Micro 1090: Fruit Mafia - Game Over!

[Night Shade]

First.

-shade

[Night Shade]

VOTE: atsi too similar to datisi, one of you has to go

Why would you not choose Datisi to go since he is physically incapable of rolling town?

[Night Shade]

tbh I think it would be funny to just lim datisi on page 3.

[Night Shade]

-Shade

[Night Shade]

Real talk though I understand the meta considerations re: ari's reaction to ausukas claim but the whole miller claim thing felt a little bit over the top to me.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

it was specifically the emotive anger part to me that felt a little bit like more than how ausuka would actually as town legitimately react.

In my mind ausuka isn't like some super gambit heavy player though so I guess I'll just tuck that thought away for later.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

Sure am.

[Night Shade]

That seems like an extremely reasonable take to "dislike."

"This person who I know extremely well sounds over the top to me compared to when she is legitimately upset that I have witnessed."

Skitter are you scum?

[Night Shade]

No
And it sounds like her reaction makes sense given the prior context

Like do u think she's scum purposefully coming into the game fake-claiming this?

This really feels like you're deliberately misunderstanding what I'm saying.

VOTE: Skitter

[Night Shade]

I am saying that her emotional reaction feels over the top to me, I noted it and then said pretty explicitly "ausuka is not a super gambit heavy player so I am going to tuck that thought away for later."

Like you're attacking me for apparently not considering a possibility that I have explicitly already talked about. Something about a player in this game rubbed me wrong, I commented on it and said what I thought about it. You can call that shade but I call it baseline town play.

Nothing in this interaction suggests to me you're trying to figure out my alignment even a little bit. It feels like you're looking for a hook to attack and you don't care about the particulars.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

Missing in your analysis is any kind of thought or motivation for what I would be doing what I'm doing as scum in particular, and a brief glance at any of my games would show you many examples of me noting small things that rub me the wrong way for later just like I'm doing here.

But you're not interested in that at all, are you?

[Night Shade]

I am implying that I think you are not trying to sort me, your posts aren't real.

[Night Shade]

Honestly Datisi ALSO feels off in this conversation what the hell. You seem like...way too diplomatic dude

-Shade

[Night Shade]

Nah I don't believe town skitter actually has these thoughts.

[Night Shade]

ok skitter riddle me this:

What do you think about Datisi's take here?

[Night Shade]

Honestly Datisi ALSO feels off in this conversation what the hell. You seem like...way too diplomatic dude

-Shade

Also, yes
Pedit
Ok b/c. ...?

On a baseline level because I'm town and I know its a real thought I had and it seems like such a simple and trivial thing that's baseline part of how I play the game that I don't know how you can possibly think its scum indicative rather than just...the way I actually feel.

[Night Shade]

My bravado is always there, thats how I get reads. I feel like you should know this.

[Night Shade]

Do you not agree that ausukas series of posts reads like quite a bit of an overreaction to rolling miller? I understand theres a history there, but there felt like a performative aspect to me.

Of note I'm like the number one person on the "townies are frequently performative" fan club. So that is why I noted it but didn't feel like pushing it.

[Night Shade]

I have no idea why you think i should know how to read you

And this feels like a misrep.

Here is what I said

My bravado is always there, thats how I get reads. I feel like you should know this.

in response to you saying you didn't understand the bravado of my read.

That is not just a subtly different statement then me claiming "you should know how to read me" its not even in the same ballpark. I am saying you should have at least have passing familiarity with my playstyle and know that I am aggressive and loud, which is a much more reasonable claim than like the one you're attacking here which is like pretending I'm nancy drew and saying you're scum for not town reading me.

[Night Shade]

Yes but the background explains the performativeness-ness imo

+ i just don't think it's likely that scum who isnt, like, flavor leaf claims miller in their first post so even if it's performative i don't really care

"I don't care about this thing you noted" is a reasonable response.

Saying it's off for me to note it is not.

[Night Shade]

I would like shea to explain his feelings about my emotional reaction to things.

I also think datisi feels off but maybe this is a sign we are not graced with the 9000iq presence of scum datisi

idk dude you really need like 4 posts and rending of your garments to be like I rolled miller and I'm not happy about it?

[Night Shade]

something feels Off about the skitter/shea conversation

no i don't know exactly what i'll figure it out at some point

Yes plz vote shea ty

Enjoy ur trip

Doesn't really seem like someone who "only voted me because they're annoyed" and "doesn't think [I'm] scum here" tbh.

[Night Shade]

hey I'm here

I haven't read anything but I'll do that today

[Night Shade]

Lots of new people to me. I recognise Datisi, Skitter and the TSQ part of the hydra. Maybe Ausuka too? Either way ima do what I always do at the start of day 1:
VOTE: Elements

ok I still haven't read but I looked at the first page and saw this. How could you not remember me

[Night Shade]

are berries fruits?

[Night Shade]

"This person who I know extremely well sounds over the top to me compared to when she is legitimately upset that I have witnessed."

I mean sincerely I am referring to this. I think in a vacuum it is not unreasonable for someone who does not know my feelings about millers in advance to raise an eyebrow at my entrance but this line kind of caught my eye because I don't think being slightly over-the-top about frustration is particularly out of character for me. Like I did not 'need' to use profanity to demonstrate how much I hate the colour yellow-green on discord yesterday but I did so anyway.

I guess what I'm feeling is that it kinda felt like not real to me in the sense that it felt like you were deliberately choosing to make it seem exceptionally angry.

I can't guess your mindset but I've been thinking about this for a bit and I wonder if its possible that its because there was a decently long break between getting the role PM and the game starting and you kinda maybe were stewing on the role and thinking about your entrance in your head? I mean I think that's a plausible reason you would feel like overworked and not real to me in your emotion in those posts if you were town.

But like the other thing I want to touch on here is skitter seems to be picking at very minor things with me but doesn't even consider the possibility that you could be doing it as scum. Like, I get like thinking that its town on a personal level but skitter seemed to be acting like there is no benefit whatsoever for anyone to ever claim miller as scum. And I have a hard time wrapping my head around that because I don't really understand what the downside is for claiming miller as scum if a) you can get away with it and b) the reaction by people is to town read it. I get that there is the history with you and ari here but I suspect skitter didn't know that history when they made those posts and even if they did you being town the last time this happened would make me personally think I could get away with doing it and the cheekyscumfuck in me would want to because its funny.

Like, I don't really know if I think you would feel the same way because you are different from me and I'm not sure how cheeky you are. (at least a little cheeky: "vig baltar") but its definitely something I'm thinking about given I felt like the tone of those posts felt staged to me and I feel like its an extremely reasonable thing for me to be thinking about and everything about skitters interaction with me on the subject screams "bad faith"

[Night Shade]

Also like as a more direct response to the posts its like usually when you're feigning anger theres a joking edge to it that I can pick up on. I'm thinking about how you talk about "brit phobia" or whatever or the example you raise about the yellow-green but I didn't really feel that joking tone here at all and further you apologized to cakez which makes me feel like idk it was meant to be real anger. A lot of the anger I've seen from you that is over the top tends to be deliberately done so for laughs.

This felt like extremely different from that to me idk.

[Night Shade]

-Shade, in case it wasn't incredibly clear already.

[Night Shade]

Skitter felt like they were white knighting you quite a bit there with arguments and a push on me that didn't totally make sense to me and I think of you as a player who is somewhat susceptible to pockets and I think skitter probably knows that.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

I just looked at activity overview to get a sense of who is here and vibing and who isn't and how the fuck does marci have 14 posts but I don't remember any of them?

-Shade

[Night Shade]

Ok I just looked at some of them and if skitter flips red I will be coming for marci with the fire of 1000 suns. Those posts all look so partnered to me lmao.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

I understand some parts of what you're saying. I think you were like mostly tired yesterday and maybe not communicating clearly idk.

I agree with your point about skitter defending ausuka. I just made a very similar comment.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

I guess reading your last in depth post I also think I agree with your overall point about infinity likely having no thoughts about the 1v1 if scum and would likely have more thoughts as town.

I think that the problem is sometimes town just does like go ok no thoughts head empty about things. I do for sure.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

UNVOTE: yeah that's kinda how we were expecting town!dats to respond. but also dats did you make anything of 107 having a lot more weirdness associated with skitt than shea? like I know you're voting skitt but it felt a bit weird that you didn't even mention it

we still pretty strongly believe that making a level 0 read and expecting other people to think the same way is in character for skitt

also @shea marci only has 5 posts

lmao ok that makes so much more sense elements is listed right above her and has 14.

I need coffee.

[Night Shade]

My main experience with elements is the normal where they just said some absolute nonsense and got called out on it by CKD and then they were like oh I always just lie about all my reads day 1.

And then they were scum.

Not really sure what to read into that re: what you noticed but its interesting context.

[Night Shade]

I think ausuka is town

-Shade

[Night Shade]

My main experience with elements is the normal where they just said some absolute nonsense and got called out on it by CKD and then they were like oh I always just lie about all my reads day 1.

And then they were scum.

Not really sure what to read into that re: what you noticed but its interesting context.

I don't really know either! I guess i could read the mafia pt of that game

I think ausuka is town

-Shade

You wouldn't be cheeky scum saying this just after calling me easily pocketed right

That is definitely something I would do.

But I guess I feel like you're reasoning through things in a way I vibe with and feels to be coming from a solving mindset. You could replicate that obviously, I've seen you do it, but I'm happy enough with it to town bin you for right now.

-Shade

[Night Shade]

My main experience with elements is the normal where they just said some absolute nonsense and got called out on it by CKD and then they were like oh I always just lie about all my reads day 1.

And then they were scum.

Not really sure what to read into that re: what you noticed but its interesting context.

I don't really know either! I guess i could read the mafia pt of that game

I think ausuka is town

-Shade

You wouldn't be cheeky scum saying this just after calling me easily pocketed right

That is definitely something I would do.

But I guess I feel like you're reasoning through things in a way I vibe with and feels to be coming from a solving mindset. You could replicate that obviously, I've seen you do it, but I'm happy enough with it to town bin you for right now.

-Shade

Well I'm impressed you didn't claim scum with your partner on page 1 at least. That's progress.

I hard carry won that game didn't I?

[Night Shade]

"This person who I know extremely well sounds over the top to me compared to when she is legitimately upset that I have witnessed."

I mean sincerely I am referring to this. I think in a vacuum it is not unreasonable for someone who does not know my feelings about millers in advance to raise an eyebrow at my entrance but this line kind of caught my eye because I don't think being slightly over-the-top about frustration is particularly out of character for me. Like I did not 'need' to use profanity to demonstrate how much I hate the colour yellow-green on discord yesterday but I did so anyway.

I guess what I'm feeling is that it kinda felt like not real to me in the sense that it felt like you were deliberately choosing to make it seem exceptionally angry.

I can't guess your mindset but I've been thinking about this for a bit and I wonder if its possible that its because there was a decently long break between getting the role PM and the game starting and you kinda maybe were stewing on the role and thinking about your entrance in your head? I mean I think that's a plausible reason you would feel like overworked and not real to me in your emotion in those posts if you were town.

But like the other thing I want to touch on here is skitter seems to be picking at very minor things with me but doesn't even consider the possibility that you could be doing it as scum. Like, I get like thinking that its town on a personal level but skitter seemed to be acting like there is no benefit whatsoever for anyone to ever claim miller as scum. And I have a hard time wrapping my head around that because I don't really understand what the downside is for claiming miller as scum if a) you can get away with it and b) the reaction by people is to town read it. I get that there is the history with you and ari here but I suspect skitter didn't know that history when they made those posts and even if they did you being town the last time this happened would make me personally think I could get away with doing it and the cheekyscumfuck in me would want to because its funny.

Like, I don't really know if I think you would feel the same way because you are different from me and I'm not sure how cheeky you are. (at least a little cheeky: "vig baltar") but its definitely something I'm thinking about given I felt like the tone of those posts felt staged to me and I feel like its an extremely reasonable thing for me to be thinking about and everything about skitters interaction with me on the subject screams "bad faith"

I just think that it's exceedingly unlikely enuf that i don't need to worry abt it rn
Idk if ausuka is that cheeky scum. Like i def know people who are, i don't particularly feel like she's one of them (and you're not sure she is apparently)

(Also i'm a she btw)

Confused. I know you're a she? Did I misgender you here somewhere and I missed it?

[Night Shade]

also yeah skitter is scum.

For anyone keeping track the progression is

1) I don't like this take to
2) vote
3) try to get other people to vote me
4) when no one hops on unvote and claim 'I dont think you're that scummy I was just annoyed.
5) "Shea has pinged me a bunch"

Pedit: That is just my speech patterns.

[Night Shade]

You said I have "pinged you a bunch."

Care to unpack that claim some because from where I'm sitting I made one observation that you failed to explain any justification for why it was even remotely out of the ordinary and then backtracked on immediately and have not mentioned anything else.

[Night Shade]

I want you to stop taking pot shots from the sidelines and actually justify your positions because I associate that with scum you.

[Night Shade]

I think I've been very clear.

[Night Shade]

Hi I'm a tomato

Guess what my role is.

Guess.

Why do people put millers in setups

They are not fun

They are not an entertaining mechanic

Everyone claims as miller! I know I might actually just get day 1d for this and I still ended up claiming it because if I don't claim it there is a pretty large chance that will turn out to be a fun mechanic.

Why would you put a miller in a game? Why do I always roll fucking miller? I will never understand it

I think Ausuka is probably town

like, were you expecting me to push you for that or something, idgi

I mean yes

Aristeia pushed me for rolling miller twice which is like magnitudes more likely probabilistically

Ausuka expected to be pushed after claiming miller so I'm not sure why scum!Ausuka would enter the game this way

First.

-shade

Which one of u is which

Hi I'm Night

why did you E-1 him?

why did you E-1 him?

I dream of one day getting everyone to e-1 during day 1

This feels pretty standard for how I've seen Elements play early on

initially I thought it could be a good way to get some vca going early that would give good info after some flips
no idk if it would, but I still want it to happen
would be fun

This feels weird though. I'm not sure I believe this? To me this feels like Elements is trying to justify getting people close to elimination but I don't think page 3 VCA is really a valid reason to be doing so. I would have liked this a lot more if Elements had just said she was just having fun, or something to do with RVS

I probably owe cakes an apology, my entrance was too hostile and just because I don't enjoy the role doesn't mean I should expect every game I join to accommodate that. Maybe one day I will get it removed from the normal whitelist

Anyway uh I genuinely think atsi is town so far and would like to hear why elements is voting there

I don't understand the atsi townread

what have they done to make you think they're town @ausuka

I quoted this because Datisi took the thought out of my head as I was thinking it

Real talk though I understand the meta considerations re: ari's reaction to ausukas claim but the whole miller claim thing felt a little bit over the top to me.

-Shade

I agree with my other head that it did feel over the top but I don't really think that's alignment indicative here

something feels Off about the skitter/shea conversation

no i don't know exactly what i'll figure it out at some point

Something feels off about Datisi being in the middle of this here

Honestly Datisi ALSO feels off in this conversation what the hell. You seem like...way too diplomatic dude

-Shade

Yep

I can't type as fast as u >.>
Dats feels off agreed

I can see Dats/Skitter being partnered here but the more I read the more I'm feeling like skitter might be town

I think i was annoyed that you voted me
I probably don't actually think ur scum here
UNVOTE:

I have to counts the votes but i probably go back to voting dats here

I don't like this but does scum admit this here?

why was my reaction bad

the convo you and shea were having was lowkey bizzare

I don't think it was bizzare...

not the biggest fan of infinity's weaksauce attention diversion from the main argument (yes this is partly fueled by omgus but i still think it's odd with how little comment they handvawed skitt/shea)

really? like what does it say to you that we don't have much of an opinion on shea's alignment from that interaction

also why as scum do we try to divert attention from a 1v1 that is probably just gonna draw more attention to itself

I don't really like these two posts by Infinity but I can see them coming from town

my page five guess for the scum team is skitter + dats

it kind of feels like their early interaction in pictures where they're kind of just fighting about something that's nonsensical and neither is really sorting the other.

I quoted this because I had this thought too, fwiw

Crap day at work and brain mush >.>
Nothing especially new tho, not a lot happened since i has here

Infinity is probably town
Shea pinged me a bunch, as did black's entrance, trying to decide how much stock i'm putting into this rn, his approach wrt me vis a vis ausuka still doesnt feel great to me

Why did my entrance ping you?

@black how much have you read btw?
i can't tell if your intro is, like, you haven't not read anything or you choosing to let shea talk or idk

At the time I had only read like 5 posts

Hi I'm a tomato

Guess what my role is.

Guess.

Miller?

How did you guess this so easily?

I have to do some work right now but these are my thoughts after reading. I think Datisi and Infinity feel the worst rn. Ausuka is probably town and skitter feels town but I'm wary there. Ari and marci didn't have many memorable posts when reading through, and I'm not sure what to think of Elements/Dragon atm

-Night

[Night Shade]

Not really. Your explanation was essentially "two decent, experienced players shouldn't be posting like this" and I don't really think anything Shea/skitter posted was that out of the ordinary

It's scummy of you to think this because the thought feels forced, like you used it as a way to shade two townie slots. And then your whole mediating felt like you were trying to decide which of Shea/skitter felt worse so you could run with one or the other once they gained traction

[Night Shade]

-Night

[Night Shade]

Oops, I thought you asked if I agreed with your explanation, hence the "not really"

[Night Shade]

I'm moreso referring to their interaction as a whole. Like, their interaction as two experienced players didn't feel out of the ordinary for me, idk. I think skitter felt weird at first but the more I read the more I liked from her

I haven't had the chance to talk to Shea about it bc he stays up until like 5 AM and sleeps all day while I have a normal functioning adult sleep schedule

[Night Shade]

black, did you make anything about the follow up to my questions, and my townread of datisi afterwards?

Not really. I'm not a huge fan of 151, in particular you saying you expect town!Datisi to respond a certain way and then unvoting. Could be a legit thought you're having but it also just kinda seems informed to me

I'm not a huge fan of where our vote is atm but I just discussed internally with Shea and his skitter read seems stronger than mine, so I'm cool with it for now

-Night

[Night Shade]

@black your entrance seemed off b/c of what you chose to talk abt

I couldnt tell if you hadnt read and were just saying hi -> nai
Or did read and wasnt posting content -> scummy

Hence why i asked how much i read

I find the hydra dissonance scummy tbh

I literally said in my entrance that I haven't read anything (twice) so I'm not sure how you could have this thought? Idk this just feels like shade for the sake of it

-Night

[Night Shade]

hey I'm here

I haven't read anything but I'll do that today

Lots of new people to me. I recognise Datisi, Skitter and the TSQ part of the hydra. Maybe Ausuka too? Either way ima do what I always do at the start of day 1:
VOTE: Elements

ok I still haven't read but I looked at the first page and saw this. How could you not remember me

Like how do you read these two posts and think "hmm I wonder if Black has read anything or not"

[Night Shade]

Datisi could be town, sure. I don't think I have a strong enough read atm to argue that

-Night

[Night Shade]

Crap day at work and brain mush >.>
Nothing especially new tho, not a lot happened since i has here

Infinity is probably town
Shea pinged me a bunch, as did black's entrance, trying to decide how much stock i'm putting into this rn, his approach wrt me vis a vis ausuka still doesnt feel great to me

This is shade on our slot. If you're scum trying to paint us as scum then you're gonna have to find issues with both sides of the hydra, otherwise the momentum towards our lim falls flat. Throwing shade at my entrance feels like it could be a scum tactic

-Night

[Night Shade]

I told Shea it would be bold for scum!skitter to pick a fight with both of us. Shea responded "skitter is bold" to which I don't really have a good comeback to. He's right. So I'm fine sheeping Shea for now

-Night

[Night Shade]

@skitter why not? I've never been confident in my town game, especially early. It makes sense to defer to someone a little more skilled until I have something better to contribute

-Night

[Night Shade]

This seems uncharacteristic of you

You've never played with me in a hydra before so how can you say this? If it seems uncharacteristic of me then maybe that's because I've never been in a situation where I know someone else's thoughts are coming from a guaranteed town perspective to start the game

and you don't seem particularly interested in trying to sort me

I hate this comment

What is your independant read of me, not sheas?

You seem kinda townie, but it's not a strong read

-Night

[Night Shade]

i think dragon eaters town

why?

[Night Shade]

Black townreading me wtf this isn't supposed to happen

I'm trying this new thing where I don't scumread every post you make. It's working out ok so far

-Night

[Night Shade]

half the game is still a bunch of people!!! smh my head

2 people is not half the game

[Night Shade]

Because why not?
I don't even know who they replaced, but i think their posts seem excitable in a way that isnt faked + 205 seems fun, like in a way that they very easily didn't have to mention team mafia, but decided to because they can see the relation. + theyre defending skitter, which like i say, skitters a pretty big sus rn >.> as scum they have no need to do that right?

I don't really see how any of this indicates Dragon as town tbh

-Night

[Night Shade]

I don't think it's that abnormal for scum to defend an early town wagon. Sure scum!Dragon wouldn't need to do it, but what's the harm in earning free town points? Do you really think skitter's wagon had enough momentum to get all the way to a lim? I don't

-Night

[Night Shade]

Seriously ... kinda wild that both black and dats are going with that

???

[Night Shade]

Pedit it's not impossible but like ... how likely do you think that is for scum-him to replace in and decide to defend town-me this way?

I don't think it's nearly as improbable as you're making it out to be. Not even close tbh

-Night

[Night Shade]

Obviously

[Night Shade]

Like you started your sentence with 'its not impossible but' ...lol. I've probably seen scum defend early town wagons in every game I've played here. I even do it as scum. You're right it's not impossible. It's very possible

[Night Shade]

Ok so you think it's more likely that scum-dragon replaces in and decides to defend me instead of just following the push that shea's making?

Idk the likelihood behind it tbh. I'm not saying Dragon is scum for this. I'm saying he's not town for it

[Night Shade]

How your slot is approaching this to me is like utterly foreign; i feel like either ur playing a totally different game then i am, or you're engaging in bad faith

I'm not sure what is so foreign to you? Can you elaborate

[Night Shade]

skitter I feel like we had a similar discussion recently...

I think it's p unlikely that thise posts come from scum. Do you really think that this post is equally likely to come from town/scum?

I'm not sure about the liklihood, but I can tell you that I read it and it did not make me think "ok Omi is probably town". I don't know where the disconnect here is between us, maybe I'm just more skeptical about early reads than you are or something

So yeah, not sure how this behavior is foreign. You've seen it pretty recently, from me even

[Night Shade]

i dont think scum would really want to defend someone so openly so early on unless theyre partnered though..? and what are those odds?

I don't think they are scum together fwiw

i feel like scum usually just like to sit back and let things happen

I won't disagree, but I think people play scum in a variety of ways. I don't think there's a set behavior that is better or worse tbh, I think it just depends on the player

How does this belief tie in to your current reads? You think skitter might be scum but she's definitely not just sitting back letting things happen imo

-Night

[Night Shade]

Ok so you think it's more likely that scum-dragon replaces in and decides to defend me instead of just following the push that shea's making?

Idk the likelihood behind it tbh. I'm not saying Dragon is scum for this. I'm saying he's not town for it

So you're cautioning marci not to townread it b/c it *might* come from scum, but don't want to commit to how likely it is?

Everything can come from scum, the trick is to determine if its likely or not ...

I wasn't cautioning Marci? I was trying to sort Marci with those questions

Commiting to how likely it is? I don't know how likely it is, but it happens a lot, so I stand by what I'm saying here. If we just limmed people based on whether they are doing typical scummy stuff or not then town would lose every game. That same logic applies to town binning people

[Night Shade]

I don't think it's that abnormal for scum to defend an early town wagon. Sure scum!Dragon wouldn't need to do it, but what's the harm in earning free town points? Do you really think skitter's wagon had enough momentum to get all the way to a lim? I don't

-Night

@black what does this post mean/what are you trying to do with it

It means I don't think what Dragon has done makes him town and I was trying to engage with marci more

[Night Shade]

@dats why doesnt scum just follow the push that has a lot of momentum?

I expect someone as good at playing scum as you to understand the benefits of what Dragon did if he's scum. If for some reason this is a real question then just look at how certain people are townreading DragonEater and you have your answer

-Night

[Night Shade]

half the game is still a bunch of people!!! smh my head

2 people is not half the game

mm this feels like not the way to approach someone who's having trouble getting into the game

I feel like this was just a harmful observation in a moment where I was trying to sort out marci's read, but if for some reason this comment was taken poorly, I'm sorry! I didn't even know she was having a hard time getting into the game

[Night Shade]

HARMLESS* smh

[Night Shade]

yeah it's just something i'm sensitive to, certain players do better when they're given space, and marci seems like one of those players to me.

What do you think of DragonEater?

Any thoughts on my slot vs. skitter?

-Night

[Night Shade]

That post gives me townvibes. It feels honest and real. And I may be slightly biased because I started exploring my own Elements/Dragon paranoia earlier today so I liked that Infinity is also feeling that

I had to go back and look over Infinity's iso because I remember getting bad vibes from them. Some of the posts and positions feel diplomatic in a way and I think that's what also felt off with Dats. If Infinity is scum then they are really good at it, but I think I'm leaning town here after a small reread

focusing on our initial questioning of datisi rather than his response and our unvote, the questioning of marci

I had to look back at this too. I realize now that I didn't answer your question in 226, instead I just kinda said what I was thinking about your slot because when you engaged with me then I had just been looking at 151 like right before that. I just reread over you/Datisi interactions around this and I didn't really feel anything. I'm getting vibes that Datisi feels different than other games I've played with him but I'm not sure if that's alignment indicative really. None of my reads are really strong at this point tbh

As far as questioning marci, I'm not sure why that's odd, but I sort people better when I engage with them. So yeah maybe it is a playstyle thing

-Night

[Night Shade]

I can explain why I think Dragon's slot might be scum tomorrow but I have to leave for the night

For now I'm taking over our vote

VOTE: DragonEater70

[Night Shade]

Ok I'm gonna just multi-quote this on mobile and walk through it. I think DE70 is the scummiest person in the game

initially I thought it could be a good way to get some vca going early that would give good info after some flips
no idk if it would, but I still want it to happen
would be fun

I'm not really buying this as an actual thought Elements had. This just feels like a weird defense after being called out for putting Datisi at e-1. I don't think there's much VCA to be done on page 3 so I feel like this was a fabricated reason

VOTE: Skitter

It feels like skitter backed down from the vote on Night Shade too easily once things started to feel like they were swinging back her way. Then tried to save face by migrating the scumread to playstyle differences.

I don't like this vote or this reason. It feels forced. To me it just seems like Elements wanted to give the skitter wagon even more momentum but the reasoning just doesn't line up

Hi I'm a tomato

Guess what my role is.

Guess.

Miller?

This is very miniscule but I'm having a hard time believing DE70 skimmed through the thread, saw people talking about tomatoes, but didn't see Ausuka claim Miller. To me this is just content for the sake of content and I have a feeling DE70 knew Ausuka was a miller when he wrote this. If that's true then there's some dishonesty involved, but I can't prove it so admittedly this point isn't much

Hello hello
I just watched the barbie movie and it was glorious

VOTE: dats

Ausuka's probably town

vla on fridays/saturdsay, etc

I think this post gives me townvibes, so I like Skitter for now.

can one of the datisi voters unvote him so I can vote him without e-1ing him pls ty

UNVOTE:

thx VOTE: Dats

VOTE: Datisi
E-1

the betrayal :O

UNVOTE:

Am I allowed to like an interaction my slot was involved in? Because I find this interaction incredibly funny but also quite townie.

Sure am.

Oh okay because I was reading you as Black and your tone felt off. I will have to reread your posts now.

DE70 calling his predecessor townie feels really odd

VOTE: atsi too similar to datisi, one of you has to go

Why would you not choose Datisi to go since he is physically incapable of rolling town?

Real talk though I understand the meta considerations re: ari's reaction to ausukas claim but the whole miller claim thing felt a little bit over the top to me.

-Shade

it was specifically the emotive anger part to me that felt a little bit like more than how ausuka would actually as town legitimately react.

In my mind ausuka isn't like some super gambit heavy player though so I guess I'll just tuck that thought away for later.

-Shade

So I actually don't like these posts upon reread. Like they have this neutral sort of tone which at first I thought was typical of TSQ, and then I realized was the same tone he had in Team Mafia, when he was scum. (I don't think I recall playing a game with town!TSQ so this might definitely be a personality thing but for now I sus that)

VOTE: TSQ - I mean Night Shade

This feels forced. Scum typically don't have any good reason to SR someone early and this aligns with how I would expect scum to push an early wagon on a townie. SRing Shea based on his tone isn't the biggest stretch but it doesn't feel natural here

Nah I don't believe town skitter actually has these thoughts.

Now this is a really weird take. Skitter's posts come from a pretty plain town mindset IMO

This feels informed to me

Nah I don't believe town skitter actually has these thoughts.

Now this is a really weird take. Skitter's posts come from a pretty plain town mindset IMO

can you elaborate on this?

Sure.

Basically, these posts:

Spoiler: quotes

Hello hello
I just watched the barbie movie and it was glorious

VOTE: dats

Ausuka's probably town

vla on fridays/saturdsay, etc

Like i get ur not officially calling her scum rn but it reads as shade if you're not going to

No
And it sounds like her reaction makes sense given the prior context

Like do u think she's scum purposefully coming into the game fake-claiming this?

I don't think his ausuka take is real
It sounds like he's throwing shade but is purposefully not going sonfar as to call her scum

Also idk why he's calling me scum, doesnt seem like a reasonable reaction to what I said, or what he's implying by complaining that i 'misunderstood' him

All feel like they are coming from a perspective of someone who is trying to figure things out, and also, more importantly, THEY MAKE SENSE. Like I know this sounds dumb but more often than not the things that scum say don't actually make sense, they just appear to, but here I can clearly follow Skitter's logic and it doesn't sound fake or contradict itself. So this is what I call a town mindset.

IDK how to explain it better than that. It's just the mindset that town people have and scum don't.

This has been touched on already but it also gives me informed vibes, especially the last sentence. DE70 has played enough Mafia to understand scum and town don't always operate on the same frequency or mindset. It feels really weird to be so confident in townskitter based on her having a "town mindset", as if scum aren't trying to mimic this in every game

Like I know this sounds dumb but more often than not the things that scum say don't actually make sense, they just appear to, but here I can clearly follow Skitter's logic and it doesn't sound fake or contradict itself.

have you, uh ever played with skitter before

Yeah but I was scum so it doesn't really count. What's your point though?

my point is that saying "this person is town because i can follow their logic" is a godawful argument to make, doubly so when it's skitter you're talking about who's definitely a good enough player to keep her internal points consistent

like, in my mind i'm osculating between "dragon is town because that argument is so bad no way scum ever makes it" and "dragon is scum because he didn't even look at whether skitt's post make sense as scum or town motivation and townchucked her for being logical"

I kinda get your viewpoint but that's not reallywhat I said. What I was saying was not that I tr'd her for self consistency, but for her takes being takes that I could easily have.
Like, scum often use forced/reachy/nonsensical reasoning to fake an SR (because they don't have a SENSIBLE reason to sr someone who they know is town), and that wasn't that.

This pinged me because DE70's vote for Shea felt forced/reachy and it's ironic that DE is admitting this is how he believes scum operate

-Night

[Night Shade]

mmm really? i basically said "this slot is basically null but a couple things pinged me" which feels like a very different thing than paranoia. if you're town and actually felt something related that's ok haha just feels a bit weird

Is it really that different? DE pinged us both and I like when other people are what I see

yeah just the way you engaged came off as a bit aggressive, but if you didn't realize they were having trouble getting into the game that's fine. but this response feels a bit diplomatic if you think i was saying engaging with people is scummy?

I refuse to let you misrep me like this. I wasn't aggressive toward Marci, so can you just drop that? Thanks

[Night Shade]

Also I think Ausuka is likely scum, for 2 reasons:

• Both her anger, and the later apology in #50, feels kinda off to me. I'm not sure how to best explain it, but it's different from how I think a person that genuinely feels angry/apologetic would express those feelings.

• Having rolled miller twice in a row before would would likely put miller on top of scum!Ausuka's mind when considering a strategy.

I don't necessarily agree with this but I feel like this post comes from a town perspective

[Night Shade]

Spoiler: for dats

maybe I'm being unfair to you because I think about you all the time - sorry if you're town and you find me annoying

Spoiler: for dats

I guess I just miss the days when you would say to me "hi ari this dragon is evil I'm sure of it let's go kill it"

This was rly cute

[Night Shade]

it's a pretty weak scumlean. though i accept the criticism we've been cautious with our vote

VOTE: atsi

Why atsi?

-Night

[Night Shade]

that's what i was thinking

[Night Shade]

i'm around i just don't really have anything to say lole

any thoughts on the Ari/Infinity interaction?

to me it felt a little weird that Ari basically ignored me saying that Infinity felt off while I was catching up on Tuesday. it wasn't until I started to change my mind about the slot that Ari made her suspicions public and made the vote

while I don't really find Ari scummy outside of this interaction i can't help but feel it might have been theatre. Ari said something about Infinity being widely townread so to me this could definitely be an attempt to a) cast some shade on her buddy so when they don't die N1 everyone won't go "???", and then b) claim she was the first person to sus him for some free town points

im not confident at all that this is the reality we live in but I guess I wanted to see if you felt anything similar?

-night

[Night Shade]

i think one of my biggest problems playing this game is not understanding the likelihood of stuff and just letting my mind go down these conspiracy tunnels. i also don't really know when i should share my conspiracies or if i should even share them at all. like i want to be open and honest about what im feeling wrt the game but i also think im just wrong a lot, so idk

[Night Shade]

? I didn't even get online on Tuesday until I voted infinity. I was busy with RL stuff before that.

ok i had to look back but this checks out. for some reason the timing of things was way off in my head

[Night Shade]

i legit thought i changed my mind about Infinity on Wednesday so in my mind there was a lot more time for you to agree with me about them

[Night Shade]

I still find night shade ro be ridiculously scummy

Idk why this is dead

you scumread me when i'm town and townread me when i'm scum. idk what to say but can you figure it out already? i think this game will be 5 for 5

[Night Shade]

VOTE: Infinity 324

[Night Shade]

that's for me to know and you to find out when i decide to tell you

[Night Shade]

do you think skitt is town atp?

yes

[Night Shade]

I don't get ur trajectory changed here

i don't rly care if you don't get it? is there some rule that says i have to make sure skitter understands what i'm doing before i do it?

[Night Shade]

i'm kind of annoyed rn so i'm just gonna step away from the game for the weekend. maybe shea will post at some point, idk

[Night Shade]

I'm sorry but i have no desire to reveal my intentions to you so that you can just find a way to scumread them

i'll reveal why i do what i do on my own terms, thanks

[Night Shade]

VOTE: skitter30

this exchange made me feel like skitter isn't really trying to sort me, instead i'm getting the feeling she just wants me to talk more so she can continue to paint me in a bad light. and i think scum are generally more concerned with keeping tabs on who trs/srs who. the obsession with my vote on Infinity and her trying to pry how i feel about the slot probably comes from scum here. my skitter tr was based on how i've seen skitter play as town before and also a couple of posts in her interaction with shea that felt genuine. i'm sure scumskitter is perfectly capable of mimicing this

[Night Shade]

I'm sorry but i have no desire to reveal my intentions to you so that you can just find a way to scumread them

I'm confused regarding this statement. So what you're saying is that explaining your reason for voting Infinity will make you look scummy?

if skitter is town then she has proved over the course of several games that she doesn't know how to read me at all. if she is scum then she already has it in her mind that she's going to be dismissive of my reasoning, whether it's finding a way to call it scummy or refusing to acknowledge anything townie about it. so yeah i don't really have any interest in proving my towniness to her

[Night Shade]

black's progression on the last two pages is probably an indication that 390 was a scumslip

-ace

scumslips mostly don't exist

-ivy, ash

we'll probably discuss in-sys/iso the slot/outsource the read to someone else atp

it's not a scum slip. my opinion on skitter has changed since then

[Night Shade]

it's not a scum slip. my opinion on skitter has changed since then

i don't believe that a town player would read skitter's posting from 399 to 405 and go from townreading to scumreading her

-ace

why not? do you think all town players act and think the same?

[Night Shade]

if skitter is town then she has proved over the course of several games that she doesn't know how to read me at all. if she is scum then she already has it in her mind that she's going to be dismissive of my reasoning, whether it's finding a way to call it scummy or refusing to acknowledge anything townie about it. so yeah i don't really have any interest in proving my towniness to her

So you won't explain your reasoning, just because you think that skitter is either gonna call it scummy or not find it townie? If her read on you is usually wrong, then why do you seem to care so much about it?

that wasn't the only reason i didn't want to share my reasoning at the time

[Night Shade]

and i care about people reading me wrong because that's just the way my brain works

[Night Shade]

lovely