Mini Normal 2005: Fun With Decimals(game over)

[Mumble]

Hi.

I'm Town Miller.

[Mumble]

Not sure what the difference is, but the one that appears as guilty in all cop investigations.

[Mumble]

VOTE: UnaBombaH

[Mumble]

n-not like I know una's town or anything like that but I t-tr him b-b-baka

Bakajanai no. Shinde kudasai.

[Mumble]

You started it.

VOTE: MariaR

I'm finishing it.

[Mumble]

Dunnstral is town.

VOTE: Ruby Red

[Mumble]

2) Because I forgot that Mumble even posted let alone did that or I would've called him out on it.

Catching up for today, but this stood out.

You forgot that I posted? Anything? 9 pages in?

[Mumble]

After our little engagement no.

Halfway through my catchup...though I am being a bit lazy with it.


Read anything on page one that catches your attention?

[Mumble]

ftr i asked for the games because of mumble's read, was guessing it's meta based and not based off of just this game

Why did you care about my read? Why not ask me about it instead of asking for meta?

Slight townlean due to 49.

This makes 0 sense.

Well, what I'm getting at is, it's a bad idea to be confident in early game reads, especially ones THIS early.

Not sure if you are a new player or an alt, and I know how awkward it is as an alt to be asked if you are an alt, so I won't ask you, but I will say that if you are new, you should try to maintain an open mind as much as you can, and that will significantly lower your chance of going down in flames. (I know because I used to do that all the time before I figured this out.)

for the record i asked smart what his read on me was because this post is kind of tmi on me being town

he doesn't seem to consider the chance that fake confidence could come from a wolf

still think kokichi is more likely to flip wolf but either works

VOTE: something smart

This strikes me as a good post.

wagons are pro-town, there was already one starting on the one person, what would the point be in starting another?

This is making my tr stronger.

@zoro he makes a contradiction. Says una is wolfy then says Asuka's vote on una is a bad vote.

Like kokichi.

kokichi is lock wolf to me, don't understand how people are townreading him. like, this is ---literally--- a classic faked push. let's review the reasons he's given why i'm a wolf:

Dislike ruby more. "lock wolf"

Wow the game already started. I am late the party.. Let me catch up

Please do!

I'm okay with Ruby red now

Why are you ok now?

towny
In post 169, UnaBombaH wrote:
Dunn is likely town.

wolfy

Not a fan of the Dunn/Ruby turnaround...need to hear more of a reason from both as to why.

Ausuka is town.

Done...though I was lazy on page 8 and skimmed quite a bit.

[Mumble]

Do you... want me to explain it?

If you...want me to understand it.

[Mumble]

VOTE: Zoronos

I am either a town read or a scum read. For you to have me as null is horrible. Your entire post now reads as fake.

[Mumble]

I am either a town read or a scum read.

Why?

I claimed Town Miller on page 1.

Not a fan of you or Maria at this point.

[Mumble]

I know you claimed Miller. That doesn't automagically move you off null.
I haven't decided if I believe you yet, and I'm not interested in playing PR bingo about it nor do I feel particularly time pressured to decide if I believe you *right now*.

Talk to me about that Maria read -> why do you think she's scum?

My doing that should establish your read on me as either:

Town: claiming because that's what a town miller should do; or
Scum: fakeclaiming to try and get town to ignore him.

There is no null there.

I don't like Maria because she legit said she didn't remember anything I said despite my claim and our interaction.

Enjoy my vote park. Not moving.

[Mumble]

Can you point out where those Maria posts happened?
I'm curious about this interaction. I have some ~thoughts~ but they'd be premature without seeing specifically what you're referring to.

Absolutely not. We're less than 15 pages in, and if you actually cared, you can easily find it. ISO and game searches exist (especially since I already called it out).

If you don't care to one of those, then I can't see anything else than feigned care.

[Mumble]

@something_smart

I want to talk about Mumble for a second. Not because I'm at a conclusion yet, but because I want to get this reasoning written down, and you might have some useful feedback. I was hoping he'd come back and confirm I was looking at the right post, but he didn't, so w/e.

I asked him about his Maria read last night specifically because he seems to be viewing the game through a lens centered on his own play. His objection to Maria seemed based on Mumble not being able to fathom someone missing one of his posts on accident, ergo the only remaining explanation was that Maria had noticed his Miller claim then lied about not seeing it (ergo, scum). His only non-joke post at the time of his objection was his miller claim. By my read, they had a joke interaction on page-2 or so, but that's not conclusive evidence (to me) that she actually saw the Miller claim.
Moving on, his objection to me was that he couldn't fathom the notion that I hadn't made up my mind on him as a player yet. By virtue of claiming miller, I was required to have a positive or negative sort on him, immediately. He picked his name out of my larger post on the entire field. Again, this suggests he's viewing the game strongly through a notion that everyone should have an opinion on him by now, and be paying high levels of attention to his posts.

This seems to indicate that he is operating under a high degree of projection / illusion of transparency. An town miller in his seat could, knowing full well he is actually a miller, presume that everyone else obviously knows that same thing (and being important, would be paying attention to all his posts). Projection and illusion of transparency with a bias towards 'clearly I am town' in my experience tend to come from, well, town.

Obviously, there's a other side of the coin situation where a scum fake claims miller, tries to establish credibility, and then coasts on the claim. His posting is largely self-focused, however, my initial evaluation is that this is less likely since he's basically accusing everyone else of things in a reasoning-from-self fashion, rather than by reflecting on his own posting. He doesn't appear self-conscious *at all*, if any the opposite is true. He wants everyone else to be conscious of him.

Why are you asking for feedback on this? You asked for non-directed, open ended feedback on your "reasoning" for not taking a stance. Why not just say "Here's where I'm at" and take a stance, instead of presenting two possibilities and asking for feedback? That comes across as you positing a stance and seeing which one you should solidify.

[Mumble]

My feedback? This is fantastic post, with very solid reasoning. Nicely done

What's your read on me? Solid. No outside feedback.

[Mumble]

mumble is lockvilla. it shouldn't even be a discussion.

Are you an alt? If you don't want to answer, don't. But, if you are I think I know who you are.

[Mumble]

Why are you voting the second towniest player in the game...

2nd towniest...really?

Why?

[Mumble]

And it's impossible for people to not have a firm opinion as to whether your claim is real or not?

No.

I'm not saying the read shouldn't be fluid as we progress, but there should be one.

[Mumble]

Great.

Why is he 2nd?

[Mumble]

Which analysis is really good? Or, are you talking overall?

[Mumble]

Why aren't you voting?

[Mumble]

Why am I asking for feedback? Because talking to other players is more effective than just shouting my opinions into the void.
Also, you are completely mischaracterizing that post. I very much took a stance in it.
Do you need me to make that stance more explicit?

Just tell me why Smart, specifically.

[Mumble]

UNVOTE:

For now.

I like Ruby...I don't like where her vote sits...and sits. Re-examine tomorrow.

[Mumble]

eat a rope

VOTE: Zoronos

This is an awful vote. Like, I want to see your reasoning to see if it's even plausible to come up with a reason to vote him there.

Why was this awful, and mine not?

[Mumble]

Mr Moisto could be lurkwolf
Ruby Red v
Mumble lock v
ArcAngel9 v
Ausuka lock v
UnaBombaH weird
MariaR deepwolf potential
Kokichi Oma w
Zoronos going for deepwolf?
Dunnstral still probs v
Lapsa still probs v
Something_Smart v
Espeonage could be lurkwolf

thinking all scum are in (moisto, una, maria, kokichi, zor, espeon). it'll be an easier sort when people stop lurking.

I'm fine reciprocating the lock town read here (though help me with Ausuka as a lock town read). I like the scum list.

[Mumble]

What is deep wolf

This is interesting because I've heard the term several times on this site.

From my understanding, a deep wolf is someone who comes across as strongly town, but is actually mafia (wolf). As in, I think the wolf team is x and y, with a or b being potential deep wolves based on there play.

[Mumble]

How do you know this? Want to call this a joke before I question this further?

I said what my role PM said, and what you posted afterward doesn't contradict it. A gunsmith is not a cop.

This could be Mumble scolding a scumpartner for acting weird.

This could be Mumble not scolding a scum partner but asking a question to try and sort a player. (see how easy that is to do?)

Someone might read that as town, because it's so bold, but I think this is very likely scum trying to pose.

You're an idiot and I invite you to read any and all of my scum games.

[Mumble]

One question: Why did you start with me for your ISO read through if you had an initial town read on me?

[Mumble]

I'm fine with a Kokichi lynch. We have two days left and it's the weekend.

VOTE: Kokichi

[Mumble]

One question: Why did you start with me for your ISO read through if you had an initial town read on me?

Because it was actually, really, completely random.
I clicked "Activity Overview" and then a post count at random.

Just curious as to why your first thought wasn't to ISO the player you're voting.

[Mumble]

2 days left, why rush a lunch on someone you said could be town?

Because we have two days left and it's the weekend when players are usually not around much. I don't want to have a deadline rush lynch, and I definitely do not want a no lynch.

I'd prefer a Una lynch at this point, but I don't think support for that is going to happen.

[Mumble]

Are you people kidding me? Kokichi sits as a non-threatened but leading lynch for most of D1, there is a last minute push (less than 2 days left) on a new wagon that grows steam.

I'm not a great player, but that super stands out. There is 100% definitive scum in the vanity wagons.

Cool. Wanna help me kill Una?

Yes.

VOTE: Una

[Mumble]

Claim, please.

[Mumble]

Claim, please.

I don't want to

Why not?

[Mumble]

VOTE: Lapsa

Self-voting and refusing to claim as town is crap, so you're either scum or I don't care to play with you.

[Mumble]

Cool.

Mora => Maria => xxxx wins the game

Guessing if they both somehow flip town Dunn is the best revisit but I would not revisit until then :s

Gonna lurk out and let more people check in.

I agree with this.

[Mumble]

VOTE: Morality

[Mumble]

Can we please just lynch Morality/Boon/Flavor Leaf already? If he's going to mess with us and cause confusion, it's better to just get rid of him now.

[Mumble]

I’m no longer the optimal lynch due to apparently something confirming three scum.

You are scum. You are not a sk.

[Mumble]

Lynch this please.

[Mumble]

Holy crap! Lynch Boon.

[Mumble]

Lynch this please.

Hilarious. We did not get along well this game.

We didn't interact much this game, and you being scum doesn't help.

Fingers crossed for next time!

[Mumble]

He's L-2. I want the hammer. :3

jfc...why does it matter?

[Mumble]

So can you...guy who has made no positive contribution to the game.

[Mumble]

I wish everyone would send in for fast nights, but other than that i'm fine.

Doubt you will get

everyone

, but I will.

[Mumble]

Duck....hammer!

[Mumble]

Fast Nights

[Mumble]

Go ahead. If Boon is causing that much of an issue, I’ll either be dead or write stuff tomorrow.

I literally just got home... and there's the hammer.

Type

Code: Select all

[b]Fast Night[/b]

Please.

[Mumble]

fast nights

VOTE: Morality

DOWN WITH MORALS

I mean...you saw nsg's post right above...should have waited to make sure everyone posted "fast night" before hammering.

Again, unlikely it would have happened, but would have been better to pressure everyone to.

p-edit

What nsg said.

[Mumble]

I thought the Ruby persona was fine. No need to apologize.

[Mumble]

The overview I got from it is that Kokichi spent a *lot* of time arguing with Maria and NSG / Ruby.

Maria entered today with the intent to try and mislynch me. Look at her D1 posts about me (and interactions...where she originally didn't see I claimed Miller), then look at her D2 opening posts, and then how it progressed after.

Solid bet she's scum.

[Mumble]

Why did night end early if there were holdouts? Is the timer off, or did they vote for fast night?

[Mumble]

Ok. Timer then.

I kinda want Una now.

[Mumble]

Let's start with Una!

[Mumble]

VOTE: Unabombah

[Mumble]

Why even entertain a massclaim right now? Not necessary at this point and is anti-town.

[Mumble]

Can I claim first? I like claiming.

Um...no.

There is no pro-town reason to claim right now.

[Mumble]

What was wrong with the way that I claimed Miller? I literally said “I’m Town Miller.”

[Mumble]

I don’t know what the difference between universal Miller and Miller is. I paraphrased my role pm. It’s says all cop investigations.

You latching on to that for three days and not doing anything else is why you are scum. And, don’t give me that “you were busy” because you’ve been active elsewhere on site plenty.

[Mumble]

^
Seems to be a favored response from the losing team.

Good game all!