Updates from a Failing Democracy

[~Jordan`]

blah people

[Vi]

By "that" I meant getting two thirds of the vote. Unless you think that could happen in the near to middle future?

...eh, considering they need 75 people in the Senate when they're currently struggling to get 50, no. On the other hand, if you have the Supreme Court you don't need to amend the Consitution.

My theory (I Am Not A Political Scientist) is--
Non-ideologically-driven Republicans know that if things stand as they are their control over the government is going to erode. Their (positive) rebranding is severely limited because of their rabid base. Under these circumstances, the best bet for their long-term survival is to go for a power grab, then rewrite the system so they can stay in power.

[Psyche]

in my doomsday scenario the rules are changed on the state level and reinterpreted on the federal level such that conservatives can reliably gain sufficient and consistent control of the government without winning the popular vote

when a particularly egregious election involves a republican, pro-business president achieving victory with popular support of like 40%, a strong reaction by citizens ever brings us into a completely new era of american politics in the same way that the Great Depression did long ago

and after a spate of important reforms, things are meh again

[BlackPawn14]

@Vi: Well, I think that may happen for any non-ideologically-driven party/group. Once they're in power, they'll just want to stay in it, since they don't actually have an idea on what they want to do with said power. Some guy tried to do that in my country, but messed up and couldn't modify the constitution enough to stay in power.
Regarding my other post in this thread, I reread it and it sounded a lot more stupid than what I thought (almost like I wanted a dictatorship... and I don't). The point is, in my country, the two dominant "parties" (one party is made of a bunch of parties that just want to stay in power, the other one basically follows the guy mentioned above) are kinda shitty.

[Vi]

@Psyche: The problem is that we're heading for elections where you can win without the popular vote, PLUS economic woes, PLUS a significant portion of the population that has been told for years that armed revolt is a pretty cool idea, PLUS we're not as isolated (geographically, not politically) as we were during our previous moments of weakness. There are all kinds of ways this could end poorly.

@Vi: Well, I think that may happen for any non-ideologically-driven party/group. Once they're in power, they'll just want to stay in it, since they don't actually have an idea on what they want to do with said power.

I'm pretty sure the Saud family has a good idea of what they want to do with their power.

[BlackPawn14]

I mean that, when a governing party actually has an idea of what they want the country to become, they can just do that and leave the government after they're done. When they don't, they just want to keep the power.
The Sauds aren't trying to perpetuate themselves as rulers; they're already perpetuated rulers. And they know that if they want to stay they have to keep the country prosper.

[Psyche]

@Psyche: The problem is that we're heading for elections where you can win without the popular vote, PLUS economic woes, PLUS a significant portion of the population that has been told for years that armed revolt is a pretty cool idea, PLUS we're not as isolated (geographically, not politically) as we were during our previous moments of weakness. There are all kinds of ways this could end poorly.

you've forgotten one thing

[Rob14]

the best bet for their long-term survival is to go for a power grab, then rewrite the system so they can stay in power.

See: gerrymandering

They're already doing this at the state level and in the House.

[CooLDoG]

so wait, let me get this straight, right now if the leading party of Hungary wanted to convert the nation to North Korea they could. And no one could stop them. Do you guys have nuclear weapons over there?

[chamber]

so wait, let me get this straight, right now if the leading party of Hungary wanted to convert the nation to North Korea they could. And no one could stop them. Do you guys have nuclear weapons over there?

I don't know hungary's system, but I assume that those 2/3rd's vote is still made up of individuals who would all personally draw the line at some point long before North Korea.

[CooLDoG]

Yeah, but you do realize this is probably their one and only chance to have the national animal changed to a pink unicorn, right? I mean at a certain point the whole yolo factor would kick in, at least for me.

[Korts]

So fun stuff today!

I haven't been following political events much lately, because I really don't need an aneurysm right now, but apparently submitting questions to a national referendum was not possible due to some bureaucratic shenanigans? I dunno. Anyway, the submission process was opened this morning, I guess.

So one of the most easily accessible complaints against the government is recent legislation that prohibits most stores from being open on Sundays, and the opposition party has been trying to bring this up for a long while.

And now they are physically being blocked from entering the government building where they can submit the question to a referendum, by concerned citizens who just so happen to be the same ex-con skinheads who have provided unofficial security at other protests, government functions, etc.

When asked if they minded the Sunday closings, one of the skinheads said that they like to diet.

Some GIFs from the occasion:

[Plotinus]

[Plotinus]

The mayor of Óbarok is resigning for the good of the village, because if you don't elect a fidesz mayor then you don't get any EU subsidies, and they need it for renovating the kindergarten. It's the village next to Felcsút where Orbán is from. In Felcsút, lots of EU money was put towards making a useless giant football stadium a while back.

[Korts]

Oh hey, last week Fidesz suddenly decided that the Central European University (which was,

entirely coincidentally they swear

, founded by György Soros) is not in full compliance of the law.

The specific law that CEU in violation of, you ask? Oh, they hadn't passed it yet when they first brought up the violation. But they promised they would pass it as fast they can, to make sure that CEU is not allowed to operate illegally, which it isn't, because the law they are breaking didn't exist yet.

But today, the Parliament made it a reality. They rushed it through without any debate - though the President has yet to sign it, and may veto due to the unprecedented international pressure. The law would require universities with institutions in foreign nations (CEU is registered in New York and is thus accredited in the US) to have a contract between the governments of the two nations regarding the university's operation, an impossible ask given that the US federal government does not have the authority to make such a contract. There was also another impossible condition, but I forget, and I do not want to look it up, because I am angry enough.

CEU is the highest ranked university in not just Hungary, but the region. Multiple cities in other countries have already offered to take them in if they have to leave.

I feel like my country's leaders have officially declared war on the intelligentsia.

[Papa Zito]

I heard about this on NPR! The President's attitude seemed to be "we could just open a campus in New York but why should we have to?"

[Korts]

We just had some special elections in Hódmezővásárhely, a city that has been ruled by one of Fidesz's main guys for more fifteen years. The opposition candidate won 57-41.

This is the government propaganda machine's reaction:

Spoiler:

For reference, this is what he looks like:

Spoiler:

[McMenno]

what does the article say? something about him being a communist?

[Korts]

The lead of the article about the election results starts with "opposition hysteria has borne its fruit."

The next article is "Memorial Day for the Victims of Communism." The one after that is "Sentences about Communism by Alexandr Solzhenitsyn," with the first couple words of the lead "more destructive than communism."

[T-Bone]

I was wondering why this thread popped up in my ego search...

Get out while you can?

I always wonder if this could happen in the US, where one party takes control and re-writes everything to pander to the base.

Heck our political parties have redrawn district lines based on party affiliation rather than sense.

Is Hungary at risk from some foreign intervention? At you at the 'rioting on the streets' phase?

Oh man, I am a prophet.

I suppose bumping this thread means 'get out while you can' wasn't an offer you took.

[Maruchan]

I was wondering why this thread popped up in my ego search...

Get out while you can?

I always wonder if this could happen in the US, where one party takes control and re-writes everything to pander to the base.

Heck our political parties have redrawn district lines based on party affiliation rather than sense.

Is Hungary at risk from some foreign intervention? At you at the 'rioting on the streets' phase?

Oh man, I am a prophet.

I suppose bumping this thread means 'get out while you can' wasn't an offer you took.

I was just thinking this same thing

[Plotinus]

record breaking voter turnout! 53.64% already at 3pm and another 4 hours still to vote. I am hopeful for a non fidesz victory but I'm worried it'll be Jobbik instead.

I voted this morning. I'm lucky that I live in a region where the tactical voting strategy matches who I wanted to vote for anyway. I've voted at that school before and I knew it'd be too noisy to concentrate and have terrible florescent lights so I brought a hat and earplugs and it went okay.

My girlfriend linked me this story in English about the election: https://theintercept.com/2018/04/07/for ... rge-soros/

[Plotinus]

4 more years of winter