Micro 773: Twin Trap - Game Over

[Torn Up]

VOTE: GulityLion

Let's wagon this

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: RC most awesomest

Come at me

Town

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: torn up
let's wagon this

you're just jealous because we're awesome

-tor

[Torn Up]

I swear on my secret love for Ether that I am town in this game.

Anyone who votes us from now on is scumclaiming 100% of the time.

I believe you

which hydra are you

does it contain RC

if it doesn't wtf is that name

-tor

[Torn Up]

Ok scum team is GL and eth0s/mumble. GG.

~ C

[Torn Up]

hello everyone!
RC, are we friends?

Hi Chara, where's your vote?

[Torn Up]

If you don't lock me as town in your next post we're not friends anymore.

It's implied by the sheep. We're samesies

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Torn up

VOTE: Hopkirk

You're going to put us at L-2 with 2 scum in the game, without a reason?

That's bad form old chap.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Could you please share it so we can move things along? I don't like pulling teeth.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Omg... seriously do I need to keep prodding you to get your thoughts into something coherent? You know this is a hydra right? We're bound to be inconsistent. Or you could elaborate so I know what you mean.

~ C

[Torn Up]

You want to wagon GL but don't like being wagoned.

That's called hypocrisy not inconsistency. I said wagon GL not wagon us. I don't mind the prior votes on us, it's your vote that bothers me.

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Torn up

VOTE: Hopkirk

You're going to put us at L-2 with 2 scum in the game, without a reason?

That's bad form old chap.

~ C

I actually give reasons. You can assume "without a reason" is referring to your naked vote.

How do you know scum wouldn't hammer?

[Torn Up]

I can agree with that logic. Yeah I didn't like GL's entrance either, I can't put my finger on it, but it included the fact he didn't vote and it somehow felt awkward.

I like N_M's fearlessness and his RVS vote was pretty quality. Mumble hasn't given away much but feels natural at this stage. I like eth0s pushing us back for my wagon GL opening.

I dislike your first post was a naked vote putting a wagon to L-2 which you claim you had a reason for but it's not RVS. You backtracking feels scummy but I'll admit I'm biased at this point.

~ C

[Torn Up]

A prior vote is likely scum after vote.
You don't mind the prior votes.

Explain please.

It's called a reaction test. I'm not seriously calling the scumteam before everyone has posted. I've abandoned it because it looks like we've left RVS already. Also Hopkirk, you've played with me before so don't act like you don't know I'm all over the place with my playstyle.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Why do you think I don't have a reason?

By the way, asking what you think my reason is doesn't require me to have a reason.

No it doesn't but you decided to give me one when I pushed you for it so I'm not sure what your point is here.

~ C

[Torn Up]

I have no idea who is in your hydra.

My point is you said I had a reason that I claimed wasn't RVS. I didn't say that.

Having a reason means its not random right? Didn't you say you were voting me for inconsistency?

~ CheekyTeeky

[Torn Up]

wait how the fuck are we L-1 in this

-tor

[Torn Up]

Vote Count

Torn up - 3 - eth0s, not mafia, flubber
Guiltylion - 2 - rc most awesomest, hopkirk
Not mafia - 1 - mumble
Hopkirk - 1 - torn up
Flubber 1 - Guiltylion

Not Voting: Chara

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is January 29 at 11:00 PM EST

who even are these people

not mafia unvote me please

-tor

[Torn Up]

Omg... seriously do I need to keep prodding you to get your thoughts into something coherent? You know this is a hydra right? We're bound to be inconsistent. Or you could elaborate so I know what you mean.

~ C

Ohh I'm stupid

VOTE: torn up

you are unbelievably bad, yes

-tor

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Torn up

this vote is awful

-tor

[Torn Up]

If scum hammer then they're obvious scum.
If dumb scum hammer we lynch them.
Good trade if it happens.

VOTE: GL
thoughts?

no, you do this little goofy putting people in L-2 and L-1, and sit back and enjoy the lolhammer

it fucking happens and I lost games because town did it on town

you're anti town, so you're either mafia or idiot

I'm leaning mafia right now

-tor

[Torn Up]

I can agree with that logic. Yeah I didn't like GL's entrance either, I can't put my finger on it, but it included the fact he didn't vote and it somehow felt awkward.

I like N_M's fearlessness and his RVS vote was pretty quality. Mumble hasn't given away much but feels natural at this stage. I like eth0s pushing us back for my wagon GL opening.

I dislike your first post was a naked vote putting a wagon to L-2 which you claim you had a reason for but it's not RVS. You backtracking feels scummy but I'll admit I'm biased at this point.

~ C

I agree with everything cheeky said here apart from agreeing with hop's 'logic'.

-tor

[Torn Up]

'Ok scum team is GL and eth0s/mumble. GG.'
This was a joke then?

I'm backtracking?

do you think cheeky thinks she actually caught the entire scumteam on page 2?

do you know this player? does it read like an airheaded village idiot to you?

only on mafiascum do people find such ridiculous reasons to push a player and that's not considered a scumclaim.

-tor

[Torn Up]

Why do you think I don't have a reason?

By the way, asking what you think my reason is doesn't require me to have a reason.

cheeky's reasoning was towny and thoughtful

your reasoning was poop

-tor

[Torn Up]

VOTE: torn up

Policy lynching a hydra that just admitted they'll be using hydra dissonance to cover their tracks

L-1

No love

I'll lynch you when this gameday is over

-tor

[Torn Up]

torn up please someone might think that the hydras got mixed up

I don't sign up to games to be quicklynched by idiots

-tor

[Torn Up]

I'm not using AtE or anything. it's this ridiculous mafiascum 'playstyle' that gets town to lose over and over. putting someone on L-1 when the game barely started because MAFIA WUD NEVER LYNCH THEM and then someone fucking hammers town early anyway... also, apart from maybe chara who is actually good at mafia, none of you is capable to reading me at any level that isn't exactly =rand. and not mafia is just wolfreading me everygame until he finally, maybe someday gets it right. I agree with cheeky he is relatively towny.

I'll do what I always do in games here, which is be at war with the entire town, get scum lynched and get my NK, thanks. now get the fuck off my wagon not mafia. the other two can stay there if they want as they're scummy af.

-tor

[Torn Up]

in before 'OMG HE IS OVERREACTING HE SCUMZ' and then I flip town

-tor

[Torn Up]

Actually you are precisely AtEing. Whether you're doing so directly or indirectly does not change the fact that you are attempting to towntell by wearing your emotions, real or faked, on your sleeve. Given how badly you reacted to Kaede Akamatsu getting upset in Magical Girls, especially when she was clearly legitimately upset to the point that she claimed to be given her replacement, you should either show a little bit more self control or start accepting that emotional displays are part of the game.

mafiascum plays mafia poorly

it pisses me off

check the very last game I played here where SOMEONE ELSE was put in L-1 and my reaction replacing in and reading that

you don't know me, I'm not appealing to any emotion, I'm trying to appeal to reason. putting people in L-1 is bad and none of you are capable to untangle the mess that will go through after a quicklynch here.

-tor

[Torn Up]

here is a brilliant piece of advice for games where majority is on: only vote when you mean it

your decade of playing mafia poorly needs to stop eventually guys

-tor

[Torn Up]

I AM L-1 ALREADY IF YOU VOTE ME I'M LYNCHED LOL

-tor

and no I didn't speak with cheeky

[Torn Up]

...

[Torn Up]

alright that's enough from you

VOTE: Torn Up

are you actually radiant cowbells?

[Torn Up]

If MS is so bad you're welcome to leave it.

I for one don't think systematically ignoring and lynching everyone who isn't enough of a member of the in crowd doesn't beget a good mafia experience, but y'know.
Or that lynching the playerlist in order of whoever has the least posts to highest is actually playing mafia.

that's mafiascum in a nutshell

look what you just did to me LOL

you're the most ingroup people I have ever met in my life. I do nothing but play well here, win most of my games and I'm called a shit player super often. when we played turbos together, I didn't mislynch you once. I voted you when you were scum because I'm good at turbos. anyway. I'm trying to see if I'm lynched or not and it's a little confusing. I thik I'm L-1 right now.

-tor

[Torn Up]

radiant you're the last person in the world to say to anyone they're creating a bad mafia experience

won't forgive your little spat with merymainbtw either

-tor

[Torn Up]

I AM L-1 ALREADY IF YOU VOTE ME I'M LYNCHED LOL

-tor

and no I didn't speak with cheeky

You quoted being L2...

I liked Cheeky's reaction. I hate yours.
If you'd spoken, you'd be obv-scum.

no, I was complaining of you putting me on L-2

radiant is scum btw

[Torn Up]

I AM L-1 ALREADY IF YOU VOTE ME I'M LYNCHED LOL

-tor

and no I didn't speak with cheeky

You quoted being L2...

I liked Cheeky's reaction. I hate yours.
If you'd spoken, you'd be obv-scum.

you don't like me calling you an idiot. I'm doing so because you deserve it. because your play is bad.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I mean: I haven't been in most of your games. I just know that when you played scum versus me you fell down exactly the rabbit hole that I wanted you to.
I'm self aware enough not to judge anyone's town game too hard based on their performance versus me in particular but you'll forgive me if I don't personally have a super high view of your play.

won't forgive your little spat with merymainbtw either

That was 0% my fault and 100% Zarathustra being a flagrant asshole. Do you seriously think that that was my fault?

I was never scum versus you

-tor

[Torn Up]

not talking about zara. that was someone else's return game that means something to me, and you created a shit experience for her and she doesn't feel like playing mafia anymore

for you to then come here and give me shit for 'creating a bad experience' for others lol you RC

you have never played with scum!me before and this isn't it either

-tor

[Torn Up]

I AM L-1 ALREADY IF YOU VOTE ME I'M LYNCHED LOL

-tor

and no I didn't speak with cheeky

You quoted being L2...

I liked Cheeky's reaction. I hate yours.
If you'd spoken, you'd be obv-scum.

you don't like me calling you an idiot. I'm doing so because you deserve it. because your play is bad.

-tor

You're just insulting people. That's not productive. That's not scumhunting.

don't lynch me before I even play though

I spent days looking forward to this game. what's wrong with all of you. it's a game with MAJ on, stop throwing votes around like it's meaningless jfc.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I AM L-1 ALREADY IF YOU VOTE ME I'M LYNCHED LOL

-tor

and no I didn't speak with cheeky

You quoted being L2...

I liked Cheeky's reaction. I hate yours.
If you'd spoken, you'd be obv-scum.

you don't like me calling you an idiot. I'm doing so because you deserve it. because your play is bad.

-tor

You're just insulting people. That's not productive. That's not scumhunting.

don't lynch me before I even play though

I spent days looking forward to this game. what's wrong with all of you. it's a game with MAJ on, stop throwing votes around like it's meaningless jfc.

-tor

Your slot was in no danger of lynch until you entered it.

do you understand that scum just thought he was hammering me? you put people near lynch and say they were never in any trouble lol

anyway I don't know how else I should react to opening a game I didn't even play yet and be this close to getting lynched. if I wasn't close to getting lynched I wouldn't be a vote away from it. you can't simply deny reality because you suppose mafia is played completely backwards lol. may this serve as an experience for when RC flips red, that mafia indeed does quickhammer when given the opportunity.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I don't give a fuck about her shit experience her hydra partner was repeatedly antagonizing me, continuing after the mod publicly warned people to stop being toxic because of his behaviour.
Her playing with a shitty human being isn't my problem. Don't blame me because you have friends who are shitty people.

it's not me who has shitty friends

-tor

[Torn Up]

And sorry but you're creating a pretty unpleasant game experience and I'd rather we just move on to D2 regardless of your alignment.

And yes: I knew I wasn't hammering here I just wanted to see how you'd react to it.

UNVOTE:

But there's a fairly good chance that I just end up policy lynching that slot for the mercymain comment.

so you put me in L-1 without announcing

let's see what alignment does that make you hm

-tor

[Torn Up]

If you're going to push the rationale that I actually believed I was quickhammering then I will have both an alignment and a personal reason to lynch you.

aren't you personal with me every game? when did you not try lynching me, RC? isn't that your dream scenario, to lynch me when you're actually scum? lol.

-tor

[Torn Up]

'I will lynch toranaga for daring me to scumread me' he says in scum PT

postgame 'oh toranaga played into what I wanted!! I wanted to be flipped!!!' lol yeah right gg there, totally winnable from where I stood too I bet you'd win as town there subbing in to everything in shambles and getting vigged by townvig after lynching the first mafia...

[Torn Up]

'you put people near lynch

What the fuck are you talking about.
I put you at L2 then unvoted.
I'm not voting you.
Two other people did after I unvoted.

You're being toxic as well as not reading properly.

that's what you were arguing with cheeky. that scum would never hammer me, remember? that's what I'm talking about hopkirk. this is bad play. that's all. IDK what else to tell you, this isn't how you play a game with MAJ on.

when I vote I will want the person lynched. you don't need to put anyone in L-1 to get a read off of them and I wouldn't be toxic if I wasn't pissed at that. don't do this to me, don't do this to anyone. let people play the games they signed up for, thanks.

-tor

[Torn Up]

No, I wanted you to townread my teammates if I did end up flipping which you did. I had no personal stance on whether I got lynched or not though I was certainly not trying to.

you were extremely blatant about getting me lynched, and I quote, for 'daring to scumread me'. you were also salty that you were being bussed. you can't deny the reality that I owned your ass that game, I'm sorry.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I wasn't able to play the last game on MU I signed up for because Zara was indefinitely saying shit about me and the mod team ended up protecting him.
But apparently since that's my fault, this is your fault that you are getting quicklynched. Maybe you should get better friends!

you show your true colours constantly dude.

-tor

[Torn Up]

VOTE: RC most awesomest

[Torn Up]

the one game RC uses to brag about himself with me is one where I got him lynched



-tor

[Torn Up]

RC GET OFF!

Guys what's going on? Please can someone unvote while I catch up?

~ C

[Torn Up]

and yeah hop I agree, playing here is dumb. this hasn't happen in a while but every smaller game, 13er and 9er has the most incredibly poor early game strategies being applied.

anyway.

-tor

[Torn Up]

UNVOTE:

Just a sec Tor.

~ C

[Torn Up]

If the fact that 3 out of the first 4 voters were my teammates doesn't signal to you that my goal wasn't to evade being lynched then I don't know what would.

you got lynched because you were scummy af

-tor

[Torn Up]

you think zara is high up in MU's hierarchy lol ok

I'm sorry cheeky I may have indeed screwed up with getting upset by our situation

-tor

[Torn Up]

Um ok nobody wants to see this bad blood brought up here. Tor RC didn't hammer us and I'm sorry this is happening.

Can we all just chill and focus on actions this game and not on out of game topics. I love MS and the community who have taught me how to play mafia so please let's move on.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Flubber had the worst reaction. I don't think RC is scum.

VOTE: Flubber

~ C

[Torn Up]

hello everyone!
RC, are we friends?

Hi Chara, where's your vote?

it was

going

to be on RC after my question was answered, but sleep. :>

you didn't like Guilty's lack of vote either. are you of the opinion scum avoids RVS?

Yes I think scum can be quite awkward during RVS when trying to integrate into the game. Not voting is usually a good point to push people on.

Have you got any reads yet Chara?

~ C

[Torn Up]

Um ok nobody wants to see this bad blood brought up here. Tor RC didn't hammer us and I'm sorry this is happening.

Can we all just chill and focus on actions this game and not on out of game topics. I love MS and the community who have taught me how to play mafia so please let's move on.

~ C

I'm sorry cheeky, RC and everyone

-tor

[Torn Up]

in my defense I'm right

-tor

[Torn Up]

Flubber had the worst reaction. I don't think RC is scum.

VOTE: Flubber

~ C

I agree with your flubber but I see no reason to townread RC. this is exactly how I expect him to behave as mafia, just push something horribly anti town and pretend it's for outside the game reasons if he can't find reasons within the game to do so.

he is still voting us, cheeky. he didn't even give enough of a fuck to remove his vote on us after you appeared. if that's not indicative of him being scum then IDK what is.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I don't know what alignment you are right now so I don't know if you genuinely believe that I'm scum who feels the need to pursue some sort of vendetta to lynch you.
But when you do end up knowing I'm town leave me the fuck alone.

I think you're scum but I'm sorry for bringing up other stuff, I just got tilted at you of all people saying I was creating a bad environment cause from my experience you don't actually care enough about that stuff.

I was extremely unfair with some comments and I'm sorry about them too. there, I said I'm sorry like 10 times already. if you think I'm scum or you're scum and think this is a good mislynch fine, keep your vote on me it happens it's mafia game. I just hope you don't do it for things that are unrelated with this current game. I'll do the same.

-tor

[Torn Up]

anyway can we have fun now

it may start with us not getting lynched

did anyone notice RC didn't even prod me to hardclaim after putting me on L-1

it's like he doesn't even care about this game at all

probably scum

-tor

[Torn Up]

IDC about reading any games, let's drop that altogether. you're not creating a friendly environment yourself though, so telling that to anyone else is hypocritical.

-tor

[Torn Up]

there is no need for you to put further pressure on me by fake hammering as means to make a read on my slot

it's toranaga and cheeky teeky ffs it's not exactly the hardest read on the planet. just let me work on the game and I'm clear.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I was searching for a reason to attempt to hammer.

Why?

~ C

[Torn Up]

Because I thought the reaction would be telling as to your alignment.

Really? You think you'd find out more from an obvious derp hammer rather than just pushing our posts? I don't buy that RC.

What are your thoughts on others?

~ C

[Torn Up]

Fair enough I guess. Hopefully NSG comes to post soon.

~ C

[Torn Up]

What do you believe the alternative is? That I actually thought I was hammering and that I didn't check? Or that I faked a hammer for some other reason?

I don't think about any alternative. I just dont think RC fake hammers for an AI reaction but my meta read could be wrong. I don't think you meant to realistically hammer but you put us in a pretty precarious position for something not really worth it (AI behaviour) and something which I'm pretty sure you could figure out through other measures. Well the first time you L -1'd us anyway. The following revote you said was policy in the heat of the moment.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Yeah I didn't like GL's entrance either, I can't put my finger on it, but it included the fact he didn't vote and it somehow felt awkward.

why is scum!GL more likely to not vote than town!GL?

sometimes it's Friday night and you're not in the mood/mindstate to play mafia so you post lyrics to check in and call it a day

The lyrics plus a vote would've been okay, I guess scum are more likely to hold off voting to prevent closing off useful TRs and to feel out the gamestate before voting to follow the consensus. I know some people don't like to RVS at all though. I can understand your reasoning here and I like the question in your response.

Just out of curiosity, what song is that?

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Chara

~ C

[Torn Up]

Do you actually personally think that I'm scum or are you trying to follow up on Toranaga's scumread of me?

You said it better yourself:

I don't like leaving stones unturned

Like I'm not looking for him to scumclaim, I don't believe in that kind of play happening more than once in a blue moon, I just think whatever reaction he gives will be useful.

What's your read after the reaction?

~ C

[Torn Up]

Cheeky: i have a few reads. :>

Cheeky monkey. I'll let you hold your cards for now.

~ C

[Torn Up]

My read right now is that I'm not in the right emotional state to try to read anything that you've said for alignment.

Feel better soon.

@

--'-,--

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Mumble

~ C

My bad.

[Torn Up]

Cheeky: i have a few reads. :>

Cheeky monkey. I'll let you hold your cards for now.

~ C

really? is that vote just for show?

pedit: hm, never mind. why the change?

I'm reskimming the thread and like you for town rn.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Cheeky: i have a few reads. :>

Cheeky monkey. I'll let you hold your cards for now.

~ C

really? is that vote just for show?

pedit: hm, never mind. why the change?

hi chara.

you asked me about flubber. in short, it can die. flubber's vote on our slot has the worst reasoning behind it and, as you caught so yourself, the unvote and then vote again is actually pretty senseless from their standpoint. I don't believe it comes from town very often.

anyway, it's an early read, things can change, but it's where I'm leaning so far.

we also thought you were a little dodgy here and there but I'm sure if we work together like we did in alisae's hydra game and in your C9++ with cheeky, we'll be clear to each other.

-tor

[Torn Up]

hello everyone!
RC, are we friends?

Hi Chara, where's your vote?

it was

going

to be on RC after my question was answered, but sleep. :>

you didn't like Guilty's lack of vote either. are you of the opinion scum avoids RVS?

This was the only post I didn't like. The rest is looking like good ol' fashioned town intent.

~ C

[Torn Up]

hello everyone!
RC, are we friends?

Hi Chara, where's your vote?

it was

going

to be on RC after my question was answered, but sleep. :>

you didn't like Guilty's lack of vote either. are you of the opinion scum avoids RVS?

This was the only post I didn't like. The rest is looking like good ol' fashioned town intent.

~ C

what I didn't like was 'not getting into' my argument with RC and saying most stuff are NAI because it's off game stuff, which is probably true but it rubbed me the wrong way that she decided to say descriptive things instead of trying to read into it anyway.

-tor

[Torn Up]

So...this has become the RCisawesome and Torn Up game. Do I really need to read through all 188 posts or is it mostly noise? I'm thinking noise.

There's a bit of noise but some silent gems in between the dragons vs cat. I'm happy with my vote methinks.

~ C

[Torn Up]

So...this has become the RCisawesome and Torn Up game. Do I really need to read through all 188 posts or is it mostly noise? I'm thinking noise.

I'm thinking scum.

-tor

[Torn Up]

Don't be rude Tor is pretty great.

~ C

[Torn Up]

I like my naked votes, they get interesting reactions. I use my vote as a tool to push people around a bit and it seemed to get you and Chara out in the open so I think it's safe to say it's game moving play. I can't help that my concern felt fake to you unfortunately.

What did you make of Hopkirk's unvote after my push?

~ C

[Torn Up]

^^^@Mumble

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Torn up

VOTE: Hopkirk

You're going to put us at L-2 with 2 scum in the game, without a reason?

That's bad form old chap.

~ C

I actually give reasons. You can assume "without a reason" is referring to your naked vote.

How do you know scum wouldn't hammer?

If scum hammer then they're obvious scum.
If dumb scum hammer we lynch them.
Good trade if it happens.

VOTE: GL
thoughts?

This bit here - not sure what to make of it.

~ C

[Torn Up]

I don't think it's specifically scummy if that's what you're saying. And there's enough else that I like.

Roger that. Hmmm. I just don't get the thought process behind it as either alignment. Like if town at what point did they town read us and why? If scum why state that a trade off is good if we're derp hammered but then move off?

~ C

[Torn Up]

And there's enough else that I like.

What do you like?

~ C

[Torn Up]

right hand of god
first in command
my testimony
when I take the stand

It helps if you help me see how you TR others so I can see things from your perspective. I'm not "interrogating" you lol.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Actually just ISO'd him so this is where I'm at:

Not_Mafia, Hopkirk
Chara, RC Most Awesomest
eth0s, GuiltyLion
Mumble, flubbernugget

~ C

[Torn Up]

torn up / RC is t/s I think

also toranga is being really annoying this game. Leaving my vote on torn up for now because I don't like the way toranga was handling vote pressure

at all.

Who do you think is town and who do you think is scum? Just want some clarity.

~ C

[Torn Up]

@C

Since you've gone beyond the naked vote on me, and we've had some exchange, I would appreciate elaboration on your read on me.

I just find you too fluffy Mr. Panda. Like your opening, your entrance back into the thread saying it was all noise and then being pushed to look deeper. When you summarise your catchup your suspicion is a little too cookiecutter for me, like not liking naked votes is fine in and of each instance but at least put that read into the context of a players overall posts.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Oh mumble you've made a grave mistake as scum. I've given my readslist, I don't think I can provide a better conclusion of my reads than that. I was clear in my post to you I don't need to clarify anything there, you seem desperate trying to cast shade on me here using the term "fake" again to describe one of my posts but you don't point out whether it's AI or not.

I'd like a readslist from you.

~ C

[Torn Up]

torn up / RC is t/s I think

also toranga is being really annoying this game. Leaving my vote on torn up for now because I don't like the way toranga was handling vote pressure

at all.

Who do you think is town and who do you think is scum? Just want some clarity.

~ C

That makes it pretty clear that he thinks that you're the scum, no?

Not really because:

torn up / RC is t/s I think

Makes me think torn = t and RC = s by the positioning of the t/s and torn/RC but then he said he didn't like Toranaga's reaction so I wanted clarification if it's a policy vote or not.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Do you remember the percy debacle when you didn't trust my trs

Do you remember the Awoo debacle?

[Torn Up]

Lol no I mean Awoo, I SR that hard but everyone said town and we didn't lynch it until Day 3. It's the same mistake Awoo made as scum that I'm seeing here.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Oh mumble you've made a grave mistake as scum. I've given my readslist, I don't think I can provide a better conclusion of my reads than that. I was clear in my post to you I don't need to clarify anything there, you seem desperate trying to cast shade on me here using the term "fake" again to describe one of my posts but you don't point out whether it's AI or not.

I'd like a readslist from you.

~ C

Watch the baseless accusations. You still haven't provided a solid reason for your read on me, and failed to answer my questions in response. (If you won't, just say so, and I won't ask again.)

You've given a list of the players in this game without reasoning. That's not a reads list. You can give a better conclusion by stating the why.

I can't give you a reads list because players with less posts than the mod haven't done much. Again, I ask, why do you read each the way you do...specifically the town read on N_M. If you don't want to/can't answer (which you seems to have indicated), just say so, so I don't have to keep asking. If you can't though, then they are nothing more than words, no?

And this reminds me of scum hopkirk in beyond death XD

~ C

[Torn Up]

Mumble not voting me looks bad, are you afraid the OMGUS will be too obvious?

~ C

[Torn Up]

We've been town for 3 scum lynches together on this site, two of them I decided to sheep god empress cheeky on, and you cited the one where I was after him before you were.

Wuttt you literally replaced into that game after the vote unvote! You replaced in before Plot said "bitch eating crackers though"

~ C

[Torn Up]

Fine RC.

UNVOTE:

I'm watching you Panda!

~ C

[Torn Up]

I mean, you aren't answering my questions...which is yucky, but I'm still waiting for you to. Again, if you are not going to, please let me know.

I have though. You're just splitting hairs. I'm not serving you up everything on a silver platter and wasting my time answering mundane questions. I've been open and transparent thus far. Vote me for naked votes and unanswered questions, I have bigger fish to fry apparently.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Did you not see my reads list??

~ C

[Torn Up]

Talk to me about why a slot that won't answer simple questions is town. I am listening to you.

@Hopkirk when you come on, tell me what you think. Remind you of someone?

~ C

[Torn Up]

I mean. I think yours was objectively the scummiest push onto them regardless of whether you're scum or not.

Then why isn't your vote there?

~ C

[Torn Up]

I can agree with the eth0s scum arguments. I like GL and Chara over the last couple of pages. Digging GL's readlist.

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Eth0s L-1!

~ C

[Torn Up]

I can feel you struggling not to hammer from here

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: unvote

I'm reading the thread

-tor

[Torn Up]

VOTE: RC

I could see you thinking I'd lolhammer.

Oh, my bad I misread this as a quickhammer.
Given that Tor at one point was claiming to think he was at L-1 and I played through it like I thought I was hammering, I would think my intentions were clear to a third party.

RC, you say you were faking the quickhammer from the beginning. but if that's true, why did you lie here that you thought you were hammering? doesn't work as a reaction test anymore, so why do it?

-tor

[Torn Up]

Actually just ISO'd him so this is where I'm at:

Not_Mafia, Hopkirk
Chara, RC Most Awesomest
eth0s, GuiltyLion
Mumble, flubbernugget

~ C

skimming it up to page 10 I actually like guiltylion and mumble better than where they stand here, and I have hopkirk and RC at the top of my townreads. the rest is fairly similar. anyway I'll get to that when I'm done reading.

-tor

[Torn Up]

torn up / RC is t/s I think

also toranga is being really annoying this game. Leaving my vote on torn up for now because I don't like the way toranga was handling vote pressure

at all.

I don't like anything about this post, from calling me;RC TvS (very likely both town btw), to using italics for emphasis on how much he disliked how I dealt with pressure. also this post doesn't actually indicate a scumread on either me or RC.

-tor

[Torn Up]

Because when I first read it I thought Hopkirk

actually

quickhammered you. I saw the vote as being for you as opposed to being for me when I first read it.

yeah you're cool

I woke up grumpy yesterday and saw us being wagoned, so I just got angry. fwiw the person hydraing with zara is one of my best friends and I can get a little tribal with it. I don't suppose I'll read your interactions with the hydra with objectivity so I won't do that, but I don't judge you for that anyway, it just upsets me on a personal level that game happened in the first place.

-tor

[Torn Up]

We've been town for 3 scum lynches together on this site, two of them I decided to sheep god empress cheeky on, and you cited the one where I was after him before you were.

cheeky is GOAT

-tor

[Torn Up]

Torn Up, I'm surprised you don't have more of a problem with eth0s.

disclaimer: I refuse to stoop to such a petty 1v1 like the one y'all were already in.

as far as I can tell the only reads you made this game are related to the petty 1v1 I had with RC, so this makes no sense.

-tor

[Torn Up]

The game would be 100% the same with or without hopkirk's posting and I don't think that's as true for my town reads.

what do you mean? also did you think you were putting our slot in L-1 back then or was that a reaction test?

-tor

[Torn Up]

no, ethos did say something to that effect. it's TvS, but currently reading Torn Up as the scum.
actually this is better, yes. there's nothing to townread.
VOTE: eth0s

I like chara's string of posts in this page leading up to a vote on eth0s and many of her thoughts mirror mine.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I mean. I think yours was objectively the scummiest push onto them regardless of whether you're scum or not.

agree with this. I get the sense that eth0s is trying to stir shit up in an early TvT, and the justification he used to leave his vote on Torn Up slot was bad

VOTE: eth0s

I wasn't feeling Chara town at all until they beat me to this vote. Flubber's townread of Chara in 280 is bad, might be scum trying to take a different angle on the game by townreading a townie who hasn't gotten many other townreads. Not really townreading Mumble either. I suspect the eth0s partner is between Flubber/Mumble and will determine who it is based on how willing they are to join the eth0s wagon.

I'm like here
{Torn Up}
{RC hydra, Hopkirk}
{Chara, Not_Mafia}
{Flubber, Mumble}
{eth0s}

I am exactly there reads wise.

RC's posting feels genuine and he was one of the first noticing eth0s' scummy behaviour. buddying up with cheeky and mumble the way he is doing is unlikely to be scum, and I like many of his reads.

Hopkirk has been very actively scumhunting the whole game and I especially like his votes on GL, RC and ethos. I also like when flubber voted our slot for bad reasons, and hopkirk asked if flubber's wolf partner would come and hammer us.

I disliked GL's entrance but since his return on p3 he has been nothing but pure town to me. like the reaction to flubber early and obviously I appreciate this reads list very much.

chara and NM are similar nulltown reads where there isn't anything to scumread them for, but they didn't do much to show themselves either way just yet. a bit more confident on NM being town as per his meta.

so we're left with flubber, mumble and ethos. I'll be surprised if ethos is town, so let's start with him then figure out the other two.

reads

-tor

[Torn Up]

VOTE: eth0s

[Torn Up]

L-1...

[Torn Up]

viewtopic.php?f=84&t=70391

there we go

that feels like NM scumgame where he is faking reads and trying to look towny, unlike here

-tor

[Torn Up]

I want to say for the record I know there's a game where N_M was scum and came in with a half decent opener then literally just sheeped me the whole game and this is starting to feel like a repetition of that game

But N_M hasn't sheeped you at all this game?

~ C

[Torn Up]

Ok but he jumped off us, hasn't voted mumble which indicates town. He voted Chara which matches your suspicion and he hasn't voted hopkirk so the only read he might be sheeping you on is GL imo. The rest is implied by his voting prior to your reads.

~ C

[Torn Up]

RC, why do you townread mumble

-tor

[Torn Up]

When I hard TR'd him page 1 he voted us shortly after which is what I expect from Town.

~ C

[Torn Up]

UNVOTE: eth0s

[Torn Up]

Mumble and Chara are town.

talk to me about Mumble town?

Hopkirk: do you agree with Cheeky or not about Mumble looking like scum you? i'm assuming no as you voted elsewhere. and no, Cheeky's comment doesn't have anything to do with my vote.

Cheeky was referencing a previous game where I was scum.
I've tunneled new players as town too though.
Mumble entered looking town. That reduced a bit over time.

It's not so much the tunneling as much as it is the useless nit-picking questions and then vote regardless of answer. I remember hopkirk getting all up in arms about me not answering his questions. Also I entered that game with an instant gut scum read on him so he started saying I was suspicious and asked a bunch of questions that were easily answered by reading my ISO but his rage at my reaction test felt genuine and I dropped the read

Honestly so many things from mumble remind me of scum trying to scumread me, which is not good for scum because it highlights their behaviour in my already paranoid mindset. I am better at sorting scum reads on me than anything else. In my latest game with Chara a scum slot had me hard TRing them until they tried to scumread me on the last day. Yeah gross self meta I know but I'm trying to explain how my scumdar is going off on mumble.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Spoiler: Word Vomit

34 is really yucky. This reeks fake concern.
Hopkirk seems genuine and town.
45 is true. Don't get the vote.
I like GL as of 59 and Hopkrik a bit less. Not a fan of 60 though.
Liking hopkirk again as of 62 . No change on GL.
Not a fan of Chara 64; 65; 66
Hate 73 and 74
Page 4 is Tor being completely rude and hopkirk trying to get Tor to understand his own partner. Weird.
Page 5-6 is complete noise and distracting.
Tor needs to watch his language.
153

@Tor

Why is RC-hydra scum?
158

@N_M

: Naked Chara vote. Why?
172

@C

: Another naked Chara vote. Why?
176 I could naked vote Chara.
182 I could not naked vote Mumble.
185

@C:

Why?
196: C was helpful. T was snarky. I probably should have just said rude, but...Wine haze.

I actually like this post a lot and can see how town!mumble is scumreading chara for those rather iffy posts. I can see his reactions to cheeky being genuine as well, so I'm moving mumble up a notch. probably town.

-tor

[Torn Up]

Can we just flip him now? I'm really itching to see his alignment now lol.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Can we just flip him now? I'm really itching to see his alignment now lol.

~ C

so am i, Cheeky. well, sort of, anyway.
i know NM is a lol-hammerer, but his threat to hammer did not seem serious. either a joke, or seeing how players would react. honestly, not really understanding the townreads there, but i don't know how to read him at all. he looked obvtown in my last game with him, but i was scum so probably biased.

Toranaga: what exactly is iffy? i know you mentioned that post about RVS that you didn't like.

64: disliking GL's lack of vote but then asking cheeky if this is something she thinks scum does more often more often than town (not sure I'd agree with it but if you don't like the lack of voting surely this is your opinion on it). 66 is talking about NAI things that don't matter much to the game. I'm not scumreading you for these posts, I'm saying I can see what was there to dislike and why mumble disliked them.

-tor

[Torn Up]

i didn't dislike Guilty's lack of vote, Toranaga.

I misread that everytime I read it

yeah you're fine. I mean it's probably just eth0s and flubber the way I'm reading this game rn.

[Torn Up]

guilty lion said that. I don't think it's a particularly interesting read though.

-tor

[Torn Up]

radiantcowbells and cheeky teeky are both in hydras, they just slipped. they're not one posters...

I'm with cheeky teeky and radiantcowbells is part of the rc the awesomest hydra

-tor

[Torn Up]

I like ethos for scum, but I'm not putting my vote there while they dance around L1

why do you think he is scum?

-tor

[Torn Up]

lol

-tor

[Torn Up]

he L-1ed himself and then NM hammered him actually

I did unvote :shrug:

[Torn Up]

how is this anyone else's fault but eth0s RC

your emotions are really off right now

-tor

[Torn Up]

unvoting isn't scummy dude

anyway I need to reevaluate this clearly

[Torn Up]

how is this anyone else's fault but eth0s RC

your emotions are really off right now

-tor

I'm glad you can see it

-tor

[Torn Up]

I didn't push to quickhammer eth0s. I wanted a quick lynch on mumble. Eth0s you only having yourself to blame for things being boring, you chose to not engage with the game the way you did so it's nobody's fault but yours. This is a great town we just had a bumpy start so eff that, my bro.

~ C

[Torn Up]

and the answer to why RC won't be nightkilled can be found above. :>

what do you think of his posts after the hammer?

tor

[Torn Up]

and the answer to why RC won't be nightkilled can be found above. :>

thought I was scum but all of a sudden I'm not being nightkilled because I"m town with bad reads? okay.

she didn't say you're scum I don't think

[Torn Up]

what do you think of his posts after the hammer?

tor

i don't think this is a good thing to discuss in twilight.

I agree to a certain extent, but I also wanna know what you think;signal a read in case I die. IDK what the best approach is.

-tor

[Torn Up]

I'd say chara is probably town

-tor

[Torn Up]

cheeky if I die ignore tor and keep placing your vote on chara please

Tor is the one who suspects Chara. I TR him for some reason. :/

~ C

[Torn Up]

I really hope you guys are actually scum then.

Wtf is this?

~ C

[Torn Up]

personally I was back and forth on chara but I think her end of day;twilight posts are pretty towny and I like that she is being quiet about things while people push her. I'd be surprised if she is scum.

-tor

[Torn Up]

Dude hasn't even flipped and you plus NM are already setting up Chara lynch?!

You're spewing TMI.

~ C

[Torn Up]

yo I honestly have not reread this game yet, will bring content tonight. I'd like some time to talk to Flubber/Mumble to get firmer reads there before we lynch today. I'll try to reread and start really doing shit in a bit

why these 2 especifically? why not chara? are you fine with lynching chara here and if so, why?

I mean I'd like to talk to Chara too but it's those two players off the mislynch wagon that are much nullier/messier for me (plus, three of the players on the wagon are conftown FMPOV) and so I'd like to try to better my understanding/read of the game state by finding town inside of {flubber/mumble} if I can.

I'm not currently fine with lynching Chara here - I might be by the end of D2 but if Chara's a mislynch then this town is fucked. Everyone should be trying to put more work into sorting myself and Hopkirk as well today

you seem to be suggesting being on the mislynch wagon yesterday is alignment indicative. why? there were two players off the wagon that are conftown to me (us and RC), vs two players that didn't flip yet. who are the 3 conftown players on eth0s by your perspective? eth0s, yourself and...

-tor

[Torn Up]

If we all agree on a town!TornUp read then it makes the D1 wagon more interesting because it means either both scum stayed off of it (in Mumble-Flubber scumteam world) or there's lock scum between {Hopkirk, GL, Not_Mafia}. Since I'm in that pool and town (and presumably Hopkirk/NM would say the same thing), it does help focus the gamestate to a few possibilities, even if you don't have a townread on me. I'm kinda still gut townreading Not_Mafia at the moment which means it's likely either Mumble/Flubber or Mumble/Hopkirk. Don't think the Hopkirk/Flubber interactions on page 12 look like SvS

I'm not sure I understand this point you're making here. why is chara clear in your evaluation? what difference does it make who was on and off wagon? there can be any combination of teams both on or off the wagon that got lynched, wouldn't you agree?

-tor

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Flubber

I'm still scum reading mumble, but RC hard defended him and flipped town so I'll leave it today, plus I don't think Tor sees it yet. I need to look closer at Hopkirk's reasoning for TRing us, GL makes sense. From our last convo I think Tor suspected Chara but I say no.

I'm suspicious of the N_M quick vote SOD. He felt town D1 though but is back on my radar.

I think RC NK looks to stir up more trouble between the reads on our slot and Chara's so I hesitate to lynch there today.

Sorry for the lack of effort I'm playing Team Mafia.

[Torn Up]

Cheeky: why did NM feel town on day 1? getting a read on him one way or the other would be useful. he looks like town NM to me but it's hard to feel confident in it.

His entrance felt towny + taking on RC early felt town, this was reinforced when he voted us for making us lock town. Actually thinking about it I don't think think I'll lynch there today either.

I'd prefer mumble over flubber, because I think flubber probably saw the same things the D1 lynch player did.

So for me right now it's looking like this


N_M, GL
Hopkirk, Chara
Flubber, Mumble

~ C

[Torn Up]

Because there are only two scum and I like his stance on TU. Kinda hard for there to be much interaction between all slots when D1 ends after two days.

Oh this reminds me why I started scum reading NM --- twas the hammer.

~ C

[Torn Up]

town NM does that and scum NM knows he can get away with it.

You can usually sort NM through his votes. It does overall feel like Town NM. I think we can afford to leave this slot for a little bit.

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Chara

[Torn Up]

L-1 I believe.

[Torn Up]

I thought for some reason you were playing low key D1 because you might be a PR. I didn't see you scum reading mumble D1 so I assume you're trying to pocket me by encouraging my bad reads. I didn't like you subtly discrediting mumble's claim by putting out the possibility for a counterclaim.

Flubber is looking a little better this page.

[Torn Up]

It's Cheeky btw.

[Torn Up]

I put a sad face with my vote because I don't want you to be scum. :/

[Torn Up]

I put a sad face with my vote because I don't want you to be scum. :/

i don't want you to be scum either.

I think it's pretty clear I soft-claimed tracker. If the watcher is out I may as well make scum choose one that makes the NKA a bit more readable.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Last night we tracked Chara, he went nowhere.

[Torn Up]

I thought for some reason you were playing low key D1 because you might be a PR.

This is the soft-claim.

Sorry could you tell me what you'd like me to respond to now you know my alignment?

[Torn Up]

toranaga here skimming the pages I missed

[Torn Up]

UNVOTE: chara

[Torn Up]

Guilty's never scum here. i think Hopkirk is more likely scum than Flubber but don't quote me on that.

chara can you go through your GL townread for me please?

-tor

[Torn Up]

and i really can't play like this as scum.
you didn't see me scumreading Mumble day 1: i told you you were wrong and you're content not even looking? it's frustrating, especially when i became confident Mumble was scum from

today's

play. and you seem to be implying that playing lowkey makes me scummy if i'm not a PR, when it's a factor of simply being in the thread less earlier.

chara can you self meta to me in a way that explains how this isn't how you play as scum?

-tor

[Torn Up]

NM is NM and probably scum, Mumble i plain don't know and isn't present to talk to anyway, but you were just in two games with me and know how i work to a point.
i became less confident in my townread after you explained your vote on me (i'd wondered if you wanted to see a reaction to it, or something, before you did), so it's at least nice to know you're town, but still.

why is NM scum? did he do anything scummy in your opinion, that isn't matching exactly how town!NM plays?

-tor

[Torn Up]

Cheeky: why did NM feel town on day 1? getting a read on him one way or the other would be useful. he looks like town NM to me but it's hard to feel confident in it.

chara what changed from 435 (NM looks like town) to 512 (NM is NM and probably scum)? I dislike your phrasing in 512 and have a hard time believing town!you would say something like that.

-tor

[Torn Up]

Tor wants GL - and he should probably follow up on the Chara questionning/replies.

VOTE: GuiltyLion

~ C

[Torn Up]

Mumble - why was Torn Up's read "fake" here? And what's your current read on them?

Because I think they're lock/obvious town

I can see this as an attempt to pocket us. I don't think you could say we were obv. town, particularly when you take into consideration the hydra 1v1. If that made us obv town then the RC hydra should've had the same standing. I don't see any analysis on why our slot is likely town.

[Torn Up]

Ugh LyLo. Thanks scum lol.

Last night we Tracked GL and he went nowhere.

So yesterday there were wagons on Flubber > Chara > NM. I think reading around these wagon changes will make the scum obvious. Will look into that soon.

Yesterday we suspected Chara and GL. Not sure where Tor stands on Chara atm. I'm going to reassess the 4 of you.

~ C

[Torn Up]

I need to really get into this game but I haven't shaken off from GL and chara and think we're likely losing if the mafia team isn't exactly these 2 now

[Torn Up]

Chara I'll read the game again today and decide

I thought the way you 180ed and pushed NM was scummy btw. why were you scumreading him in the first place? IIRC you had a townread on NM the same day you decided he was a wolf and needed to die.

[Torn Up]

I'm gonna need help not getting hard pocketed by you

gladly I have cheeky with me

[Torn Up]

Talk to me about why a slot that won't answer simple questions is town. I am listening to you.

@Hopkirk when you come on, tell me what you think. Remind you of someone?

~ C

You mean scum me?

VOTE: eth0s

Vote Count

Eth0s - 5 - hopkirk, Chara, guiltylion, eth0s, not mafia
Chara - 1 - mumble
Torn up - 1 - flubber

Not Voting: rc most awesomest, torn up

That's a Lynch.

Eth0s was a

Vanilla Townie

Deadline for Night 1 actions is January 23 at 9pm EST.

Torn up is strong town.
Chara's entrance was meh, but seemed okay later. Neutral-town.

Where is Chara in 422 GL?

VOTE: Flubber

I want to look at GL/Chara again when I've got more time actually.
UNVOTE: Flubber

If Flubber flipped town I couldn't see NM/GL or NM/Chara which would only leave Chara/GL.
Same doesn't apply if NM flips town as I could see Flubber/Chara.

Got called away briefly. I think this is only 10 minutes later than I said.
VOTE: Not_mafia

That's a Lynch!

Not Mafia - 4 - Chara, guiltylion, flubber, hopkirk
Guiltylion - 2 - torn up, mumble
Flubber - 1 - not mafia

Not voting- N/A

Not Mafia was a

Vanilla Townie

Night 2 deadline is Thursday February 1 at 5pm EST

Um guys Hopkirk is scum...doubt = zero.

~ C

[Torn Up]

Flubber is town so that leaves Chara/GL for buddy. I intend to vote in 24 hours.

~ C

[Torn Up]

OK on further inspection it's Hopkirk/GL.

~ C

[Torn Up]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

{Torn Up, Mumble}
{Chara}
{Flubber}
{Hopkirk, Not_Mafia}

I still think Chara's town, will let Chara defend itself though.

Hopkirk - if Chara flips town, who is scum?

I think I'm down for the Chara lynch today.

Chara do you still think I'm definitely town?

how did chara go from top townread outside the claims to your best guess at lynching a wolf today? why are hopkirk and flubber suddenly more likely to be town than chara?

-tor

[Torn Up]

alright I'm not going to sign my posts cause cheeky already does that. she has a very specific read into the game that I'm... halfway confident in. I think GL is scum and one of chara;hopkirk is having a hard time seeing it, and the other is GL's partner. I am townreading both players now though.

[Torn Up]

okay so quick thoughts:

I have not had time yet this weekend to sit down and reread and dig into this as much as I would like. With the Super Bowl coming up today (going to a party), I won't have time for that until this evening. So I'm not ready to vote or push anything hard yet because I haven't sorted out how I feel.

However as for a quick gut take on where my head is currently at - I think Chara has done an effective job buddying/pocketing me, Chara's tone sounds incredibly townie but their actual content and stances have not been town. I'm most skeptical of that slot, further since it seems every dead townie has been calling for their head - it would feel like bad play to mislynch someone else today in 5p LYLO and let scum!Chara win the game. I also think Hopkirk makes a great point about how Hopkirk/Flubber seems stupid (I would instead say implausible) due to Hopkirk going for a bus ahead of time early on D2.

this might be scum theater because they have to bus eachother at this point though. I haven't ruled out Hopkirk/Chara as a team. Flubber has been all over the place but I started townreading that on D2 because it seemed to genuine/unplanned to be scum.

I'm going to try to do an in depth reread tonight and come to a stronger conclusion about this, but that's where I am right now. I'm sorry I haven't given this game the time it deserves yet

this is never town. he wants chara dead but not only did he not figure out a partner, but also his phrasing suggests he doesn't think anyone works as chara's team mate, which is supposed to be concerning him. instead he is townreading flubber and 'haven't ruled out chara;hopkirk as a team', which... if he is townreading flubber, is the ONLY possible team.

now which one of you can't see this and which one of you is his partner, I'm not sure.

[Torn Up]

GL has 2 posts this gameday and the big one is scummy wishy washy keeping his options open and fake gamesolvey that town never writes in lylo.

needs death.

[Torn Up]

VOTE: guiltylion

and then GL f3 imo

cheeky approved vote

[Torn Up]

VOTE: guiltylion

and then GL f3 imo

cheeky approved vote

I meant good luck not guilty lion on f3

tbh I have no idea. I don't think it's flubber but who knows. cheeky is pretty sure hopkirk is scum though.

[Torn Up]

I'm more confident in hopkirk. I might not have explained myself well in my series of posts from his ISO and vote counts. I expected you guys to look at his ISO and the thread surrounding those key posts. He is openly setting up flubber/Chara/GL for LYLO towards the end of Day 2.

Scum should play with the endgame in sight so I ask why are we all in LyLo from a scum perspective? It makes sense that Flubber is here because he was a suspect from D1, Chara also. Now when I do a VCA how come Hopkirk is here when he's only ever had one vote on him the entire game? Surely scum would want to get rid of someone who looks unlynchable in LYLO, so wouldn't they have preferred to get a wagon on him instead of eth0s/NM? It almost feels like scum left our slot here because of inactivity and so killed off mumble instead of us, leaving us with Chara and Flubber who we had announced suspicion on.

Hopkirk's D1 was terrible but we got well pocketed and were more concerned with scummier slots/ not entirely attentive. Read the interaction where I voted him from post 33 to 54 in the thread. Post 33 is the beginning of his entrance which is awkward af. The vote/unvote of GL was pretty suspect I quoted it below. I get the feel of someone trying to assess how likely different wagons are rather than scum hunting D1. It's slightly Ironic that after Hopkirk unvotes us, a wagon builds up to L-1 without him (or GL), the irony is he already said it would be suicide for scum to derphammer D1. He did try to alter the read on our slot when the 1v1 took place between the hydras by saying Tor was scummy but he didn't look comfortable enough to vote there. I don't know if GL was around at the time as I'm pretty sure he could have got away with a SR on us and a hammer if he's scum.

His vote on Eth0s isn't explained anywhere in his ISO but in the context of the thread it looks like he's voting Eth0s for scumreading our slot. How did Hopkirk have such a strong read on our slot so early? I think this matters because he was the one to start the wagon? I really didn't like that the vote was tagged in a post that was completely irrelevant to the vote. In hindsight the Eth0s slot was clearly mislynch bait.

His vote on Not_Mafia was terrible in 595, I mean if you're going to SR NM for this you may as well SR GL and us for this too. Both votes were minimal effort in terms of scum hunting to back up his reads, the majority of which was "PoE"

I rule out Chara because I don't see scum saying things like: 176 181 200 377 etc
In general Chara is happy to push people even when he is being scum read, asks insightful questions, feels genuine. To me this is in contrast to hopkirk who attempts to push both Chara and myself but quickly backs off when it looks like things are escalating towards a SR on him. Like his backtrack on his vote on our slot, and the distraction technique with Chara by moving his vote off her and discussing someone else Chara is scumreading.

I rule out flubber because I don't see scum saying things like: Pretty much all of it. Strong pushes/stances, doesn't really care about how he reads to others in contrast to Hopkirk being hedgy and overly careful at times. (please read the game in full if you can't see it)

Hopkirk can you please explain this reaction test? How does it explain the vote/unvote of GL? What information did you get from that reaction? Quote in spoiler.

Spoiler:

I tentatively think that Mumble and Torn Up are town

I was thinking N_M was town based on his opener but it's not enough to commit to

Hopkirk might also be town, so if I'm right about all of those the game is already PoEd to 4 on day 1. although I actually think NM is less town than hopkirk

Ethos has nothing
Still have bad gut feels about GL
Not a fan of Chara but still relatively null
flubber's kind of garbage so far but not sure if he's scum garbage

These are my reads also

Very similar to mine.

VOTE: Torn up

VOTE: Hopkirk

You're going to put us at L-2 with 2 scum in the game, without a reason?

That's bad form old chap.

~ C

I actually give reasons. You can assume "without a reason" is referring to your naked vote.

How do you know scum wouldn't hammer?

If scum hammer then they're obvious scum.
If dumb scum hammer we lynch them.
Good trade if it happens.

VOTE: GL
thoughts?

This bit here - not sure what to make of it.

~ C

Ah, I said in my word vomit post I didn't get the vote. Hopkirk will need to explain the switch.

Reaction test. 100%.

If GL is scum, please don't let hopkirk off tomorrow peeps.

~ C

[Torn Up]

well GL is lynched and I'm guessing neither of you is enough of a dick to be slowrolling here

I really don't know where I would go at f3

good luck town :>

-tor

[Torn Up]

are you meme'ing me

[Torn Up]

jesus christ

sorry cheeky

[Torn Up]

I need a break from mafia

[Torn Up]

WP you goddamn wolves!

[Torn Up]

thank you!
my biggest worry was accidentally incriminating Hopkirk. i thought i was caught the whole game.

I was very suspicious of you but always thought guilty lion was more likely anyway

this gameday I read the whole thing and while your d1 was wolfy, I thought you picked up nicely and was especially not wolfing with hopkirk so there goes my scumhunting in these goddamned MS games

[Torn Up]

cheeky needs to find a better hydra partner

to case hopkirk so beautifully and get her partner lolvote town at f5 like that

smh