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Dunnstral
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Post Post #950  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:30 am

In post 921, OkaPoka wrote:I actually do have a solid townread-ish on skitter

I tried a dirty method to get her to vote with me but it didnt work

so im just meh


Care to elaborate on what the 'dirty method' here refers to?

And would you consider it superior to the clean method where you try to get people to vote TemporalLich which also isn't really working, or is this an incredibly low bar for determining askitter's alignment?

In post 922, skitter30 wrote:it can't have been both easy adn hard to hammer you; apparently which it was is dependant on what you're trying to argue at the time


It's Schrödinger's hammer

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Post Post #951  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:47 am

In post 947, Kop wrote:If Dunn isn't exactly doing anything then he's dead weight, your scum reading him based on that, but if you voted for him, and others seen that vote, it might make people follow or accept that he needs pressure. Dunn can be in the frame of mind by reading the thread, seeing no votes on him, notices a few questions towards him but that's it, he can coast through because he knows that Oka is getting most of the attention. But as soon as Dunn sees a vote, and another person follows, he's going to actively have to do something, he's going to have to say something, but you were only lightly pressuring him and allowed him to go page after page after page and just sit on the sidelines whilst town are fighting with Oka


I like how you're making it *my* responsibility to get dunn to play (i.e. as opposed to pressuring him or leveling this complaint against the other several people who have noted that dunn is doing nothing)

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Post Post #952  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:47 am

In post 949, Kop wrote:Lich I'm not 100% sure, I don't think he's scum based on his contradictions. I can't see scum playing so loosely. I know I mentioned about the contradictions and said when does that tell stop, but I wanted to see what Skitter thought about it and has she not taken any other perceiving angle on it apart from town play carefree. I've not got a interest in voting there at this time, unless something changes.


This is not an accurate representation of my read on tl, try again

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Post Post #953  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:48 am

In post 950, Dunnstral wrote:
In post 921, OkaPoka wrote:I actually do have a solid townread-ish on skitter

I tried a dirty method to get her to vote with me but it didnt work

so im just meh


Care to elaborate on what the 'dirty method' here refers to?

And would you consider it superior to the clean method where you try to get people to vote TemporalLich which also isn't really working, or is this an incredibly low bar for determining askitter's alignment?

In post 922, skitter30 wrote:it can't have been both easy adn hard to hammer you; apparently which it was is dependant on what you're trying to argue at the time


It's Schrödinger's hammer


The first bit is uhhhh kinda bad

The second bit - and do you not see a problem with that or ... ?

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Post Post #954  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:14 am

I don't think conversing with you further will be beneficial and I've made up my mind

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Post Post #955  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:17 am

No offense but i dont think your read on me is real

And i'm not sure why you think that conversing with me further wont be beneficial or why you've made up your mind - your read suddenly seems a lot stronger than you've been presenting it as

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Post Post #956  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:18 am

In post 954, Dunnstral wrote:I don't think conversing with you further will be beneficial and I've made up my mind
alright, I can freely assume your skitter SR is bologna
time will end

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Post Post #957  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:31 am

In post 940, OkaPoka wrote:ill rephrase

mrs skitter whats your solve? i know you think its me + dunn/kop but here's why your solve can't be me + dunn/kop since I would've told them to hammer me and they would have been praised!


Again, were Kop and I the only ones not commited to a wagon or something...? I don't get this angle at all, it seems like a false presentation of the situation

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Post Post #958  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:38 am

In post 956, TemporalLich wrote:
In post 954, Dunnstral wrote:I don't think conversing with you further will be beneficial and I've made up my mind
alright, I can freely assume your skitter SR is bologna


I've never been to Italy

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Post Post #959  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 9:54 am

In post 935, Ircher wrote:
Day 1 VC #18Oversoul (0) -
OkaPoka (2) - skitter30 (), TemporalLich ()
Dunnstral (1) - Oversoul ()
Kop (2) - callforjudgement (), OkaPoka ()
skitter30 (2) - Dunnstral (), Kop ()
Firebringer (0) -
TemporalLich (2) - Sleepless Assassin (), Firebringer ()
Not Voting (0) -

Lynch ThresholdWith 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to lynch a player.

DeadlineThis phase will end on July 13, 2019 9:30:00 PM EDT (GMT-4) or in (expired on 2019-07-13 21:30:00).

Moderator Notes1. If you have regular weekend V/LA, you must either notify me each time or set V/LA tags each time.
2. If you see any errors in the votecount, please let me know.
3. Firebringer is V/LA indefinitely.
4. Moderator is V/LA from Wednesday, July 17 to Sunday, July 21. Please forward any questions to Skygazer during that time.
5. skitter30 is V/LA until Sunday, July 14.

Voting History Key: * = Hammer, + = L-1 vote.
Spoiler: Current Voting History
Day 1the worst (5): skitter30 () --> (Null) () --> OkaPoka () --> (Null) () --> SweetNSassy ()
Oversoul: OkaPoka () --> Dunnstral ()
callforjudgement: Firebringer () --> OkaPoka () --> the worst () --> OkaPoka () --> Kop ()
OkaPoka: SweetNSassy () --> Dunnstral () --> TemporalLich () --> Kop ()
Dunnstral: SweetNSassy () --> the worst () --> skitter30 ()
SweetNSassy (0):
Kop: skitter30 ()
Sleepless Assassin: TemporalLich () --> Dunnstral () --> TemporalLich ()
skitter30: OkaPoka (+)
Firebringer: Dunnstral () --> skitter30 () --> Dunnstral (+) --> skitter30 () --> TemporalLich ()
TemporalLich: OkaPoka () --> Dunnstral (+) --> OkaPoka () --> Firebringer () --> OkaPoka (+)

Spoiler: Previous Voting History
Dawn (Pregame; reference purposes only)Sleepless Assassin: callforjudgement ()
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Post Post #960  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:59 am

Prodding Oversoul (2d 0h). He has until (expired on 2019-07-14 08:00:00) to post in-thread before I seek a replacement.
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Post Post #961  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:24 pm

Prod received, need to read

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Post Post #962  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 12:26 pm

Hm. Deadline is soon. That's not good

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Post Post #963  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:28 pm

Dirty as in threatening skitter to get her to move


VOTE: lich

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Post Post #964  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:30 pm

People should move their votes to temp.
3-2 as scum and 5-7 as town

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Post Post #965  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:12 pm

In post 949, Kop wrote:
In post 880, callforjudgement wrote:
In post 859, Kop wrote:Well at this stage, it doesn't look like the Oka wagon is going to be the final wagon, there's got to be a compromise. You have 2/3 other possibilities, why not pursue them, I haven't seen your cases against them.

Are you townreading OkaPoka?

On another note, what's your read on TemporalLich?


I'm not necessarily town reading Oka. I can't possibly see scum tunnelling as hard as Oka in regards to wanting Lich lynched. Scum will obviously want to manipulate the game state I agree, but I don't see them putting a huge marker on there back by going into a hard tunnel that is almost making it a trade. Then posturing themselves into a position where they are going to look elsewhere if he doesn't get his own way, i.e he will force through a lynch on Skitter, and myself (you quoted the post #669 I think it was or somewhere around that region). But I'm not town reading him either because he has actively said he plays better as scum so I don't know for sure whether he's town or scum, hes somewhere in the middle.

Lich I'm not 100% sure, I don't think he's scum based on his contradictions. I can't see scum playing so loosely. I know I mentioned about the contradictions and said when does that tell stop, but I wanted to see what Skitter thought about it and has she not taken any other perceiving angle on it apart from town play carefree. I've not got a interest in voting there at this time, unless something changes.

But if this tunnel continues and we aren't exactly finding some middle ground, and we're getting nearer deadline, something will need to happen because if one or both are still around in day two, day two could potentially be another day one, but this time there will be some flips to also add to the mix. But it's going to take a better case if people need convincing. I will reread the whole interaction between the pair of them in the mean time.

From my point of view, OkaPoka is the most likely deadline lynch; there aren't four players (other than OkaPoka) with a strong townread there. Apparently, your read of the situation is similar. But in #, you're scumreading skitter for not looking elsewhere for a compromise lynch? I can understand this behaviour if you think OkaPoka is strongly town, but not really in a case where you've been sort-of-on sort-of-off that wagon ever since you replaced in. FWIW, the reason you've given for townreading OkaPoka is stronger than the reason you've given for scumreading him, but you're acting like the two are identical; likewise, when you replaced in, there was a lot of shading but no intent. So I have the strong feeling that you a) want people to think you want OkaPoka lynched, but b) don't actually want OkaPoka lynched. That likely implies you're scum regardless of OkaPoka's alignment (as S/S, it's a great way to distance if he flips, and doesn't actually hurt him much; as S/T, you'd want to save a likely mislynch for a future day if you don't think scum are at real risk toDay).

I asked the question about Lich to see if you'd been trying to scumhunt anywhere other than your stated reads, and from your answer, I'm guessing you hadn't been. That's not good play as town (although not necessarily scum-indicative; some people aren't that good at town).
scum · scam · seam · team · term · tern · torn · town

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Post Post #966  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:15 pm

In post 964, Sleepless Assassin wrote:People should move their votes to temp.

Your stated reasoning for this (#/#) is very similar to OkaPoka's, which hasn't convinced enough people to give a realistic chance of a lynch.

If you want to push this lynch, you'll need arguments that are strong enough to convince people; coasting on existing arguments is unlikely to make any progress.
scum · scam · seam · team · term · tern · torn · town

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Post Post #967  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:16 pm

In post 963, OkaPoka wrote:Dirty as in threatening skitter to get her to move


VOTE: lich
I have zero context for this post so it looks extremely out of place and scummy.
time will end

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Post Post #968  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:18 pm

In post 963, OkaPoka wrote:Dirty as in threatening skitter to get her to move

You do realise that attempting to manipulate people to vote along with you is generally a really bad idea when you're town (and don't have investigative info)? It makes you look scummy, tends to backfire if people figure it out, and means that you don't have other people giving you a sanity check on your own reads.

(As a side note, did you expect the manipulation to succeed, and how good do you think you generally are at that sort of thing?)
scum · scam · seam · team · term · tern · torn · town

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Post Post #969  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:33 pm

I'm very good at being stubborn and the chances that would have worked is fairly close to zero

@cfj ehat do you think of dunn rn?

I will be around for another hour or so and then not till after deadline; i'm willing to change my vote to dunn (or maybe kop) but if it doesnt happen in the next hour i will be unable to change it again

(I thought that deadline was a little later, sorry)

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Post Post #970  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:37 pm

I don't agree with everything that Dunnstral's posting, but most of what he has posted recently seems like it comes from a position of thought about the game. He's not being particularly useful, and doesn't have enough content for a strong townread, but it's not a slot I'm particularly alarmed about.

I'd be willing to deadline lynch Dunnstral if I couldn't get a lynch on a better option but not to vote there from a position of any confidence.
scum · scam · seam · team · term · tern · torn · town

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Post Post #971  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:39 pm

I think his push on me is p bad (particularly the last page or so)

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Post Post #972  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:48 pm

I think many of the points he's made against you are valid (e.g. the case against you is better than the case against TemporalLich). That said, it's not nearly a strong enough case to votepark without further explanation.

FWIW, unlike OkaPoka who's shown strong signs of tunnelling, I'm pretty sure Dunnstral isn't tunnelling (e.g. he was willing to attack OkaPoka even while OkaPoka was "attacking" you). Regardless of Dunnstral's alignment, I think his points are things he perceives as genuine scumtells (which can of course be dropped by townies on occasion). The main one is #/# which basically attacks you for pushing a read based on incorrect reasoning; I agree with him that the reasoning is incorrect, but also think it's not a scumtell because I suspect you thought the reasoning was correct at the time.
scum · scam · seam · team · term · tern · torn · town

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Post Post #973  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:53 pm

In post 798, TemporalLich wrote:firebringer and dunn are my compromise lynches... skitter is not to be voted


Hmmm.

I think I am no longer comfortable with a Temporal lynch and strongly urge everyone to vote Dunn. Posting this out of reference of my catchup because deadline is [allcaps]soon[/allcaps].

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Post Post #974  (ISO)  » Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:40 pm

there aren't enough consensus on wagons for me to cede my vote on one of my compromise lynches
time will end

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