Micro 744: ??? [Endgame]

[Yume]

I am done arguing with you. Your belief that PoE shouldn't be used in LYLO is erroneous, cos many players here do use it in LYLO.

[Yume]

But I guess it doesn't matter, cos I'll be leaving this site soon. And frankly, this has been a long time coming. I may return if my two favorite mods run their games, but only for their games, and nothing else.

[Yume]

Goodbye MS.....

[Agent Dale Cooper]

I don't want to hear you talk about your town meta. Self-meta'ring makes me nauseous, but I don't want to go down that path of discussion.


So what does PoE say from your perspective,

who is scum and who is town?

This will be my last question on this matter, as I need to look at the whole game now.

[Yume]

You, Lucky and Luca are scumleans. Pro is town.

[Agent Dale Cooper]

I am done arguing with you.

I respect this decision.

(My motivations are pro-town at heart)

[Yume]

Okay, but your recent comments suggest you are not as informed of current MS culture. I suggest you integrate more, then you'll know that PoE and self-meta are generally acceptable.....

[Yume]

You are giving me a headache with your misinformed comments. So I suggest you get to know this place a little better before you go firing at all cylinders at people who try to explain to you how this site and its culture works.

[Lucky2u]

Since it's the most obvious place to start, let's begin with a Yume post.

Spoiler: Yume's Razor

For Lucky, well, the player who suspected him just died. That's why

Occam's razor

he is scum. He removed the person suspecting him. I mean, sure, you can go on and on about why that's not the case, but

Occam's razor

says so and disregarding it is a bad idea.

As for Luca, his posts kinda seem fake to me.

None of that please. You both sound like partners engaged in bad theatre.

Okay, so explain to me why it isn't true that Lucky simply killed a player suspecting him? Is it so implausible to you? I am willing to engage with you here, as per your request, so talk to me about this.

p-edit: No, it's because

Occam's razor

said so. Why is so difficult for you to accept

Occam's razor?

FYI, violating Occam's razor led to town loss before, and you are about to let that happen again. Please stop.

And, admittedly, there are no other reasons, but saying that

Occam's razor

is irrelevant is also naive.

You are the one who discarded the

Occam's razor

simply because you want to give him a free pass.....:/

p-edit: Oh, yeah? I don't recall you saying 'don't do it' when he declared an INTENT TO VOTE ME. :/

You keep using that phrase but I don't think you truly know what it means... but without getting into that debate, let's talk about why you're wrong using it the way you are.

Yume's Razor. All things considered, accept the simplest solution and disregard all other possibilities even if they are just as likely.

You seem to think that you arguing a point that goes along the lines of "If you hear hooves, think horse not Zebra" but what you are actually arguing is "If you hear hooves, think brown horse named Lucky, not Black horse named Yume.". I mean you've been on this site long enough according to the date below your avatar. There is no way that you are this stubbornly denying the possibility that scum night killed Brian to get town to lynch me. This is Mafia. The simplest solution is rarely the correct solution because you aren't trying to determine if it was the dog or bigfoot that ate your dinner, you're trying to determine which one of multiple human beings each with their own cunning and intelligence is manipulating you to think what they want you to think. If you always accept what is simple, you will end game alot as mafia string you along to do their bidding. There is no way you are ignoring the one major tool that mafia has at their disposal... Deception.

Your words have no vale to me. You are cornered scum, voting whomever and whatever hoping that it would go away.

If I'm cornered scum, why are you the one that is panicked and...

Oh, and also, you yourself have pointed out that my case is weak. So, if he was truly innocent, he should be able to dismantle my case easily without resorting to 'intent to vote me'. So why didn't he make a nice long paragraph pointing out exactly why my read on him is wrong. And by that, I don't mean the weak reasoning he used already.

The fact he hasn't dismantled my case with solid reasoning is that 'something else' you've been looking for.

... trying to get ADC to agree with you so quickly? Are you that desperate to setup you and your scum partner to quick hammer?

----------------------------------------

Then there are all these scummy statments:

I wish mastina was here, she'd hit you for overthinking things like this. Since she's not, I have to hit you in her place.

This awkward appeal to ADC to think about what another uninvolved party might think about them

If you knew what I know, you'd be saying differently right about now.

allusion to a PR that frankly if they really were one, should have claimed by now so this statement is vaguely ego threatening.

If Lucky were to vote me, like he said he would, I doubt you'd tell him to unvote.

a "Do it, I dare you to do it, but you won't" statement.

What will it take for you to scumread Lucky?

And my read on you changed a long time ago, but the moment I mention this, you'd no doubt come running at me with torches and pitchforks, saying I am crazy for scumreading you and should be ashamed, or that my 'read on you is stupid' because I am 'stupid', or that 'I should join the scumteam, because I'm skilled in the job of helping them'. :/

combination of a threat that Yume will lower his read of ADC and also preemptively defending himself against an attack that hasn't happened yet

Fnny, cos you were not grilling him even when he was online earlier. Even when he was on, you were focusing on me instead. Nice try.

Combination of another "I dare you, you won't" statement and an attempt to deflect. Brian had clearly stated by this point that he was talking to you because you were there.

Are you questioning the tools many players on this site use? O.O

If you are that uncomfortable with them, I suggest you find another place where they aren't used at all, cos you are bound to run across several more players who use them. Of course, they are used in conjunction with other methods, but this doesn't mean they aren't used at all.

How dare ADC go against the norms! How dare he break meta! Shun him, ostracize him! ...unless he votes your way, then he is ok and accepted.

And you prove you don't know my playstyle at all. Senseless posting is my town norm. Just ask the mod after the game, he'll tell you this is true.

p-edit: Tell that to many players who do use PoE in LYLO. I suggest you read Spring Fever, where PoE was used in LYLO......

An appeal to meta that can't be confirmed until game over and "It was true there (in a situation that is not relevant to this one) so it must be true here (with different players facing a different type of LYLO)".

You are giving me a headache with your misinformed comments. So I suggest you get to know this place a little better before you go firing at all cylinders at people who try to explain to you how this site and its culture works.

complete dismissal of ADC trying to think or questions things by using potential shame he might endure for not falling in line with site meta. I never fall in line with site meta, come at me bro!

VOTE: Yume

Before you say it, nope I don't care if ADC doesn't like it if I throw a vote out there.

[Lucky2u]

Well that took a whole lot more effort than I was hoping for. I guess that's what you get for trying to dig your way out of a hole with a lolhammer.

[Alisae]

VOTE COUNT 3 . 16

• Lucky2u
  ---- 1 ( Yume )
  L- 2
  
  
  Yume
  ------- 1 ( Lucky2u )
  L- 2
  
  
  
  
  Not Voting
  - 3 ( Luca Blight, ProHawk, Agent Dale Cooper )

With 5 alive, it takes 3 to Lynch
Deadline is in (expired on 2017-10-30 07:01:37)

[ProHawk]

.... I guess we have our 1v1 for the day.

[Yume]

So explain why they're just as likely. You are arguing that the simplest solution isn't applicable here. Why isn't the simplest solution applicable here?

You say he was grilling me because I was around, but you were clearly around yesterday. He says you were there briefly, but it was enough time that he could have asked you a single question. And if I recall, you seemed to agree to talk while I was asleep. Why, I am awake now, and I don't see a conversation between you at all like I would have if you had one while I was asleep. Talk to each other, right now.

[Lucky2u]

.... I guess we have our 1v1 for the day.

Don't count yourself out yet pro!

Crying? Nahh, Its prob game over if we lynch town, and yes the kills have directly been setup to lynch me today so scum will lean that direction. At least one of the partners will and the other will hammer it home. You can't tell me that you are town because you have been kicking against my lynch while semi-supporting it, especially now. I get, that you can't see it that way, but I can.

I still need to do a reset and re-read because scum-kills have been off the wall for me, which is why they are pointing to a Hawk lynch D3.

Lucky is either really dumb town or scum, and its probably the latter. I don't like the defeatist post to excuse his LOL-Hammer. He also set his team up nicely today by doing so.

Not after unnatural posts like this! I can't tell if your concern at your own lynch is dumb town or fake scum...

[Lucky2u]

So explain why they're just as likely. You are arguing that the simplest solution isn't applicable here. Why isn't the simplest solution applicable here?

Did... Did you even read my post? Let me try again. We are playing a game where lying and deception are the key tactics by the bad guys. If player 1 is under pressure by player 2, and player 2 town reads player 3 who is actually scum, then who is the best person for player 3 to kill? Ding ding ding! Player 2! Player 3 then gets to claim it was player 1 who wanted to remove someone who opposed him and cry about being the victim by losing someone who supported him. You know... Kind of like you did...

Yeah, okay, I am a big bad scum who let the player townread me get killed and removed my only defense from the equation, knowing that you would be at my throats the very next day. Sure. Let your conspiracy theories carry you.

In this game where lying is expected... Another simple solution is that you're lying and you are scum. I don't believe a town player outside a newbie game would have that much trouble understanding this concept.

[Lucky2u]

You say he was grilling me because I was around, but you were clearly around yesterday. He says you were there briefly, but it was enough time that he could have asked you a single question. And if I recall, you seemed to agree to talk while I was asleep. Why, I am awake now, and I don't see a conversation between you at all like I would have if you had one while I was asleep. Talk to each other, right now.

You can't really be holding this up as one of your arguments. Ok well I'm awake right now! Answer to my posts.

[Lucky2u]

OMG yume is not answering me guys he must be scum! Look at how he is dodging me with only 14 days left in the deadline!

[Lucky2u]

You see what I did there right? This is a forum game. Not a Skype chat. Activity is not alignment indicative.

[Yume]

No, don't talk to me. Talk to Cooper. Because he should be grilling both of us, not just me. A true town player should be open to all possibilities, not just one.

p-edit: It was you who suggested Dale a time to chat with him. Wheres is this chat you offered to have with him?

[Lucky2u]

Scum don't dictate when they get talked to.

I offered, ADC declined. I don't really care since he is a town read of mine. I'd rather talk with you anyway. since you deflecting me however, I can settle with just talking ABOUT you

[Yume]

And frankly, I still see it as you killed him. You have every reason to. You remove the player who scumread you and you get to use this argument. You say one of mafia primary tools is deception. So give me one reason why is it me deceiving you in a manner you described as opposed to you deceiving us in a manner I described?

p-edit: Show me where he declined?

[Lucky2u]

If Lucky was online we would be talking about his anti-town/scummy behaviour from D2 in detail.

At work, mobile posting at this pace not plausible. How are you tonight around 9 eastern?

I suggest you talk to Yume first and address her "scum case" on you.

This will help us sort both you and Yume.

Thank you for your cooperation.

[Yume]

That's not refusing. That's postponing it. He still intends to talk to you later.

[Lucky2u]

And frankly, I still see it as you killed him. You have every reason to. You remove the player who scumread you and you get to use this argument. You say one of mafia primary tools is deception. So give me one reason why is it me deceiving you in a manner you described as opposed to you deceiving us in a manner I described?

p-edit: Show me where he declined?

Because frankly I see it as you killed him. You have every reason to. You remove the player that was scum reading me and you get to use this argument. The whole site says that one of mafia primary tools is deception. So give me one reason why is it not you receiving the town in the manner as I described?

[Lucky2u]

That's not refusing. That's postponing it. He still intends to talk to you later.

I'm sure he does. He didn't want to right then and there and your argument seems to be that if we don't answer right here right now, it's because... Scum? That's the disconnect.