Newbie 1964 - Dead PT

[skitter30]

the micc force-replace was entirely my fault, sorry :/

karange had a notes pt; i usually add the listmod to all pts and i added micc to that one instead of penguinpower by mistake

micc found the pt and felt he was comrpomised and asked to be replaced

[Micc]

Existence of a note PT all but confirmed Karnage as Town to me. Had to replace out even though I was slowly getting to that point with my read. This game was tough to play because getting any sort of Town momentum was really hard, but I thought we might be getting there. Then the wheels really fell off after I was out, and now I think Town is in pretty bad shape with this lylo.

[Billy Pilgrim]

Jem came in and started playing. Real upgrade from Gyro. If Jem is scum he deserves to win because town just sat there waiting for things to happen.

[Micc]

I didn't take a hard enough look at the day 2 deadline scramble to feel comfortable making that judgment. If that's the case, then I think it points to bepwei being scum and doing a lot of work to keep momentum from building anywhere and leading to the poorly executed mass claim and deadline Karnage lynch.

[Karnage]

we're crossing the vantasner danger meridian, fingers crossed...

[Micc]

ahh the ole two post lylo. fingers crossed I suppose but that hammer post looks bad for town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think we should have more mod leverage about force replacing slots not contributing to the game: I think creating situations like this where scum win by not playing the game at all is incredibly shitty and simply not playing a game you signed up for shouldn't really be a 'strategy'

[RadiantCowbells]

Not faulting Jamelia who I thought played well.

[RadiantCowbells]

Shouldn't have let myself be bullied into lynching Karnage when I knew it was strictly inferior to lynching Bepwei but I can't really change that now

[Karnage]

this is from my PT:

a question for post game:

do we have an obligation as SEs in a newbie game to advocate for policy lynches? to enforce the standards of play at mafiascum? part of me says yes but another part says no because once you get outside of newbie games I always feel like the "standards" get thrown out anyways

curious what you all think

[RadiantCowbells]

I feel like

We shouldn't have to push policy lunches

Unless we're talking like policy lynching someone who quickhammers a doctor for example.

I think removing a slot like Gyro is the mod's job

[RadiantCowbells]

This remains true if Gyro wasn't in fact scum

[Micc]

I think we should have more mod leverage about force replacing slots not contributing to the game: I think creating situations like this where scum win by not playing the game at all is incredibly shitty and simply not playing a game you signed up for shouldn't really be a 'strategy'

I don't think that's really an option in the newbie queue. Kinda just gotta use it as a teaching moment in the post game. Even outside the newbie queue its a really tough ask for the mod to make a judgment call about what counts as contributing. As much as I hate it, not contributing to the game is a scum strategy that works. I think it's the responsibility of the town to 1)meet the standard themselves and 2)lynch people who don't meet the standard. That's a bit of theory I've moved quite a bit on in the last couple years, but I like my current take.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think the real solution then becomes to refuse to play with players who don't contribute because they're going to fuck over whatever alignment they end up rolling

[RadiantCowbells]

I remember playing with certain players I was pretty much just ignoring them until they got replaced for flaking and I just don't think it's healthy

[Micc]

this is from my PT:

a question for post game:

do we have an obligation as SEs in a newbie game to advocate for policy lynches? to enforce the standards of play at mafiascum? part of me says yes but another part says no because once you get outside of newbie games I always feel like the "standards" get thrown out anyways

curious what you all think

I play SE pretty similar to how I played IC. I'm heavily focused on holding newbies to the really core/basic concepts of the game. "Why do you think that thing is alignment indicative", "How do you expect this game to progress forward if you aren't actively helping make it happen?" and the like. So yeah, I'd say I do my best to promote a good standard of play when I can. Those core/basic concepts or the standard of play do break down outside the newbie queue for a lot of players, but the one's who do that well understand what they're doing and do it for a purpose.

[RadiantCowbells]

Anyway I'm glad Jamelia won, I felt bad that he lost his last scum newbie to essentially a newbie misinterpreting me switching accounts as a ragequit and townreading me for it and voting him when he was universally TR all game.

gg

[Micc]

The key, I think, is to identify who or what is making the good games enjoyable and seek those things out in your future games.

this will always be true fwiw. newbie queue doesn't offer much discretion over who you play with, but the other queues do and I think its an important part to enjoying this otherwise frustrating game.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't claim that it's because of everyone else rather than me but the amount of people I can enjoy playing mafia with is pretty narrow. I probably shouldn't sign up given that I don't remember the last time I actually enjoyed a game.