Team Mafia 2018 Results and Postmortem

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Post Post #18 (isolation #0) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:54 am

Post by Ranmaru »

I'm fine with releasing our team pt, as long as my team mates are fine with it too.

Spoiler: White Flag Shoutouts
Davsto: Hello, it was nice meeting you this game. I genuinely felt you might have been scum for the entirety of the game. I got slight town vibes from you at the end, but my vote on Shadoweh was a big risk I took. I was glad you were town in the end. I'm glad you took the time to mull the end over, and glad you chose correctly.

Lycanfire: You were right on CES, that is true. I was wrong, and I admit it. I enjoyed playing with you, you're funny. Every time I pushed you I thought 'holy shit this is so town' and then I backed off.

Llamarble: Yo, nice playing with you after so long. I'm interested in your thoughts on my play, and if you have any feedback or critique, I'd love to hear it. I would also love to hear what you would do to block a lynch you were against, something I feel I should learn as well.

Postie: Hey Postie. It was good playing with you again. I'm glad you were night killed, I think I was going to scum read you if you didn't. xD Here I am, scum hunting, and then RC keeps butting in before I have a chance to develop a read, and i'm like 'that's not very helpful'. I think RC should try to improve his skill as being a team player. I also think that it was funny how I'm trying to consider his critique that I didn't re-evaluate Screen, but was doing so with LQ and then is like 'oh yeah he's scum for that'. Ok. I'm going to bet that even after Eddie flipped town, he still scum read me. (Although, after me missing CES scum, I would not blame him afterwards if he scumread me for that) I think RC's read of me was just 'ran disagrees with my read so he must be scum'. I was pushing all those wagons simply because I predicted Eddie would flip town, knowing RC would hound me for it. On Screen, I was already considering that Tchill left without a word. That was pretty... game throwing? So that's why I tunnelled him there, and didn't care if I was wrong on him as I feel a town flip would be good information D1 anyway. (Although I guess it wasn't) Meh. RC town read him hard but that's his fault for not posting early enough, I might have considered it at an earlier time. Again, I think RC should work on his cohesion with town.

Gamma: You played very well here. You were my towniest read here, and I hope to see you play like this as town forever. The only thing was the CES flip, but I'm interested in knowing why what I said didn't convince you. I was annoyed when you hammered no lynch. :( I was thinking we'd have a better chance of lynching Shadow right then and there. I knew you would die at night. Oh well. I have nothing else to say. I have told you what I think you should improve on during the game. I was trying a thing where I could get people to improve on their play because, as scum I would do that with my team mates. So, why not openly do that with people I town read in thread? I was trying to do that to prevent mislynches on you guys. Also, again, I want you to focus more on individual play and behavioral analysis, vote analysis, rather then solely looking at wagon stalls. Again, the stall was a town stall, not a scum stall. :P

CES: I was flip flopping on you. I wanted to read you as town, as you were giving me town vibes. You did well to do that. I did note you weren't working with me as much, but only after you yourself said it. I was like 'hmm, that is true.' I hope you enjoyed my suffering after your lynch. I was shocked to see you flip mafia, it demotivated me. That is why I didn't post as much the next day, I was pretty sure that I'd be mislynched that day. This reminds me of our game together in Open 300. I did the same thing, defend scum Agar, and he flips mafia RB. Lol, I was like shit. Damn you CES. I'd like your critique on my play as well. I'd hope to play with a Town CES some time, I have not experienced that. I mostly town read you at the end because your push on Marquis made sense. Lately, scum always manage to fool me when they bus their partner. Your bus just seemed awkward from the start, though. You should have pushed harder, to sell it. You should have lynched him D1. Maybe.

Marquis: Hello Marquis, nice meeting you. Sorry you got the short end of the stick here. You seemed blatantly scummy at parts. I can't really critique you, I'm not sure if you were busy or having a hard time. Let me know if you'd like some help. I liked your comment about my avatar. :)

Shadow: Hey there! Thanks for playing with us. I'm sorry if you felt I lynched you for your predecessor, I did mostly, but I got the same feeling from you, just less blatant. You did well. You just had to progress your scum wincon, and I could slightly see it.

T-chill: Dude. Why did you flake? That's the only reason you were mostly lynched, due to that. I have nothing else to say besides that. At least, in that situation, come back and explain yourself before you replace out, so that there is some closure. Thanks broski.

Screenplay: Sorry for the mislynch my dude. :D

Eddie: I'm sorry to hear you were depressed. Yes, Mastina was right on Marquis. Honestly, I realized Mastina found some interesting tid bit from my catch up, lol. I was like 'shit, that does seem like a cog dis'. I ignored it though, but it was deff a mistake I made that scum could have used. (Or anyone really) Thing is, I felt Llama seemed a bit forced in the beginning, but I felt CES was voting him to undermine him, which is why I asked him to clarify. I was hoping you'd have Thor say some things, though! He and I have played quite a few times, I'm sure he would have read me correctly as he always does. (Although I can read him EZ too, he's easy to read) I know Mastina has scum read me in the past in a game we had together, though. I bet you her reasoning may have been similar. Although, I'd like to hear more from her why she felt that way.

Action Dan: Sorry about my scum read on you and all that 'hey lycan vote action dan thanks'. You're right, I guess I was tone deaf. I think I'll try not to do that more than once so that I don't antagonize peeps. It was good playing with you again, hydra buddy.

NSG: Hello again, NSG. I apologize for my abbrasiveness with you. A50 has been town reading you from the very beginning, there was a silent time where I avoided saying anything in our team pt because I was ashamed to talk about my scum read on you, haha. What I want you to work on, is your activity and follow up. You were right, but it was hard for me to trust you and I admit here and now, that I have hard time trusting anyone... but myself. I'm going to try to be more open to trusting others, it's hard but I will try. Yet, I think as town, there shouldn't be a reason you get demotivated, unless things get boring for you for some reason. I was trying so many times to bring you back in, I did try to encourage you. Also, I really would appreciate activity so I can bounce ideas with a town ally. Had we really theorised scum teams as much as you said we would? (Near the end of CES lynch day, we did, but upon my request) More so, you came around when I was pushing for things you disagreed with, rather then being around so we could just talk reads and be a force scum would be annoyed with. I'm sorry, maybe I come across as needy here. I really like the idea of buddying with town, and truly, I felt I didn't 'buddy up' with town enough. It's primarily my fault for attacking everyone I guess, but I did get a bit lost here. Anyway, moving on to follow up. You didn't follow up with your CES response for a long while. I suggest in the future, you try to follow up so you show that you are interested in sorting the player, and are willing to show that you have the motivation to keep following up. Funnily enough, CES also showed the same type of motivation after I nagged you to follow up. Maybe it was that you were busy? Because when I saw you reply, I thought 'shit, that's a good response!' If I have seen that much earlier, trust me, I would have stayed on CES with you. I think Quick was able to see that you made an error here too, but he correctly read you as town regardless of that fact, and I'm glad he did.

Shea: Hello there Shea. It was nice meeting you in this game. I have read a white flag game where you were scum, and lurked. So I kind of ignored you for D1, but it was thanks to A50 that I came around to a scum read on you. I honestly didn't want to scum read you. You have successfully pocketed me, but when I got your responses to me, I felt 'yeah, this doesn't totally relieve my concerns'. I just didn't say as much. I shouldn't have dropped it there, you only re-evaluated after I pointed that out. Maybe I should have waited on you. Anyway, you played solidly through and through. I knew that I'd have to focus on your scum mate, since it'd be easier to lynch them. Although I almost got you lynched D4. Oh well. :P

Dunnstral: Hey Dunn, nice playing with you. Sorry for hammering you, I would have kept you around, but I hammered you so others could see that I wasn't ignoring you because we were scum together. That's all. Also deadline. Otherwise I'd continue pushing Shea with your support. Oh well. In the future I want you to stick to being involved as you can. I want you to challenge yourself. Your play makes it easy for scum to push you, even though I saw no scum motivation from you. I didn't understand why some people didn't see that. :P

Quick: Alright quick. First off, I could do much less without the insults, cool? Anyway, at some points I felt your play to be slimy. Here I am, trying to re-evaluate you, and then you backstab me. You're lucky I hold no grudges, but I always wonder why everytime I've come around to helping you out, you never town read me, but then when Shea is paranoid, he gets town read. That was having me waver on you near the end. Genuinely, this was not what I was expecting from your play from our talks together. I'm sure what I have done, you did not expect either. I tried to get you to work with me but then you constantly avoided each attempt. Your 'hey shea, why do you switch your scum read with ran and me?' felt like 'hey shea, why do you scum read me instead of ran, you should be scum reading him'. That was annoying too. Also, didn't like the votes on me when you were town reading me at the same time. Now, you were right on Shea. I'm glad you switched to CES when you did, even though it caused me much suffering. Either way, it helped us get closer to a town win. Please in the future, work with me more. I'll try to give you more leeway with your playstyle. That way, we'll get more done. I wonder, if Shadow voted me, and I voted her, who would you have chosen? Also, if you ever want to talk more about theory and such, I'm still open to that. I will say, that you were confusing even as town. I want you to keep that in mind. I think your playstyle works, but I think it could do with less of the confusing parts. That's all. Like, less of 'ok i'm goin to vote my town read here and see how it goes'. I'm not sure you should post things about a strong scum read (like shea) with things that cause people to say 'yeah that's just dumb stuff'. It makes it harder to lynch the scum. I know, i've done those things. I have noted that your play on D4 and D5 and D6 were more focused then in earlier days. So, I won't blame you for being distracted, as I too, was distracted by many things. I think you said *I* was confusing, and if I was, I apologize. I did not try to be. Anyway, it was fun playing with you and I'm glad we were able to vote together on something for once.

Math: Thank you for hosting this game! It was fun.
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Post Post #20 (isolation #1) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:00 am

Post by Ranmaru »

Spoiler: White Flag Shoutouts Extended
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Post Post #114 (ISO) » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:39 am

Reading scum qt. I enjoyed it. I think me being 'loud, townie, and wrong' is why I'm so open to changing my reads at the flip of a hat. Vordark hit it on the nail in my newbie: I'm a wave of lightning that scum have to ride and hope it doesn't touch them. So, I try to be the wave of lightning that is aware of itself. I'm sorry to see that you were kind of depressed at the end of this all, but I was tired of it too. Half of me would have wished myself to ride CES at the critical moment, so I would have more town cred. Yet, half of me also is glad that I was allowed to live and suffer to end game, where I could extend my influence. Usually the times I lose a town game is when I'm wrong and still wrong on D3 and get killed on N3.

In a way I played in a way that I could raise my own town equity while also using that time to solve the game further. I'm sorry to hear that Shadoweh would rather not be trapped with myself or LQ. If there was anything that bothered you please quote it so I will try to avoid it in the future. I enjoy finding and enjoying scum suffer, but in reality we are still human and people and I don't want to stress anyone out too much or anything. Generally I would play with anyone here again, I'm pretty tolerant. You all played well, and it has challenged my own play and hope we can all have a merry time now.

I can see you guys had been annoyed due to my and quick's nature. It might be because we are more gut oriented then logic oriented, no matter how hard I try. That's why, I was able to see some of the things he saw, and was TRYING to work with him at times. I am not good at debate, so I can see why you may feel how I had scum for the wrong reasons. That is entirely true. I had the feeling Shea was scum, but I couldn't find evidence of him being scum. Others were like 'nope he can't be'. That's why I pushed for Shadow. I'm sorry you guys didn't have as much fun though, I do want other players I play with to also have fun. If there was anything I had done that was unnecessary that made the game nonfun to you, please let me know so I can lessen that.
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Post Post #21 (isolation #2) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:04 am

Post by Ranmaru »

In post 15, Ellibereth wrote:I'm curious what people think about "smaller" but more regular runs of the event with a "larger" edition every n years.
I'm down for that. That sounds good. There is plenty of demand for it.
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Post Post #25 (isolation #3) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:09 am

Post by Ranmaru »

I think at least having it be small per year, then large the next, is healthy for the site. (Or large every other year) At least have a poll to see if there still remains any demand.
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Post Post #27 (isolation #4) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:19 am

Post by Ranmaru »

Please open team mafia dead thread thank you.
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Post Post #33 (isolation #5) » Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:19 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

Gamma: #2351.
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Post Post #80 (isolation #6) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:44 am

Post by Ranmaru »

Cheeky, Almost50, and myself are fine with it. Toranaga still needs to respond. Momo siteflaked (I was told).
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Post Post #86 (isolation #7) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:55 am

Post by Ranmaru »

Seeing the dead QT, I'll explain why I pushed Shadow/Marquis over Shea: I felt that Marquis was scum, and people would be able to see that much more easily then Shea. Imagine if it was between Shea and Quick, I would fear for Quick's fate in that case. That's why I pushed for Marquis. I always favor the easy scum lynch over the hard one, except in times when I feel it's my responsibility to push the harder one, which was Shea, I just didn't know how to push him exactly. In general, that game showed me that I should refrain from flip flopping. I was wrong, and I theorized too much. In general, after the first mislynch, I did try to re-evaluate players, but I'll try to refrain from doing that so openly in the future. I realize that being obvious town and universal town read doesn't matter if you let yourself get linked to scum in the end (as that made it easy for scum to push for me afterwards). I'm sorry to those that thought I was crazy pushing what I was pushing, but in the end I'm glad we got it right. If anyone has any critique for my play there, I'd gladly accept it.

I had fun, and I want to thank Mathblade, Alisae, MSMITH, Beeboy, Ether, Jingle, and most especially, Ellibereth for hosting this event. I'm glad I was able to participate in this, as I see it as a challenge to myself, and it definitely was challenging. I want to thank Almost50, CheekyTeeky, Toranaga, and Momo, for having me. I want to thank Sauce for giving me the opportunity to replace. I know there were some mistake from the event, but I don't mind if they host again, as I'm sure they learned from it and will do better next time. Better people host then no one host at all.
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Post Post #87 (isolation #8) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:57 am

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EBWOP: Imagine if it was Quick and Shea in a 1v1, I would fear Quick might be the one chosen in that instance. Also I preferred the easy lynch in general, but earlier on I made many pushes on Shea because I felt I had the responsibility to push him, otherwise no others would. (Besides Quick)
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Post Post #89 (isolation #9) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:51 pm

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I'm pretty sure I couldn't argue that. I could have been scum that took Shea with me to wifom why experienced players were alive. I did think of it though, and hoped others would argue it for me. Also, Mastina always seems to scum read me, even from many years ago. I'm curious as to why, but I'm going to guess it's my playstyle. (Ran asks too many questions)
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Post Post #97 (isolation #10) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:58 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

Elli can you PM Toranaga and try to get his response for the team pt release agreement. He doesn't respond at all lol. Been that way the whole game except in the beginning and when he was mislynched. I guess momo doesn't need to since it seems he site flaked?? (I pm'd everyone)
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Post Post #103 (isolation #11) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:06 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

Alright thanks. For anyone guessing, it's mostly A50 / Cheeky / Myself. Then mostly A50 / Me and then me when I'm the only one alive. Puzzle stuff from A50, and global game reads and VCA from A50, and reads of his own that I took into account, at certain times. Then myself just catching on up on his game and I read all that but then he died n1 so it didn't matter. >.> Then me just mostly going 'YATTA, THIS IS THE TEAM!' and then 'wait no... it's davsto shea... no wait, shadow quick... wait no... wait NO...' etc. :3
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Post Post #104 (isolation #12) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:08 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

Elli could you critique my play in PM, thanks.
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Post Post #106 (isolation #13) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:12 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

That's fair. I'm generally open to what you have to say anyway, even if it's polar to my style, as I like to try new things. I'm basically a chameleon.
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Post Post #113 (isolation #14) » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:23 pm

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I generally like to post concise posts, but I was trying to 'post less, say more' with that game. I like having many posts of one line. I'm still tempering a playstyle that would be concise and still gives a good big picture and stuff.
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Post Post #143 (isolation #15) » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:32 am

Post by Ranmaru »

I would have read it. Also Katsuki, respect for having an avatar from Durarara. One of my favorite anime.
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Post Post #148 (isolation #16) » Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:55 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

In post 140, xRECKONERx wrote:yeah im fine with our pt going public bc almost
nothing is there
Lame. :igmeou:
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Post Post #151 (isolation #17) » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:18 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

I wanna see
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Post Post #164 (isolation #18) » Sat Apr 21, 2018 11:42 am

Post by Ranmaru »

A50 contributed greatly to my own reads, and was what helped me to see Shea scum. I haven't shown it as much. Others liked to give their team mates reads constantly, I liked to play it like a hydra that gives united reads. He also helped to temper me when I have been doing silly things. Thank you for your support A50, and thank you again, Team Sauce.
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Post Post #175 (isolation #19) » Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:22 pm

Post by Ranmaru »

Eddie I would have preferred you used that avi in team mafia instead of the other one.
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Post Post #177 (isolation #20) » Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:43 pm

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The other one was annoying, this one is better.
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Post Post #179 (isolation #21) » Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:23 am

Post by Ranmaru »

Yes, I forgot that they are both Eddies.
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Post Post #184 (isolation #22) » Sat May 05, 2018 4:19 pm

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It's all good, and thanks my dude.
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