Should we do a tournament?

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Should we do a tournament?

Yes
7
70%
No
3
30%
 
Total votes: 10

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Post Post #25 (ISO) » Sat Jan 23, 2021 7:24 pm

Post by Umlaut »

We could use standard delay-based time controls, but with the numbers scaled up, something like 10day+3hr. That is:
  • Players start with 10 days (240 hours) on the clock.
  • An additional 3 hours are added to the clock after each move.
  • If you run out of time you lose, unless the board position is such that it would be completely impossible for your opponent to checkmate you, in which case you draw.
  • It's up to each player to track their opponent's clock and point out if they exceed it, and they must make that claim while the game is still otherwise in progress.
With these rules, an average length game (40 moves) would definitely conclude with 30 days, and a long one within 45 or so, and that would be if players used literally all their available time, which they probably won't.

Then, since 10+ days is a long time to sit around waiting to claim victory if your opponent has flaked, we can additionally say players must make at least one move per 3 days (or whatever) or else they are considered to have forfeited the game, and that if a player forfeits two games in this manner then they are removed from the tournament and none of their games are counted in anyone's score. This ensures players aren't punished for having lost earlier on to someone who later flakes.

If we limit to two games at once, then with 8-9 players we can expect a single round-robin to conclude within something like 4-5 months, which seems reasonable. With 10-13 players I'd say we should play three games at once, and with more than that I'd say we should reconsider the format.
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Post Post #26 (ISO) » Sun Jan 24, 2021 5:58 pm

Post by Menalque »

In post 25, Umlaut wrote:and that if a player forfeits two games in this manner then they are removed from the tournament and none of their games are counted in anyone's score. This ensures players aren't punished for having lost earlier on to someone who later flakes.
Doesn’t this end up punishing players who beat someone who flaked though?

But in principle I like the sound of the rest

I also like the sound of a semi-live tournament tho, so interested to hear where everyone else’s heads are at!
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Post Post #27 (ISO) » Sun Jan 24, 2021 5:58 pm

Post by Menalque »

I believe we have 8 players as things stand
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Post Post #28 (ISO) » Mon Jan 25, 2021 7:39 am

Post by Umlaut »

In post 26, Menalque wrote:Doesn’t this end up punishing players who beat someone who flaked though?
Yeah, you're right. A simpler solution would be to just declare all their games in future rounds forfeit as well, but I wouldn't want someone to rack up a bunch of "wins" just by having the most absent opponents remaining. I don't think this is likely to be decisive to the outcome though, so it's probably not a big deal.

(We could also just
not
kick people out and leave open the possibility that they might return later, but then we need to have a bunch of game topics for games that will probably not really be played, which is ugly)

Incidentally, if a game is abandoned by both players, i.e. one runs out of time and the other just never claims the victory, then we'd probably score it as a mutual loss, 0-0.
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Post Post #29 (ISO) » Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:45 pm

Post by Umlaut »

So are we still interested in this? Does anyone love/hate my time control suggestion? Should we just get this going or what?
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Post Post #30 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:45 am

Post by Menalque »

I like it! And am still interested, just waiting for others to chip in
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Post Post #31 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:46 am

Post by Menalque »

I guess I may PM the /ins in case they’re not actually watching the thread lol
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Post Post #32 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:13 am

Post by Gypyx »

still interested and i like the format yeah
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Post Post #33 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 1:36 am

Post by MURDERCAT »

I trust umlaut's decision making completely
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Post Post #34 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:04 am

Post by Datisi »

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Post Post #35 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:43 am

Post by clidd »

I like the format too.
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Post Post #36 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:00 am

Post by innocentvillager »

In post 33, MURDERCAT wrote:I trust umlaut's decision making completely
this
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Post Post #37 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:11 am

Post by Dannflor »

I am still in
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Post Post #38 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 6:55 am

Post by Umlaut »

I have no idea why people trust my decision-making, but if that's the case, I maaaay have already made a round-robin schedule in advance. It can't be perfectly fair (we have 7 games each, so some of us will take white 3 times and some will take black 4 times), so to make it at least statistically fair we can consider it as a schedule for "Player 1" through "Player 8" and then roll dice tags (something huge like 1d1000 to be sure of no ties) to see who takes which slot.

Menalque, since this was your idea do you want to be in charge of it (tallying scores and whatever else needs done)?
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Post Post #39 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 8:21 am

Post by MURDERCAT »

In post 38, Umlaut wrote:I have no idea why people trust my decision-making, but if that's the case, I maaaay have already made a round-robin schedule in advance.
Lol this is why
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Post Post #40 (ISO) » Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:55 pm

Post by Umlaut »

Well, here it is, feel free to use it:

Spoiler: A possible round-robin tournament schedule
Round 1
  • Player 1 vs. Player 5
  • Player 2 vs. Player 6
  • Player 3 vs. Player 7
  • Player 4 vs. Player 8
Round 2
  • Player 1 vs. Player 2
  • Player 5 vs. Player 3
  • Player 6 vs. Player 4
  • Player 7 vs. Player 8
Round 3
  • Player 3 vs. Player 1
  • Player 2 vs. Player 4
  • Player 8 vs. Player 5
  • Player 6 vs. Player 7
Round 4
  • Player 4 vs. Player 1
  • Player 8 vs. Player 3
  • Player 2 vs. Player 7
  • Player 5 vs. Player 6
Round 5
  • Player 1 vs. Player 8
  • Player 7 vs. Player 4
  • Player 3 vs. Player 6
  • Player 5 vs. Player 2
Round 6
  • Player 7 vs. Player 1
  • Player 6 vs. Player 8
  • Player 4 vs. Player 5
  • Player 2 vs. Player 3
Round 7
  • Player 1 vs. Player 6
  • Player 5 vs. Player 7
  • Player 8 vs. Player 2
  • Player 3 vs. Player 4
Players roll 1d1000 and are assigned slots in ascending order (lowest is Player 1, second-lowest is Player 2, etc.)


The division into "rounds" is not all that important here, nor, really, is the order. We can just say that once two players are waiting for their next game and haven't played yet, they start a game with one another, and we can keep track in a separate thread of who is queued up and which games are complete / in progress / not-yet-started (so we do have to have a "moderator" to handle that bookkeeping). The only thing that's really important is that each player gets white or black as nearly an equal number of times as possible, which is what I've worked out here.

In fact, we could even allow players to set their own pace for how many games they're willing to play simultaneously (but set a lower bound of two, to ensure the tournament doesn't take all year). This would mean that some people would finish early and then wait a long time for the final results but that's probably okay.
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Post Post #41 (ISO) » Mon Feb 01, 2021 10:44 pm

Post by Sirius9121 »

in if allowed
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Post Post #42 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 7:05 am

Post by Umlaut »

In post 41, Sirius9121 wrote:in if allowed
Fine with me, 9 is actually a better number than 8 for this.
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Post Post #43 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 8:09 am

Post by Menalque »

ooh, I just saw that umlaut pinged me! I can run it if you'd rather not, but overall you seem to have been by far the most on top of this and I think that if you're willing and able it would probably all go smoother if you're in charge :)
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Post Post #44 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 8:37 am

Post by innocentvillager »

all yours umlaut trust whatever you decide
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Post Post #45 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:10 pm

Post by Umlaut »

I am willing and able! I'll get this going ASAP.
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Post Post #46 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:48 pm

Post by Umlaut »

Menalque, are you willing to be backup arbiter for games that I'm playing? (This would mean you would resolve any disputes about the rules, clock time, etc. for those games. Probably none will come up but I think it's important to have a resolution procedure in case they do)

Will someone else volunteer to be arbiter for the game between me and Menalque?
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Post Post #47 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:49 pm

Post by Menalque »

Yes, I’m happy to do that!
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Post Post #48 (ISO) » Tue Feb 02, 2021 6:22 pm

Post by Gypyx »

confirming my interest
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