Magic: The Gathering,GO TEAM MS!

[Thestatusquo]

I found RTR and gatecrash to both be remarkably boring because of how constrained you were into a very limited number of prepackaged archetypes. I like GTC more simply because I've played it less, but they both suffer from the same problems.

Hopefully adding DGM will allow us to actually be able to play fun limited magic again.

[Thestatusquo]

I have lost one match of IRL draft in the last 2 months. I have drafted every single guild at least 2 times in that time frame. I think that the heavy battalion deck is the third best in the format and the heavy bloodrush deck is the fourth best in the format. Frankly, I don't know what you're talking about. That said, I don't think gatecrash is good. I think it's meh. And boring. I also think RTR is meh and boring.

Also, you're proving my point. You just named 5 decks. That's all you can draft. (also, if you were drafting izzet as control you were doing it wrong) That's not real limited magic. That's not fun. You lose just because 2 guys 4 seats away from you whose signals you can't even read are picking the same gold cards as you. It's bullshit. It's drafting with training wheels. I can't wait til we can actually have real drafts again, where you can draft a good strategy and evolve with the draft instead of being like "Oh, one of the only 5 things I can possibly do in this format is being done by the guy in my left, better switch into the 2nd of the only 5 things I can do in this format and hope the guy to my right isn't in that one.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, lol. You thought golgari was viable.

[Thestatusquo]

M13 is a very underrated format. AVR was sweet. You had to be very resourceful to do well. It was a really big skill test format.

[Thestatusquo]

I mean, sure. But those decks aren't good, unless you get shipped the nuts.

[Thestatusquo]

I'll probably just roll some dice to figure it out.

[Thestatusquo]

GJ reck. You made a wildly unplayable card broken by cheating.

You win life.

[Thestatusquo]

This might be a cost thing, but wouldn't you much rather play Lillliana over Ajani?

[Thestatusquo]

They chump it. Like 90% of the value from pump spells come from the fact that you can surprise your opponent with them at instant speed. The track record of pump spells that are not instant speed that are playable in the 20 year history of magic is basically Rancor and um... rancor. Both sides of this card have been printed before and I've never seen then be used by anything except the worst draft decks. Most of our judgement of playability comes from heuristics. No, I haven't tested every card in every scenario. That's absurd. I have, however, been playing magic since I was 6, know in general what kinds of cards are powerful enough to make the cut, and I have experience with very similar cards that have been bad.

[Thestatusquo]

Here is a list of cards that gave double strike for sorcery speed. Not one of them was playable or played in anything.

Assault Strobe
R
Target creature gains double strike until end of turn.

Cleaver Riot
4R
All creatures you control gain double strike until end of turn.

Runes of the Deus
4 R/G
Enchantment
As long as enchanted creature is red, it gets +1/+1 and has double strike.
As long as enchanted creature is green, it gets +1/+1 and has trample.
(Granted, this one was playable in limited in a very slow format.)

Bonus: Both double cleave (1R/W) and Psychotic Fury (1R) were instants and not constructed playable, though they were both very good in limited because of that instant speed.

The question isn't "Is the effect I'm getting here good" because clearly double strike is a good ability. It's instead "is what I'm getting worth a card slot? By and large, such an effect does not have a large enough impact on the game to justify playing it over something that has a lasting impact (rancor). Pump spells in general are only played in the most aggressive of decks (like mono Green Stompy, or modern Infect) and they are both weak to removal and generally the worst cards in the deck to begin with, making them sorcery speed gets rid of the tiny amount of utility that they have.

But, you're your own player. Feel free to put the card in your decks. I don't think you'll be pleased with the outcome, but, if you are then all the more power to you.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't understand why anyone thinks this matters. If you're picking for value, RTR is far and away the best set to do it in. It's not even close. As for the shocks, they'll all be 15-20 by the time next modern season hits, so people who are talking about their price right now are being ridiculously short sighted.

[Thestatusquo]

Except I don't think that the one in nine chance of opening an 8$ card makes up for the fact that there are just tons more cards you'd rather open in RTR.

[Thestatusquo]

Except everything in GTC is falling whereas everything in RTR is rising. Also, RTR has like 6-7 cards that are eternal format playable, and will therefore continue to gain value forever. GTC has um let me check. Oh yeah, exactly 0.

Also, Reckoner is like a 8$ card now on ebay unless I'm much mistaken. As pretty much everyone predicted.

[Thestatusquo]

I won one, then went to a buddies house and we drafted with our prize packs and I won another.

Seems likely to just be dumb luck to me. No one knows the format yet so we're all just picking random cards. I'll have some impressions of the format up probably tomorrow that we can all argue about.

[Thestatusquo]

Might as well throw this out here just as I laughed at Klazam for. I need

3x wasteland
3x standstill
4x mutavault

to complete a legacy deck (two, actually)

Anyone happen to have some lying around I could trade for? Or if you see any in someones binder at a local shop pick them up for me and I'll trade you for them.

[Thestatusquo]

Yeah, I'm not looking to buy, I'm looking to trade. My store has em too. I was saying if you could trade for them

[Thestatusquo]

4-0 with this deck last night:

4x lord of atlantis
4x master of the pearl trident
4x merrow reejery
4x silvergil adept
4x cursecatcher
2x phantasmal image

4x aether vial
4x mana leak
3x vapor snag
2x spell pierce
2x spreading seas
3x cryptic command

14 island
4 mutavault
2 tectonic edge

WHEEE.

Not the stiffest competition, but I'm happy to be playing real formats again, and not the most boring and least skill intensive standard in recent memory.

[Thestatusquo]

Yes. What if you have thragtusks in your graveyard, but you want to take your opponents mana dorks for the sick rub ins? Decisions, decisions.

Either way, I really like how this deck plays. I love tempo decks. Several times when my opponent had ostensibly stabilized I could just sit back and wait to draw 1 lord for the island walk to finish them off in one swing with mutas. The deck is really fun.

[Thestatusquo]

That is pretty clearly the modern version.

This is the legacy version:

4x lord of atlantis
4x master of the pearl trident
4x merrow reejery
4x silvergil adept
4x cursecatcher
1x phantasmal image

4x aether vial
3x standstill
4x daze
2x spell pierce
4x force of will
1x dismember
1x Kira, great glass spinner

12 island
4 mutavault
4 Wasteland

The dismember and Kira being flex slots. I've been toying around with a singleton Jitte in the Kira slot. Pretty sure I like the one of dismember.

[Thestatusquo]

I've found standstill to be great.

[Thestatusquo]

Why? I don't see them going down anytime soon, and it seems really really stupid to trade them for standard stuff even if you think they are.

[Thestatusquo]

Demand isn't raising the price, it's supply.

It was just printed and readily available. Now, people have tended to hoard theirs and there aren't any more coming out, though I wager we might see it in FtV20.

[Thestatusquo]

You could have traded the jaces for goyfs.

[Thestatusquo]

Uh, the most played goyf deck in the format does not play jace, and the second only runs 2, typically.

[Thestatusquo]

Off the top of my head I can think of like 3 tier one legacy decks that run goyf but not jace.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, that sounds like a personal problem.

Also I want to pick up my goyfs just because of both modern and legacy playability. But I'mma wait for modern masters. I've cracked at least 4 of every mythic in RTR etc in drafts, so I figure I'll be able to do the same since my store says they'll be doing a lot of MM drafts.

[Thestatusquo]

Ok. Drafting tonight. I hope I've gotten a better handle on this format. My last two attempts (0-3, 1-2) did not go so well.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm off to the ptq. Wish me luck!

[Thestatusquo]

I went to two. I will have a detailed rant later tonight, dont worry.

[Thestatusquo]

I played blitz at Chicago PTQ and went 4-4 after a miserable start that involved me finding literally every imaginable way to lose a game of magic, including but not limited to blocking with a fiend hunter with a tusk under it because I didn't read the card and thought it went back to hand, forgetting to play a second land drop, not drawing colors, not playing a boros charm eot to give myself a chance to top deck a haste dude and win the next turn (which happened! yaaaay!) and many more. It is possible that a more experienced aggro player would have done much better than me, but I still dont think they would have top 8'd. The matches that are bad are just unwinnably so, and the decks mana base is so inconsistant that sometimes you just mull to 5 twice in a favorable one and don't get there. I have never played a deck more likely to lose to its own lands in my entire life (both in the sense of taking damage and not letting you cast spells.)

In Madison on sunday I played a Jund concoction of my own, where me and a buddy spliced the parts of jund aggro that we like (boar, experiment one, emisarry, hellrider etc) with the pieces of jund midrange we liked (liliana, Olivia, Bonfire. decay, putrefy etc) and the deck played beautifully. I took my first loss playing a buddy and car-mate playing a more traditional midrange jund list (which is a quite bad matchup, because he's just going bigger than I am and I'm not fast enough to beat his removal) rd 4. I reeled off two more wins and was sitting 5-1 with 16 people to be X-1 or better at the end of the round. Essentially, win and in. I got paired down. I asked my opponent if he'd be willing to scoop. He said no. That's fine. People want to play out matches for product, etc. But then he said that he was pretty sure an X-2 would make it, and he would have the best breaks because he was paired up against me. I was like uhhhh no, there's no way. And then the people sitting next to us were like, nah, you're dead bro. And he was just like "disagree" and kept shuffling.

He then proceeded to start his turn in the middle of my second main phase, and when the judge came over told him that I had said go. "Actually what I said was "ok" in response to an end of combat tragic slip. The judge said it was a communication error and that he wanted to put the card back on top shuffle the deck and rewind. I appealed. THE CARD HIT HIS HAND. That is the definition of "drawing extra cards" It's a game loss. Magic has rules. It is looking at extra cards if you see the card but it doesn't touch your hand. It is drawing extra when it touches the cards in your hand. There is a clear line. It is there for a reason.

Anyway, head judge comes over, asks us both what happened, and now he's like "oh, the card didn't touch my hand, I just peeked at it." The head judge asked the table judge what had happened (he had been watching the game) and he said that he would rule it hit his hand because he thinks if it were a miracle trigger he would not have let him reveal it. The head judge goes and talks to some people and comes back and rewinds the game, shuffles the deck and goes "play on."

Opponent rips angel of serenity off the top, hits both my deathrite shamans which had him at 8 with plenty of instants in the yard, and proceeds to smash me out of top 8 from there.

I am the most pissed I have ever been at magic and I considered quitting right there.

[Thestatusquo]

Wait, fuck. I totally blanked that this is where you are. We were at misty mountain games.

[Thestatusquo]

To be fair, though, I also didn't know I was going to madison til I was already at the Chicago PTQ and some guys told me they had a motel room and were leaving straight from there.

I didn't really have a chance even if I had remembered.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, it wasn't really the guys fault. Like, I don't think he was actively trying to cheat, which is probably ultimately why the judge decided to not game loss him.

But, it really should have been a game loss. The rules are really really clear on this point. It was entirely the judges fault.

[Thestatusquo]

I agree with some of that. I mean, I don't think its as cut and dry as he presents it. There's a reason that mono red aggro isn't the aggro deck of choice anymore, and it has a lot to do with speed and power. There is an inherent trade off between the three. The problem is that Naya Blitz doesn't bring

enough

more speed on power than RG aggro. It is only about a turn faster, and champion/mayor isn't enough more powerful than the rg shell to justify it, imo.

Jund is a whole other kettle of kippers. a) That deck is way more consistent than naya and b) the increase in power level over the other two is huge. I think jund aggro is a pretty good deck, though I haven't played with it much. A girl from my store did top 4 the PTQ with it the one I lost with blitz, though that doesnt mean much.

[Thestatusquo]

the double strike mode is almost always irrelevant. You have to be swinging with 5 power for it to be better than just doming them eot, and if thats the case there's no reason to spend the card.

[Thestatusquo]

Congrats! That's an awesome accomplishment.

[Thestatusquo]

What was the white for? didnt you just talk about how bad you thought naya was?

[Thestatusquo]

uhhhhh. Just as a white green source that also taps for reckoner? Interesting.

[Thestatusquo]

still. big ups, fate. congrats.

[Thestatusquo]

"I need to shuffle better"/"I'm going to practice shuffling" are two of the most misguided statements, probability wise, in the entire world of magic. If you shuffle correctly you SHOULD get mana screwed a significant amount of the time. That's what it means to have a sufficiently randomized deck.

[Thestatusquo]

Ratchet bomb isn't even that good?

[Thestatusquo]

I don't think you even need to sb around it. If you just get blown out by ratchet bomb in a way that you can't play around then you already get blown out by a large number of things (supreme verdict for one) and probably need to rethink your deck construction.

Went 4-0 with merfolk in modern last night. I don't understand why the deck doesn't get more play. It's sweet against so much of the format.

[Thestatusquo]

I posted it a few pages back. But no harm posting it again. It was RL BV. Monday at my LGS alternates between legacy and modern.

4x lord of atlantis
4x master of the pearl trident
4x merrow reejery
4x silvergil adept
4x cursecatcher
2x phantasmal image

4x aether vial
4x mana leak
3x vapor snag
2x spell pierce
3x spreading seas
2x cryptic command

14 island
4 mutavault
2 tectonic edge

I've been liking pierce less and less in the main though. Been toying around with 2 Kira in that slot.

[Thestatusquo]

I would be shocked if you showed up at the event missing just a couple reckoners and not be able to find some to borrow. I've walked into my store missing an entire mana base and gotten there.

[Thestatusquo]

The key is to have friends? I'm pretty good friends with most of the regulars at my store.

[Thestatusquo]

A) Jitte really isnt that big a deal.

B) So we've finally reached the point where magic has been dumbed down enough that we're making rule changes with the idea of enriching a shitty durly offshoot variant? Eff that.

[Thestatusquo]

Playing this at FNM tomorrow, because why the fuck not.

3 Mountain
1 Swamp
4 Maze's End
2 Izzet Guildgate
2 Gruul Guildgate
2 rakdos Guildgate
2 Simic Guildgate
2 Golgari Guildgate
2 Azorius Guildgate
2 Selesnya Guildgate
2 Orzhov Guildgate
2 Dimir Guildgate
2 Boros Guildgate
4 fog
2 supreme verdict
4 Devour Flesh
4 Saruli Gatekeepers
4 Urban Evolution
3 Dreadbore
4 Far // Away
2 pillar of flame
4 Mizzium Mortars
1 Putrefy

[Thestatusquo]

Just threw it together based on the block list. Any suggestions are welcome,

[Thestatusquo]

Oh man, I need a way to shove gatecreeper in there.

[Thestatusquo]

I think as constructed bant is actually a good matchup.

[Thestatusquo]

Ok, so here's the final list:

1 Mountain
1 forest
1 plains
1 Swamp
4 Maze's End
2 Izzet Guildgate
2 Gruul Guildgate
2 rakdos Guildgate
2 Simic Guildgate
2 Golgari Guildgate
2 Azorius Guildgate
2 Selesnya Guildgate
2 Orzhov Guildgate
2 Dimir Guildgate
2 Boros Guildgate

2 gatecreeper vine
2 terminus
2 supreme verdict
4 bonfire of the damned
4 Devour Flesh
4 Saruli Gatekeepers
4 Urban Evolution
3 Dreadbore
4 Far // Away
2 pillar of flame
1 Putrefy

Sb:
3 pithing needle
2 dispel
3 abrupt decay
4 sin collector
3 cracking perimeter

[Thestatusquo]

Perimeter comes in against control. In particular it and abrupt decay are your only answers to pithing needle.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't know that I agree. For one thing, bonfire hits planeswalkers.

[Thestatusquo]

WMCQ and PTQ this weekend. Taking this to both of them:

4 Blood Crypt
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Dragonskull Summit
2 Kessig Wolf Run
4 Overgrown Tomb
3 Rootbound Crag
4 Stomping Ground
4 Woodland Cemetery

4 Huntmaster of the Fells
3 Olivia Voldaren
2 Sire of Insanity
4 Thragtusk
2 Vampire Nighthawk

3 Bonfire of the Damned
1 Devour Flesh
4 Farseek
2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
2 Ground Seal
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Mizzium Mortars
2 Putrefy
1 Rakdos Keyrune
1 Rakdos's Return
2 Tragic Slip


Sb: 1 Acidic Slime
2 Appetite for Brains
1 Barter in Blood
1 Deadbridge Chant
1 Duress
1 Ground Seal
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Mizzium Mortars
2 Pillar of Flame
1 Rakdos's Return
1 Tragic Slip
1 Vampire Nighthawk
1 Vraska the Unseen

[Thestatusquo]

I'd go with DnT, just because I hate tron though.

[Thestatusquo]

so my buddy woke up late and we didnt get to the WMCQ on time, but we played in the TCG Platinum, and then I played in the PTQ sunday. I scrubbed out of the first event at 1-3, and though I was able to reel off 5-0 to start the PTQ, lost 3 straight to eliminate myself from contention.

I came away from the weekend with the strong impression that Jund is just not playable in current standard. It has poor matchups against too large a portion of the field. The new Junk aristocrats deck is a bad matchup (and I think one of the top choices in the format) Junk rites is pretty much an unwinnable matchup, and bant hexproof and the new aetherling control decks are slightly unfavorable as well. I would not play the deck again

[Thestatusquo]

It really depends on what environment you want to create. The bare minimum is 360, which allows you 24 packs of 15, meaning that you will see every card every draft. This is probably ideal if you're looking for an environment where it is possible to draft very intricate strategies (storm combo, for instance, where if you just don't see a kill con then you just have drafted a deck that literally can't win.)

A lot of cubes tend to be more than this, around 720, because this allows you to have a more dynamic draft format where different archetypes shine in each iteration of the cube.

If you're interested in cubing in general, I would strongly check out the magic box with Eck and TSG on mtgcast. They also have a "bare bones" cube posted which I think is a very good starting point. But there are lots of great cube informations in that podcast.

[Thestatusquo]

I am generally not a fan of set based cubes, just because I find they get stale really quickly.

[Thestatusquo]

Cube is great. It's everything edh wishes it could be.

[Thestatusquo]

TBH I think a lot of people get too caught up in cycles when they're building cubes. Like, there's no intrinsic reason why you shouldn't pick the best 720 cards, and damn all the rest. If you want lightning bolt and ancestral in your cube, that is not a reason to include giant growth and healing salve. Pick cards of equivalent power levels at that slot instead.

I think this is really something that is important when it comes to lands. A lot of cube builders feel the need to include every land from every cycle in the cube, and thats not necessary imo because different color pairs tend to want different things from their lands.

[Thestatusquo]

I like the idea of a combo cube in theory, but in practice I think it would play out very poorly. I think the majority of drafts would just be 1 or 2 guys who "got there" and 6 guys who are playing decks that almost literally do nothing.

[Thestatusquo]

Yeah, the problem is with all the blanks in there that are just viable in the combos, those decks would just be so inferior to the decks that "got there" that I think it would be an unfun play environment for most people in any given draft.

Someone gets his storm deck together and I'm trying to race him with my goblin guide followed by heartbeat of spring? Poop.

[Thestatusquo]

ugh. topical pop culture magic cards.

[Thestatusquo]

Shock probably isn't constructed playable. The 2 damage isn't why you played pillar.

Firefist striker is stronger in some scenarios, weaker in others. It's basically useless against decks like the aristocrats, for example. I don't know what should be in the main because I haven't tested it, but boldly asserting that one is just better than the other seems incorrect.

[Thestatusquo]

To be fair, the dealers were buying at 35 at the PTQ I was at a week or so ago. That suggests to me that they expect a price jump to at least 60. This set is just getting cracked way way too little. Thundermaw hellkite wasn't a 50$ card because it was played in everything, it was a $50 card because m13 wasn't cracked enough.

[Thestatusquo]

Seriously, why? Those are both horrendously unfun formats.

[Thestatusquo]

I assume its unsanctioned and with proxies?

[Thestatusquo]

I think that skills is good in the sense that it is an answer to problems the deck otherwise would just lose to. It serves the same function as pyreheart wolf did in really old builds last season. There are plenty of times where you just scoop to turn 3 smiter or turn four flashed resto/advent of the wurm or a thragtusk. Skills gives you an out in those situations, and is pretty good at piling on damage even when you don't have to play around those cards.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, then would Madcap just be a good sideboard card then?

Temple Garden is a forest that taps for Boros Reckoner, 'nuff said.

uh, no? Have you seen what the meta is like lately? Also saying "everyone has answers to it" is probably the dumbest reason to not include a card ever, since every tier 1 deck has answers to basically any card.

[Thestatusquo]

You don't get 2 for one'd if you play correctly. Saying "it has the potential to be blown out" is true of pretty much anything. The question is "is the effect I'm getting from this worth the risk of blowouts if I play correctly" In the case of madcap skills, forcing through x damage (usually 5 or more) that you otherwise would not have been able to get because of a blocker or flash creature is just worth it. especially game one, most decks don't have a ton of instant speed targeted removal anyway. If you get in 5 damage and then you get mortersed, its probably still good enough.

[Thestatusquo]

if you dont play MCS in limited you're a fish. The raw power level of that card is absolutely absurd, especially in the hands of someone who has any idea what they're doing. It can just steal games in the hands of someone who is just haphazardly turning things sideways, and in the hand of someone who simply knows how to play around removal it can just be legitimately dominant.

You're doing it wrong.

[Thestatusquo]

Like, I don't want to sound rude here, but if you don't play MCS in any limited deck with red in it then you are not a very good limited player.

[Thestatusquo]

Legacy merfolk is not an aggro deck.

[Thestatusquo]

I think the technical term for this is "got there"

[Thestatusquo]

I beat brian wong in the finals of an 8-4 recently, which is sweet. Seeing as I listen to him on podcasts and he's among the top 25 rated players on MTGO. This is the second former pro tour competitor I've bested in the last 3 weeks. (the other being David Gleicher of team CFB.)

http://oi44.tinypic.com/4m6us.jpg

[Thestatusquo]

I just think shes outclassed by Dormi and Ral Zarek and Jace at the very minimum in any archtype that would want that effect. The super aggressive red decks just want a creature at the top of their curve. I don't think shes bad, just there are better option.

[Thestatusquo]

Think of it this way. Dormi costs 3.

Also, 3-1 with fish last night. Lost to junk, which should be a fine matchup. I just didn't draw enough creatures. Beat a weird mill deck, Living end (which is pretty much a bye) and varulz jund, which was an interesting matchup.

[Thestatusquo]

I wouldn't play that in modern fish and I don't understand why you would. I have run into essentially no situations where I lost a game that I would have won if I could have that ability.

[Thestatusquo]

murica.

[Thestatusquo]

isn't pithing needle just better in pretty much every conceivable way?

[Thestatusquo]

I assume he was saying he is also playing aetherling.

[Thestatusquo]

trostani doesn't fit in that deck.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, its also just not trying to accomplish the same things as the rest of the shell.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't make constructive suggestions, I just tear other people down.

[Thestatusquo]

5:19:14 PM) Shea: Nacho just claimed scum
(5:19:17 PM) Shea: and hes not lynched
(5:19:22 PM) Shea: HES THE ONLY BLACK MAN HERE.

[Thestatusquo]

Standard right now is absolutely horrendous.

[Thestatusquo]

Legacy is not expensive. In the long run legacy is far far far far cheaper than standard.

[Thestatusquo]

If you buy those cards, you never have to buy cards ever again. Like, literally, the keep my legacy decks competitive I have to buy approximately 1 playset every block or so. For standard, you're generally dropping 300-500$ each block. Over the long run its not close. If you intend to play magic for a long time, legacy is much much much cheaper.

[Thestatusquo]

I wasn't talking about efficiency. I was talking about total cost. And using that rubric its 100% incoherent to say 'I don't play legacy because its too expensive.'

Something like what you just said might be true. I don't know. I do, however, know that the amount of enjoyment I get out of playing legacy is greater than what I get from playing standard by orders of magnitude,

[Thestatusquo]

The problem is that "casual game" does not mean "don't communicate with your opponent." You should still clearly enunciate everything you're doing and when. If you don't, any and all resulting confusion is your fault. (In this case, your opponents.)

[Thestatusquo]

I'm pretty sure that's incorrect. It's like if your opponent tried to cast abrupt decay with the wrong mana. The spell wouldn't "fizzle" (an outdated term, btw) it would go back to his hand because it was illegal for him to cast it like that in the first place.

There is a difference in how the game treats targeting something that afterwards becomes an illegal target (say, you give protection to it in response) and how it treats attempting to target something you couldn't target from the beginning, since choosing a legal target is part of casting the spell.

You cheated in this situation. Unintentionally. But the correct ruling would be to untap his lands and return the spell to his hand.

[Thestatusquo]

Nominate Fate for

Mike Long

[Thestatusquo]

This format seems stupid. Bulletins at 11.

[Thestatusquo]

Oh, I was talking about sealed. My frustration actually probably isnt a reflection of the format, but rather has to do with anger at my pool and the fact that I played poorly.

Standard? How about a combo deck that is viable. When is the last time we had a truly viable combo deck in standard that wasn't creature based? How about games that boil down to more than "I played/blinked my overpowered monster with a ridiculous CITP effect more times then you did" how about a format that gives you more options than "Aggro creature, midrange creatures, or control creatures" for archtypes.

[Thestatusquo]

I didn't say blinking thrags. I was very precise. Like 80% of the meta revolves around playing creatures with ridiculous CITP effects. The person who plays the most of these usually wins. Thrag, resto, acidic slime, angel of serenity. The format is almost entirely about these cards. If you're not running them you're losing to the virtual card advantage they create, and its just boring magic.

Also, I agree with a lot of what chamber said.

[Thestatusquo]

also, "diversity" is this red herring that people continually bring up to "prove" that a format is fun and healthy. Balls, I say. I would rather play a format with only a couple of completely different decks then one where there are ostensibly 10 decks, but they all have the same fucking game plan

Modern is diverse. Legacy is diverse. Vintage is diverse. All formats where the mana is incredible. Standard is not diverse. Standard is everyone doing the same thing and dressing up in different color prom dresses.

[Thestatusquo]

Magic doesn't care about players like us. They want 12 year old kids with mommy and daddy to buy them booster packs. Players like us buy singles, and magic could care less about the secondary market.

[Thestatusquo]

shot in the dark, here, because I assume most of you dont play constructed online, but I'm looking to borrow some angel of serenity and restos if anyones got them on Modo.

[Thestatusquo]

I have all of junk rites minus 3 angel of serenity and 4 restoration angel.

If you wanted to get those, I would certainly let you borrow it, in exchange for the same privilege.

[Thestatusquo]

For the record, the list I've been messing around with is:

4 Restorarion Angel
3 Angel of Serenity
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Thragtusk
4 Avacyn's Pilgram
1 Sin Collector

4 Farseek
4 Mulch
4 Unburial Rites
1 sever the bloodline
4 Grisely Salvage
2 Abrupt Decay

2 Cavern of Souls
4 Overgrown Tomb
4 Temple Garden
2 Godless Shrine
3 forest
4 sunpetal Grove
3 Woodland Cemetary
1 Vault of the Archangel

SB is mostly complete but needs 4 Voice of Resurgence but fuck if I am getting those. I'll probably run 4 other things instead. 4 voice is like 200$ of digital cardboard. O.o

[Thestatusquo]

3-0 with the fishies tonight. Beat Jund, RU Delver and WB tokens.

[Thestatusquo]

PS: I love beating $1750.00 stock jund decks with my 150$ fish list. So much. So So much.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, my list isn't budget. There's a difference between a budget list and a list that is cheap when optimized.

There isn't a single card I don't play in my deck because they're too expensive.

also, what the hell dredge deck is 300? Have you heard of a card called lions-eye diamond?

[Thestatusquo]

I repeat. Legacy is, in the long run, much cheaper than other formats.

[Thestatusquo]

Deathblade is fine. Legacy meta cycles. I doubt there will ever be a legacy meta where there isn't some form of esper control deck that abuses stoneforge mystic.

[Thestatusquo]

Although, from talking to you, I wonder if deathblade suits your play style. You always seem to be talking about piloting more aggressive decks. I would suggest something like RUG delver if I'm reading that right.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, I would suggest sleeving up a whole bunch of legacy decks proxied (elves!, Show and Tell, Deathblade, RUG delver, Shardless BUG, Tin Fins, Goblins, Fish, Maverick, Storm, Death And Taxes to name just a few) and play a couple games with each just to get a feel for which ones you enjoy playing before you start dropping money on cards. Nothing sucks more than dropping a couple bills on a couple gaea's cradles or show and tells to find out you don't even enjoy playing the deck that much.

Also, if you have a legacy scene in your area, get to know those players. Tell them you're interested in getting into the format. Most legacy players get super excited about getting new people involves, so you'll probably find at least a few of them willing to lend you decks/play against your proxied lists to help you figure out which direction you want to go. That's how I got into legacy in Chicago. A friend of mine just straight up loaned me over 2000$ RUG delver list for an SCG and I just fell in love with it.

[Thestatusquo]

Also Also, buddy of mine is rocking a sweet Ral Zarek-Stasis list. If I go to an SCG sometime in the near future, and I can borrow Jace's from someone, I'll probably play that. Just for the lulz.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't think all or even most decks do that, Sudo.

The only one which that is really true for that is a top tier deck is Elves! but that does has sort of been a pseudo-combo deck in every format its been in.

RUG delver and goblins are both very aggressive decks that don't have any sort of combo element.

The issue with decks like the one you mention, fate, is that they don't really have the tools to fight combo without U or B. A straight up aggressive zoo deck will almost always just lose to combo. You're playing three colors, and the two you're not playing are objectively the two best colors in the history of magic.

Which is not a debate, it's just true. In terms of all time, blue and black and just strictly better than anything else. Basically what I'm trying to say is that in legacy just balls to the walls aggression isn't good enough. The combo decks are just as fast if not faster than you are, so you need to pack significant disruption to get there.

I just looked through like 10 weeks of SCG open results and couple find a deck like that in the top 16. Sorrrries.

Dragon Stompy hasn't really been a deck in years.

[Thestatusquo]

mono red goblins (though often splashing W for thalia) is a deck. A very good one that can do very well in a field without too much combo. Same with mono red burn.

IIRC dragon stompy doesn't actually play dragons. I don't remember where the name comes from.

Also, if that is your goal, DRAGON SHIFT.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, I played Faerie stompy for a long time back in the day. It looks something like this:

22 Mana
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
9 Island
4 Chrome Mox
1 Seat of the Synod

18 Creatures
1 Shoreline Ranger
3 Cloud of Faeries
4 Serendib Efreet
4 Sea Drake
4 Trinket Mage
2 Weatherseed Faeries

20 Other Spells
4 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Pithing Needle
2 Psionic Blast

[Thestatusquo]

Neat Trick with Sea Drake is that since it says 2 target lands, and not up to two target lands, if you play it with a mox and either tomb or city, you don't have to return anything. Turn 1 4/3 flier!

[Thestatusquo]

They could make it the block of "people forcibly shitting down your throat" and I will still be happy as long as they put thoughtseize in it.

[Thestatusquo]

oh great. they ruined magic again.

[Thestatusquo]

oh great. they ruined magic again.

?

Ignore him, he hates everything.

It's funny because you totally don't get it.

[Thestatusquo]

Mainly I was making fun of the propensity of magic players to complain when they really don't even know what they're complaining about.

[Thestatusquo]

also, aetherling.

[Thestatusquo]

The mail-seclusion package just seems pretty bad. Seclusion is going to be a dead card some unacceptable percentage of the time, and your finishers don't need the help it gives. I'd rather play some more control elements or a finisher that is better than the mail.

[Thestatusquo]

Yeah, I can see that. I just don't think its necessary. With a control list like this, at the point where you're comfortable swinging, you just don't need the effect that it provides.

[Thestatusquo]

How is this better than the bant version?

[Thestatusquo]

Voice makes it not even close, imo. And unflinching courage/rancor are a pretty competting reason to play green.

[Thestatusquo]

In fact, technically, sharing accounts is against the TOS. If they were to find out you both were using the same account they would banz.

[Thestatusquo]

I doubt it.

[Thestatusquo]

I think devoting a sb slot in your deck to sphinx's is pretty poor considering it is very very narrow and you already have syncopate in the main which answers sphinx's pretty well and negate in the board which does the same. You just have to play in such a way where you know which cards are important to counter. There's no need to water down your deck with crap like notion thief which has no utility anywhere else.

[Thestatusquo]

I've got a jace I could trade you.

[Thestatusquo]

You quoted a price a dollar higher not an hour ago. XD

The main card I'm looking for is mutavault, or threads of disloyalty. I'd just trade straight up for equal value. Whats some stuff you're looking to get rid of?

[Thestatusquo]

Got a mutavault? I really need one. I'll trade jace and something else for it?

[Thestatusquo]

I ran it in the board of the mazes end deck I took to game day for Dragons Maze. It always did what I wanted it to do.

[Thestatusquo]

It was better when Junk was more of a thing. It's not amazing right now I don't think.

[Thestatusquo]

In general, the way I make a sb is different from the way you're making yours. I try to play several games (like a set of 10) pre-board in each match to see what cards in my main I think are under-performing. Sometimes this is easy (I.E. in the old Jund ground seal came out against everything but Junk and sometimes american flash) and sometimes this is less obvious (counters coming out against aggro, olivia coming out against decks with few creatures and a ton of spot removal) You do that for the most popular decks in the format, then you think of cards that would make those matches better to fill those slots. You look for as much crossover as possible (which is why I suggested taking out notion thief, because hes really only "just ok" against a few things, and good against one specific card which you already should be able to beat if you play correctly. You're just not getting enough bang for the sb slot) and try to decide which matches need the most help. You usually end up with a list of about 20-30 cards that you would conceivably like in the board. Then you try to figure out what configuration of those cards in your board will give you the best percentages to win over-all against the field. It's a long process, but its worth it.

For the record, I think against flash and other blue based control decks you should be siding in Pithing needle if you have it in your board. It's your best answer to Aetherling. Consequently, you should probably side out your aetherlings and try to win with planeswalkers and drownyard activations in that match.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, maybe. I don't know how I feel about pithing needle in this meta. It might be good, it might be meh. I'd have to test it. The key to playing a deck like this is knowing through testing what the key cards in a matchup are to counter, and saving your counters for them. In any matchup with a deck like this (besides hardcore aggro, for instance, and even then, you really dont want to let, say, hellrider or big daddy thunder resolve) there are like 2-3 cards which are must counters. His are PWs. Garruk can't resolve against Jund. It just can't. If you countered a turn 4 huntmaster (a card you can beat) and lost to the next turn Garruk (a card you can't) then you lost to your own play, not because your deck loses to planeswalkers.

Shrug.

[Thestatusquo]

Which might be a design flaw in the deck, and if your line leaves you open to letting a planeswalker resolve if you play your barter in blood, then don't play that line? It's really that simple. If playing barter in blood routinely causes you to tap out in dangerous situations against decks that can punish you then thats a pretty good argument for not playing it in the maindeck.

[Thestatusquo]

#blamenuwen

[Thestatusquo]

I think a major problem with the deck vs. creature based strategies is its inability to generate card advantage through killing multiple things at once. Barter is cute, but I'd be really interested in seeing if we can make mutilate work.

[Thestatusquo]

I say this after testing a few g1s on cockatrice.

[Thestatusquo]

I played like 8 preboard games against randos and like 3 against fate, this is what I'm rocking. Haven't attempted to touch the sb yet.

1 AEtherling
3 Augur of Bolas

4 Think Twice
2 Opportunity
2 Syncopate
3 Psychic Strike
4 Far // Away
3 Doom Blade
2 Warped Physique
1 Devour Flesh
1 Rewind
3 Mutilate
2 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Barter in Blood

1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage

4 Watery Grave
4 Drowned Catacomb
2 Nephalia Drownyard
5 Island
11 Swamp

[Thestatusquo]

Want to cut one spell slot for one more drownyard to get the land count up to 27.

[Thestatusquo]

It's possible. All the changes I just made were for testing. The main reason for alchemy is it gives us something early to do EOT if we dont have think twice. The games where we have think twice are just so so so much better than the games where we don't. Rewind is very good because all of our deck is instants. Its clunky, so one is probably the right number, but it lets us counter and still do things EOT, which is very nice.

[Thestatusquo]

#blamenuwen

[Thestatusquo]

try playing on camera... it's ridiculous.

[Thestatusquo]

also, a good way to get over that is to practice is while play testing. Have some sessions where each player has someone over their shoulder to tell them all the things they would have done differently after the game.

[Thestatusquo]

- Player Communication
There are three categories of information: free, derived and private.


Free information is information to which all players are entitled access without contamination or omissions made by their opponents. If a player is ever unable or unwilling to provide free information to an opponent that has requested it, he or she should call a judge and explain the situation. Free information includes:

• Details of current game actions and past game actions that still affect the game state.
• The name of any object in a public zone.
• The type of any counter in a public zone.
• The physical status (tapped/flipped/unattached ) and current zone of any object.
• Player life totals, poison counter totals, and the game score of the current match.
• The current step and/or phase and which player(s) are active.


Derived information is information to which all players are entitled access, but opponents are not obliged to assist in determining and may require some skill or calculation to determine. Derived information includes:
• The number of any type of objects present in any game zone.
• All characteristics of objects in public zones that are not defined as free information.
• Game Rules, Tournament Policy, Oracle content and any other official information pertaining to the current tournament. Cards are considered to have their Oracle text printed on them.


Private information is information to which players have access only if they are able to determine it from the current visual game state or their own record of previous game actions.

• Any information that is not free or derived is automatically private information.


The following rules govern player communication:

• Players must answer all questions asked of them by a judge completely and honestly, regardless of the type of information requested. Players may request to do so away from the match.
• Players may not represent derived or free information incorrectly.
• Players must answer completely and honestly any specific questions pertaining to free information.
• At Regular REL, all derived information is instead considered free.

Lying to a Tournament Official or intentionally misrepresenting Free or Derived information to your opponent in order to gain an advantage is considered Cheating - Fraud and carries the penalty of Disqualification. Even at REL. Do you think your opponent intentionally told you the wrong number of lands?

[Thestatusquo]

Technically I believe that if the judge doesn't believe it was sought out by the other player (I.E. he told his friend before hand to give him advice.) then there's no penalty for the player being told. In this case the correct course of action (assuming CEL) would be to give the player giving the advice a match loss in their next match. (Unless they are currently playing in one, in which case they would be given a match loss in the current one.)

If the judge feels that it was discussed between them before hand, then it is unsporting conduct major - cheating. They should both be DQd and investigated by the DCI.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, from your comments it sounds like they also committed unsportmanlike major - cheating by lying to a tournament official.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm pretty sure if you announced x as 2 you should have been allowed to pay x as 2. At CEL too.

[Thestatusquo]

Because you illegally cast the spell if you announced x as 2 and then played it as x as 1. It the same thing as what happened to fate a while back. Since paying the mana cost is part of casting the spell, you never actually cast it, because the mana cost of the spell you were trying to cast was 3 and you only paid 2.

I could be wrong but I'm reasonably sure about that.

[Thestatusquo]

yo reck.

http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/c ... andard-ub/

[Thestatusquo]

UB isn't really non-meta at all. The deck that LSV plays in that video is Cifka's 60 from the world championships.

[Thestatusquo]

It was played in the world champs like a week ago........

[Thestatusquo]

http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=1062594

Use it for ideas!

[Thestatusquo]

I dont think that will happen. Also, I'm pretty sure BV has mono U tron online. Maybe if you asked him pretty please he'd let you borrow it.

[Thestatusquo]

You can also check out A.J. Sacher streaming on twitch. He run infect in a few online PTQs, so you can go watch those.

[Thestatusquo]

FWIW Tiaga is only worth about 10-15 tix online, so this prize isn't nearly as good as it sounds.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, that is a kipper of an entirely different kettle.

[Thestatusquo]

Ok, who is doing this and wants to test?

[Thestatusquo]

I'm basically giving reck his whole deck and if you need any commons I can probably hook you up too. Compulsively drafting finally pays off.

[Thestatusquo]

I think I would go up to 4 sign in blood. There really isnt a reason not to play that many for a deck that gains as much life as yours does. I think Executioners swing is too slow for the format, and probably would want like victim of night over 1/2 of the murders.

Its also possible you want to cut a removal spell or two for a couple more creatures. Specifically, I think you need to be playing 4 Sereph of Dawn. That card is just bonkers in this format.

[Thestatusquo]

Just a PSA, tomorrow at noon is the deadline for signing up.

Read the link pie posted, email the guy your info. You don't have to have a deck list, so there's no reason not to get this out of the was ASAP so you don't forget.

[Thestatusquo]

Oh. My sleep schedule is out of wack. I thought today was sunday.

Still, there's nothing wrong with scaring people into not procrastinating.

[Thestatusquo]

Just over 9 hours to sign up.

Also, apparently the tournament is already over 50 people. Which is sweet and not sweet at the same time.

[Thestatusquo]

how do you know you don't have a local scene? Have you checked here:

http://locator.wizards.com/

Also, I looked up Newcastle NSW Magic the gathering on google (thats where your fb says you're living these days) and this store popped up:
http://www.goodgames.com.au/stores/nsw/newcastle.html

Maybe check them out?

You can also always play on magic online, which is the same as in real life (you pay for cards and to enter tournaments) but there's always someone to play with or a tournament to join, and you can do it in your undies.

The other question is kind of hard to answer specifically, since it all depends on what you want to do. I will try to lay a framework, give you opposite ends of the spectrum. Most people fall somewhere in the middle. All the money I'm quoting you is in USD. Some people can very easily spend 100s of dollars on cards for decks for tournaments (an average standard deck will probably run you around 500, modern like 700-800, legacy 1200-2000) Whereas some people are very happy just buying a few packs or starter decks or whatever, and playing very casually with their friends. That will only cost you like 30$. There is a format called draft where you build a deck from 3 boosters and some lands they provide you and then play a tournament with that deck, and that is very popular and fun. It runs about 15$ a pop. There was one guy at my store in Chicago that referred to his weekly draft as his "bowling league" because he just went, drafted, then gave any cards he got away to someone else.

I would definitely recommend something like buying a starter deck (they come with two ready to play decks that are not very good for a competitive tournament player, but will be totally fine for you and a buddy to sit down, read the walk through, and learn how to play and have fun. Another option that would work pretty well is find a local store (like the one I posted up top) and ask if they have any casual magic days. If they do, come in and watch for a little bit, then ask someone if they'd mind teaching you how to play. Magic players are usually very happy to do this.

Magic can be a ridiculously fun hobby and a ridiculously expensive one as well, but spending money on cards can be worthwhile if you're getting enjoyment out of playing them, and winning with them, but there are plenty of ways to enjoy the game without going broke too. It's all up to you.

[Thestatusquo]

Depends very much on the decks on either side of the table. Two decks that are not very aggressive can pretty easily play a game that goes hours. There's a casual format called Commander which is multiplayer and those games tend to take a very long time. In a tournament setting a round (consisting of a best of three game match) is 50 minutes long, though very aggressive decks can win a game much quicker than that.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm really excited.

[Thestatusquo]

i've been trying to tell you to play deadly recluse since you started testing the deck.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't know since I haven't played your deck, but I'd be tempted to run a 2/2 split.

[Thestatusquo]

I got all o' dat.

[Thestatusquo]

Hasn't answered you or what? Mine can't play til tomorrow.

[Thestatusquo]

I am considering going to the games shop locally for Friday Night Magic. Just thought I'd let you know...

I am intrigued.

Do it!

[Thestatusquo]

I still dont understand why you dont play serif of dawn.

[Thestatusquo]

any reason mist raven/blindhunter bat didnt make the cut?

Also, I think you should reverse the numbers for tragic and murder.

Also, 4/4 for 4 in pauper is actually a house. There's like one thing that trades with it straight up, and that requires 3 mana.

[Thestatusquo]

I'd probably trade for a playset of geists.

[Thestatusquo]

Not for deathrites though, since I think those are going up and I think Geist will drop significantly when it rotates. It's played in modern and legacy but not nearly at the same level deathrite is.

[Thestatusquo]

I got you.

[Thestatusquo]

FrankerZ

[Thestatusquo]

Because given that you have creatures its just better in every way, and at the point where the deck doesn't have any creatures chainwalker isnt going to win the game anyway?

[Thestatusquo]

Both Travis Woo and his brother Elliot top 8 GP oakland, even after they hit round 13. That's sweet.

[Thestatusquo]

Does anyone else think that "the god cards" sounds way too close to yugioh for comfort?

[Thestatusquo]

You should probably see what the singles selection at your local shop looks like before purchasing cards off the Internet. Or, ask players at that store what they use to buy cards, since it'll surely be more efficient and cost effective then any way we can guess at from here.

[Thestatusquo]

Is anyone interested in going to GP DC? Format is legacy and I'm looking to get a motel room with some guys or stay with someone in the area if that magical opportunity exists.

[Thestatusquo]

make a cheap legacy deck. Or go and play side events. Its a GP. its like a giant magic party whether or not you play the main event.

[Thestatusquo]

RD 2 pairings up.

[Thestatusquo]

Looks like we all managed to miss each other again.

[Thestatusquo]

lol

[Thestatusquo]

Took my match down against dedicated UB mill.

[Thestatusquo]

Couple more days and send a message to the organizer. If you send an email and your opp doesnt then you win the rd and your opp gets dropped.

[Thestatusquo]

Well done sudo. They call that "playing well and getting rewarded"

I'm pretty sure, anyway.

[Thestatusquo]

HUZZAH!

[Thestatusquo]

Some mono U deck? Different from the one I'm running?

[Thestatusquo]

Reprint the moxes or bust.

[Thestatusquo]

Mythic spoiler has thoughtseize up. I checked out the background on mtgs, and it seems sketchy, but mythicspoiler has never lied to me before.

[Thestatusquo]

Unless they reprint fallen empires.

[Thestatusquo]

you should almost never buy sealed product. thats for damn sure.

[Thestatusquo]

Yep. Or that one time I really needed arbor elves for a deck and the vendors didnt have any and no one had any so I cracked three packs that I had been saving to draft with and got there.

[Thestatusquo]

^

its an aggressive deck. Given two effects that are similar, you prefer the one that turns sideways.

[Thestatusquo]

Is that cuz of gambling laws or something?

[Thestatusquo]

The issue is I dont think its better than Kiln Fiends and Cyclops. That deck already has Wee Dragonauts that it doesnt play.

[Thestatusquo]

Yes. Is that better than Kilnclops?

[Thestatusquo]

But its objectively worse than waiting for all the cards to be revealed.

[Thestatusquo]

I see that you are an EDH player.

[Thestatusquo]

MaRo just officially spoiled thoughtseize.

https://twitter.com/maro254/status/3739 ... 98/photo/1