Micro 16 (Game Over)

[shos]

so many people, damn. people should be notified that the game started, I think

[shos]

VOTE: FuDuzn

*continues the legacy of voting the last voter*

[shos]

lol so change that to 'at least'. have anyone else played a micro before?

[shos]

lol @ two last posts being 1.5 days away from each other.

we'll need a wagon to get this game going.
VOTE: Camilla
does it seem wierd to anyone that she voted one of those that haven't posted despite the tiny titbit of discussion that started going?

[shos]

dunno, usually RVS is a time where everyone votes until some reaction/post/something rises to get us actual discussion. it looked like it might rise up from there, and then sshe came and voted someone who hasn't even posted, so that's kinda lurkish/something. it *is* page 1 of the game tho...so I might just be too eager to start the game..

[shos]

*posting to actively ignore bullshit*

this game's activity is so amazing that we might stay in RVS till deadline.

[shos]

what case? you say that the fact I tried to raise some discussion is scummy; I did not even state anything to 'backtrack' as you say; I said that it was wierd, not scummy. you just put me on L-2 for literally no reason tho, and 2birds tried to actually blame me for not taking responsibility on first RVS vote? that a real case?

[shos]

lol I did not ignore him, I *actively* ignored him. that is, I meant to deliever the message that I DID read the post, but it is negligible because I don't think it is serious. if it is serious, that's reaaaally wierd, because seriously voting a person for not voting in first post is lolwut in the best case.. I'm not sure what your point is.. but still, being in L-2 is bad here, because if you are in L-1 here, scum will auto quickhammer. that will cause lylo in the cost of just one scum, which is good for them. that is, of course, assuming there is more than one scum and only a 5-2 setup.

[shos]

I do think that scum might quickhammer at L-1. think about it this way - if you were scum, after a hammer and a NK, you'll be in lylo officially. then D2 will not progress much because well, quickhammer cut D1 short and there really isn't much discussion available. so...D2 sooner or later will end by lynching the quickhammerer, who will probably even quickhammer himself to cut the day even shorter. Then NK again and it's 3p lylo which is basically random, and that is a situation some scum might prefer. very easy to get there. so don't put someone in L-1 range unless we're like 150% sure he's flipping scum.
~~~

FOS: kondi

I don't usually FoS but I'm already voting~ this vote is because #37 looks to me a lot like buddying; both voting like me and talking good just for the setup spec which could really come from anyone - could be even scum telling the other to quickhammer if possible. furthermore - that's another L-2 vote, which as I said I'm not quite fond of that.

[shos]

I know, I'm not voting you.

...

but I'm also not voting FuDuzn - I'm voting Camilla.

Fixed! -CDB

[shos]

are you kidding me.? well no, I don't know those games, and quite frankly I've never faced anything even similar to this - it's always the opposite, lol. everyone gives shitty reasons for their vote. "for our last game" "scumslipped when confirming" etc etc. I really don't know how to treat you for this lol.

about the rest of your post - that's a pretty far fetch you know. I opened a few other micros with 7 players to see how setups work with this many players, and I never saw anything like what you mentioned.
about the last part - that is a logical fail imo. if I were scum I wouldn't worry for being quickhammered at all and just ignore the fact I was at L-2. I understand this is sort of WIFOM (as in, 'if I was scum' is always wifom), but really, scum try to divert attention from themselves, and it's not like I told them to temporary unvote or something IIRC.

if you can link me to 7p setups which are different than 5-2, I will be glad.

[shos]

I never modded a game, and never played anything like this before, and it's 3 am, so you'll have to excuse me for making oh my god such an amazingly scummy assumption.

if you think that any of my posts is scummy, point to them specifically please, and I'll defend myself tomorrow.

[shos]

*sigh*, this game is unbelievable. THAT IS NOT REMOVING ACCOUNTABILITY. *NOBODY* FREKING STAYS WITH HIS FIRST RVS VOTE. that is starting to be an insult -_-

@2b1s, sorry for yesterday, but since I really find it hard to understand any of your points against me(except the idiotic point from above), can you still sort of compile them to me? I'll be fine with just a "post 6, 12, 90, and 160" response.

[shos]

Very well

*

Removal of accountability (with as much explanation as I can possibly provide)

: When you make an RVS vote, you say, I dunno, "Vote: 2B1S because he's a total nutjob" or something to that effect. In saying this, you have said "I am voting this person for no real reason of my own free will, and if they flip scum, I was either bussing them or being a good townie". Yes, that's a very broad statement, and seemingly worthless than "I vote this person because my pattern of voting the last voter says I must, and their flip has no bearing on my actions". You did the latter. Now, on the one hand, you have done a very good job of looking like this is a new concept to you; on the other hand, your join date suggests not.
*

Not voting in first post

: This is a small point, but it's a point of sorts. There was no notification sent out to the players when this game started; that gives scum a great chance to stall a few RL days off Day 1; eh, it's not much of an advantage, but it's a minor one.
*

Paranoia about L--2

: Self-explanatory
*

Assumptions about set-up

: Self-explanatory, especially when you admit you've never seen this sort of a game before and therefore shouldn't have any preconceived notions of what the scumteam should be.
*

Initially ignoring my serious vote

: Yes, you didn't freak out. That was good. However, any serious vote, however weak, is ultimately good for the town, and any townie should be relieved to see RVS over. You weren't.

Scum enough.

Very well indeed.

1. I seriously do not understand what the difference is between "I vote him because he's stupid" and "I vote him because he RVS voted her". seriously, you said that my vote was 'because I must' instead of 'because I want' - in order to remove responsibility - but nothing dictated me to vote that way, in fact, nothing even dictated me to post; I really see no water in this jar of yours.

2. ....... .........this is so forced. seriously. I can go right now back to the board index and get back here with no less than 50(increase that numbers as you'd like) game which started in a post without a vote. are you seriously accusing me of stalling the game on post 1? and even furthermore - look at the damn post:

so many people, damn. people should be notified that the game started, I think

"there was no notification sent out to the players when this game started" - IN CASE YOU DID NOT NOTICE THAT IS WHAT THE POST IS ABOUT. if I wanted to stall the game I wouldn't post that. SO forced.

3+4. I can't see any reason for my setup spec and the fear caused by it to be a scumtell, not to mention self explanatory. I gave you my not-so-unlikely analysis of the game(yes, without investigating alllllll the ways a 7p game can go) and gave you very specific reasons on how and why being in L-1 is dangerous. Just the fact that Camilla has been like that for a while now makes me sure that she is scum. If you think this is a scumtell, you are welcome to correct me; analyse the setup yourself. tell me everything.

5. that was not a vote to come out of RVS. eventually it was meaningful since it promoted this discussion, but at the time, I coulda sworn it wasn't serious. the reasoning behind it was just about as stupid as any RVS vote you can find. Now that you elaborated, it might look a tad less stupid, but still it is SOOO forced that even if this happened again in another game, I'd react exactly the same.

next please. tell me what you think of Camilla, and the two other voters on her wagon.

[shos]

I could easily see a Camilla/2B1S scumteam here. oh yes, that is 2 scums...ooh and another assumption on the setup..

@Fuzudn: I always get defensive eventually >< I'm pretty sure that in each and every game I played you can see that.

[shos]

lol I keep confusing them too kondi

Camilla, your sheep of a nonexistent case is not legitimate. that is why you have so many votes.
and now - you're posting, but no content. what's your reads? thoughts? what do you think of the case you're sheeping?

[shos]

so generally you think I am scum but you can't back it up.

my reads are currently:
scum: Camilla and 2bird1stone
townguys: Kondi, fuduzn(both only slightly)
rest are null.

[shos]

please do tell me then why you think I am the scummiest.

Syndrome - I always wanted to say SOAD but then there was no D lol, it'll take time to get used to it

[shos]

It's hardly nitpicking. It's not like I picked a tiny sentence out of a wall of text and span an entire case around it. These are fairly obvious transgressions, you can call them minor, or even go as far to argue that they're not scumtells (though I obviously disagree), but it's most certainly not picking nits.

hardly nitpicking? you seriously accused me of being scum for not voting in ym first post, and for 'not taking responsibility' of my RVS vote!! aer you fucking kidding me???

and @sean - "try real damn hard" - read my meta, I literally always get defensive when attacked.

VOTE: 2birds1stone
obvious consistency in bad logic and faulty arguments is obvious.

[shos]

That is just bullshit in disguise. You are trying to negate my argument by saying that i gave it the wrong name. Fine - call it an uber forced case, i dont care. Point is that having not voted in fitst post is no scumtell; nor is reasoning your rvs vote.

[shos]

what.?

This:

Very well

*

Removal of accountability (with as much explanation as I can possibly provide)

: When you make an RVS vote, you say, I dunno, "Vote: 2B1S because he's a total nutjob" or something to that effect. In saying this, you have said "I am voting this person for no real reason of my own free will, and if they flip scum, I was either bussing them or being a good townie". Yes, that's a very broad statement, and seemingly worthless than "I vote this person because my pattern of voting the last voter says I must, and their flip has no bearing on my actions". You did the latter. Now, on the one hand, you have done a very good job of looking like this is a new concept to you; on the other hand, your join date suggests not.
*

Not voting in first post

: This is a small point, but it's a point of sorts. There was no notification sent out to the players when this game started; that gives scum a great chance to stall a few RL days off Day 1; eh, it's not much of an advantage, but it's a minor one.
*

Paranoia about L--2

: Self-explanatory
*

Assumptions about set-up

: Self-explanatory, especially when you admit you've never seen this sort of a game before and therefore shouldn't have any preconceived notions of what the scumteam should be.
*

Initially ignoring my serious vote

: Yes, you didn't freak out. That was good. However, any serious vote, however weak, is ultimately good for the town, and any townie should be relieved to see RVS over. You weren't.

Scum enough.

Very well indeed.

1. I seriously do not understand what the difference is between "I vote him because he's stupid" and "I vote him because he RVS voted her". seriously, you said that my vote was 'because I must' instead of 'because I want' - in order to remove responsibility - but nothing dictated me to vote that way, in fact, nothing even dictated me to post; I really see no water in this jar of yours.

2. ....... .........this is so forced. seriously. I can go right now back to the board index and get back here with no less than 50(increase that numbers as you'd like) game which started in a post without a vote. are you seriously accusing me of stalling the game on post 1? and even furthermore - look at the damn post:

so many people, damn. people should be notified that the game started, I think

"there was no notification sent out to the players when this game started" - IN CASE YOU DID NOT NOTICE THAT IS WHAT THE POST IS ABOUT. if I wanted to stall the game I wouldn't post that. SO forced.

3+4. I can't see any reason for my setup spec and the fear caused by it to be a scumtell, not to mention self explanatory. I gave you my not-so-unlikely analysis of the game(yes, without investigating alllllll the ways a 7p game can go) and gave you very specific reasons on how and why being in L-1 is dangerous. Just the fact that Camilla has been like that for a while now makes me sure that she is scum. If you think this is a scumtell, you are welcome to correct me; analyse the setup yourself. tell me everything.

5. that was not a vote to come out of RVS. eventually it was meaningful since it promoted this discussion, but at the time, I coulda sworn it wasn't serious. the reasoning behind it was just about as stupid as any RVS vote you can find. Now that you elaborated, it might look a tad less stupid, but still it is SOOO forced that even if this happened again in another game, I'd react exactly the same.

explains to you why he is voting me and what I am doing. he gave me specific points, and I answered them one by one. The first two are those two precisely. Maybe instead of failing in talking

for him

(not why

he

's voting you), you should tell me why *you* are voting me?

[shos]

yes, it does look like that. you put effort in making a case against me, half of which is WAAAY forced and even the non-forced stuff are faulty and using bad logic.

what is FuDuzn's line of reasoning.? I'm taking the logical line of reasoning. ever heard of Occam's Razor? you're going against it consistently, and really I have nothing else to say. if you keep posting stuff that do not make sense and stand behind them, then you're either a VI or scum, and I doubt you're a VI atm.

of the people not on my wagon- it doesn't look like there's anyone scummy; so I'll give you soat, because he is the least-townie of them, methinks. I am well aware to the fact that my scumreads are all on my wagon - but that's a problem when half the town seriously wants to lynch me for not voting in the first post, and the other half is just THINKING.

reread the damn game and your damn case and start thinking too.

[shos]

ok so let's try it this way - can anyone who is not 2b1s present ALLL the scummy things I have said/done in their eyes?

[shos]

nobody died? le me is seing a perfect win over here.

anyone has some night results? watcher/cop/tracker to tell us more of what happened?
yes I thought about a massclaim too.

[shos]

VOTE: Horrordude. L-1.

[shos]

oh man I was the only VT...
three scums in a 9p? I never expected that :X

I played well I think ><

SOAD, I assume you thought there was only 1 player in the mafia?

[shos]

JK also docs the target from kills you know, so it doesn't mean anything. town really had no chance against both SK and mafia imo.

[shos]

You know what, my question to the mod probably isn't too important to my decision. I am going to vote
VOTE: seanald

what was that question?