his alignment because it gives me information either way.

Gorkington
Rem and Ram
Vifam
Ankamius
Sakura Hana
Vecna
Ser Arthur Dayne
Spiffeh
TheRealGin-N-Tonic
Majiffy
Creature
MagnaofIllusion
Rick and Andrea
Titus
BigYoshiFan
Nahdia

This is about where I am reads-wise right now.

[Ankamius]

Are you going to post any of those reasons?

[Ankamius]

I'm surprised SAD is dead actually

I'm not. He was the obvious choice for a myriad of reasons. Among them, his accuracy.

I was going to mention this before, but I would very much like to know your reasoning for this too.

You never answered this either.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: mastina

[Ankamius]

ank needs to explain herself.

thats the real issue here.

im not going to get any further in this game until she does.

because i really would love to know why she thought her posting would be beneficial under any circumstance as town here.

titus is a fine backup wagon.
because im frankly thinking that my consistent returns to a scumread there are happening for a reason.
and my reasons for letting go have been largely emotional-based.

I was trying to emulate my PR-town play in order to draw a night kill since I figured out pretty quickly that there's a lot of 'leader' types and we really don't need another one.

Don't have time for more right now, but I'd like to point out again that Mastina still hasn't addressed any of what I asked her to address last night.

[Ankamius]

Promise me that if I end up getting lynched, Mastina loses all credibility for reads. Her scum read strength on me is disgustingly bad and she hasn't given much of any reasoning for it.

[Ankamius]

Everyone seems to think that my scumreads outside of Mastina are strongly town so I won't even bother listing them.

[Ankamius]

I was trying to emulate my PR-town play

i really want more words on this.
why did you think what you were doing was going to make you nightkill bait?
why would you even bother with that strategy in a large theme and why would you make so much noise with said strategy when there was already so much noise in the game?

im really struggling to believe you here ank.

Exactly the same reasons I stated before. I meant to mostly lay low and snipe at things like I would as a PR since I couldn't reasonably get a foothold in the game, but that plan got distorted by all the tunneling on me so early and for so long.

[Ankamius]

I'd have to wait until I'm home to find specifics. Its pretty common for me to get screwed up by pressure when I'm disengaged and its not helping, though.

[Ankamius]

I was trying to emulate my PR-town play in order to draw a night kill since I figured out pretty quickly that there's a lot of 'leader' types and we really don't need another one.

Yeah this is bullshit.

I did see you doing the crumbs. That's one of the main fucking reasons I'm scumreading you though, is specifically because of them. So while you were in fact trying to emulate your town PR play this reason is absolute shit.

Okay then, genius. Why would I try to emulate a style that blatantly isn't my usual town style instead of just riding the fact that the town is a clusterfuck and just feigning complete apathy and 'waiting' for an opportunity instead of trying to stir the pot as much as I did?

I have a precedent of not being effective at all in fast-moving games and being useless. It makes no sense for me to go that route as scum.

[Ankamius]

I am pretty certain that there's a lot of scum voting me right now regardless.

[Ankamius]

This wagon in general feels very not town, especially all of the bizarre sheeping.

[Ankamius]

The most basic answer to why Sakura's scum for how she's been interacting towards me is that she pretty blatantly waffled on her read towards me and dropped it immediately when I confronted her about it; she also refused to interact with me every time I asked her questions; now that I'm onto her and it seems possible that I'll be lynched, she's suddenly a lot more emboldened to put up a direct scumread towards me.

That behavior doesn't make sense from a Sakura with organic reads, but it does make sense for a Sakura scum that wants to avoid interacting with me if she has any ability to.

[Ankamius]

Do you want me to point out all my scumreads? I specifically said I didn't feel it was worth bothering with before since most of them are strong overall town reads.

[Ankamius]

Also, I'm at work right now so this is the limit of what I can do.

[Ankamius]

Meanwhile you keep pushing this scum creature meta and completely ignore my scum bee meta post while continuing to strongly townread him.

Ank.
Sakura is not scum.
This is what pure, genuine, townposting looks like.
-Ali

Sakura and I have a lot of history.

I don't see her acting like this towards me as town. It doesn't happen.

[Ankamius]

it could also be that attention is freed up now that her main scumread was lynched?

p-edit: youre saying the sheepvotes are weird.
which ones.
why.
who.
when.
where.
how.

i dont understand why youre being so defensive about being scumread when youre being so insistent on hiding your thoughts on things.

pp-edit: okay.
im just frustrated because i feel like youve been doing this a lot this game.

I just got done with a 48 hour workweek. I've been typing at work a lot.

[Ankamius]

so why does scum sakura hard buss beeboy?

I don't find it very genuine when she hasn't done much else throughout the game and was pretty idle in actually pushing it through.

Its very interesting to me that she's getting that much towncred for it.

[Ankamius]

Anyone who is legitimately sheeping Mastin onto me, I would very much like to know why.

Mastin has only ever given two direct reasons as to why I'm scum, both of which I have already addressed. The third reason she has ever given was because SAD was scumreading me, but she has strangely decided that answering my question on why SAD was killed for his read accuracy (hence why his reads are to be sheeped) is not worth doing and has spent the rest of her time grandstanding about how there's so many reasons I'm scum and trying to force it down everyone's throats that she can.

The reason is because she doesn't actually have a case. The entire way she's been going about this push on me is sketchy as everloving fuck and it's mind blowing that people are somehow thinking that it's worth sheeping.

[Ankamius]

Also Ankamius and Titus reasoning here is dodgy as fuck.

I want details on this.

[Ankamius]

i dont really think i believe ank's "strategy". or at the very least i have absolutely no idea what she was trying to do with it.

and spiff is right that if you look at the magnitude and other aspects of her reaction to the moi/gin wagons, you get more of a feeling of outrage with the former and more of a feeling of hesitance with the latter. former flipped town. difference there probably means something.

What's the scum motivation behind this, though?

Just the precedent of how many wagons formed up out of nowhere and died just as quickly meant that it was very possible that the wagon on Gin could've turned out the same way. Why would I comment on it as scum, especially with very little force, when I could very easily either hop on or ignore it entirely?

[Ankamius]

A combination of how she interacted towards the Beeboy slot and her interactions with me.

I would like you to expand on these, since i dont remember ever interacting with you this game other than one off interaction where i forgot your playstyle.

Spoiler:

VOTE: beeboy

What changed, exactly?

Don't ask.

---

Change my mind, Sakura.

I mean it's not like MoI has a lot of posts, you can ISO him fine and form your opinion based on that, but calling him town just because you dont like the people pushing him is kinda weird.

I mean it's not like MoI has a lot of posts, you can ISO him fine and form your opinion based on that, but calling him town just because you dont like the people pushing him is kinda weird.

No it isn't? You should know by now how I hunt.

Actually i dont remember how you hunt, dont mind me then.

---

Ankamius continues to ignore the thread.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

What exactly do you want me to not ignore?

People's points towards why Creature is town.
But you already answered that you're just lynching him because of the spam, which is a PL.

Ankamius continues to ignore the thread.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

What exactly do you want me to not ignore?

People's points towards why Creature is town.
But you already answered that you're just lynching him because of the spam, which is a PL.

I don't understand why people keep thinking I'm on the Creature wagon when I'm pretty clearly not.

Just a quick glance at the vote count tells me that a Creature lynch is far better than a Rem and Ram lynch.

Well posts like this can be misleading you know.
It's not like im checking who you're voting.

---

This wagon speed, though.

This wagon speed, though.

wagon speed is NAI.

This wagon speed, though.

wagon speed is NAI.

I know. I'm more amazed than anything.

This is every interaction we've had with each other up to the point that I voted you.

You avoided engaging with me or attempting to sort me at all, even when given prime opportunities to try to sort or push me. The only time you gave any indication was a light scum read right before I voted you, which you drove into the ground here:

MoI's reasoning makes sense.
Also,
VOTE: Ankamius
Come at me.
And i'll drive your blood through my blade.

This looks a lot more like you're trying to push a scumread on me by pushing up everybody else that you had already put lower in the scumlist instead of actually believing I'm scum this game.

None of it looks organic.

[Ankamius]

I think im gonna start counting how many times ank ignores my questions while complaining about me ignoring her non existant questions.

I gave my reasons for why I was focusing on specific things before and I'm pretty blatantly going in order now, so you don't have any room to talk about this.

[Ankamius]

This, for a combination of reasons. Among them, SAD's reads, SAD's death, SAD's reasoning, my own reads, and my own reasoning.

And yet the level of explanation for any of this is laughable.

[Ankamius]

do you have other towngames where youve gotten similarly frazzled by pressure?
i dont remember you taking it anywhere near as badly in hope+1.

Most of the examples I was able to think of where I was disengaged and the majority of them are years old, so they're not very good indicators since I had a fundamentally different way of wording my posts and thinking about the game.

Death Note
Undertale

These are more recent games where I've had moments of doing similar things.

I wouldn't suggest reading Undertale though, that game was torture.

[Ankamius]

MoI's reasoning makes sense.
Also,
VOTE: Ankamius
Come at me.
And i'll drive your blood through my blade.

This looks a lot more like you're trying to push a scumread on me by pushing up everybody else that you had already put lower in the scumlist instead of actually believing I'm scum this game.

None of it looks organic.

Also this sounds like you dont know how I play or react at all, guess we've had several games together for no reason then ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Last 2-3 games we've played, you were more than happy to push me for any reason at all, even when you weren't scumreading me.

So what exactly am I supposed to think about you consistently shying away from having anything to do with me this game?

[Ankamius]

What other than the first question which I already explained were supposed to be questions that im not answering?

This should be obvious now, but I remembered specifically trying to probe your responses and assumed they were questions because of it.

It doesn't ultimately change my point in any way.

[Ankamius]

Oh, I'm L-1?

If I end up getting lynched:

Mastina and Sakura Hana should be chain lynched in any order.
Spiffeh is likely scum.
Rick and Andrea is leaning scum.

Titus is town.
MoI is town.
Nahdia is town.

[Ankamius]

But I guess it's too convenient to ask for reads, much less read them after they are posted, i guess suspecting someone isnt worth of checking their reads progression right? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I saw a single post indicating you had any kind of scumread on me, and that was right before I voted you.

If there's any others, be my guest and point them out.

[Ankamius]

I forgot to mention that Gork is strongly town too.

[Ankamius]

So you're effectively proving my point by showing that after I gave you multiple opportunities to try to get a read on me, you both didn't engage me and didn't get a read on me.

[Ankamius]

I told you specifically a while back that the easiest way to read me is to pressure me and see how I respond. You've done that multiple times in the past and you have one game where you initiated an engagement and caught me based on my response. In a similar vein, the easiest way for me to hunt is by being pressured since that's how I get reads most easily. I would expect most people that have at least half a dozen games with me to know that.

Your response to me getting a 4-vote wagon this game was to weakly put support on it and then immediately back off when I challenged you on it. That indicates to me that you're not town interested in sorting me and that you're not wanting me to get a read on you.

[Ankamius]

Hey, can you both do me a solid for my birthday and not go after my green town reads for 24 hours?

All I am hearing from you both is.

Mommmmm, they didn't answer my question where I called them scum!!!! Vote them or I won't do my homewoek.

Sakura, Ank, this is at you.

I think I've done enough to show that Mastina's full of shit.

[Ankamius]

So let me get this straight:
You come replace in here, decide to not read anything, decide to townread MoI out of the people that were wagoning him with an actual case that Vecna made tho i didnt buy back then, and then when you're pointed out to read what happened you decide to instead say "You forgot how i hunt", then when i point to you towards the reason people are saying Creature is town you decide to ignore it, then you make an amused comment at Gin's wagon speed, and decide to stay silent afterwards, and somehow out of all this im supposed to magically give me a townread of you?

I never once said that I expected you to townread me, I expected you to

sort

me. That's a huge difference. I don't actually care what your read of me is as long as I can see it as genuine.

You're misrepping about the MoI case. Vecna was the one that told me to read (and frankly, not being willing to put in the time to make sure a wagon goes through is not going to convince me). You said that it was weird that I was townreading MoI because of the wagon on him. I essentially responded by saying that getting reads on people based on the wagons on them is not weird for me, and you backed off.

Or is it that you are coming here and expecting me to drop everything i was going after in beeboy just to try to sort you because im supposed to have a gigantic memory of how you play when i havent played with you in at least a year?

And then out of all of this you somehow make up a scumread on me because "im not trying to sort you".

And im supposed to think all of this comes from town?
How?

Bullshit.

You can have more than one read at a time.
You put the time to idly comment on things I've done multiple times.
You were not pushing Beeboy that hard for most of the time I was in the game.

[Ankamius]

Hey, can you both do me a solid for my birthday and not go after my green town reads for 24 hours?

All I am hearing from you both is.

Mommmmm, they didn't answer my question where I called them scum!!!! Vote them or I won't do my homewoek.

Sakura, Ank, this is at you.

I think I've done enough to show that Mastina's full of shit.

Yes, but attacking Sakura detracts from that message and only serves to annoy town. Mastina Nahdia and Vifam are basically sheeping whatever they can get away with. If you get lynched, you won't have a vote to help lynch scum with.

Mastina was outright lying about Gin and beeboy not having content but you spammed it out with this stupid shit war.

So just hold your nose and pretend Sakura's town for my birthday k?

Fine.

I'll ignore Sakura for the next 24 hours if I manage to be alive then.

[Ankamius]

Like seriously is like i cant ever be happy for a single second...
When in my mind im like "YES I FINALLY GOT BEE FOR THAT GAME ON OSU!" "I finally managed to catch scum on my own"
And then ppl here are like "boo you did nothing" "no that wasnt genuine".

How am i even supposed to feel?
Like no matter what i ever do, it's like i cant ever do something right, nor something that make ppl go like "oh good that sakura's here she'll catch us all the scum".

I dont even know why i even bother playing mafia tbh.

You actually did catch beeboy but we just didn't get a wagon on him until the end. I fully intended to talk to Ank about this tomorrow when he calmed down. He wasn't going to be receptive, so anything I said good about the other would be viewed as taking sides when my position is you are both obvious fucking town.

I don't want you in a place where you feel validated only if I agree with you. That's not a good place for a dialogue.

cough
pronouns

[Ankamius]

It's because you met me when I had "he" as a pronoun and only changed to this one recently. You're not crazy.

[Ankamius]

Also Ankamius and Titus reasoning here is dodgy as fuck.

I want details on this.

Then dig up the posts that it was referring to because youve done quite a bunch of it and I cba to go digging it up again to save your lazy slot.

No. Tell me why my reasoning is dodgy, because I'm not going to get that answer anywhere except directly from your own mouth.

[Ankamius]

Or is "go find it yourself" the way you avoid taking responsibility for your statements?

[Ankamius]

Or is "go find it yourself" the way you avoid taking responsibility for your statements?

Its me being done with going back to dig through the posts to remember what it was referring to, while you refuse to do any reading up. Like I said, if you quote me the posts to refresh my memory what they referred to, ill gladly tell you what I meant with it.

That excuse is not going to fly anymore now that I'm actively part of the game and contributing.

I'm not going to do the legwork of reposting everything I've already posted today solely because you don't feel like backing up your vague nothing statement.

[Ankamius]

I was trying to emulate my PR-town play in order to draw a night kill since I figured out pretty quickly that there's a lot of 'leader' types and we really don't need another one.

Which posts of yours indicate you are trying to emulate your town-PR play?

Because this sounds like a load of BS to me

It's not specific posts, it's my entire approach.

[Ankamius]

So are you ever going to answer my question or not?

[Ankamius]

The burden of proof is on you, not me.

[Ankamius]

People aren't exactly scumreading her for it either.

[Ankamius]

ok well this is me saying i WANT to vote ank for posts like that. i wont tho so we don't go TOO FAST.

Why?

She's pushing this hard for me to be lynched, yet she is being very careful not to answer any of my calls for her to substantiate it or really give any reasoning for it in general. Instead, she goes on a crusade to call for more votes.

If that's not a bullshit read, then none are.

[Ankamius]

Mastina and Sakura Hana should be chain lynched in any order.
Spiffeh is likely scum.

Why do people think it's ok to suddenly scum read me without giving reasoning just because I'm not here

Please explain.

Also these reads imply that our neighborhood consisted of the entire scum team and SAD. Does this mean anything to you?

I've been scumreading you for a while, actually. The only reason I haven't stated it before now is because I have never played against scum-you as town yet.

[Ankamius]

People aren't exactly scumreading her for it either.

It looks like mastina being mastina to me and I'm having trouble understanding how you don't see that since (iirc) you claim to have a decent amount of experience with her.

Do you think scum!mastina blackmails our neighborhood to not lynch her scumbuddy when he's clearly going down?

I have seen Mastina have a huge ego in the past as scum and do pretty blatantly scummy things when she thinks she can get away with it. I don't find that as convincing as everyone else seems to.

[Ankamius]

ank.
your posting is really gimmicky right now.
people didnt need to directly interact with beeboy to get a read on him.
why did they need to interact with you to get a read on you?
do you expect mastin to interact with her scumreads?
because i really dont think ive ever seen her try and parse someone by saying "hey can u respond to this " its more "this person is scum and this is why" and i really doubt you dont know that.

Gork.

The interaction bit is directly tied to Sakura, nobody else. I never once said that anybody else needed to interact with me to get a read on me.

Mastin was more than happy to respond to my challenges when they didn't have anything to do with explaining her read on me or similar things. I'm not expecting her to interact with me to get a read on me, I'm expecting her to put her money where her mouth is and state exactly why she's scumreading me.

I've been scumreading you for a while, actually. The only reason I haven't stated it before now is because I have never played against scum-you as town yet.

Ok and I'm asking you why you're scum reading me.

Because every time you've scumread me in the past, you've immediately voted and tried to put as much pressure on as possible. Your play looks more like you're trying to emulate that since you're doing the voting bit, but I never once got the feeling that you were legitimately trying to pressure me outside of the first 1-2 posts you made after your initial vote before you backed off.

That's something I have never seen from you before and it makes me very wary since you've even been able to emulate your town response near perfectly when we were both scum.

[Ankamius]

like, these shitfits you're throwing bc people aren't scumreading mastina for scumreading you are fucking silly. ppl aren't sheepign it but you demand everyone scumread her for it without actually making any case. it's goofy.

Are we reading the same fucking game?

[Ankamius]

Am I speaking in some moon language that nobody can understand?

My entire point about Mastina being scum for scumreading me

is because she has been very hesitant to back it up.

[Ankamius]

Anyone who is legitimately sheeping Mastin onto me, I would very much like to know why.

Mastin has only ever given two direct reasons as to why I'm scum, both of which I have already addressed. The third reason she has ever given was because SAD was scumreading me, but she has strangely decided that answering my question on why SAD was killed for his read accuracy (hence why his reads are to be sheeped) is not worth doing and has spent the rest of her time grandstanding about how there's so many reasons I'm scum and trying to force it down everyone's throats that she can.

The reason is because she doesn't actually have a case.

The entire way she's been going about this push on me is sketchy as everloving fuck

and it's mind blowing that people are somehow thinking that it's worth sheeping.

[Ankamius]

Do it.

Maybe people will start listening to me and getting their heads out of their ass once they find out I'm actually town.

[Ankamius]

I've been scumreading you for a while, actually. The only reason I haven't stated it before now is because I have never played against scum-you as town yet.

Ok and I'm asking you why you're scum reading me.

Because every time you've scumread me in the past, you've immediately voted and tried to put as much pressure on as possible. Your play looks more like you're trying to emulate that since you're doing the voting bit, but I never once got the feeling that you were legitimately trying to pressure me outside of the first 1-2 posts you made after your initial vote before you backed off.

That's something I have never seen from you before and it makes me very wary since you've even been able to emulate your town response near perfectly when we were both scum.

I should amend the read itself to leaning scum, actually.

The R&R suspicion post is likely town since I've been noticing the same thing about Creature's activity.

[Ankamius]

I've calmed down a bit.

Where are all the miscommunications stemming from?

[Ankamius]

Because every time you've scumread me in the past, you've immediately voted and tried to put as much pressure on as possible. Your play looks more like you're trying to emulate that since you're doing the voting bit, but I never once got the feeling that you were legitimately trying to pressure me outside of the first 1-2 posts you made after your initial vote before you backed off.

Your responses to me satisfied me enough to look elsewhere. I'm pretty sure I made a post about reading you as town a little bit after that?

It's not like I've had this constant scum read on you that I've been holding in my back pocket to use in case a wagon on you formed. I didn't really scum read you until after the flip and until I noticed your asymmetric treatment of the MoI and Gin wagons.

And none of your recent posts make me feel that much better.

What are your thoughts on BYF?

I'm not assuming that you've held a scumread on me the whole time. I'm saying that when you did put pressure on me, it doesn't look like how you usually pressure me when you believe I'm scum.

I'm dead null on BYF right now.

[Ankamius]

Hey Majiffy what are your reads beyond Creature scum?

MoI, R&A, Nahdia, Titus, Mastin town
Gork, Vifam, Vecna, Creature scum

Why aren't you trying to push for a Vecna lynch?

[Ankamius]

Throwing your hands up and blindly sheeping on someone you're not even scumreading is really bizarre when there's enough people scumreading Vecna to make that a viable option.

[Ankamius]

That's the reason I haven't mentioned it before very recently and why it's not something I've been interested in pushing at any point.

[Ankamius]

I mean you said I'm likely scum

And I'm almost universally town read

So why wouldn't you want to bring this up to make sure I don't continue to get overlooked?

I did. I posted the scumread when I noticed I was at L-1.

[Ankamius]

I guess in ankamius's mind im the only one not allowed to forget things ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Spiffeh and I have only played like 4 games overall and the town-me scum-him dynamic is the only one we haven't played yet.
We have far many more games than that and have had all four dynamics multiple times.

It's a huge difference.

[Ankamius]

Yeah but I had to pry the reasoning out of you

Did you think a naked scum read on me would have accomplished anything if you were lynched?

I still don't get why you wouldn't want your suspicion of me known and evaluated, even before you have a strong possibility of getting lynched

I pretty accurately determined that it wouldn't have mattered either way, judging by how pretty much every point of mine in the past 10 or so pages have been received.

I'm well aware I have close to no influence this game. The best I can do is try to hammer home that I strongly believe that town is getting severely duped and that people should reset instead of trying to point fingers at specific people. It's a lot less likely to be swept aside and forgotten.

[Ankamius]

I mean YOU're the one that poked my memory and reminded me of Greater Idea Mafia where i pushed you and you pushed back, which is the same thing you're doing with mastina here.

Not even a month ago, I caught scum-Not_Mafia using that exact same method.

[Ankamius]

I'm not factoring in neighborhoods until I specifically have a reason to.

I can't answer the reads question very well since my wagon has been the focal point of the day and I've spent most of my energy trying to scumhunt on it. If I had to guess, the scum off the wagon are coasting since MoI is likely town.

[Ankamius]

Huh?

[Ankamius]

I've been completely ignoring you by request. The only reason I responded before is because I was having a discussion with Spiffeh and I could see your involvement leading it astray.

[Ankamius]

I'm requesting no hammer for Gorkington's sake, Titus.

[Ankamius]

I told him to revote me and he said he was going to wait because he wanted to metadive me first.

[Ankamius]

Why can't we change?

Because town is completely stuck on incorrect reads while scum is either fanning the flames or just sitting out of the way while we repeat the early days of Undertale.

[Ankamius]

I dunno what were you even expecting to happen?
For me to raise my hands in the air and go "Here enjoy your mislynch ank" or something?

Reset for one day. At least pretend my reads had an ounce of validity.

It's kinda hard to do that.
Look at it this way, there's this scummy scumbutt pushing all this BS about me, and in the case im wrong im probably going to die next, and if they somehow flip it around to me, my townflip will make them die next, there's no stopping this train. And at this point, i dont even care, if he's actually town, he deserves to die for reading me wrong and pushing BS statements about me.
Any sort of hope of ever working together and seeing her as town vanished when she decided to ignore my reach out and continue pushing BS.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

You have my attention now.

What reach out are you referring to?

[Ankamius]

Like im literally here giving you space to change my mind, tell me WHY am i supposed to be townreading you given all these circumstances, because i dont see it.

I put a lot of weight into the reads I get from interacting with people, especially the people that are scumreading me. I naked voted to gauge your reaction since I was already scumreading you based on our interactions before. The sudden change from mostly avoiding contact with me and making passive comments to outright deathtunneling once it changed was a huge red flag to me, so I went into deathtunnel mode.

Greater Idea Mafia was me trying to emulate that since my biggest problem as scum is that I struggle to choose believable targets and make up reasons on why I'm pushing them, especially to the extent of pushing that hard.

Most of my reads today were based on direct interactions. The only one that isn't is MoI, who I'm mainly townreading based on the gamestate itself.
I immediately changed to having reads and analyzing the game when we had a scumflip (which is provable via the neighborhood) and started aggressively pushing reads when I suspected scum were pushing me.

This is the core of my playstyle and how I've been playing the game. Hopefully some of it rings a bell at least.

[Ankamius]

I legitimately didn't even notice the reads list before I voted you.

[Ankamius]

Read through my ISO in the game I linked a bit ago. That game's probably one of my best and it's very recent.

It outlines the reads-by-interaction and the deathtunneling-from-pressure to a T.

[Ankamius]

I mean YOU're the one that poked my memory and reminded me of Greater Idea Mafia where i pushed you and you pushed back, which is the same thing you're doing with mastina here.

Not even a month ago, I caught scum-Not_Mafia using that exact same method.

I thought I linked that in the post above but apparently I forgot to.

[Ankamius]

The basic gist of it is this:

I replaced in and immediately caught Alisae.
Alisae made a gambit and tried to force a fake solved endgame with the unnamed scum and three town in the lynch list with a 3-man scumteam and only one free mislynch.
I aggressively argued against that and had Alisae and Not_Mafia push me for trying to discredit the 'likely town' list.
I argued with the two of them for two game days until a vanilla town followed by Alisae got lynched.
Mathblade and I turned against each other and eventually another vanilla town got lynched for a scum win.

[Ankamius]

That was my first time ever seeing him, actually. Nothing he said so far pinged me, but I can't really remember much of anything they've done all game outside of the claim.

[Ankamius]

Vecna's just a whole mess all the way around and I don't feel like writing up another big case.

Yes, but annoyingly enough, that doesn't actually make him scum. I'm fairly certain by now that he's one of the players that I'm just going to inevitably scumread for his play and vice versa.

[Ankamius]

Is this what my arguments have looked like all day?

[Ankamius]

Titus, what are you thinking?

[Ankamius]

Can you unpack that a bit for me? How do you get from Gin's neighborhood all voting for Gin despite Mastin to scum wanting the rolecop?

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Vecna

That is a very interesting observation that puts him right back into my scumreads after looking through the posts again. I can see that being a bus attempt, especially if the scumteam isn't doing all that well around that time.

[Ankamius]

What I'm seeing from mastina's analysis is that bussing Gin sounds like a damn good way to get enough towncred to coast for a while.

...doesn't that fit my conclusion before that scum are likely coasting today?

MoI: I'm not scumreading Sakura anymore.