Micro 756: Extra Communication Mafia GAME OVER!

[Chip Butty]

MB, you played really well btw. Practically nobody suspected you after d1, meaning i could throw shade at you without worrying too much about it sticking.

[MathBlade]

Esp whispering bad things about me to fferyllt....

/whistles

Espe was totally doing that, btw. He had the game pretty much figured out when he got neighborized. I wasn't lying when I said I thought you made the best NK decisions possible.

And also, that was totally reasonable, given that you just had more access to information than MB did. Which was why you were the one making the NK choices.

Esp was definitely a big threat. Accidentally hammering him was probably my best move of the game lol.

Lol I thought that was intentional and just defended you with my fuckups.

Didn’t realize that was intentional

[MathBlade]

Esp whispering bad things about me to fferyllt....

/whistles

Espe was totally doing that, btw. He had the game pretty much figured out when he got neighborized. I wasn't lying when I said I thought you made the best NK decisions possible.

And also, that was totally reasonable, given that you just had more access to information than MB did. Which was why you were the one making the NK choices.

Esp was definitely a big threat. Accidentally hammering him was probably my best move of the game lol.

Lol I thought that was intentional and just defended you with my fuckups.

Didn’t realize that wasn’t intentional

Ebwop

You did really good too Chip.

You have a really good future on MS

[Chip Butty]

Incidentally, i just remembered i initially submitted fferyllt for the n1 NK, then thought about it more and changed to skitter.

[Ghostlin]

MB, you played really well btw. Practically nobody suspected you after d1, meaning i could throw shade at you without worrying too much about it sticking.

So...actually that was well played by scum. We were pretty much outplayed here. I can't feel salty about it even though I feel a bit of a Cassandra about it.

[MathBlade]

MB, you played really well btw. Practically nobody suspected you after d1, meaning i could throw shade at you without worrying too much about it sticking.

So...actually that was well played by scum. We were pretty much outplayed here. I can't feel salty about it even though I feel a bit of a Cassandra about it.

Thank you.

What is a Cassandra?

[Ghostlin]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassandra

[MathBlade]

Thanks Ghostlin!

You did really good too

I am quite honestly surprised I wasn’t forced to bus Chip.

[Ghostlin]

You know, he did fine. You generally don't wanna unless they're on fire and going down. You guys were c also right seperating me and Ffery from syncing in LYLO.

[MathBlade]

I was meaning more my stance “scum have to exist in the hood” while proceeding to mislynch the town in the hood.

[Fishythefish]

Well played the scum, and thanks to the mod for modding. Very smoothly run game.

The PT detector you guys were missing was in fact skitter. I assumed (perhaps unfairly) that the neighbor would recognize the role when/if skitter flipped given that it was just an additional two words from what they were informed was in the game. This remains my greatest regret about the setup: that a last minute (Ok, days before signups) attempt to bump up the power level for town in response to everyone telling me towns on MS need to be increasingly powerful ended up causing so much confusion.

I think you were unlucky here - the confusion was definitely increased by GD's gambit meaning there were

two

roles that didn't match the info; that was an unfortunate coincidence. Other than this, the setup seems reasonable (and certainly fun) now it's revealed. The closest thing thing to a lie about a role is Ghostlin's role - the assumption that it provided alignment information was a pretty natural one which led to a lot of confusion.

[Jingle]

It did, just only if it targeted MB at the right time. And, to be perfectly honest I expected it to get a result on pretty much everyone pretty early on because I expected both messengers to use their ability, if only out of curiosity, early as well. You being silent till LYLO wasn't really something I took into account, which seems silly in hindsight because the power of it grew the longer it went unused.

[Ellibereth]

WAIT WHAT WAS THE BASTARD PART OF THIS SETTUP

[Jingle]

IT WAS NON BASTARD!

The reasonable mod lies were the reporter and messenger.

Hence, non bastard, but possible reasonable mod lies.

It's almost exactly like a miller, but I didn't want people going in completely unaware they might exist because they're pretty nonstandard roles.

[Jingle]

[Jingle]

So, I think one of Ghostlin and CB must be scum - Ghostlin's role makes no sense for town unless scum were aware of it. And my read on CB remains scum (from the days before role madness took over).

This, btw, is exactly why CB was informed of Ghost's role. The rest of the roles were distributed to maintain a sense of symmetry and to prevent this from being the only lynchable neighbor. But scum 100% needed to know about the eavesdropper.

The pattern for the IN's was 1 extra communication role and 1 communication dependent power for each player. They also didn't really post much there (GD didn't even post in the neighborhood until after she'd fullclaimed ITT, which again, I did NOT expect.)

[Jingle]

Now I'm gonna run a bastard setup where the bastard part is that there is no bastard aspect of the setup, just to see if your brains explode.

[Fishythefish]

It did, just only if it targeted MB at the right time. And, to be perfectly honest I expected it to get a result on pretty much everyone pretty early on because I expected both messengers to use their ability, if only out of curiosity, early as well. You being silent till LYLO wasn't really something I took into account, which seems silly in hindsight because the power of it grew the longer it went unused.

Oh, could Ghostlin see the scum "non-PT", MB's messages and my messages? That's not something I'd realised. But wait - how did MB know about the role if CB couldn't talk back to MB?

Using my power; I was going to have a gambit day 1 (in fact I started talking to you about it), but then there were roles which claimed to need to know who was dying, so I decided not to fuck with those by faking daykills. And using it frivolously seemed silly, in case I needed it (e.g. to "clear" myself in desperation and LYLO)

[Ellibereth]

I FUCKED UP NOT JOINING SOME OF THOSE ROLES HAD SO MUCH MEME-TENTIAL

[Fishythefish]

The PT detector you guys were missing was in fact skitter. I assumed (perhaps unfairly) that the neighbor would recognize the role when/if skitter flipped given that it was just an additional two words from what they were informed was in the game. This remains my greatest regret about the setup: that a last minute (Ok, days before signups) attempt to bump up the power level for town in response to everyone telling me towns on MS need to be increasingly powerful ended up causing so much confusion.

viewtopic.php?p=9820474#p9820474

Like people were going on about the missing PT detector, but it was like spelled out in my flip lol

Well... kinda. The two PM extracts are:

In the game

Once per night you may target a player. If they have access to any PT, I will tell you their alignment. Otherwise, you will receive no result. If you are roleblocked, you will recieve no result.

Informed on

Once per night you may target a player. If they have access to any PT, I will tell you. Otherwise, you will receive no result. If you are roleblocked, you will recieve no result.

These roles are not the same role. I think this counts as a "PM lieing to you" which the queue post said was impossible. I think the setup as really good overall and it looks like Jingle didn't mean this, but the assumption in the game that this wasn't your role was a reasonable one.

Annoyingly, the "mod changed this at the last minute and forgot to update the IN PM" explanation did cross my mind, but I didn't pay it too much attention because "mod mistakes" for a setup explanation is an epic-sized can of worms.

[Jingle]

how did MB know about the role if CB couldn't talk back to MB?

It was up to CB to get her that information through the thread or hunt out the PR that could pick up on it. I expected he'd support a full claim in the neighborhood because of it.

And yeah, Ghost's role could see any communication that traveled outside of the thread between two players. My criteria for that was: sent by a player to either me or a PT and another player had the ability to read it. Hence, until ffery neighborized someone, no ghostlin results cause a player couldn't read it. He also could have picked up on Math's PR messages.

And yeah, faking a Inno Child claim was a very real possibility I considered for your role, with the added benefit of NOT being a scum fakeclaim if you got caught.

Lol, Elli. I hope to see you in one of my future strange and weird setups then.

I mod for three reasons. I see a need for mods, I have a flavor I want to write a game around, or I have an idea for a weird setup like this one. In any case, I don't let them get anywhere near the mod queue unless I can ask myself "Would I as a player enjoy this game?" and truly believe the answer to be yes.

[MathBlade]

Because of mass claim by CB.

I told him to be honest when power claims came up

[Fishythefish]

Cool. I think this was a really lovely setup, then. The only niggle is that if CB isn't quick off the mark, and MB sends an unlucky message, the game can end day 1 without the scum doing much wrong? Other than that, it all fits together very nicely.

[Jingle]

I intentionally didn't tell the informed neighbor about the checking for alignment bit, because then they could have told town to no lynch 3 times as it would be a breaking strategy right out the gate. Espy's role was true, (skitter was told whether her target had a PT by the results PM) and I never told the neighbors that they were the complete roles of the people they were informed of. As such I don't see it as a lie. I will say that I am very disappointed in myself for the unintended ambiguity in role PM's this time around.

Skitter's and ffery's rolenames were terribly chosen, for one. The neighbors should have all been explicitly informed that they might not have complete information, instead of just one of them (GD, wrt to the fishy role). I had to make a last minute clarification to both skitter and Flubber about what PT's are because I decided to offer PT's to coordinate your thoughts in the early game. And I probably could have phrased most if not all of the role PM's to be a little less confusing.

If anyone is upset or believes what I said constituted a lie, I apologize, and can only offer my sincere promise to try harder in the future to provide a better quality modding experience. Was there room for improvement in my modding this game. Yes. Dear god yes. But I hope you all had fun anyway.

[Jingle]

Yeah, I considered that possibility, and in fact an earlier version of the setup had both mafia members seeing each other's role PM. But at that point there's literally no reason for Ghost's role, and the odds of him getting a double guilty early d1 were pretty slim mathematically speaking, so I chose to discount it. It could have happened, but I thought it likely that it wouldn't.