Updated Mod Eligibility Rules

[animorpherv1]

You've got the teaching mod thing wrong. The Newbie doesn't run the game by him/herself. The veteran does most of the work at first, and slowly adds the newbie into doing things.

[MafiaSSK]

You've got the teaching mod thing wrong. The Newbie doesn't run the game by him/herself. The veteran does most of the work at first, and slowly adds the newbie into doing things.

...Why would you do that? The newbie would feel no power and it gives the veteran way too much power. The newbie could end up doing nothing until the last bit, when they maybe get to do one prod. Or what may end up happening is the veteran gives the newbie all the annoying work, and doesn't let him experience the more fun aspects of what moderating can be.

[animorpherv1]

You've got the teaching mod thing wrong. The Newbie doesn't run the game by him/herself. The veteran does most of the work at first, and slowly adds the newbie into doing things.

...Why would you do that? The newbie would feel no power and it gives the veteran way too much power. The newbie could end up doing nothing until the last bit, when they maybe get to do one prod. Or what may end up happening is the veteran gives the newbie all the annoying work, and doesn't let him experience the more fun aspects of what moderating can be.

Well, obviously only people who wouldn't give the newbies annoying work wouldn't be allowed to do it.

I see where you are coming from. Maybe it would work better if the Newbie worked in tandem with the vet, instead of the Newbie doing everything and the vet just watching?

[Vi]

You've got the teaching mod thing wrong. The Newbie doesn't run the game by him/herself. The veteran does most of the work at first, and slowly adds the newbie into doing things.

Major problems:
1) Modding isn't that hard
2) The hardest part of modding is right at the beginning

Maybe it would work better if the Newbie worked in tandem with the vet, instead of the Newbie doing everything and the vet just watching?

That's what the hydra is supposed to be about in the first place.

[Faraday]

Worst/hardest part of modding is the nervousness when sending out pm's for me. OH FUCK DID I SEND THE RIGHT PM + right qt links(even though I know I did as I previewed it 14 times >_>)

Major problems:
1) Modding isn't that hard

Yes well. Shouldn't be. Doing it wrong is still not uncommon for some people.

[shaft.ed]

1) Modding isn't that hard
2) The hardest part of modding is right at the beginning

My thoughts on the matter as well. Which is why I would rather push our creepy old man and inexperienced nubility interactions towards set up review

[Vi]

Worst/hardest part of modding is the nervousness when sending out pm's for me. OH FUCK DID I SEND THE RIGHT PM + right qt links(even though I know I did as I previewed it 14 times >_>)

This so much.

[shaft.ed]

actually, I've never experienced that

[gandalf5166]

DAMN RC is bitter about absolutely nothing. I flaked because he wasn't doing ANYTHING. He kept giving me "pointers"(which amounted to "OH YOU SHOULD FIGURE OUT YOUR GENERAL VISION BEFORE DESIGNING SPECIFIC ROLES"), but meanwhile I was expected to design a 40-player game(yes, it was going to be 40 player) with no help whatsoever. Meanwhile he's probably taking MY ideas(I had a lot of awesome ideas, I just couldn't figure out the specifics as far as roles) and using them in a game but won't even give me partial credit because he's angry at me for not liking Blackest Night. The teaching mod thing might work, so long as the teaching mod actually TAUGHT instead of being like "oh well i thought up this one part of the game now you run along and create a bigger setup than anyone on this site has ever even seen before".

[ReaperCharlie]

I'm not bitter. I just wanted things to get done, which they are now, thanks to Andy and me. And we decided 40-players was unnecessarily large for our aims (however lofty they may be). Looks like the game will be 30-35 players now. And no, we're not using your ideas. If we were, I'd give you credit, duh.

Anyway, this isn't the place. If you want to PM me, feel free.

[Faraday]

How do you teach someone to mod though, like, I dunno, like each mod likes their own certain things, there are awesome mods on here that I'd probably not want to design a game with because we have different design philosophies (i'm fairly easy though, so that's not so true I guess)

What do you do? Let them watch how you work? Okay, that's...sort of helpful? But it'd be better if theyworked out what works for them. I think it's an okay idea, but not sure how it'd work. Co-mods are fine, I love them (I've only modded 2 solo games, after all and my next ~3 are co-modded games) but not sure if some sort of apprentice mod would actually work.

Just design a set-up yourself, then get

spyrex

a good reviewer (you should be able to figure out who they are) to help you look over your game and point out flaws.

Edit: Not sure this had a point.

It's fairly easy to teach someone not to mod wrong, but there's no real 1 right way (some ways are obviously better than others)

[Faraday]

Worst/hardest part of modding is the nervousness when sending out pm's for me. OH FUCK DID I SEND THE RIGHT PM + right qt links(even though I know I did as I previewed it 14 times >_>)

This so much.

Thank fuck I'm not alone. I always check it again then in the outbox (although I think it takes you automatically there but eh)

[zoraster]

Sending out role pms is like packing for vacation. No matter how many times you check, you're sure you missed something.

[animorpherv1]

I did. Several times. In my Newbie game I gave a Doctor the Cop PM. Luckily there was only 1 PR, so it didn't matter.

Then, SSBM.

[Mr. Flay]

I always check it again then in the outbox

I do this, too... [/offtopic]

[Vi]

Sending out role pms is like packing for vacation. No matter how many times you check, you're sure you missed something.

But I

always

forget something when I go on vacation. And leave the house in general.

[RedCoyote]

The teaching mod thing might work, so long as the teaching mod actually TAUGHT instead of being like "oh well i thought up this one part of the game now you run along and create a bigger setup than anyone on this site has ever even seen before".

Okay, so who would you prefer to be taught by?

[Rhinox]

hey I had a big post typed up but it got lost maybe for the better haha

Basically, it was something like, I'm just now a new mod but I'm a member with 3 years experience. From my perspective, a new mod gets more ideas of proper game setup and balance from playing in lots of games, not from modding games.

I heard an argument that opens shouldn't be counted fullt towards mod experience. But the same argument can say that modding 2 mini normals shouldn't qualify someone to run a large theme, but it does.

Basically, even though I never modded a game, my length on site and completed game history should prove I wouldn't flake as a mod, and I am comfortable with mini normal and theme balance (not perfect at it, but no one is) because I've played so many of them. I would not be comfortable modding a large normal or theme because I have no idea how to balance a game with more than 13 players - I haven't played in many of them - yet I could be qualified to do so after modding another mini.

So what I'm thinking is, I think maybe instead of or in addition to or alternate to the standard modding path, I think games completed experience should have somewhat of an influence on modding eligibility. It should be a requirement to have actually played a number of the sizes and types of games you want to mod.

Afterall, I've heard it repeated that the mechanics of modding is easy, but setup is hard. I can learn everything I need to learn about setting up a mini theme without ever having modded a normal or an open, just by playing lots of mini themes. Probably that experience would be even more relevant than modding a single mini normal or an open. Yet I have to run a normal or an open to be able to run a theme, even though that experience doesn't really tell me anything I need to know about setting up a theme game.

Just some $.02 as an alternate perspective from someone who didn't have an interest in rushing into modding.

[The Kool]

Actually, modding a setup and seeing what you did right and what you did wrong and what failed epicly teaches you a lot more than just playing and seeing only your little corner of the game. I learned this from experience. And trust me, you need to have the basics down before you try running a theme, there are SO MANY ways you can go wrong. I also learned this from experience.

I mean, come on! The chances of having the cult manage to secure two converts each night from night 1 were slim, but they should have been nonexistent.

It just should not happen.

Because even though it was so slim I hadn't thought of it,

it still happened.

Alternatively, opens I think should be counted, even playing in them, to some degree, because you can see everything that is going on, which is a great situation for people new to it, IMHO.

But in all seriousness, the only way to know how to set up a Theme if you haven't done so before, is to examine existing setups and discuss them with the creator. In the example above, I missed a key caveat of the cult, which completely unbalanced them. I had not thought the setup through very far, and had no previous experience with setups of that size, or even any resources of any, to draw from.

And that's my two cents.

[ReaperCharlie]

ITT we post under alts?

[Herodotus]

No, they are probably joining us from a different site.

[StrangerCoug]

What is the ruling on mods that entered the queue before the rule change? Magua needs clarification on this.

[Amrun]

Can you be in the Open Queue while modding a Mini Theme (if the theme will end before you get to the top of the open queue)?

No (though this was never quite a well-defined rule prior to the current announcement, so it isn't my intent that anyone who signed up under the old rules be kicked off a list).

[Mr. Flay]

What is the ruling on mods that entered the queue before the rule change? Magua needs clarification on this.

My understanding is it will be grandfathered/whatever is most advantageous to the mod.

[mith]

That's correct.