Open 720: NOIR (GAME OVER)

[ceejayvinoya]

Did you prefer the FFI or FFIX ref Ceejay? V important

FFIX best FF tho I did get the FFI reference.

Btw I want to hear from you on why Oxy is scum.

[the worst]

Oof...IV is my favourite. Guess I'm foreveralone.

I'll have a better read of Oxy when he talks to me (if he isnt scared of me. ). Pardon me for being dismissive but any case or explanation I give now would be lacking compared to one I can give shortly.

[Oxy]

You wanted the analysis...

So you're town reading him for giving a town read without explanation in a confident fashion?

No I'm saying a confident town-read early in the game is anti-scum. Scum don't want to clear people, and they don't want to put a spotlight on their scumpartners, the easiest and simplest way to do this is to say little of note about them. One of the hardest and probably most dangerous for scum ways to do this is to give confident townreads.

This is bunk because
a) there's really no downside to having a strong town read D1.
b) wifom
c) if it becomes convenient to try and mislynch/bus, there will be more recent posts to allow changing a read
d) there's not actually any evidence that he held you as a strong read at that point
e) wifom

165 is a strong push against a quick wagon who had one of his townreads already on it, this is what I'm getting at with anti-groupthink

And this is bunk because the vote was based on a potential town slip being misunderstood to be a scum slip (or a reaction test, w/e) and the only reasonable view from either alignment is that the vote was bad.

So yeah, my conclusion from this exercise is that I should be very careful to check your work before sheeping any of your reads, even if you end up conf!town.

[Alonzo]

330 am, Read complete to this point, Q&A session 2moro

[the worst]

Seeya tomorrow dude

[Oxy]

Oof...IV is my favourite. Guess I'm foreveralone.

I'll have a better read of Oxy when he talks to me (if he isnt scared of me. ). Pardon me for being dismissive but any case or explanation I give now would be lacking compared to one I can give shortly.

You want to talk about my not having sorted you yet?
I'm not working on a well cited paper with footnotes for you about why fumuki is my strongest town read right now.

[the worst]

I'm concerned that your biggest concern seems to be my read on you.

This is starting to ping me.

Why do you think this is a concern and not a topic?

the worst, asking them for the posts that make you look town is an exercise to both to help me sort you, and to continue building my reads on them. The game is long, and I'll get to different slots as I get to them.

I'm concerned that your biggest concern seems to be my read on you.

Yo talk to me

This game has been quiet, you and I have posted a lot. I'm also pretty introverted so get very strong feelings based on how players interact with me.

Give me a strong read and justify it with textual evidence. :3

Your read list was bad for a few reasons which I'll go into shortly~

Oxy I'm concerned you stated a nullread on me yet keep quizzing people on me while ignoring your other nullreads.

I believe you have a read on me. Your readslist was shonky and I do not believe it stated how you actually feel about players. cough up buddy

[the worst]

Wallcasing Fumuki would be boring. Just give me a stance.

[Oxy]

1) define concern vs topic
2) What is the benefit of me doing this homework assignment when I've already given the tl;dr on why fumuki is my strongest read.
3) You're wrong? You're charismatic, and that's great, but you're not bleeding town for me and I'm working on sorting you.

Tell me why my read list is shit.

[Oxy]

This is not the game of scum!fumuki claiming scum
claiming slayers
Executing the switch from trolly posts to more serious posts, back to a middle ground in an emotionally and tonally manner consistent with town.

here's a stance

[the worst]

I'm charismatic? ^_^ thankyou!

Not actively coaching someone I'm starting to scumread though, I'm sorry. If you're town show me your townie gamesolving mindset!

I hate being condescending but I am curious to see your stance. You strike me as a generally clever individual. What do you define as concern vs. topic?


pedit: and another one pls

[Oxy]

I don't have another strong read at this point to take a stand on.

[the worst]

See thats a big problem. I notice you've got townreads/leans on a number of players, but it feels like every reason you give comes with a reason you could be wrong. This is a scummy behaviour. It indicates avoiding accountability which comes from a survival>gamesolving mindset.

[Quick]

I'm charismatic? ^_^ thankyou!

Not actively coaching someone I'm starting to scumread though, I'm sorry. If you're town show me your townie gamesolving mindset!

I hate being condescending but I am curious to see your stance. You strike me as a generally clever individual. What do you define as concern vs. topic?


pedit: and another one pls

They gave a reads list with explanations, you are being unreasonable.

[Oxy]

See thats a big problem. I notice you've got townreads/leans on a number of players, but it feels like every reason you give comes with a reason you could be wrong. This is a scummy behaviour. It indicates avoiding accountability which comes from a survival>gamesolving mindset.

Have strong reads - You're too confident in your reads! You must be scum because only they could be that confident
Don't have strong reads - You don't have strong reads! you must be scum because they benefit from not having strong reads

Both lines of argument are awful at this point. Turns out, the strength of my reads are determined by the town tells other people give off in a particular game, and my ability to pick up on them.

[the worst]

Another concern I have is that you don't seem to find it easy to talk to your townreads. You've made no effort to reach out to Fumuki/Sando/Korina to discuss the goings on of the game and yet you reached out to our favourite Renaissance artist? It's just very strange unconscious behaviour.

[the worst]

@Quick please don't WK - there is a lot I want to talk through with Oxy - if I believe I am wrong I'll be the first to admit it.

[Quick]

Another concern I have is that you don't seem to find it easy to talk to your townreads. You've made no effort to reach out to Fumuki/Sando/Korina to discuss the goings on of the game and yet you reached out to our favourite Renaissance artist? It's just very strange unconscious behaviour.

I disagree.

[Oxy]

Pin is a person who I have spoken to prior to the start of this game, and who I enjoy engaging with.

Replace korina with vivi to better represent my reads at this point

I've literally just began the process of engaging two of the three people (on the proper list)

[Oxy]

actually, Pin is the only person in this thread who I have spoken to prior to the start of this game.

[ceejayvinoya]

Why are we dragging scumtells out of reads lists? Asking why a person is tr or sr is fine I guess. But to go and say "I don't like this list. You're scum" won't help us.

[the worst]

See thats a big problem. I notice you've got townreads/leans on a number of players, but it feels like every reason you give comes with a reason you could be wrong. This is a scummy behaviour. It indicates avoiding accountability which comes from a survival>gamesolving mindset.

Have strong reads - You're too confident in your reads! You must be scum because only they could be that confident
Don't have strong reads - You don't have strong reads! you must be scum because they benefit from not having strong reads

Both lines of argument are awful at this point. Turns out, the strength of my reads are determined by the town tells other people give off in a particular game, and my ability to pick up on them.

I agree strong reads are only valuable when you actually believe them but evasive reads which contain reasons to withdraw them later are a far better scumtell than confidence!

In a manner of simplifying, town tends to present as genuine while scum prefers to present as correct.

[Oxy]

re: 446 So then what about my reads reads as insincere?

[Sando]

This is bunk because
a) there's really no downside to having a strong town read D1.
b) wifom
c) if it becomes convenient to try and mislynch/bus, there will be more recent posts to allow changing a read
d) there's not actually any evidence that he held you as a strong read at that point
e) wifom

K...

a) Yes there is, I said why
b) K
c) really? If duckling turns around now and says "gee Sando your attack on Oxy is deserving of a lynch" you're not going to be a little suspicious?
d) he expressed it and continues to back it up, that's kinda what we're looking for here.
e) K

And this is bunk because the vote was based on a potential town slip being misunderstood to be a scum slip (or a reaction test, w/e) and the only reasonable view from either alignment is that the vote was bad.

So yeah, my conclusion from this exercise is that I should be very careful to check your work before sheeping any of your reads, even if you end up conf!town.

So hang on, duckling points out why someone was wrong (and you agree he's correct), but I'm wrong to think that gives him townpoints?

I've also specifically stated that my scum-reads are pretty bad, I'm not asking anyone to sheep me on them.

[the worst]

Why are we dragging scumtells out of reads lists? Asking why a person is tr or sr is fine I guess. But to go and say "I don't like this list. You're scum" won't help us.

The intent behind readslists is = important to the content of the list

Unless you know the posters alignment