Micro 602: Pokémon Ep 3+4: Game Over!

[lilith2013]

Hello hello

VOTE: justin trudeau for voting me in lylo

[lilith2013]

Omg i wasn't scum you were. Lynch all liars!! VOTE: kuroi

[lilith2013]

Omg i wasn't scum you were. Lynch all liars!! VOTE: kuroi

Oh shit, you're right. <3

[lilith2013]

Care to explain that list?

[lilith2013]

Urgh why are people townreading me after 4 posts

[lilith2013]

Dewy is scum. Thoughts?

~heat

Why?

[lilith2013]

Okay I can get the first part, but why is Dewy asking for thought process scum but me asking Smart (sword?) to explain his readslist is town?

[lilith2013]

I don't know why people are townreading me period.

[lilith2013]

Skeeved out?

[lilith2013]

Classic Kaboose D1-bashing.

I would love it if somebody who has experience with town!Dewy could weigh in. This is starting to feel like scum!Dewy but I don't know if she is always like that.

@FA what I found weird about your questions was that you clearly have experience with Ranger, yet you asked "what could possible be scummy in RVS?" even though that's how Ranger gets her reads.

@Ranger in Fire & Ice beeboy was very open-minded and tried to really analyze what people were doing (including totally catching an error I made), but here he's just throwing down reads without reasons. Doesn't feel the same to me at all.

I don't have experience with Kuroi, but nothing he's said has caught my eye much one way or another.

@Lilith you have a tendency to be really obvtown sometimes and that's probably coloring my read on you. I'm not too worried about it because our read on you will probably sort itself out without too much trouble.

-smart

Still doesn't explain why you were townreading me after 3-4 posts with no content..?

[lilith2013]

Now you made me town read you. Are you skeeved out about that as well ?

Yes. Yes I am.

[lilith2013]

FA is town.
Dewy should be sortable.
Kuroi has done no tells and went VLA.
Kaboose is sorta scummy not sorta towny.
Justify your Lilith read for me please.
I am obv town.


I have trouble I'd have such a hard time agreeing with any of your reads right now (5/8). As town even without explanation if you look at what is going on Ranger's reads make sense and when they don't she explains them.
I wasn't trying to be a dick sorry if I was I am starting to think you are scum unless you explain literally all of those reads :/

~Bee

Why do you need his read on me explained.. when you're also townreading me?

[lilith2013]

I'm particularly skeeved out by Sword and Ranger townreading me, because 1) Sword gave me a townread after I made 3-4 contentless posts, 2) Ranger then sheeped this baseless (fmpov) read, and 3) Ranger never townreads me when I'm town!!! Like ever.

[lilith2013]

@FA sorry that isn't exactly what you said. But it's kind of what you implied by saying "it's RVS".
Activate rangeah powah!
{Lilith, Kaboose}
{Kuroi, School of Science}
{Dewy, Ranger}
{Frozen Angel}
{Justin Trudeau}
Be warned that these come from the bad head and none of them are that strong. Will consult Ari and get back to y'all.
-smart

Which category is null?
Why do you have different categories for at the very least your townreads if none of your reads are strong?

[lilith2013]

This has really not gone in a productive direction for me... that's my fault. I'm going to take a step back and forget my earlier reads and consult with Ari.
Just @Lilith though the null categories were {Kuroi, School of Science} was true null and {Dewy, Ranger} is I can't sort at this time.
My D1 reads usually end up decent by the end of the day, but at the start they're usually awful. This game is no exception so far.
-smart

Can you answer me about why you started townreading me?

[lilith2013]

VOTE: Sword

I like this vote.

I forgot to do this:
VOTE: Justin

I don't like this vote.

Scum slips are rarely ever actual scum slips and JT look pretty town to me so, yeah, I don't get it.

Caught up. I'm happy with the current game-state, I really like the Ranger wagon. Would also approve of a Sword wagon.

~BBT

What about JT is town to you?

[lilith2013]

FA, do you have any reads?

[lilith2013]

I do have some.

[lilith2013]

I want BBT to answer my question about why they are townreading JT.

[lilith2013]

Okay here's the thing BBT. A lot of your posts about JT were like "I don't understand why JT said ____ but I agree with them anyway." And then you call them town after questioning a lot of what they said.

[lilith2013]

VOTE: school of science

[lilith2013]

I think Ranger is scum because her early read list felt incredibly forced like she was trying to play to her meta

Bee, how do you differentiate between it being genuine and forced? I don't understand how you would see the difference? I agree that the reads-list is strange as she suddenly picks up a ton of town reads after finding everyone scummy from p1 though.

Where is this coming from?

I saw a wagon forming on Ranger and thought it would be just swell if I joined and put her to L-1.

Now that I'm starting to read up though, it could actually be a pretty decent wagon.

~BBT

Hmm I thought there was more but mostly it's just this. You're like "I agree with you but I don't understand why you're saying what you're saying," and if that's the case why did you end up agreeing with them? It doesn't make sense to me.

[lilith2013]

VOTE: School of Science
-smart

Are you scumreading them?

[lilith2013]

FA: see 196.

BBT: It's like, if you don't understand how/why they came to a particular conclusion, why are you townreading them? Is it in spite of that thing, and there are so many other towny things about them that it outweighs that thing you don't understand? Then why would you point it out? It feels like you're offering reasons to townread them but at the same time being like "but wait this doesn't make sense" so later you can point to that and turn your read around.

Perhaps I'm ascribing more ulterior motivation to this than I should be.

[lilith2013]

Argh I don't think I can articulate this any better.

[lilith2013]

Hmm.

Sword, what's your opinion on BBT please.

[lilith2013]

I'm scumreading them, yes.
Mostly it's for BBT claiming to like beeboy's vote on us, which sets off all sorts of alarm bells in my head. But it's also for their inability to understand the town viewpoints behind so many things that have happened so far. I can quote specifics if you want.

Voting without explaining was a reaction test to see how BBT would respond to two naked votes on him in a row. Interestingly, he calls our vote a scum vote (indeed he has now indirectly called us scum three times without explaining why).

In response to BBT:
#1 those reads have since changed but I was originally of the opinion that 19 is too unusual to fake as scum. I no longer think that.
#2 I basically saw this:
Justin: Ranger is scum because she is scum.
Ranger: Justin is town because they are town.
And my feelings on both slots were not nearly as clear-cut, so they both seemed like questionable oversimplifications.
-smart

Yes, quotes please.

[lilith2013]

Smart, why is FA calling you out on a fallacy town just because you've only done it as town?

[lilith2013]

BBT, do you continue to disapprove of using meta?

[lilith2013]

Smart, why does BBT liking beeboy's vote on you "set off alarm bells"?

[lilith2013]

No you

Are you still townreading School?

[lilith2013]

Quick hammering is the theme of these Pokemon games, apparently.

[lilith2013]

Some unanswered questions from yesterday:

Smart, why is FA calling you out on a fallacy town just because you've only done it as town?

BBT, do you continue to disapprove of using meta?

Smart, why does BBT liking beeboy's vote on you "set off alarm bells"?

@JT: Are you still townreading School?

[lilith2013]

FA didn't call you out on it though. So was that a good reaction or a bad reaction?

[lilith2013]

So we're no lynching, right?

Lilith, I do still disapprove of meta.

Then why are you okay with it being used to townread you?

[lilith2013]

Sorry for disappearing, really busy with school this week

I thought I was scumreading School/JT and townreading Swords until like 5 minutes ago when I checked our other games (that is, mine and Smart's) and now I'm leaning scum on Swords, sooooooo... Not sure if that changes my read on School and JT though because the stuff that I dislike about them is kind of independent of my read on Swords. In particular TTH's one big post just felt so attack-y and rather than trying to organically present her thoughts and come to a conclusion, it sounds like she spent time organizing all of her evidence to fit her final reads. I'm scumreading JT much less but still a little bit but I guess not as much as before.

[lilith2013]

It's a little late for that... Literally everyone else has given reads at this point.

[lilith2013]

School:

What pushes do you think FA made that were "alright but not super strong"? Were those pushes justified/based on evidence that you think is alignment indicative?

What posts that JT made were transparent?

[lilith2013]

You said Dewy had scary scumplay. Do you think this is how she would play if she were scum?

[lilith2013]

I have no idea. I don't think I've ever been in a situation where NLing is a viable option.

[lilith2013]

It's too late we all hate you ari

UTL, I'm leaning towards NL now, since I think the chances of us having an unlimited shot vig are probably not that high.

[lilith2013]

... Why is one of the two things you mentioned out of 3 pages regarding a dead person?

[lilith2013]

Because I think Ari knew kuroi was dead and wanted to make it seem like he was putting in effort into his reread.

"Joy and excitement of discovery"... Okay.

Maybe you should talk to your other head because it sounds like BBT thinks I'm town.

[lilith2013]

gack.

Still scumreading Swords and School.

[lilith2013]

Meh I don't even know what's happening anymore. Tbh I'm not really scumreading BBT anymore but I didn't like TTH's big catch-up.

[lilith2013]

Meh I don't even know what's happening anymore. Tbh I'm not really scumreading BBT anymore but I didn't like TTH's big catch-up.

That makes zero sense and that's now the second time you've discredited me and played me off of BBT.

I did ask you questions, to which you never responded. Also kind of my fault for not pursuing.

[lilith2013]

Sorry. I'm just like.. not sure what I can do here? I was waiting to claim but I guess I'm not claiming today?

[lilith2013]

I'm just very meh about it. Either way the game is going to end tomorrow, but at the same time I guess a massclaim probably wouldn't provide us with enough info to lynch scum anyway.

[lilith2013]

Looking at previous Radja games (Pokemon & Walking Dead), there's no way he'd put an SK into a Pokemon game.

Also @Lilith could you link me to a scumgame where you were not in a hydra? Thanks.
-smart

I don't have any... Like I literally don't roll scum on this site. There's this but I don't really think that's what you're looking for.

[lilith2013]

Samurai's Metapod, VT.
@Justin are you an unlimited vig?

Really leaning toward UTL/SoS right now.
-smart

^

[lilith2013]

I have a question for UTL after we finish claims.

[lilith2013]

UTL, did you give your full role name when you claimed?

[lilith2013]

Hmmm.

You see, I'm Ash's Pidgeotto (VT).

Does that change your flavor claim?

[lilith2013]

Hmmm.

You see, I'm Ash's Pidgeotto (VT).

Does that change your flavor claim?

Hmmmm.

I'm actually super annoyed with a lot of things atm, I'm just in a snarky mood.

But I'm not sure what kind of reaction you were hoping for from that tbh.

I think you're scum so I pretty much expected something like what you said. This looks like an acknowledgement that your reaction was terrible.
-smart

Pedit: you checked your role PM, huh? Why was it necessary to add that part?

What are you "hmm"ing at me for?

[lilith2013]

Side note: I think town would have been more likely to look closely at the flips for flavor (in essence, being game-solvey; whereas as scum are more focused on the role that flipped than the flavor) before claiming, and--regardless of whether they checked the flips--would notice that the other people's claims followed the same [trainer]'s [pokemon] format as theirs. The only reason they wouldn't know to claim that would be because the other scum didn't have a pokemon and so they couldn't compare formats (i.e. SOS).

I realize this is kind of a dumb reason to scumread UTL but /shrug

[lilith2013]

I'm like kind of weirded out by how well you say you can read me but I also feel like that's justified considering word sneak..?

[lilith2013]

.. Did you not read the UTL SK thing that happened? Like, are you serious right now?

[lilith2013]

Is it really that simple? Why is no one considering the possibility of bussing? (Am I just too dumb to see why that wouldn't make sense strategically?)

[lilith2013]

SS: that's why I asked if it was this easy. Like there's just no bussing going on? That seems pretty unusual.

Not sure how I'm supposed to defend myself here; I know my content sucks, but then it almost always does. My scumread on you came from me comparing games with you, and I thought you sounded more like your wordsneak self than your maths self, but tbh I have just had nothing solid this entire game and have basically been scumreading or nullreading everyone.

UTL: All I can do is compare my thought process to yours, and as soon as we started claiming I was going through the flips because I noticed that SoS claimed Samurai's Metapod, and I went back to my role pm and saw Ash's Pidgeotto, and I started putting the pieces together. I can't say for sure whether your inattention came from town or scum but that's what was going through my head when I posted it. Like I think that town would notice this detail but scum would not because they 1) wouldn't realize it was important, and 2) would be paying more attention to the roles that people flipped than the flavor. Ftr, if you had told me your flavor claim didn't change, that probably would have cleared you as town for me (because your cluelessness re: flavor claims was at least consistent).

[lilith2013]

... Does it matter? At least we know he's confirmed not-scum

[lilith2013]

Like we have to lynch scum today or we lose, so regardless of whether JT is a vig or an SK, he can't be lynched. Because that's an autolose. It's in JT's best interest to lynch scum too.

[lilith2013]

It just literally doesn't matter because regardless at least right now he has the same goals as us.

[lilith2013]

ahhhhhhhhhhhh

can I vote, O Lord PM?

[lilith2013]

I'm not I'll wait then.

[lilith2013]

Well I'll be here, and hopefully whoever is town out of Sos/Swords will be here soon, and then 2 of us will be confirmed not-scum-together and that should be good yeah?

[lilith2013]

I agree with all of 627 but I was kinda thinking JT might have deliberately lied to see who would react in that way.

Don't you believe me

[lilith2013]

After reading 601 when UTL kept insisting JT could be an SK who shot Dewy and I started thinking, well what if he had? Only scum would know that JT was lying (if they didn't have strongman). Didn't say anything because I thought JT might want to prolong the reaction test a bit more but then you kind of explained the reasoning already so i figured the cat was kind of out of the bag.

[lilith2013]

Shall I hammer, then?

[lilith2013]

Sorry. Was walking home.

VOTE: UTL

[lilith2013]

So we lynch it with fire tomorrow. Got it.

Where's radjaaaa

[lilith2013]

Lol I think you know my scumgame would be such a mess, SS.

[lilith2013]

Wtf? Swords and I were clearly online at the same time, there is no reason to not have quickhammered and waited for JT's go-ahead to vote if we were scum together. So no.

Thanks for confirming yourself as scum though!

[lilith2013]

There is also no reason for us to pretend like we're not scum after the hammer happened.

[lilith2013]

Can't be too careful can you?

It's my ego really, I just want the credit when UTL flips town.

Meh.

At least I'm less likely to forget about this game now.

... Are you admitting that the game hasn't ended?

[lilith2013]

Good game everyone <3 sorry for sucking so much. Thanks for modding radja!!

/pre-in for the next episode

[lilith2013]

@TTH: you just described Lilith's towngame.
-smart

I cried a little bit inside when you said this </3

[lilith2013]

It's true though lol.

[lilith2013]

I'm sorry I didn't mean it that way. The way I see it is that you do a very important part of scumhunting, which is to point out all the little details that people miss (like 665- I saw that and was like LOL how did I not notice that). It's a lot harder to do naturally as scum, which may be why I always read you as obvtown. The town is a team and you effectively make scumhunting a lot easier by making everything transparent.

Well in that case. Please continue townreading me!

[lilith2013]

Thanks for modding Radja. <3

Sorry for being really bad. And sorry to Lilith for being kind of a bitch in the push. That was completely a consequence of being scum.

No worries! I didn't think you were being bitchy at all <3