Micro 658 - Frozen [Game over]

[Parama]

SUP Y'ALL, I'M YOUR ACTING ELSA FOR THE DAY. ANY QUESTIONS?

[Parama]

VOTE: ARISTO

REVENGE

[Parama]

I DISLIKE DUNNSTRAL'S STRATEGY.
1. IT GIVES SCUM A ONE NIGHT HEADSTART
2. IF I CHOOSE RIGHT, SCUM WILL KNOW ONE LESS PERSON WHO CAN BE ELSA
3. IF I CHOOSE WRONG, SCUM WILL KNOW ELSA.

IT'S VERY FLAWED AND VERY RISKY.

[Parama]

I WOULD SUGGEST EVERYONE PLAY THIS GAME LIKE THEY WERE SCUM. I DON'T WANT TO SEE ANY CASES AND PEOPLE SHOULD KEEP THEIR READS CLOSE TO THEIR CHEST.

[Parama]

AS ELSA, I WILL NOT BE REVEALING MYSELF TO ANYONE WHO SUSPECTS ME, AS THIS KEEPS IT EASIER FOR MY SUBJECTS TO AVOID HAVING TO GO BACK ON THEIR WORD OR CONTRADICT THEMSELVES.

[Parama]

MOD: CAN ELSA TARGET THE SAME PERSON MORE THAN ONCE AT NIGHT?

I DOUBT IT BUT THE SETUP DOES NOT SPECIFY SO WE SHALL ASK TO SEE

[Parama]

Still doable. Elsa could target someone, claim to have been targeted, then lynch their target

I'm just saying hypothetically scum can't assume anything and this plan allows for strategic diversity

AND THIS LITERALLY GIVES AWAY ELSA TO THE SCUM IF HER TARGET IS TOWN

DUDE. CHILL. JUST ACCEPT THAT YOUR PLAN SUCKS OK?

[Parama]

LIKE SERIOUSLY DUNN JUST DROP IT I DON'T INTEND TO FOLLOW YOUR PLAN EITHER WAY

[Parama]

I feel like you guys are misunderstanding something

I UNDERSTAND PERFECTLY WHAT YOU'RE SAYING. I THINK IT SUCKS.

[Parama]

Why is this guy yelling?

DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING USEFUL TO SAY. BECAUSE IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE IT.

[Parama]

LANE CONTINUES HAVING NOTHING USEFUL TO SAY, YET CONTINUES SAYING STUFF ANYWAYS

[Parama]

Dunn, you can't just appoint yourself as town leader. Your plan means nothing if no one follows it.

ESPECIALLY SINCE I AM TOWN LEADER THIS GAME

[Parama]

What if we executed my strategy but also lynched today

I HATE THAT YOU EVEN SUGGEST THIS BECAUSE IT GOES AGAINST THE PREMISE OF YOUR PLAN. IF YOUR PLAN'S SOLE PURPOSE IS TO NOT GET ELSA LYNCHED, WHY WOULD YOU BE OKAY WITH LYNCHING TODAY?

[Parama]

What if we executed my strategy but also lynched today

But why would we gladiator this when we could... not do that?

Because we'll never lynch Elsa this way.

??????

LIKE I DON'T CARE ABOUT EVERYTHING ELSE BUT THIS IS ACTUALLY AWFUL

[Parama]

The biggest misunderstanding seems to have been that I was asking for your opinion on my plan; I wasn't. I was telling you what we were going to do. If needed we can lynch someone day 1 anyway. As for the actual plan you won't be able to hold me back anymore

As for the caps rage thing you need to let that go

IF YOU FOLLOW THROUGH WITH YOUR PLAN WHILE EVERYONE ELSE IS DISAGREEING IT, THERE ARE TWO SCENARIOS:
1. YOU WILL BE LYNCHED
2. ELSA WILL NOT REVEAL THEMSELVES TO YOU

YOUR PLAN IS BAD. PLEASE STOP PUSHING IT.

[Parama]

ALSO YOU MAY BE MISUNDERSTANDING. MY CAPS IS NOT FUELED BY RAGE. MY CAPS IS ASSERTIVENESS. I, ELSA, WILL LEAD THIS TOWN TO VICTORY.

[Parama]

I answered your question, responded to a vote on me, and asked for clarification. What the fuck are you on about? Are you expecting something profound for page 3 or what is this shit?

IT'S NOT THAT YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO SAY
IT'S THAT YOU KEEP POSTING WHILE HAVING NOTHING TO SAY
I VEHEMENTLY DISLIKE FLUFFPOSTING LIKE THIS BECAUSE TOWN HAS NO INCENTIVE TO DO SO

[Parama]

What's your read on Dunn and Parama? What's your opinion on strategy?

@Postie

- since you are so quick to ask others about their reads ...

What are your reads on Dunn and Parama?

BOTH OF THESE ARE BAD POSTS

[Parama]

@Postie

- since you are so quick to ask others about their reads ...

What are your reads on Dunn and Parama?

Dunn lean town. No read on Parama.

I UNDERSTAND IT'S YOUR FAULT FOR ASKING THE BAD QUESTION IN THE FIRST PLACE BUT YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE ANSWERED THIS

[Parama]

It's not awful. Give a real reason why it's bad and I can prove you wrong

I DISLIKE DUNNSTRAL'S STRATEGY.
1. IT GIVES SCUM A ONE NIGHT HEADSTART
2. IF I CHOOSE RIGHT, SCUM WILL KNOW ONE LESS PERSON WHO CAN BE ELSA
3. IF I CHOOSE WRONG, SCUM WILL KNOW ELSA.

IT'S VERY FLAWED AND VERY RISKY.

[Parama]

PLEASE POINT AT WHAT YOU ARE CONFUSED ABOUT BECAUSE OTHERWISE I DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE CONFUSED ABOUT

[Parama]

POSTIE SEE THIS

I WOULD SUGGEST EVERYONE PLAY THIS GAME LIKE THEY WERE SCUM. I DON'T WANT TO SEE ANY CASES AND PEOPLE SHOULD KEEP THEIR READS CLOSE TO THEIR CHEST.

[Parama]

I LITERALLY HAVE NO CLUE WHAT DUNN IS TRYING TO ARGUE FOR ANYMORE SO I'M JUST GOING TO IGNORE HIM

[Parama]

ELSA DECIDES WHO TO ELSA. THAT'S EASY.

[Parama]

I HAVEN'T WORKED OUT HOW WE SHOULD SCUMHUNT IN THIS GAME BUT I'LL GET BACK TO YOU ON THAT

I'M GOING TO A CONCERT TONIGHT SO I'M GONNA BE BASICALLY GONE FOR THE REST OF THE NIGHT THOUGH

[Parama]

EVEN IF WE ALL COLLECTIVELY VOTE ON WHO ELSA SHOULD PICK, THEY ARE UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO FOLLOW THE TOWN'S CONSENSUS, SO THERE'S NOT REALLY ANY POINT IN DISCUSSING IT

[Parama]

THE OTHER ISSUE IS THAT 25% OF THE TOWN IS SCUM, AND THUS 25% OF THAT CONSENSUS WILL BE SCUM DRIVEN. SCUM WANT EITHER THEMSELVES OR THEIR PARTNER TO BE TARGETED AND CAN DRIVE THE CONSENSUS IN THAT DIRECTION

[Parama]

AND AN INNOCENT CHILD IS NOT THE ONE SUBMITTING THE NIGHT ACTIONS IN A NORMAL GAME

[Parama]

IF THE WHOLE TOWN DECIDES SOMEONE IS SCUMMY THAT PERSON IS LIKELY THE LYNCH ANYWAYS

AND I AM MORE CONCERNED WITH WHO THEY SHOULD PICK RATHER THAN WHO THEY SHOULDN'T

[Parama]

WE HAVE BEEN TELLING YOU HOW

[Parama]

AGAIN, I ALREADY DID

[Parama]

I REALLY HAVE NOTHING NEW TO COMMENT ON TBH.
MAGNA LOOKS PRETTY BAD I GUESS. THERE'S NO PROBLEM WITH MY POST. I DON'T SEE POSTIE BUDDYING EITHER???

[Parama]

WE HAVE A ONE-IN-NINE CHANCE OF LYNCHING ELSA

WHICH IS LOWER ODDS THAN SCUM SHOOTING ELSA N1 (ONE-IN-SEVEN)

ON THE OTHER HAND WE HAVE TWO-IN-NINE CHANCE OF LYNCHING SCUM D1, WHICH IS BETTER ODDS THAN ONE-IN-SEVEN

[Parama]

ON TOP OF THAT, I WOULD LIKE TO NOTE
1. IF WE COME CLOSE TO LYNCHING SOMEONE AND THEY CLAIM ELSA, WE DO NOT LYNCH THEM. THIS CHANGES OUR ODDS TO EITHER ONE-IN-EIGHT OR TWO-IN-EIGHT DEPENDING ON WHETHER THE PERSON CLAIMING IS THE REAL ELSA OR SCUM. THE REAL ELSA ABSOLUTELY SHOULD NOT CLAIM OTHERWISE, EVEN IF SCUM CLAIMS ELSA.
A: THEY ARE ELSA AND WE LYNCH ELSEWHERE, RAISING OUR ODDS OF SUCCESS. THIS IS A ONE-IN-THREE CHANCE GIVEN THIS SCENARIO.
B: THEY ARE SCUM AND WILL BE OUTTED IF THE REAL ELSA IS NOT KILLED THE FOLLOWING NIGHT, AS ELSA WILL BE ABLE TO OUT HER IDENTITY TO SOMEONE ELSE, AND THAT PERSON WILL KNOW THE CLAIMED ELSA IS FAKE AND THUS SCUM. TWO-IN-THREE CHANCE IN THIS SCENARIO.

2. IF WE COME CLOSE TO LYNCHING SOMEONE AND THEY CLAIM NOT-ELSA, WE CAN LYNCH THEM WITH NO CONSEQUENCE. ONE-IN-FOUR CHANCE THEY ARE SCUM.

ALL THE NUMBERS AND POTENTIAL OUTCOMES OF DAY 1 FAVOR LYNCHING TODAY.

[Parama]

FOR THE RECORD, HERE'S THE MATH:
WITH THIS STRATEGY, WE HAVE A 0% CHANCE OF LYNCHING ELSA DAY 1.
ALSO, IF TWO ELSAS CLAIM DAY 1, WE ABSOLUTELY WILL LYNCH BETWEEN THEM. THAT'S 50/50 ODDS. JUICY.

SCENARIO A: ELSA IS NOT OUTTED DAY 1 (8/9)
A1: SCUM IS RUN UP TO LYNCH AND CLAIMS ELSA (2/8)
-A1.1: THE OTHER SCUM IS RUN UP TO LYNCH. REGARDLESS OF WHAT THEY CLAIM THIS IS THE END OF THE GAME. (1/7) [END, TOWN WIN]
-A1.2: A TOWNIE IS RUN UP TO LYNCH AND DOES NOT CLAIM ELSA (6/7)
--A1.2.1: SCUM KILLS NON-ELSA NIGHT 1 (5/6) [END, TOWN WIN]
--A1.2.2: SCUM KILLS ELSA NIGHT 1 (1/6) [END, SCUM WIN]
A2: A TOWNIE IS RUN UP TO LYNCH AND DOES NOT CLAIM ELSA (6/8)
-A2.1: SCUM KILLS NON-ELSA NIGHT 1 (5/6)
--A2.1.1: ELSA REVEALS HERSELF TO SCUM NIGHT 1 (2/7) [CONTINUE TO D2, SCUM ADVANTAGE]
--A2.1.2: ELSA REVEALS HERSELF TO TOWN NIGHT 1 (5/7)
---A2.1.2.1: ELSA TARGETS THE SAME AS THE MAFIA (1/5) [CONTINUE TO D2, NO ADVANTAGE]
---A2.1.2.2: ELSA DOES NOT TARGET THE SAME AS THE MAFIA (4/5) [CONTINUE TO D2, TOWN ADVANTAGE]
-A2.2: SCUM KILLS ELSA NIGHT 1 (1/6) [END, SCUM WIN]

SCENARIO B: ELSA IS OUTTED DAY 1 (1/9)
B1: TOWN IS LYNCHED DAY 1 (6/8) [END, SCUM WIN]
B2: SCUM IS LYNCHED DAY 1 (2/8) [END, TOWN WIN]

THIS IS ABOUT AS THOROUGH AS I CAN BE WITH EVERY POSSIBLE CASE GIVEN THIS COURSE OF ACTION DAY 1.
NOW LET'S DO THE NUMBERS.
TOWN WINS: [21.826%]
A1.1: 3.175%
A1.2.2: 15.873%
B2: 2.778%

SCUM WINS: [22.619%]
A1.2.2: 3.175%
A2.2: 11.111%
B1: 8.333%

CONTINUE TO D2: [55.556%]
A2.1.1: 15.873% [SCUM ADVANTAGE]
A2.1.2.1: 7.937% [NO ADVANTAGE]
A2.1.2.2: 31.746% [TOWN ADVANTAGE]

THOSE ADD UP TO 100.001% SO THAT SHOULD ALL BE RIGHT GIVEN SLIGHT ROUNDING ERRORS
DO NOTE, IF WE COMBINE THIS WITH ARISTO'S PLAN, AND THERE IS A D2:
57.143% CHANCE WE LYNCH TOWN D2
28.571% CHANCE WE LYNCH SCUM D2 [WHICH IS A WIN]
14.286% CHANCE WE HAVE NO IMMEDIATE LYNCH CANDIDATE D2

MULLING OVER THESE NUMBERS A BIT THOUGH, I'M ACTUALLY WONDERING IF IT'S IDEAL TO LYNCH SOMEONE IF THEY DO CLAIM ELSA TOO. AT THAT POINT THERE'S A 66% CHANCE THEY'RE SCUM, GIVEN IDEAL SCUM PLAY
ALSO FOR THE RECORD IT'S IDEAL SCUM PLAY BECAUSE WE 100% WILL LYNCH ANYONE WHO DOES NOT CLAIM ELSA.

FOR THE RECORD, SCUM ODDS OF KILLING ELSA NIGHT 1 IF WE NO LYNCH ARE 14.286%
WHEREAS IF WE FOLLOW BOTH THIS PLAN AND ARISTO'S PLAN IN TANDEM, WE HAVE 37.699% CHANCE OF WINNING EVEN BY PURE CHANCE ALONE, AND IN PRACTICE WITH PROPER TOWN PLAY WE SHOULD HAVE EVEN BETTER ODDS THAN THAT

[Parama]

HMM. IF SOMEONE IS RUN UP TO L-2 AND CLAIMS ELSA, SHOULD THEY BE LYNCHED IMMEDIATELY?
66% CHANCE THEY'RE MAFIA IN THAT CASE. AND IF THEY ARE MAFIA, AN 85.714% CHANCE THEY WILL AUTO-LOSE (THEY HAVE TO KILL ELSA N1)
BUT 33% CHANCE THEY'RE REAL ELSA AND LYNCHING THEM IS SCUM WIN
HMM. ACTUALLY NO. WE AREN'T DOING THAT.

OH YEAH BY THE WAY ALL CLAIMS ARE HAPPENING AT L-2 WITH INTENT TO VOTE GIVEN, TO MINIMIZE ANY CHANCE OF SCUM QUICKHAMMERING AN ELSA CLAIM

[Parama]

SCENARIO B IS MORE COMPLICATED THAN I'M GIVING IT CREDIT FOR BUT IT'S ALSO 11% OF THE TOTAL 100% AND INEVITABLY SCUM-FAVORING REGARDLESS OF THE COMPLEXITIES SO I DON'T REALLY CARE

[Parama]

B1 AND B2 DO ACTUALLY GET A BIT COMPLICATED AND I GUESS I LIED SINCE IF THE REAL ELSA IS OUTTED THERE'S ACTUALLY A SMALL CHANCE SHE'LL STILL BE LYNCHED IN THAT SCENARIO, MAINLY IF SCUM CCS HER AND WE HAVE TO DECIDE BETWEEN THE TWO

BUT THAT'S A 50/50 WHERE WE'RE ALREADY SCREWED TO BEGIN WITH SO IT'S ACTUALLY A BETTER 50/50 TO BE IN THAN NOT

[Parama]

WE CAN DISCUSS IT FURTHER IF WE GET STUCK IN THAT SCENARIO BUT I'M GOING TO GUESS WE LIKELY WILL NOT BE SEEING THAT SCENARIO

ANYWAYS HERE ARE THE RULES:

1. ELSA DOES NOT CLAIM UNLESS IN DANGER OF LYNCH

2. ALL NON-ELSA CLAIMS WILL BE LYNCHED. ALL TOWN WILL CLAIM THEIR TRUE ROLE

3. ELSA SHOULD TARGET SOMEONE THEY FEEL IS LIKELY TO BE SCUM

NOTE: THIS ISN'T A FOOLPROOF PLAN BUT THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FOOLPROOF PLAN. WITH GOOD PLAY HOPEFULLY THIS WON'T EVEN MATTER REGARDLESS

[Parama]

i'll just wait for him to be replaced tbh

[Parama]

I'M WRITING SONG CONTEST WRITEUPS ATM IT'S HARD TO SWITCH BETWEEN CAPS AND NON-CAPS ON THE FLY, YOU CAN JUST DEAL WITH IT

[Parama]

I like scum-hunting and Elsa claiming to town myself. With no reveals which greatly diminishes chance of accidentally revealing Elsa. I wouldn't trust myself to find scum before the town could find scum before scum could find me. So if else is anything like me, we should really consider not doing that plan.

THIS IS NOT AN ARGUMENT AGAINST EITHER PART OF THE PLAN. SIMPLY SAYING YOUR PREFERENCE WITHOUT BACKING IT UP IN ANY SIGNIFICANT WAY IS A WASTE OF MY TIME.

ANYWAYS WHO SAID ANYTHING ABOUT NOT SCUMHUNTING

[Parama]

I WOULD SUGGEST EVERYONE PLAY THIS GAME LIKE THEY WERE SCUM. I DON'T WANT TO SEE ANY CASES AND PEOPLE SHOULD KEEP THEIR READS CLOSE TO THEIR CHEST.

Trying to hide reads in any case, and especially saying everyone should, reads sus AF to me. This game can be solved simply from reads.

YOU AND MAGNA ARE BOTH MISSING THE BIG PICTURE.

IF WE DECIDE ELSA SHOULD OUT TO HER TOWN READS, AND EVERYONE HAS THEIR TOWN READS OUT IN THE OPEN, THEN SCUM CAN USE THAT INFORMATION TO FIGURE OUT WHO ELSA IS.
IF WE DECIDE ELSA SHOULD OUT TO HER SCUM READS, AND EVERYONE HAS THEIR SCUM READS OUT IN THE OPEN, THEN SCUM CAN USE THAT INFORMATION TO FIGURE OUT WHO ELSA IS.
IF A TOWNIE WHO THINKS ELSA IS SCUM LEARNS WHO ELSA IS, THEY WILL HAVE A HARD TIME NOT MAKING IT BLATANTLY OBVIOUS TO THE SCUM.
I THINK PEOPLE SHOULD PUT ONE SCUM READ OUT IN THE OPEN AND NOTHING ELSE. KEEP YOUR OWN PERSONAL NOTES IF YOU NEED TO. HAVE READS. SCUMHUNT. YOU CAN STILL DO THAT WITHOUT GIVING SCUM INFO THAT HELPS THEM.

[Parama]

Fortunately, Elsa is too strong for an assassin to handle alone. Town immediately wins if an assassin is lynched.

Quick phone post -

I think too many people are forgetting the first part of this facet of the set-up ... I don't inherently think scum have a PT to coordinate this game given this particular nature of the set-up.

Take-away - anyone trying to hint at Elsa's identity in thread should be turbo-lynched.

DUDE I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE EVEN TRYING TO IMPLY HERE OR HOW YOU CAME TO THIS CONCLUSION BUT PLEASE GO LOOK AT THE FIRST PM THE MOD SENT OUT
IT EXPLICITLY DESCRIBES THE ASSASSINS AS "THE MAFIA"
SO YES. THEY PROBABLY HAVE SOME WAY OR ANOTHER TO COORDINATE

[Parama]

Aristo, I appreciate the humour but you're almost as bad as lane at this point.

Tell me

Who are we lynching today?

Anyone but Postie, Parama, Ari, Dunn.

I have no real preference beyond that.

THAT THIS POST IS NOT BUNDLED WITH A DUNN UNVOTE IS BOTHERSOME
YES I KNOW THE ORIGINAL VOTE IS A JOKE VOTE
BUT YOU'RE SAYING NOT TO LYNCH HIM WHILE YOU LEAVE YOUR VOTE ON HIM
AND THAT BOTHERS ME A LOT

[Parama]

Aristo, I appreciate the humour but you're almost as bad as lane at this point.

Tell me

Who are we lynching today?

There isn't anyone who is better than I am at that point, and if you think you are yours delusional. Everyone has done almost nothing alignment indicative, and everyone has done almost no scum hunting. So stop

UNVOTE:
VOTE: LANE

ALRIGHT. WE'RE POLICY LYNCHING UP IN THIS SUCKAHHHHHH
BECAUSE LANE HAS JUST TRIED TO PASS OF HIS PISS POOR PLAY WITH AN EXCUSE IMPLYING NOBODY ELSE IS DOING BETTER, WHICH IS JUST OBJECTIVELY UNTRUE. PRACTICALLY EVERYONE ELSE IS ALREADY PUTTING ACTUAL EFFORT AND PRODUCING DECENT CONTENT
AND I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT HE WILL CONTINUE TO BE USELESS ALL GAME IF WE ALLOW HIM TO LIVE
THAT'S JUST HOW BAD PLAYERS LIKE THIS FUNCTION
SO LET'S JUST PURGE THIS NOW
IF HE'S ELSA WE'RE TOTALLY BONED ANYWAYS

[Parama]

I thought about it tbh, but your vote was still on me despite our coordinating plans. I don't see any activity towards Dunn, so I don't see a reason it needs to be moved.

But sure.
UNVOTE:

I'll join you on Lane as long as we're not at L-1 or something.

FAIR ENOUGH. I TEND TO FORGET WHERE MY VOTE IS ANYWAYS LOL

[Parama]

lol

Can we lynch lane now

Excellent point. You are much better than me this game. I see it now.

GARBAGE LIKE THIS IS WHY I WANT TO LYNCH YOU TBH

[Parama]

Everyone has done almost nothing alignment indicative

Also this isn't true at all

Alright name the things that are alignment indicative

JUST GO ISO A RANDOM PLAYER IN THE GAME THAT ISN'T YOU AND YOU'LL FIND A FEW

[Parama]

This is dog shit scum hunting. And to try to push my lynch like this is scummy as shit. It's been 95% really about either claim or no claim and who Elsa should be targeting. And he wants to push my lynch for policy? What a joke.

GOOD THING IT'S NOT SCUMHUNTING

HONESTLY I FIND YOUR PLAY ANTI-TOWN AND YOUR PERSONALITY VERY UNPLEASANT
I DON'T THINK YOU'RE SCUM BUT I DOUBT YOU'RE ELSA EITHER AND YOU'RE A LIABILITY TO THE TOWN AS IS

[Parama]

I've nothing to claim if we're claiming at l-2. Some pretty house shit votes though Holy shit

ANYONE NOT INSTA-VOTING LANE AFTER THIS CLAIM IS SCUM. 100%.

[Parama]

Yes Parama, if I'm Elsa you are boned, cause you're running me up page 9 when nobody has done shit to scum hunt. You're lucky I'm not Elsa. If I was none of that would've been my fault. It'd be on town or if you Postie and ari, forcing someone to claim page 9 when not shit has happened. How fucking awful are you guys

LIKE, SEE, IT'S THE ARROGANCE AND THE HYPOCRISY THAT GETS TO ME.

YOU REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT YOU ARE THE PROBLEM. YOU INSTEAD BLAME THREE OTHER PEOPLE.
OCCAM'S RAZOR SAYS THAT YOU'RE THE PROBLEM WHEN THE MAJORITY IS AGAINST YOU
YOUR PLAY JUST SUCKS DUDE. OWN UP TO IT INSTEAD OF FLINGING INSULTS AROUND AND MAYBE PEOPLE WOULD ACTUALLY LISTEN TO YOU

[Parama]

I don't see a reason to keep someone who claimed not elsa alive.

Also l-2 tomorrow is going to be 2 votes so everybody needs to be very careful with their votes

HE SAYS, NOT VOTING LANE

[Parama]

Rules for the Game –

1. Town never, ever claims Elsa falsely.
2. If scum fake-claim Elsa when being run up then the Real Elsa DOES NOT COUNTERCLAIM THAT DAY. Another Town who knows Elsa’s Identity can safely counterclaim them and we lynch the scum immediately. If no Town who knows is alive then we don’t lynch the Elsa claimer and if they survive the Night we lynch them the next day. If it really is Elsa we lose the game for being bad at running up Elsa. Only reason for Elsa to counterclaim is if someone claims Elsa and another player supports that claim which Elsa knows is a fake support. In that case we lynch the supporter and win the game.

HEY MOI GUESS WHAT I ALREADY BEAT YOU TO THE PUNCH ON BOTH OF THESE,
EVEN ASIDE FROM #1 BEING BLATANTLY OBVIOUS
ALSO BTW IF ELSA SURVIVES OVERNIGHT THEN THAT MEANS THE ELSA IS A FAKECLAIM BECAUSE MAFIA HAVE LITERALLY NO REASON TO NOT KILL ELSA

[Parama]

DUDE I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE EVEN TRYING TO IMPLY HERE OR HOW YOU CAME TO THIS CONCLUSION BUT PLEASE GO LOOK AT THE FIRST PM THE MOD SENT OUT
IT EXPLICITLY DESCRIBES THE ASSASSINS AS "THE MAFIA"
SO YES. THEY PROBABLY HAVE SOME WAY OR ANOTHER TO COORDINATE

Just shut up. Seriously. If you were some Newb I might take your complete lack of imagination as just “Doesn’t understand that Themed games can be non-standard”. But you are not a Newb.

I’ll put it in a way that is required for you to understand.

JUST BECAUSE THEY ARE MAFIA DOESN’T MEAN THEY HAVE TO HAVE A PT TO COMMUNICATE AT NIGHT IN A CLOSED GAME.

There, that more understandable for you. I know it isn’t for most people but you apparently still think it is useful to post in All-Caps.

The set-up specifically says that one Assassin alone can’t overcome Elsa. A logical conclusion is that probably each Assassin submits a target for killing and they can kill Elsa if both choose her the same Night. The logical conclusion from that is that scum can’t coordinate outside the thread or the set-up is frankly stupid. And I don’t think Fakegod makes stupid set-ups. Probably if the Mafia doesn’t choose the same players there is some behind the scenes element that chooses between the two submissions. In all likelihood given the size of the game scum only knows each other via Role PM.

Of course you probably stand a good chance of being scum given your "Herp a derp let's policy lynch" but Town needs to see this regardless.

BUT MAGNA, WHY ARE YOU SO DEAD-SET ON THIS THEORY ANYWAYS? YOU'RE EXTRAPOLATING FROM ONE FLAVOR LINE THAT SCUM 1. DON'T HAVE ANY WAY TO COORDINATE 2. BOTH HAVE TO SELECT THE SAME TARGET INDEPENDENTLY OF EACH OTHER

SURE, THIS IS A POSSIBILITY, BUT YOUR REJECTION OF ALL OTHER POSSIBILITIES MAKES IT FEEL LIKE YOU KNOW SOMETHING I DON'T

HOW IS THE SETUP STUPID IF MAFIA CAN COORDINATE, BY THE WAY? YOU'RE USING THAT AS THE BASIS FOR YOUR ARGUMENT BUT YOUR BASIS HAS NO BASIS IN OF ITSELF UNLESS YOU CAN ARGUE WHY THE SETUP WOULD BE IMBALANCED IF MAFIA COORDINATE, AND RUNNING THE NUMBERS LIKE I ALREADY DID PREVIOUSLY IT HONESTLY ALREADY SEEMS A LITTLE TOWNSIDED EVEN IF THEY CAN COORDINATE AT ALL, IT'D JUST BE WAY WORSE IF THEY COULDN'T

BUT YOUR SETUP THEORY BEING A "LOGICAL CONCLUSION" IS COMPLETE GARBAGE THE WAY I SEE IT

AND YOUR INCREDIBLY HOSTILE TONE ISN'T DOING ANY FAVORS EITHER. SO I'M SCUM WITH POSTIE. SO EVERYONE ELSE IS TOWN. SURE. ME AND POSTIE DEFINITELY HEDGED ALL OUR BETS ON A POLICY LYNCH WAGON. WOW. GOOD SCUMHUNTING THERE. YOUR READS COME OFF AS INCREDIBLY WEAK AND YOU HIDE BEHIND THIS PISSY TONE TO MAKE THEM SEEM STRONGER THAN THEY ARE BUT I'M NOT BUYING INTO IT

[Parama]

Not to mention the hypocrisy, Postie, you should realize I've done just as much as you to move the game forward. Which I'll agree is next to nothing

SEE, THIS IS EXACTLY THE PROBLEM

YOU'RE ADMITTING TO CRAP PLAY

AND YOU'RE GOING "BUT EVERYONE ELSE IS DOING IT TOO" AS YOUR JUSTIFICATION

THAT.

THAT IS WHY YOU ARE THE PROBLEM.

[Parama]

He claimed Not Elsa so obviously I'm not scumreading him anymore. Before that, I was scumreading him because all of his posts amounted to "hurr durr I don't know what's going on" and fluff that was superficially game-relevant but actually did nothing to move the game forward (e.g. 38, 40), all of which felt like a disingenuous attempt at looking like he was playing the game while actually not doing so.

And yet you are still voting him ...

THE PROBLEM IS THAT YOU AREN'T. WE POWERLYNCH ANYONE WHO CLAIMS NOT-ELSA. POSTIE'S FINE. POSTIE'S VOTE IS IN THE RIGHT PLACE

[Parama]

I don't see a reason to keep someone who claimed not elsa alive.

Also l-2 tomorrow is going to be 2 votes so everybody needs to be very careful with their votes

HE SAYS, NOT VOTING LANE

chill

STILL NOT VOTING LANE

[Parama]

It's literally impossible for me to be the problem of being run up to l-2 based on policy.

I LITERALLY CANNOT FATHOM HOW BLIND TO THE WORLD AROUND YOU YOU HAVE TO BE TO MAKE THIS POST. IT'S POINTLESS TO EVEN ARGUE WITH YOU IF THIS IS HOW DEEP YOU ARE UP YOUR OWN POSTERIOR

[Parama]

BECAUSE YOU HAVE CLAIMED NOT-ELSA, GUARANTEEING THAT 1. YOU ARE A SAFE LYNCH 2. YOU ARE A LIABILITY THAT SCUM WILL NEVER KILL 3. YOUR ALIGNMENT IS UNKNOWN AND THERE IS STILL THE POSSIBILITY OF YOU FLIPPING SCUM

[Parama]

WHOOSH

THERE IT GOES, THE POINT RIGHT OVER LANE'S HEAD

I'M DONE RESPONDING TO DEAD MAN WALKING ANYWAYS, WASTE OF TIME

[Parama]

TOO BAD, DUNN, THE NUMBERS SUPPORT MY PLAN

[Parama]

YOU DON'T HAVE TO, SINCE YOU'RE BEING LYNCHED TODAY

[Parama]

IT IS ACTUALLY ANTI-TOWN TO LEAVE SOMEONE ALIVE AFTER THEY'VE CLAIMED ELSA

[Parama]

CLAIMED NOT-ELSA RATHER LOL

[Parama]

IT'D BE COOL IF ASP AND LOHI WERE POSTING MORE BUT IT'S NOT NECESSARY EITHER

[Parama]

ok

[Parama]

the disappointment was that in such a short game I still found someone to hate

always gotta be one I guess

[Parama]

the disappointment was that in such a short game I still found someone to hate

always gotta be one I guess

When you find a game where you have someone to hate ... that person is likely the problem.

When you find someone to hate every game ... the problem is likely you.

yeah, go read undertale mafia and tell me btd6 wasn't the problem there lol

[Parama]

like I could've handled lane better here sure but his attitude really was insufferable

[Parama]

like did you think I townread postie? cause uhh my only real townread was dunn tbh, though I didn't scumread postie either