Rule Addition Regarding Hiding Identity from Staff

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Rule Addition Regarding Hiding Identity from Staff

Post Post #0 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:50 am

Post by zoraster »

The following has been added to the site rules:

You may not hide your identity from the site administrators and moderators acting in their official capacity. Users should register their alternate accounts ("alts") as alts (here for help), and they should not register with fake emails, exclusively use proxies, or use other methods to hide their identity. Doing so will be reason in itself to remove you from the site.


This is not an attempt to stop users from using alternate accounts, but with this rule we want to clarify that for administrative purposes, we need to know which accounts are linked. If you accidentally register your account as a main, don't fret (it's easy to accidentally do if you mess up part of the form), just post in the alt activation thread or PM a mod. We may inquire as to your identity if there's some confusion.

Also, this isn't intended to necessarily stop users from using proxies
so long as the proxies aren't hiding your identity from us
. In other words, if your alt is known and registered there's no problem with using proxies or registering with a different email address. It's just when we believe you are attempting to deceive us in our official duties that there is a problem.

To be clear, it's not a problem to act like a different person on an alt in a game even if there's a staff member playing the game, though as we've stated before, you should not attempt to get around another player or game mod's "blacklist" by using an alt. Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity.

Last, keep in mind that certain areas of the site, such as The Speakeasy/GTKAS and Newbie Games have their own rules about alternate accounts.
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Post Post #1 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:35 am

Post by vonflare »

seems reasonable
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Post Post #2 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:42 am

Post by mykonian »

For your safety and protection, alt tracking is employed at all times.
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Post Post #3 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:31 am

Post by Nexus »

#banallalts
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Post Post #4 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:49 am

Post by Davsto »

In post 3, Nexus wrote:#banallalts
What is a lalt anyway? What's so boring about it?
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Post Post #5 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:56 am

Post by AniX »

I think it is disgusting a member of this site's staff is campaigning to ban a specific user. What violation has Albert Lalts even committed?
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Post Post #6 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:30 am

Post by Gamma Emerald »

I'm glad this is in effect.
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Post Post #7 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:58 am

Post by zakk »

In post 4, Davsto wrote:
In post 3, Nexus wrote:#banallalts
What is a lalt anyway? What's so boring about it?
In post 5, AniX wrote:I think it is disgusting a member of this site's staff is campaigning to ban a specific user. What violation has Albert Lalts even committed?
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Post Post #8 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:08 am

Post by Cheetory6 »

The mods should ban one person every month to appease the hungry masses.
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Post Post #9 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:11 am

Post by Davsto »

Can that person be shotty

Every month
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Post Post #10 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:40 am

Post by pirate mollie »

In post 3, Nexus wrote:#banallalts
whew!
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Post Post #11 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:45 am

Post by vonflare »

#freeShotty

That guy was a riot. He threatened to buy mafiascum and ban whoever upset him lol
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Post Post #12 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:20 pm

Post by Lady Lambdadelta »

Zoraster, can we talk legal precedent for a moment?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p7096589

Given mods have been reprimanded for revealing hidden alts in games prior, where is the stance of the moderation team on this?

Because "Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity." makes it sound an awful lot like "mods won't go out of their way to look you up but if they happen to be privy to some knowledge that they wouldn't otherwise, fair game?

Like I just want to know what the standard moderation response to "A Moderator has revealed who I am to the other players in my game while I was playing on an alt" will be.
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Post Post #13 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:54 pm

Post by Spiffeh »

In post 8, Cheetory6 wrote:The mods should ban one person every day to appease the hungry masses.
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Post Post #14 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:56 pm

Post by Gamma Emerald »

Week would be a decent middle ground
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Post Post #15 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 2:08 pm

Post by AniX »

In post 12, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:Zoraster, can we talk legal precedent for a moment?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p7096589

Given mods have been reprimanded for revealing hidden alts in games prior, where is the stance of the moderation team on this?

Because "Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity." makes it sound an awful lot like "mods won't go out of their way to look you up but if they happen to be privy to some knowledge that they wouldn't otherwise, fair game?

Like I just want to know what the standard moderation response to "A Moderator has revealed who I am to the other players in my game while I was playing on an alt" will be.
Surely knowing and revealing are two different things. You can know and not tell anyone else after all. To my knowledge there was no punishment for the mod knowing and only for the mod revealing.
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Post Post #16 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:06 pm

Post by Accountant »

Wouldn't it provide the mod an unfair advantage in meta terms? Say Bob makes an alt, Albert. Bob has a specific and distinctive tell that he only does as scum, but he doesn't mind doing it as Albert because nobody knows it's him. One day, a staff member discovers his identity as part of their duties and now knows Albert is Bob, which gives them a game advantage.
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Post Post #17 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:26 pm

Post by AniX »

That is the risk you take on when you use an alt.
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Post Post #18 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:48 pm

Post by RadiantCowbells »

In post 12, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:Zoraster, can we talk legal precedent for a moment?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p7096589

Given mods have been reprimanded for revealing hidden alts in games prior, where is the stance of the moderation team on this?

Because "Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity." makes it sound an awful lot like "mods won't go out of their way to look you up but if they happen to be privy to some knowledge that they wouldn't otherwise, fair game?

Like I just want to know what the standard moderation response to "A Moderator has revealed who I am to the other players in my game while I was playing on an alt" will be.
I'm with LLD. I don't think that this is a good rule for the Mafia half of the site.
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Post Post #19 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Post by AniX »

How do you propose Mafia side site mods make sure alts aren't joining games with their mains then?
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Post Post #20 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:56 pm

Post by N »

In post 18, RadiantCowbells wrote:
In post 12, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:Zoraster, can we talk legal precedent for a moment?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p7096589

Given mods have been reprimanded for revealing hidden alts in games prior, where is the stance of the moderation team on this?

Because "Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity." makes it sound an awful lot like "mods won't go out of their way to look you up but if they happen to be privy to some knowledge that they wouldn't otherwise, fair game?

Like I just want to know what the standard moderation response to "A Moderator has revealed who I am to the other players in my game while I was playing on an alt" will be.
I'm with LLD. I don't think that this is a good rule for the Mafia half of the site.
There is no change there though. The change, from my perspective as an ex-mod who was not involved in the rule change at all, is that mods don't have to know which banned user a troll is an alt of before they can ban them.
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Post Post #21 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:34 pm

Post by xyzzy »

I feel like the easiest solution if you're worried about this is to avoid joining a game with a forum moderator in it, and request that the game moderator not allow any forum moderators to replace into the game.
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Post Post #22 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:00 pm

Post by zoraster »

In post 12, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:Zoraster, can we talk legal precedent for a moment?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p7096589

Given mods have been reprimanded for revealing hidden alts in games prior, where is the stance of the moderation team on this?

Because "Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity." makes it sound an awful lot like "mods won't go out of their way to look you up but if they happen to be privy to some knowledge that they wouldn't otherwise, fair game?

Like I just want to know what the standard moderation response to "A Moderator has revealed who I am to the other players in my game while I was playing on an alt" will be.
It's a good question. A moderator shouldn't reveal who you are to others in your game. Generally their power of detection should be kept to themselves (and other mods) in their official capacity. Part of the problem before was revealing a secret identity to the game in general. The problem wasn't that the mod himself knew the identity of a secret alt.
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Post Post #23 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:18 pm

Post by Lady Lambdadelta »

In post 22, zoraster wrote:
In post 12, Lady Lambdadelta wrote:Zoraster, can we talk legal precedent for a moment?

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p7096589

Given mods have been reprimanded for revealing hidden alts in games prior, where is the stance of the moderation team on this?

Because "Also, it's worth noting that while staff members shouldn't use their position to try to gain an advantage in a game, their official duties may mean they discover your identity." makes it sound an awful lot like "mods won't go out of their way to look you up but if they happen to be privy to some knowledge that they wouldn't otherwise, fair game?

Like I just want to know what the standard moderation response to "A Moderator has revealed who I am to the other players in my game while I was playing on an alt" will be.
It's a good question. A moderator shouldn't reveal who you are to others in your game. Generally their power of detection should be kept to themselves (and other mods) in their official capacity. Part of the problem before was revealing a secret identity to the game in general. The problem wasn't that the mod himself knew the identity of a secret alt.
Where does this coincide with playing to your win condition? I mean, I'm not an advocate of meta but there's plenty who are and considering just how powerful that knowledge is... You could see where the player may be stuck in a situation where they now need to choose between not completely playing to their win condition and not breaking this rule?

How is this issue handled?
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Post Post #24 (ISO) » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:24 pm

Post by Lady Lambdadelta »

Additionally, looking at it from the other perspective, how do you reconcile the advantages this could grant a member of the moderation team?

And I'm not talking about abuse or breaking the rules states here, I mean that there now exist a set of players on site who may or may not have the knowledge of who you are, when much of the point of an alt is often to remove just that.

No matter how you look at it, it provides a significant consideration, even if the moderator DOESN'T know who the person is.

Because the mod is gagged on speaking about it, players are left to make their own assumptions about whether or not the mod knows the identity of the user and thus whether that factors into the strength of their read or how other people view them.

There's just no possible way it doesn't shift the dynamic of the game, at least in some small capacity.
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