Micro 789 - Alternating 9p - Mafia wins

Micro Games (9 players or fewer). Archived during the 2023 queue overhaul.
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Post Post #100 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:51 am

Post by Christopher »

tr Greenliquid.

leantown on BuJaber, Iconeum, and Lovebird.

Major's afk, and i'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

tbh, I'm null on ZZZX and Rask.

leanscum on no content Not_Mafia.
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Post Post #101 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:47 am

Post by Kmd4390 »

Vote Count

Raskolnikov - 2 - BuJaber, ZZZX
Iconeum - 2 - Lovebird, major minor
Not_Mafia - 2 - Raskolnikov, christopher
Christopher - 1 - Greenliquid
BuJaber - 1 - Iconeum

Not Voting - Not_Mafia

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.


Deadline is April 2 at 1pm EST
Last edited by Kmd4390 on Sat Mar 17, 2018 5:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post Post #102 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:28 am

Post by Lovebird »

In post 94, Iconeum wrote:
In post 51, Lovebird wrote:VOTE: Iconeum
In post 71, Lovebird wrote:Vote iconeum pls.
These are literally the only mentions Lovebird has about me.
Care to explain at least the scumread on me?
Really empty initial posts, didn't like the push on buj.
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Post Post #103 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:30 am

Post by Lovebird »

In post 98, Major Minor wrote: Iconeum's push on BuJaber seems weak and phony. It basically comes down to "you didn't stop and rewrite your post to avoid possibly being read as scum for the contradiction" -- which, IMO, is a reason to point to Bu being TOWN, not mafia. Town doesn't have to go through that extra layer of thought because they aren't trying to hide who they are -- Mafia do. Would love to hear a response to this. The rest of Iconeum's stuff feels null at worst.

I dislike Lovebird's empty push on Iconeum, though. No reasons or anything? Feels opportunistic.
How is that opportunistic? What makes you assume I don't have a reason when you see something there yourself?
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Post Post #104 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 10:13 am

Post by Major Minor »

@Christopher: I made a post before you posted either of those two posts... I'm not AFK.

@Lovebird: Because I believe not stating reasons and just jumping on something you feel in your gut is "easy" is a good way to appear to let other people fill in your reasons for you.
There's nothing pro-town about withholding reasons.
I'm anti anti, ain't I?
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Post Post #105 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:55 am

Post by Christopher »

In post 104, Major Minor wrote:@Christopher: I made a post before you posted either of those two posts... I'm not AFK.

@Lovebird: Because I believe not stating reasons and just jumping on something you feel in your gut is "easy" is a good way to appear to let other people fill in your reasons for you.
There's nothing pro-town about withholding reasons.
You’re right. I didn’t mean to imply you were completely afk, but rather were afk and were catching up.
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Post Post #106 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:58 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

In post 59, Iconeum wrote:I agree that putting Lovebird in a scumpool, but in the same post mentioning that is has no reason to act like that if scum, is just weird.
Still like how he tries to steer conversation away, because that was leading us nowhere.
Out of curiosity, you didn't notice this when you made right?
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Post Post #107 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:38 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

In post 98, Major Minor wrote:The way he also threw his vote around onto Not_Mafia just felt really town in my gut? I hate gut reads, it's hard to explain, but it was the lack of pretense that pinged me as town. There's no show to put on, nobody to impress with his vote switch, it's just what it is.
In post 98, Major Minor wrote:I dislike Lovebird's empty push on Iconeum, though. No reasons or anything? Feels opportunistic.
I'm having trouble squaring these.
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Post Post #108 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:44 pm

Post by GreenLiquid »

@Raskolnikov: Is your vote switch to Not_Mafia on the basis of anything other than lack of content?
In post 99, Christopher wrote: gucci, my dude.

VOTE: Not_Mafia
Same question @Christopher.
In post 62, BuJaber wrote: Okay you want me to spill some secrets? Here's a small insight into how I play.
The prediction is based on WIFOM. That's usually how I narrow things down between a pool if there is nothing specific that pings me. (Such as this game). Since everyone is more or less a nullread I come up with a theory that makes sense to narrow down the field and split up the players into categories for further analysis.
In post 96, BuJaber wrote: I knew it pinged me but now I don't remember why. I may have misread it because I read it again now and nothing is pinging me.

I think my prediction is still solid though. I want to lynch one of you 3 but I promise I won't factor in the opening and my RVS vote. Whoever I find the most scummy today I will vote for from GL/Rask/Love.
Your POE strategy doesn't seem very useful to me but seems like an "idiosyncratic townie" thing as much as a scum tactic. But I don't like that you're mostly just talking about this instead of engaging with anything else going on. Are your reads still generally null?
In post 86, ZZZX wrote:A scum read on me wouldn't be what I call it, But if its about being defensive then, yea. I feel this is the best way to get what I need to get from people. It ends up working.
What exactly did you intend to get out of Raskie by being defensive here? All I really get out of this is that you were being being insincerely defensive and that doesn't feel like town play.
In post 95, Iconeum wrote:
In post 76, ZZZX wrote:I just feel people trying to talk about people not posting enough or not giving enough content at the 2nd (or 3rd?) day is really... fakeLets keep it at thatVOTE: Raskolnikov
While I agree that activity is NAI, I Feel Rask has made enough other posts to not scumread him.
This seems contradictory to me; can you clarify?
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Post Post #109 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:00 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

N_M's been posting elsewhere onsite the whole time which to some extent just makes me want to say fuck him. Icon's statement there is also consistent with my skims and was mainly why I think icon might be paying attention, though from experience saying meta on people you've played isn't that difficult either when scum so eh.

But I'm also lacking a bit in scumreads atm.
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Post Post #110 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:11 pm

Post by GreenLiquid »

In post 109, Raskolnikov wrote:N_M's been posting elsewhere onsite the whole time which to some extent just makes me want to say fuck him. Icon's statement there is also consistent with my skims and was mainly why I think icon might be paying attention, though from experience saying meta on people you've played isn't that difficult either when scum so eh.

But I'm also lacking a bit in scumreads atm.
Is it out of character for Not_Mafia, though? From what (little) I've seen of his posting, it seems normal enough for him, except for the fact he hasn't voted.
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Post Post #111 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:13 pm

Post by Not_Mafia »

I'm waiting for someone to do something interesting
Also, what is NM doing? Worst play I’ve ever seen.
I can't remember the last N_M post that wasn't bland, unimaginative and lame. Some shitposters are at least somewhat funny. You are the epitomy of the type of poster that nobody would miss if you were to suddenly disappear. You never add anything of value.
I'm guessing you haven't read the game and probably never will? Why even sign up to play?
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Post Post #112 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:15 pm

Post by GreenLiquid »

In post 111, Not_Mafia wrote:I'm waiting for someone to do something interesting
Be the interesting you wish to see in the world.
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Post Post #113 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:17 pm

Post by Not_Mafia »

Prime numbers and their properties were first studied extensively by the ancient Greek mathematicians.
The mathematicians of Pythagoras's school (500 BC to 300 BC) were interested in numbers for their mystical and numerological properties. They understood the idea of primality and were interested in perfect and amicable numbers.
A perfect number is one whose proper divisors sum to the number itself. e.g. The number 6 has proper divisors 1, 2 and 3 and 1 + 2 + 3 = 6, 28 has divisors 1, 2, 4, 7 and 14 and 1 + 2 + 4 + 7 + 14 = 28.
A pair of amicable numbers is a pair like 220 and 284 such that the proper divisors of one number sum to the other and vice versa.
You can see more about these numbers in the History topics article Perfect numbers.

By the time Euclid's Elements appeared in about 300 BC, several important results about primes had been proved. In Book IX of the Elements, Euclid proves that there are infinitely many prime numbers. This is one of the first proofs known which uses the method of contradiction to establish a result. Euclid also gives a proof of the Fundamental Theorem of Arithmetic: Every integer can be written as a product of primes in an essentially unique way.

Euclid also showed that if the number 2n - 1 is prime then the number 2n-1(2n - 1) is a perfect number. The mathematician Euler (much later in 1747) was able to show that all even perfect numbers are of this form. It is not known to this day whether there are any odd perfect numbers.

In about 200 BC the Greek Eratosthenes devised an algorithm for calculating primes called the Sieve of Eratosthenes.

There is then a long gap in the history of prime numbers during what is usually called the Dark Ages.

The next important developments were made by Fermat at the beginning of the 17th Century. He proved a speculation of Albert Girard that every prime number of the form 4 n + 1 can be written in a unique way as the sum of two squares and was able to show how any number could be written as a sum of four squares.
He devised a new method of factorising large numbers which he demonstrated by factorising the number 2027651281 = 44021 × 46061.
He proved what has come to be known as Fermat's Little Theorem (to distinguish it from his so-called Last Theorem).
This states that if p is a prime then for any integer a we have ap = a modulo p.
This proves one half of what has been called the Chinese hypothesis which dates from about 2000 years earlier, that an integer n is prime if and only if the number 2n - 2 is divisible by n. The other half of this is false, since, for example, 2341 - 2 is divisible by 341 even though 341 = 31 × 11 is composite. Fermat's Little Theorem is the basis for many other results in Number Theory and is the basis for methods of checking whether numbers are prime which are still in use on today's electronic computers.

Fermat corresponded with other mathematicians of his day and in particular with the monk Marin Mersenne. In one of his letters to Mersenne he conjectured that the numbers 2n + 1 were always prime if n is a power of 2. He had verified this for n = 1, 2, 4, 8 and 16 and he knew that if n were not a power of 2, the result failed. Numbers of this form are called Fermat numbers and it was not until more than 100 years later that Euler showed that the next case 232 + 1 = 4294967297 is divisible by 641 and so is not prime.

Number of the form 2n - 1 also attracted attention because it is easy to show that if unless n is prime these number must be composite. These are often called Mersenne numbers Mn because Mersenne studied them.

Not all numbers of the form 2n - 1 with n prime are prime. For example 211 - 1 = 2047 = 23 × 89 is composite, though this was first noted as late as 1536.
For many years numbers of this form provided the largest known primes. The number M19 was proved to be prime by Cataldi in 1588 and this was the largest known prime for about 200 years until Euler proved that M31 is prime. This established the record for another century and when Lucas showed that M127 (which is a 39 digit number) is prime that took the record as far as the age of the electronic computer.
In 1952 the Mersenne numbers M521, M607, M1279, M2203 and M2281 were proved to be prime by Robinson using an early computer and the electronic age had begun.

By 2018 a total of 50 Mersenne primes have been found. The largest is M77 232 917 which has 23 249 425 decimal digits.

Euler's work had a great impact on number theory in general and on primes in particular.
He extended Fermat's Little Theorem and introduced the Euler φ-function. As mentioned above he factorised the 5th Fermat Number 232 + 1, he found 60 pairs of the amicable numbers referred to above, and he stated (but was unable to prove) what became known as the Law of Quadratic Reciprocity.

He was the first to realise that number theory could be studied using the tools of analysis and in so-doing founded the subject of Analytic Number Theory. He was able to show that not only is the so-called Harmonic series ∑ (1/n) divergent, but the series
1/2 + 1/3 + 1/5 + 1/7 + 1/11 + ...
formed by summing the reciprocals of the prime numbers, is also divergent. The sum to n terms of the Harmonic series grows roughly like log(n), while the latter series diverges even more slowly like log[ log(n) ]. This means, for example, that summing the reciprocals of all the primes that have been listed, even by the most powerful computers, only gives a sum of about 4, but the series still diverges to ∞.
At first sight the primes seem to be distributed among the integers in rather a haphazard way. For example in the 100 numbers immediately before 10 000 000 there are 9 primes, while in the 100 numbers after there are only 2 primes. However, on a large scale, the way in which the primes are distributed is very regular. Legendre and Gauss both did extensive calculations of the density of primes. Gauss (who was a prodigious calculator) told a friend that whenever he had a spare 15 minutes he would spend it in counting the primes in a 'chiliad' (a range of 1000 numbers). By the end of his life it is estimated that he had counted all the primes up to about 3 million. Both Legendre and Gauss came to the conclusion that for large n the density of primes near n is about 1/log(n). Legendre gave an estimate for π(n) the number of primes ≤ n of
π(n) = n/(log(n) - 1.08366)
while Gauss's estimate is in terms of the logarithmic integral
π(n) = ∫ (1/log(t) dt where the range of integration is 2 to n.

You can see the Legendre estimate and the Gauss estimate and can compare them.
The statement that the density of primes is 1/log(n) is known as the Prime Number Theorem. Attempts to prove it continued throughout the 19th Century with notable progress being made by Chebyshev and Riemann who was able to relate the problem to something called the Riemann Hypothesis: a still unproved result about the zeros in the Complex plane of something called the Riemann zeta-function. The result was eventually proved (using powerful methods in Complex analysis) by Hadamard and de la Vallée Poussin in 1896
Also, what is NM doing? Worst play I’ve ever seen.
I can't remember the last N_M post that wasn't bland, unimaginative and lame. Some shitposters are at least somewhat funny. You are the epitomy of the type of poster that nobody would miss if you were to suddenly disappear. You never add anything of value.
I'm guessing you haven't read the game and probably never will? Why even sign up to play?
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Post Post #114 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:40 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

In post 110, GreenLiquid wrote:Is it out of character for Not_Mafia, though? From what (little) I've seen of his posting, it seems normal enough for him, except for the fact he hasn't voted.
Not a not mafia expert but my impression was he was a little more likely to be engaged as town. Low sample size here tbh but not townread so.
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Post Post #115 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:52 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

GL if you had to lynch 3 people right now, who would they be?
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Post Post #116 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:54 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

@NM
In post 73, Raskolnikov wrote:Not mafia pretend this is a turbo and you have to dayvig someone and post a paragraph why in the next 20 minutes or you lose
Please
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Post Post #117 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 3:12 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

ZZZX defensive/aggressiveness (and disbelief in very early reads, and maybe even hating activity in general) is strictly standard unfortunately.
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Post Post #118 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 3:13 pm

Post by Raskolnikov »

GL are you secret scum hiding in town by not making any mistakes? :lol: :?
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Post Post #119 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 4:08 pm

Post by GreenLiquid »

In post 115, Raskolnikov wrote:GL if you had to lynch 3 people right now, who would they be?
These are still weak reads but I'd go for:

Lovebird -- Still slightly pinged by that early and unnatural-seeming townread, and from her ISO. There's a lot of activity there but it doesn't read like scumhunting to me. It just looks like pecking (hah) at various things without enough reasoning for me to tell why.
ZZZX -- Mainly because his defensiveness is apparently not genuine and I question if that's town-motivated. Although if this is standard for him as you say, then I guess it may be NAI.

That's only two but that's all I've got here. Major Minor's pings me slightly in ways I can't really put to words (too detached, I guess?) but that could be posting style for all I know. I don't scumread him in general yet.

I guess the theme drawing me towards Lovebird / ZZZX is "doesn't seem genuine". I'd rather see a lynch on that basis than on the basis of things that might just be playstyle and not really AI.
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Post Post #120 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 4:17 pm

Post by GreenLiquid »

In post 118, Raskolnikov wrote:GL are you secret scum hiding in town by not making any mistakes? :lol: :?
No, although I get the feeling scum are basically getting away with that. We need more pressure or direction or something right now, and less voting and scumreading on the basis of activity/lack of content. And more people posting in the evenings, Christ.
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Post Post #121 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:47 pm

Post by Lovebird »

In post 119, GreenLiquid wrote:
In post 115, Raskolnikov wrote:GL if you had to lynch 3 people right now, who would they be?
These are still weak reads but I'd go for:

Lovebird -- Still slightly pinged by that early and unnatural-seeming townread, and from her ISO. There's a lot of activity there but it doesn't read like scumhunting to me. It just looks like pecking (hah) at various things without enough reasoning for me to tell why.
ZZZX -- Mainly because his defensiveness is apparently not genuine and I question if that's town-motivated. Although if this is standard for him as you say, then I guess it may be NAI.

That's only two but that's all I've got here. Major Minor's pings me slightly in ways I can't really put to words (too detached, I guess?) but that could be posting style for all I know. I don't scumread him in general yet.

I guess the theme drawing me towards Lovebird / ZZZX is "doesn't seem genuine". I'd rather see a lynch on that basis than on the basis of things that might just be playstyle and not really AI.
It seems inconsistent to me in what you attribute to playstyle and what you attribute to alignment.
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Post Post #122 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:48 pm

Post by Lovebird »

What do you think of ico and chris?
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Post Post #123 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:49 pm

Post by Lovebird »

In post 120, GreenLiquid wrote:
In post 118, Raskolnikov wrote:GL are you secret scum hiding in town by not making any mistakes? :lol: :?
No, although I get the feeling scum are basically getting away with that. We need more pressure or direction or something right now, and less voting and scumreading on the basis of activity/lack of content. And more people posting in the evenings, Christ.
Your vote is still on chris?
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Post Post #124 (ISO) » Fri Mar 16, 2018 7:45 pm

Post by BuJaber »

In post 107, Raskolnikov wrote:
In post 98, Major Minor wrote:The way he also threw his vote around onto Not_Mafia just felt really town in my gut? I hate gut reads, it's hard to explain, but it was the lack of pretense that pinged me as town. There's no show to put on, nobody to impress with his vote switch, it's just what it is.
In post 98, Major Minor wrote:I dislike Lovebird's empty push on Iconeum, though. No reasons or anything? Feels opportunistic.
I'm having trouble squaring these.
Good point.

As of now:
1 scum in {GL, Rask, Love}
1 scum in {NM, Icon} maybe chris.

I know it's a big pool but one of them flips scum it makes it less likely that there's another scum in the same group imo.
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